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Posted: 6/26/2024 2:17:36 PM EDT
[#1]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By planemaker: The notion that hypersonic speed by itself creates invisibility is just nonsense. If that were true, we wouldn't be able to track ICBMs or reentry vehicles at all. We can and do with radar. We have the ability to intercept hypersonic missiles both on land and at sea. It's just another tool in the toolbox and not some media-fueled boogeyman. The reason that the Russian navy often visits Cuba is so they can go someplace warm where the sun shines, same as the reason why American tourists visit the Caribbean. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By planemaker: Originally Posted By R_S: Originally Posted By ColtRifle: Originally Posted By R_S: Honestly the more I think about it, the more concerned I get. Russian nuclear forces are not as large as they used to be, but that Frigate in Cuba almost certainly has their latest generation hypersonic missiles... which are unstoppable... and which probably have nuclear warheads. Russian Frigate sails to the Atlantic with Hypersonic Missiles (2023) If you estimate range at 600 miles, from Havana all of Florida is in range. It is a dangerous first strike capability. I'm not convinced the land based Russian ballistic missiles are super dangerous as anti-missile defenses exist for them, but sub based missiles and hypersonic ship based missiles can cause havoc in the coastal areas with little response time. https://thebulletin.org/2024/03/hypersonic-weapons-are-mediocre-its-time-to-stop-wasting-money-on-them/amp/ Further, Ukraine using US Patriots has shot down at least one, and likely two, Zircon missiles. Why would the Russian ship shoot nuclear Zircon missiles at the US? Let’s say they do…..then what? Every Russian surface ship in the Atlantic become converted to Russian subs and the Russian subs all go down and stay down. If that’s their first strike plan, they are dumber than whale shit. Russians are stupid but they aren’t remotely THAT stupid. To sit in fear over this non important event is pointless. By the way, the scary ships and sub are not in Cuba any more. Ukraine has make lots of unsubstantiated and baseless claims (ie Ghost of Kiev, longest sniper kill ever, etc). Why Russia's Hypersonic Missiles Can't Be Seen on Radar: And it's so fast that the air pressure in front of the weapon forms a plasma cloud as it moves, absorbing radio waves and making it practically invisible to active radar systems. U.S. Aegis missile interceptor systems require 8-10 seconds of reaction time to intercept incoming attacks. In those 8-10 seconds, the Russian Zircon missiles will already have traveled 20 kilometers, and the interceptor missiles do not fly fast enough to catch up. While satellite systems may be able to provide some early warning of hypersonic missile attacks based on thermal signature, making an intercept would be very difficult. The fact that the ships are still in the Gulf and could return to Cuba whenever the Russians feel like it is not very re-assuring to me. The notion that hypersonic speed by itself creates invisibility is just nonsense. If that were true, we wouldn't be able to track ICBMs or reentry vehicles at all. We can and do with radar. We have the ability to intercept hypersonic missiles both on land and at sea. It's just another tool in the toolbox and not some media-fueled boogeyman. The reason that the Russian navy often visits Cuba is so they can go someplace warm where the sun shines, same as the reason why American tourists visit the Caribbean. Plasma stealth may not be widely talked about, but it's been around for a long time: The SR-71 Blackbird’s Predecessor Created “Plasma Stealth” By Burning Cesium-Laced Fuel Skunk Works needed a way to hide the A-12's radar reflecting behind, so they dumped cesium into its fuel to create a radar-absorbing exhaust plume... The basic principle behind this is a concept known as “plasma stealth.” In the simplest terms, this involves creating a cloud of plasma, or ionized gas, around some or all of an object. The plasma then absorbs electromagnetic radiation, such as radar waves, preventing them from reflecting back. There are multiple ways to generate the required plasma Lovick’s idea was to inject an alkali metal, via a fuel additive, into the extremely hot exhaust streams, where the heat would turn it into an ionized gas. |
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Posted: 6/26/2024 3:42:25 PM EDT
[#2]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By R_S: Plasma stealth may not be widely talked about, but it's been around for a long time: The SR-71 Blackbird’s Predecessor Created “Plasma Stealth” By Burning Cesium-Laced Fuel Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By R_S: Originally Posted By planemaker: Originally Posted By R_S: Originally Posted By ColtRifle: Originally Posted By R_S: Honestly the more I think about it, the more concerned I get. Russian nuclear forces are not as large as they used to be, but that Frigate in Cuba almost certainly has their latest generation hypersonic missiles... which are unstoppable... and which probably have nuclear warheads. Russian Frigate sails to the Atlantic with Hypersonic Missiles (2023) If you estimate range at 600 miles, from Havana all of Florida is in range. It is a dangerous first strike