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9/1/2014 8:01:55 PM EDT


This is about a new 7.5" Radical Firearms upper I bought from you guys recently.  I almost described this as a double feed, and then realized that it's a not a double feed but possibly an extraction issue.  I took the new 7.5" upper to the range over the weekend and this is what happens.







I chamber the first round and fire and it goes boom.  Then, click.  I guess I didn't notice the casing hadn't ejected.  I look and notice that the first round had not been ejected and the second round had fed far enough forward that it was ahead of the first one.  I remove the mag and notice that the firing pin had left a slight mark on the primer.  I removed the rounds and tried again and the same thing happens.  I tried this with a PMAG, a USGI mag, and even a Lancer.  I tried with 75 grain and 55 grain with the exact same problem.







The extractor on the BCG seems to work fine and when I cycle it manually, it extracts every single time.  The range officer said he thinks the gas tube is too short.  I'd think a pistol length tube would be suitable for a 7.5 but I'm wondering if not enough pressure is being delivered via the gas tube to cycle it properly.  I assembled the lower myself and use a Spike's T2 buffer.  Since it is new, I figured you are the guys to talk to, first.  I would think Radical Firearms would be the folks to talk to, but their website has a no return policy and it seems like they don't offer a warranty.  Maybe I'm reading it wrong.







What do you guys recommend?  I trust PA so I know you guys wouldn't steer me in the wrong direction.

 
9/1/2014 10:24:03 PM EDT
[#1]
Sounds under gassed - but use a standard carbine buffer before you really call it an issue. The T2 is heavy.
9/2/2014 9:53:59 AM EDT
[#2]

Quote History
Quoted:


Sounds under gassed - but use a standard carbine buffer before you really call it an issue. The T2 is heavy.
View Quote




 
From most of the posts I've read, folks with 7.5 inch barrels seem to recommend this buffer.  It's the one I have on all my ARs, anyway.  I seriously doubt that this is a buffer issue, though.  The case wasn't just not ejecting all the way.  The second round was fed directly underneath the previous one that did go off.
9/2/2014 10:00:36 AM EDT
[#3]
If the buffer is too heavy or under gassed it will not fully cycle. If it doesn't fully cycle, it will go back just enough to strip the next round but not eject the last case which is exactly the problem you're having.

Try a lighter buffer. Maybe RA took note of the issues people had with the over gassed 7.5s people have and made the gas port smaller to run standard carbine buffers. Also try running a different BCG so you can narrow it down to exactly what is wrong. My bet is the buffer fixes it. What happens when you load one round into the magazine and fire it?
9/2/2014 10:11:40 AM EDT
[#4]

Quote History
Quoted:


If the buffer is too heavy or under gassed it will not fully cycle. If it doesn't fully cycle, it will go back just enough to strip the next round but not eject the last case which is exactly the problem you're having.



Try a lighter buffer. Maybe RA took note of the issues people had with the over gassed 7.5s people have and made the gas port smaller to run standard carbine buffers. Also try running a different BCG so you can narrow it down to exactly what is wrong. My bet is the buffer fixes it. What happens when you load one round into the magazine and fire it?
View Quote
I'm not sure what you mean by that last part.  Could you elaborate?  

 
9/2/2014 10:16:57 AM EDT
[#5]
If you load only one round into the magazine, load it and fire, what happens? Does the BCG lock back? or does it close?

If it doesn't lock back then you're under gassed for sure.
9/2/2014 10:24:22 AM EDT
[#6]
Quoted:
This is about a new 7.5" Radical Firearms upper I bought from you guys recently.  I almost described this as a double feed, and then realized that it's a not a double feed but possibly an extraction issue.  I took the new 7.5" upper to the range over the weekend and this is what happens.

I chamber the first round and fire and it goes boom.  Then, click.  I guess I didn't notice the casing hadn't ejected.  I look and notice that the first round had not been ejected and the second round had fed far enough forward that it was ahead of the first one.  I remove the mag and notice that the firing pin had left a slight mark on the primer.  I removed the rounds and tried again and the same thing happens.  I tried this with a PMAG, a USGI mag, and even a Lancer.  I tried with 75 grain and 55 grain with the exact same problem.

The extractor on the BCG seems to work fine and when I cycle it manually, it extracts every single time.  The range officer said he thinks the gas tube is too short.  I'd think a pistol length tube would be suitable for a 7.5 but I'm wondering if not enough pressure is being delivered via the gas tube to cycle it properly.  I assembled the lower myself and use a Spike's T2 buffer.  Since it is new, I figured you are the guys to talk to, first.  I would think Radical Firearms would be the folks to talk to, but their website has a no return policy and it seems like they don't offer a warranty.  Maybe I'm reading it wrong.

