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Posted: 9/30/2021 11:17:30 PM EDT
[#1]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Correction, it is the generally accepted theory of the beginning of the observable universe. No, you’re never going to reach tomorrow, tomorrow never comes, you’re stuck in the present. Future events aren’t certain, nobody knows what, if any, future events will unfold, and nobody can count how many events in the past have occurred, thus infinity. Nobody can tell the future, so the possibilities of what lies in the future are endless. Infinity isn’t a number you can count to. The number line also has no end. There is as much evidence for the existence of Quetzalcoatl as there is of the god of your religion. Speaking of which, how many religions are on this earth right now? How many different gods is that? I have read the Bible. Show me where, scientifically speaking, can the story of Jonah be a reality? A virgin getting pregnant by a spirit? Muhammed also gives the Quran a sort of credibility in that it’s tied to a living person. Again, what makes your bible more credible than the Quran, besides your faith? That contradiction is on your end, you say an infinite universe cannot exist, yet an infinite being can. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: There is plenty of scientific evidence for the beginning of the universe. The Big Bang theory is generally accepted by the majority of the scientific community. As to your time question, that depends. You will reach tomorrow, tomorrow. Assuming you believe that future events will occur, and the past events have occurred. If you agree with the above, then time can be seen as a series of events. If you have an infinite number of events, you would never be able to arrive at today’s set of events, because there would always be a proceeding event. If you have an explanation about how you can reach infinity by successive addition, I’d love to hear it. The second part of your comment has been addressed. There is no evidence for the existence of Thor, Zeus, etc.. Norse mythology also does not work within the scientific framework about what we know regarding the universe. Now take the Bible. If you ever read it, you will notice it reads like a historical document. Naming places and people. Furthermore, as I’ve already mentioned, Jesus Christ existed and claimed to be God in the flesh. He either was or he wasn’t. However you fall on that question, Jesus does give the Bible a different sort of credibility in that it’s tied to a living person. That last part seems to be a contradiction. You say you cannot know if the universe is infinite, yet claim there cannot be an infinite being. Correction, it is the generally accepted theory of the beginning of the observable universe. No, you’re never going to reach tomorrow, tomorrow never comes, you’re stuck in the present. Future events aren’t certain, nobody knows what, if any, future events will unfold, and nobody can count how many events in the past have occurred, thus infinity. Nobody can tell the future, so the possibilities of what lies in the future are endless. Infinity isn’t a number you can count to. The number line also has no end. There is as much evidence for the existence of Quetzalcoatl as there is of the god of your religion. Speaking of which, how many religions are on this earth right now? How many different gods is that? I have read the Bible. Show me where, scientifically speaking, can the story of Jonah be a reality? A virgin getting pregnant by a spirit? Muhammed also gives the Quran a sort of credibility in that it’s tied to a living person. Again, what makes your bible more credible than the Quran, besides your faith? That contradiction is on your end, you say an infinite universe cannot exist, yet an infinite being can. Over 200 correct prophesies. Eye witnesses to Jesus performing miracles, his death and resurrection. It is the most studied book in the history of the world and has never been proven untrue. |
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Posted: 9/30/2021 11:19:53 PM EDT
[#2]
Quote HistoryQuoted: The Big Bang theory is based on the universe expanding from an nearly-infinitely compressed locus of energy, not "nothing". Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: I am presented with two options. Option A - the universe springs into existence, uncaused, from nothing Option B - something that exists BEYOND time and space brings the universe into existence Option B seems far more logical to me than Option A Obviously, this is a matter of opinion, but I’ve provided other scientific reasoning for believing option B to be more plausible. That’s a misunderstanding of the Big Bang. Nothing exists before the Big Bang. The Big Bang is the birth of the universe. |
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Posted: 9/30/2021 11:20:52 PM EDT
