Posted: 5/18/2009 2:00:26 PM EDT
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Lexington about 2 weeks ago...
I had just got done shooting a night time fire session with some friends. So I didnt drop my SBR off at the house when my friends called me to pick them up at a local bar. My trunk was full off stuff from college, I just threw my AR in passenger seat and went to pick them up( was going to make them sit backseat in my grand cherokee.) I get there tons of cops, they wave me over and ask if Im DD. I reply with a yes, as the officer keeps approaching my vehicle I put my hands on the wheel and tell him I have firearms in the vehicle. He responds by calling all his cop buddies over and they all draw pistols on me. I comply with their demands, I was cuffed and thrown in the back of a cruiser then bitched at for 45 min for having a class 3 in my vehicle instead at home "where it should be". They told me several times I was goign to jail and going to have my class 3 revoked from me. After about 45 min I began to get impatiant and asked them what laws I had broken and why I was still being held. Thats when they let me go gave me my AR back and told me to expect to give that up to the ATF in the next week. Just thought this story should be told for people who travel through Lex at night with SBR riding shotgun with them 
ATF still hasn't contacted me as I thought they wouldn't |
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I wouldn't consider myself getting away clean just yet, if I were you. BATF doesn't move fast, but when they move you better get the hell out of the way.
At the very least, you are on their radar screen now. If it were me, I'd make damned sure that all the T's are crossed and the I's dotted and that I had all my documents in place and in duplicate with a set in a safe place that they wouldn't think to look, a set in my lawyer's files, and a set sealed in an envelope and mailed to myself. Including a set of pictures with serial numbers on the pictures wouldn't be a bad idea, just in case that knock on the door at 3 in the morning comes. You might also make sure that your safe is solid and secure (and everything is in it) because some cops ain't completely honest and it would tickle some of them to no end to have some throw-downs they know couldn't be traced back to them. I'm not acussing anyone of anything and this is not legal advice, just watch your ass. |
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Very similar incident happened to me man. I was DDing my buddy from the bars and had my pistol in my trunk in my SUV. Cops were around mainstreet and got pulled over. Cop thought i was drunk driving when I was clearly sober. I informed the officer of my handgun, next thing you know, the officer confiscated my pistol and sat me and my buddy in the patrol car. Few minutes later, I was informed I was free to leave to take my buddy back home but the handgun had to stay with him. I could get the pistol back once I called the police department and set up a meeting.
I feel your pain. It is Bullsh*t, but thats how america works.. |
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Very similar incident happened to me man. I was DDing my buddy from the bars and had my pistol in my trunk in my SUV. Cops were around mainstreet and got pulled over. Cop thought i was drunk driving when I was clearly sober. I informed the officer of my handgun, next thing you know, the officer confiscated my pistol and sat me and my buddy in the patrol car. Few minutes later, I was informed I was free to leave to take my buddy back home but the handgun had to stay with him. I could get the pistol back once I called the police department and set up a meeting. I feel your pain. It is Bullsh*t, but thats how america works.. How could they seize your handgun if you hadn't committed any crime or without a warrent? That flys directly against the Fourth Amendment. Please tell a little more about what the LEO said directly before he confiscated your handgun and what was discussed at the police department. Chase45, Did the Lexington police officer even know anything about SBRs or did you need to explain to him? Did he search your vehicle while you were in the back of the cruiser? I would have asked him if I was free to leave as soon as he had finished running my DL and had seen my proof of insurance and registraton. If he had said no, I would have made him tell me why I was being detained. If they could have proved you were in possesion of a illegal SBR they wouldn't have gave it back. I would at the very least make it a point to talk with the Captain of the police department (in person) and ask him why you were detained for almost a hour when no crime had been committed. |
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One of the officers there did. I had 3 copies of the stamp with me. One in a scaled down copy in my wallet and two in my glove box. The only thing he was confused about is the fact of how i had one at 19. I had to walk him through the form one and explain how i didnt need to be 21. Another officer was all bent out of shape about me not being "trained" on the firearms i had in my car. That got settled away when i showed him my certificates for ar15 armourer school i went to. Which was a bs class. And also my SO certificate for IDPA.
