Posted: 4/2/2010 3:03:29 PM EDT
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My survival strategy rests heavily on being foot-mobile and re-grouping and rebuilding with others.
My specially is technology, thus my survival preps are about 40% tech, more details and pics here: http://www.angryludwig.com/blog-post.aspx?postid=bpCFZPPOIT Foot-Mobile is the key here. If you’ve got tech, and you’re on foot, you need a power source that’s renewable. To this end, I’ve built this: 
Its a battery back with standard 12V in and out. (Can charge while in use) Key Features Include: 12.8V @ 16Amps provides up to 204Watts of power in your BOB 13Amp-hours of power is enough to run my laptop computer for over 9 hours in addition to the computers internal 6hr battery. Can recharge from portable solar panel (as little as 4 hours ) or from car battery Battery lasts for 2-3 thousand charge / discharge cycles – 4-6x longer than Lead Acid or Lithium Ion Rated to last over 5 years with every day use, and another 3-4 years with diminished output. Its light, under 4lbs for the entire unit. 
The battery is computerized and has a battery fuel gauge, and power management circuitry that facilitates safe charging and discharging and balances the individual power cells that make up the pack. This is just a prototype design; I’m going to continue to work on it. I’m thinking I might sell these (to a very limited market) in the future. The system works in conjunction with off-the-shelf equipment as shown here for a complete mobile power source. 
FULL SIZE PIC HERE: http://www.angryludwig.com/mediacenter/images/powerkit.jpg Any feedback or suggestions? Ok, its true, I am a bit of a dork, but I'm very excited about this 
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Nope haven’t carried it yet, but its roughly the same weight as a spare battery for my notebook so should come out equal. I do nature photography on the side so power in a backpack has always been kind of a must for me.
As far as survival goes - well I'll be explaining my tech approach in another article. Its not for everyone, but I do have a philosophy on this 
I’ve got nothing but great things to say about the Brunton. It’s actually under-rated and produces more power than it says, even where I live in Illinois which is not premium solar land. I know that just one of the 2 26W panels I carry produces enough power to recharge and operate my cell phone, and run a SAT phone at the same time, under cloudy skys which is pretty good. |
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Nope haven’t carried it yet, but its roughly the same weight as a spare battery for my notebook so should come out equal. I do nature photography on the side so power in a backpack has always been kind of a must for me. As far as survival goes - well I'll be explaining my tech approach in another article. Its not for everyone, but I do have a philosophy on this
I’ve got nothing but great things to say about the Brunton. It’s actually under-rated and produces more power than it says, even where I live in Illinois which is not premium solar land. I know that just one of the 2 26W panels I carry produces enough power to recharge and operate my cell phone, and run a SAT phone at the same time, under cloudy skys which is pretty good. drawing on your knowledge.....where is the best place to aquire them....link? I've been looking for a small unit for charging purposes. |
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Very true, but EMP is not on my top 20 list of things to be concerned about
for the panels - Amazon.com is where I got mine at. Keep in mind, that if your panel is for a fixed location there are much cheaper solutions. I'm set on stationary panels....I have been looking for a portable panel. We have a 360w solar setup. It works well for lights (led) and radios...portable, base, and shortwave recievers. the portable would be carried on atv for charging two-ways. |
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Yep, I have a similar setup.
I know if your going DC to DC (no inverter) it should be no problem. I've charge two Garmin 530s off of a single panel at the same time. The pannel is very light, and small. Very quick to deploy. The only thing you need is something to secure it to the ground so it doesnt blow away. I use tent stakes. |
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EMP = failed preps As long as the pack is not plugged in a land line to charge, there are no long power lines to act as antennas in his design. I am not sure that an EMP would effect this, and I suspect (based on what limited government studies I have read) that it probably would not. |
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EMP = failed preps I still don't get why everybody makes a big fuss over the EMP boogie man. How many EMP bursts have taken out the power grid as opposed to more mundane factors? How many ice storms or blizzards, or foul weather has killed the power as opposed to a high orbit tact nuke that fried all electronics on the ground? Sigh. If you're seriously worried that 1 in 500 Million chance of an EMP taking out your electronics. . .spend 5 bucks for Static shielded bags like what they ship motherboards out and packaged in, wrap up your gear in them and you'll be fine. |
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Not mine but another writeup on this type system http://go.notebookreview.com/?id=525X832&url=http%3A%2F%2F69.65.114.219%2Fsolar%2Fpower-shtf-backpack.pdf&sref=http%3A%2F%2Fforum.notebookreview.com%2Fshowthread.php%3Ft%3D223655 |
Oh no, it's more modern than stone and chisel, it will FAIL and you will DIE, oh the noes.......
