Posted: 4/28/2010 11:57:18 AM EDT
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We've got a horse. We're planning on acquiring another one. They are for pleasure riding but I'm keeping in the back of my mind, their potential usefulness in a hard-core SHTF situation.
Anyone else thought of this? TC |
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Wrong place to ask that question, way to much horse hate in arcom.
I have several and I think that they would be the ultimate bov at least here in Idaho. I can get to places in the backcountry where no one will be, I can carry enough supplies to get along just fine. Plus if the wild game runs out I could eat them. My horses are not frail, they don't require massive vet bills, I can trim and doctor them so they are not a huge expence. |
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Wrong place to ask that question, way to much horse hate in arcom. I have several and I think that they would be the ultimate bov at least here in Idaho. I can get to places in the backcountry where no one will be, I can carry enough supplies to get along just fine. Plus if the wild game runs out I could eat them. My horses are not frail, they don't require massive vet bills, I can trim and doctor them so they are not a huge expence. Just check out the horse girl thread in GD if you need a laugh on the subject. 
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| Horses are awesome, just in general. My fiancee is a horse vet. Started her horse vet career with 2 horses, now down to zero. Hers were pasture ornaments and cost a fair amount to maintain. After not using them for a couple years and just watching them get fat and do nothing, she got rid of them. I think horses would be great in SHTF, but beyone that, we currently have no use for them. |
| The last time I ate a horse it tasted like fourwheeler. If your looking for a horse right now around hear is a great time to buy people can’t hardly give them away. I pastured 23 horses this winter for people and all but 9 of them have been picked up, the last guy will not come pickup the remaining. Im going to give him another week and then there going to the canner. |
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I like horses and given the area they are in could be huge advantage but also think the closer to society you are your going to be forced to shoot someone in the head who's trying to eat your pony or join in the festivities of apaloosa stew.
If your going jerimiah johnson horses are great. |
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I think the person who brought up the 4 wheelers had a good point.
Horse might be useful, but you also have to look at the alternatives. A 4 wheeler I would imagine can do nearly everything a horse can with much lower up keep. However someone also reminded us all, horses can be used as a food source should things get really hectic. Let me say, after unknowingly eating some horse steak in France a few years ago, Horse is delicious. that's my .02 |
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I ate plenty of horse in Italy. It's like any other critter, some's tough, and some's tender.
As for SHTF, depends alot on where you are, and how bad it gets. If you have horses anyway and enjoy riding them, then if things get that bad, maybe you have an asset, until then they are a pleasure item and a financial liability. YMMV |
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We went the four wheeler route. You only have to feed a four wheeler when you use it. True. But in a survival sense, gasoline doesn't grow in pastures.  unless you buy a diesel four wheeler, then it does grow in the pasture.
there are certain breeds of horses that are much better than others for hard work. for example, there are some wild mustangs in OK, that make excellent, low maintenance horses. there are also certain breeds that are more tailored for mountain work, these are also a stout breed and better suited for the hard work. donkeys would function well as a BOV. |
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We had horses when I was a kid, but I've never owned one since leaving home. My understanding is that mules are better than horses as to riding and hauling. And by riding, I'm referring to long hauls, not a half hour at the stables.
ETA-Here's Big Jake. He's a Belgian gelding and stands 6'11" tall. He weighs 2600 lbs. 
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We have but they are a pain in the ass to take care of and trying to keep up with horse meds and extra feed that they require, I am not sure if the pros outweigh the cons. We went the four wheeler route. You only have to feed a four wheeler when you use it. Ever read "Farmer in the Sky"? ...Horses can make more horses... Although you are correct, they are a short term logistical nightmare. They are however, long term self sustaining with the proper planning. |
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Wow. That's a work horse.
