This

Do we know what this was about yet?

this exactly

oh also, you guys still planning on doing that flash under nods vid you mentioned in the sierra thread?

Go click the links that paco posted in his thread. They are all links that look like they would go to other brands websites, but they all bring you to Griffin's.
Pretty sketchy, but doesn't mean the Griffin cans don't perform. I'd love to be in the position to try their explorr can vs some others.. I'm in the market for another dedicated 556 can

Nobody likes that kid who gets caught and points out the others.

This thread got weird. I’m actually interested in the explorr but still curious about the eco flow baffles. I have a turbo that is a bit gassy. How much would I notice a different with the Explorr when it comes to back pressure on a 11.5”? I don’t run adjustable gas blocks.

Is there a quantitative way that Griffin could measure backpressure during these tests like bolt velocity? Would be interesting to see baseline vs various silencers to see the difference. Maybe the shooters ear numbers tell the same story, but not the same as understanding the changes in action dynamics.

You could seal a rifle in a box with the action on the inside and the muzzle outside.  Then just measure how much gas is expelled by action.  It's pretty simple to do with water displacement, chemists do it to measure gasses produced in reactions.

What’s the background on your Surname?

I just want to say that while Griffin Armament could probably use a revamp on marketing strategy, I do appreciate their presence on ARFCOM.  The search term stuff is super common in other industries, and seems to me to be completely unrelated to the technical performance of suppressors.  I get it, the suppressor industry is a small one, and people like to see everyone be all corny and buddy buddy.  That would be nice, but people don’t always get along.  Ultimately businesses are in business to make money, not be pals with each other.  That seems to upset a lot of folks here on arfcom (though it is unclear to me what percentage of offended parties actually shoot their guns or own suppressors or maybe even own guns), who respond to perceived slights with fun things like memes of people pooping everywhere.

I own a number of griffin armament products because they are good quality, perform well, are priced competitively, their accessories are in stock way more than a number of their competitors, and the company has always been responsive to me.  

I also own Dead Air suppressors and am happy with those.  I like my Q stuff too.  I don’t own any CGS stuff but would buy, with the caveat that I’d want to know which setups CGS recommends for acceptable performance from the Helios QD.  I don’t even blame Paco for avoiding the Pew Science thread, because as Griffin Armament proves quite frequently, attempting negotiations with mobs armed with torches and pitchforks is a good way to start a non consensual spit roast.

I think they’re shysters and dirtbags but their MLOK panels are the only ones on the market that aren’t hot garbage.

What Griffin needs is to decide on a tone and own it; it's a gun accessory company, I expect a certain amount of aggro bravado, but what's aggravating is the passive aggressive nature of a lot of it and the evasiveness when called out on it.  Think your can is better than the Sierra 5?  Just come out and say so, politely or not, it's the dismissive "not a bad first attempt" thing that rankles, I think a more aggressive "you've heard the hype, now hear the real deal!" type approach would have gone over better, especially if delivered with a bit of winking kayfabe.  KB had a similar problem, his jerk shtick was funny before people realized it wasn't a shtick, that he was actually a jerk, but he's a talented enough marking guy to still make it work to some extent.  With Griffin, it's like they want to be cool and edgy, with the porny double entendre names or the infamous engravings back in the day, but then they waffle when people criticize them for it when the better move would be to stick their collective chin out and straight up own it.  Same with the Dugan Ashley thing, even if they genuinely think he slandered the company (a highly dubious assertion), the response was terrible optics and defending it just digs the hole deeper and encourages the trolls who see it still bothers them, when it would be so easy to shut it down with "yeah, our social media guy got a little twitchy that day, that was out of line", it could even have been spun as "yeah, KAC cans are virtually unobtanium for civilians, so we were fulfilling a demand from vets for something that looked like what they had in the service but with a more modern design and a lower price", pure win.  

I'm not going to let a company owner being a little clumsy on the communications front deter me from purchasing a product I think is good, but it clearly is at least a bit of an issue for Griffin given the number of people here sworn off the brand over it, and it sure seems like something that could be fixed with a little marketing and message discipline.

Ok, but how do those 1911's shoot?

You are right about their MLOK panels.  I really wish they made Keymod rail panels.  I have some older keymod rails I'd love to have them on.

A lot of us would buy with the same caveat and that thread would have been the perfect spot for recommendations, but...

??

A lot of this lol

This
I thought I was cool but honestly if you fuckers have IM’d me

Honestly never knew there were so many marketing experts on ARFCOM, very surprising to me. Personally I love seeing a company compare their products to the biggest and latest releases. I want to see which is better. Griffin took no time to compare their cans to dead airs sierra 5, nomad, sigs qd and I believe even the surefire rc2. I was hyped for the sierra 5 but found it odd that it took several weeks after selling that they released any sound or performance videos. First video I saw was from a random YouTuber shooting with the sierra 5. Almost as shady as the rugged razor 556 release but at least the sierra 5 turned out to be good at the end.

Yeah, talking about a let down........the Rugged Razor 5.56

Did you throw as much shade in your other two posts?

I agree with what someone said above: the TBAC “here’s the data” approach seems neutral and chill. Hell, zak-smith could be totally fibbing competitor data (lol) but their approach makes it seem super low key and trustworthy.

I just hope the dual lok mounts are solid... Converting a few cans to this interface since I've had some direct thread things try and walk on me a bit lately... ??