Nice setup, have one of my own but not nearly as nice, lots of ideas there! Small electronics like this are easily shielded and EMP is so far down the list of REALISTIC threats for most people as to be hardly worth worrying about. There was no EMP during the recent quake in Chile, none during Katrina and none during the floods right now in the Northeastern USA. The guy with a small amount of power and a laptop has a HUGE advantage over someone who has none in almost any survival situation. |
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Another thread that is similar http://www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=10&f=17&t=632626&page=1 My setup is listed on pg 2 and Pictured on pg 5 Edit: forgot the link  |
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EMP = failed preps emp = highly over rated as an issue. its like worrying about a comet hitting the earth. This is not a survival item. Its something you want to assist you in your recreational activities. Thats not bad, but don't fool yourself into thinking it will do anything other than add dead weight in a survival situation. |
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Sigh. If you're seriously worried that 1 in 500 Million chance of an EMP taking out your electronics. . .spend 5 bucks for Static shielded bags like what they ship motherboards out and packaged in, wrap up your gear in them and you'll be fine. Common static bags do not have much effect in reducing the level of emp. they are static control only. These seem to have some kind of foil on them so might reduce emp. |
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emp = highly over rated as an issue. its like worrying about a comet hitting the earth. This is not a survival item. Its something you want to assist you in your recreational activities. Thats not bad, but don't fool yourself into thinking it will do anything other than add dead weight in a survival situation. True and false, IMO. The battery and the laptop would be with me in a survival situation, but would also be among the first things to be dropped if the weight was too high (if i needd to move on foot). The solar panel, smartphone, data card, and AA battery charger would be among the LAST things to be dropped (also very light). Knowledge is power, and there is a LOT of knowledge on the memory cards. (including many of the best AR15.com posts). I agree on the EMP. Inactive (OFF) electronics have little to fear from anything but very high powered EMP. Plus EMP is extremely unlikely, NUKE (in which case you have bigger things to worry about), and a solar flare on a magnitude that this planet has never experienced are the only real things that would do this. Again if we got hit by a flare like that, you’d have bigger things to worry about like no ozone layer and solar radiation. |
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Sigh. If you're seriously worried that 1 in 500 Million chance of an EMP taking out your electronics. . .spend 5 bucks for Static shielded bags like what they ship motherboards out and packaged in, wrap up your gear in them and you'll be fine. where do you guys get this stuff, or do you make it up on the fly? http://www.ar15.com/archive/topic.html?b=10&f=17&t=631841 ar-jedi |
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Please do not mistake this for a flame. No disrespect is intended... However, I cannot begin to fathom the rationale behind these "preps". The following is a serious question: How does a computer contribute to survival preparations?
I can understand concrete items that contribute to survivability. Some things are indeed technological: Water filters. Communications gear. Some optical rifle sights. Each of these has some degree of 'technology' however each also contributes to the ability to feed, defend, clothe, etc. I do recognize that information is power. However, I have yet to understand how a powered up computer contributes to survival. Books work good for information storage and retreval. Radios work great for communications. I CAN see the usefullness of a battery charging system for use in things like lights, radios, optics, etc. If radios provide communications, and both the brain and written word provide information storage, what does a computer do for you in a survival situation??? |
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frozenny & eracer
In short-term SHTF, communications and access to information. In long-term, data-lots of useful organized data. I sorta use it as an external brain for everything I havn’t had time to learn yet. For example: Many of the best how-tos and guides from this forum are among my files. Also I could use it to interface with a lot of modern technology to repair it (everything’s computerized today). Happy Easter! |
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I personally don't know how many pages of info my toughbook can hold but it is a whole lot simpler to carry my laptop than to carry the number of books with an equal number of pages. I somewhat consider my stuff in the toy category but I stick my night vision in the toy category since that is how it is used these days. Make times really bad and that night vision is going to be awfully useful when trying to keep an eye on things during the night. Now books are not going to need batteries to show what they have stored for info so I am not saying a computer can replace a book, but for someone who rents and might have to bug out it would be a lot simpler to store their info on some thumb drives and what not and take the laptop with them. To some extent we discussed this and someone was going to mess