AR Sponsor
[ARCHIVED THREAD] - My Bargin Bin and the The Exploding Pmag **New update pg 1..Remington steps up** (Page 2 of 3)
S&W = Shoot and Whine. For years their products have SUCKED. NOW they have a few decent weapons, They had to to save the company.
Are you kidding me? the M&P rifles are great...the M&P pistols are getting rave reviews (although not my cup of tea) the standard pistol line is still being used by police across the US. Are you basing you beliefs on reality or a preconceived notion? are you thinking about the old European owned S&W?? |
|
I'll second the headspace likelihood, or maybe a really bad combination of marginal headspace combined with high pressure caused by bullets breaking crimp and seating too deep (but if this happened on the first round from a mag, bullet seating and OAL can't be the cause). Headspace might have increased as a result of this failure, but the lug setback should be visually apparent - for this kind of failure without an ammo problem headspace would have to be off more than 0.006" (the tolerance of a field guage, probably much more). Given my choice of blaming US factory ammo or a bargin bin gun, I've got to go with the bargain bin. I think that a field guage is a wise investment for do-it-yourselfers, and bargain hunters (and I'm as cheap as they come). Cheap Insurance |
| I have ZERO confidence in the upper\barrel\bcg. I made that well known to both CMMG and Remington. A Rem. rep left a voicemail today, i'll give him a call tomorrow . I'm leaning toward shipping label and new gun and they can pay for the 9 boxes I have left. We'll see. |
|
Could be excessive headspace but what about a slamfire as well? IIRC an SKS will slamfire and blow the whole back end of a case out because of the case not being all the way chambered and the lugs not locked. Rem's UMC rifle ammo is weak on the crimping and sometimes the primers are a little softer than usual. Cant figure out how the UMC pistol line is pretty good but the rifle isnt. |
|
From what I have read on the net Rem. UMC ammo has had quite a bit of problems. I bought 100 rounds from Walmart awhile back. When firing I listen to each round as it is fired. So far I have had a few go "pop" and I stop and pull things apart and check down the barrel. I've got maybe 40 rounds of UMC stuff left to shoot and will definately check the length on it. I've also shot Ultramax before and had good luck...but have heard they had/or have the same problem. I mainly shoot Black Hills remanufactured 52gr or 68 gr match grade HP ammo. From Midwayusa it is only about $25 more per 200 rounds than the UMC ammo and you get quality match grade ammo. Catch it on sale and it is about the same, although the sales are getting few and far between any more. Don't know how many times that I have read where people have spent a lot on their AR, wnet out to shoot and complain about how poor the groups are and are using cheap ammo...but the rifle is at fault. I personally am done with the cheap ammo route. I believe that Black Hills would stand behind any problems that their ammo creates...but better to pay a bit more and not run the chance of blowing up your AR or getting hurt. |
| Its your UMC ammo. Had the same problem with my friend using 1000 rounds of it as Winchester ammo wasnt available at the Bass Pro shop in Las Vegas. Had to check every single round as bullet set back was a big problem before the round was even loaded in the mags. Some rounds you can push the bullet into the casing without any pressure. That is hot bad UMC ammo is. Stick to Federal American Eagle or Winchester. Call Remington and see what the hell they would do for you. Send them your pics too. Be glad you are ok, as Pmags are replaceable and fingers are not. |
The no-go will tell you if headspace is greater than 0.004". If it is then you do have a headspace issue that should be fixed, but your rifle may still be safe to fire. If headspace exceeds 0.006", indicated by swallowing a field guage, then headspace is dangerously out of spec and the rifle shouldn't be fired before it's fixed. So a no-go will tell you if you have headspace issues, a field guage will tell you if it's safe or not. I hate Midway's backorders. |
Forget asking questions about people's preferences. They are just that, their preferences and are often unverifiable through fact. I currently own two smith ans Wesson M&P series firearms, a 9mm and the M&P15t. Both are of the best quality, shoot like a dream and come backed up by an outstanding warranty. My father has a modell 66 he's owned for years and never had a problem. The real issue is mindless goons who don't like something getting all pumped talking about how this or that is junk/sucks spouting their opinion as the word of God rather than what it is; mindless goon's personal opinion. I personally don't care for Glocks OR Sigs but I won't call them junk because it is my OPINION not fact! |
My stash is 340 rounds +- that I would pick up at Walmart when I would go there over the last year of two. It is all dumped in an ammo can. Guess this will be my trading pogey bait for when the SHTF. Honestly, I have never shot a round of it, always had too much Wolf to shoot. I wonder what 340 rounds of ammo will get me on the EE???? |
That dude's just got a serious bug up his ass about S&W for some reason. It has nothing to do with how good their guns are. Fortunately, his personal bias against the company in no way affects the quality of the S&W guns that you, I, or anyone else happen to own, so posts like his have no value and are very easily dismissed. 
