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Posted: 5/31/2017 2:59:25 PM EDT
[#1]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Unless the problem is that they are breaking into pieces, MIM vs Cast is irrelevant. It is a design or machining issue. The only actual problem with MIM is that they are prone to shearing because of defects in their internal structure, and unlike traditional castings or forging it is nearly impossible to estimate a lifetime for the parts. It also needs to be considered that not all MIM is equivalent, there are many different alloys that can be used and like cast or forged parts the heat treat is very important. If done correctly, with the appropriate alloy and heat treat, there really isn't anything inherently bad about the MIM process other than defects being hard to detect |
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Posted: 5/31/2017 3:02:13 PM EDT
[#2]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
update with my earlier suggestion and a stiff detent spring the selector is fixed NICELY! definate clicks into s f b..(e echo) 90% as good as the milspec which is good im 100% on this now till the hammer shears off... lol I had fostech call me back today and mine is going back to them for repair. Its sounds like what my third one is doing is not uncommon. |
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Posted: 6/4/2017 11:39:33 AM EDT
[#3]
Am I the only one having an issue with lite primer strikes? I've tried 3 different types of ammo and the problem has not been resolved. 1st range session I was using the fostech carrier the h2 buffer that was previously in the gun and some reman from a local guy. Gun functioned flawlessly in semi but would fail to ignite like every third or fourth round in echo mode. 2nd range trip I put a carbine buffer in the gun along with a modified cryptic coatings mystic black m16 bcg. This time shooting fed American eagle. No malfunctions in semi but I would still get lite primer strikes in echo mode. Took the trigger apart. Inspected parts and reinstalled. Hit the range with different mags and wolf gold and I'm still getting lite primer strikes. I have not contacted fostech yet however I am very frustrated.
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Posted: 6/4/2017 1:25:34 PM EDT
[#4]
Gpoche92
Did your trigger fly appart while u put it in? Did u get it back together correctly? |
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Posted: 6/4/2017 1:32:47 PM EDT
[#5]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Here are some pics of frt and back hyperfire springs. http://i1002.photobucket.com/albums/af144/matthewjbooth/echo%20trigger/hyperfire%20front.jpg http://i1002.photobucket.com/albums/af144/matthewjbooth/echo%20trigger/hyperfire%20back.jpg The hyperfire spring cups should be in this orientation. If they are the opposite way the springs will bind up a little against the disconnector. |
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Posted: 6/4/2017 1:38:29 PM EDT
[#6]
On the original install no it did not. On the second install I completely disassembled the trigger pack inspected all of the components then carefully reassembled the fcg and reinstalled it into my lower. Going to tear it down again tomorrow afternoon.
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Posted: 6/4/2017 1:46:13 PM EDT
[#7]
Not saying this to be an ass but...
Are u sure the hammer was falling in echo when it did not fire? If the trigger is not pulled all the way back you won't get your second shot. *editted* |
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Posted: 6/4/2017 1:58:29 PM EDT
[#8]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Not saying this to be an ass but... Are u sure the hammer was falling in echo when it did not fire? If the hammer is not pulled all the way back you won't get your second shot until the hammer is pulled all the way back. |
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Posted: 6/4/2017 2:05:38 PM EDT
[#9]
Okies then check the cups on the hyperfire springs are not on backwards and binding. I put mine togther incorrectly once and it would bind on the disconnector during use but still ran. If on correctly then it sounds like a warranty issue. I ran the trigger as it came from fostech for 500 rounds without issue and then installed the hyperfire extra power green springs and a 7.62x39 firing pin because i shoot mostly wolf 223. Sucks u are having issues.
