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AR15.COM
2/1/2009 12:04:27 AM EDT
I recently put up a post here in SF about my wife working for free. Found out a friend at Folsom state prison is in the same sitch. Anyways the reaction in the GD (post was moved) scares me into thinking that there is a vast majority of folks, obviously armed are not ready to accept any news the there's turmoil ahead and coming. On top of that they are angry. Sure I could be lying or whatever (wish I were) but the responses are angry and shows plenty of denial. Sorry for the rant here in SF but I'm comfortable here and know that you all are like minded. I had a BOB before I even knew it was a BOB... Just shows that we prep because there are folks out there that will be armed and desparate. I wish this wasn't happening and pray that the court ruling will decide a better decision. Peoples ignorance or denial will be the one that will cause waves. This scares me but will keep on doing what I do and won't let the negativity get me down. It's going to be one hell of a fight though.
2/1/2009 12:17:37 AM EDT
[#1]
How do you eat an elephant?






















One bite at a time.

Same as a potato chip, elephant just takes a little longer.

Looks to me like you'll do just fine

Seeing a few things I don't like here in the midwest too.

One guarantee....NObody has a crystal ball.

Do your best, take what comes, try to spread a little sanity if the opportunity comes up.

One thing I haven't figured out about you supposed left-coast-party-central types?

How come y'all never got the hang of a little extra corn and some copper tubing?

Grapes are okay, I guess, but some jobs just seem to DEMAND some quality, week or more aged, ball mason jar, lightning corn whiskey.

Oh well, what's done is done, see you on the far side, one way or t'other.






2/1/2009 12:19:59 AM EDT
[#2]
GD has a lot of smart people, a lot of optimistic people, a lot of ignorant people, and a lot of pessimistic people.

Right now, what scares me the most is that the optimistic people in GD are almost invariably also the ignorant ones.
2/1/2009 2:11:15 AM EDT
[#3]
funny! I used to make a living making wine! I live in the Napa valley and when in Rome... But me and Jack, we go waaaaay back!
2/1/2009 2:17:55 AM EDT
[#4]
just trying to stop wide spread panic too bad we need a real leader and instead we got a Soros puppet
2/1/2009 3:07:47 AM EDT
[#5]
Some people think they see the big picture.

I see a bigger picture than I did when I was younger.

I doubt I will ever see the biggest picture but I sure the heck can understand why your wife would work 2 days for free because of the people she is helping.

I started a job as a corrections officer last year and while my state is not where cali is yet it very well might get there eventually.

I don't know what I would do if put in a similar position, but these days I at least understand why your wife does what she does.

I have not checked that thread since yesterday evening before work but a lot of the posts I read then reminded me of youngsters who are out for themselves only and have a nice safety net of mom and dad backing them up.

Once someone actually gets out and does some living they can appreciate what they are looking at differently.

And that is why I started this post with the picture comments.  When younger I would have really questioned the idea of working 2 days a month without pay.

But these days I see how what I do affects the whole puzzle a bit better.

I don't know if I ever want to see the biggest picture of all, but I easily see why your wife would work those 2 days for free and I applaud her for doing so.

I hope I don't have to figure out what I would do in a similar situation, but I am thinking about it and I know already that I can't say what I would do until I see what comes down the road.
2/1/2009 6:44:49 AM EDT
[#6]
I know turmoil is ahead. I prepare for it. I also know when someone is posting sensationalist twisting of the news. No one is working for free. Murders are not going to be wholesale released from prison. Life will go on.


http://www.latimes.com/news/local/la-me-budget-workers30-2009jan30,0,930288.story

Engineers, scientists, nurses, Department of Motor Vehicles clerks, pharmacists, Caltrans maintenance workers, dietitians, psychologists, social workers, computer programmers, unemployment caseworkers, full-time state commissioners and attorneys not working for the state attorney general will all be affected.

