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Posted: 11/12/2015 9:24:30 PM EDT
[#1]
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I do disagree. Given the ridiculous failure and dropout rate for college students in the first couple of years, making them an extension of high school (which already has horrendous dropout rates in some places) is just useless expense. The people this is drained to "help" simply won't benefit from more time in a classroom, so the lofty goal of "makin our society more educated" is bunk. Motivated students aren't the problem. They work their way through school and generally do fine with things the way they are. The problem is the FSA turds who don't belong there in the first place. My tax dollars shouldn't fund adult day care for millenials to "study" Russian Literature or Sociology. Even in the best case, those people will continue to be a drain on productive folks- the sooner you cut them off the better. You want government funded trade schools for non academics? That I might be able to get behind. There is a genuine need for skilled workers... Much more so than for say, English majors. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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College, Military or Trade schools. The gov is already pretty much subsidizing higher education. Make community colleges free and help educate our population. It's one of the few things I don't mind my tax dollars going to. Better than social security or Medicaid. It's an investment in our future. I would not disagree. I do disagree. Given the ridiculous failure and dropout rate for college students in the first couple of years, making them an extension of high school (which already has horrendous dropout rates in some places) is just useless expense. The people this is drained to "help" simply won't benefit from more time in a classroom, so the lofty goal of "makin our society more educated" is bunk. Motivated students aren't the problem. They work their way through school and generally do fine with things the way they are. The problem is the FSA turds who don't belong there in the first place. My tax dollars shouldn't fund adult day care for millenials to "study" Russian Literature or Sociology. Even in the best case, those people will continue to be a drain on productive folks- the sooner you cut them off the better. You want government funded trade schools for non academics? That I might be able to get behind. There is a genuine need for skilled workers... Much more so than for say, English majors. I would rather my taxes pay for russian literature than some bum to sit around playing video games all day and collecting a check. |
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Posted: 11/12/2015 9:24:58 PM EDT
[#2]
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College, Military or Trade schools. The gov is already pretty much subsidizing higher education. Make community colleges free and help educate our population. It's one of the few things I don't mind my tax dollars going to. Better than social security or Medicaid. It's an investment in our future. 'I don't mind the 4473 and the NICS check...' |
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Posted: 11/12/2015 9:26:21 PM EDT
[#3]
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Come on man, all we need is the government to run everything and Primus_Pilus says we'll only pay $100 per credit hour yet somehow everyone is going to get an awesome education.  Quote HistoryQuoted:
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JFC, there are actually people on this board in favor of this.
Half the people that are paying for college with student loans don't show up to class, I can't imagine the worthless shit that would go on if it was a free ride for all. Come on man, all we need is the government to run everything and Primus_Pilus says we'll only pay $100 per credit hour yet somehow everyone is going to get an awesome education. Twisting what people say is pretty cool too. How liberal of you. |
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Posted: 11/12/2015 9:28:43 PM EDT
[#4]
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'I don't mind the 4473 and the NICS check...' Quote HistoryQuoted:
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College, Military or Trade schools. The gov is already pretty much subsidizing higher education. Make community colleges free and help educate our population. It's one of the few things I don't mind my tax dollars going to. Better than social security or Medicaid. It's an investment in our future. 'I don't mind the 4473 and the NICS check...' Logical leap...... man you can really tell who did and didn't go to college. |
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Posted: 11/12/2015 9:31:45 PM EDT
[#5]
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They are already doing it, what is difficult to understand. They already have spent over a TRILLION on student loans, most of that will never be paid back. Why would someone get a job and have 50% of their income garnished for the next 10 years when they can just stay unemployed or work under the table. All this would do is divert those costs to cheaper education on a local level. I wold rather people get a decent education for free, unburdening them to become an economic factor than be a perpetual drain on society. In the long run, its a MUCH better investment then anything we currently have. It is also politically viable since we aren't going to get gov out of education. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Education is a right? Exactly. 
Forcing someone to work for another's benefit is a right.  If I'm "less fortunate" than you, then I have a right to your efforts. You don't get any rights since you are "more fortunate."
Things aren't looking good. We've definitely reached critical dumb mass. No its not a right. But its shortsighted and ignorant to see that an uneducated population is going to be a factor in the downfall of the country while other countries gain ground. Government providing free education for everyone will not make our population any more educated than it is, and will more than likely have the opposite effect while also putting us more in debt and furthering the socialist agenda. 
