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Posted: 6/4/2022 12:52:19 PM EDT
[#1]
Thank God we are (mostly) free to pursue our own happiness.
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Posted: 6/4/2022 12:54:03 PM EDT
[#2]
Quote HistoryQuoted: So he wants the solution that the communists choose. We are fucked. |
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Posted: 6/4/2022 12:58:21 PM EDT
[#3]
Maybe they should offering housing in factories like they do in china. You get a 50sq ft cube to sleep in, and shared kitchen and bathrooms.
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Posted: 6/4/2022 12:59:32 PM EDT
[#4]
I travel to Moab for real estate work occasionally. Homes are going crazy down there, and they have a real problem. It's a seasonal tourist economy. An RV parking space recently listed for $250k down there. The McDonalds is hiring for $18.50/hr.
The issue is most of the service jobs down there that support the influx of tourists for half the year aren't worth paying $100k salary. You simply aren't going to make that as a gas station clerk, cashier at a souvenir shop selling T shirts, cleaning hotel rooms, or washing dishes at one of the many restaurants. But you can't buy even a very modest home down there unless you make 6 figures. I've heard some people that commute over an hour from Green River to work in restaurants in Moab. Homes are much cheaper in Green River, but that commute is not going to work out with gas prices today. I don't know if the solution is dense apartments, but you have to have somewhere to put the low income people you need to make everything in town run for the rich people who come to stay in their summer homes there, and all the tourists who line up in cars for half a mile to get into Arches. It's either make some cheap places to live or start paying bus boys and car wash attendants enough to afford to buy houses there. What other option is there? |
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Posted: 6/4/2022 1:03:09 PM EDT
[#5]
What if I told you that you don't have to live in Steamboat Springs?
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Posted: 6/4/2022 1:08:13 PM EDT
[#6]
The funny thing is that the suburban zoning people get just as upset with small lot single family as they do with apartments. Put (12) 800 SF houses on a 30,000 SF lot in a city and they get vapor lock just the same as if they shared walls.
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Posted: 6/4/2022 1:10:06 PM EDT
[#7]
Kruschevkas. That is the obvious solution. Maybe call them Bidenkas this time.
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Posted: 6/4/2022 1:12:56 PM EDT
[#8]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I travel to Moab for real estate work occasionally. Homes are going crazy down there, and they have a real problem. It's a seasonal tourist economy. An RV parking space recently listed for $250k down there. The McDonalds is hiring for $18.50/hr. The issue is most of the service jobs down there that support the influx of tourists for half the year aren't worth paying $100k salary. You simply aren't going to make that as a gas station clerk, cashier at a souvenir shop selling T shirts, cleaning hotel rooms, or washing dishes at one of the many restaurants. But you can't buy even a very modest home down there unless you make 6 figures. I've heard some people that commute over an hour from Green River to work in restaurants in Moab. Homes are much cheaper in Green River, but that commute is not going to work out with gas prices today. I don't know if the solution is dense apartments, but you have to have somewhere to put the low income people you need to make everything in town run for the rich people who come to stay in their summer homes there, and all the tourists who line up in cars for half a mile to get into Arches. It's either make some cheap places to live or start paying bus boys and car wash attendants enough to afford to buy houses there. What other option is there? Hilton Head Island has the same issues. The jobs pay better on the island, but the rent is higher too. The only solution is for the people working those jobs to live off island and fight traffic every day as they commute. They can’t afford to live on the island. |
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Posted: 6/4/2022 1:18:50 PM EDT
[#9]
Quote HistoryQuoted: "Gentrification" it's bad enough with your evil gated communities acreages are evil, you hear me? E-V-I-L-!-!-! Oh, yeah. Yuppies in Richmond are buying in blighted areas, fixing up and becoming neighborhoods again. Of course, the indigents hate this and call it 'gentrification', trying to find a way to stop it through ordinances, zoning, whatever. At the same time, VCU is constantly expanding toward the worst areas from the west and from the east, eradicating the worst neighborhoods and most blighted commercial areas. All in all, its a lovely situation! As far as Steamboat Springs and similar places, if the 'poors' can't afford single-family residences, let them eat cake! They can move somewhere else where they can afford to live. Why does anyone think they are entitled to live in a resort town with sky-high real estate? The best system in the world for promoting success is being destroyed by 'fairness'. If your standard of living is lower than you'd like, get your ass in gear and better yourself! My own son was a drifter at 35 - then he saw the light, went back to school and is now a tenured teacher. |
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Posted: 6/4/2022 1:20:00 PM EDT
[#10]
Quote HistoryQuoted: As far as Steamboat Springs and similar places, if the 'poors' can't afford single-family residences, let them eat cake! They can move somewhere else where they can afford to live. Why does anyone think they are entitled to live in a resort town with sky-high real estate? The best system in the world for promoting success is being destroyed by 'fairness'. If your standard of living is lower than you'd like, get your ass in gear and better yourself! My own son was a drifter at 35 - then he saw the light, went back to school and is now a tenured teacher. So your son bettered himself right into a job that still doesn't pay enough to live where he works? |
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Posted: 6/4/2022 1:31:36 PM EDT
[#11]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Kruschevkas. That is the obvious solution. Maybe call them Bidenkas this time. That's not really a proposal that anyone is looking at, except anti-market fake conservatives looking to slay an easy straw man. |
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Posted: 6/4/2022 1:37:14 PM EDT
[#12]
The author of that article can suck my entire dick. Shaft, tip, and the balls.
