Posted: 8/20/2010 4:09:40 PM EDT
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Hey Everyone,
So my father had an interesting day today....figured I would check and see what the hive thinks about it. Around 11:30 today my father noticed a white ford explorer pull up outside and two Clay Co Sheriff's dept. Officers/Deputies get out (wearing polos, and khakis). They came to the door after taking some time to look at the CCTV sign in the yard to ask about an 870 shotgun. Mid last year my father bought a mint condition wingmaster 870 from a local reputable gun shop. He sold in early this year back to the same gunshop in a trade on other items. At the time he couldn't remember it in specific or what happened to it, so he took the deputies through the house to the long gun safe (which sits by a smaller handgun safe, and ammo cabinet). After looking through the safe for a while with no luck he told them he would have to look at records to try and remember what he did with it. At the same time the deputies made a few comments about how they were gun lovers and asked general questions about some of the others guns, like "how many AR's you got there?" etc (only 2, fair bit of .22 replicas though), commenting that they wish they had setups at the department like that. Neither had a business card, but wrote down thier contact info for him to call them when he found out anything about the location of the gun, etc. They advised him that 30 years ago that gun had been stolen, and they were unsure why it was sold to him but that they needed to find out more about it. He looked up his records and right before they drove off he was able to tell them it had been sold back on a trade to the same gunshop and the date in which it was sold. They were able to provide the serial number etc, to confirm. They also asked him what his occupation was, at which time he told them he was retired law enforcement. He thought that was the last of it, then again he told me at 6PM they drove by and appeared to take a picture of the house. I advised him that I didn't think showing them the safe, etc was a very good idea w/o warrant (instead suggesting he tell them he needed to go check and then returning to tell them what he found, instead of bringing them with him (nothing to hide just in this day and age with all the "domestic terrorist" bull profiling, anything can set some people off. However that has already been done, so can anyone tell me what they think, the pictures part seems kinda disturbing, but maybe its just for thier case?? IDK.... Thoughts? |
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Meaning? I know probably just being paranoid, just not like the old days, have alot more crap being published by FBI, etc etc saying gadsen flags, boy scouts, bolt logos etc identify militia. Seeing as how he's done nothing wrong, doesn't own any ilegal guns, etc guess there isn't anything to worry to much about....but IDK...thats why I ask the hive thier thoughts.
My whole family is pro-leo, with my uncle being a sheriff with Shelby Co, and my dad being retired, me still applying with PDs, etc so don't think I am anti-leo kill my dogs and burn down my house. |
| Maybe your dad should go fishing and take along his gun collection. Ya just never know, might have to defend himself from those flying carp. Hence the reason to take his arsenal collection along. Then make sure to capsize his boat over the deepest part of the waterway. Better if there is a swift current. |
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Quoted: Hey Everyone, So my father had an interesting day today....figured I would check and see what the hive thinks about it. Around 11:30 today my father noticed a white ford explorer pull up outside and two Clay Co Sheriff's dept. Officers/Deputies get out (wearing polos, and khakis). They came to the door after taking some time to look at the CCTV sign in the yard to ask about an 870 shotgun. Mid last year my father bought a mint condition wingmaster 870 from a local reputable gun shop. He sold in early this year back to the same gunshop in a trade on other items. At the time he couldn't remember it in specific or what happened to it, so he took the deputies through the house to the long gun safe (which sits by a smaller handgun safe, and ammo cabinet). After looking through the safe for a while with no luck he told them he would have to look at records to try and remember what he did with it. At the same time the deputies made a few comments about how they were gun lovers and asked general questions about some of the others guns, like "how many AR's you got there?" etc (only 2, fair bit of .22 replicas though), commenting that they wish they had setups at the department like that. Neither had a business card, but wrote down thier contact info for him to call them when he found out anything about the location of the gun, etc. They advised him