|
30 dollars!!!! Ill take it!!! 
|
|
Quick update: Talked to both CMMG and Rem. Sent the rifle and casing to CMMG today They will take a look then send the casing to Rem Rem is sending me a shipping label for the other 9 boxes FWIW, CMMG says they have seen an increase in ammo failures lately and every one they have had has been taken care of by the ammo mfgr. |
WOW... First off, I'm happy to hear no one was hurt during this KB!! I always thought brand names like Remington was safe but damn if I'm not wrong. Heck, I've heard people having hell with their .22lr over on Rimfirecentral. Anyhow, I pray their UMC 250CT bulk packs are good...I got 1500rds of 9mm Luger So far I've sent about 50 rds down range all of which was problem free. Now I have a box of this stuff for my AR but I've been using Wolf and Monarch instead. But I just picked up some of that XM193 that people suggest is good ammo. As for using this in an AK, I've never had good luck using American made ammo in my AKs. They seem to chew up Russian stuff all day long though. Anyhow, I think Acadamy had some Monarch .223 (steal case) for 5.29 and Monarch (brass case) for 7.67 a box. |
I shit you not I had one this past weekend exactly like that. I had a handful of them loose in a bag and when I reached in the bag I felt powder. Sure enough one of them had the bullet pushed clear back into the case letting the powder out in the plastic bag. Luckily I have less than 100 of this junk ammo left but I'll be damn sure to check every single round if I decide to try firing it. |
|
If you go over to the reloading forum, 80% of reloaders will tell you that they never crimp their .223. The action in an AR isn't really rough enough to warrant it. I crimp now but, there was a long time and many thousands of rounds in the past when I didn't. I doubt seriously it was a bullet set back in the case. My guess is that it is either: 1) Wrong powder- happens sometimes when manufacturers change over to another caliber and the powder hopper doesn't get cleaned properly. 2) Squib load- Light powder charge causes one bullet to lodge in barrel- the second bullet is overpressured- both bullets can stay in the barrel or sometimes fly out leaving you with a broken rifle and wondering why. |
I guess that FAIR MARKET threw you huh? Ok, I'll bite, $30 PLUS shipping and HANDLING.... I'll trade for corn, yeast and copper line when society collapses. |
|
i figured my 30 will save you a 1100 dollar rifle when the ammo goes boom mine have been immune to remington ammo and by so many posts on this forum my S&W, RRA and Delton rifles are only good for cannon fodder ill do the 30 plus shipping....you never said anything about fair market LOL
|
With all due respect how do you explain the fact that 2 of us have already chimed in on this thread with bullets that either were completely in the case or had some that could be pushed back into the case with a finger? Not saying the OP might have had a squib load as you suggested however, there is some kind of issue with these bullets not being held in the cartridge well enough (at least some of them). |
I dunno- all I can say is that in reloading circles, most don't crimp. I never crimped even on bullets with no canelure (i.e. your slick match bullets that have a tendency to set back in larger calibers). In all those thousands of rounds, I never saw one set back. There is some crazy off chance that the bullet seat die that Remington was using is somehow not supporting the neck properly when the bullet is seated. ETA: set back is a little harder than one might think- powder fills the case completely on most .223 loads. These means for the bullet to set back, it must compress the powder. There is simply not enough action in the little AR to do that. Looking at the pics of the case, it doesn't look like a case failure. Interesting, though, is that the primer is still intact and barely bulged. In most gross overpressure cases you will see the primer pushed out of the primer pocket. So, I don't think case failure is ruled out. If there were better pcitures of the case, I might be able to tell. Here are my new guesses: 1) Wrong powder in the hopper 2) Squib 3) Case failure |
