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User Panel
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NC, USA
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Posted: 5/23/2020 7:22:44 PM EDT
[#1]
Im seeing some more accuracy reports on the Cz Bren 2 Ms carbines. These guys are saying 4-6 MOA. They claimed the called Cz and that they were told 4 MOA is what to expect at 100 yards. That is terrible accuracy for a 16 " heavy barrel. That cant be right. One guy bought a new scope setup to rule out the optic. These guys have pics of their gun and the targets so I dont think they are trying just bash on the Bren because they are SCAR fanboys. Either these guys are terrible shooters or they have defective rifles wouldnt you think? Anyone here have a bren 2 Carbine that can share their 100 yard accuracy results?
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Posted: 5/23/2020 7:56:28 PM EDT
[#2]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By JuanCarlos: Im seeing some more accuracy reports on the Cz Bren 2 Ms carbines. These guys are saying 4-6 MOA. They claimed the called Cz and that they were told 4 MOA is what to expect at 100 yards. That is terrible accuracy for a 16 " heavy barrel. That cant be right. One guy bought a new scope setup to rule out the optic. These guys have pics of their gun and the targets so I dont think they are trying just bash on the Bren because they are SCAR fanboys. Either these guys are terrible shooters or they have defective rifles wouldnt you think? Anyone here have a bren 2 Carbine that can share their 100 yard accuracy results? They're not precision rifles. 4 MOA ia 4" at 100 yards (obviously). Hitting 4 inches off in any direction when aiming center mass is still going to hit center mass. 4 MOA is about what you're going to get from a mil-spec M4, the Tavor and any number of other military issued rifles over the years. Now, maybe you think the price of the gun is too expensive if it's only capable of 4 MOA but that's a different discussion. I don't think it was reasonable to expect SCAR accuracy from a gun that costs $1,000 less. |
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Posted: 5/23/2020 8:04:55 PM EDT
[#3]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By JuanCarlos: Im seeing some more accuracy reports on the Cz Bren 2 Ms carbines. These guys are saying 4-6 MOA. They claimed the called Cz and that they were told 4 MOA is what to expect at 100 yards. That is terrible accuracy for a 16 " heavy barrel. That cant be right. One guy bought a new scope setup to rule out the optic. These guys have pics of their gun and the targets so I dont think they are trying just bash on the Bren because they are SCAR fanboys. Either these guys are terrible shooters or they have defective rifles wouldnt you think? Anyone here have a bren 2 Carbine that can share their 100 yard accuracy results? Guess I'm not seeing these reports anywhere. Have a link? |
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SC, USA
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Posted: 5/23/2020 8:14:51 PM EDT
[#4]
I get Scar accuracy from my 14" Bren 2 all day long with heavier loads. I sold my scars after getting my Bren 2 Pistols. I cant imagine 4 moa from this platform.
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USA
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Posted: 5/23/2020 8:23:43 PM EDT
[#5]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By 29212: I get Scar accuracy from my 14" Bren 2 all day long with heavier loads. I sold my scars after getting my Bren 2 Pistols. I cant imagine 4 moa from this platform. Agreed! |
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Posted: 5/23/2020 8:37:51 PM EDT
[#6]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By 29212: I get Scar accuracy from my 14" Bren 2 all day long with heavier loads. I sold my scars after getting my Bren 2 Pistols. I cant imagine 4 moa from this platform. I've also not ran into the accuracy issue claimed and cant seem to find these reports either. Maybe my googlefu is weak  |
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Posted: 5/23/2020 9:20:16 PM EDT
[#7]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By JuanCarlos: Im seeing some more accuracy reports on the Cz Bren 2 Ms carbines. These guys are saying 4-6 MOA. They claimed the called Cz and that they were told 4 MOA is what to expect at 100 yards. That is terrible accuracy for a 16 " heavy barrel. That cant be right. One guy bought a new scope setup to rule out the optic. These guys have pics of their gun and the targets so I dont think they are trying just bash on the Bren because they are SCAR fanboys. Either these guys are terrible shooters or they have defective rifles wouldnt you think? Anyone here have a bren 2 Carbine that can share their 100 yard accuracy results? Link? |
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SC, USA
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Posted: 5/23/2020 9:53:02 PM EDT
[#8]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By BisonWorld: Guess I'm not seeing these reports anywhere. Have a link? I found this: https://m.facebook.com/groups/160260951975034?view=permalink&id=165319434802519&ref=m_notif¬if_t=group_comment_mention |
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Posted: 5/24/2020 2:31:40 AM EDT
[#9]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By mk4dubbin: @mrozowjj BR stock assembly -15.3oz 807 carbine stock assembly -15.0oz I'm not sure what BR is and I'm confused on the numbering (I thought the Bren 2 was the 806) The ACR stock with adapter is 19oz so either way the factory option is 4 oz lighter so a 14.5in pistol turned into a rifle with a pin/welded with the factory stock is going to be about 8oz lighter than the carbine. I assume that's the extra handguard length and thicker barrel. |
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Posted: 5/24/2020 4:07:35 AM EDT
[#10]
BR = Battle Rifle, 308 version not yet imported.
