User Panel
Posted: 2/7/2024 10:33:08 PM EDT
[Last Edit: CreativeBall]
I was going to have a Drs appointment today for the first time in forever and I was greeted with this on their door:
Attached File Can they legitimately enforce their commie rules? I called them and canceled my appointment, since the issue wasn't urgent any more, but I would like to get an x-ray or other imaging to make sure I don't have something seriously wrong. I just hate financially supporting organizations that hate freedom. Can anyone suggest any doctor's office in the Louisville area that doesn't have this kind of nonsense posted? Edit: I just noticed that KRS 237.100 doesn't even apply to that carrying. Section 237.100 - Notification of purchase of firearm or attempt to purchase firearm - Immunity |
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Looks like they intended to cite KRS 237.110 section (17)
(17) The owner, business or commercial lessee, or manager of a private business enterprise, day-care center as defined in KRS 199.894 or certified or licensed family child-care home as defined in KRS 199.8982, or a health-care facility licensed under KRS Chapter 216B, except facilities renting or leasing housing, may prohibit persons holding concealed deadly weapon licenses from carrying concealed deadly weapons on the premises and may prohibit employees, not authorized by the employer, holding concealed deadly weapons licenses from carrying concealed deadly weapons on the property of the employer. If the building or the premises are open to the public, the employer or business enterprise shall post signs on or about the premises if carrying concealed weapons is prohibited. Possession of weapons, or ammunition, or both in a vehicle on the premises shall not be a criminal offense so long as the weapons, or ammunition, or both are not removed from the vehicle or brandished while the vehicle is on the premises. A private but not a public employer may prohibit employees or other persons holding a concealed deadly weapons license from carrying concealed deadly weapons, or ammunition, or both in vehicles owned by the employer, but may not prohibit employees or other persons holding a concealed deadly weapons license from carrying concealed deadly weapons, or ammunition, or both in vehicles owned by the employee, except that the Justice and Public Safety Cabinet may prohibit an employee from carrying any weapons, or ammunition, or both other than the weapons, or ammunition, or both issued or authorized to be used by the employee of the cabinet, in a vehicle while transporting persons under the employee's supervision or jurisdiction. Carrying of a concealed weapon, or ammunition, or both in a location specified in this subsection by a license holder shall not be a criminal act but may subject the person to denial from the premises or removal from the premises, and, if an employee of an employer, disciplinary measures by the employer. View Quote Of course, they are required to post signs, which they did. But the signs aren't correct so I guess you could argue that they aren't valid ETA - 237.110 allows them to ban concealed deadly weapons only. Not sure what laws would apply to open carry |
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Right. That's what I was figuring. Still, I hate to give my business to anti American commies.
Does anyone know of any decent doctors in the area that aren't commie idiots? |
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Originally Posted By scottr: Looks like they intended to cite KRS 237.110 section (17) It's not a criminal act to carry there, but they can ask you to leave. If you don't they can trespass you Of course, they are required to post signs, which they did. But the signs aren't correct so I guess you could argue that they aren't valid ETA - 237.110 allows them to ban concealed deadly weapons only. Not sure what laws would apply to open carry View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Originally Posted By scottr: Looks like they intended to cite KRS 237.110 section (17) (17) The owner, business or commercial lessee, or manager of a private business enterprise, day-care center as defined in KRS 199.894 or certified or licensed family child-care home as defined in KRS 199.8982, or a health-care facility licensed under KRS Chapter 216B, except facilities renting or leasing housing, may prohibit persons holding concealed deadly weapon licenses from carrying concealed deadly weapons on the premises and may prohibit employees, not authorized by the employer, holding concealed deadly weapons licenses from carrying concealed deadly weapons on the property of the employer. If the building or the premises are open to the public, the employer or business enterprise shall post signs on or about the premises if carrying concealed weapons is prohibited. Possession of weapons, or ammunition, or both in a vehicle on the premises shall not be a criminal offense so long as the weapons, or ammunition, or both are not removed from the vehicle or brandished while the vehicle is on the premises. A private but not a public employer may prohibit employees or other persons holding a concealed deadly weapons license from carrying concealed deadly weapons, or ammunition, or both in vehicles owned by the employer, but may not prohibit employees or other persons holding a concealed deadly weapons license from carrying concealed deadly weapons, or ammunition, or both in vehicles owned by the employee, except that the Justice and Public Safety Cabinet may prohibit an employee from carrying any weapons, or ammunition, or both other than the weapons, or ammunition, or both issued or authorized to be used by the employee of the cabinet, in a vehicle while transporting persons