No thank you. They are already doing it, what is difficult to understand. They already have spent over a TRILLION on student loans, most of that will never be paid back. Why would someone get a job and have 50% of their income garnished for the next 10 years when they can just stay unemployed or work under the table. All this would do is divert those costs to cheaper education on a local level. I wold rather people get a decent education for free, unburdening them to become an economic factor than be a perpetual drain on society. In the long run, its a MUCH better investment then anything we currently have. It is also politically viable since we aren't going to get gov out of education. Care to cite these numbers. Seems like your just throwing out b.s. to make it sound good. BTW, the gov isn't lending the money for student loans, so how have they already spent a trillion dollars and how are we already paying for it? |
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Posted: 11/12/2015 9:55:46 PM EDT
[#6]
American borrowers have racked up about $1.2 trillion in outstanding federal student debt, according to the Consumer Financial Protection Bureau.?
There is more Student Loan Debt then all credit card debt combined. The Gov IS lending the money. And for the ones they aren't lending, they are guaranteed..... So it shows up as a liability on their balance sheet anyway. The default rate is going through the roof and will only get worse. It is debtors prison without the bars. Can't be discharged in bankruptcy. How much do you think the payment amount is for a $80-100K student loan at 6-8% interest over 10 years? Any more than that and the interest soars and you end up paying more in interest than the principle. |
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Posted: 11/12/2015 9:58:10 PM EDT
[#7]
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Twisting what people say is pretty cool too. How liberal of you. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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JFC, there are actually people on this board in favor of this.
Half the people that are paying for college with student loans don't show up to class, I can't imagine the worthless shit that would go on if it was a free ride for all. Come on man, all we need is the government to run everything and Primus_Pilus says we'll only pay $100 per credit hour yet somehow everyone is going to get an awesome education. Twisting what people say is pretty cool too. How liberal of you. Which part is an incorrect summary of your position? The cost per hour or the fact that they will get a good education? |
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Posted: 11/12/2015 10:01:10 PM EDT
[#8]
Maybe, just maybe if some of them wouldn't take out student loans to study courses that WILL NOT translate into a job in the private sector, they might be able to get a job and pay them off
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Posted: 11/12/2015 10:12:09 PM EDT
[#9]
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Logical leap...... man you can really tell who did and didn't go to college. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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College, Military or Trade schools. The gov is already pretty much subsidizing higher education. Make community colleges free and help educate our population. It's one of the few things I don't mind my tax dollars going to. Better than social security or Medicaid. It's an investment in our future. 'I don't mind the 4473 and the NICS check...' Logical leap...... man you can really tell who did and didn't go to college. As you seem to be arguing that there are a bunch of useless college degrees out there, your 'didn't go to college' appeal to authority doesn't really carry much weight, does it? 
My point is that there are certain people who base their political leanings on the level of governmental involvement with which they are comfortable, e.g. "I don't mind _____________(insert level/degree of governmental involvement), therefore that level must be just and proper." "I don't mind universal background checks" is just as meaningless to me as "I don't mind my tax money going to welfare." So what? Why should I care? The reason people are so defiant in the face of this kind of statement is because it implies something more pernicious... "I believe I have the right to force you to submit to universal background checks" or "I believe I have the right to take your money to pay for others' educations." Just as people will deride others' failure to support welfare because they'll "riot and steal and kill and burn your house down" and "you're paying for it now anyways", so are you: you seem to be only supportive of 'free' education because there's some mysterious threat of a future uneducated populace, and that "well, we're already paying for it." I reject both your notions. However, you'll continue to vote in accordance with your thinking, redistributing wealth using the tyranny of the majority under the guise of some future unverifiable benefit. That you refuse to accept that I have the right to tell somebody else to pay for their own education, while you advocate for taxes to continue...
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Posted: 11/12/2015 10:19:33 PM EDT
[#10]
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American borrowers have racked up about $1.2 trillion in outstanding federal student debt, according to the Consumer Financial Protection Bureau.? There is more Student Loan Debt then all credit card debt combined. The Gov IS lending the money. And for the ones they aren't lending, they are guaranteed..... So it shows up as a liability on their balance sheet anyway. The default rate is going through the roof and will only get worse. It is debtors prison without the bars. Can't be discharged in bankruptcy. How much do you think the payment amount is for a $80-100K student loan at 6-8% interest over 10 years? Any more than that and the interest soars and you end up paying more in interest than the principle. Show me where I can go to get a student loan from the government. People chose to take out loans to go to college. They were not forced. Maybe a math class should be required prior to taking 100,000 in student loans. |
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Posted: 11/12/2015 10:21:57 PM EDT
[#11]
Useful idiots.