capability. I'm not convinced the land based Russian ballistic missiles are super dangerous as anti-missile defenses exist for them, but sub based missiles and hypersonic ship based missiles can cause havoc in the coastal areas with little response time. https://thebulletin.org/2024/03/hypersonic-weapons-are-mediocre-its-time-to-stop-wasting-money-on-them/amp/ Further, Ukraine using US Patriots has shot down at least one, and likely two, Zircon missiles. Why would the Russian ship shoot nuclear Zircon missiles at the US? Let’s say they do…..then what? Every Russian surface ship in the Atlantic become converted to Russian subs and the Russian subs all go down and stay down. If that’s their first strike plan, they are dumber than whale shit. Russians are stupid but they aren’t remotely THAT stupid. To sit in fear over this non important event is pointless. By the way, the scary ships and sub are not in Cuba any more. Ukraine has make lots of unsubstantiated and baseless claims (ie Ghost of Kiev, longest sniper kill ever, etc). Why Russia's Hypersonic Missiles Can't Be Seen on Radar: And it's so fast that the air pressure in front of the weapon forms a plasma cloud as it moves, absorbing radio waves and making it practically invisible to active radar systems. U.S. Aegis missile interceptor systems require 8-10 seconds of reaction time to intercept incoming attacks. In those 8-10 seconds, the Russian Zircon missiles will already have traveled 20 kilometers, and the interceptor missiles do not fly fast enough to catch up. While satellite systems may be able to provide some early warning of hypersonic missile attacks based on thermal signature, making an intercept would be very difficult. The fact that the ships are still in the Gulf and could return to Cuba whenever the Russians feel like it is not very re-assuring to me. The notion that hypersonic speed by itself creates invisibility is just nonsense. If that were true, we wouldn't be able to track ICBMs or reentry vehicles at all. We can and do with radar. We have the ability to intercept hypersonic missiles both on land and at sea. It's just another tool in the toolbox and not some media-fueled boogeyman. The reason that the Russian navy often visits Cuba is so they can go someplace warm where the sun shines, same as the reason why American tourists visit the Caribbean. Plasma stealth may not be widely talked about, but it's been around for a long time: The SR-71 Blackbird’s Predecessor Created “Plasma Stealth” By Burning Cesium-Laced Fuel Skunk Works needed a way to hide the A-12's radar reflecting behind, so they dumped cesium into its fuel to create a radar-absorbing exhaust plume... The basic principle behind this is a concept known as “plasma stealth.” In the simplest terms, this involves creating a cloud of plasma, or ionized gas, around some or all of an object. The plasma then absorbs electromagnetic radiation, such as radar waves, preventing them from reflecting back. There are multiple ways to generate the required plasma Lovick’s idea was to inject an alkali metal, via a fuel additive, into the extremely hot exhaust streams, where the heat would turn it into an ionized gas. Plasma blockage of RF has been around since reentry has been a thing. That's why you get a comms blackout during reentry. However, the author of the article is mistaken in how exactly the fuel additive of the A-12 was supposed to work. It wasn't creating a plasma from/in the exhaust plume, it was changing the exhaust plume to not be completely transparent at radar frequencies. In effect, it created a semi-metallized cone around the exhaust nozzles so that the huge RCS of the afterburners would not be seen from the aft quadrant. It's still there, it's just a lot harder to see because of the reflective "pollutants". It's a high-temp version of the "metallized" canopies on fighters. It occurs to me that the biggest problem with non-ballistic hypersonic missiles is the shortened reaction time for the crew, not the interception system. |
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Posted: 6/26/2024 4:29:12 PM EDT
[Last Edit: R_S]
[#3]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By planemaker: Plasma blockage of RF has been around since reentry has been a thing. That's why you get a comms blackout during reentry. However, the author of the article is mistaken in how exactly the fuel additive of the A-12 was supposed to work. It wasn't creating a plasma from/in the exhaust plume, it was changing the exhaust plume to not be completely transparent at radar frequencies. In effect, it created a semi-metallized cone around the exhaust nozzles so that the huge RCS of the afterburners would not be seen from the aft quadrant. It's still there, it's just a lot harder to see because of the reflective "pollutants". It's a high-temp version of the "metallized" canopies on fighters. It occurs to me that the biggest problem with non-ballistic hypersonic missiles is the shortened reaction time for the crew, not the interception system. