I tried to make it as straight forward as possible...

ETA <sighs> -  pic thread & all that...

(from off the interwebs - a few M4s are mixed in there with the A4s though.)
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ACOG showed up today so I think this one is just ...about ...done. Might start saving up for an ATPIAL-C (civi version of a PEQ15)....maybe... I don't know - with so many different projects in-the-pan so-to-speak, my wallet is fast becoming thinner than my patience.

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FlDiveCop71

Wife loves my M16a4 clone.  She can't wield it worth a damn being tiny.  Soooo....

How'd I do?  I think it may be the next recce, handguard covered muzzle device, using all your picatinny space, broom handle, electronic sight, insert fad etc. etc.

 
Stunning.

 
Splendid. I would leave it exactly like that. Wouldn't touch it. Wouldn't touch either, unless you want to slap an optic on either one, but that would be about it.


'Keep 'em classy', that shorty looks awesome.

Thanks brother.  I have a hard time putting optics on an A4 being so near and dear to me equipped with irons and all.

where did you get the short stock?

I think that's a Bushmaster entry stock.

It's the RRA entry stock.  Probably the same thing though.

Not on the fence anymore:





 



 

 
Well done!

Sunny day. Break out the rifles for some pics.



M16A4 Clone by SoloDallas, on Flickr

Anyone know if Colt will start making the AR15A4 again?

Colt makes them in small batches.  There is supposed to be another run of them this year.

I hope so, I'm holding out for one.

Ugh... well I just ordered a M5 RAS off the EE just now.

Gotta hope that Colt releases the AR15A4 again this summer!

With an aimpoint and matech buis.

A while back I got a Knights A4 rail from a Jarhead on Craig's list and I'm sure he "acquired" if from supply since it was new in box and I got it for a bargain. I always wanted to do a M16A4 built so I parted together this rifle.
Lower is a Sundevil with an old A2 buttstock, pistolgrip, and Spikes G.I. (a.k.a. mushy) 2-stage trigger
The Upper is a Bushmaster/Del-Ton 20" 5.56 Government Profile Barrel 1x9 and the afore mentioned Knights rail
I didn't make this to compete so 1/9 will work with standard 55 grain Walmart ammo
Im waiting on a A4 Carry handle and G.I. sling and then its done as far as I'm concerned.
While I shot a A2 this brings back some memories
M16A4gery by John Hermesmeyer, on Flickr

M16A4gery by John Hermesmeyer, on Flickr

M16A4gery by John Hermesmeyer, on Flickr

This was my first complete build. I assembled the upper and lower. Ive built partial upper and complete lowers before but not the whole thing.

Very nice!

I started buying parts but kind of messed up on the barrel.  In my haste I obtained a 1/9 20" barrel, at least it is a govt profile and has the F marked FSB. I'm not sure if I want to keep looking for the correct barrel yet. Where did you get yours?

The Barrel a few weeks ago
I wanted to keep the build priced reasonable
the Barrel, sight, sight parts, and everything else totaled about 170ish
Like I said 1/9 I can shoot cheap 55grn out to 4-500 yards with open sights fine enough
didn't want a CMP competition rifle and if I change my  mind later I can upgrade the barrel easy enough

I have a 18inch BCM rifle I use for 3 gun and scoped target shooting and a 14.5 Faxon upper'd Rifle I use for HD and general tacticool shit
Both shoot very well
this rifle is just for fun range time and general plinking

Understood, I got my barrel for $150 I think so I was thinking the same way. Same thing with the BCG, I think I'm just gonna pick up a phosphate coated generic model, I've never seen one that affected the accuracy, so I think as long as it has an original coating on it I should be "authentic" enough. Other then that I'm just waiting on my lower   AeroPrecision M16A4 Lower

I found the lower the other night searching around for M16A4 images and thought what the hell, for $105 it was cheap enough. It should look pretty good!

This way I can keep the lower I have on my A2 National Match rifle, the one that started all this! I really love that A2, I've got a RRA 2 stage trigger and HB on it, it shoots really well, just heavy as hell. IT would be cool to find a M4A1 clone lower to do one of those.....

So, after consulting with a manufacturer of .gov UID labels, I've decided to take my clone builds just a liiittle bit closer to being more "ofishul" & will soon be forking out just over $300 to have 50 or so custom-made, .gov "certified", UID labels manufactured & shipped to my home address. At roughly $6 each as shipped to me,  I don't find it all that bad a rate, all things considered... Yes, it's a lot of money, but at that cost range, it allows me to have 6 different MFG-CAGE-code/Part# combinations certified, manufactured, and shipped - so in the end, I'll have labels for not only my A4 clones, but also my M4A1 clones, A2 clones, & even the A1 clones as well...Yeah - technically the A1s don't really need them as I'm not even sure there are still any left in.gov inventories to put labels on, but since I happen to be "re-commissioning" an M12 rifle rack at the same time, and it has an A1 clone in it, I figure I might as well stick a label on it the same as all it's neighbors in the rack... just to make it more "o-fishul" & all...