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Posted: 11/12/2015 10:30:16 PM EDT
[#13]
#freeshitnow
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Posted: 11/12/2015 10:34:17 PM EDT
[#14]
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We should just make everything free. and pay everyone 100K a year. Fucking unicorns for everyone! Stupid bint AND her b/f only owe 50k? That's it? Get the fuck out of here. This is really going to speed up the collapse of a bunch of our universities, plus it's getting in the way of a bunch of fucks I don't like actually getting an education. So overall I'd have to say this is a win. |
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Posted: 11/12/2015 10:38:25 PM EDT
[#15]
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They are already doing it, what is difficult to understand. They already have spent over a TRILLION on student loans, most of that will never be paid back. Why would someone get a job and have 50% of their income garnished for the next 10 years when they can just stay unemployed or work under the table. All this would do is divert those costs to cheaper education on a local level. I wold rather people get a decent education for free, unburdening them to become an economic factor than be a perpetual drain on society. In the long run, its a MUCH better investment then anything we currently have. It is also politically viable since we aren't going to get gov out of education. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Education is a right? Exactly.
Forcing someone to work for another's benefit is a right. If I'm "less fortunate" than you, then I have a right to your efforts. You don't get any rights since you are "more fortunate."
Things aren't looking good. We've definitely reached critical dumb mass. No its not a right. But its shortsighted and ignorant to see that an uneducated population is going to be a factor in the downfall of the country while other countries gain ground. Government providing free education for everyone will not make our population any more educated than it is, and will more than likely have the opposite effect while also putting us more in debt and furthering the socialist agenda.
No thank you. They are already doing it, what is difficult to understand. They already have spent over a TRILLION on student loans, most of that will never be paid back. Why would someone get a job and have 50% of their income garnished for the next 10 years when they can just stay unemployed or work under the table. All this would do is divert those costs to cheaper education on a local level. I wold rather people get a decent education for free, unburdening them to become an economic factor than be a perpetual drain on society. In the long run, its a MUCH better investment then anything we currently have. It is also politically viable since we aren't going to get gov out of education. I read the part in red and stopped. I am not reading any more from you. No they are not providing free education to everyone. Where do you come up with this shit. List grows by 1. 
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Posted: 11/12/2015 10:39:30 PM EDT
[#16]
Life.
Liberty. The Pursuit of Happiness. I have the right to pursue an education. I have no right to force my fellow man provide an education to me... or anyone else. I have no right to force my fellow man to 'invest' his wealth in anything, e.g. a future 'more' educated populace. There are those people who confuse personal willingness with the application of force through government. If I am willing to spend some of my liberty in the pursuit of knowledge, and I agree to trade a portion of my life/liberty/property to someone else to accomplish the goal of being recognized as an 'educated man', then I can become educated. I am free and respected the freedom of my fellow man. If I am willing to spend someone else's life/liberty/property on yet someone else's 'education', how shall I accomplish this goal? I should persuade someone to part with their money, should I not? Of course I should. What course of action should I take if I fail to persuade that someone to part with their money? The personal responsibility conscious person realizes that each one of us is responsible for our own education, and that failure to achieve that 'happiness' rests with each individual. He respects the life, liberty, and pursuit of happiness of his fellow man. The governmental minded person realizes that there are 3 persons concerned: the person willing to spend someone else's money, the person who's money is at risk, and the potential recipient of that money via an education. - That person who is willing to spend someone else's money will always vote in favor of that, justifying it in their mind because they are willing to spend their own money. - That person who is the potential recipient of the education will normally always vote in favor of receiving it, as the human nature tends towards greedy: who wouldn't want 'something for nothing'? - That individual whose money is hanging in the balance will of course vote to keep their money... And in a 67% landslide, taxation to support 'free' education and 'forgiveness' of current education loans passes... ensuring that anyone who wishes to keep their own money may not legally do so. If my neighbor came to ask me for $$ to send their kid to college, I'd simply tell them no. Unfortunately, my neighbors use the IRS to 'ask' so that I may not legally say no. Don't hide behind the IRS as they do the sort of work you would not deign to soil your hands with. If these socialistic fucks truly wished for a utopian society based on their ideals, they would put in the work to compensate for the work I refuse to do or money I refuse to contribute. Instead, they must use force to extract every $$ from those who are producing. Sounds like pretty Communistic thinking process to me. Fuck them. |
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Posted: 11/12/2015 10:40:24 PM EDT
[#17]
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So: K - 12 government education.... learning. College - Postgrad.... nothing. lol Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Government providing free education for everyone will not make our population any more educated than it is, and will more than likely have the opposite effect while also putting us more in debt and furthering the socialist agenda.