They searched my car for contraband but i didnt have anything but alot of dirty clothes. Laundry day was the next :P. They told me they were detaining me until their sargeant got their to talk to me about my actions... He turned out to be a cool guy and sent me on my way quickly and thanked me for being understanding as well as being DD for my friends All in all it was an experience that could have easily avoided on my part. I just think the officers on scene overreacted on their part slightly. If i was trying yo cause them harm i wouldnt have rolled up and when the officer came o my door i wouldnt have told him i had firearms in my vehicle |
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They told me they were detaining me until their sergeant got their to talk to me about my actions... He turned out to be a cool guy and sent me on my way quickly and thanked me for being understanding as well as being DD for my friends WTF, your actions? You let them know, when not legally required to do so, you had a firearm in the vehicle. I can understand from their standpoint separating you from the firearm while they run their checks. After you and the firearm come back clean, you should be let go immediately. While the sergeant sounds like a good guy, I would still file a complaint about the detaining officer and the one(s) who stated the ATF would be taking your SBR stamp. These are the officers who give police a bad image. Keep us posted. |
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They told me they were detaining me until their sergeant got their to talk to me about my actions... He turned out to be a cool guy and sent me on my way quickly and thanked me for being understanding as well as being DD for my friends WTF, your actions? You let them know, when not legally required to do so, you had a firearm in the vehicle. I can understand from their standpoint separating you from the firearm while they run their checks. After you and the firearm come back clean, you should be let go immediately. While the sergeant sounds like a good guy, I would still file a complaint about the detaining officer and the one(s) who stated the ATF would be taking your SBR stamp. These are the officers who give police a bad image. Keep us posted. +1 I think I'd be more POed about the fact they searched my vehicle without any cause. Unless you volunteered and agreed to the search, I can't see where they had any proabable cause. I hope they didn't base it solely on the fact you had a legal firearm in your possession. |
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Was it UKPD or Lexington PD? If you had any of their names I could screw with a few of them for you  Only name I clearly remember is Boyle, Thats because the detaining officer right before he went in to unbuckle me and get me out of my jeep yelled cover me Boyle and I had to bite my tongue not to laugh. |
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You definitely have a right to file a complaint. You did nothing illegal, you had the rifle in plain site (no illegal), you had all of the appropriate paperwork (not illegal), and you were detained for an uneccesary amount of time while waiting for the sargeant to show up (which is illegal), plus, you were put through an illegal search as they had nothing to indicate you were doing anything illegal to search your car.
Fact, an officer can not search your vehicle without probable cause, and the mere refusal by you to allow them to search does not give them probable cause. If they wish to pursue it further, it would require a warrent. The old, "now you wouldn't mind us looking if you don't have anything to hide" is a tactic used by police to search your vehicle without a warrent, by making you think that if you refuse they can arrest you. Know your rights, and don't be a victim. I have known and work with police officers all my life through various part of the state, and unfortunately, their are a select few that give them a black eye. |
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They told me they were detaining me until their sergeant got their to talk to me about my actions... He turned out to be a cool guy and sent me on my way quickly and thanked me for being understanding as well as being DD for my friends WTF, your actions? You let them know, when not legally required to do so, you had a firearm in the vehicle. I can understand from their standpoint separating you from the firearm while they run their checks. After you and the firearm come back clean, you should be let go immediately. While the sergeant sounds like a good guy, I would still file a complaint about the detaining officer and the one(s) who stated the ATF would be taking your SBR stamp. These are the officers who give police a bad image. Keep us posted. +1 I think I'd be more POed about the fact they searched my vehicle without any cause. Unless you volunteered and agreed to the search, I can't see where they had any proabable cause. I hope they didn't base it solely on the fact you had a legal firearm in your possession. They never asked, they just told me they were going to search my car for any other firearms and went through the whole jeep. I ment to get all the officers badge numbers but by the time I was uncuffed and let go I just wanted to round up my friends(which was another adventure) and get back home for the night. I have thought about writting an email/letter to the chief of Lexington and tell them about the incident, and then also suggest a different approach to that type of situation, not to mention tell them to look at their strategy for facing a threat with a gun. almost every officer bladed at a 45 degree angle, whcih made their heart vulnerable to a shot through the armpit hole of their vests. While I was a bit dissapointed with the whole night when it happened, I must say I set myself up for that. I however at the same time think they also didnt handle it right and went on a fishing expedition to find something to screw me on. |
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They told me they were detaining me until their sergeant got their to talk to me about my actions... He turned out to be a cool guy and sent me on my way quickly and thanked me for being understanding as well as being DD for my friends WTF, your actions? You let them know, when not legally required to do so, you had a firearm in the vehicle. I can understand from their standpoint separating you from the firearm while they run their checks. After you and the firearm come back clean, you should be let go immediately. While the sergeant sounds like a good guy, I would still file a complaint about the detaining officer and the one(s) who stated the ATF would be taking your SBR stamp. These are the officers who give police a bad image. Keep us posted. +1 I think I'd be more POed about the fact they searched my vehicle without any cause. Unless you volunteered and agreed to the search, I can't see where they had any proabable cause. I hope they didn't base it solely on the fact you had a legal firearm in your possession. They never asked, they just told me they were going to search my car for any other firearms and went through the whole jeep. I ment to get all the officers badge numbers but by the time I was uncuffed and let go I just wanted to round up my friends(which was another adventure) and get back home for the night. I have thought about writting an email/letter to the chief of Lexington and tell them about the incident, and then also suggest a different approach to that type of situation, not to mention tell them to look at their strategy for facing a threat with a gun. almost every officer bladed at a 45 degree angle, whcih made their heart vulnerable to a shot through the armpit hole of their vests. While I was a bit dissapointed with the whole night when it happened, I must say I set myself up for that. I however at the same time think they also didnt handle it right and went on a fishing expedition to find something to screw me on. Were they facing a threat with a gun? Focus on your mistreatment and don't get preachy on their "tactics". |
