So I've been emailing back and forth with Cliff at WW Guns. I'm sending an upper, lower and rail to them to be cerakoted. I had been waiting for my lower to come in before I sent everything out. Yesterday I got my lower in and boxed up my parts and fired off a quick email to Cliff at WW Guns to let him know I'd be shipping tomorrow morning.
I get an email back (from a very polite nice gentleman) saying Cliff no longer works for WW Guns, but they'd be happy to still take care of me. So my question is should I continue on with WW Guns or find another Cerakoter? I was under the impression Cliff was the one doing all the cerakoting for WW Guns/JFE.
Has anyone else heard of this or know more of what may be happening? Is WW Guns still cerakoting Costa's guns? Ugh now I'm worried about sending my stuff there and getting a crappy job done. Maybe it'll be even better now, who knows....
Any insight is appreciated!!!!!!!

bump and tag.

I have been talking to Cliff since Dec 2011 about dipping one of my bolt guns.

Maybe he started his own venture. Would like to know

I just got my AR back this afternoon from WW Guns. After a quick inspection of the firearm, I am not pleased.

go on

Why aren't you pleased?

I guess I expected a lot because many people praised their work. I'll see if I can get some pics taken.

When I inspected my rifle, I noticed the paint wasn't consistent. There are a lot of spots where the paint has a rough finish on it. There's small tool marks from the rail installation. Bolt catch lever roll pin not fully seated. Also, I don't quite know who to blame for this but small chipped corners around the bolt catch and magazine release. That could be from shipping, but I looked at the foam padding in my case and did not see any evidence of the damage.

Maybe I'm nitpicking, because I didn't do all the work, but I'm not enthused about the services. I'm content because it looks pretty from afar and I don't plan on pampering it.

I would appreciate you taking the time to upload the photos

Sorry about your results. Even if you don't plan on pampering it, spending that much deserves a near-perfect job

There's more areas but I wasn't able to get a good picture of it. Enjoy.

so that wasn't their "dipping" but a cerakote job?

Yes, it is Cerakote.

A very sloppy job at that.

Wow I would not be satisfied with that at all. Did you tell them your not pleased?
ETA-what color is that even supposed to be?

Yes, I contacted them and received a reply. They said the issues will be addressed to the workers and was asked if I was interested in getting it redone, which I declined. I am more concerned on how my rifle passed their quality control inspector(s) in the condition it is.

Oh, and the color is Patriot Brown.

Edit: Pic added.

I'm sorry man that sucks! I actually have parts with them right now. Very nice people. Can you post a pic or two of the complete rifle?

Why would you decline their offer?

That is a pretty horrible job.

I didn't want to go through the hassle of sending it out again when it should've been done right the first time. Plus it would be a good conversation piece. IDK. Another thing to think about is that it is only aesthetic.

I am interested to hear if anyone else has anything to say about WW Guns Inc.? All I've been hearing is quality stuff and it shocked me to see subpar work.

Did they give you a refund?

I would have them send me a shipping label and return it to them so they can fix it. Why live with it? I bust my ass for my money, and I don't feel bad at all demending that things be perfect.

I am still in contact and waiting on a response from WW Guns.

I had an AR dipped in multicam 3-4 months ago.  And I was thoroughly NOT impressed with their work.  There are multiple places on the receiver where the finish is rough and spots are shinier/stick out for some reason.  There is actually a partial finger print right below the mag release on the right side of the gun.  Also, I have a troy alpha rail on the rifle, and the finish did not do well AT ALL on it.  There is spots all over the rail inbetween the grooves where no finish got to.  It doesn't look terrible since the undercoat is close to the multicam white, but if you know what you are looking at, its not impressive.  I got the distinct impression upon looking at it's the type of thing where the high visibility (aka Costa) guns get special attention to ensure they look extra good, while normal rifles don't get the same treatment.  Now, I don't have any proof to back up that last statement with, it was just the feeling I got upon inspecting my rifle and seeing what they had done via pictures on the internet.

ETA:  I didn't contact WW Guns or raise a stink over it, because when I received it, the only thing I really noticed was the spots on the Alpha Rail.  I only really started noticing the other stuff when I did some close inspections later on (I was busy at work an it sat in the safe for 1-2 months before I really got to pull it out and play with it).

I used to see paint jobs and camo dips from these guys all the time on Facebook, and come to think of it, I haven't in quite some time.

BTooneUSMMA,

Would you mind posting a picture or two when you can?

I have a Noveske Gen 2 lower, Vltor MUR1A upper and Gieselle SMR there now for Cerakote. So far they've been excellent to deal with and I have high hopes for the project.

No problem brother!



Overall, definitely looks good from a distance.  I haven't had anybody look at it yet, and not say it looked great.