No thank you. So: K - 12 government education.... learning. College - Postgrad.... nothing. lol We are not going to get in the rabbit hole on government funded primary education. It never should have happened. Government should not be involved in any type of education. Period. |
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Posted: 11/12/2015 10:45:59 PM EDT
[#18]
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American borrowers have racked up about $1.2 trillion in outstanding federal student debt, according to the Consumer Financial Protection Bureau.? There is more Student Loan Debt then all credit card debt combined. The Gov IS lending the money. And for the ones they aren't lending, they are guaranteed..... So it shows up as a liability on their balance sheet anyway. The default rate is going through the roof and will only get worse. It is debtors prison without the bars. Can't be discharged in bankruptcy. How much do you think the payment amount is for a $80-100K student loan at 6-8% interest over 10 years? Any more than that and the interest soars and you end up paying more in interest than the principle. 1. Show us on the doll where the student loans touched you. 2. According to Inside Ed the default rate went from 13.8 to around 11 this year 3. The solution to .gov caused problems is not more .goc |
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Posted: 11/12/2015 10:54:47 PM EDT
[#19]
Yes, we definitely need to emulate Greece. A nation of unemployed Phd's.
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Posted: 11/12/2015 11:03:49 PM EDT
[#20]
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Logical leap...... man you can really tell who did and didn't go to college. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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College, Military or Trade schools. The gov is already pretty much subsidizing higher education. Make community colleges free and help educate our population. It's one of the few things I don't mind my tax dollars going to. Better than social security or Medicaid. It's an investment in our future. 'I don't mind the 4473 and the NICS check...' Logical leap...... man you can really tell who did and didn't go to college. ....and who paid their college loans. |
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Posted: 11/12/2015 11:11:17 PM EDT
[#21]
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Posted: 11/12/2015 11:12:51 PM EDT
[#22]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Not on the east coast. Construction is dead unless you are Clark or one of the large national/international firms (who then bring in foreign labor). I grew up around new residential and commercial construction. The economy is fucked.... there are tens of millions of sqft of vacant commercial space....so new construction is all but dead unless you are building apartments in the city (which are the big boys). It takes 4 years to become a journeyman, including night school for most of the trades. Problem is, outside of union work there is not alot out there. Good luck getting a union gig out here. You are right though about the quality of apprentices. Schools , councilors and parents need to make it known as an option to college. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Learn a skill or trade in demand in or out of college ----->profit Get a degree that helps you get a job in a career that is high in demand and income ----->profit Waste time and money getting a degree in MOST of the various social science degrees (especially from private colleges) with little demand for higher income or employment --------> poor life decision = staying poor with lots of debt. Not anyone's fault except the individual. What trades or skills? Plumber? Sorry new construction is all but dead. Plus Mexicans took over most of the work. Electrical? Sorry new construction is all but dead. Plus Mexicans took over most of the work. Framing/Drywall? Sorry new construction is all but dead. Plus Mexicans took over most of the work. Mechanic? Cool you get to spend the same as you would going to college to go through a good mech school. Miner? Great until commodity prices drop back down and you lose everything. Enjoy that $80K lifted brodozer before the bank repos it. Oil & Gas? Great until commodity prices drop back down and you lose everything. Enjoy that $80K lifted brodozer before the bank repos it. Stripper? Now were on to something. One of the coveted Union trades (Pipefitter/elevator/electrical) ? Hope you know or are related to someone, otherwise you have a snowballs chance in hell. Truck Driver? NAFTA Killed a bunch of the decent paying jobs while high fuel costs squeezed out many operations. Not what it used to be. If it was so easy, everyone would be doing it. I deal with electrical contractors and unions and apprenticeship for a living and have been for going on 20 years. Plumbers, welders, electricians, fitters, steel workers are in short supply in My AO, and it is getting worse. As for "new construction" being dead...I defy you to drive through Houston, Beaumont, Austin, DFW, San Antonio, or any major city in Texas and count less than 25 tower cranes over new buildings, as well as refineries that are being retrofitted, and LNG export terminals being built. Hell, in my home town of Corpus Christi, we have a new steel mill, a new plastics mill, a port expansion, a new hospital, and a MASSIVE expansion at our refinery. We are short about 1100 electricians in Corpus Christi...that's just THIS pissant town. I deal with 11 different electrical apprenticeship programs in Texas and the Southern USA, they are STARVING for quality applicants...and the kicker is that people either don't want to get their hands dirty, or cannot/will not pass a drug test, or they will not go where the