We maintain two horses. I certianly see everyones point about maintaining horses vs. a small ATV. Good discussion. We take care of most of our equine issues ourselves. So it is not a huge drain. Comforting to know I wont need to worry about finding a gas pump out in the middle of the Allegheny Forest. |
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We have but they are a pain in the ass to take care of and trying to keep up with horse meds and extra feed that they require, I am not sure if the pros outweigh the cons. We went the four wheeler route. You only have to feed a four wheeler when you use it. First post always wins. I have two horses and take care of 3 more at my neighbors (medication, trim, train, etc) They sure take a lot of time more than just hop in my little cub cadet. Having said that, in SHTF situation, you may have more time and energy to take care/use them. |
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I've never been thrown from my ATV. It doesn't kick or bite me. It doesn't startle when my gun goes off.
It doesn't fight me to get to the closest Mare-in-heat in a rage to tear through barbed wire fences. It doesn't lay down and roll in mudholes with a saddle on it's back. If I'm hungry, I'll eat my neighbor's horses. 
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I've never been thrown from my ATV. It doesn't kick or bite me. It doesn't startle when my gun goes off. It doesn't fight me to get to the closest Mare-in-heat in a rage to tear through barbed wire fences. It doesn't lay down and roll in mudholes with a saddle on it's back. If I'm hungry, I'll eat my neighbor's horses. Sounds like you either have a shitty trained horse, or never had a good one. My Dad does Mounted action shooting, the horse doesn't give a damn at all, and is well behaved. |
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I rode a horse for a week a few years ago on a bison hunt. My butt still hurts. I ended up walking for the last part of the week. That is the worst form of transportation imaginable if you are not used to it.
The wild horses here have pretty much got out of control, as they have no predators and the government can only sell them as pets, not dog food. I imagine the mustang population would quickly be decimated if people got hungry. |
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[url]http://www.seattlepi.com/getaways/032797/goat27.html[url]
Bred to go where horses fear to tread, goats pack quite a load By JOE HARWOOD TRI-CITY HERALD FINLEY, Wash. –– Bred to climb the craggy rocks and sheer cliffs of the Himalayas, Arnie appears amused by the bumbling human who is struggling up the loose basalt hillside. Arnie and his buddy, P.B., glad to be out after a long winter in the barn, are waiting for the human to catch up. They trot up to the edge of the cliff, a hoof-width away from a 40-foot drop to the rocks below, then peer down at their master still shuffling up the grade. The two goats don't seem to notice the saddles covering their reddish-brown backs or the packs hanging over their shorthaired flanks. But then, why should they? Arnie and P.B. are pack goats, born for the backcountry –– the rougher the terrain, the better. Roger Slack, owner of "the boys," as he calls them, and a goat ambassador of sorts, finally scrambles over the crest. "Show me a horse that can walk up that," Slack said, out of breath and pointing to the steep rockslide dotted with boulders and crevasses. Slack can't understand why more people don't use goats as pack animals, or why goats in general have a bad rap. Their reputation as sneaky, stinky or cantankerous animals isn't entirely justified, he says. But it's not entirely unjustified either. "People think that goats stink, and the bucks certainly do," Slack said. "During rut they get pretty rank." Even in the Bible, sheep sit at the right hand of God while goats are relegated to the left. But Slack says goats are not sneaky, they're just curious. To Slack and others, goats are amiable beasts of burden willing to help share the load for hikers, campers or hunters. "People need to see what they can do and where they can go," he said. "There's real opportunity here." Slack owns a five-acre farm in Finley and is a maintenance worker in Kennewick. He started raising goats for pack animals 10 years ago, about the time he decided to give up flat-track motorcycle racing for a more family-oriented hobby. "I started with one goat as a 4-H project for my oldest son and I got hooked," he said. Slack had used horses to pack his gear into the Blue Mountains for camping trips. Now he takes a string of goats. "With horses, you have to pack the feed in," he said. "Goats are ruminate feeders, like deer, only goats will eat just about anything." Even the bark off trees and sagebrush. Despite their appetites, Slack said the environmental impact of goats