Prison guards and park rangers will be permitted to schedule their days off without pay in a way that does not compromise public safety. California Highway Patrol officers, who have a contract specifically prohibiting furloughs, will be exempt.
2/1/2009 7:20:44 AM EDT
[#7]
I'll make the offer here again - post the link to the news site that supports your claim or I'm going to have to call you a liar.

You've skipped the offer on the last post so the offer is made again. Post it up.

You can't tell me that in a liberal dominated news media like we have here that there's not at least 50-100 news stories on this right? Certainly the liberal public union public affairs groups have contacted the media right? Those labor unions which have spend tens of millions of dollars collectively to elect the liberal democrats into power right? There's been zero in the news about anything about working for free.

To the contrary when you posted this in the General Discussion you were confronted about the FUD factor and never replied to a single challenge. I posted a link and displayed the AP's news story on the program. I've read the news stories and NONE of them support the tail you're telling here. In fact there are a number of news stories which say just the opposite of what you're saying - as an example the CHiPs and the prison guards are allowed to schedule their days off to allow management to coordinate them.

There ain't JACK SHIT about working for free.

Those cubical workers - the welfare offices, the DMV, those buildings full of paper pushers are going to close their doors to the public as their workers are forced to go HOME without pay.
2/1/2009 7:30:41 AM EDT
[#8]
http://www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=1&f=5&t=823912&page=2

Here's your original General Discussion post - I've been tracking it too. You refuse to address the challenge there but rather continue to spread your rumors and lies here. I've sent you an IM just in case you've missed this challenge too.

Post up the news story or shut up.
2/1/2009 7:37:15 AM EDT
[#9]
From The Policy Report

Arnold Schwarzenegger

The Issue: California Governor Arnold Schwarzenegger has announced plans to require a monthly furlough for California State Employees.  The furlough, if approved by the Legislature will require all civil service employees to take 1 day off of work without pay each month for the next 19 months.

The State of California faces a continually growing budget deficit.  An offspring of the United States economic trouble resulting from the real estate bust, the deficit is estimated to be over $11 billion.  The budget approved 85 days after its July 1 deadline depended on meeting certain tax revenue targets for the state.  The increase in foreclosures and decline is sales statewide prevented the state from collecting the expected revenues.

One idea floated by the Governor is to effectively cut state employee pay by 5% by having each state employee take a monthly one day furlough without pay and by eliminating 2 paid state holidays.  Many, especially the media and labor leaders have expressed opposition to the idea, but the idea has some merit.

The economy has caused a loss of revenue for the state and we don’t have as much money in our budget as we had expected.  Let’s analyze this from the private sector.  If a business were to see a shortfall in revenue, which many are actually seeing right now, they are forced to cut costs.  Starbucks, for example, has shut down 800 stores it can no longer afford to operate.  Other businesses, like American Express, have laid off countless employees (Amex laid off 8,000).  Others are filing for insolvency, like Circuit City.

California doesn’t have the option to shut down.  The other two options are possibilities:  downsizing and layoffs.

Downsizing and Layoffs

I doubt the state of California is going to downsize their government.  This is a viable option though.  Many states provide much less in the way of social services.  Both Texas and Nevada have part-time legislatures.  They however have ceeded much of their authority to their executive branches, which our legislature won’t do.  Also, this idea encompasses layoffs.  In a time of economic trouble, putting tens of thousands of more out on the street isn’t a good idea.

Governor Schwarzenegger’s Proposal

Arnold isn’t requesting a downsize or a layoff, merely a reduction in the numbers of hours worked by our civil servants.  Arguably he could be asking for a pay or benefit cut to achieve an equal result, but that would ask employees to do the same job for less pay.  This way is a great alternative.  It maintains pay and benefits, prevents layoffs or a government downsize and works toward fixing our budget.
2/1/2009 7:38:45 AM EDT
[#10]
From the LA Times

A judge orders officials to implement Schwarzenegger's plan to force 238,000 employees to take two days off without pay each month. The state is expected to shut down some services on those days.