work is. Opportunity in the skilled trades IS there...and it is not being overrun by Mexicans. People just don't want it. Not on the east coast. Construction is dead unless you are Clark or one of the large national/international firms (who then bring in foreign labor). I grew up around new residential and commercial construction. The economy is fucked.... there are tens of millions of sqft of vacant commercial space....so new construction is all but dead unless you are building apartments in the city (which are the big boys). It takes 4 years to become a journeyman, including night school for most of the trades. Problem is, outside of union work there is not alot out there. Good luck getting a union gig out here. You are right though about the quality of apprentices. Schools , councilors and parents need to make it known as an option to college. The last 5 automotive plants built have all been built in the South. Toyota, Hyundai, BMW, mercedes Benz, and Volkswagen. Manufacturers are leaving the east coast and upper Midwest and moving to right to work states down south. In addition to those jobs...refinery work is a never ending project in Texas, Louisiana, and Mississippi. I kid you not.llwhen I was in Austin last week...I stopped counting tower cranes when I hit 25. Houston is ridiculous. Yes apprenticeships are 4 or 5 years and you've got to go to night school...but you'll earn a good living, have health insurance, and you will graduate with ZERO college debt. Skilled trades apprenticeship is the best deal in post high school education in the universe. |
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Posted: 11/12/2015 11:14:08 PM EDT
[#23]
If the government pays school det then they should pay my CC, house, private school for my kids and truck payment I mean that's only fair
Posting from phone |
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Posted: 11/12/2015 11:20:02 PM EDT
[#24]
I have always said that if there is a student loan forgiveness for these turds,
They need to leave their piece of paper at the door on the way out. No way do they get to keep the degree and utilize it if they can't pay for it. |
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Posted: 11/12/2015 11:22:02 PM EDT
[#25]
Seems like an automatic win promise for Hillary.
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Posted: 11/12/2015 11:24:49 PM EDT
[#26]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Maybe, just maybe if some of them wouldn't take out student loans to study courses that WILL NOT translate into a job in the private sector, they might be able to get a job and pay them off NOW you didn't it. There you go, using that logic and stuff. |
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Posted: 11/12/2015 11:26:36 PM EDT
[#27]
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Assuming they have somewhere to live, someone paying for their food and transportation. Not to mention things like insurance. It's not cheap to live. Not to mention every state is not the same. In places like NJ, it is cheaper to go out of state to MD/DE than to stay in state. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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"yet students have to take on crippling debt in order to get a college education," No...they don't. There are many avenues to avoid crippling student loan debt. Tuition for 2 years at community college + two years at a state school in Iowa is approx. $24k ($23,754) That is hardly crippling. Assuming they have somewhere to live, someone paying for their food and transportation. Not to mention things like insurance. It's not cheap to live. Not to mention every state is not the same. In places like NJ, it is cheaper to go out of state to MD/DE than to stay in state. Would they not need food or somewhere to live if they didn't go to college? How about transportation and mandatory health insurance? Do those bills suddenly go away when you aren't a student? |
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Posted: 11/12/2015 11:27:21 PM EDT
[#28]
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Posted: 11/12/2015 11:28:02 PM EDT
[#29]
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What part is the bullshit? The working your way up in a manufacturing plant? If that is the case, notice I did not say it is NONEXISTANT, merely that it is RARE (read that harder than it used to be). Many, (but NOT ALL) manufacturing jobs have moved out of the US. It's not that they don't exist here any longer, it's just that they are not as prolific as once was the case. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Gone are they days of working your way up in a manufacturing plant. This is true. Unless you are member of the UAW (or a government worker) starting with a HS education or equivalent and having a low-skill, high paying job for life is rare. Bullshit. I've done it, The brothers I work for did it, and most of my friends have done or are doing it. What part is the bullshit? The working your way up in a manufacturing plant? If that is the case, notice I did not say it is NONEXISTANT, merely that it is RARE (read that harder than it used to be). Many, (but NOT ALL) manufacturing jobs have moved out of the US. It's not that they don't exist here any longer, it's just that they are not as prolific as once was the case. Yes, that part. The part you said was gone. As in not there anymore. |
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Posted: 11/12/2015 11:28:58 PM EDT
[#30]
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Seems like an automatic win promise for Hillary. Easily translatable to an exact $$ amount, whether total or the monthly payment. How much is someone's integrity worth to them? Either in aggregate or individually, we're about to find out if this comes to pass. 