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TX, USA
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Posted: 5/24/2020 4:38:43 AM EDT
[Last Edit: dSmith45]
[#11]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By BisonWorld: Figured I would go over my carbine build a little more in detail as promised. While not a personal fan of medium weight contoured barrels, they do look great dimpled.  ETA. Total weight loss from barrel rework was about 9 ounces, around 3.5 of that was from shortening down to 14.5 (barrel starts at ~16.9 in. from the breech face) Frank Proctor direct m-lok light mount also works just about perfect here for a low profile set up, though it is a bit of a pain to assemble on the angled sections due to the awkward angle your Allen key or screw driver ends up in when tightening down the screws. (Also needed to shave down the thickness of the pads on the mount a little ways as their height is slightly larger than the handguard wall thickness, believe about .010" here did the trick) https://www.AR15.Com/media/mediaFiles/299270/20200305_213645_jpg-1417128.JPG https://www.AR15.Com/media/mediaFiles/299270/20200305_213715_jpg-1417129.JPG https://www.AR15.Com/media/mediaFiles/299270/Resized_20200118_140825_jpeg-1417181.JPG After various accessories (HBI trigger and charging handle are fantastic upgrades I would highly recommend), optic, and flash light, whole set up ends up about 7lbs 6 ounces empty(no mag) took me me two days off and on but read all 44 pages  Bison, on your build, is that a Surefire Warcomp? What is your ATF length with this setup after cutting the barrel to 14.5? Did you have to adjust the gas regulation after trimming 2 inches of barrel (running non suppressed)? edit: reread some of your earlier posts and saw you machined the bolt carrier and had a custom spring made. If you didn't do all that do you think the gas port sizes would need to be changed? Same volume of gas hitting the port but dwell time decreased by 2 inches. General Q: Does the HBI QD socket plate sold with the pistol handguard fit this factory carbine handguard ? thx |
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WA, USA
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Posted: 5/24/2020 9:44:02 AM EDT
[#12]
waiting for someone with clout to actually talk trash about the bren. I haven't seen anything that says it shoots like a precision rifle
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OR, USA
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Posted: 5/24/2020 12:59:29 PM EDT
[#13]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Zeebz: Maybe everyone here knows already, but AT3 Tactical has a Bren 2 adapter for the SBT B&T brace: https://a3-tactical-inc.myshopify.com/collections/cz-bren-2-collection/products/b-t-stock-brace-adapter-bren-2 https://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/1161/7622/products/IMG_1678copy_1024x1024.jpg https://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/1161/7622/products/IMG_1675copy_1024x1024.jpg Great I just bought the Dan Haga rail. now I have to buy this one. |
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Posted: 5/24/2020 1:13:14 PM EDT
[Last Edit: BisonWorld]