Reporting from Sacramento –– California officials must immediately implement Gov. Arnold Schwarzenegger's order that state employees take two days off without pay each month, a judge ruled Thursday, denying claims by unions and the controller that the governor's directive is illegal.

The decision clears the way for the biggest rollback of the state payroll in decades. Starting next week, 238,000 state employees will be furloughed on the first and third Fridays of each month. Some state offices that provide public services, including DMV field offices, will be closed on those days.

The judge's order, if it withstands an appeal promised by organized labor, would represent a shift in power over the civil service workforce. Past attempts by governors to cut salaries and hours have generally been stymied by the courts or the Legislature.

"This state is in a huge mess . . . the scope of which is unprecedented," Sacramento County Superior Court Judge Patrick Marlette said in a courtroom packed with government workers. His ruling called the governor's order "reasonable and necessary under the circumstances."

He acknowledged that his decision could have "devastating" financial consequences for some workers, but said state law and union contracts provide the governor with the authority to cut the payroll during an emergency.

The state is in the midst of a financial crisis, with an immediate cash shortage and a projected deficit of nearly $42 billion by the middle of next year. Refunds to taxpayers and other payments will be suspended Feb. 1 because the state does not have the money for them.

State Controller John Chiang, a longtime ally of organized labor whose job is to manage the state payroll, said he would put into effect the pay cuts that will result from the furloughs.

"Today, the court has directed me to implement the governor's order affecting state employee pay, and I will immediately move to do so," he said in a statement.

The mandatory time off will apply to almost all state workers except those employed in public universities, on state tax boards, in the Legislature and in other offices not under the control of the governor.

Engineers, scientists, nurses, Department of Motor Vehicles clerks, pharmacists, Caltrans maintenance workers, dietitians, psychologists, social workers, computer programmers, unemployment caseworkers, full-time state commissioners and attorneys not working for the state attorney general will all be affected.

Prison guards and park rangers will be permitted to schedule their days off without pay in a way that does not compromise public safety. California Highway Patrol officers, who have a contract specifically prohibiting furloughs, will be exempt.

Union leaders said the furloughs will drain the finances of workers and disrupt the Californians they serve. The union officials are drafting court papers that they hope will stop the mandatory time off from taking effect until the appeal is complete.

"We think [Marlette] is wrong. The governor does not have this authority," said Bruce Blanning, executive director of the Professional Engineers in California Government. "One man is telling 200,000 people to stay home: 'Don't go to work.' "

The unions had argued that furloughs must be approved by the Legislature. Chiang agreed and sided in court with the Service Employees International Union Local 1000, the California Assn. of Professional Scientists and the engineers.

The governor wants the furloughs to remain in place even if he and lawmakers reach a budget agreement that addresses the deficit. The equivalent of a 9% pay cut, the move will save the state about $1.3 billion through June 30, 2010, officials said.

State employees who packed the courthouse Thursday were angered by the judge's ruling.

David Miller, a toxin-control scientist, is newly married and helping to put his wife through college. "We will have to reduce our expenditures, tighten our belts," he said. His wife "may have to reduce her [course] schedule," he said. ". . . It's a real bite."

Dianne Bradford of San Diego, who does nursing-home inspections, said in a telephone interview that she is "seriously considering getting a second job."

Bradford, 56, said the $600 a month that she will lose will make it tough for her to pay for her car and mortgage. "I'm not sure how I'm going to manage," she said.

Schwarzenegger said earlier this week that he was imposing the furloughs as an alternative to mass layoffs.

2/1/2009 7:39:27 AM EDT
[#11]
From the New York Times

A Sacramento County Superior Court judge has ruled that Gov. Arnold Schwarzenegger has the authority to furlough thousands of state workers. An order forcing the workers to take off two days a month without pay is scheduled to take effect Feb. 6. It would apply to 238,000 workers. Two unions had challenged Mr. Schwarzenegger’s order, saying he did not have the authority to impose furloughs. The judge, Patrick Marlette, said the governor had the “authority to reduce the work hours of the state employees” under the current fiscal emergency. California faces a $42 billion budget deficit through June 2010. Mr. Schwarzenegger has said the furloughs will save about $1.4 billion through then.