Here's what I'm going with design-wise...

The labels themselves will be printed on 1.75 inch x 0.5 inch Tesa Label material (same stuff as used on issued weapons)

All the A4 labels will be printed in what I like to call "FN Format", as I've only ever seen this type of label layout used on FN A4s:
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They use "MFG" instead of "CAGE", use serial numbers that consist only of numbering (no lettering is used in the serial number) and have all of the "info" printed in a single, verticle, left-justified column, with the data matrix printed on the far right of the label.

Whereas - All of the Colt labels I'm having made (for A1s, A2s, M4A1s) will be in this format:
(Labels (Like below) have been seen with a number of different cage codes and unlike factory FN labels which are often 1.75" x .5" - the below labels are all 1.5" wide x .4" tall.)
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Which uses "CAGE" instead of "MFG", generally uses serial numbers starting with a "W", and have all of the "info" organized into two vertical, independently left justified columns also with it's data matrix on the far right like the FN's.

Oddly, there have been a few of these labels that have had the information in these columns right-justified...
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Both from what I recall as well as having researched since, most of these 1.5" x .4" labels have been placed primarily on weapons that have either been rebuilt, reassigned to alternate service, or otherwise at some point required their original round, .75" x .75"  or 1" x 1" labels (if the weapon ever had them to begin with) to be replaced.

Newly constructed weapons appear to primarily be using either 0.75 inch x 0.75 inch, or 1 x 1 inch labels in this format, though I have yet to see any of these in use on any M16A4s:
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They appear to be being used on pretty much everything, except A4s... (go figure).

Along with having labels produced with my weapons' actual serial numbers, I decided to have a number of the labels produced with "generic" serial numbers representing the particular weapon's official adoption date by the military, for example:

The M16A4's official adoption date is July 29th, 1997...So the "generic" serial number (FN) label I'm having produced will read:

MFG 3S679
PART # 12973001
SERIAL # 07291997

...with the data matrix, of course, being placed on the right side of the label as pictured in the first pic above.

Does this seem like a reasonable approach to creating a generic A4 label?... or does the hive perhaps have a better idea? My purchase order has yet to actually be proto-typed or funds laid down, so I'm wandering if maybe the hive has a better perspective on this?

FlDiveCop71

Nicely done, Ankratz...

How do you like the ATPIAL-C? I've been thinking about getting one myself, though I've only ever had experience with the DBAL series.

I'm not sure if this one has ever been posted here or not...

That is just an awesome photo! Is that intentionally "battle worn" or just one of the A4's from the start of this thread? As old as this thread is the first posters should be looking like that by now

Would be cool if you could figure out a way to add serial numbers to the stickers, then you could sell em...

Any place else that could clone those stickers? We've got a real nice high end label maker at work, I wonder if I could get the label material and make some up...

Do it! They're only going to dry up sooner or later. You won't be disappointed.

I had an LDI DBALi2 (green vis) and loved it. But that was before you could get the ATPIAL-C. I sold mine.

The ATPIAL-C red visible is very bright (so no worries there), and I kid you not, you can see the dot out to 500m at night. Haven't tried the IR yet because I'm too poor for NVG's right now, but I've tried a buddies actual PEQ-15 on "low IR" with nods and it is perfect. Hi IR is really too bright, truthfully (I think it's for designating targets, which I have no plans on doing)

Midway USA has them, and I believe Ownthenight.com and TNVC also have them right now.

My M16A4gery
M16A4 by John Hermesmeyer, on Flickr

M16A4 by John Hermesmeyer, on Flickr

M16A4 by John Hermesmeyer, on Flickr

My UID Label project is getting closer to completion...

Here's a paper cutout of one of the generic FN label proofs. Still have to make a few minor corrections (change the "O" in the serial # to a zero, equalize the data matrix with the information height & overall size-wise, ect.), but should have the final proofs worked out by Friday, & some actual labels received shortly thereafter.

Please excuse the crappy cell pics as my camera has yet to receive it's upgrade...
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FlDiveCop71

Here's a question for you A4 guys. I have a PSA 20" upper and it came with the triangular front handguard retainer. I recently got a good deal on a Knights Armament M5 RAC. I haven't messed with it much, but it doesn't seem to fit the triangular retainer. Should it work with this set up?