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Posted: 11/12/2015 11:30:46 PM EDT
[#31]
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People chose to take out loans to go to college. They were not forced. Agreed - the taxpayer had no say when the loan terms were agreed to. Force is now advocated by parasites (debtors) to pay for their poor decision by those who had no say. |
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Posted: 11/12/2015 11:31:12 PM EDT
[#32]
When one of them can get my order right at the drive thru window then maybe.....
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Posted: 11/12/2015 11:33:46 PM EDT
[#33]
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I would rather my taxes pay for russian literature than some bum to sit around playing video games all day and collecting a check. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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College, Military or Trade schools. The gov is already pretty much subsidizing higher education. Make community colleges free and help educate our population. It's one of the few things I don't mind my tax dollars going to. Better than social security or Medicaid. It's an investment in our future. I would not disagree. I do disagree. Given the ridiculous failure and dropout rate for college students in the first couple of years, making them an extension of high school (which already has horrendous dropout rates in some places) is just useless expense. The people this is drained to "help" simply won't benefit from more time in a classroom, so the lofty goal of "makin our society more educated" is bunk. Motivated students aren't the problem. They work their way through school and generally do fine with things the way they are. The problem is the FSA turds who don't belong there in the first place. My tax dollars shouldn't fund adult day care for millenials to "study" Russian Literature or Sociology. Even in the best case, those people will continue to be a drain on productive folks- the sooner you cut them off the better. You want government funded trade schools for non academics? That I might be able to get behind. There is a genuine need for skilled workers... Much more so than for say, English majors. I would rather my taxes pay for russian literature than some bum to sit around playing video games all day and collecting a check. LOL they'll do both and you'll have to pay for both...... why do you hate America? |
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Posted: 11/12/2015 11:35:22 PM EDT
[#34]
Let them have it, jokes on them, they're the ones who will actually have to pay for it in the end.
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Posted: 11/12/2015 11:35:40 PM EDT
[#35]
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I would rather my taxes pay for russian literature than some bum to sit around playing video games all day and collecting a check. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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College, Military or Trade schools. The gov is already pretty much subsidizing higher education. Make community colleges free and help educate our population. It's one of the few things I don't mind my tax dollars going to. Better than social security or Medicaid. It's an investment in our future. I would not disagree. I do disagree. Given the ridiculous failure and dropout rate for college students in the first couple of years, making them an extension of high school (which already has horrendous dropout rates in some places) is just useless expense. The people this is drained to "help" simply won't benefit from more time in a classroom, so the lofty goal of "makin our society more educated" is bunk. Motivated students aren't the problem. They work their way through school and generally do fine with things the way they are. The problem is the FSA turds who don't belong there in the first place. My tax dollars shouldn't fund adult day care for millenials to "study" Russian Literature or Sociology. Even in the best case, those people will continue to be a drain on productive folks- the sooner you cut them off the better. You want government funded trade schools for non academics? That I might be able to get behind. There is a genuine need for skilled workers... Much more so than for say, English majors. I would rather my taxes pay for russian literature than some bum to sit around playing video games all day and collecting a check. I would rather anyone on welfare perform community service. The odds of someone with a literature degree getting a job is slim and they end up on welfare anyways. If everyone had a degree they become worthless in the job market. |
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Posted: 11/12/2015 11:36:08 PM EDT
[#36]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
American borrowers have racked up about $1.2 trillion in outstanding federal student debt, according to the Consumer Financial Protection Bureau.? There is more Student Loan Debt then all credit card debt combined. The Gov IS lending the money. And for the ones they aren't lending, they are guaranteed..... So it shows up as a liability on their balance sheet anyway. The default rate is going through the roof and will only get worse. It is debtors prison without the bars. Can't be discharged in bankruptcy. How much do you think the payment amount is for a $80-100K student loan at 6-8% interest over 10 years? Any more than that and the interest soars and you end up paying more in interest than the principle. Did the .gov stick a gun to their head and force them to take those loans? Did the .gov force them to attend college, especially for stoopid degrees they can't get jobs for? Was it their own choice to sign on the dotted line? Then what are you complaining about? |
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Posted: 11/12/2015 11:38:08 PM EDT
[#37]
Quote HistoryQuoted: They assumed that debt volitionally. Their decision, their debt. Why should I make up the difference? |
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Posted: 11/12/2015 11:38:28 PM EDT
[#38]
I worked my way thru college...busted my ass to pay for it along with student loans which I paid off.
Its not supposed to be easy! These freaking liberal kids want everything for free. It would be a waste with most of them. I knew guys in college whose parents were footing the bill...they rarely went to class because it wasn't coming out of their pocket. This would be the biggest waste of money since obamacare and the stadium the dems are building in my hometown..