They're quoting the AP story.
2/1/2009 7:40:41 AM EDT
[#12]
Here's the Sacramento Bee

Gov. Arnold Schwarzenegger ordered Friday that state employees take two unpaid furlough days each month starting in February and that the least-tenured workers may face layoffs to save cash during the ongoing budget crisis, delivering a blow to Sacramento's government-oriented economy.

The Republican governor also renewed his fiscal emergency declaration and called for a new special legislative session, demanding that state lawmakers resolve a $40 billion budget gap by Christmas.

Schwarzenegger's fiscal missives provoked frustration among state workers and criticism from Democratic leaders who assailed him for rejecting their $18 billion budget plan Thursday. The governor tried to soften the blow by sending a blanket e-mail letter to 238,000 state workers, explaining that his emergency steps "will require sacrifices from everyone."

Unlike the once-monthly furlough plan Schwarzenegger pursued in November, the two-day measure does not require legislative approval and will take effect barring legal intervention. The governor believes he can now impose furloughs unilaterally because the state is in a fiscal emergency, according to an administration official.

Furloughs will have a significant impact on the Sacramento-area economy, said Jeffrey Michael, director of the Business Forecasting Center at the University of the Pacific. The state employs 73,536 workers in Sacramento County alone, including 63,818 full time.

Union officials consider the furlough plan equal to a 10 percent pay cut for workers. Managers and non-union employees will receive an equivalent 10 percent pay decrease starting the same day, Feb. 1.

In addition, the governor has instructed his Department of Personnel Administration to "initiate layoffs, reductions and other efficiencies" to reduce costs by 10 percent starting in February. To do so, he will give one-fifth of state employees – those with the least seniority – notices that they are at risk of being laid off, though it does not necessarily mean they will lose their jobs.

Those workers can retain their jobs for 120 days upon receiving a "surplus" notice within the next month. But they will be subject to layoff, demotion or transfer thereafter, said DPA spokeswoman Lynelle Jolley.

Schwarzenegger also prohibited state agencies from hiring contract workers as of Jan. 1.

Some state employees are exempt from the order because their entities fall outside the governor's authority, including the Legislature, the University of California and California State University. The governor asked them to take similar steps.

Schwarzenegger told public employees of his executive order in an e-mail that began, "Dear State Worker."

"Californians can be proud of the services you provide day in and day out, and I appreciate your dedication and work," he wrote. "But it is imperative that state government look inside itself and be part of the solution."

Service Employees International Union Local 1000 President Yvonne Walker said Friday she plans to file a legal complaint with the state Public Employment Relations Board charging the administration with engaging in an unfair labor practice. Her union represents 95,000 state workers.

"The situation is out of control," Walker said. "With the state's economy heading toward a cliff, Gov. Schwarzenegger has pushed the state's fiscal crisis into a catastrophe."

State workers filing out of their downtown Sacramento offices Friday afternoon were frustrated with the governor's announcement, especially its timing before the holidays.

"It's really a sad state of affairs that we have to resort to that kind of a pay cut," said Dawna Jones of Sacramento, an executive assistant for Cal-EPA. "On the other hand, I'm just very thankful that I have a job."

Richard Castle of Antelope, a research program specialist at the California Integrated Waste Management Board, lamented that one allure of state employment – job security – seems to be gone.

"I understand the budget constraints that we're under," Castle said. "It's frustrating that (we) always seem to be the first whack. The public always seems to think we're all overpaid and underworked. … But the reality is most people are making wages like they would with any other company."
2/1/2009 7:42:06 AM EDT
[#13]
And MSNBC ...