[#14]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By dSmith45: took me me two days off and on but read all 44 pages Bison, on your build, is that a Surefire Warcomp? What is your ATF length with this setup after cutting the barrel to 14.5? Did you have to adjust the gas regulation after trimming 2 inches of barrel (running non suppressed)? edit: reread some of your earlier posts and saw you machined the bolt carrier and had a custom spring made. If you didn't do all that do you think the gas port sizes would need to be changed? Same volume of gas hitting the port but dwell time decreased by 2 inches. General Q: Does the HBI QD socket plate sold with the pistol handguard fit this factory carbine handguard ? thx Yes, surefire warcomp. Barrel was cut to ~14.55 from the breech face with a .625 threaded shank. Without diving into my safe for a measurement, it looks like a war comp has an OAL of 2.7 from their website. So my pin and weld is likely sitting at about 16.63 give or take .02" You would definitely need to adjust your gas system if you did a barrel chop without the other tweaks I made (or always shooting with a suppressor attached depending on the model might work). Unfortunately, simply adjusting the ports of your regulator would be inconsequential given the standard port size is already far larger than the barrel port, so you would need to open up the port on your barrel instead. I hesitate to give out exact specifications without first confirming the results myself though. (ETA, this is of course if just looking for an easy modification to the system. If you could get ahold of a gas regulator from an 8 inch gun or able to weld up and remove or modify the relief valve of your current regulator, a whole new set of options is available )In regards to the hbi QD plate, while I haven't confirmed it, I am led to believe it will work and have seen at least one picture of a gun set up as such. |
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Posted: 5/24/2020 1:15:44 PM EDT
[#15]
So far I am loving my Bren 11" 5.56. Zeroing with Wolf Gold was one ragged hole at 25 meters. I'll have to get it on paper at 100+ meters. I can easily hit gongs out to 300 meters with the Aimpoint PRO. Close to 1000 rounds all trouble free. Eats brass and the lacquered Russian crap. I am seriously thinking of SBRing this as I want the OEM folding stock. Sling is from the euro-militay site. Those guys rock. It shipped out Wednesday from Czech Republic and on my door step in Montana Friday @ 10:42am. Great service!
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Posted: 5/24/2020 4:53:42 PM EDT
[#16]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By mrozowjj: Thank you for the info. I'm not sure what BR is and I'm confused on the numbering (I thought the Bren 2 was the 806) The ACR stock with adapter is 19oz so either way the factory option is 4 oz lighter so a 14.5in pistol turned into a rifle with a pin/welded with the factory stock is going to be about 8oz lighter than the carbine. I assume that's the extra handguard length and thicker barrel. 807 carbine stock https://www.instagram.com/p/B9pAZg_hhH0/?igshid=j8txknjdowid BR stock https://www.instagram.com/p/BorU3VhH-7-/?igshid=a8ru1kuisl35 And I'm using the 807 nomenclature because that's what the tag on the bag from CZ had it labeled as |
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CZE
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Posted: 5/25/2020 1:01:28 PM EDT
[Last Edit: morho]
[#17]
Carbine EU version (apparently).
 https://www.armurerie-lavaux.com/article/CZ-BREN-2-MS-16.5-cal.223-Rem.html |
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MI, USA
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Posted: 5/25/2020 1:20:02 PM EDT
[Last Edit: Zeebz]
[#18]
Took my Bren 2 in 5.56 out today and torture tested it in dirt and sand to see how it did. I ran it along my Galil ACE. The Galil did considerably better. The Bren had a few FTF on the regular gas setting with sand on it. I put it on adverse and it had no issues until I literally packed sand on the ejection port, I had one stovepipe. But did another packing of sand over the port and ran 20 more rounds through it with no issues. Overall it did pretty well and especially so on adverse which is expected.