on wilderness areas is significantly less than with larger animals such as horses or llamas. "There's no trail erosion because these guys prefer not to walk on the trails," Slack said. And goats tend to stay close to their human handlers. The castrated males, called wethers, make the best pack animals. And wethers –– unlike rams or bucks –– don't exude the infamous and malodorous rutting scent. "They're curious, but they'll gladly follow you along just like the family dog," Slack said. The trick to raising a good pack goat is to bond with it immediately after birth, Slack said. That means bottle-feeding when the kid hits the ground. "Once they bond with you, 90 percent of your work is done," he said. Slack said he picks about one out of every 100 goats born on his farm to become a pack animal. After breeding goats for several years, he said he knows what sort of animal he's going to get, well before conception. In fact, when he selects a specific frozen straw filled with goat semen out of his liquid nitrogen tank to impregnate a doe, he has a clear idea of what he wants The tank, by the way, is insured for $25,000 and holds the semen of hundreds of bucks, including past grand-champion goats that have been dead as long as eight years. Slack said he's sold pack goats to people in Alaska, Colorado, Idaho, Utah, Wyoming, Canada and around Washington. "It's a strange business," he said. "Three years ago, I sold 50 for pack animals. Last year I didn't sell any." He said once people realize the benefits of pack goats, they usually start breeding their own. Slack sells a newborn pack goat, usually of Oberhasli or LaMancha stock, for $50, plus $25 for each month he raised the goat. In the mountains, Arnie and P.B.'s superior breeding is evident in the loads they can carry –– about 50 pounds each –– and their disciplined, friendly demeanor. Arnie, a 5-year-old Oberhasli, weighs 230 pounds. P.B., who is 4, weighs about 210. Because a goat can't carry as much as a mule or horse, Slack simply brings more goats when he heads into the hills. "Not only can I feed six goats for what it costs to feed one horse, I can pack more on six goats than I could on one horse," he said. For packing, Slack attaches a miniature version of the old crossbuck saddle used on pack horses and mules. The crossbuck has a nylon cinch, breast strap and a rump strap to hold the load in place. The saddle bags, or panniers, hang from the crossbucks with loops. It's essential to weight each side equally, Slack said. When he heads into the hills for a camping trip, he usually will place a sleeping bag between sawbucks as a top load. When goats are in shape, they can cover about 15 miles a day, depending on the terrain and the physical limitations of their human handlers. "They like steep climbs and nasty conditions," Slack said. "And if the packs are weighted properly, they don't even notice they are wearing them." In the wilderness, goats are a source of curiosity for other hikers and the indigenous animals. "Whenever I meet someone on the trail, I end up explaining that, yes, these are goats, and yes, I use them for pack animals," he said. "People always say 'What a good idea, I never thought of that.'" |
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I have horses. Too much work. -Foxxz Agreed. One thing I have to warn those of you who don’t know about already is what I call “horse silliness.” Watch this disease, particularly if you have female around. I’ve been married for 23 years to a woman who is better than I deserve. She has very few weaknesses…except horses. She grew up in the city and her grandfather gave her a horse. They kept it on some land about 5 miles from where the family lived. Now the girl is a horse “expert.” If she only know ½ as much as she thought she did it might be different. I grew up in the country and there is one thing I’ve found out, particularly about city girls. Even city girl that knows the difference between a mare and a gelding is a horse “expert,” regardless of how many mistakes they make around them or with them. It is kinda of like someone picking up a pistol and asking, “What gauge is this?” You know they don’t know what they are talking about. “Horse silliness” manifests itself almost exclusively in women. I once described to a friend that horses are animals that embody many of the bad characteristics of stereotypical of females: unfettered emotions, high maintenance, and need lots of attention. Those who say they’ve watched their horses sit and grow fat, I can related. Over the past ten years, probably $15-20k has been wasted on horses and all we have to show for it is a bunch of horse piles. Heck, each year I might as well buy a new, top of the line AR and then, at the end of the year throw it away. That is the kind of money we waste of horses each year. Of course, I’m the one stuck caring for the