Fucking commies won’t rest until we are all in government housing. |
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Posted: 6/4/2022 1:43:08 PM EDT
[#13]
Mountain tourist towns have a solution for the seasonal help. The workers live in their cars or in plywood shacks semi hidden behind the resorts or on a street a couple of blocks from the main thoroughfares.
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Posted: 6/4/2022 1:45:37 PM EDT
[#14]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Maybe they should offering housing in factories like they do in china. You get a 50sq ft cube to sleep in, and shared kitchen and bathrooms. 
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Posted: 6/4/2022 1:45:39 PM EDT
[#15]
Marxists need to end their love affair with dictating to people how they may live.
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Posted: 6/4/2022 1:48:08 PM EDT
[#16]
Quote HistoryQuoted: That is not the impression I get from reading the Bible, there are a lot of great planners and administrators in there, from Joseph, to David, Solomon, Daniel, to Nehemiah, just to name some prominent ones. Using wisdom to guide the construction of a settlement isn't anti-God, and it is a common thing that many of the founding fathers of this country did when they set up a city too. The city I live has mostly non-existent master planning and it is causing us a lot of headaches as we grow. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: City planners are just central planning authoritarians with smaller budgets than national politicians and bureaucrats. They are inherently evil. I try to avoid them. I'll go one further: I'll go so far as to state that the Bible teaches this. In Genesis 4 we see two branches of men - one that began to build cities (4:17), one that began to 'call on the name of the Lord' (4:26). This seems like an innocuous distinction barely mentioned in passing, but it reveals two mindsets: one (Seth) that lives by faith (and may well become part of a community - I'm not saying settlement is bad, I'm saying the conceit of thinking you can centrally plan settlement is bad). The other, Cain, rather than living by faith, begins to build its own institutions, and trusts in those institutions. The institutions become a god, of sorts. Of course, this 'god 'fails (Babel being the prime example, though all great secular cities/nations eventually fail) and usually takes a few million people with it. That is not the impression I get from reading the Bible, there are a lot of great planners and administrators in there, from Joseph, to David, Solomon, Daniel, to Nehemiah, just to name some prominent ones. Using wisdom to guide the construction of a settlement isn't anti-God, and it is a common thing that many of the founding fathers of this country did when they set up a city too. The city I live has mostly non-existent master planning and it is causing us a lot of headaches as we grow. See the part in bold. That's where I agreed with you in advance. Not all planning is bad. Godless 'I am smart; I will make a city where other people do what I tell them and it'll be great!' is what I'm talking about. God-fearing people can make plans, but do so with a humility that recognizes they aren't perfect and aren't smarter than everyone else because they grasp the old economic calculation problem - they know they can't fully understand what other people truly want without leaving the market free for people to show what they really want. So they don't force us all into one flavor of deodorant or potato chips like Bernie Sanders wanted. |
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Posted: 6/4/2022 1:55:06 PM EDT
[#17]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Pretty sure steamboat (like all of those shitty liberal mountain towns ) needs low cost workers to service the wealthy people vacationing there Despite food and gas being double what it is off the mountains wages remain pretty much the same…. Where are those people gonna live? Company housing? |
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Posted: 6/4/2022 1:56:51 PM EDT
[#18]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I travel to Moab for real estate work occasionally. Homes are going crazy down there, and they have a real problem. It's a seasonal tourist economy. An RV parking space recently listed for $250k down there. The McDonalds is hiring for $18.50/hr. The issue is most of the service jobs down there that support the influx of tourists for half the year aren't worth paying $100k salary. You simply aren't going to make that as a gas station clerk, cashier at a souvenir shop selling T shirts, cleaning hotel rooms, or washing dishes at one of the many restaurants. But you can't buy even a very modest home down there unless you make 6 figures. I've heard some people that commute over an hour from Green River to work in restaurants in Moab. Homes are much cheaper in Green River, but that commute is not going to work out with gas prices today. I don't know if the solution is dense apartments, but you have to have somewhere to put the low income people you need to make everything in town run for the rich people who come to stay in their summer homes there, and all the tourists who line up in cars for half a mile to get into Arches. It's either make some cheap places to live or start paying bus boys and car wash attendants enough to afford to buy houses there. What other option is there? |
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Posted: 6/4/2022 1:59:16 PM EDT
[#19]
Communists sharing communist ideas. Shocking.