that 30 years ago that gun had been stolen, and they were unsure why it was sold to him but that they needed to find out more about it. He looked up his records and right before they drove off he was able to tell them it had been sold back on a trade to the same gunshop and the date in which it was sold. They were able to provide the serial number etc, to confirm. They also asked him what his occupation was, at which time he told them he was retired law enforcement. He thought that was the last of it, then again he told me at 6PM they drove by and appeared to take a picture of the house. I advised him that I didn't think showing them the safe, etc was a very good idea w/o warrant (instead suggesting he tell them he needed to go check and then returning to tell them what he found, instead of bringing them with him (nothing to hide just in this day and age with all the "domestic terrorist" bull profiling, anything can set some people off. However that has already been done, so can anyone tell me what they think, the pictures part seems kinda disturbing, but maybe its just for thier case?? IDK.... Thoughts? 1st off, I would not talk to them without seeing their credientials, then I would not have let them in to look at my gunsafe or its location without a warrent... They have absolutley no reason to see in my house or safe. If I sa I don't have it, I don't have it... 2nd, Why don't you do some lookups/digging on the Phone Numbers they gave him... If they come up as Cell numbers, thats strike one.... Then, call the department they are supposedly from (or better drive down there)... Tell whoever you are inquiring with that you had some suspicious folks show up at your door asking for personal info that may or may not have been actual L.E.,... This day in age, they should understand... If they have never heard of them; yu/he just got cased... Time to file a report and move the gun to a different location and a better safe... They could have somehow got a list of people who purchased guns (for future targets) from that pawnshop or somewhere else he dealt with... Interesting story, keep us updated... Seriously, do some checking... |
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There isnt any need to be paranoid or over complicate the issue. Don't let those who get "thin skinned" over LEO contacts get you worked up. Its simple..... there was a stolen gun, they know he bought it legit from a FFL..... they are just trying to connect the dots to where it is now. ITS THEIR JOB.
Call Clay County dispatch. Explain that you are concerned (assuming you are) that they were real Deputies. They will tell you based upon the address if deputies responded there. If you have any other concerns feal free to send me private messages and I will refer you to any contacts or phone numbers you might need. - Dave |
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Quoted: I advised him that I didn't think showing them the safe, etc was a very good idea w/o warrant Poor PerSec.  Otherwise shown proper ID/proof of authority/warrant I would have helped as much as possible. Honestly though, I don't have purchase or sale "records" for half of the three guns I own. And there is NO legal requirement for me to have it either!  |
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There isnt any need to be paranoid or over complicate the issue. Don't let those who get "thin skinned" over LEO contacts get you worked up. Its simple..... there was a stolen gun, they know he bought it legit from a FFL..... they are just trying to connect the dots to where it is now. ITS THEIR JOB. - Dave Investigating a theft from 30 years ago? I kinda doubt it. They won't even investigate a car break-in from this week.  What's the Statute of Limitation on stolen goods? Besides, don't guns fall under the ATF's house?
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Quoted: 1. There isnt any need to be paranoid or over complicate the issue. Don't let those who get "thin skinned" over LEO contacts get you worked up. Its simple..... there was a stolen gun, they know he bought it legit from a FFL..... they are just trying to connect the dots to where it is now. ITS THEIR JOB. Call Clay County dispatch. Explain that you are concerned 2.(assuming you are) that they were real Deputies. They will tell you based upon the address if deputies responded there. If you have any other concerns feal free to send me private messages and I will refer you to any contacts or phone numbers you might need. - Dave 1. Not known, no one over complicated it, 1st action that was suggested was pretty much same as yours... Make the calls to the right people... 2. He was concered enough to come post here and ask everyone their thoughts... Good chance this was legit, I hope it was.... OP<, Make the calls, know for sure... |
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Thanks for the replies everyone!