under the employee's supervision or jurisdiction. Carrying of a concealed weapon, or ammunition, or both in a location specified in this subsection by a license holder shall not be a criminal act but may subject the person to denial from the premises or removal from the premises, and, if an employee of an employer, disciplinary measures by the employer. Of course, they are required to post signs, which they did. But the signs aren't correct so I guess you could argue that they aren't valid ETA - 237.110 allows them to ban concealed deadly weapons only. Not sure what laws would apply to open carry Lol in the rush to ban guns they missed the correct law I think this came up some weeks ago and I took it at the time as illegal Looks like I read wrong Carrying of a concealed weapon, or ammunition, or both in a location specified in this subsection by a license holder shall not be a criminal act but may subject the person to denial from the premises or removal from the premises |
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PROUD AMMOSEXUAL
Adam Calhoun: "You can’t hurt my feelings, I was born in the 80's" |
Originally Posted By CreativeBall: Right. That's what I was figuring. Still, I hate to give my business to anti American commies. Does anyone know of any decent doctors in the area that aren't commie idiots? View Quote Sorry if this sounds crass... I would recommend just living your life and not worrying about what others think. Carry if you want. They can tell you to leave but they'd have to know or care that you're carrying in the first place Although I highly recommend leaving your piece at home if you go in for an MRI |
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Looking through the KRS I can't find where "concealed deadly weapon" is defined
If it's in a briefcase that you carry is it still a concealed deadly weapon or does it have to be on your person? |
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Originally Posted By scottr: Looking through the KRS I can't find where "concealed deadly weapon" is defined If it's in a briefcase that you carry is it still a concealed deadly weapon or does it have to be on your person? View Quote Those are good questions. And while I normally would rather just live my life, I feel that it's best to spend your time and money with organizations that share your values. With this, it looks like the Norton group has completely struck out on every possible subject. |
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Isn't Norton Health Care part of the University of Kentucky Healthcare system? If so, I can guarantee they want guns banned.
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Sounds like it is time for a good excuse to get a man bag for such excursions...
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Originally Posted By scottr: Looking through the KRS I can't find where "concealed deadly weapon" is defined If it's in a briefcase that you carry is it still a concealed deadly weapon or does it have to be on your person? View Quote If it is in your possession, it belongs to you. The same is true if it is within your reach. |
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Originally Posted By CreativeBall: I was going to have a Drs appointment today for the first time in forever and I was greeted with this on their door: https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/553184/IMG_20240207_151242425_jpg-3121709.JPG Can they legitimately enforce their commie rules? I called them and canceled my appointment, since the issue wasn't urgent any more, but I would like to get an x-ray or other imaging to make sure I don't have something seriously wrong. I just hate financially supporting organizations that hate freedom. Can anyone suggest any doctor's office in the Louisville area that doesn't have this kind of nonsense posted? Edit: I just noticed that KRS 237.100 doesn't even apply to that carrying. Section 237.100 - Notification of purchase of firearm or attempt to purchase firearm - Immunity View Quote KRS 237.110 (17) says (in part) the underlining is mine. (17) The owner, business or commercial lessee, or manager of a private business enterprise, day-care center as defined in KRS 199.894 or certified or licensed family child-care home as defined in KRS 199.8982, or a health-care facility licensed under KRS Chapter 216B, except facilities renting or leasing housing, may prohibit persons holding concealed deadly weapon licenses from carrying concealed deadly weapons on the premises and may prohibit employees, not authorized by the employer, holding concealed deadly weapons licenses from carrying concealed deadly weapons on the property of the employer.... This has been the law since 1996 and this language was in the original bill, HB 30. Notice that the prohibition here is for "premises", not just the building, so this would include the grounds and parking lots. There is more in this section, so I suggest that you read all of it. |
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double tap |
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Originally Posted By scottr: Looks like they intended to cite KRS 237.110 section (17) It's not a criminal act to carry there, but they can ask you to leave. If you don't they can trespass you Of course, they are required to post signs, which they did. But the signs aren't correct so I guess you could argue that they aren't valid ETA - 237.110 allows them to ban concealed deadly weapons only. Not sure what laws would apply to open carry View Quote Only two statutes apply to openly carried weapons, schools and bars. However, private property owners can limit anything, anyway that they want. Your doctor's office is private property, I assume. |