with a netbook and modify it to fit into a pelican case I think and make it a darn tough little netbook. We discussed how some phones can accept little cards and display the info. I know some of the people with ham radios have posted some similar power setups and they gave me some ideas as well. I am not planning to walk on foot and carry my toughbook. To some extent I am learning what my little blackberry can do when it comes to reading info off various items like cards that actually fit in the phone and perhaps an adapter to see if it can read a thumb drive or not. My aunt has a netbook and while it would wind up useless to her I can adapt a lot of what I have to make the thing darn useful for showing info and it is a lot lighter than my toughbook. I personally don't put much thought into emp. I have some books but depending on how I am bugging out they won't be going. If emp wipes out all my electronics then so be it. I have the knowledge needed to let me get by at that point with what I have. But if I bug out in my vehicle then darn right the tough book and thumb drives and burned cds and burned dvds of info are going with me. And having a way to keep it working and showing that info is kind of important because I am not about to try and print it all out because I won't be stocking printer ink or that much printer paper. As much as I would love to take a ton, literally a ton, of books with me it is not really feasable. And even for those who plan to bug in a house fire or tornado or other mother nature hissy fit might wipe out your library. If I have a chance to grab my go bag and run it has my laptop and a lot of info in it. That site about listening to katrina has some pointers on that stuff. Anyway, just my ramble on information. As nice as books are they are bulky and heavy and can be lost due to no fault of your own. The same could happen to my laptop. My phone. My aunt's netbook. And all the other stuff out there that could read the info I have stored on media devices. But it is simpler to chase little puters and smart phones to read my storage devices than it is to chase a library. |
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Very good points thanks for the backup. ; )
I just want to chime in that I replaced my Netbook, with a Toughbook. Mine (a bit older one) consumed 45W of power, my toughbook only 18. That means that I can direct-power it from solar. Plus a better day-light viewable screen and “tablet” format which is superior for data-access IMO. I keep most my data con micro-SD cards which can be placed into small USB readers for my notebook, or used by my smartphone. Then again, in the end, the notebook, like the NVG, would be among the first things to be left out should I need to drop weight. The data however will not leave me. |
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Quoted: frozenny & eracer In short-term SHTF, communications and access to information. In long-term, data-lots of useful organized data. I sorta use it as an external brain for everything I havn’t had time to learn yet. For example: Many of the best how-tos and guides from this forum are among my files. Also I could use it to interface with a lot of modern technology to repair it (everything’s computerized today). Happy Easter! I've thought about this a bit. Communication. The internet will most likely be down very quickly in a SHTF scenario, turning the laptop into a storage device. Maybe not though - I am guessing about that. What happened during Katrina? Did the affected hve internat access? Data. I bet I can store most everything I need on a big flash drive. My WM6 cell phone can read that data, and it weighs MUCH less, and consumes MUCH less power. Interfacing with other equipment. Again, my cell phone will do that if the other equipment has a USB port. And I could carry a USB-Serial adapter if I thought I'd need a terminal to interface to an older piece of gear. To me, a BOB is all about saving weight wherever possible. Subsituting a laptop for a PocketPC just seems...inefficient. T'each his own, though. |
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Communications? With a laptop?
A radio can pull signals from areas that still have power. You can obtain shortwave signal from some truly astounding distances. I have some very real concerns about using a laptop for communications. This would assume there is some form of internet access. If power is down to such an extent that chargers are needed for your electronics, I have some serious concerns regarding access to the 'net. I can tell you that in many areas of the US there is no internet access (or even cell phone access) when the power and grid are ON. This is a neat charging set up. However, there are about five dozen other things you need to a far greater extent than a computer. If you are buggin on foot, trust me, access to gobs of information stored on a hard drive or flash drive isn't likely going to be anywhere in the top 20 or 30 most needed items.... Nice set up. Think reaaaaaaaaaallllly hard before you start luggin this stuff. Set up a nice four or five day 50 mile hike. Pack your bag, clothes, food, water filter, meds, first aid kit, knife, side arm, rifle, radio, shelter and rain gear. It's not going to be fun with a 68 lb pack. You might miss the electronic toys (access to your email games, etc) but you can survive. If you are leaving food or actual tools at home for the computer you are likley missing something really important. |
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Thanks talontsi_95!
You make a good point frozenny – thanks for disagreeing without being an ass – It’s appreciated. 