Max-Paul - Has been a while since a boat trip might be time to take another, maybe do some duck hunting on the water... Topknot - Yeah I'll give them a call to make sure today. Takeone - Well I think the quality of google maps pics could be better... I thought they did that in black suits in black vans with black helicopters above them.... :-) CZ75 - Yeah thats what I wondered when he told me the no business card thing...calling today to check on that GiltWeasel - Yeah that was in one of those idiotic memos, gadsen flags, bolt logos, prior military or boy scouts, ....etc etc etc Smullen - I agree, especially with all the home invasions that have happened with people pretending to be PD. The phone numbers given are cell, as they stated they were thier nextel numbers ("that sometimes don't work"). Gonna call Clay Co today and check to see if anyone was supposedly out at the residence. ShootinDave - Thats what I will do. Thanks. Eric10mm - Yeah same here, just happened to make sales and purchases records a while back for in case of fire etc. Supposedly it was stolen 30 years ago and then they got some case on it in 01. They then somehow tracking it to being traded into the gun dealer (not pawn, but actual local dealer) and then got the dealer's records which they in turn found he purchased from. After speaking with him they were supposedly going back to the gun dealer. Though after talking with my father more this morning he said they didn't seem to believe that, that in fact they asked about where else it might be (like they thought it was being hidden...but maybe they were just trying to track everything down). |
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There isnt any need to be paranoid or over complicate the issue. Don't let those who get "thin skinned" over LEO contacts get you worked up. Its simple..... there was a stolen gun, they know he bought it legit from a FFL..... they are just trying to connect the dots to where it is now. ITS THEIR JOB. - Dave Investigating a theft from 30 years ago? I kinda doubt it. They won't even investigate a car break-in from this week. What's the Statute of Limitation on stolen goods? Besides, don't guns fall under the ATF's house?Not sure what the statute of limitations on this sort of thing is, E; but I do know my buddy Rock traded an old Remington 30-06 he received for his 14th birthday to Bob's Gun Rack for a handgun he was wanting and it turned out to be stolen. Ja Co Sherrif's showed up and his door and asked him questions about how he came to own it. Basically, his dad used to own "Mega Torque starters and alternators" in Kansas City. It was in the bad part of town and he was always having guys coming in trying to "Sell" stuff to him. He'd buy anything that interested him. Turns out it was stolen and when Bob's logged it, it came back stolen. It took a few months, what with the beurocracy's efficiency and all. He had to pay Bob's the difference since he sold them a stolen gun. Rocky was 14 when he received it, which was apparently 7 or so years after the gun was stolen. So it wasn't like he was being suspected of the theft, but it was over 20 years after the theft and they were still investigating it. |
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I think that verifying the identity of these "officers" is a very important thing to do right now.
After that, I don't think there is really any problems. Taking a picture of your house really is no big deal. They likely took a picture of it so they can document the trail they walked in their adventure. |
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I think that verifying the identity of these "officers" is a very important thing to do right now. After that, I don't think there is really any problems. Taking a picture of your house really is no big deal. They likely took a picture of it so they can document the trail they walked in their adventure. I agree with this. If they are real officers, don't sweat it. If they aren't real officers, well... then you've got some interesting times ahead. |
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Well I called up and left a voicemail for the SGT who's name was given (that supposedly is the same guy who came out), the number he gave out returns to some telemarketer...so waiting to hear back from the SGT who I left a voicemail with at Clay Co, to make sure it is the same guy, and whether he maybe just wrote down the number at little off or something...
I did call up the dealer I bough the gun from as well and he stated they had confiscated the gun from him yesterday evening that he still had it in stock, so that makes me feel better. |
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Do you have both of their names? If you do, call the police department and ask to speak with another officer. Do not take a voicemail. Policemen (at least in my neck of the woods) are terrible at returning voicemail.
Call tomorrow during normal business hours and get to the bottom of it. Do not stop until you have verified the identity of both officers that were at your house. That means actually speaking with someone and finding out if they work there. |
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Quoted: Well I called up and left a voicemail for the SGT who's name was given (that supposedly is the same guy who came out), the number he gave out returns to some telemarketer...so waiting to hear back from the SGT who I left a voicemail with at Clay Co, to make sure it is the same guy, and whether he maybe just wrote down the number at little off or something... I did call up the dealer I bough the gun from as well and he stated they had confiscated the gun from him yesterday evening that he still had it in stock, so that makes me feel better. Wait, the dealer still has the gun? If anything I would be even more nervous since their story isn't checking out bit by bit. |
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Well I called up and left a voicemail for the SGT who's name was given (that supposedly is the same guy who came out), the number he gave out returns to some telemarketer...so waiting to hear back from the SGT who I left a voicemail with at Clay Co, to make sure it is the same guy, and whether he maybe just wrote down the number at little off or something... I did call up the dealer I bough the gun from as well and he stated they had confiscated the gun from him yesterday evening that [since] he still had it in stock [from when his father traded it back in], so that makes me feel better. Wait, the dealer still has the gun? If anything I would be even more nervous since their story isn't checking out bit by bit.