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By planemaker: Originally Posted By R_S: Originally Posted By planemaker: Originally Posted By R_S: Originally Posted By ColtRifle: Originally Posted By R_S: Honestly the more I think about it, the more concerned I get. Russian nuclear forces are not as large as they used to be, but that Frigate in Cuba almost certainly has their latest generation hypersonic missiles... which are unstoppable... and which probably have nuclear warheads. Russian Frigate sails to the Atlantic with Hypersonic Missiles (2023) If you estimate range at 600 miles, from Havana all of Florida is in range. It is a dangerous first strike capability. I'm not convinced the land based Russian ballistic missiles are super dangerous as anti-missile defenses exist for them, but sub based missiles and hypersonic ship based missiles can cause havoc in the coastal areas with little response time. https://thebulletin.org/2024/03/hypersonic-weapons-are-mediocre-its-time-to-stop-wasting-money-on-them/amp/ Further, Ukraine using US Patriots has shot down at least one, and likely two, Zircon missiles. Why would the Russian ship shoot nuclear Zircon missiles at the US? Let’s say they do…..then what? Every Russian surface ship in the Atlantic become converted to Russian subs and the Russian subs all go down and stay down. If that’s their first strike plan, they are dumber than whale shit. Russians are stupid but they aren’t remotely THAT stupid. To sit in fear over this non important event is pointless. By the way, the scary ships and sub are not in Cuba any more. Ukraine has make lots of unsubstantiated and baseless claims (ie Ghost of Kiev, longest sniper kill ever, etc). Why Russia's Hypersonic Missiles Can't Be Seen on Radar: And it's so fast that the air pressure in front of the weapon forms a plasma cloud as it moves, absorbing radio waves and making it practically invisible to active radar systems. U.S. Aegis missile interceptor systems require 8-10 seconds of reaction time to intercept incoming attacks. In those 8-10 seconds, the Russian Zircon missiles will already have traveled 20 kilometers, and the interceptor missiles do not fly fast enough to catch up. While satellite systems may be able to provide some early warning of hypersonic missile attacks based on thermal signature, making an intercept would be very difficult. The fact that the ships are still in the Gulf and could return to Cuba whenever the Russians feel like it is not very re-assuring to me. The notion that hypersonic speed by itself creates invisibility is just nonsense. If that were true, we wouldn't be able to track ICBMs or reentry vehicles at all. We can and do with radar. We have the ability to intercept hypersonic missiles both on land and at sea. It's just another tool in the toolbox and not some media-fueled boogeyman. The reason that the Russian navy often visits Cuba is so they can go someplace warm where the sun shines, same as the reason why American tourists visit the Caribbean. Plasma stealth may not be widely talked about, but it's been around for a long time: The SR-71 Blackbird’s Predecessor Created “Plasma Stealth” By Burning Cesium-Laced Fuel Skunk Works needed a way to hide the A-12's radar reflecting behind, so they dumped cesium into its fuel to create a radar-absorbing exhaust plume... The basic principle behind this is a concept known as “plasma stealth.” In the simplest terms, this involves creating a cloud of plasma, or ionized gas, around some or all of an object. The plasma then absorbs electromagnetic radiation, such as radar waves, preventing them from reflecting back. There are multiple ways to generate the required plasma Lovick’s idea was to inject an alkali metal, via a fuel additive, into the extremely hot exhaust streams, where the heat would turn it into an ionized gas. Plasma blockage of RF has been around since reentry has been a thing. That's why you get a comms blackout during reentry. However, the author of the article is mistaken in how exactly the fuel additive of the A-12 was supposed to work. It wasn't creating a plasma from/in the exhaust plume, it was changing the exhaust plume to not be completely transparent at radar frequencies. In effect, it created a semi-metallized cone around the exhaust nozzles so that the huge RCS of the afterburners would not be seen from the aft quadrant. It's still there, it's just a lot harder to see because of the reflective "pollutants". It's a high-temp version of the "metallized" canopies on fighters. It occurs to me that the biggest problem with non-ballistic hypersonic missiles is the shortened reaction time for the crew, not the interception system. From the article you posted: At hypersonic velocity, a missile will be travelling inside a self-generated bubble of ionised plasma – as happens to a spacecraft during re-entry – cutting it off from all sensor and communication inputs. The author is basically tip-toeing around the fact that the plasma bubble works both ways absorbing radar signals. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Plasma_stealth Plasma stealth is a proposed process to use ionized gas (plasma) to reduce the radar cross-section (RCS) of an aircraft. Interactions between electromagnetic radiation and ionized gas have been extensively studied for many purposes, including concealing aircraft from radar as stealth technology. Various methods might plausibly be able to form a layer or cloud of plasma around a vehicle to deflect or absorb radar |
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Posted: 6/26/2024 6:53:54 PM EDT
[Last Edit: ColtRifle]
[#4]
R_S….do you really think the Russians are going to launch relatively short range hypersonic nuclear cruise missiles from a lone warship in the Caribbean at the US??
