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Posted: 5/12/2024 9:04:17 PM EDT
[#1]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Mall-Ninja: Looks justified to me… ETA: doesn’t prone mean you’re on your stomach? MF is on his back with a gun still in his hand… On your back is supine...prone is on your stomach. That wasnt an anchor shot since he was raising the gun up. Also; this is a case where telling the guy to take his hand out of his pocket might not be the smartest thing to do. Having him keep his hand in his pocket then have him prone out with his hand in the pocket is the better action. |
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Posted: 5/12/2024 9:09:21 PM EDT
[#2]
Suspect still poses a threat to the public (bystanders) and to the uniformed police who gave multiple orders to drop said firearm.
Tennessee v Garner Connor v Graham Texas PC CH 9 solid good to go. |
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Posted: 5/12/2024 9:09:38 PM EDT
[#3]
Originally Posted By doc540: after all, though prone and leaking he did keep it in his hand and raise it  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_r8wijZsy8QWithout additional context, I don’t see that as a justified shoot. the pistol had just been pulled out and was hanging at his side. The victim wasn’t a threat. This is another video of cops shooting someone not them who has a firearm. |
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Posted: 5/12/2024 9:11:47 PM EDT
[#4]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Naffenea: Without additional context, I don’t see that as a justified shoot. the pistol had just been pulled out and was hanging at his side. The victim wasn’t a threat. This is another video of cops shooting someone not them who has a firearm. What? Do you think he has to start shooting at them before they can shoot? Nonsense. Good shoot. |
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Posted: 5/12/2024 9:12:41 PM EDT
[#5]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Naffenea: Without additional context, I don’t see that as a justified shoot. the pistol had just been pulled out and was hanging at his side. The victim wasn’t a threat. This is another video of cops shooting someone not them who has a firearm. Holy shit dude. |
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Posted: 5/12/2024 9:15:04 PM EDT
[#6]
The fuck are people just sitting there watching like it’s a sporting event
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Posted: 5/12/2024 9:15:30 PM EDT
[Last Edit: NCPatrolAR]
[#7]
Another thing........officer on the right (#1 on video) is way too quick to get on the radio. Dudes need to fight the urge to immediately get on the radio.
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Posted: 5/12/2024 9:15:52 PM EDT
[#8]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Rudukai13: The fuck are people just sitting there watching like it’s a sporting event Arent in the hood much are you? |
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Posted: 5/12/2024 9:16:01 PM EDT
[#9]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Rudukai13: The fuck are people just sitting there watching like it’s a sporting event Well, according to some forum members, a grossly non compliant subject who pulls out a firearm isn’t a threat. So maybe they just agree. |
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Posted: 5/12/2024 9:19:29 PM EDT
[#10]
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Posted: 5/12/2024 9:19:32 PM EDT
[#11]
100%.
I would say 101% but that would cast doubt on my math. |
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USA
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Posted: 5/12/2024 9:19:40 PM EDT
[#12]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By AttachedFile: They way he dropped I'm guessing a round hit the spine? Also kind of surprised there were only 2 shots fired before the anchor shot. Normally it's mag dumps in s lot of these videos. Maybe they were shooting .40 S&W. It's the ideal pistol cartridge. |
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Posted: 5/12/2024 9:22:05 PM EDT
[#13]
"Awww fvck!"
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Posted: 5/12/2024 9:22:43 PM EDT
[Last Edit: Surf]
[#14]
Ask the IDF on their rules….
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Posted: 5/12/2024 9:23:59 PM EDT
[#15]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Rudukai13: The fuck are people just sitting there watching like it’s a sporting event To them, it is. |
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Posted: 5/12/2024 9:25:54 PM EDT
[#16]
Damn...how were they able to hit him without a RDS on their pistols?
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Posted: 5/12/2024 9:26:30 PM EDT
[#17]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By WhatsGnu: Reclined just doesn't convey, though. the term is "supine" . |
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Posted: 5/12/2024 9:27:42 PM EDT
[#18]
Somehow the only way his hand could have come out of his pocket was with the gun in his hand?
ZFG.... Good shoot. |
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USA
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Posted: 5/12/2024 9:28:09 PM EDT
[#19]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By WinstonSmith: There's always gotta be the one guy.  Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By WinstonSmith: Originally Posted By mike240: Too many cops giving commands. It only takes one. Because there always ends being conflicting commands. Simple concepts of contact cover, been taught for decades. And fucked up usually. There's always gotta be the one guy. You took the words outta my mouth |
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Posted: 5/12/2024 9:33:56 PM EDT
[#20]
Compton and long beach
Man you know you in trouble |
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Posted: 5/12/2024 9:42:15 PM EDT
[#21]
Good shoot.
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Posted: 5/12/2024 9:48:26 PM EDT
[#22]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Naffenea: Without additional context, I don’t see that as a justified shoot. the pistol had just been pulled out and was hanging at his side. The victim wasn’t a threat. This is another video of cops shooting someone not them who has a firearm. LOL. Really? |
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OK, USA
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Posted: 5/12/2024 10:04:37 PM EDT
[#23]
Looks like a good shoot all around to me. But I do agree that there needs to be one cop telling a suspect what to do, too many times they are giving conflicting orders so anything they do is going to be wrong. If it can't be just one they at least need to be consistent in what they are saying.