horses in many occasions. She’d do it, but isn’t experienced enough around animals to realize how dangerous the work really is. Until she gets really hurt, or one of our kids does, she won’t. And then she’ll feel guilty and I’ll have to spend time convincing her everything is going to be alright, even though, if she was a man, I’d ask “well what the hell did you expect?” Run through fences and tear down fences? Check. Shy away whenever something really scary, like a blade of grass, spooks them? Been there? Act like complete idiots when the mare is in heat? Yeah, they act as rationale as Bill Clinton. Don’t get me wrong, horses can be useful. I grew up on the farm and used one daily for, what is that word, “work?” Horses are WORK animal and would be good for a long term SHTF situation, but in today’s situation, all they are is a headache, a drain on the wallet, and a big pain. They are not 1,000 pound substitutes for a lap dog. If you live on a farm, great. If you don’t, then don’t think twice or even three times, but longer about getting one of these time consuming, money sucking animals. And watch yourself around your wives and daughters because, even though men like horses, most men are realistic about what a horse is and what they can be used for. Almost exclusively women and teen girls are overtaken by “horse silliness” which would be fine except we men, much like PMS, have to bear the brunt of the disease. Figure out what you are going to use the horse for, what the monetary value of the horse is, then compare it to the complete costs of the horse and you’ll find, in most cases, they are a big, time consuming waste of money. |
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Quoted: Quoted: .I have horses. Too much work. -Foxxz Don’t get me wrong, horses can be useful. I grew up on the farm and used one daily for, what is that word, “work?” Horses are WORK animal and would be good for a long term SHTF situation, but in today’s situation, all they are is a headache, a drain on the wallet, and a big pain. They are not 1,000 pound substitutes for a lap dog. If you live on a farm, great. If you don’t, then don’t think twice or even three times, but longer about getting one of these time consuming, money sucking animals. And watch yourself around your wives and daughters because, even though men like horses, most men are realistic about what a horse is and what they can be used for. Almost exclusively women and teen girls are overtaken by “horse silliness” which would be fine except we men, much like PMS, have to bear the brunt of the disease. Figure out what you are going to use the horse for, what the monetary value of the horse is, then compare it to the complete costs of the horse and you’ll find, in most cases, they are a big, time consuming waste of money. Best post I have read in quite a while....I use horses on an almost daily basis...To me they are a tool, a handy tool sometimes, but other times a pickup, tractor with feed wagon, or "gasp" even a four wheeler can get the job done more efficiently...The Horses definitely earn their keep as our country is very rocky and brushy making any kind of off road travel a snails pace proposition.... When I was single, I had multitudes of women just wanting to come out and ride...I will usually not ride unless it is work (Cow or Hunting) related issue...So I took them to work...Most of the time our ride would last less than an hour before the fun was over.... Horses are good if you have a reason for them to return an investment.... Also in this pic, another tool, Russ the Dog....   And yes I have used these pics quite a bit...Don't carry a camera much...One more thing to break or lose... |
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Wrong place to ask that question, way to much horse hate in arcom. I have several and I think that they would be the ultimate bov at least here in Idaho. I can get to places in the backcountry where no one will be, I can carry enough supplies to get along just fine. Plus if the wild game runs out I could eat them. My horses are not frail, they don't require massive vet bills, I can trim and doctor them so they are not a huge expence. finally someone besides me with horses not pets |
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Wrong place to ask that question, way to much horse hate in arcom. I have several and I think that they would be the ultimate bov at least here in Idaho. I can get to places in the backcountry where no one will be, I can carry enough supplies to get along just fine. Plus if the wild game runs out I could eat them. My horses are not frail, they don't require massive vet bills, I can trim and doctor them so they are not a huge expence. finally someone besides me with horses not pets |
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I wish I had a horse or two. Not to be in the city...