Housing in my area is expensive because it's so damn expensive to get permits before you even start to build. It's compounded by the lack of buildable land caused by terrible land use laws. Low interest rates and high demand drove prices for a remodeled 50s bungalow on a 5000 sq ft lot to over $500k. Rent is sky high on a house. Apartment rent is also sky high because of demand and made worse from all the HUD vouchers artificially inflating the price. All created by government mismanagement. |
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Posted: 6/4/2022 1:59:56 PM EDT
[#20]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Mega City One, come to a neighborhood near you soon. ETA: Beat by 13 seconds. https://www.scifibloggers.com/wp-content/uploads/dredd-mega-city-one.jpg Great movie. 
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Posted: 6/4/2022 2:02:00 PM EDT
[#21]
One of my happiest days was when we bought out first home and I never had to share a wall again. I was 32. Then we bought what I consider our dream house in our early 40s i would rather live in a crappy trailer than an apartment of any kind.
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Posted: 6/4/2022 2:02:10 PM EDT
[#22]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Communists sharing communist ideas. Shocking. Quote HistoryQuoted: Communists sharing communist ideas. Shocking. This is the "Marxists want to deregulate the housing markets whereas us real conservatives know that we need rules and regulations to give the people what they want through democratic control of the means of production" argument. It doesn't work if you apply even the tiniest amount of critical thinking. People want to buy something and your solution is to use the government to stop them in the name of freedom. Quoted: Housing in my area is expensive because it's so damn expensive to get permits before you even start to build. It's compounded by the lack of buildable land caused by terrible land use laws. Low interest rates and high demand drove prices for a remodeled 50s bungalow on a 5000 sq ft lot to over $500k. Rent is sky high on a house. Apartment rent is also sky high because of demand and made worse from all the HUD vouchers artificially inflating the price. All created by government mismanagement. What do you think our housing market should look like? |
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Posted: 6/4/2022 2:02:33 PM EDT
[#23]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Sounds like there is massive demand not being met for some reason, and you want to freaking *TIGHTEN* zoning!? Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Sounds like they know what the problem is. So they’re going to build more apartments, only for the same investors swoop in and turn them into AirBnbs? AirBnbs are a plague in lots of places. We have areas down here where hundreds of properties have been scooped up and turned into short-term rentals. Results are the same complaints about skyrocketing costs for the working-class. I don’t know the solution as “muh free country”, besides stricter zoning. I personally know folks who settled in nice neighborhoods only to have the house next door turned into a kind of hotel/party house. Sounds like there is massive demand not being met for some reason, and you want to freaking *TIGHTEN* zoning!? The massive demand is not for people living in these areas though, but for Airbnb amateur “hoteliers”and their customers. People vacationing and figuring they can get a better deal renting Bob’s 1500 sq ft 3br second home for a weekend rather than staying at the Hilton downtown. And sure, it makes the owners/landlords just as much if not more to rent an Airbnb for a couple weekends a month rather than deal with a FT tenant. But I’ve seen single zip codes where houses that are Airbnb/Vrbos number in the hundreds. These areas never built up with the expectation that this much of the liveable inventory would wind up being not much more than hotel rooms. |
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Posted: 6/4/2022 2:04:17 PM EDT
[#24]
Quote HistoryQuoted: A lot of Americans want that lifestyle. Look at this thread. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: At a minimum we need to stop forcing and subsidizing Suburban, rural, car transportation living on everyone. It's really been a plague on us. A lot of Americans want that lifestyle. Look at this thread. They aren't real Americans in this thread. They are fucking communists. |
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Posted: 6/4/2022 2:06:31 PM EDT
[#25]
They want you to live in soviet buildings
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Posted: 6/4/2022 2:08:29 PM EDT