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Posted: 11/12/2015 11:39:56 PM EDT
[#39]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Communism/socialism colors and icons. Nice. Quote History |
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Posted: 11/12/2015 11:41:00 PM EDT
[#40]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Well, the world needs ditch-diggers, too. 
TC Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
These ass hats can piss up a rope. If you can't afford college, don't go. If you go, get a degree that is usable in this economy. Personally, I've advised both my kids to not go to college. My oldest prefers working two jobs and is making bank! Youngest is graduating HS early next year and has no desire to go to school. I'm not pushing it either. If either decides later to go, their decision, their dime. Well, the world needs ditch-diggers, too.
TC This...^. Wait till his "youngest" decides to live at home for ever. 
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Posted: 11/12/2015 11:41:04 PM EDT
[#41]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Because your a white man. Or a minority race traitor puppet of white men. Or something like that. Something to do with feels. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
They assumed that debt volitionally. Their decision, their debt. Why should I make up the difference? very well stated........even if you are white. |
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Posted: 11/12/2015 11:43:31 PM EDT
[#42]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
JFC, there are actually people on this board in favor of this.
Half the people that are paying for college with student loans don't show up to class, I can't imagine the worthless shit that would go on if it was a free ride for all. Absolutely! Anyone here in favor of this has shit for brains or has never had to work hard for anything. |
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Posted: 11/13/2015 12:03:41 AM EDT
[#43]
Statistics show a historical correlation between government investment in student loans and rise in tuition rates. Though correlation doesn't equal causation (learned that in college), it isn't a stretch to assume they are causally linked. I'm all for trying to lessen student loan debt and make higher education more affordable, but I knew what I signed up for, and worked my way through school working a full-time job. IMO, the government needs to get out of the student loan business altogether, and if a free community college system can be made to work i.e. the Tennessee Promise, then I'm for that too. What I'm not for is assholes who signed a contract reneging on their commitments, and then being outraged that they are expected to pay the piper. Fuck these freeloading F.S.A fucktards. im guessing, they're mostly Liberal Arts majors and not required to study economics or business.
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Posted: 11/13/2015 12:31:10 AM EDT
[#44]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
American borrowers have racked up about $1.2 trillion in outstanding federal student debt, according to the Consumer Financial Protection Bureau.? There is more Student Loan Debt then all credit card debt combined. The Gov IS lending the money. And for the ones they aren't lending, they are guaranteed..... So it shows up as a liability on their balance sheet anyway. The default rate is going through the roof and will only get worse. It is debtors prison without the bars. Can't be discharged in bankruptcy. How much do you think the payment amount is for a $80-100K student loan at 6-8% interest over 10 years? Any more than that and the interest soars and you end up paying more in interest than the principle. Don't care, don't borrow money if you don't like the terms. |
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Posted: 11/13/2015 12:45:17 AM EDT
[#45]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Life. Liberty. The Pursuit of Happiness. I have the right to pursue an education. I have no right to force my fellow man provide an education to me... or anyone else. I have no right to force my fellow man to 'invest' his wealth in anything, e.g. a future 'more' educated populace. There are those people who confuse personal willingness with the application of force through government. If I am willing to spend some of my liberty in the pursuit of knowledge, and I agree to trade a portion of my life/liberty/property to someone else to accomplish the goal of being recognized as an 'educated man', then I can become educated. I am free and respected the freedom of my fellow man. If I am willing to spend someone else's life/liberty/property on yet someone else's 'education', how shall I accomplish this goal? I should persuade someone to part with their money, should I not? Of course I should. What course of action should I take if I fail to persuade that someone to part with their money? The personal responsibility conscious person realizes that each one of us is responsible for our own education, and that failure to achieve that 'happiness' rests with each individual. He respects the life, liberty, and pursuit of happiness of his fellow man. The governmental minded person realizes that there are 3 persons concerned: the person willing to spend someone else's money, the person who's money is at risk, and the potential recipient of that money via an education. - That person who is willing to spend someone else's money will always vote in favor of that, justifying it in their mind because they are willing to spend their own money. - That person who is the potential recipient of the education will normally always vote in favor of receiving it, as the human nature tends towards greedy: who wouldn't want 'something for nothing'? - That individual whose money is hanging in the balance will of course vote to keep their