[#3]
Quoted: All of modern science points to a finite past. Thus, time and space had a beginning. In an Atheistic worldview, how does one get a beginning to the universe? It seems apparent there needs to be a causal event, “Big Bang” theory, but before time and space existed, how does one get said causal event? It would seem that something would need to exist beyond time and space to create the universe. School me atheists.  There is no way an intellectually honest athiest can answer that question honestly. To deny the existence of a thing without proof is lunacy. Only the agnostic is honest enough to admit that there may or not be a higher power but that they are not able to prove or disprove their existence. Screw athiests. It's like fighting with a pig. You both get muddy but the pig likes it. |
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Posted: 9/30/2021 11:23:01 PM EDT
[#4]
Quote HistoryQuoted: The Big Bang theory is based on the universe expanding from an nearly-infinitely compressed locus of energy, not "nothing". Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: I am presented with two options. Option A - the universe springs into existence, uncaused, from nothing Option B - something that exists BEYOND time and space brings the universe into existence Option B seems far more logical to me than Option A Obviously, this is a matter of opinion, but I’ve provided other scientific reasoning for believing option B to be more plausible. That wouldn't be the origin then. Where did that energy come from? |
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Posted: 9/30/2021 11:23:46 PM EDT
[#5]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I do not have faith that tomorrow the ‘sun will rise.’ I know there’s the possibility that it won’t. Option A: god springs into existence, uncaused, from nothing. Option B: something that exists beyond time and space brings god into existence. With the same thought experiment and replacing one word for another, you’ll select a different option. That’s mental gymnastics. If the possibility that a god can exist without being created, the same possibility can happen for a universe to exist without being created. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: No, of course not. Everyone acts on faith. For example, the problem of deduction. The idea that tomorrow will be like today is a faith claim. You have faith that tomorrow the sun will rise and you will not float out of your chair. It’s based off prior experience. I am presented with two options. Option A - the universe springs into existence, uncaused, from nothing Option B - something that exists BEYOND time and space brings the universe into existence Option B seems far more logical to me than Option A Obviously, this is a matter of opinion, but I’ve provided other scientific reasoning for believing option B to be more plausible. I do not have faith that tomorrow the ‘sun will rise.’ I know there’s the possibility that it won’t. Option A: god springs into existence, uncaused, from nothing. Option B: something that exists beyond time and space brings god into existence. With the same thought experiment and replacing one word for another, you’ll select a different option. That’s mental gymnastics. If the possibility that a god can exist without being created, the same possibility can happen for a universe to exist without being created. Then you are arguing for an infinite universe, which goes against not only modern science, but the metaphysical problem of an infinite by successive addition, which you failed to deal with. Again, science generally accepts the Big Bang theory which is the creation of the universe. Therefore, saying the universe can exist without being created is a contradiction. The Bible is specific that god is eternal. God has no beginning or end. It sounds like you just dislike infinity unless it suits you. |
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Posted: 9/30/2021 11:25:31 PM EDT
[#6]
Quote HistoryQuoted: That wouldn't be the origin then. Where did that energy come from? |
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Posted: 9/30/2021 11:26:00 PM EDT
[#7]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Over 200 correct prophesies. Eye witnesses to Jesus performing miracles, his death and resurrection. It is the most studied book in the history of the world and has never been proven untrue. So you’re telling me a whale can swallow a man whole, this man can live in its digestive tract for three days and get spit back out alive? |
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Posted: 9/30/2021 11:26:35 PM EDT
[#8]
Why couldnt it be born from inside of a larger universe?. The "stuff" to make everything is there, gets all smooshed, then goes party popper setting forth the laws of physics for this universe?