I know we'll likely never subject our guns to that type of environment but torture tests intrigue me so I wanted to see how it'd do. |
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FL, USA
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Posted: 5/25/2020 3:48:10 PM EDT
[Last Edit: Magsz18]
[#19]
Montuckyman,
What folding adapter are you using? How close to the receiver does it actually fold? |
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MO, USA
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Posted: 5/25/2020 4:04:43 PM EDT
[Last Edit: rlbuzz]
[#20]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By morho: Carbine EU version (apparently). https://www.armurerie-lavaux.com/images/produit/normal/1579107593_CZ_BREN_2_MS_16_right.jpg https://www.armurerie-lavaux.com/article/CZ-BREN-2-MS-16.5-cal.223-Rem.html I like the EU version better than the US version of the Bren 2. The hand guard is very similar in styling to the hand guard on the Bren 2 pistol. It probably doesn't have as many possibilities for mounting accessories, but it has enough. I also like the standard iron sights and the 3 pronged flash hider, as well as how the gas adjustment knob is more exposed. I've been thinking about buying the carbine but for some reason keep holding back because I'm not completely sold on the looks of the hand guard, but I'd buy that one in a minute if it were available in the US. |
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Posted: 5/25/2020 5:50:11 PM EDT
[#21]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By rlbuzz: I like the EU version better than the US version of the Bren 2. The hand guard is very similar in styling to the hand guard on the Bren 2 pistol. It probably doesn't have as many possibilities for mounting accessories, but it has enough. I also like the standard iron sights and the 3 pronged flash hider, as well as how the gas adjustment knob is more exposed. I've been thinking about buying the carbine but for some reason keep holding back because I'm not completely sold on the looks of the hand guard, but I'd buy that one in a minute if it were available in the US. Agreed |
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USA
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Posted: 5/25/2020 6:18:57 PM EDT
[#22]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By rlbuzz: I like the EU version better than the US version of the Bren 2. The hand guard is very similar in styling to the hand guard on the Bren 2 pistol. It probably doesn't have as many possibilities for mounting accessories, but it has enough. I also like the standard iron sights and the 3 pronged flash hider, as well as how the gas adjustment knob is more exposed. I've been thinking about buying the carbine but for some reason keep holding back because I'm not completely sold on the looks of the hand guard, but I'd buy that one in a minute if it were available in the US. That EU version looks perfect. Love it. |
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USA
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Posted: 5/25/2020 8:10:34 PM EDT
[#23]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Noctis: That EU version looks perfect. Love it. I'll be the odd man out here as I prefer the US version. I had the opportunity to try one two days ago and though I'm a big fan of the Galil Ace, I prefer the ergo's ( being a lefty ) and the aesthetics of this carbine. As soon as some more become available I'll be making that purchase. |
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FL, USA
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Posted: 5/25/2020 8:11:29 PM EDT
[#24]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By sgwlower: Agreed Agreed. I feel like CZUSA had a ton of those awful looking muzzle brakes sitting in their warehouse so they were like "well, we better get rid of these!". Also, 1900 bucks and you cant include iron sights? Granted, I tend to replace them but at 1900 dollars...what the hell? The cheaper pistols come with them, why isnt a more expensive gun coming ready to shoot out of the box? I guess that added barrel steel and handguard aluminum equate to 400 dollars worth or material? :P |
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USA
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Posted: 5/25/2020 9:10:59 PM EDT
[#25]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By morho: Carbine EU version (apparently). https://www.armurerie-lavaux.com/images/produit/normal/1579107593_CZ_BREN_2_MS_16_right.jpg https://www.armurerie-lavaux.com/article/CZ-BREN-2-MS-16.5-cal.223-Rem.html Nice. Don't know why they felt the need to bastardize the US model. |
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PA, USA
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Posted: 5/25/2020 10:03:33 PM EDT
[#26]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Magsz18: Agreed. I feel like CZUSA had a ton of those awful looking muzzle brakes sitting in their warehouse so they were like "well, we better get rid of these!". Also, 1900 bucks and you cant include iron sights? Granted, I tend to replace them but at 1900 dollars...what the hell? The cheaper pistols come with them, why isnt a more expensive gun coming ready to shoot out of the box? I guess that added barrel steel and handguard aluminum equate to 400 dollars worth or material? :P Technically only $200 more. MSRP of pistols are 1799, while carbine is 1999. But, still I agree. |