[#26]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Hilton Head Island has the same issues. The jobs pay better on the island, but the rent is higher too. The only solution is for the people working those jobs to live off island and fight traffic every day as they commute. They can’t afford to live on the island. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: I travel to Moab for real estate work occasionally. Homes are going crazy down there, and they have a real problem. It's a seasonal tourist economy. An RV parking space recently listed for $250k down there. The McDonalds is hiring for $18.50/hr. The issue is most of the service jobs down there that support the influx of tourists for half the year aren't worth paying $100k salary. You simply aren't going to make that as a gas station clerk, cashier at a souvenir shop selling T shirts, cleaning hotel rooms, or washing dishes at one of the many restaurants. But you can't buy even a very modest home down there unless you make 6 figures. I've heard some people that commute over an hour from Green River to work in restaurants in Moab. Homes are much cheaper in Green River, but that commute is not going to work out with gas prices today. I don't know if the solution is dense apartments, but you have to have somewhere to put the low income people you need to make everything in town run for the rich people who come to stay in their summer homes there, and all the tourists who line up in cars for half a mile to get into Arches. It's either make some cheap places to live or start paying bus boys and car wash attendants enough to afford to buy houses there. What other option is there? Hilton Head Island has the same issues. The jobs pay better on the island, but the rent is higher too. The only solution is for the people working those jobs to live off island and fight traffic every day as they commute. They can’t afford to live on the island. And that's how it should be. It will make them (you) want to better yourself, rather than bitchin' and moanin' all the time about "fairness". Get the fuck outta here with that shit! That's how I did it, that's how almost every other successful American did it in the past. |
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Posted: 6/4/2022 2:15:41 PM EDT
[#27]
Quote HistoryQuoted: That is the end objective here. If you don't know it now, you'll feel it later. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Hey, this is how the communists roll. You'll take your Section 8 housing, your weekly chocolate ration, and you'll like it. That is the end objective here. If you don't know it now, you'll feel it later. QFT |
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Posted: 6/4/2022 2:16:54 PM EDT
[#28]
The Commies are pushing this nation wide.
Even here they have passed urban grouth plans that make it difficult to build new single family homes other than houses crammed into lots so small you could touch your neighbors house from your window. We also have a screwed up housing market with artificial housing shortage. HUD / Sect 8 relocation programs fill up every new apartment complex built with out of area trash. |
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Posted: 6/4/2022 2:25:50 PM EDT
[#29]
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Posted: 6/4/2022 2:29:20 PM EDT
[#30]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Hey, if someone wants to bring chaos into their life by having other families live with them in the same house, more power to them. But I won't be one of them. My house is MY house. My property is MY property. And no one is going to tell me what to do with it. Stop paying your taxes and see how fast "My" becomes the Governments. |
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Posted: 6/4/2022 2:34:13 PM EDT
[#31]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Even here they have passed urban grouth plans that make it difficult to build new single family homes other than houses crammed into lots so small you could touch your neighbors house from your window. Quote HistoryQuoted: Even here they have passed urban grouth plans that make it difficult to build new single family homes other than houses crammed into lots so small you could touch your neighbors house from your window. You're confusing land use policies with land values and markets. Single family zoning exists to preserve a lower value use. If you had no land use rules you wouldn't have "houses crammed into [small] lots" you would have apartments and townhouses, because that's what the market would naturally provide. Quoted: We also have a screwed up housing market with artificial housing shortage. HUD / Sect 8 relocation programs fill up every new apartment complex built with out of area trash. Section 8 pays the 40th percentile rents for the area, so they aren't filling up new apartment buildings. About 30% of America's 136M housing units are apartments and there are 2M Section 8 vouchers, so at most under 5% of all apartments are rented to Section 8 tenants. |
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Posted: 6/4/2022 2:38:11 PM EDT
[#32]
‘It takes a village’ translates to mud huts and warlords driving around in technicals
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Posted: 6/4/2022 2:43:42 PM EDT
[#33]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Yep. As of now they have the freedom to get out and go somewhere else that practices this commie crap. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: America needs to kick these people out. Yep. As of now they have the freedom to get out and go somewhere else that practices this commie crap. Who's going to kick them out? They're importing tons of people who are used to living 87 people to a trailer. Country is just about dead(might take a few years for most to catch on) and nobody gone do shit |
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Posted: 6/4/2022 2:46:33 PM EDT
[#34]
Sounds very Soviet Union ish.