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Posted: 6/4/2017 4:23:17 PM EDT
[#10]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
valid comment but I am sure it is lite primer strikes as per firing pin marks on the primers. I understand that the trigger needs to be pulled all the way back in order to engage the second disconnecter. In each instance I gave the trigger a second pull and release in a safe direction to ensure it was not operator error, then I put the firearm on safe then eject the round. Checking to make sure it was not a squib and then inspecting the live round. Each time there is obvious firing pin indentations on the primer. i agree with dubtap it does suck that your having issues 
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Posted: 6/4/2017 4:44:07 PM EDT
[#11]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
you can get firing pin indentations by the round just chambering i agree with dubtap it does suck that your having issues |
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Posted: 6/4/2017 5:40:40 PM EDT
[#12]
Yes your correct. It should reset itself and fire if u keep completeing a full pull and release.
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Posted: 6/4/2017 8:02:53 PM EDT
[#13]
Ok i just pulled the take down pin and snapped a pic. This is the orientation that I am running the springs in.
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Posted: 6/4/2017 8:27:20 PM EDT
[#14]
That is how it's supposed to look. Any chance u are having serious bolt carrier bounce? Would have to be pretty extreme though...
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Posted: 6/4/2017 8:33:39 PM EDT
[#15]
I highly doubt it. The barrel is a 16 inch mid length gov profile from ballistic advantage. From my experience ballistic advantage barrels are pretty spot on as far as gas port goes. The gun was also ran with a h2 buffer at first. I bought the echo because it was supposed to work with out turning. Am I missing something obvious? I'm really scratching my head here.
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Posted: 6/4/2017 8:50:48 PM EDT
[#16]
H2 not a bolt bounce issue...
I would give fostech a call and see what they say. I am sure they will make it right. I have called them a few times and they are nice to deal with. |
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Posted: 6/4/2017 9:17:06 PM EDT
[#17]
Going to call tomorrow. After looking it over again while watching several YouTube videos I can't visually find the problem. Could it be the firing pin? I used the same firing pin and bolt in both carriers. I've ran it with an sd-e through 700 rounds without an issue.
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Posted: 6/4/2017 9:42:28 PM EDT
[#18]
If it works in semi and with other triggers it should work on echo. I think your the 1st person we have had on here with light strike issues. Please let us know how fostech handles this when u call.
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Posted: 6/5/2017 12:32:38 PM EDT
[#19]
Just got off the phone with Pete from fostech.
Great guy to speak with btw. He ask me to make sure my gas block was properly lined up over the gas port and it didn't walk off. Then he asked if I had an h3 buffer that I could try it with. I told him that I didn't have one and I don't know of anyone local to barrow one so he sent me an email with return instructions. " If you send it UPS Ground (Adult Signature Required), and we find the problem you are describing to be a defect with the trigger, we will be happy to cover your shipping costs. If we find something going on with the gun, we will give you a call and see how you want to proceed. We should have no trouble getting it working flawlessly, and send it back to you. Please print out and include the attached Repair Form. Thanks! Looking forward to getting your trigger back to you, fully functional! Pete". I will verify proper gas block alignment when I get home this evening. If everything is correct on my end I will ship it out tomorrow morning. (Edit). I would like to include that the barrel was not dimpled from the factory. I dimpled the barrel myself using a brd engineering jig. I am using a bcm lopro gas block that was torqued to spec using loctite. |
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Posted: 6/9/2017 1:45:20 PM EDT
[#20]
Okay, I got my trigger this morning and dropped it in, but even pushing the trigger lock forward and holding the trigger I cannot get my upper to close.