The sub appears to be headed back home (while being followed by US ships, planes, and probably a US sub). It’s nowhere close to the Russian “fleet” at last news report I saw on it. |
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Posted: 6/26/2024 9:20:37 PM EDT
[#5]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By R_S: From the article you posted: The author is basically tip-toeing around the fact that the plasma bubble works both ways absorbing radar signals. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By R_S: Originally Posted By planemaker: Originally Posted By R_S: Originally Posted By planemaker: Originally Posted By R_S: Originally Posted By ColtRifle: Originally Posted By R_S: Honestly the more I think about it, the more concerned I get. Russian nuclear forces are not as large as they used to be, but that Frigate in Cuba almost certainly has their latest generation hypersonic missiles... which are unstoppable... and which probably have nuclear warheads. Russian Frigate sails to the Atlantic with Hypersonic Missiles (2023) If you estimate range at 600 miles, from Havana all of Florida is in range. It is a dangerous first strike capability. I'm not convinced the land based Russian ballistic missiles are super dangerous as anti-missile defenses exist for them, but sub based missiles and hypersonic ship based missiles can cause havoc in the coastal areas with little response time. https://thebulletin.org/2024/03/hypersonic-weapons-are-mediocre-its-time-to-stop-wasting-money-on-them/amp/ Further, Ukraine using US Patriots has shot down at least one, and likely two, Zircon missiles. Why would the Russian ship shoot nuclear Zircon missiles at the US? Let’s say they do…..then what? Every Russian surface ship in the Atlantic become converted to Russian subs and the Russian subs all go down and stay down. If that’s their first strike plan, they are dumber than whale shit. Russians are stupid but they aren’t remotely THAT stupid. To sit in fear over this non important event is pointless. By the way, the scary ships and sub are not in Cuba any more. Ukraine has make lots of unsubstantiated and baseless claims (ie Ghost of Kiev, longest sniper kill ever, etc). Why Russia's Hypersonic Missiles Can't Be Seen on Radar: And it's so fast that the air pressure in front of the weapon forms a plasma cloud as it moves, absorbing radio waves and making it practically invisible to active radar systems. U.S. Aegis missile interceptor systems require 8-10 seconds of reaction time to intercept incoming attacks. In those 8-10 seconds, the Russian Zircon missiles will already have traveled 20 kilometers, and the interceptor missiles do not fly fast enough to catch up. While satellite systems may be able to provide some early warning of hypersonic missile attacks based on thermal signature, making an intercept would be very difficult. The fact that the ships are still in the Gulf and could return to Cuba whenever the Russians feel like it is not very re-assuring to me. The notion that hypersonic speed by itself creates invisibility is just nonsense. If that were true, we wouldn't be able to track ICBMs or reentry vehicles at all. We can and do with radar. We have the ability to intercept hypersonic missiles both on land and at sea. It's just another tool in the toolbox and not some media-fueled boogeyman. The reason that the Russian navy often visits Cuba is so they can go someplace warm where the sun shines, same as the reason why American tourists visit the Caribbean. Plasma stealth may not be widely talked about, but it's been around for a long time: The SR-71 Blackbird’s Predecessor Created “Plasma Stealth” By Burning Cesium-Laced Fuel Skunk Works needed a way to hide the A-12's radar reflecting behind, so they dumped cesium into its fuel to create a radar-absorbing exhaust plume... The basic principle behind this is a concept known as “plasma stealth.” In the simplest terms, this involves creating a cloud of plasma, or ionized gas, around some or all of an object. The plasma then absorbs electromagnetic radiation, such as radar waves, preventing them from reflecting back. There are multiple ways to generate the required plasma Lovick’s idea