I really don't have a clue about owning horses; I've only been on a horse a single time as a kid. I've been meaning to pick up a Horses for Dummies book, just haven't gotten around to it. Does anyone have any good sites for learning about horses? There's one I've been checking out, but I don't know shit from shinola about horses so I couldn't say one way or the other. http://www.functionalhorsemanship.com/ |
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I've never been thrown from my ATV. It doesn't kick or bite me. It doesn't startle when my gun goes off. It doesn't fight me to get to the closest Mare-in-heat in a rage to tear through barbed wire fences. It doesn't lay down and roll in mudholes with a saddle on it's back. If I'm hungry, I'll eat my neighbor's horses. Sounds like you either have a shitty trained horse, or never had a good one. My Dad does Mounted action shooting, the horse doesn't give a damn at all, and is well behaved. I've owned over 20, been riding horses since I was 4. Been riding them for 34 years now. I started breaking horses for my papaw when I was 14. Your Daddy might have had a horse that didn't give a damn at all and was well behaved, but if he has his balls and gets within smelling distance of a mare in heat, your Daddy is going to have his hands full. Every horse is different, they all have a unique personality much like a dog or man does. However, horses can be unpredictable, ornery beasts and when it's mind is set on doing something, you ain't going to stop it. I've owned some good ones and a couple of bad ones. I've seen a man get his back broke trying to break an Appaloosa stallion I ended up owning myself later. I didn't break that one, my papaw did. He turned out to be one of the best horses I ever owned. I miss Geronimo. I used to ride him bareback in the woods and all over the back roads and pipelines where I grew up. And I broke him from being gunshy. I was knocked off of my first horse when I was 7. She was a runaway Shetland pony that was "barn broke" and I didn't have the strength to turn her. She ran me into a pine limb and I ended up on my back in a ditch. 
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Have one horse and looking for one more. If you look you can get one for cheap. Many people in my area are almost giving them away for the fact they can not afford the food, meds.etc. due to the rate of unemployment in these parts.
As the rest have said, at the current time they can be a PITA. But when SHTF, you will be with your horse 24/7 It's one thing to have a horse as a pet,riding it every few days as such. But it's another for transportation/survival on a day to day basis. Growing or "special" horses will need grain, but for most, just a pasture will be fine. The problem is water... they drink a bunch. ( up to 25 gallons a day ) Shooting a gun/rifle off your horse is fun.... once you desensitize them to it
Horses have been used for thousands of years before the horseless carriage. Don't limit yourself only to the conveniences of the modern world. |
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Maybe I'm spoiled; the only horses I've ever owned were mustangs. Yeah, they take some work, but they give back too. Yeah, they can be ornery, and they are known to bit occasionally (as my scars will attest). but as Bad_example said, they've been mankind's servants for thousands of years, and that's a decent track record.
As for relying solely on the rubber shod gas burners, I've been wandering around town lately and noticing that this past winter has been pretty hard on the local roads. Construction crews have been pretty busy trying to bring them back. Got to thinking what it would be like driving cross town if those construction guys took a couple of years off. Conclusions were not pretty. If you've got the water and the grass, a good mustang or two would be a great idea, though I'd stay the hell away from stable queens. |
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I've never been thrown from my ATV. It doesn't kick or bite me. It doesn't startle when my gun goes off. It doesn't fight me to get to the closest Mare-in-heat in a rage to tear through barbed wire fences. It doesn't lay down and roll in mudholes with a saddle on it's back. If I'm hungry, I'll eat my neighbor's horses. Sounds like you either have a shitty trained horse, or never had a good one. My Dad does Mounted action shooting, the horse doesn't give a damn at all, and is well behaved. I've owned over 20, been riding horses since I was 4. Been riding them for 34 years now. I started breaking horses for my papaw when I was 14. Your Daddy might have had a horse that didn't give a damn at all and was well behaved, but if he has his balls and gets within smelling distance of a mare in heat, your Daddy is going to have his hands full. Every horse is different, they all have a unique personality much like a dog or man does. However, horses can be unpredictable, ornery beasts and when it's mind is set on doing something, you ain't going to stop it. I've owned some good ones and a couple of bad ones. I've seen a man get his back broke trying to break an Appaloosa stallion I ended up owning myself later. I didn't break that one, my papaw did. He turned out to be one of the best horses I ever owned. I miss Geronimo. I used to ride him bareback in the woods and all over the back roads and pipelines where I grew up. And I broke him from being gunshy. I was knocked off of my first horse when I was 7. She was a runaway Shetland pony that was "barn broke" and I didn't have the strength to turn her. She ran me into a pine limb and I ended up on my back in a ditch.