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They told me they were detaining me until their sergeant got their to talk to me about my actions... He turned out to be a cool guy and sent me on my way quickly and thanked me for being understanding as well as being DD for my friends WTF, your actions? You let them know, when not legally required to do so, you had a firearm in the vehicle. I can understand from their standpoint separating you from the firearm while they run their checks. After you and the firearm come back clean, you should be let go immediately. While the sergeant sounds like a good guy, I would still file a complaint about the detaining officer and the one(s) who stated the ATF would be taking your SBR stamp. These are the officers who give police a bad image. Keep us posted. +1 I think I'd be more POed about the fact they searched my vehicle without any cause. Unless you volunteered and agreed to the search, I can't see where they had any proabable cause. I hope they didn't base it solely on the fact you had a legal firearm in your possession. They never asked, they just told me they were going to search my car for any other firearms and went through the whole jeep. I ment to get all the officers badge numbers but by the time I was uncuffed and let go I just wanted to round up my friends(which was another adventure) and get back home for the night. I have thought about writting an email/letter to the chief of Lexington and tell them about the incident, and then also suggest a different approach to that type of situation, not to mention tell them to look at their strategy for facing a threat with a gun. almost every officer bladed at a 45 degree angle, whcih made their heart vulnerable to a shot through the armpit hole of their vests. While I was a bit dissapointed with the whole night when it happened, I must say I set myself up for that. I however at the same time think they also didnt handle it right and went on a fishing expedition to find something to screw me on. Were they facing a threat with a gun? Focus on your mistreatment and don't get preachy on their "tactics". true... |
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Very similar incident happened to me man. I was DDing my buddy from the bars and had my pistol in my trunk in my SUV. Cops were around mainstreet and got pulled over. Cop thought i was drunk driving when I was clearly sober. I informed the officer of my handgun, next thing you know, the officer confiscated my pistol and sat me and my buddy in the patrol car. Few minutes later, I was informed I was free to leave to take my buddy back home but the handgun had to stay with him. I could get the pistol back once I called the police department and set up a meeting. I feel your pain. It is Bullsh*t, but thats how america works.. Same here....sorta  Anyway when I went to get my pistol back from them I noticed a round missing out of one of the mags. My guess is they ran a ballistics check on it I sold that pistol about a month later..... and of course everything else was lost in the boat fire
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Very similar incident happened to me man. I was DDing my buddy from the bars and had my pistol in my trunk in my SUV. Cops were around mainstreet and got pulled over. Cop thought i was drunk driving when I was clearly sober. I informed the officer of my handgun, next thing you know, the officer confiscated my pistol and sat me and my buddy in the patrol car. Few minutes later, I was informed I was free to leave to take my buddy back home but the handgun had to stay with him. I could get the pistol back once I called the police department and set up a meeting. I feel your pain. It is Bullsh*t, but thats how america works.. Same here....sorta Anyway when I went to get my pistol back from them I noticed a round missing out of one of the mags. My guess is they ran a ballistics check on it I sold that pistol about a month later..... and of course everything else was lost in the boat fireI thought they also forgot to give me my round back from my 1911 that was in the chamber, I eventually found it in another mag that was in my range bag. Ha no Ill pass on his email address I will write this down as my own fault for not putting my SBR in the proper spot it should have been, even though it was legal. BTW here was the culprit that almost made me have a bad night 
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I think everyone here is correct about the wrongful treatment and the way it should be handled. Here is something else to think about.What IF, you did have something not within the law in your vehicle.They searched it ILLEGALY because they had no warrant nor your permission to do so.They then found the offending item(s) during this search.You are then locked up lose gun rights,court/attorney costs etc and now your focus is getting out of the mess that you shouldnt be in in the first place.All because of this illegal search and tactics.Of course it may come out in the end but at what cost?Protect yourself even if you get careless.Either better placement of the weapon,dont have the offending item or whatever,or dont submit to illegal search.
I understand its intimidating and you probably didnt think much of it since you were legal and had your papers.Its always easy to think about it after its done,especially for us! But, if you are right,you are right.Dont ever forget that and stand up when needed.I think there is some decent advice here that we all should adhere to. Fortunately all is well so no big deal.Just my thought. |
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I think everyone here is correct about the wrongful treatment and the way it should be handled. Here is something else to think about.What IF, you did have something not within the law in your vehicle.They searched it ILLEGALY because they had no warrant nor your permission to do so.They then found the offending item(s) during this search.You are then locked up lose gun rights,court/attorney costs etc and now your focus is getting out of the mess that you shouldnt be in in the first place.All because of this illegal search and tactics.Of course it may come out in the end but at what cost?Protect yourself even if you get careless.Either better placement of the weapon,dont have the offending item or whatever,or dont submit to illegal search. I understand its intimidating and you probably didnt think much of it since you were legal and had your papers.Its always easy to think about it after its done,especially for us! But, if you are right,you are right.Dont ever forget that and stand up when needed.I think there is some decent advice here that we all should adhere to. Fortunately all is well so no big deal.Just my thought. What better placement would there be other than in plain sight? Something tells me, that even if it was in a case in the back or even in his trunk, if he stated he had a firearm on him at all, he still would have been treated the same way. |