SACRAMENTO, Calif. - A judge ruled on Thursday that Gov. Arnold Schwarzenegger can force tens of thousands of state workers to take days off without pay to help close a multibillion-dollar budget gap.

The two-day-a-month furloughs are scheduled to start Feb. 6 and would apply to all 238,000 state workers, although many of those would be exempt.

Two employee unions had challenged Schwarzenegger's executive order, saying he did not have authority to order furloughs.
Story continues below ↓advertisement | your ad here

Judge Patrick Marlette disagreed. In a preliminary ruling, he said the governor has "express authority to make the challenged order."

He also said certain union agreements allow the administration to reduce employee hours if the state runs short of money.

Schwarzenegger has declared a fiscal emergency as California faces a $42 billion budget deficit through June 2010. He said the reduced-work plan will save California about $1.4 billion through June 2010.

'Necessary' move, judge says
"The current circumstances constitute an emergency," Marlette said. "The challenged order is reasonable and necessary."

He is scheduled to issue a final ruling later.

Despite weeks of meetings with legislative leaders from both parties, Schwarzenegger has yet to reach a deal on how to close the deficit over the next 18 months. They hope to fill the gap before February, when the state could start to run out of cash and begin issuing IOUs instead of payments to some contractors.

The furlough plan comes as the Schwarzenegger administration and the state's largest employee union, Service Employees International Union, Local 1000, negotiate a new contract for 90,000 workers.

Negotiations have taken on a new urgency recently as the state slides toward insolvency, SEIU spokesman Jim Zamora said.

"On the one hand we'd like to compromise, make some sacrifices to help the state, but also to protect our members... to protect people from getting laid off," Zamora said.

Eliminate 2 paid holidays?
Schwarzenegger also has sought other concessions from state employees, including eliminating two of their 14 paid holidays.

On Wednesday, he called state workers dedicated individuals who make California run. He said he wants to avoid layoffs if possible.

"To me labor has the choice, and I made this very clear: That they can help us in making the decision in how they save the $1.4 billion," the governor said.

Bruce Blanning, executive director of Professional Engineers in California Government, one of the unions that sued over the furlough plan, said his group has suggested Schwarzenegger save money by reducing its outsourcing. Outsourcing engineering jobs to private companies costs the state twice as much as hiring its own engineers, he said.


Their source is the AP again.
2/1/2009 7:43:22 AM EDT
[#14]
Peoples ignorance or denial will be the one that will cause waves.


Yeah, people's ignorance is always troubling.
2/1/2009 7:45:09 AM EDT
[#15]
Hell even ChinaView has the story right.

LOS ANGELES, Dec. 22 (Xinhua) –– Two public employee unions on Monday filed a lawsuit against California Governor Arnold Schwarzenegger for his attempt to furlough state workers.

The lawsuit accused the governor of ordering all state workers to take two unpaid days off each month starting next February.

While announcing the executive order last week, Schwarzenegger said the furloughs were necessary to cut costs as California's treasury runs out of money.

The lawsuit, filed in Sacramento Superior Court, called for an end to Schwarzenegger's efforts, asserting that only the Legislature can alter the pay of workers who have labor contracts with the state.

"We don't think he has the authority," said Bruce Blanning, executive director of the Professional Engineers of California Government (PECG), which filed the lawsuit along with the California Association of Professional Scientists (CAPS).

The governor has "asked for a couple of months to try to convince the Legislature to pass a bill to allow him to furlough employees," Blanning said.

California, the most populous state in the nation, is 14.8 billion dollars in the red, and the budget deficit is projected to grow to nearly 42 billion dollars in 18 months.

Earlier on Monday, Schwarzenegger warned of a deepening crisis in the state due to legislature's failure to pass a real and comprehensive budget solution.

"Due to the legislature's continued failure to provide a real and comprehensive budget solution, 2,000 infrastructure projects in California valued at more than 16 billion dollars are in jeopardy and tens of thousands of California jobs are immediately at risk," the governor said in a statement.