It will work, mine has it.

The rifle (triangle) retainer is the one you want for the M5 RAS.

Tried again and it dropped right in. There was a tab I didn't see in the front of the top rail. All good now.

Just remember - The front tab goes under/inside the front end cap - Not on top of it.

Yes it's under. I had to completely unscrew to barrel nut attachment to get it to go into place and then gently tightened the screw to make sure it threaded ok. Pretty easy the second go round.

Looking good so far!

What's going on in this pic? That his blood?

I've seen the pic before, but can't remember the story behind it.

ugh....you turkey.

Love that SAM-R

I've tried every way I could think of to get the KAC covers to cover the whole rail like that, never did work.

Now I see it what I'm missing.

Normally, you would remove the charging handle & carry handle, and then (while pressing the locking tab down) slide the panel along the upper receiver & onto the rail assembly, though some have trouble holding the tab down while moving the panels forward. In those instances, you can always temporarily remove the tabs from the panels & then reinstall them into the panels once you get the panels into position...

Well, I'm looking at his top rail and I see nine ridges on one cover and ten on the other. My first RAS I owned I bought used here in the EE. The rails that came with it just either too long or too short to cover the top or bottom rail like that.

My current RAS that I bought direct from KAC a couple years ago came with three panels only. I don't like using the VFG at all and would like to cover the whole bottom of my RAS like he did with his top.

As far as I'm aware, KAC doesn't actually make a 10-rib cover... usmcchet9296's using an 11-rib & a 9-rib to cover the top rail, though you are correct that the same combination would be used on the bottom rail.
I used to not like using a forward vertical grip because doing so would often cause the rail to flex, and I didn't want to run the risk of ruining it due to metal fatigue, though I've since given up worrying about it as years of such happening to the rails of similarly equipped rifles hasn't seemed to adversely affect them... Besides, adding accessories out toward the front adds a rather significant amount of weight to have to throw around whilst searching for targets, and I find that having the grip helps me manage that aspect a little better...YMMV though.

Some of you may remember a previous post I made (quite a ways back in this thread now) regarding the differences between the M7, M9, & OKC3S bayonets which have been used with the M16A4, and how I had liked the OKC3S bayonet so much, that I was actually considering acquiring a few more of them at the time simply because they were such fine bayonets...
How I so wish that I had followed through with that thought & actually purchased a few more back then, for little did I know that shortly after I'd made my original purchase, the OKC3S would soon become a widely commercialized product & that finding it's military counterpart in sealed, new-in-wrap format would become frustratingly difficult to either locate or obtain, particularly at anything approaching a reasonable price.

Well - after placing various purchases through numerous sources over the years & ending up with mostly (unsatis)factory commercial variants, I finally managed to get my hands on a few of these oh-so-prized new-in-wrap specimens (Lord - was it ever a long & painful journey), and so I thought that I might share some of my hard-won knowledge with those of you that are perhaps less knowledgeable about the differences, so that you may more easily wade your way through all the commercial BS to better find the few pearls that are the objects of our A4 cloning hearts...

Below from left to right:
Original military contract OKC3S bayonet & sheath, Commercial Variant #1 (sold until @ May of 2015), Commercial Variant #2 (production started @ June of 2015 to present?), Apr '07 military contract bayonet/sheath & leg strap (opened package), sealed/new-in-wrap Apr '07 contract OKC3S bayonet system.  
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When Ontario Knife Company originally came out with the OKC3S bayonet, even though military sales initially sucked away nearly all production, you could still contact Ontario's main distributor (Knifecenter) to purchase one of these bayonets & would be shipped the exact same bayonet & sheath (even wrapped in the same paper & sealed in the same plastic bag similar to as pictured above) as that which was delivered to the USMC...albeit at a much higher price tag than that which the military had to pay. Still, even @ $85 shipped to the civilian consumer - It was a great deal (for which I still kick myself, for not having taken better advantage of it at the time). Hindsight being 20/20 however, It was soon found that the molly webbing on the sheaths of these initial production bayonets was extremely tight & difficult to actually use as intended. Thus, within that first year or so, production would see the webbing on the sheaths loosened up considerably.  