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You're posting bad/incomplete information
527.20 (8) A loaded or unloaded firearm or other deadly weapon shall not be deemed concealed on or about the person if it is located in any enclosed container, compartment, or storage space installed as original equipment in a motor vehicle by its manufacturer, including but not limited to a glove compartment, center console, or seat pocket, regardless of whether said enclosed container, storage space, or compartment is locked, unlocked, or does not have a locking mechanism. No person or organization, public or private, shall prohibit a person from keeping a loaded or unloaded firearm or ammunition, or both, or other deadly weapon in a vehicle in accordance with the provisions of this subsection. Any attempt by a person or organization, public or private, to violate the provisions of this subsection may be the subject of an action for appropriate relief or for damages in a Circuit Court or District Court of competent jurisdiction. |
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Originally Posted By CreativeBall: Those are good questions. And while I normally would rather just live my life, I feel that it's best to spend your time and money with organizations that share your values. With this, it looks like the Norton group has completely struck out on every possible subject. View Quote I would imagine you'd be hard pressed to find many medical practices in the state that are permissive for carry. |
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Hard drugs, guns, and nuclear stuff does not mix to well together. - R_Fury
Masturbation is a valid option - Naamah La liberté consiste à ne dépendre que des lois. - Voltaire R.I.P. tnsparky |
Put simply
By obtaining a license they agree to provide services to everyone and not discriminate. They can't discriminate against someone exercising a constitutional right any more than they can against someone of a different religion, creed, or color |
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Originally Posted By scottr: Put simply By obtaining a license they agree to provide services to everyone and not discriminate. They can't discriminate against someone exercising a constitutional right any more than they can against someone of a different religion, creed, or color View Quote If you're making that argument pursuant to 527.20 above, that argument is great until you leave the parked vehicle. That's why no employer or service provider, short of a federally controlled facility, can prohibit a weapon locked in your car. But, that same establishment can have you trespassed for carrying against their wishes just as much as they can have you trespassed for protesting loudly in their store. It's also how a Jewish baker can refuse to make a Nazi cake, or Christian bakers refusing to celebrate a transition or gay wedding. SCotUS has repeatedly ruled in favor of private businesses. |
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Hard drugs, guns, and nuclear stuff does not mix to well together. - R_Fury
Masturbation is a valid option - Naamah La liberté consiste à ne dépendre que des lois. - Voltaire R.I.P. tnsparky |
Not a great analogy
The baker can refuse to decorate a cake with something they find offensive, but they can't refuse to sell a cake out of the case because of the customer's religion or beliefs I posted the law about having a firearm in a vehicle because softpoint posted incomplete information about possession anywhere on the premise |
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Then we agree that a company providing a service can deny some, or all, services based upon things that may be constitutionally protected.
They're not saying you can never be armed. They're just saying not in their building. And if they catch you, they will ask you to leave. |
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Hard drugs, guns, and nuclear stuff does not mix to well together. - R_Fury
Masturbation is a valid option - Naamah La liberté consiste à ne dépendre que des lois. - Voltaire R.I.P. tnsparky |
Originally Posted By 7255: Then we agree that a company providing a service can deny some, or all, services based upon things that may be constitutionally protected. They're not saying you can never be armed. They're just saying not in their building. And if they catch you, they will ask you to leave. View Quote The first part is an over generalization and not what I said They're citing a law (or at least attempting to cite a law) that only allows them to limit carrying a concealed deadly weapon. What KRS allows them to ban ALL weapons? |
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I don't know, I'm not an expert in KRS.
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Hard drugs, guns, and nuclear stuff does not mix to well together. - R_Fury
Masturbation is a valid option - Naamah La liberté consiste à ne dépendre que des lois. - Voltaire R.I.P. tnsparky |
Originally Posted By 7255: If you're making that argument pursuant to 527.20 above, that argument is great until you leave the parked vehicle. That's why no employer or service provider, short of a federally controlled facility, can prohibit a weapon locked in your car. But, that same establishment can have you trespassed for carrying against their wishes just as much as they can have you trespassed for protesting loudly in their store. It's also how a Jewish baker can refuse to make a Nazi cake, or Christian bakers refusing to celebrate a transition or gay wedding. SCotUS has repeatedly ruled in favor of private businesses. View Quote There is no provision in KRS 527.020 or in KRS 237.106 that the vehicle must be locked. |
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