was to inject an alkali metal, via a fuel additive, into the extremely hot exhaust streams, where the heat would turn it into an ionized gas. Plasma blockage of RF has been around since reentry has been a thing. That's why you get a comms blackout during reentry. However, the author of the article is mistaken in how exactly the fuel additive of the A-12 was supposed to work. It wasn't creating a plasma from/in the exhaust plume, it was changing the exhaust plume to not be completely transparent at radar frequencies. In effect, it created a semi-metallized cone around the exhaust nozzles so that the huge RCS of the afterburners would not be seen from the aft quadrant. It's still there, it's just a lot harder to see because of the reflective "pollutants". It's a high-temp version of the "metallized" canopies on fighters. It occurs to me that the biggest problem with non-ballistic hypersonic missiles is the shortened reaction time for the crew, not the interception system. From the article you posted: At hypersonic velocity, a missile will be travelling inside a self-generated bubble of ionised plasma – as happens to a spacecraft during re-entry – cutting it off from all sensor and communication inputs. The author is basically tip-toeing around the fact that the plasma bubble works both ways absorbing radar signals. Yeah, one wonders how exactly the hypersonic missile is guided if it's surrounded by a plasma bubble. Better hope it's (a) short-ish range where INS drift won't be an issue and (b) the INS system is temperature swing tolerant. (FYI, I didn't post an article, somebody else did but I'm having trouble following the quote trees on my browser tonight. I blame sunspots. Or plasma.  )
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Posted: 6/26/2024 9:33:38 PM EDT
[Last Edit: ColtRifle]
[#6]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By planemaker: Yeah, one wonders how exactly the hypersonic missile is guided if it's surrounded by a plasma bubble. Better hope it's (a) short-ish range where INS drift won't be an issue and (b) the INS system is temperature swing tolerant. (FYI, I didn't post an article, somebody else did but I'm having trouble following the quote trees on my browser tonight. I blame sunspots. Or plasma. )It’s all the nukes that Russia fired at us when their lone surface warship was in Cuba. But, they are stealth nukes. So sneaky you don’t know you’ve been hit. Wonder weapon. Russia strong!!! |
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Posted: 6/26/2024 9:35:55 PM EDT
[#7]
On a serious note….for those who believe we are in more danger of WWIII than in the 1960s, 1970s, and 1980s and who feared this flotilla of Russian ships was the start of it, why do you think nothing happened?
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Posted: 6/27/2024 8:12:40 AM EDT
[Last Edit: TomJefferson]
[#8]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By ColtRifle: On a serious note….for those who believe we are in more danger of WWIII than in the 1960s, 1970s, and 1980s and who feared this flotilla of Russian ships was the start of it, why do you think nothing happened? Didn't expect anything to happen. It was Putin's way to let the American public know, he can get to us and our two oceans are not a barrier. It was blatant sword rattling and sword ratting is always a precursor to war. It was also a test of what Biden would do which he got his answer, nothing, not even an acknowledgement let alone following them with warships to South America. He's pissed Biden told Ukraine he could bomb Russian soil with our weapons, which btw Biden shouldn't have put limitations on them to begin with. On the world stage, Biden steps in shit like a blind man in a barn. |
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Posted: 6/27/2024 8:45:24 AM EDT
[#9]
I read some of the replies on the SURVIVAL forums here sometimes and I honestly wonder WHAT some people are supposed "preparing" for?
Just playing positive Patty and singing Kumbaya is not preparing, we have to take an objective look at the world, not thinking "this hasn't happened yet" but COULD this happen. No scenario should be outside the realm of preparation IMO. 