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Posted: 5/25/2020 11:31:44 PM EDT
[#27]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Master_Blaster: Nice. Don't know why they felt the need to bastardize the US model. Well technically the EU version is an additional 9 ounces heavier than the US one, (having played with it I can tell you the weight spec on that website is way off) so that is probably at least one of the reasons they changed it
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CZE
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Posted: 5/26/2020 2:00:29 AM EDT
[#28]
Quote HistoryWell technically the EU version is an additional 9 ounces heavier than the US one How come? CZ-USA carbine description is 7.3 lbs, that French site says 2.98 kg ~ 6.6 lbs. |
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USA
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Posted: 5/26/2020 4:46:13 AM EDT
[#29]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By BisonWorld: Well technically the EU version is an additional 9 ounces heavier than the US one, (having played with it I can tell you the weight spec on that website is way off) so that is probably at least one of the reasons they changed it Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By BisonWorld: Originally Posted By Master_Blaster: Nice. Don't know why they felt the need to bastardize the US model. Well technically the EU version is an additional 9 ounces heavier than the US one, (having played with it I can tell you the weight spec on that website is way off) so that is probably at least one of the reasons they changed it I don't think the difference would be a nonstarter for most. 7.3# is still lighter than the 805. They've almost made it a different rifle. Gun companies make me scratch my head with some of their decisions. "Hey, I know: let's start up a new line & then switch things up & disown it 6 months later like we never knew it existed while we move on to something else. Wash/rinse/repeat. Shazam!" Sig & Beretta are the mac daddy kings of this strategy. |
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TX, USA
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Posted: 5/26/2020 9:09:36 AM EDT
[#30]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Master_Blaster: I don't think the difference would be a nonstarter for most. 7.3# is still lighter than the 805. They've almost made it a different rifle. Gun companies make me scratch my head with some of their decisions. "Hey, I know: let's start up a new line & then switch things up & disown it 6 months later like we never knew it existed while we move on to something else. Wash/rinse/repeat. Shazam!" Sig & Beretta are the mac daddy kings of this strategy. They all learned it from Apple. 
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SC, USA
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Posted: 5/26/2020 9:33:26 AM EDT
[#31]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Zeebz: Took my Bren 2 in 5.56 out today and torture tested it in dirt and sand to see how it did. I ran it along my Galil ACE. The Galil did considerably better. The Bren had a few FTF on the regular gas setting with sand on it. I put it on adverse and it had no issues until I literally packed sand on the ejection port, I had one stovepipe. But did another packing of sand over the port and ran 20 more rounds through it with no issues. Overall it did pretty well and especially so on adverse which is expected. I know we'll likely never subject our guns to that type of environment but torture tests intrigue me so I wanted to see how it'd do. Galil Ace is way over gassed. Bren 2 gives you the best of both worlds with an adverse setting that can be easily switched over in 2 seconds if you are operating in sandy or muddy conditions. It does excellent in sand and mud. Ive tested the hell out of the Bren 2 and the P-10 side by side with many other weapons such as the mk18, ace, sig 556xi, sks, ak47, glock 19, walther ppq, scar 16, etc...One week the bren 2 and the P-10 powers through like its nothing and then the next time it has a few hicups. but never fails to where it cant get back into fight quickly. Especially after turning on adverse gas setting. Almost all the others struggle all the time. The galil trigger doesnt reset most of the time causing the issues and the sig 556xi ak47 and glock die nearly every time with mud and lock up and cant get going with out rinsing in water. The best performers were the Bren 2, Cz P-10, Walther PPQ and Mk18. Scar 16 does ok but not great. These tests though show that some brands die every time and some chug along and get back in the fight quickly. If you test the Bren 2 and the ace again you will get different results and then different the next time as well. On average the Bren 2 will do better. Especially if you put on adverse to start with. Bren 2 is excellent platform that will serve you well in any condition. Do a series of test with the Bren 2 and the ace and youll see that the Bren will beat any other platform 4 out of 5 times. :) |
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Posted: 5/26/2020 10:29:46 AM EDT
