Posted: 11/24/2009 6:37:39 PM EDT
| How many of you have and are proficient with muzzle loading weapons - rifles and hand guns. These seem to me to be the lowest on the radar screen weapons you can currently get, and yet in the right hands are just as purposeful as modern cartridge guns, albeit obviously slower. I have a couple of modern inline rifles and a colt reproduction revolver, but always just considered them hunting guns. However, there are some pretty serious SHTF potential guns out there. I got thinking about this while researching my newest purchase, a Gibbs long-range rifle, which is suppose to launch a 500+ grain conical bullet to over 1000 yards. Unless you are defending agains a horde of zombies, that is some pretty serious firepower. Anyways, anyone have their muzzleloaders in the defensive lineup? |
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It's been years since I shot Muzzle Loaders. We used to hunt with them when I lived back in OK. They're fun to shoot and hunt with. They do pack some serious firepower too. Some of the modern rifles are accurate too. Slow to reload but you definitely would not want to get hit by a .45 or .50 cal. Muzzle Loader Slug.
Correct me if I'm wrong but I don't think you have to fill out a 4473 for a Muzzle Loader which is nice. As you said they're under the radar and in the hands of a good shooter they are a great weapon for hunting deer sized game. |
| Last year, I picked up a CVA magnum Wolf at Cabela's in the bargain bin for $100. It is not a bad rifle and it is plenty accurate, it take the 209 shotgun primers, and you can purchase these by the 1000 if need be. I have been thinking about purchasing a smooth bore fouling gun, so I can shoot, slugs, and round ball (buckshot). They are the perfect survival weapons and a must have in your survival kit. |
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If you mean by low on the rader "hard to tell who owns them or regulate or track them", I would point out that the weapons may be paperless, but they're still a "firearm" in all legal definitions. So caryring one or possessing it when another firearm is prohibited is no different and draws the same charges.
And many places require ID or something similar to buy black powder. And there are restrictions on how much black powder you can store in most jurisdictions, unlike conventional ammo. I suppose the replacement pellets can negate those issues. If you mean by low on the radar "legal when all else has been outlawed", there is no point in owning them- we'll have waited too long. 
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For someone who's already got the AR, .22 LR, handgun, and shotgun angles covered... What would be the purpose of one of these in a SHTF situation? Why would I want this over one of the other types I already have? Well, if you have a flint lock and some flints (or know where to get more) and take the time to learn how to make black powder and a mold you really never have to worry about minor things like running out of ammo. Lots of places also have special black powder seasons for the hunting. |
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Quoted:
Quoted:
For someone who's already got the AR, .22 LR, handgun, and shotgun angles covered... What would be the purpose of one of these in a SHTF situation? Why would I want this over one of the other types I already have? Well, if you have a flint lock and some flints (or know where to get more) and take the time to learn how to make black powder and a mold you really never have to worry about minor things like running out of ammo. Lots of places also have special black powder seasons for the hunting. Hmm, I think this was covered here in the last month or so. While you have a point about casting bullets and primative hunting seasons making black powder at home is beyond most folks. Much easier to just stockpile a bunch of ammo now then blow your hands off later or have powder you can't trust. If you have to make your own from scratch I think you are better with a bow and arrows, both much easier to make than BP. |
| Here is the other thread: http://www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=10&f=17&t=629248 |
It takes longer to buy Black Powder at Cabela's than it does a rifle? Bunch of old laws on books about the storage and such of it. All of that modern ammo, powder, primers on the shelves, but black has to be kept in the back. Quoted:
Last year, I picked up a CVA magnum Wolf at Cabela's in the bargain bin for $100. It is not a bad rifle and it is plenty accurate, it take the 209 shotgun primers, and you can purchase these by the 1000 if need be. I have been thinking about purchasing a smooth bore fouling gun, so I can shoot, slugs, and round ball (buckshot). They are the perfect survival weapons and a must have in your survival kit. |
i love my black powder rifle and pistols. its great when you have a tool box next to you at the range complaining about noise. then they complain about smoke.
but in ca its the only thing you can cash and carry. i bought my 1851 navy replica from a one armed mexican at agun show. |
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Quoted:
For someone who's already got the AR, .22 LR, handgun, and shotgun angles covered... What would be the purpose of one of these in a SHTF situation? Why would I want this over one of the other types I already have? One reason is that you can make your own black powder if you have the right ingredients. |
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It takes longer to buy Black Powder at Cabela's than it does a rifle? Bunch of old laws on books about the storage and such of it. All of that modern ammo, powder, primers on the shelves, but black has to be kept in the back.[img]http://www.ar15.com/images/smilies/smiley_thinking.gif[/img] Quoted:
Last year, I picked up a CVA magnum Wolf at Cabela's in the bargain bin for $100. It is not a bad rifle and it is plenty accurate, it take the 209 shotgun primers, and you can purchase these by the 1000 if need be. I have been thinking about purchasing a smooth bore fouling gun, so I can shoot, slugs, and round ball (buckshot). They are the perfect survival weapons and a must have in your survival kit. obviously the assholes who make up all those bullshit rules, as well as the jackass who named the day after thanksgiving, are all bigoted racists...   
K. |
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If you mean by low on the rader "hard to tell who owns them or regulate or track them", I would point out that the weapons may be paperless, but they're still a "firearm" in all legal definitions. So caryring one or possessing it when another firearm is prohibited is no different and draws the same charges. In many states a muzzle loader is not considered a firearm. Nor is it considered a firearm by the feds. No federal felon prohibition. However, I believe it is a common parole/probation requirement that it is prohibited while under supervision. I have never done a proper survey of the laws in all 50 states, but I would bet that the majority of states do not consider ML firearms to be firearms at all. |
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Quoted:
It takes longer to buy Black Powder at Cabela's than it does a rifle? Bunch of old laws on books about the storage and such of it. All of that modern ammo, powder, primers on the shelves, but black has to be kept in the back. That is because black powder is a low yield explosive, meaning it can actually detonate. Other gun powders just burn. Its a legimate safety issue that causes it to be kept in special storage. |
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Quoted:
Quoted:
If you mean by low on the rader "hard to tell who owns them or regulate or track them", I would point out that the weapons may be paperless, but they're still a "firearm" in all legal definitions. So caryring one or possessing it when another firearm is prohibited is no different and draws the same charges. In many states a muzzle loader is not considered a firearm. Nor is it considered a firearm by the feds. No federal felon prohibition. However, I believe it is a common parole/probation requirement that it is prohibited while under supervision. For federal and state purchasing requirements and such, yes MLs are not considered a firearm. But if you read most states' section of the law on carrying, using, misusing, etc (where firearms are regulated in our day-to-day lives, IMHO) they will usually have a separate definition for that section. Here in Virginia it's 18.2 Section 300-something (sorry, can't look it up from where I am now). That definition is usually one based on principle (such as projectile propelled by expanding gas) and absolutely covers MLs. Concealing, brandishing, discharging or carrying where you shouldn't, etc are all the same charges, here and in many states, whether you used a modern sem-auto or a blackpowder revolver. And the felon prohibition is mirrored in most states, with this wider definition used. I know this for a fact in the couple of states I lived in, but certainly can't speak for others. |