That happened to my sister when we were kids. Brings back memories. 
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I don't know how many we have right now. I'm gonna guess 25 or so.
The kids don't ride 'em at all so they're basically pets. The tack room just sits there closed up full of saddles, bridles, rigging, tools etc. We don't really have to fool with vets and meds much and we have plenty of space for them so other than feeding them in the winter they aren't much extra work. We can do most of the hoof care and minor doctoring ourselves. We already feed about 50 Herefords and we have plenty of hay right here. We also have a 2 hitch convertible road buggy and some of the old field implements and hitches for them as well. If SHTF they would rather quickly become either a valuable work/ transportation animal, trade items or food if it got really bad. |
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Mtnpatriot sent me an e-mail telling me about this thread on using horses for survival.
Thanks Mtnpatriot for listing my site: http://www.functionalhorsemanship.com Lots of good posts on horses,..some hate them, some own them – which is usually the case with horses. Way too many horse owners that should not be owning horses as they will not treat their horses with any fairness or learn to do so. Horses are a large part of my life. I own them, train them, train other client’s horses, used them for LE work as a Conservation LEO; taught horsemanship and tracking to SF teams and would not consider a survival plan that did not incorporate horses and their capabilities. Several of you are right about horses most likely being available for barter or trade after any collapse – many available now cheaply due to the economy; horses are a large expense and a lot of trouble if you don’t know what you are doing; and, really only viable if you have water and pasture to support and the area that support using them. There are many places I can take a horse that you can’t follow on an ATV and some circumstances were the quietness of the horse is preferable to a loud ATV. Most horses can go bare footed (un-shod) and you can use pull on hoof boots is you are transiting a really rough area. Somebody was correct about eating horses too. Good grub as the Europeans, who we exported hundreds of thousands of pounds of horse meat to, will attest. We don’t export horse meat anymore as wrong headed animal lovers got the Gov’t to cut off funding for inspections of these plants. Safe Journey to all. |
I've had horses all my life...literally. My mom was raised training them, and at 72, she still does. I started riding as soon as I could sit up on my own, and was actively training them from the age of 7. Been doing it ever since. At 51, that gives me a bit of experience. I've also co-authored 3 books on the subject, all published in multiple languages. We sold out of several printings, so apparently someone else values what I have to say about it too. I've trained them for the track, for dressage, for jumping, for roping, for cutting, and for just pleasure among other disciplines. I also do most of my own veterinary work, and even have some of the local vets coming to me for advice (since few specialize in large animals anymore). And yes, I do my own farrier work when I need to, although my back bitches a blue streak when I do. Guess I ain't as young as I used to be. My herd stays in a state of flux, but right now it's somewhere around 25-30, with most of them on my farm, but a few in my back yard (I live in an equestrian neighborhood several miles from town). My advice to folks that are thinking of getting into horses as potential BOVs is DON'T!!!!! Horses can be a lot of fun, but they are expensive and a pain in the ass if you don't already know how to take care of them. Hell, they are a pain in the ass even if you DO!!! Save yourself some trouble and get a 4-wheeler. Yeah, gas may become an issue, but getting hurt on a horse that you don't know shit about can be a bigger issue. And trust me, you mess with horses long enough, you're gonna get hurt. I've got enough broken legs, broken arms, broken ribs, fractured vertabrae and concussions to speak from experience on that too. I don't ride the wild ones anymore, but I still manage an occassional broken toe or finger if I drop my guard even a little bit. And a 4-wheeler does not require care when you are not riding it...horses, they invent ways to cause you headaches. If you live in a remote area, where there is plenty of graze and you can find some low-maintenance horses, maybe give it a try. Otherwise, get something else. You'll thank me in the long run.