Is there more to it that I am missing? |
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Posted: 6/9/2017 1:55:08 PM EDT
[#21]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I highly doubt it. The barrel is a 16 inch mid length gov profile from ballistic advantage. From my experience ballistic advantage barrels are pretty spot on as far as gas port goes. The gun was also ran with a h2 buffer at first. I bought the echo because it was supposed to work with out turning. Am I missing something obvious? I'm really scratching my head here. |
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Posted: 6/9/2017 1:56:13 PM EDT
[#22]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Okay, I got my trigger this morning and dropped it in, but even pushing the trigger lock forward and holding the trigger I cannot get my upper to close. Is there more to it that I am missing? |
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Posted: 6/9/2017 1:56:34 PM EDT
[#23]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Just got off the phone with Pete from fostech. Great guy to speak with btw. He ask me to make sure my gas block was properly lined up over the gas port and it didn't walk off. Then he asked if I had an h3 buffer that I could try it with. I told him that I didn't have one and I don't know of anyone local to barrow one so he sent me an email with return instructions. " If you send it UPS Ground (Adult Signature Required), and we find the problem you are describing to be a defect with the trigger, we will be happy to cover your shipping costs. If we find something going on with the gun, we will give you a call and see how you want to proceed. We should have no trouble getting it working flawlessly, and send it back to you. Please print out and include the attached Repair Form. Thanks! Looking forward to getting your trigger back to you, fully functional! Pete". I will verify proper gas block alignment when I get home this evening. If everything is correct on my end I will ship it out tomorrow morning. (Edit). I would like to include that the barrel was not dimpled from the factory. I dimpled the barrel myself using a brd engineering jig. I am using a bcm lopro gas block that was torqued to spec using loctite. |
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Posted: 6/10/2017 9:19:39 PM EDT
[#24]
The selector in my trigger is hard to turn. It feels like its bound up some how. I have it in a mega billet lower, so I doubt its the lower. And I didnt have any issues with the last selector.
When I got my first one I had the same problem. They sent me a new one and it was a little better, but still feels like its in a bind. You can barely feel it click in semi and into echo. It works, just not like a 500 dollar trigger should. Now the BFSIII in my MPX is just awesome! Should have bought 2 of those. |
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Posted: 6/10/2017 10:40:56 PM EDT
[#25]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
The selector in my trigger is hard to turn. It feels like its bound up some how. I have it in a mega billet lower, so I doubt its the lower. And I didnt have any issues with the last selector. When I got my first one I had the same problem. They sent me a new one and it was a little better, but still feels like its in a bind. You can barely feel it click in semi and into echo. It works, just not like a 500 dollar trigger should. Now the BFSIII in my MPX is just awesome! Should have bought 2 of those. |
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Posted: 6/11/2017 5:02:16 PM EDT
[#26]
I got back my third ECHO trigger that had problems from fostech on Saturday and they fixed it. However there are some very nice improvements on the trigger. The hammer lock has changed in design and it looks like the detent cap is now CNC machined. The selector now feels like a normal AR selector no more mushy feel. 100% improvement on that. It also does not spin. They noted in the return that the selector might spin but i could not make it do it during normal rifle operation. The ECHO mode now is much easier to do. I do not have to pull back as much on the pull fire movement in order to get the release fire pull to work like I have to do on the other 2 echo trigger I have installed. I'm not sure if its the design on the hammer lock or something else they might have done. Whatever it is I like it! It does dry operation just like the BFS III now in the binary/ECHO mode. I wish I had a device to measure the trigger pounds but it feels light in semi and echo mode (~ 4-5 lbs). Now I need to get it some range time to make sure all of this dry firing is the same a live fire. Here are photos of the new designed trigger lock and the CNC cap
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Posted: 6/11/2017 7:29:16 PM EDT
[#27]
That sure LOOKS like a MIM sprue.
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Posted: 6/11/2017 7:59:03 PM EDT
[#28]
Quote HistoryThe trigger lock did not change in the material used only in the shape. Maybe both the trigger lock and the old detent cap were MIM but I'm not familiar with that process. The detent cap is CNC machined and much better than the old one. I wish I could get the CNC caps for my other two triggers. Even though my other two are not that bad they are still sort of mushy
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Posted: 6/11/2017 9:57:39 PM EDT
[#29]
New trigger lock modified to work with 22lr auto sear trip?
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Posted: 6/12/2017 2:16:22 AM EDT
[#30]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
New trigger lock modified to work with 22lr auto sear trip? |
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Posted: 6/13/2017 3:34:27 AM EDT
[#31]
my Echo safety selector wasn't mushy at all, and didn't spin.
