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Free SBR stamp? (Page 17 of 17)
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Link Posted: 6/17/2024 6:21:31 PM EDT
[Last Edit: a390st] [#1]
I'm sure the pending submissions will set until all the lawsuits are done, at which time they will be closed out without approval.  However, there is some degree of inequity if in fact the approved applications are let stand and other applications submitted complete and accurate by the advertised deadline are not processed.  That is if the unapproved pending applicants argue that it was within the purview of the  AG to forbear the tax, they made a valid submission, and others received a benefit they were denied.  It will be interesting to see how the whole situation plays out.
Link Posted: 6/17/2024 8:17:42 PM EDT
[#2]
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Originally Posted By 3-gun:
I agree, if you have an approved form 1 it’s done, but I don’t think they can or will approve what is pending.
But who knows about the fatf. I’m sure they will try again but the problem is the long paper trail they have from prior approvals.
View Quote


I believe the Judge called the ATF attempts to backtrack "arbitrary and capricious."
Link Posted: 6/17/2024 9:47:00 PM EDT
[#3]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By a390st:
I'm sure the pending submissions will set until all the lawsuits are done, at which time they will be closed out without approval.  However, there is some degree of inequity if in fact the approved applications are let stand and other applications submitted complete and accurate by the advertised deadline are not processed.  That is if the unapproved pending applicants argue that it was within the purview of the  AG to forbear the tax, they made a valid submission, and others received a benefit they were denied.  It will be interesting to see how the whole situation plays out.
View Quote

Interesting, haven’t thought about it that way. But you’re correct about the AJ having the authority to waive it.
It may be better for them to go ahead and approve them while they decide what to do next.
Link Posted: 6/17/2024 9:59:47 PM EDT
[#4]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By a390st:
I'm sure the pending submissions will set until all the lawsuits are done, at which time they will be closed out without approval.  However, there is some degree of inequity if in fact the approved applications are let stand and other applications submitted complete and accurate by the advertised deadline are not processed.  That is if the unapproved pending applicants argue that it was within the purview of the  AG to forbear the tax, they made a valid submission, and others received a benefit they were denied.  It will be interesting to see how the whole situation plays out.
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Kinda what I have been saying, more or less.
Link Posted: 7/9/2024 9:56:48 AM EDT
[Last Edit: durtychemist] [#5]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By a390st:
I'm sure the pending submissions will set until all the lawsuits are done, at which time they will be closed out without approval.  However, there is some degree of inequity if in fact the approved applications are let stand and other applications submitted complete and accurate by the advertised deadline are not processed.  That is if the unapproved pending applicants argue that it was within the purview of the  AG to forbear the tax, they made a valid submission, and others received a benefit they were denied.  It will be interesting to see how the whole situation plays out.
View Quote


Why would they approve pending forms for a rule the courts essentially knocked down?

“Hey..here is your free approved form for a rule the courts determined is invalid.” Or whatever they decided.


Edit: the forms were approved only if the final rule was approved.  The final rule was not approved.  The pending applications will sit while the rest of the folks with the “approved pending final rule” do nothing. There isn’t a judge who is going to make the ATF convert the approved tax free forms to full SBR approvals. Pending or not, the final rule isn’t approved or removed so it’s a giant nothing burger at this point.
Link Posted: 7/9/2024 2:01:15 PM EDT
[#6]
I’m still not sure what you said.
Link Posted: 7/9/2024 2:08:09 PM EDT
[Last Edit: crazyelece] [#7]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By durtychemist:
the forms were approved only if the final rule was approved.  The final rule was not approved. There isn’t a judge who is going to make the ATF convert the approved tax free forms to full SBR approvals
View Quote


That's not how any of this works.

The "approved" forms are just that - approved. They are officially title 2 SBRs. The conditions were on the tax exempt part, not the SBR part. There is no "conversion" needed. Tax exempt forms are processed all the time, there is nothing unique about that.

ETA: quote doesn't appear to work, maybe it will later as it shows in preview.
Link Posted: 7/16/2024 9:08:54 PM EDT
[#8]
Has the ATF appealed the decision in Mock v Garland?  They still list the factoring criteria on their website.  Seems to me that they must be appealing, otherwise they should remove the rule and update their site to include guidance to people who registered their FreeBR.  I agree with those here that say it's registered regardless of the rule and thus legal to put a proper stock or VFG on, but I think the ATF would owe a duty to citizens to also inform them that per the court's ruling, the firearm is not considered to be governed by Title 2 if configured without a stock or VFG.  I think that logically that must be the case even though conventional wisdom is that a SBR cannot return to being a pistol but could return to being a Title 1 rifle due to the fact that if left unchanged with a brace, it was never made as a rifle, SBR or otherwise.

caveat:  I'm not a lawyer, YMMV, and I intended to actually use the tax exempt pistol braced registrations as SBRs, so this is purely a thought exercise for me.
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