Note the thinness of the webbing on the sheath on the far right below as apposed to that of the others. The webbing on current production models is almost too flexible leaving much slack & movement of the sheath itself whilst worn.
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Shortly after this change (About a year and a half after initial production began?), Ontario, perhaps due to a clause in their military contacts, or likely some other mundane reasoning decided to stop selling the military OKC3S bayonets through commercial channels, and rather came out with the first "Officially Licensed by the USMC", commercial variant of the OKC3S bayonet. This bayonet was shipped in a two part cardboard box that was just over 17 inches long with a black lid & white inner sleeve. The sheath used with this bayonet was in fact of the same sheath production as the standard OKC3S military contract bayonet, while the bayonet itself, though constructed of the same materials as it's military counterpart, differed in that the blade itself was no longer stamped with "USMC", but rather was brightly laser-etched with it's information showing "Made In USA", instead of "USMC" among the text printed onto the blade's surface. Other than changing the text to read "Made In USA" & being laser-etched, all other text & aspects of this bayonet were the same as military issue.

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For well over a decade, this first commercial variant was sold to consumers, then, starting sometime @ June of 2015, a new commercial variant was produced which contained a number of design changes to both cut costs & increase advertising. To start with, the laser-etched text was shortened by over 8 letters (removing the "Made In" & "Co." from the text) which ever so slightly decreased production time (& remember  - time is money), moved the location of Company info from being mostly hidden underneath the sheath's webbing at the hilt, to openly exposed along the length of the sheath's outer edge (much better free advertising - and free is always good, eh?), though perhaps the most noticeable cost-saving change was that made in the use of packaging materials that were 3 inches shorter than those of the first commercial variant. Another slightly less noticeable change was that made by the use of an ever so slightly thinner & more flexible material for the webbing on the sheath. This difference is more clearly recognized whilst manipulating the various aspects of the sheath itself with the sheath "in hand" as it were...

I cannot say whether the current production commercial sheath (as like that of it's predecessor) is of the same design & materials as that of current military production bayonet systems, as the most recent military sheath I have is from '07. Perhaps others may know if current military production carries the above features or not, though I doubt the military versions will ever have their blades Laser-etched...
 
In the pic below, Note the tightness of the webbing on the original contract sheath on the far left (lack of shadowing on the webbing) as compared to the much looser webbing evident on the sheaths to the right (shadowing, ect.).

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Some pics of the '07 military production models...

Note that it is exceedingly rare to find OKC3S bayonets packaged in this format for sale, and that while this type of packaging usually means it's contents are of genuine military origin, it may also happen that more nefarious sellers use similar type packaging to "clinch" the sale of an otherwise fake or commercial bayonet. Beware bayonets that are packaged in white paper; sealed in perfectly clear plastic bags (military packaging on these bayonets is almost universally somewhat "hazy" to look through); contain production dates before 2003 (the military didn't start using the OKC3S bayonet until early 2003); or shows bar-coded tags inside of the plastic bags (the military would never have bar-coded info placed inside a plastic bag that is supposed to typically be "hazy" in appearance. Rather, the manufacturer typically places labeling on the outside of the packaging as pictured below.)
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Note that the webbing on these '07 military production bayonets is not near as tight as that of early first contract series, and that (after '05) the packaging typically contains a "leg strap" along with the bayonet & sheath. Further note that the text is physically stamped into the blade material rather than it being laser-etched onto the surface, and that "USMC" can be read from either side (stamped into the blade on one side & the handle on the other).
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So now you know both what to both look for & be wary of in your hunt for the perfect OKC3S bayonet for your M16A4 Clone. Be vigilant, though cautious in your search, and don't just jump at the first sight of a seemingly great deal, and should you happen across such as these bayonets above & decide to spend the cash - always be certain to ensure that you specifically request that your purchase be shipped in a securely sealed sturdy box, lest your treasure arrive missing from it's packaging. I can not tell you how many times I have lost purchases because a seller failed to prevent a shipper from guessing what was being shipped due to faulty/flimsy packaging & subsequently stealing some or all of the item(s) held within....

P.S...
While I will not hot-link the source of my acquisition since the sale site & seller are not sponsored members, I will say that there are still currently a very precious few of these sealed bayonets left available... The well has now seemingly dried up ...permanently.
Good luck in your bayonet-hunting adventures, whether they be from Rome to Connecticut, or even the shores of Tripoli.

My Apologies for the slight derailment with this bayonet post. ...We now return you to your regularly scheduled M16A4-Cloning broadcast...




FlDiveCop71

My 3rd ID clone is getting there...

-FN 20" A4 barrel (F marked) NOS
-FN A3 upper NOS
-FN BCG NOS
-KAC/Surefire shenanigans

 
Jeez, what a beauty.

Don't know about you, but I have always been into bayonets. Don't even know why; I think they look super cool, wether if fixed on (some) rifles or even on their own, as blades.


Cool post.