[#32]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Master_Blaster: I don't think the difference would be a nonstarter for most. 7.3# is still lighter than the 805. They've almost made it a different rifle. Gun companies make me scratch my head with some of their decisions. "Hey, I know: let's start up a new line & then switch things up & disown it 6 months later like we never knew it existed while we move on to something else. Wash/rinse/repeat. Shazam!" Sig & Beretta are the mac daddy kings of this strategy. Think I may not have explained that well. The US carbine empty weighs in at ~7lbs. 3 ounces ( no idea where the the .3 came from) The EU carbine empty weighs in at ~7lbs 13 ounces. Personally I appreciate the effort to at least attempt to meet the weight expectations with the US version. |
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Posted: 5/26/2020 10:49:40 AM EDT
[#33]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By morho: Carbine EU version (apparently). https://www.armurerie-lavaux.com/images/produit/normal/1579107593_CZ_BREN_2_MS_16_right.jpg https://www.armurerie-lavaux.com/article/CZ-BREN-2-MS-16.5-cal.223-Rem.html I don't understand CZ's desire to try and "Americanize" everything? |
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Posted: 5/26/2020 12:47:58 PM EDT
[#34]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By tifosi: Definitely like this handguard better, and of course the spiral FH. I don't understand CZ's desire to try and "Americanize" everything? Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By tifosi: Originally Posted By morho: Carbine EU version (apparently). https://www.armurerie-lavaux.com/images/produit/normal/1579107593_CZ_BREN_2_MS_16_right.jpg https://www.armurerie-lavaux.com/article/CZ-BREN-2-MS-16.5-cal.223-Rem.html I don't understand CZ's desire to try and "Americanize" everything? Hmm, so the EU handguard is a hair shorter and has a mini pic-rail at the front. Some lightening cuts along the top. That it? I'd call it a wash myself. I like the lightening cuts but the extra MLOK is probably more useful. Not a fan of the baby cheese grater though, they make mini rails for MLOK as well as MLOK bipod mounts. I'd happily take either verson though. 
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Posted: 5/26/2020 1:44:27 PM EDT
[#35]
Don't care, want BR.
 I love shooting the BREN 2 MS pistol, just really need to put a dot on it. The factory flip up sights are OK, but the front post white dot ends up facing away from me when sighted in. 
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MI, USA
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Posted: 5/26/2020 2:05:31 PM EDT
[#36]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By armoredman: Don't care, want BR. I love shooting the BREN 2 MS pistol, just really need to put a dot on it. The factory flip up sights are OK, but the front post white dot ends up facing away from me when sighted in. I cannot wait for the BR. That is one gun I want more than just about anything. I'll pay MSRP for it at this point, I don't care. |
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TX, USA
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Posted: 5/26/2020 2:14:37 PM EDT
[#37]
Just ordered a Bren 2 11'' 5.56. I am looking to have the off setting on the gas regulator drilled for a smooth shooting suppressor setting. I will be using a normal/high back pressure can (Griffin M4SDK) What is the optimal port size for this application? Has anyone figured this out yet?
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Posted: 5/26/2020 3:43:39 PM EDT
[#38]
Originally Posted By morho: Carbine EU version (apparently). https://www.armurerie-lavaux.com/images/produit/normal/1579107593_CZ_BREN_2_MS_16_right.jpg https://www.armurerie-lavaux.com/article/CZ-BREN-2-MS-16.5-cal.223-Rem.html Originally Posted By Master_Blaster: Nice. Don't know why they felt the need to bastardize the US model. I really like the EU version - I wonder if the handguards are interchangeable and if CZ would sell the EU handguard as a replacement? |
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USA
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Posted: 5/26/2020 4:02:10 PM EDT
[Last Edit: Master_Blaster]
[#39]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By rw66: I really like the EU version - I wonder if the handguards are interchangeable and if CZ would sell the EU handguard as a replacement? I would wager so. It's the same receiver with a different HG. It appears that the US version omits the inverted "bridge" piece that bolts to the underside of the barrel/gas block, which I thought the "original" Euro variant HG setup has, or had. Probably worth tapping CS.  ETA, I'd look into it. The original version is more pleasing to my eye. |
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PA, USA
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Posted: 5/26/2020 4:32:32 PM EDT
[#40]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Razorcore: Just ordered a Bren 2 11'' 5.56. I am looking to have the off setting on the gas regulator drilled for a smooth shooting suppressor setting. I will be using a normal/high back pressure can (Griffin M4SDK) What is the optimal port size for this application? Has anyone figured this out yet? If it was mine, I'd start out at 0.6 mm or 0.7 mm. Can always go bigger, cant go smaller. |
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Posted: 5/26/2020 5:21:33 PM EDT
[#41]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By balthezor: If it was mine, I'd start out at 0.6 mm or 0.7 mm. Can always go bigger, cant go smaller.