Don't forget the HANDLING charges.....  Each round must be visually inspected inspected as I dump it into a box......this could add up quickly......LOLI guess I will keep my shite ammo for barter fodder when the ballon goes up.... |
|
So what is the best cheap ammo for plinking. I was gona stock up on Rem UMC, Wolf, Winchester USA, and American Eagle for a trip up to the Boundary Waters in Minnesota over the summer. I am just going to be shooting at shit, and do not need anyting very accurate. Wolf and American Eagle has done me good in the past; I was gona try UMC, but not now. I have fired about 500rds of Wolf and AE through my gun in the past and it worked well. Does anyone know if Winchester USA is any good, or any other advise on the listed ammo would be great. I do not want any problems when I am out in the middle of nowhere. Any advise on what to stear clear of would be great. Thaks
|
|
PLEASE do not bring a bunch of ammo up here to Ely and the BWCA and " just shoot at shit" This not the "middle of nowhere" to just shoot in. Respect the solitude of the other campers that have come here from all over the world to experience one of the few great places left in the USA. If you want to shoot, look me up and I can get you to some safe, fun areas here. An area that you won't be going to jail. Google the " Minnesota Six". What does this have to do with the OP anyway? 
|
|
I just bought 100 rounds of the cheap Remington 223 UMC from Walmart last week - after I read this thread, I inspected the rounds in one box of 20- -on 5 of the rounds, the bullets are loose! One was so loose I could push it into the case with just a little pressure on the plastic shell holder in the ammo box! Yes, this stuff is truly junk. I reload, and I've never had a bullet that loose, ever. I've pulled bullets I've loaded with a hammer type inertia puller, and it usually takes 3 good whacks to get the bullet out. I think my 7 year old girl could pull these- -absolutely no neck tension. Kind of ironic - my National Rifleman mag showed up today, and there was an article on how the Spec Ops guys were sabotaging ammo that the VC were using. Maybe old Osama got someone working in the Remington plant! |
I was using my wordls loosley and I am not that reckless. I will be going with my girlfriend for the first time. I guess we will be staying with a friend of her partents, who own a printing company. It is a private land, so there are no campers. There is plenty of land, from what I hear. Don't get your panties in a bunch. I have respect for nature and my girlfriend is going in to be a conservation officer. So don't lable me as some punk kid.  Sorry for the hijack
|
|
I've always heard Wolf is the devil so I fork out a little more dough and get the Remington. Now your telling me I gotta pay $15+ a box to plink reliably? Either I'm really lucky or you guys are unlucky. I have shot more than 5,000 rnds of Remington UMC & Rem JHP in 55gr without a hitch. I've had 2 loads that wouldn't fire overall. I've hardly shot quality ammo to tell you the truth. I plink alot. But my gun does love Federal Gold Medal Match 69gr best... at $24 a box I just can't afford it. For plinking, Black Hills reloads are the best as far as Quality:Price Ratio goes, right? |
| with the amount of these "push backable" bullets on these remington cartridges it would be nice to see photo graphic evidence of what you have because i have shot thousands of the green and white UMC loads and never had an issue. Without pictures, my incredibly hot super model wife and victoria secret model "mistress" both state they are having a hard time believing it being this bad and remington not having issued a full recall. |
[ARCHIVED THREAD] - My Bargin Bin and the The Exploding Pmag **New update pg 1..Remington steps up** (Page 2 of 3)
AR Sponsor