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My wife is a vet. We live out west where it's dry on a large acreage... We sold ours.
In a hard core shtf, or the more likely depression, feeding a horse, worming, shoeing, vaccinations all require more energy (or money) than maintaining our fleet of bicycles, which will get us the 5 miles/20 miles to town a lot faster anyway. On trails off road, I still run circles around the horses (obviously depends on both the bike rider and the horse/rider!).. Horses require a lot of maintenance - The steeds that run our pastures now-a-days won't hold up under heavy workloads without proper care, IMHO. My wife did all the shoeing, worming, vaccinations, etc, and they are still expensive. I was relieved when she decided she didn't want them anymore because it's about like getting rid of a cell phone bill - A monthly 'charge' that you really can't avoid. Keep bute, wormer, etc so you can take care of basic stuff. That said, if you have them, enjoy them! They might come in useful. In our case, we spend a lot more time on bikes anyway, and our focus had shifted... It didn't make sense to keep them. |
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We have but they are a pain in the ass to take care of and trying to keep up with horse meds and extra feed that they require, I am not sure if the pros outweigh the cons. We went the four wheeler route. You only have to feed a four wheeler when you use it. Ever read "Farmer in the Sky"? ...Horses can make more horses... Although you are correct, they are a short term logistical nightmare. They are however, long term self sustaining with the proper planning. Having watch more than my share of horse trainers, and the occasional wreck ending in stitches, I wouldn't say they are self sustaining... They take time and energy to continue to provide a useful purpose for packing/hauling/transportation. They would however keep producing food if you were inclined to go that route.
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I've seen a few folks talking about horses being "self-sustaining" as part of their argument for keeping them. Lemme tell you a few things. First, most of the male horses out there are geldings!! In other words, they have been cut. There is a reason for this!!!! Geldings tend to be more gentle, easier to keep, healthier, and live longer. Stallions, on the other hand, are a whole new level of pain in the ass! You think it is hard to keep your male Labrador in the backyard when the neighbor's female dog goes into heat??!! Try a stallion when he gets a sniff of poontang!! Your Labrador is maybe 75-80 lbs, and can't jump over even a moderate fence, although given time he may be able to dig under it. Now, take your male Lab, subtract all common sense, add a LOT of stupid, make the little head a WHOLE lot more controlling, and add a massive increase in power and athletic ability, and you have a stallion. A stallion is 1000-1500lbs, able to leap tall fences in a single bound, and able to simply push through those he can't leap. If you don't have a welded-pipe containment that is tall enough to keep him from going over it, you have a problem....a BIG one. I've had my share of gentle stallions, but only gentle by comparison to other stallions. Even a gentle stallion is a ticking time bomb when compared to geldings or mares.
Mares is another good subject. Just because they are horses does not mean they aren't still women!!!  They are much more likely than a gelding to develop "opinions" contrary to yours, they get bitchy when pushed hard, they are more likely to have bad ground-handling manners, and they are harder to get along with when they are in their cycle. They also tend to be smaller, so you have to watch how much work you demand from them. They are, as a rule, better work horses than a stallion, but not a good as a gelding.