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Posted: 6/27/2024 9:14:37 AM EDT
[Last Edit: ColtRifle]
[#10]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By TomJefferson: Didn't expect anything to happen. It was Putin's way to let the American public know, he can get to us and our two oceans are not a barrier. It was blatant sword rattling and sword ratting is always a precursor to war. It was also a test of what Biden would do which he got his answer, nothing, not even an acknowledgement let alone following them with warships to South America. He's pissed Biden told Ukraine he could bomb Russian soil with our weapons, which btw Biden shouldn't have put limitations on them to begin with. On the world stage, Biden steps in shit like a blind man in a barn. You think this is saber rattling? Perhaps in Russian terms. This is more like waving a wet noodle at America. This is so pathetic it’s laughable. Russia has one aircraft carrier. It’s not nuclear powered and it travels (when it travels) with tub boats because….it breaks down….a LOT. This Russia “show of power” includes a tug boat just in case the lone warship breaks down. One American carrier strike group is comprised of 1 Aircraft Carrier, 2 Guided Missile Cruisers, 2 Anti Aircraft Warships,and 1-2 Anti Submarine Destroyers or Frigates…..and often subs and other ships as mission dictates. The US has 11 of these carrier battle groups. The Navy/Marine Corps team has MEUs. (Marine Expeditionary Unit). A MEU usually has 3-4 amphibious ships comprised of the Command Element (CE), the Ground Combat Element (GCE), the Aviation Combat Element (ACE), and the Logistics Combat Element (LCE). They will frequently travel with other warships and sometimes a carrier group. Many US amphibious ships are the size or nearly the size of WWII carriers. The US has around 31 of those ships (all types). And, the US did monitor the ships transit to Cuba. “The Russian ships' transit towards Cuba was monitored by six warships from the United States Navy, Canada, and France. They included the U.S. Navy destroyers USS Donald Cook, USS Delbert Black, USS Truxton, U.S. Coast Guard Cutter Stone, the Canadian frigate HMCS Ville de Quebec, and a French Lafayette class frigate.” Biden is an idiot but ignoring this is a smart move. Why give the Russians an ego boost by showing we are scared of these ships? And we shouldn’t be scared of these ships…..it’s laughable. https://abcnews.go.com/amp/Politics/pentagon-downplays-russian-warships-arriving-cuba/story?id=111071280 The Russians last made a similar trip in 2019….while Trump was president. Didn’t hear any preppers or survivalists shitting their pants over the visit then. I just don’t understand how anyone can remotely consider this any kind of a threat. As a threat, this is absolutely laughable. This is probably the best the Russians can do. That’s not a first world power. I am more concerned with the next bad storm I will “survive” than this non event. |
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Posted: 6/27/2024 10:28:47 AM EDT
[Last Edit: R_S]
[#11]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By ColtRifle: R_S….do you really think the Russians are going to launch relatively short range hypersonic nuclear cruise missiles from a lone warship in the Caribbean at the US?? The sub appears to be headed back home (while being followed by US ships, planes, and probably a US sub). It’s nowhere close to the Russian “fleet” at last news report I saw on it. As TJ said it's sabre rattling and a test to see the US reaction. Honestly probably also a test run to see how the Russian navy performs (I guess they didn't need that tug this time, LOL). Julian Spencer-Churchill has a ton of really interesting info on nuclear strategy and one thing it shows is that the Russians are FAR better when their nuclear forces are on alert vs normal ops. The Russians also have some vulnerabilities to a decapitation strike... which I believe increases the overall risk of nuclear conflict... Russia is known for doing surprise attacks and they know that their best chance in a nuclear conflict is for them to be the ones to launch a surprise attack. You can conceal a surprise attack by doing lots of "alerts" until you lull the enemy into not reacting to your alert. That's the time to strike. That said, US intel seems to be pretty exhaustive these days, so the Russians would need to count on sleepy joe not taking action. Which honestly seems like reality at this point. |
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Posted: 6/27/2024 12:20:42 PM EDT