Schwarzenegger has declared a fiscal emergency, called the Legislature into a special session to find ways to cut spending and raise revenue.

But he has rejected tax increases and cuts in state services that Democrats got through the Assembly.

The governor and Democratic leaders of the Senate and Assembly are scheduled to meet Tuesday in an attempt to resolve their differences.


A bit old - this is from last month.
2/1/2009 7:53:10 AM EDT
[#16]
Sure I could be lying or whatever (wish I were) but the responses are angry and shows plenty of denial.


Denial? I've posted five factual news stories from Los Angeles, to Sacramento, to New York, and even to China and you're claiming that all of those new sources have it wrong and you've got it right? Here's a link to the letter your wife got - it was sent to every California state agency secretary, under secretary, and director.

http://www.news10.net/news/pdf/furlough-letter.pdf

David Gilb, the director of the California Department of Personnel Administration says that you're wrong and spreading lies.

To reduce current spending to ensure that essential services of the State are not jeopardized
and the public health and safety is preserved, the Department of Personnel Administration,
under the Governor’s authority and at the direction of the Governor, has developed a furlough
plan that will result in the closing of general government operations on the first and third Fridays
of each month, beginning this February. As such, these unpaid furlough days are not work days
and employees shall not report to work. The first furlough day under this plan will be
February 6, 2009.

DPA will post details on its website early next week and send a memo to personnel offices with
additional information.

For operations that cannot close, Agency Secretaries (and Directors who do not report to an
agency) may request approval from DPA to use a “self-directed” furlough for specific positions.

There will be two types of self-directed furlough:

• Employees take two furlough days each month but on days chosen by the employee and
approved by the supervisor. For example, revenue-generating positions may be
considered for this type of furlough.

• Employees accrue two furlough days per month to be taken when feasible. Furlough
days that cannot be used within the same month must be taken within two years
following the end of the furlough program. Furlough days will not be cashed out. Posted
positions in 24/7 facilities such as prisons and hospitals automatically qualify for this selfdirected
furlough and do not require prior approval from DPA.

Salaries will be adjusted to reflect the unpaid furlough days, but benefits will remain the same
(i.e., the furlough will not affect payouts for unused leave, service credit, health and retirement
benefits, etc.)


Done. You're a liar. Straight up.

So why are you continuing to spread fear, uncertainty, doubt, and out-right bald-faced LIES?
2/1/2009 8:37:21 AM EDT
[#17]
Paul, you seem to have WAY too much free time on your hands.  Shouldn't you be packing away rice right now or something?
2/1/2009 10:20:59 AM EDT
[#18]
Quoted:
http://www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=1&f=5&t=823912&page=2

Here's your original General Discussion post - I've been tracking it too. You refuse to address the challenge there but rather continue to spread your rumors and lies here. I've sent you an IM just in case you've missed this challenge too.

Post up the news story or shut up.




Isn't this treading the line on the COC?  From site staff too.
2/1/2009 10:22:25 AM EDT
[#19]
Quoted:
Sure I could be lying or whatever (wish I were) but the responses are angry and shows plenty of denial.


Denial? I've posted five factual news stories from Los Angeles, to Sacramento, to New York, and even to China and you're claiming that all of those new sources have it wrong and you've got it right? Here's a link to the letter your wife got - it was sent to every California state agency secretary, under secretary, and director.

http://www.news10.net/news/pdf/furlough-letter.pdf

David Gilb, the director of the California Department of Personnel Administration says that you're wrong and spreading lies.

To reduce current spending to ensure that essential services of the State are not jeopardized
and the public health and safety is preserved, the Department of Personnel Administration,
under the Governor’s authority and at the direction of the Governor, has developed a furlough
plan that will result in the closing of general government operations on the first and third Fridays
of each month, beginning this February. As such, these unpaid furlough days are not work days
and employees shall not report to work. The first furlough day under this plan will be
February 6, 2009.