The spots inbetween the rails where the dip didn't get to.  Again, I wasn't terribly upset about it, as looking at the rail, it does look like a place that would be very difficult to get covered properly.  And it does look okay, if you don't what Multicam is supposed to look like.



You can see some spots on the upper here, right above the rollmark (on the upper), and a spot between the two white spots below the optic where the finish isn't quite right, and leaves visible mars in the finish.



Here, you can see that it looks like someone applied green paint to cover up a messed up portion of the finish, and managed to leave a partial fingerprint directly below it in the white.  I know the partial fingerprint is hard to see, but its definitely there.  This is the only portion of the finish that seriously pissed me off.  It looks to me like someone saw the fuck-up in the finish, and just covered it up with paint.  And then while doing so, managed to leave his fingerprint on my rifle.  Also, there is a horizontal scratch in the brown just below the dust cover.  This is due to the dust cover hitting there when the weapon is charged, it didn't come to me from WW Guns that way.



On the upper, just forward of the optic the finish isn't quite perfect.  I don't think this is a big deal, and is due mainly to the way hydro-dip is applied.  However, if you look forward of the battle-flag on the dust-cover, there is a visible mar where the finish was scratched/didn't get applied.

I know they aren't the best pictures, so I can try to take a couple more if that helps.  Also, I'd like to specify that I'm not trying to trash talk WW Guns here.  I got my parts back, did a quick inspection, and tossed them in the safe.  I then spent 2 months at RIMPAC on Hawaii, came home and spent a week with the wife.  So It took me almost 2.5 months to really do a thorough inspection on the parts.  Since it took me so long, I just took my medicine, and didn't complain, as I should have done a better inspection sooner.  Would I buy from them again?  I don't know.  I didn't give them a chance to fix the problem, so I don't know how they would have handled it.  I did however, get that distinct impression that my gun was one of the ones that needed to get done quick, and get it out the door.  Not the special celebrity gun that was gonna get photographed so it gets more attention.

that green paint is pretty ridiculous and the coating already wearing off from the dust cover?!

The only thing I want dipped is my bolt gun, so much of the problems with complexity of angles/holes aren't a big deal but still

You should dust the fingerprint and run it through AFIS.

At least their new guys are getting plenty of practice before I send mine.

What sort of Turn around time should I expect from WW Guns? I'm thinking of sending my OBR's to be Cerakoted.

WW Guns received my AR on 6 Sep and it was shipped out 17 Sep. Everyone says about 2 weeks average. Good luck.

This is from Joint Force Enterprises' Facebook page:

I never really understood what type of business relationship they had anyway. It always seemed like WW was a separate entity.
I have never done business with them, did you have to go through Joint Force to get work from WW?

This is from to much air pressure and not enough volume on the material it appears. The cerakote is drying in the air and causing it to act like overspray. I use the Iwata LPH-80 when applying cerakote, it gives a lot more control and is more of a detail gun. If you want send it to me and Ill fix it for you. Jared

So I just talked to Cliff on FB a little, maybe have a little insight that I have put together (not from his mouth).
The problems described here seemed to be timed so that they were performed by WW Guns employees and not Cliff or under Cliff's oversight. Cliff/JFE left the partnership with WWGuns over two months ago. My understanding is WW had the FFL which JFE obviously needed to receive the firearms to do the work on. JFE is starting back up in Jax, FL and currently going through the process to get its own FFL.
In short: The awesome work that had become associated with WWGuns was the work of JFE. The problems here came after the Great Schism

Thanks for the update.

Any updates jtdam24?

They've been outstanding thus far. Communication is top notch. They sprayed 3 different colors of cerakote for me and sent me samples of each. It's important to them that I get the exact color I'm looking for. Throughout all of our emails there's a sense of quality. It's hard to explain. They could of easily coated my parts, taken payment and been done with me but that's not at all how things have worked out. They were the ones who suggested sending me samples of different shades and ratios of FDE. So far I'm very pleased with them.
On a side note the details about Cliff leaving that I was told via WW Guns, paint a different picture as to what was said in this thread. Ill update again once I receive my parts back as well as a full write up in detail with all aspects of my expierience with WW Guns.

Cool man. I definitely want to see the end result to see if they fixed their practices and quality control.

About the JFE and WW Guns issue, I don't want to get into it because it isn't my business. In their email they did mention something about "things are rough in the shop" and I don't know if they were using it as an excuse for the lesser quality work that was performed on my gun.

whatever the case was, I gather that it didn't end well. It would be nice to figure things out

thanks for the updates

I just got back a Noveske rail that WW Guns cerakoted for me in Magpul OD Green and it looks great!  I had a hard time trying to slide BUIS on the front of the rail, but that was to be expected with the cerakote.  I'll post some pictures at some point here.

Please do

I got my stuff back from WWGuns on Sept. 28th.  It came out great. And they finished it in 7 days.
It sucks to hear other have had problems with them.  

Damn that's sexy.    
love the color choice