[#12]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By R_S: As TJ said it's sabre rattling and a test to see the US reaction. Honestly probably also a test run to see how the Russian navy performs (I guess they didn't need that tug this time, LOL). Julian Spencer-Churchill has a ton of really interesting info on nuclear strategy and one thing it shows is that the Russians are FAR better when their nuclear forces are on alert vs normal ops. The Russians also have some vulnerabilities to a decapitation strike... which I believe increases the overall risk of nuclear conflict... Russia is known for doing surprise attacks and they know that their best chance in a nuclear conflict is for them to be the ones to launch a surprise attack. You can conceal a surprise attack by doing lots of "alerts" until you lull the enemy into not reacting to your alert. That's the time to strike. That said, US intel seems to be pretty exhaustive these days, so the Russians would need to count on sleepy joe not taking action. Which honestly seems like reality at this point. The Russians know the US has a very capable 1st and 2nd nuclear strike ability. The Russians NEED Americans to tremble at Russian military “power”. Stop being scared of Russia. Cautious and alert? Of course. Scared? Definitely not. Russia is a shell of its Soviet Union strength. It’s the shitty trailer park of Eastern Europe. |
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Posted: 6/28/2024 12:34:50 PM EDT
[#13]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By ColtRifle: The Russians know the US has a very capable 1st and 2nd nuclear strike ability. The Russians NEED Americans to tremble at Russian military “power”. Stop being scared of Russia. Cautious and alert? Of course. Scared? Definitely not. Russia is a shell of its Soviet Union strength. It’s the shitty trailer park of Eastern Europe. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By ColtRifle: Originally Posted By R_S: As TJ said it's sabre rattling and a test to see the US reaction. Honestly probably also a test run to see how the Russian navy performs (I guess they didn't need that tug this time, LOL). Julian Spencer-Churchill has a ton of really interesting info on nuclear strategy and one thing it shows is that the Russians are FAR better when their nuclear forces are on alert vs normal ops. The Russians also have some vulnerabilities to a decapitation strike... which I believe increases the overall risk of nuclear conflict... Russia is known for doing surprise attacks and they know that their best chance in a nuclear conflict is for them to be the ones to launch a surprise attack. You can conceal a surprise attack by doing lots of "alerts" until you lull the enemy into not reacting to your alert. That's the time to strike. That said, US intel seems to be pretty exhaustive these days, so the Russians would need to count on sleepy joe not taking action. Which honestly seems like reality at this point. The Russians know the US has a very capable 1st and 2nd nuclear strike ability. The Russians NEED Americans to tremble at Russian military “power”. Stop being scared of Russia. Cautious and alert? Of course. Scared? Definitely not. Russia is a shell of its Soviet Union strength. It’s the shitty trailer park of Eastern Europe. Normalcy bias is very real. Russia is indeed a shell of its Soviet Union strength... but they are currently in an alliance with the PRC which, now by far has a larger economy than the US, as well as Iran. These 3 teamed up with Yemen just sent the Eisenhower carrier task force home. Pax Americana freedom of the seas is now in jeopardy. If you read Brzezinski's grand chessboard carefully, you will notice that the criminals misruling our nation have made a MASSIVE strategic error. Ron Unz is VERY smart guy (off the charts)... and he is already calling it: Did the Neocons Save the World from the Thucydides Trap? Right now there are changes – the likes of which we haven’t seen for 100 years |
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Posted: 6/28/2024 1:49:35 PM EDT
[#14]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By R_S: Normalcy bias is very real. Russia is indeed a shell of its Soviet Union strength... but they are currently in an alliance with the PRC which, now by far has a larger economy than the US, as well as Iran. These 3 teamed up with Yemen just sent the Eisenhower carrier task force home. Pax Americana freedom of the seas is now in jeopardy. If you read Brzezinski's grand chessboard carefully, you will notice that the criminals misruling our nation have made a MASSIVE strategic error. Ron Unz is VERY smart guy (off the charts)... and he is already calling it: Did the Neocons Save the World from the Thucydides Trap? - Xi So, what prep steps are you taking and recommending to people given your beliefs?? |
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Posted: 6/28/2024 5:02:46 PM EDT
[Last Edit: Lowdown3]
[#15]
If people are really preparing, most of their standard "preps" will be useful in a nuclear scenario.