DPA will post details on its website early next week and send a memo to personnel offices with
additional information.

For operations that cannot close, Agency Secretaries (and Directors who do not report to an
agency) may request approval from DPA to use a “self-directed” furlough for specific positions.

There will be two types of self-directed furlough:

• Employees take two furlough days each month but on days chosen by the employee and
approved by the supervisor. For example, revenue-generating positions may be
considered for this type of furlough.

• Employees accrue two furlough days per month to be taken when feasible. Furlough
days that cannot be used within the same month must be taken within two years
following the end of the furlough program. Furlough days will not be cashed out. Posted
positions in 24/7 facilities such as prisons and hospitals automatically qualify for this selfdirected
furlough and do not require prior approval from DPA.

Salaries will be adjusted to reflect the unpaid furlough days, but benefits will remain the same
(i.e., the furlough will not affect payouts for unused leave, service credit, health and retirement
benefits, etc.)


Done. You're a liar. Straight up.

So why are you continuing to spread fear, uncertainty, doubt, and out-right bald-faced LIES?




You probably are right about the issues but this IS a personal attack.

Does the COC apply to Site Staff?
2/1/2009 10:37:01 AM EDT
[#20]
Anyone here ever worked for a company that unofficially frowns on putting in for overtime? Sure the law will back you up, but you won't stay working there for long if you try it.

Same goes for trying to get your comp time.

Same goes for "non-mandatory" satyrdau work sessions.

Then there's the company where you are paid for X hours, but you are assigned a workload that will require  X + Y hours even in the best case. just try to get paid for the extra work and you'll be out the door on some trumped up charge in a heartbeat.

There's the official rules, and the law....and then there's the reality and anyone who thinks they always match perfectly IS living in denial.

I read the OP's post one time, got the point that very first time, have watched some apparantly less than comprehending others attack the guy for something he explained quite clearly in my opinion.

His wife works at a VA hospital.

There aren't enough staff right now to keep up with the heeds of the patients.

Living with my dad for four months at a nursing home, I don't wonder if this can happen, i've seen it with my own fucking eyes.

You cut each employee two days a month, and you're going to have assholes with shit caked on them for 48 hours at a time, ulcerating the skin and possibly killing the patients, at the very least making them sicker.

I've seen this with my own eyes.

The OP said the state is forcing two day furloughs.

Every link posted supports this.

He said some jobs can't withstand two less workdays without critical work going uncovered.

That happens and anyone who says it never does IS in denial.

WHAT is so hard to understand here?

Seems kindegarten simple to me.
2/1/2009 10:51:32 AM EDT
[#21]
Paul , take it to the pit cos it looks like you are a STALKER .



just saying




john
2/1/2009 10:56:39 AM EDT
[#22]
Quoted:
Paul , take it to the pit cos it looks like you are a STALKER .

just saying

john




This is the third thread the guy has started with the same subject. We've got enough to worry about without adding water cooler rumors.
2/1/2009 11:00:43 AM EDT
[#23]





Quoted:





Quoted:


Paul , take it to the pit cos it looks like you are a STALKER .





just saying







john







This is the third thread the guy has started with the same subject. We've got enough to worry about without adding water cooler rumors.



yer I just got told I lost my bonus ( worth £ 300 ) a month







o well life go`s on .


john



edit the pound key is bust






 
2/1/2009 11:07:10 AM EDT
[#24]
I don't really have a dog in this fight and I don't know if the OP was referring to this, but I have seen something similar happen in governmental fields. It's called Comp Time. You work more than 40 hours a week for Comp Time (for free-over 40 hours should be O.T.) and then are, at least in theory, allowed to take that Comp Time off at a later date. Since positions named in the above postings require 24hr a day, 7 days a week coverage, they will continue to be staffed regardless of  financial situations. Someone has to be there at all times. If someone is told to take 2 days off, then somebody else will be required to pick up the slack. If those ‘replacements’ are required to also 2 days off, then somebody else will need to pick up the slack. The only other solution would be the elimination of duties or positions within the agencies. Even then, the slack created will need to be absorbed by someone else. The bigger problem arises when the employee asks to use those all of those accumulated comp days. When you have a greater number of folks wanting to use those days than staffing allows, people are told 'no' to those days off. Essentially, they are working for free until allowed to use the comp days.
2/1/2009 1:59:35 PM EDT
[#25]
Quoted:
http://www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=1&f=5&t=823912&page=2