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Posted: 6/14/2017 11:42:17 AM EDT
[#32]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
my Echo safety selector wasn't mushy at all, and didn't spin. Did you get your 9mm working with the ECHO? I could not see your photos yesterday. |
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Posted: 6/14/2017 3:55:29 PM EDT
[#33]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Did you get your 9mm working with the ECHO? I could not see your photos yesterday. |
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Posted: 6/14/2017 4:20:44 PM EDT
[#34]
So is there an update that improves the trigger and prevents the safety from spinning?
Seriously consindering another bfs3 if not. |
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Posted: 6/14/2017 4:30:51 PM EDT
[#35]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
So is there an update that improves the trigger and prevents the safety from spinning? Seriously consindering another bfs3 if not. |
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Posted: 6/14/2017 4:32:37 PM EDT
[#36]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I went back to the BFS. |
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Posted: 6/14/2017 6:42:06 PM EDT
[#37]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
See my photos above. Its CNC detent cap. The selector is now 100% like a normal selector Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
So is there an update that improves the trigger and prevents the safety from spinning? Seriously consindering another bfs3 if not. Like, safe and semi feels normal, but then going to echo feels like crap and will then rotate 360 degrees if you keep pushing it around |
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Posted: 6/14/2017 10:21:44 PM EDT
[#38]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Well, I'm wondering if they have recently updated the detent cap again. I have the cnc cap as well, but mine still rotates 360 degrees. Like, safe and semi feels normal, but then going to echo feels like crap and will then rotate 360 degrees if you keep pushing it around |
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Posted: 6/15/2017 12:02:39 AM EDT
[#39]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I can't get this one to do that. It feels good in all positions. Does your look like mine I photographed |
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Posted: 6/15/2017 12:33:21 AM EDT
[#40]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Yes, but I can't tell by those angles. Mine looks identical, but it has a channel all the way around the detent cap almost as though it was meant to spin 360 degrees. Does yours have that? |
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Posted: 6/21/2017 9:36:06 PM EDT
[#41]
I just got mine in dated 05/24/2017 and I also have the new safety detent. Works perfect
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Posted: 6/22/2017 1:14:13 PM EDT
[#42]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I just got mine in dated 05/24/2017 and I also have the new safety detent. Works perfect |
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Posted: 6/22/2017 2:22:58 PM EDT
[#43]
Yes and it functions flawlessly
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Posted: 6/22/2017 10:14:52 PM EDT
[#44]
Good to hear they are working better now, price has sure come down on them, gunbroker has a bunch @buy now for $479
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Posted: 6/22/2017 10:21:41 PM EDT
[#45]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
So is there an update that improves the trigger and prevents the safety from spinning? Seriously consindering another bfs3 if not. |
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Posted: 6/22/2017 11:34:25 PM EDT
[#46]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Yes and it functions flawlessly |
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Posted: 6/23/2017 12:18:38 AM EDT
[#47]
I'm waiting for the price to go down and the kinks to be worked out; I'm considering buying one as a present to myself for getting my engineering degree next May. Damn-near-FA with a proper three-position selector for under $500 is a hell of a temptation.
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Posted: 6/23/2017 8:15:46 PM EDT
[#48]
How much lower can/will they go? Website still says 6 month wait, $475 plus shipping. Thinking about the buy it now for $479 on gun broker. I wonder if these are the latest versions also
 
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Posted: 6/23/2017 8:35:08 PM EDT
[#49]
I just ordered one May 12 and it took 6 weeks from date of order to doorstep
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Posted: 6/24/2017 8:54:33 PM EDT
[#50]
I saw that it also said 6 month backorder but their Facebook looked like the wait was around 3 months. I purchased mine around 6/14 and it mentioned 30-60 days wait. Now they updated their lead time to only 30 days on the website.
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