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Posted: 5/12/2024 10:06:43 PM EDT
[#24]
fpni
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Posted: 5/12/2024 10:09:01 PM EDT
[#25]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By NCPatrolAR: Damn...how were they able to hit him without a RDS on their pistols? there it is |
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Posted: 5/12/2024 10:12:29 PM EDT
[#26]
100% justified… this isn’t freeze tag, a tie would be a loss.
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Posted: 5/12/2024 10:21:33 PM EDT
[#27]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Mall-Ninja: Looks justified to me… ETA: doesn’t prone mean you’re on your stomach? MF is on his back with a gun still in his hand… Plenty of opportunities given for it to have gone a different way. |
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Posted: 5/12/2024 10:29:23 PM EDT
[#28]
He ignored many opportunities to end the day alive.
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Posted: 5/12/2024 10:32:00 PM EDT
[#29]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Naffenea: Without additional context, I don’t see that as a justified shoot. the pistol had just been pulled out and was hanging at his side. The victim wasn’t a threat. This is another video of cops shooting someone not them who has a firearm. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Naffenea: Originally Posted By doc540: after all, though prone and leaking he did keep it in his hand and raise it https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_r8wijZsy8QWithout additional context, I don’t see that as a justified shoot. the pistol had just been pulled out and was hanging at his side. The victim wasn’t a threat. This is another video of cops shooting someone not them who has a firearm. I respect your opinion, but make no mistake you are wrong. This isn’t a video game and cops aren’t superhuman. How many times did you get to watch the video before you came to a conclusion? They don’t get that chance and innocent life is at risk. The guy had chance after chance to surrender and passed on every opportunity. What is it you think he was doing? I’ll tell you what. He was trying to create space and stall for time to gain some advantage. |
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Posted: 5/12/2024 10:40:42 PM EDT
[#30]
only if the police went home safely or were placed on admin leave with pay, courtesy of the taxpayer.ms.
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AL, USA
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Posted: 5/12/2024 10:41:30 PM EDT
[#31]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Grumple: There was no anchor shot. He still had the gun in his hamd and was moving. Zero fucks given. Agreed. The only anchor shot i saw was his reaction to a center mass that took the wind out of him. That being said, justified. If the guy meant no harm or his own survival, he should have oozed that pistol out with index and thumb on the butt end, then dropped it. |
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Posted: 5/12/2024 10:42:14 PM EDT
[#32]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Mall-Ninja: Looks justified to me ETA: doesn't prone mean you're on your stomach? MF is on his back with a gun still in his hand |
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Posted: 5/12/2024 10:44:52 PM EDT
[#33]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Flysc: Agreed. The only anchor shot i saw was his reaction to a center mass that took the wind out of him. That being said, justified. If the guy meant no harm or his own survival, he should have oozed that pistol out with index and thumb on the butt end, then dropped it. he should have left the gun in his pocket IMO |
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Posted: 5/12/2024 10:44:52 PM EDT
[Last Edit: NCPatrolAR]
[#34]
double tap
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Posted: 5/12/2024 10:46:41 PM EDT
[#35]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By NCPatrolAR: he should have left the gun in his pocket IMO Yep. |
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Posted: 5/12/2024 10:46:56 PM EDT
[#36]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By NCPatrolAR: he should have left the gun in his pocket IMO Probably would have been the only way to keep from getting shot. |
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AZ, USA
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Posted: 5/12/2024 10:51:05 PM EDT
[#37]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Square66: I don’t remember the cops telling him to pull the heater out of his pocket? You’re right they didn’t. But “show your hands” , “take your hands out of your pockets” etc puts you mentally behind since your minds eye sees compliance. Slower to react to recognize the gun in the hand. One guy says get on the ground. The other says show your hands. Seen this confuse things many times. As well as end with the witnesses saying the suspect was doing as told and was shot. Not all this incident but you get the point. You also cannot talk, think of responses to actions verbally and shoot quick or well. Concepts learned and taught in the 80s with shot timers. One gives commands or negotiates. Cover officers do just that. We only trained “police don’t move”. Thats is the only said till compliance is gained or actions that justify force is seen. If compliance is obtained then “orchestrate” the movements you want (turn away, etc) move to cover or just change position. I do not like people disarming while facing me. Funny how all those procedures that work during high risk vehicle stops are assumed to work when there are no vehicles involved. |
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MN, USA
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Posted: 5/12/2024 10:55:03 PM EDT
[#38]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Naffenea: Without additional context, I don’t see that as a justified shoot. the pistol had just been pulled out and was hanging at his side. The victim wasn’t a threat. This is another video of cops shooting someone not them who has a firearm. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Naffenea: Originally Posted By doc540: after all, though prone and leaking he did keep it in his hand and raise it https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_r8wijZsy8QWithout additional context, I don’t see that as a justified shoot. the pistol had just been pulled out and was hanging at his side. The victim wasn’t a threat. This is another video of cops shooting someone not them who has a firearm.  Attached Fileumm... thats going to be a solid "NO" Hoodrat was refusing direct commands and was trying to evade/escape. Nobody "waits" for shit to escalate at that point. All he had to do was place his hands up and let one of the officers retrieve the weapon. There is ZERO reason to believe he was not a threat at that point. What, he rotates his hat to one side makes you some how believe he was off to choir practice or something? |