To have a "self-sustaining" herd, you obviously need BOTH stallions (at least one) and mares. Did I mention that if you have more than one stallion,you have to keep them separated or they will fight over available mares? Yeah, they do that, and it creates some significant hazards to both man and beast. Anyway, your breeding herd has to combine the least desireable work horses if you want it to sustain itself, so you are taking an animal that is problematic under the best circumstances, and adding problems and complexity to the situation. I won't get into the limitations of riding and working a pregnant or nursing horse, what to do with the foal when it is young and you want to use mama for work, inbreeding concerns, etc. I'll also stay away from the fact that even if you DO manage to raise a few young ones, who's gonna train them? Do you know how? When do you start? How do you start? What equipment to you need? How do you de-sensitize them to things like dogs, gunfire, sudden noises, etc.? Like I said, if you are already doing it, and know what you are doing and have already invested in the facilities to raise horses right, then go for it! If you have a lot of land, and can find some easy-keepers that can mostly live off the land, and your investment in time and money is low, try it! If you are a suburbanite or live in a rural area, and have little or no experience with horses and no place to keep them ON YOUR PROPERTY, then do yourself a favor and look in other directions. There is a reason why so many horse owners on this forum advise AGAINST having horses solely for the purpose of SHTF, and the more experienced they are, the more adamant they are about it. It may be that they know something, and you MAY want to listen. |
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I'll still maintain that post-SHTF, (certain types of) horses will be a boon. I'll also echo the cautions of those who caution against owning them for post-SHTF. The learning curve is indeed steep, and the modern day situations where they're viable are far narrower than they once were.
As I said in an earlier post, I've only ever owned mustangs, who are far cheaper and easier to provide for than most breeds. Give them graze, some cheap hay and keep the water unfrozen through the winter and you're about good to go. I did have to build a windbreak wall for my old mare, as I couldn't force her into a barn under any circumstances, and Wyoming winters are occasionally kinda sporty. My stud would break through a six rail fence right next to an open gate and was something of an escape artist into the bargain. Also, it took some doing to convince him he didn't live in the house, and that everybody's hat wasn't his toy. Still, I didn't consider them all that expensive or all that much work. But that's just me, I guess. |
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I always become amused at posts like this. Opinions by folks with little or no experience run rampant and other folks with neither experience nor opinion are left in the dark. So could horses be useful in shtf situation? Maybe. Depends on the situation. Are horses expensive to keep up? Maybe. Depends on your situation. Are horses dangerous? Maybe. Depends on what you know.
First, horses do eat a lot so if you don’t have adequate pasture then you’ll be buying them feed and that gets expensive. I’d say 10 acres of pasture per head minimum depending on the grass is the only way you‘ll keep horses economically. Horses out on pasture are healthier in body and mind anyway. You don’t generally need to feed them a bunch of grains unless you’re working them hard or it’s really cold. BTW, you don’t need to keep mustangs to have horses that can take care of themselves on pasture. The hothouse high maintenance horses that have been referred to are really only that way ‘cause their owners think they need constant care, attention, loving, cuddles, kisses, etc…… How many of you would jump in an indy car and try to drive the Indy 500? If you don’t have a death wish, I suspect not many. Same with horses. Just because you think they’re a pita or unreliable or dangerous only means you don’t have enough of the right experience. Horses are damn reliable if you know what you’re doing. You got to get out there and do it and I don’t mean just go take a weekend horseyback clinic. You got to want to do this before you will ever have a chance of being comfortable around horses. As far as useful in shtf situations, boy, everyone has a wild scenario as to what’s going to happen. First I'll say I agree with TheOTHERmaninblack and say I don't think it'd be wise to go out and buy horses just for when tshtf. For now let’s just assume that it’s an economic crisis that severely curtails oil production and fuel is extremely hard to come by. My thinking there, is that your ol’ hay burner is going to come in pretty handy getting into town or wherever. We live about 13 miles from the nearest towns ourselves and although it’d take a pretty good need to strike out on a 26 mile round trip it’s doable. Now, let’s say you’ve got BO situation. I’d certainly say there are better ways to carry more of what you need but what about the fuel situation? Without fuel you have no other options except your feet or your horses‘. Doubt that I’ll be doing that goat thing. I’ll be astraddle my hoss with another one or two in tow. Good luck to you all. BTW: Don’t forget - good mules are worth their weight in gold but start with horses first. gkmiami |