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USA
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Posted: 5/26/2020 5:22:25 PM EDT
[#42]
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U86Es3df3rQ
Cz Bren 2 Continues to impress! |
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Posted: 5/26/2020 7:47:53 PM EDT
[#43]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Magsz18: Montuckyman, What folding adapter are you using? How close to the receiver does it actually fold? This one. It sits pretty close to the receiver. You can configure it to fold either side. https://www.sb-tactical.com/product/btfa-buffer-tube-folding-adapter/ |
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Posted: 5/26/2020 7:59:19 PM EDT
[#44]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Master_Blaster: I would wager so. It's the same receiver with a different HG. It appears that the US version omits the inverted "bridge" piece that bolts to the underside of the barrel/gas block, which I thought the "original" Euro variant Hg setup has, or had. Probably worth tapping CS. https://media.nagelsguns.net/wp-content/uploads/2020/04/09182937/CZBren2MsCarbineRWeb.jpg https://www.armurerie-lavaux.com/images/produit/normal/1579107593_CZ_BREN_2_MS_16_right.jpg ETA, I'd look into it. The original version is more pleasing to my eye. Yes, they would be interchangeable. Just need the 2x side plates, hand guard upper piece, handguard lower piece, front U mount, rear U mount, front sling attachment bracket, 2x barrel mounting screw, 2x nord lock washers, 3x m5 screws long, and 6x m5 screws short + 1 quart of lock tight to install to factory standards
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MO, USA
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Posted: 5/26/2020 8:09:24 PM EDT
[#45]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By rw66: I really like the EU version - I wonder if the handguards are interchangeable and if CZ would sell the EU handguard as a replacement? I was thinking the same thing, but as slow as CZ is with coming out with 922 parts and replacement parts in general for the Bren 2, I wouldn't hold my breath. It might be possible in the future to secure the EU hand guard through some place like the Euro-Military website, but (I'm just guessing) if you replace the hand guard with a foreign made hand guard you will probably have to find another foreign made part and replace it with a US made part to rebalance the ratio of US made to foreign made parts. It's not that the US version is bad, but I see no reason for the changes unless they were necessary to get more US made parts into the build to make importation easier. I guess the 922r regulation has good intentions behind it, but it sure can complicate things and sometimes, like in the case of the Bren 2, make us wind up with a version that is less desirable than what is available in other countries. |
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Posted: 5/26/2020 9:07:52 PM EDT
[Last Edit: BisonWorld]
[#46]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By rlbuzz: I was thinking the same thing, but as slow as CZ is with coming out with 922 parts and replacement parts in general for the Bren 2, I wouldn't hold my breath. It might be possible in the future to secure the EU hand guard through some place like the Euro-Military website, but (I'm just guessing) if you replace the hand guard with a foreign made hand guard you will probably have to find another foreign made part and replace it with a US made part to rebalance the ratio of US made to foreign made parts. It's not that the US version is bad, but I see no reason for the changes unless they were necessary to get more US made parts into the build to make importation easier. I guess the 922r regulation has good intentions behind it, but it sure can complicate things and sometimes, like in the case of the Bren 2, make us wind up with a version that is less desirable than what is available in other countries. Still not exactly sure why a heavier, less rigid, more complex, and less modular version that gets hotter much quicker would be considered more desirable than the US version, but I guess people like what they like. |
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Posted: 5/26/2020 10:05:44 PM EDT
[Last Edit: YoungPatriot]
[#47]
Questions for all here about the Bren 2 MS design —
I noticed from installation of the HBI replacement Hand guards (which look really nice btw), that the barrel unit on the Bren 2 appears to be held into the receiver area by just 4 screws. For those with rifles in hand, is that correct? Are there any locking features that transfer the stress of operation on parts other than the screws themselves? I’m not an engineer by any stretch, but if correct that the screws hold the barrel in, does this give anyone concern about long term durability or safer issues with head spacing over time or if one more of the screws vibrates loose? Are the Scar or other proven weapons similarly designed without any issue? Overall the rifle looks awesome but I’m curious to hear thoughts from those here who are more knowledgeable about this stuff than myself. Thanks. |
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Posted: 5/26/2020 10:48:22 PM EDT
[Last Edit: BisonWorld]