Eracer – you care correct also, except about the part where the net goes down. I’ve worked on physical internet backbones and trust me – they will outlast most of us. Even a direct nuke hit wouldn’t take them down. For most people I assume that the net would “appear” to go down, but tap directly into a junction or trunk line and you’ll more than likely have access. Your right though, I’d prefer a notebook, but the smartphone (my backup) issmaller. I have a lot of software tools that require a full OS, that I’d like, not need to keep with me. If you’re interested, this my full setup (it’s not only tech). Weighs 48lbs total and is designed for my area and skills specify : http://www.angryludwig.com/blog-post.aspx?postid=bpCFZPPOIT I'll be replaceing some of this stuff with my battery pack once I finish it up. |
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This is not a survival item. Its something you want to assist you in your recreational activities. Thats not bad, but don't fool yourself into thinking it will do anything other than add dead weight in a survival situation. That's my impression, too. Neat gizmos, but only tangentially related to preparedness, especially if the plan is to haul this stuff around in a backpack. I think the OP needs to spend a week in the backcountry and living out of his pack to see what what's useful and what's dead weight. His pack looks brand new, not a speck of dirt on it. |
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Anyway, just my ramble on information. As nice as books are they are bulky and heavy and can be lost due to no fault of your own. [/span] [/div] I don't understand why you'd need a library if you're in a refugee situation where you're being forced to flee on foot. What are you going to have to look up? I can understand having personal info on a flash drive, but don't see the point of lugging around a laptop. |
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Because eventually you stop running and make yourself useful again. So you're going to start life from scratch with nothing but your BOB? Not trying to be an asshole (not trying not to be either  ), but I just don't understand the plan here. BOBs are to get you through 2-3 bad days in the event of a natural disaster––-food, water, clothing, a handgun, that sort of thing, maybe even a little radio to listen to the news. Rebuilding civilization will require a bit more than a BOB, even if it does have a cool laptop and solar panel set up (and it is cool).
I have a well used BOB / backcountry pack that I keep (mostly) ready to go at all times, but I'll admit that I find a lot of bugging out scenarios to be unrealistic, at best. If you're bugging out on foot, something has gone terribly, terribly wrong. And bugging out will almost certainly be limited to localized natural disaster scenarios, not TEOTWAWKI. And fair enough about your new pack, I just see so many BOBs where it's obvious the guy hasn't even taken it outdoors, much less used it in the backcountry. I looked at your blog and it looks like you've done some field testing. I do disagree with your strategy, though. I used to spend a lot of time thinking about the best calibers for SHTF, what should go in a BOB, etc., but my preps have morphed into being much more centered around skill building and being able to make due with a limited income (extended economic problems are far more likely than global thermonuclear war, zombie hordes, and the like). Lots more gardening than shooting, more time spent filling my pantry with home canned food than thinking about BOBs, BOLs, BOVs, etc. |
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Rebuilding civilization will require a bit more than a BOB, even if it does have a cool laptop and solar panel set up (and it is cool). But it's such a survival-fiction turn on. Just think... the lone-warrior, slogging through the burned out country-side, fending off hordes of biker-gangs with his AR15 while cradling the information needed to rebuild society. Hiding by day while recharging his laptop and playing Spider Solitaire, and traveling at night using only the glow of a now useless (but fully charged) cell-phone to illuminate his way, our hero makes his away across the land, comforted by the thought that those nay-sayers in the Survival forum are living with their stone knives and bear skins while he is now the Keeper of Knowledge. OP, I think your power-pack looks cool and all and good job building it, but you've got to realize that the odds of ever having to use this kit for its intended purpose is just about about nil. If you're building this kit just because it's a fun hobby, hey that's great, but if you seriously think this will be your ace-in-the-survival-hole someday, I think it's time to take a step back. |
| For all of you saying this technology is useless and you have a radio for comm, do your wife, kids, family, friends, neighbors have radios on them turned on all the time to communicate with you? Ok now how many of those people check their emails religiously? Not to mention Skype type capabilities. If he has some kind of smart phone there are apps letting him know where wireless hotspots are not to mention that new phones can be used as a wireless hub. Also you all should know to prepare for the most likely SHTF events first. Many of those scenarios would still involve phones and internet being up in some locations. |
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I guarantee you, when you sitting in you BOL and all of a sudden you receive a “wireless network found” signal and you have access to my p0rn stash it will be a happy day indeed ; )
Seriously though - Deadmeat99 - you're funny and clever, but you've got me all wrong. Cathan91 – I find your post intresting. You said: I do disagree with your strategy, though. I used to spend a lot of time thinking about the best calibers for SHTF, what should go in a BOB, etc., but my preps have morphed into being much more centered around skill building and being able to make due with a limited income (extended economic problems are far more likely than global thermonuclear war, zombie hordes, and the like). Here’s why: I agree with you completely, but you disagree with me. Perhaps I’m not explaining it right. That is my plan. To simplify, skill and tools over gear. However, then I disagree with you on this one: Lots more gardening than shooting, more time spent filling my pantry with home canned food than thinking about BOBs, BOLs, BOVs, etc. That’s where I got to too before I realized just how immobile and weighed down my preps had made me. I responded in more detail in your post. |
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Everyone seems to get hung up on my computer!