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Posted: 6/4/2022 2:51:20 PM EDT
[#35]
It's the same way in Stone Harbor and Avalon NJ.
Only the haves own homes on the island. The have nots( service workers) live in the Cape May Courthouse area or further north west of the Garden State Parkway. Good friend of mine owns a home in SH, he's worth several million and he can't afford to purchase beach block property. Huge amount of money in those two towns. |
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Posted: 6/4/2022 3:52:39 PM EDT
[#36]
In this thread we learn who likes subsidies and government and who likes the free market.
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Posted: 6/4/2022 4:03:44 PM EDT
[#37]
Quote HistoryQuoted: The massive demand is not for people living in these areas though, but for Airbnb amateur “hoteliers”and their customers. People vacationing and figuring they can get a better deal renting Bob’s 1500 sq ft 3br second home for a weekend rather than staying at the Hilton downtown. And sure, it makes the owners/landlords just as much if not more to rent an Airbnb for a couple weekends a month rather than deal with a FT tenant. But I’ve seen single zip codes where houses that are Airbnb/Vrbos number in the hundreds. These areas never built up with the expectation that this much of the liveable inventory would wind up being not much more than hotel rooms. So the hotels are failing to serve the market. |
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Posted: 6/4/2022 4:06:51 PM EDT
[#38]
Quote HistoryQuoted: In this thread we learn who likes subsidies and government and who likes the free market. Should HUD exist and should it be able to control zoning or should that be left up to the local township, city, village, etc? |
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Posted: 6/4/2022 4:09:34 PM EDT
[#39]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Should HUD exist and should it be able to control zoning or should that be left up to the local township, city, village, etc? HUD shouldn’t exist. Neither should Fannie and Freddie. The latter would make single family housing much more expensive. |
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Posted: 6/4/2022 4:10:49 PM EDT
[#40]
Quote HistoryQuoted: So the hotels are failing to serve the market. Hotels can’t get low down payment 30 year mortgages at 2.5% backed by Fannie and Freddie. |
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Posted: 6/4/2022 4:12:06 PM EDT
[#41]
And children.
They won't tell you the punchline. They also want to stop you from having children. |
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Posted: 6/4/2022 4:14:34 PM EDT
[#42]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I get all these videos on youtube that pop up about how much American cities suck compared to European ones. They are right about everthing thy say except for the elephant in the room. Nobody wants to live in an apartment when you can afford space. And nobody wants to ride a bike if you can afford a car. /all of that! |
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Posted: 6/4/2022 4:20:02 PM EDT
[#43]
Quote HistoryQuoted: /all of that! Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: I get all these videos on youtube that pop up about how much American cities suck compared to European ones. They are right about everthing thy say except for the elephant in the room. Nobody wants to live in an apartment when you can afford space. And nobody wants to ride a bike if you can afford a car. /all of that! That’s the thing. Many people can’t afford a detached house and a car. That’s going to become more common rather than less. Yet walkable urban communities are incredibly desirable for people with money, if the market is to be believed. Odd how that works. |
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Posted: 6/4/2022 5:08:13 PM EDT
[#44]
All part of the own nothing reset push.
They want people living in cubicals. |
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Posted: 6/4/2022 5:17:28 PM EDT
[#45]
Quote HistoryQuoted: The rich folks build housing for the help out back, and maybe a maid and cook quarters in the owners residence. That's not a totally unreasonable solution if they can find American citizens willing to do it. |
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Posted: 6/4/2022 5:24:30 PM EDT
[#46]
Forcing us to live in Stalinist like apartment blocks shoddily constructed, where we will live cheek to jowl crammed on top of each other.
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Posted: 6/4/2022 5:31:02 PM EDT
[#47]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Forcing us to live in Stalinist like apartment blocks shoddily constructed, where we will live cheek to jowl crammed on top of each other. Firstly, most apartment buildings are better built than most houses. At least during my career that’s been true. Secondly, forcing? Let people buy what they can afford instead of trying to have government manipulate the markets to prohibit some housing and subsidize other housing. |
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Posted: 6/4/2022 5:34:32 PM EDT
[#48]
If one wants to live with us in a nudist community, you are welcome!!! Nothing to hide here!
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Posted: 6/4/2022 5:37:06 PM EDT
[#49]
$830K median single family home price
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Posted: 6/4/2022 5:38:21 PM EDT
[#50]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Sounds very Soviet Union ish. It sure as fuck does, doesn't it? Bye bye America. 
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