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Posted: 5/12/2024 10:55:26 PM EDT
[#39]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Never_A_Wick: Probably would have been the only way to keep from getting shot. Yep. This is why I said the better option would be to have him keep his hand in his pocket and then lower himself down with his free hand. This would keep his hand and the gun isolated in the pocket and allowed everyone to slow things down a little bit once he was prone. The second best would be taking his hand out of the pocket but this creates an issue with the officers having to immediately ID if anything is in his hand and what he;s doing with that object and then react appropriately. Most guys dont think of telling the guy to keep his hand in his pocket but it actually works pretty well if you dont have them immediately comply with your commands |
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AZ, USA
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Posted: 5/12/2024 10:55:29 PM EDT
[#40]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By WinstonSmith: There's always gotta be the one guy. Oh I never said it wasn’t justified. But 35 years doing that job, 30 doing training. Testimony on training in court, lawsuits, and thousands of force on force scenarios taught us a few things. |
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Posted: 5/12/2024 11:00:49 PM EDT
[#41]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By NCPatrolAR: Yep. This is why I said the better option would be to have him keep his hand in his pocket and then lower himself down with his free hand. This would keep his hand and the gun isolated in the pocket and allowed everyone to slow things down a little bit once he was prone. The second best would be taking his hand out of the pocket but this creates an issue with the officers having to immediately ID if anything is in his hand and what he;s doing with that object and then react appropriately. Most guys dont think of telling the guy to keep his hand in his pocket but it actually works pretty well if you dont have them immediately comply with your commands Also, not taking a gun to the park would probably work too.
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Posted: 5/12/2024 11:05:05 PM EDT
[#42]
Good shoot, but his arm raising did look like a CNS reaction. Many wouldn’t know that and can’t take the risk with a gun moving up.
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Posted: 5/12/2024 11:06:31 PM EDT
[#43]
Long Beach is a shithole, he’s one of the reasons why. Good shoot.
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AZ, USA
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Posted: 5/12/2024 11:08:13 PM EDT
[#44]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By NCPatrolAR: Another thing........officer on the right (#1 on video) is way too quick to get on the radio. Dudes need to fight the urge to immediately get on the radio. Absolutely. The worst are the ones not even on the scene! Fucking diarrhea of the mouth cops on the radio drove me crazy. |
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USA
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Posted: 5/12/2024 11:14:08 PM EDT
[#45]
Pulling a gun on a cop, and he got shot for doing so...I would be mad at the officer if he didn't shoot him for that. That's basic self defense at that point for anyone.
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Posted: 5/12/2024 11:16:09 PM EDT
[#46]
Lol, who was the idiot just sitting over at the park bench?
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Posted: 5/12/2024 11:48:08 PM EDT
[#47]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By NCPatrolAR: Damn...how were they able to hit him without a RDS on their pistols? Looks like only the one cop shot, and he I believe had a staccato. Thats how. |
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USA
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Posted: 5/12/2024 11:57:21 PM EDT
[#48]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By CTM1: Just surprised how calm the other people are. Pretty sure if LE is pulling pistols I would be vacating the area slowing with my hands up. I doubt it was anyone's first rodeo. |
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Posted: 5/13/2024 12:03:37 AM EDT
[#49]
To me it's absolutely justified. I'm of the belief that you don't get to cause a total shitshow while being noncompliant and then try and lay the blame off. To me this is a totally different situation than a situation like the Airman(men?) that was shot at his home. I do think there were some things that have been done better. One thing is that I think would help is that one person should be giving all commands and communication. When you have multiple things being yelled some of which can't be done together it makes it worse. Sometimes it's bad and I'm sure there are plenty of times it has actually caused an issue.
This guy had already made up his mind in my opinion. He had no plan of complying and being arrested so that's why I have no real problem with the shooting. Originally Posted By NCPatrolAR: Yep. This is why I said the better option would be to have him keep his hand in his pocket and then lower himself down with his free hand. This would keep his hand and the gun isolated in the pocket and allowed everyone to slow things down a little bit once he was prone. The second best would be taking his hand out of the pocket but this creates an issue with the officers having to immediately ID if anything is in his hand and what he;s doing with that object and then react appropriately. Most guys dont think of telling the guy to keep his hand in his pocket but it actually works pretty well if you dont have them immediately comply with your commands No doubt. |
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Posted: 5/13/2024 12:13:38 AM EDT
[#50]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By LRShooter: What? Do you think he has to start shooting at them before they can shoot? Nonsense. Good shoot. He didn’t even make a move to start raising his pistol. Yes, he needs to do something to justify lethal,action. A pistol in his hands isn’t justification yet. |
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