What do you guys recommend?  I trust PA so I know you guys wouldn't steer me in the wrong direction.
 
View Quote

Email [email protected] we will take care of it for you.

-Dimitri
9/2/2014 10:33:24 AM EDT
[#7]

Quote History
Quoted:


If you load only one round into the magazine, load it and fire, what happens? Does the BCG lock back? or does it close?



If it doesn't lock back then you're under gassed for sure.
View Quote
I should have tried that.

 
9/2/2014 10:33:34 AM EDT
[#8]

Quote History
Quoted:





Email [email protected] we will take care of it for you.



-Dimitri
View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Quote History
Quoted:



Quoted:

This is about a new 7.5" Radical Firearms upper I bought from you guys recently.  I almost described this as a double feed, and then realized that it's a not a double feed but possibly an extraction issue.  I took the new 7.5" upper to the range over the weekend and this is what happens.



I chamber the first round and fire and it goes boom.  Then, click.  I guess I didn't notice the casing hadn't ejected.  I look and notice that the first round had not been ejected and the second round had fed far enough forward that it was ahead of the first one.  I remove the mag and notice that the firing pin had left a slight mark on the primer.  I removed the rounds and tried again and the same thing happens.  I tried this with a PMAG, a USGI mag, and even a Lancer.  I tried with 75 grain and 55 grain with the exact same problem.



The extractor on the BCG seems to work fine and when I cycle it manually, it extracts every single time.  The range officer said he thinks the gas tube is too short.  I'd think a pistol length tube would be suitable for a 7.5 but I'm wondering if not enough pressure is being delivered via the gas tube to cycle it properly.  I assembled the lower myself and use a Spike's T2 buffer.  Since it is new, I figured you are the guys to talk to, first.  I would think Radical Firearms would be the folks to talk to, but their website has a no return policy and it seems like they don't offer a warranty.  Maybe I'm reading it wrong.



What do you guys recommend?  I trust PA so I know you guys wouldn't steer me in the wrong direction.

 


Email [email protected] we will take care of it for you.



-Dimitri
I just did.  Thank you.

 
9/2/2014 11:38:19 AM EDT
[#9]
Thanks to the folks at Primary Arms, again.  They got me in touch with Radical Firearms and I'm working directly with them to get back on track.
 



It's good to know we have local companies who try to take care of their customers.
9/3/2014 11:38:08 AM EDT
[#10]
Quote History
Quoted:
Thanks to the folks at Primary Arms, again.  They got me in touch with Radical Firearms and I'm working directly with them to get back on track.  

It's good to know we have local companies who try to take care of their customers.
View Quote



let us know how it turns out

Dimitri
9/5/2014 10:27:14 AM EDT
[#11]
I'm sorry.  I forgot to post an update.  I went by the Radical firearms storefront and they swapped out BCGs and everything seems to work fine, now.  They fired six shots in a row of XM193 without a hitch.  I'll take it to the range, soon.



Thank you for all your help.  I really appreciate it.
9/5/2014 10:57:20 AM EDT
[#12]
Interesting... wonder what in the BCG could cause that?
9/15/2014 12:45:22 PM EDT
[#13]
Only thing I can think of is an obstruction between the gas key and the carrier that was impeding the flow of gas.
9/15/2014 12:47:41 PM EDT
[#14]
Quote History
Quoted:
Only thing I can think of is an obstruction between the gas key and the carrier that was impeding the flow of gas.
View Quote


Would a loose gas key cause that problem?
9/15/2014 2:26:23 PM EDT
[#15]
Quote History
Quoted:


Would a loose gas key cause that problem?
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Quoted:
Quoted:
Only thing I can think of is an obstruction between the gas key and the carrier that was impeding the flow of gas.


Would a loose gas key cause that problem?


I imagine it would, yes.
9/15/2014 3:11:30 PM EDT
[#16]

Quote History
Quoted:
I imagine it would, yes.
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Quoted:



Quoted:


Quoted:

Only thing I can think of is an obstruction between the gas key and the carrier that was impeding the flow of gas.




Would a loose gas key cause that problem?




I imagine it would, yes.
The O-ring was missing on the BCG.  Radical swapped out the BCG for a nice melonite one and it goes bang just fine, now.