[ARCHIVED THREAD] - scope question (Page 1 of 2)
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Quality glass is expensive. Don't buy cheap optics as its a false economy, you'll end up junking them and buying again. Respected but expensive makes include Leupold, S&B, Nightforce, IOR Whats your budget  You'll typically need around 40ish moa of elevation to reach 1000m from a 100m zero with a 308, A 20Moa scope rail will help. What model Sako do you have BTW? |
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I use Nightforce or Leupold mainly. Scopes can be transferred from rifle to rifle so you are more likely to have them longer so worth getting the best you can....Worth looking at importing from the States if you can as you will make some good savings while the £/$ rate is good. If money is a real problem then have a look at some of the chinese scopes that Brian Fox is importing....they are OK for the money and I know gys who shoot 1000yd at Diggle with them OK (including on a .338 Lap Mag) proce range around £100 -£350 depending on the optics. I have one that has served on several of my rifles and I'm happy with it for the money. You are likey to need a rail with 20MOA elevation at the rear to get on at 1000yd with most scopes but I'd wait to see if the scope can get you there with elevation to spare before spending more money. 
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I dont use a rail with any elevation for my PMII on my PSS for 1000 yds. |
Some need em and some don't..... Nightforce don't have a huge range of elevation, Leupold are better but if you are at the extreme of your elevation it can affect available windage adjustment. I share Streetfighter's opinion of the U. S. Optics.....I looked at buying one and they were Very Very expensive. I wasn't keen on them..... |
My S&B is the newer 'double turn' model with the 34mm tube, needed to get all the 'guts' inside. I do find the 'double turn' model better than the older type. Before anyone says anything, I am not critisizing the older model in any way, just MHO. 
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+1 on the S&B PMII's! They are truly awesome scopes. Got one on the TRG22, and another on the Nemesis .50. Both 5-25X56, 34mm tubes, double turn turrets, and second focal plane. If you have the choice, go for a fine reticule, so it doesn't block the target out at distance. Leupold are good for the money, but the PMII's are just on a level above! There's probably not a better scope in the world. |
Have at look at the Bushnell Elite range, used to be sold as Bausch & Lomb. I have had two 6-24 x 40 Elites for some years and they are pretty good. The new ones have side focus and a better choice of reticle. T & J J McAvoy are good to deal with, pretty competitive price wise (£650 - £700) and also do Leopold: www.guns.gb.com/ Cheers Martin |
I have both, but as usual, The Schmidt's sitting right here in front of me as I've only used it once since I bought it last year and it's at present between rifles. It's a 3-12x50PM11 double turn |
Nice, I have 
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can you all stop copying me please 
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No problem - I don't like Martini !!!!  (Must say I do like coleslaw - only with a spoon though!!)
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Those ARs look decidedly un-used. ETA: I don't have an ACOG. I'm feeling like I'm not in the 'in crowd' 
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Those uppers look decidedly un-used. How very dare you !!  Well, you're almost right.....the top rifle is brand-new....I've probaby shot 50 rounds through it since I bought it before Christmas... The bottom one has seen approx 3000 rounds in my hands however 
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Imitation is the sincerest form of flattery.............. ..but it is also said that fools................ 
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I bet those ACOG's cost you arm and leg....hinese/Hong http://i27.tinypic.com/2q2ea1s.jpg be safe |
Is your Elcan clone a magnified optic (Reticule?) or a red dot ? The newer Elcans with 1xto4x fast zoom are really expensive and don't have a great rep for maintaining zero unfortunately. |
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Its a fixed 3x with a illuminated reticule (red and green) I will be in Bisley zero range tommorrow. Hopefully it will be OK. Out of the box, the cross bolt at the front of the sight where the elevation mech. pivots was not rigid enough....I managed to secure it better with shimms.....its is now solid without compromising the elevation and windage movement..... I shall see tommorrow if i can get decent grouping...... be safe |
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It was the old Elcan's that had the rep for not maintaining a zero, this was to do with the mount that was originally supplied. I have an original Elcan calibrated for 5.56 and the only issue I have had being that the post reticule seemed to have moved (canted) very slightly from the vertical after years of use. I spoke to Elcan and was told how to correct this. It appears that the mount is secured to the scope body by two Allen head screws and that over time they work loose and require securing with locktite. The new spectreDR scopes are indeed the DB's. The glass they use for the optics is German the reticule is etched onto the glass. The optical quality can only be described as comparable to S&B. The 1 to 4 converter works via a robust cam switch that has been tested to destruction (not my words but those of Elcan and Armament Technologies who are the main distributor) The red dot from memory is 1.5MOA at 4 power and 6MOA at 1 power. The original DR's came in flat earth finish and had a slightly different reticule to what's currently offered. The main complaint being that the original was not bold enough for fast target acquisition. This has now been rectified. The new versions come in black with an ARMS mount attached to them for quick mount/unmount application and guaranteed return to zero. The reticules can be had calibrated for 5.56 or 7.62. The 5.56 reticule (once zeroed for elevation and windage on a 20" barrel) is similar to what's found in most ACOGS you have a 200 yard cross hair then subtended marks for 300, 400, 500 & 600 yards. The 700, 800, 900 marks are designed for use with the SAW, these compromise a dot in a circle. The red dot (cross hair) only illuminates at the 200 setting. A set of rudimentary back up iron sights are also included. I have used this scope mounted on a 20" flat top while I was out at this years SHOT Show. Targets (standard pepper poppers) were quickly acquired at distance on the 4X setting with ultra quick transition to 1X for CQB and back again with no change to zero. All in all one of the best military scopes on the market at this moment, the only negatives being the weight (approx 1.3lb) and the $1600 plus to buy one. I have since found out that the RRP on these items is now $1800 |
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Interesting stuff Dave, I'm pretty sure that there were issues reported with the Spectre's on here some time back. Sounds like the problems have been ironed out I'm surprised that Trijicon never saw fit to produce a similar scope, something along the lines of a fusion between the Accupoint & ACOG... |