Here's your original General Discussion post - I've been tracking it too. You refuse to address the challenge there but rather continue to spread your rumors and lies here. I've sent you an IM just in case you've missed this challenge too.

Post up the news story or shut up.


http://www.denverpost.com/news/ci_11595604

"FORT COLLINS — Sheriff Jim Alderden sees himself as a straight-talking, straight- shooting lawman bent on protecting ordinary citizens from bad people, just like Alderden's Hollywood hero, John Wayne.

So it bothers Alderden that Larimer County will soon embark on a new approach to handling a swelling jail population in an era of budget cuts.

"I've spent over 30 years locking up bad guys, and now I'm setting some of those free," Alderden said. "

Not quite the same, but interesting all the same....
2/1/2009 2:05:19 PM EDT
[#26]
"On top of that they are angry"

Have you ever seen this before? It is an ego defense mechanism, if you are right, it is a reality that they just cannot accept, so they lash out violently, because it is the only thing they know to do if faced with something that they cannot comprehend or accept...  In all reality, it is a weakness in themselves that they just cannot see.
2/1/2009 2:11:55 PM EDT
[#27]
My god, I've stumbled into the GD. help, help, let me out!
2/1/2009 2:28:57 PM EDT
[#28]
I didn't start this discussion on the work hours because that has been posted and both sides argued. You showed your news propaganda and I hear straight from the horses (2) mouth. News Media I never wrong and they never try to write the little details right? Some can understand and some can't, but this post (second of same nature different topic) is about how scary it is that a guy like you specially site staff can come and use their power or retaliate in such a way that it actually tries to set fear in folks. Staff should be unbiased IMHO. And in my eyes I say believe what you wish. I'm not here to spread FUD just letting out news about what is going on in my life and my close friends. In the meantime il pull out some popcorn from my prep food, mix up some prep lemonade and watch the Super Bowl.

You post just assure me and maybe some others of the denial and anger I was speaking of. Arizona wins the coin toss. Hope this is a good game!
2/1/2009 3:24:31 PM EDT
[#29]
Quoted:
I don't really have a dog in this fight and I don't know if the OP was referring to this, but I have seen something similar happen in governmental fields. It's called Comp Time. You work more than 40 hours a week for Comp Time (for free-over 40 hours should be O.T.) and then are, at least in theory, allowed to take that Comp Time off at a later date. Since positions named in the above postings require 24hr a day, 7 days a week coverage, they will continue to be staffed regardless of  financial situations. Someone has to be there at all times. If someone is told to take 2 days off, then somebody else will be required to pick up the slack. If those ‘replacements’ are required to also 2 days off, then somebody else will need to pick up the slack. The only other solution would be the elimination of duties or positions within the agencies. Even then, the slack created will need to be absorbed by someone else. The bigger problem arises when the employee asks to use those all of those accumulated comp days. When you have a greater number of folks wanting to use those days than staffing allows, people are told 'no' to those days off. Essentially, they are working for free until allowed to use the comp days.




Know what you are talking about.  We get a lot of comp time here.  I have over 100 hours.  Some of our people have over 300 hrs.  When we ask for time off, we are told that we are too short handed.  I use mine for my reserve drill times and they can't mess with that.  I STILL have 100 hrs.

We'll get paid for the time eventually...either in time off or paid when we quit.  But it sucks that we are working and not getting paid for it at that time.