Listen, I’m not going to rebuild society with it, but I belive that if you’re a carpenter, you should have your hammer, a soldier, your rifle, a medic, your meds, and a tech wizard – your computer. It’s that simple. |
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Everyone seems to get hung up on my computer! Listen, I’m not going to rebuild society with it, but I belive that if you’re a carpenter, you should have your hammer, a soldier, your rifle, a medic, your meds, and a tech wizard – your computer. It’s that simple. I'm happy to see that there are folks here who can understand and appreciate the options you have created for yourself by putting a lot of thought into your power pack. The knowledge you gained from your efforts has made you stronger whether or not you ever need to use it, and any SHTF possibilities that might arise will likely test that knowlege. As far as those who have little imagination and may think paracord, guns and ammo, some food, etc will solve most of their problems, well they are likely in for a rude surprise someday, and likely have already missed many opportunities in life. |
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This is an interesting discussion.
I can see the allure of having all that info stored just waiting for use. Imagine if you will, traveling on foot somewhere - you can look up edible flora and fauna, navigation, how to build a shelter, etc. YES you should already know this info, but I bet not everyone does (myself included). That's probably all you'd use the laptop/notebook for, barring a fair bit of luck being able to use a wireless card of some sort to communicate - and yes being able to communicate with the outside world would be also very useful. But you should be able to survive at least short term without the tech assistance as well. Where such a setup would really shine is a major SHTF wherein you had to leave your library of books behind and bugout, and are setting up shop somewhere else as it were. Whether you are stuck in a refugee camp, or an isolated village/community somewhere in the boonies, having a lot of survival related info would be very handy. How many of us know how to build expedient what-evers, sanitation, field fortifications, medical info, etc, etc. YES we ought to know these things already...basically having a treasure trove of how-to's could be crucial. I don't think you could rebuild an entire civilization this way, but it could give that community a big help. Being as this kind of setup isn't exactly feather-light, serious consideration might be given as to what you are sacrificing to retain this capability when you are on foot. I've fooled with bugout rigs for years, and a fairly barebones setup with the capability to fight runs 40+ lbs, and that's only with a couple days food. I sure as heck wouldn't want to burden myself with another 15-20lbs of computer gear.  But something else might be worked out, say let the wife carry such gear and only give her a pistol - she's not going to be very useful in a fight (she hardly ever shoots and as such a rifle and it's support gear would be of very limited use). BUT now that we have a toddler to care for a bugout on foot would be a nightmare. It'd be very difficult to make any significant distance, and forget about not making noise, and fighting? Lotsa luck there.
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It's a nice little setup. I might have to look at the little toughbooks for my day bag. (Not bug out, just the bag I carry daily... I'm hard on stuff.)
I disagree totally about how useful it is if things go south. Day to day, great. Packing it in camo and calling it bug out material is a stretch imho. The overall pack screams "I've never been carried far!".... But the OP isn't unique, I see people every day justifying spending money on something cool under the guise of SHTF...
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....... But something else might be worked out, say let the wife carry such gear and only give her a pistol - she's not going to be very useful in a fight (she hardly ever shoots and as such a rifle and it's support gear would be of very limited use). BUT now that we have a toddler to care for a bugout on foot would be a nightmare. It'd be very difficult to make any significant distance, and forget about not making noise, and fighting? Lotsa luck there. That last part of your post reminds me of a bible verse: Matthew chapter 24 17 A person out on the deck of a roof must not go down into the house to pack. 18 A person out in the field must not return even to get a coat. 19 How terrible it will be for pregnant women and for nursing mothers in those days. 20 And pray that your flight will not be in winter or on the Sabbath. 21 For there will be greater anguish than at any time since the world began. And it will never be so great again. |