money... And in a 67% landslide, taxation to support 'free' education and 'forgiveness' of current education loans passes... ensuring that anyone who wishes to keep their own money may not legally do so. If my neighbor came to ask me for $$ to send their kid to college, I'd simply tell them no. Unfortunately, my neighbors use the IRS to 'ask' so that I may not legally say no. Don't hide behind the IRS as they do the sort of work you would not deign to soil your hands with. If these socialistic fucks truly wished for a utopian society based on their ideals, they would put in the work to compensate for the work I refuse to do or money I refuse to contribute. Instead, they must use force to extract every $$ from those who are producing. Sounds like pretty Communistic thinking process to me. Fuck them. It is Communism, plain and simple. This generation is far enough removed from the history of Communism to believe the hype. History is simply repeating itself. Communism is still the enemy. |
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Posted: 11/13/2015 12:47:15 AM EDT
[#46]
Cry baby turds
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Posted: 11/13/2015 12:54:19 AM EDT
[#47]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Did the .gov stick a gun to their head and force them to take those loans? Did the .gov force them to attend college, especially for stoopid degrees they can't get jobs for? Was it their own choice to sign on the dotted line? Then what are you complaining about? Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
American borrowers have racked up about $1.2 trillion in outstanding federal student debt, according to the Consumer Financial Protection Bureau.? There is more Student Loan Debt then all credit card debt combined. The Gov IS lending the money. And for the ones they aren't lending, they are guaranteed..... So it shows up as a liability on their balance sheet anyway. The default rate is going through the roof and will only get worse. It is debtors prison without the bars. Can't be discharged in bankruptcy. How much do you think the payment amount is for a $80-100K student loan at 6-8% interest over 10 years? Any more than that and the interest soars and you end up paying more in interest than the principle. Did the .gov stick a gun to their head and force them to take those loans? Did the .gov force them to attend college, especially for stoopid degrees they can't get jobs for? Was it their own choice to sign on the dotted line? Then what are you complaining about? I agree 100%. It took me close to 10 years to pay off my student loans. I have ambitions to go further yet with education and if I ever do, it will be on me. It is too bad that we have FSA posting about wanting communism on this site. 
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Posted: 11/13/2015 12:55:13 AM EDT
[#48]
Quoted: (Reuters) - Hundreds of thousands of students are set to walk out of classrooms across the United States on Thursday to protest ballooning student loan debt for higher education and rally for tuition-free public colleges and a minimum wage hike for campus workers. The demonstrations are planned just two days after thousands of fast-food workers took to the streets in a nationwide day of action pushing for a $15-an-hour minimum wage and union rights for the industry. Events for Thursday's protests, dubbed the Million Student March, have been planned at colleges and universities from Los Angeles to New York. Thousands of people signed up to attend on Facebook groups, though it remained to be seen how many would ultimately participate. "Education should be free. The United States is the richest country in the world, yet students have to take on crippling debt in order to get a college education," the movement's organizers said in a statement on their website. Organizers are demanding tuition-free public colleges, a cancellation of all student debt and a $15-an-hour minimum wage for campus workers. http://news.yahoo.com/students-across-u-march-over-debt-free-public-110404606.html http://bloximages.chicago2.vip.townnews.com/iowastatedaily.com/content/tncms/assets/v3/editorial/6/38/63809d96-ea03-11e4-b42b-eb28b893e88e/55396a344ed2f.image.jpg?resize=1200%2C801 http://media.npr.org/assets/img/2015/07/08/ap_237701798094_wide-2a3b7c49a2745fe92f25d5b06e8734df97658725-s900-c85.jpg http://thedailycougar.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/07/Bernie-Rally.jpg |
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Posted: 11/13/2015 7:47:36 AM EDT
[#49]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Yes, we definitely need to emulate Greece. A nation of unemployed Phd's. Three quarters of those morons would probably have a hard time pointing to Greece on a map. |
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Posted: 11/13/2015 7:57:01 AM EDT
[#50]
Quote HistoryThe communist symbolism isn't exactly subtle. Edit: So how does "free" actually occur? You can't just "forgive" the debt. The debt represents people who chose to take out loans and go to college. There are people who, a. never went to college, so debt forgiveness means their tax dollars paying for something didn't even get to use. And b. it screws over everyone who could potentially have gone to college but didn't to avoid the debt & everyone who actually worked and payed it off. Most of America is screwed by that. But again, how do you make it free? Does the government offer unlimited token loans that get forgiven every year and pass laws preventing schools from raising tuition? Do they take over all colleges and make them government funded? Then there is the quality, how do you maintain even current levels of education quality? Everything the gov. touches turns to suck. How is the government that can't make a healthcare website right going to fix college debt?
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