That's how I read it, but I could be wrong. |
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Quoted: Do you have both of their names? If you do, call the police department and ask to speak with another officer. Do not take a voicemail. Policemen (at least in my neck of the woods) are terrible at returning voicemail. Call tomorrow during normal business hours and get to the bottom of it. Do not stop until you have verified the identity of both officers that were at your house. That means actually speaking with someone and finding out if they work there. This Plus how do yuo know they did not gie the name of two legit officers??? Thats also why I suggested going down there and meeting them... Interested to hear more updates on this... |
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I thinks I be snappin' off some pics with the cell phone of any stranger tappin' on my door. Uniform or not. And get convicted of felony wiretapping/eavesdropping/assault/whatever? wait. what? My own home? I can't take pictures from my own home of people knocking on MY door? whew! The arm of the law has crept long indeed. |
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And have your dogs shot...Quoted:
I thinks I be snappin' off some pics with the cell phone of any stranger tappin' on my door. Uniform or not. And get convicted of felony wiretapping/eavesdropping/assault/whatever? 
CCTV sign in the yard
It true and recording non issue. Dogs are always targets of opportunity as SOP for all LEO....at least as told on ARCOM |
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Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: I thinks I be snappin' off some pics with the cell phone of any stranger tappin' on my door. Uniform or not. And get convicted of felony wiretapping/eavesdropping/assault/whatever? LOL...  somebody doesnt know the state statutes very well.LOL! Wait, what? Are you really telling me that I cannot take a photograph of someone who is on my private property, without an invitation, and knocking at my front door without me posting some silly-assed sign stating something along the lines of "You are being photographed/recorded/ranged with mildots/laser designated for a JDAM strike”? Seriously? Double yew, Tee, Eff!! |
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I thinks I be snappin' off some pics with the cell phone of any stranger tappin' on my door. Uniform or not. And get convicted of felony wiretapping/eavesdropping/assault/whatever? LOL... somebody doesnt know the state statutes very well.LOL! Wait, what?
Are you really telling me that I cannot take a photograph of someone who is on my private property, without an invitation, and knocking at my front door without me posting some silly-assed sign stating something along the lines of "You are being photographed/recorded/ranged with mildots/laser designated for a JDAM strike”? Seriously?
Double yew, Tee, Eff!!
Various people in several states, who were recording police officers performing various acts of abuse/illegal searches/crimes have had their camera/recorder/whatever seized and were charged with something along those lines. I've not seen an article about it happening in Missouri, but who knows. |
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If officers went to a licensed dealer and inquired about this shotgun with serial number XXXXX, and the dealer looked it up to see who bought it, how in the hell did the dealer NOT know he had that firearm in his inventory already? It seems if they found out who the dealer sold it too, they would have already known he had it in his inventory. Yet for some reason they went to your dads to find out he sold/traded it back to the same dealer they had just left... That just sound odd. Maybe it's just a lazy firearms dealer and didn't wanna look and see if he had it. Maybe it's not.
2 years ago I got pulled over by a guy pretending to be a deputy, but he had civilian plates, no red lights, no badge and no firearm. When I told him I was gonna have to call the sheriff and verify who he was, he said he had another call he had to get too. Turns out it was a guy scanning drivers license's into a laptop in his car to steal identities. Some people where tin foil hats, and some people are cautiously aware of what could happen. |
| Well owe yall and update, the officers did check out. Yes I bought the gun from the dealer, then sold it back a few months later, and he still had it in inventory, but probably just saw the sale and didn't remember getting it back in? So they just went to my father as being the buyer and then traced back. So all is good...thanks for the advice everyone, just never know in this day and age who might be looking to do harm. |