[#48]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By YoungPatriot: Questions for all here about the Bren 2 MS design — I noticed from installation of the HBI replacement Hand guards (which look really nice btw), that the barrel unit on the Bren 2 appears to be held into the receiver area by just 4 screws. For those with rifles in hand, is that correct? Are there any locking features that transfer the stress of operation on parts other than the screws themselves? I’m not an engineer by any stretch, but if correct that the screws hold the barrel in, does this give anyone concern about long term durability or safer issues with head spacing over time or if one more of the screws vibrates loose? Are the Scar or other proven weapons similarly designed without any issue? Overall the rifle looks awesome but I’m curious to hear thoughts from those here who are more knowledgeable about this stuff than myself. Thanks. Yes, the barrel is retained via the 4 mounting screws, this is true regardless of bren 2 version. (On the ms pistols the additional 2 retain the rear U block for the pistol handguard rather than the barrel, in the 2s the forward 2 screws retain the front U block for the bottom rail) This retention method is similar to that used on a variety of models such as the SCAR models, the original 805, the B&T APC, the recently adopted by Japan Howa type 20, and the MSBS Grot off the top of my head. Some of these add an additional screw, but overall it's the same concept. With guns like the grot, acr, mcx, etc. typically there isnt much of a difference in the practical nature of attachment, rather their barrel extension could simply be considered to have been separated into 2 pieces with a trunion being pressed, screwed, and/or pinned into the receiver and the barrel assembly then being clamped or screwed into this trunion. Headspace is determined by the barrel extension which is fixed to the barrel as part of the barrel assembly, these 2 components are never disassembled from each other during any level of take down and could be considered all but permanently affixed. so there is no worry of it going out of headspace. Location is based on precision drilled holes, a very close fitting internal mounting channel and quite a large amount of clamping force provided by the barrel screws pulling the mounting plates against the receiver and then in turn the receiver against the barrel. Screws are prevented from backing out on the bren2 design by the use of nordlock washers under the mounting screws. These washers are extremely effective as far as solutions go for resisting loosening due to vibration and thermal cycling. Though if removing a barrel assembly multiple times, I would certainly recommend inspecting the teeth of the washer to insure they have not worn down to an unsuitable degree as they are not infinite use. The underside of the barrel mounting screws can also become exceedingly worn after multiple installations and removals and both screws and washers should be replaced when this occurs. |
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Posted: 5/26/2020 10:50:55 PM EDT
[#49]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By YoungPatriot: Questions for all here about the Bren 2 MS design — I noticed from installation of the HBI replacement Hand guards (which look really nice btw), that the barrel unit on the Bren 2 appears to be held into the receiver area by just 4 screws. For those with rifles in hand, is that correct? Are there any locking features that transfer the stress of operation on parts other than the screws themselves? I’m not an engineer by any stretch, but if correct that the screws hold the barrel in, does this give anyone concern about long term durability or safer issues with head spacing over time or if one more of the screws vibrates loose? Are the Scar or other proven weapons similarly designed without any issue? Overall the rifle looks awesome but I’m curious to hear thoughts from those here who are more knowledgeable about this stuff than myself. Thanks. The barrel block slides into a channel inside the receiver, which itself is a pretty tight fit. Once it is secure in the channel, it is held in place by 6 screws: 2 on the bottom, then 2 on each side. The captive cross pin that connects the lower receiver to the upper receive also goes through the barrel block. |
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Posted: 5/26/2020 11:03:53 PM EDT
[Last Edit: BisonWorld]
[#50]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Zeebz: The barrel block slides into a channel inside the receiver, which itself is a pretty tight fit. Once it is secure in the channel, it is held in place by 6 screws: 2 on the bottom, then 2 on each side. The captive cross pin that connects the lower receiver to the upper receive also goes through the barrel block. No bottom screws on the hbi or cz carbine handguards. Those 2 bottom screws primarily act only to retain the bottom rail of the MS pistols and 2S versions given the manufacturing of the receiver necessitates an open bottom. The forward take down pin simply attaches the lower to the barrel extension (which is bolted into the upper) but doesnt really impact the receiver's rention of the barrel assembly. |
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