These include: moving away from target areas, having a year supply of food on hand, modes of protection, decent shelter, etc. Only truly "nuke specific" preps would be things like survey meter, dosimeters and fallout shelter- only liberals and people trying to disparage survivalism call them "doomsday bunkers". You could argue that gas mask, filters and protective suits are "nuke specific" but since they are useful in several other scenarios that wouldn't be true that they are "specific" to nukes. If someone is in an area away from targets, has a basement they are half way there. Surely farther than just sticking your head some place warm and dark and assuming it's not possible. And I liken the "we have better weapons" hubris to common thoughts from "preppers" about gangbangers. I've seen/heard for years how "preppers" are sooo much better than "G Dawg with his Jennings he shots sideways" and all that crap. Yet "G Dawg" is used to violence whereas Joe Prepper with his mostly still shiny new looking rifles (cause he's too cheap to train and practice regularly) hasn't experienced violence much in his life outside of a "yo mama is fat" push fight in elementary skewl. But that doesn't stop the hubris Joe Prepper feels because he has a better weapon (he won't use). Underestimating your enemies is never a good idea, a cursory study of history shows that. |
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Posted: 6/29/2024 6:24:52 AM EDT
[#16]
Well fellas a token gesture is about all they have now. The Black Sea fleet is in the middle of a war with reports 1/3rd has been sunk or out of action. Their Mediterranean fleet is active as hell protecting their one base in Syria with war all around them. Putin is pushing, for what he calls, a realignment of territorial waters, their pipeline was bombed, Sweden and Finland both are more military ship active in the Baltic confirming their claims, and Putin fears NATO action.
Guys, I've traveled the world and if I can tell you one thing about Russian's besides how dark their outlook is, it's WWII to them was just yesterday. Nobody knows the exact figures but it's easily over 12 million Russians died. It's in their psychology. In fact, Putin is counting on it right now in his war on Ukraine. Remember all the early war "NAZI" rhetoric? That was no BS. Many Ukrainians and for that matter the Baltic states fought with the NAZIs against the Soviet communists. We in the US are taught and reminded they were our ally but truth was Stalin was a devil worse than Hitler and had just as much to do with starting WWII. Now the rhetoric is go fight not NATO but the Americans. I haven't even touched on the heightened military reactions in Asia but it's just as alarming. Even more WOKE nuts than us Australia is doubling their military fleet size. All this shit going on and nobody is talking to Putin, hell anyone. If you watched the debate, you now know without a doubt we have a zombie commander in chief. I've been telling folks for years, all my contacts overseas have been calling Sleepy's admin, "Elder Abuse". They don't have our media spitting out propaganda 24/7 telling them otherwise and they DO have relatives and neighbors who are old. For all practical purposes, the west is and has been leaderless. After 80 years of let the US handle it, nobody has enough strength to step up where anyone will listen to them. About all the west that can is arming right now. Russia's economy is on a full war footing now and yes improving rapidly. Should we prepare for nuclear war? Hell I don't know anymore than the next guy. It's not a total impossibility. A student of history and son of a WWII vet, I can tell you this is some 1930's shit right now, heck, 1915 shit. The similarities are mind blowing especially in the US. Socialist president, check. Over regulation hampering industry necessary for war, check. Appeasement, check. I could go on. You don't have to be a Nostradamus to see what's coming. You only have to be up on current events which hands down US citizens are the least informed in the free world. Our news is nothing but political propaganda and you could fill volumes on that they lied about and don't tell us at all. Preparations? Much of what we prepare for like major weather events, fire, and crime events is applicable to a war footing. If I had to put one as top of my list, it would be communication, a way to get news, preferably world news, if the power goes out. You don't need a nuclear event to take the grid down and our borders are non-existent. Bug out is another one. If you don't think that is possible, you've never seen war documentary. I'm staying here and dying is not a survival plan. Once more, you don't need a bomb for that one either. Like any good plan, it should be adaptable and have alternatives. We're in the keep your ear to the ground and adapt as necessary stage. The world is arming, bullets are flying, and are two oceans are not impassible. Tj |
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Posted: 7/5/2024 9:30:05 AM EDT
[#17]
No one should be preparing out of a motivation driven solely by fear. I realize some do however, but they rarely last for the long game. Those are the people that tend to go all bonkers on a certain thing, certain scenario they expect to happen around X date, etc. Since those are usually people who are looking to JUSTIFY their actions either to themselves or to their "unbelieving spouse" they get themselves mentally "invested" in that certain scenario, certain time frame, etc. They are preparing out of fear.
In close to 40 years of active preparing, interacting with others, etc. both on a personal and business scale, I can tell you that most of the folks preparing solely out of fear don't last. They burn out. There is however a helluva difference between living in "fear" of something and sticking your head in a warm, dark place (head up ass syndrome) and totally ignoring or poo poo'ing a threat based on hubris or just that the individual doesn't really want to "deal" with the idea of it- witness the common "if a bomb drops I hope it lands on me" type non sense. |
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