What made you want this vs other products on the market?

yah honestly that raised some red flags with me aswell, it did turn out to be good but them not releasing any kind of data or 'in use' photos (flash) made me very suspicious; after all it wasn't like they didn't have 'em, they basically have to photograph and video the thing in the development process.  

i think it was a big oversight on da's part, especially since the performance seems good; i did end up changing my mind to recce5 after this thread, but that was after talking with @Green0 about firing schedules/ reviewing the blast baffle pic thread, not disappointment in the sierra's performance. I'm still inclined to think stelite has a bit better wear resistance, but i figure that resistance and the ~6db's extra you get from the recce are worth about the same it's just a question of priorities, and with a lifespan in the 10's of 1000's of rounds for each, for my first suppressor ever I think I'll be happier with the quieter option. I don't know that I would've paid as much attention to this thread though if da had already put out meter testing/flash vids as a part of their product release. obv i'm a sample size of one, but it seems safe to assume that if i have someone else likely has as well.

on the note of product names and descriptions, I've always wanted to point out that the m4sdII being 'forged in the fires of mount doom' would necessarily attach the evil and intents derived from Melkor (Sauron's corupter/mentor/master) to the end product, not a good thing, if you're wanting to tie an extreme power of magical nature ala LOTR to it a far better description would be something like 'wrought in the first age by Fëanor under the light of the two trees', that'd put it more on the plane of the palantir or silmarils, which i think is what you're going for.

Not quite what I meant, what I'm saying is that if you're going to be critical, you should be straightforward about it, the way you typically criticize comes off as passive aggressive.  I don't know if that's your intent, but it's how I read it, I've seen you do it many times, I almost think you think you're being polite or subtle, but that's not how I, or apparently others here, are reading it, it comes across like you're saying insults under your breath rather than to someone's face.




See, what you're doing here is a good example of what I'm talking about, you're overly defensive and taking what amounted to ball busting from a gun tuber and making a federal case out of it, almost literally, and it's following you around like TP stuck to your shoe because you can't just say that you overreacted to it and let it go at that.  It was a simple joke about looking like a more expensive product, like the Chrysler 300 trying to look like a Bentley, he wasn't comparing technical details of the locking system or baffle designs, and by pretending like he was to avoid admitting to the overreaction, you just make yourself look dishonest.  



I suspect that on some level the mystique is worth more to them than the profits they might be able to make on the mass market, like a super exclusive nightclub that lets virtually no one in.



Oh, you misunderstand me, I just threw out a possible way of spinning the Dugan Ashley incident in a more productive way, it was meant as an example of a way of responding, not as a concrete plan.  



Okay, this part is the most perfect example of what I meant when I said to pick a messaging lane, you're again being defensive when you shouldn't be, you're trying to both defend the company style and apologize for it at the same time and it comes out sounding mealy mouthed and weak.  Either keeping doing the edgy names and lean into it (the combat veteran angle makes this an easy sell, a somewhat sick sense of humor is pretty expected), or change them out for more "serious" names, but what you're doing is just confusing and weird trying to have it both ways and sending mixed messages.  All you need to say is "shut up, it's funny" and be done with it, you're just not doing yourself any favors with the prevarications.

Just as an aside, I'm a huge booster of your pistol QD system and think your company does a lot of innovative work and puts out some very cool products, that's why I cringe when I see you turn off potential customers with some of these posts.

I'd thought folks said 3db was the point where you notice a clear difference, tmyk I guess. Much more glad of my decision swap in that case

In an audiologists booth 1 dB difference is detectable by somebody with undamaged, normal hearing.  On the range or in noisy ambient environs 3dB is obvious but for many circumstances with impulse noise, maybe not a huge difference.  Often a can that seems quiet one day will seem louder others, so subjective judgement is a slippery thing.  In absolute pressure 3dB is significant.  Loudspeakers that are 3dB more efficient playing continuous sound will be very noticeably louder.   Two unsuppressed gunshots measuring 3dB apart (say 165 and 168) at 1 meter when auditioned from a distance, through muffs, or through ringing unprotected ears will be very hard to say subjectively which is louder.  Most first round pop on rimfire cans on a pistol will be around 3dB louder so that’s a good reference example.

For a locking hub interface mount, there are really only 2 options - this or the keymo. Since Griffin offers titanium mini brakes, this system is slightly lighter than the keymo. I have the keymo also, so I'll compare the two and see which I like better.. But minimizing weight is a big factor for me.

I'm just here to declare which voodoo tube brand has my allegiance and how my feelings affirm my decision. Also, insert engineering terms used incorrectly.

10/10, did snort out loud at my daughter’s ballet class.  Thanks, needed that.

I chuckled

The only Griffin products I own is the camlock piston and mount for my 9mm pistols and I have a Dead Air Nomad waiting for approval, so when I say that you need to chill the fuck out, I hope you don't think I am being biased.

Save some pussy for the rest of us, chucklefuck. It was a joke.

I think it was a decent first attempt at an Arfcom meme.

My takeaways from this thread are.

#1 I didn't know I could have my Recce 5 mod 3 upgraded to a 4.. gonna be sending that in soon.

#2 I didn't pay much attention to the Explorr before as I didn't need another 556 can but hot damn.. 9oz and 6in and it puts up those numbers? Yeah I think I'm going to grab one.

Carry on with the butthurt