We cant even see what's beyond our universe. There has to be something out there that's unfathomabley (even compared to our universe) large. |
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Posted: 9/30/2021 11:31:57 PM EDT
[#9]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Then you are arguing for an infinite universe, which goes against not only modern science, but the metaphysical problem of an infinite by successive addition, which you failed to deal with. Again, science generally accepts the Big Bang theory which is the creation of the universe. Therefore, saying the universe can exist without being created is a contradiction. The Bible is specific that god is eternal. God has no beginning or end. It sounds like you just dislike infinity unless it suits you. Yeah, I have been arguing for an infinite universe this whole time. Again, Big Bang theory applies to the observable universe. Saying a god can exist without being created is a contradiction. That one word that can be exchanged in your thought experiment throws your whole argument off. The Bible also talks about a whale swallowing a man whole, having this man in its digestive tract for three days and then spitting this man out. A talking snake, a virgin getting pregnant by a spirit. The Bible is specific on many things, that doesn’t make them true. |
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Posted: 9/30/2021 11:32:31 PM EDT
[#10]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Why couldnt it be born from inside of a larger universe?. The "stuff" to make everything is there, gets all smooshed, then goes party popper setting forth the laws of physics for this universe? We cant even see what's beyond our universe. There has to be something out there that's unfathomabley (even compared to our universe) large. This has been covered. You are referring to the cosmic crunch theory, or a variation of it. 1) If there are other universes spawning new universes, there would still be the question of “how did the original universe begin, before it began creating new universes?” 2) If you claim it’s infinite, or that it has no beginning, you have to deal with the metaphysical question of how you would ever arrive at this universe if there are an infinite number of universes before this one. |
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Posted: 9/30/2021 11:32:37 PM EDT
[#11]
Quote HistoryQuoted: So you’re telling me a whale can swallow a man whole, this man can live in its digestive tract for three days and get spit back out alive? Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Over 200 correct prophesies. Eye witnesses to Jesus performing miracles, his death and resurrection. It is the most studied book in the history of the world and has never been proven untrue. So you’re telling me a whale can swallow a man whole, this man can live in its digestive tract for three days and get spit back out alive? Now the Lord had prepared a great fish to swallow up Jonah. And Jonah was in the belly of the fish three days and three nights. |
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Posted: 9/30/2021 11:34:03 PM EDT
[#12]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Yeah, I have been arguing for an infinite universe this whole time. Again, Big Bang theory applies to the observable universe. Saying a god can exist without being created is a contradiction. That one word that can be exchanged in your thought experiment throws your whole argument off. The Bible also talks about a whale swallowing a man whole, having this man in its digestive tract for three days and then spitting this man out. A talking snake, a virgin getting pregnant by a spirit. The Bible is specific on many things, that doesn’t make them true. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Then you are arguing for an infinite universe, which goes against not only modern science, but the metaphysical problem of an infinite by successive addition, which you failed to deal with. Again, science generally accepts the Big Bang theory which is the creation of the universe. Therefore, saying the universe can exist without being created is a contradiction. The Bible is specific that god is eternal. God has no beginning or end. It sounds like you just dislike infinity unless it suits you. Yeah, I have been arguing for an infinite universe this whole time. Again, Big Bang theory applies to the observable universe. Saying a god can exist without being created is a contradiction. That one word that can be exchanged in your thought experiment throws your whole argument off. The Bible also talks about a whale swallowing a man whole, having this man in its digestive tract for three days and then spitting this man out. A talking snake, a virgin getting pregnant by a spirit. The Bible is specific on many things, that doesn’t make them true. Ok, now we are back to an infinite by successive addition. If the universe is infinite, this includes multiverses, how would you ever arrive at this universe if there are an infinite number of universes created before this one? |
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Posted: 9/30/2021 11:35:09 PM EDT
[#13]
Quote HistoryQuoted: OP is forgetting something. That the same question can be applied to any ultimate being/god. The creator of everything, what was its origin? If one uses the classic response of 'always was, cannot not be' then there could also be anything else which 'always was and cannot not be' 
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Posted: 9/30/2021 11:37:41 PM EDT
[#14]
Quote HistoryQuoted: That’s a misunderstanding of the Big Bang. Nothing exists before the Big Bang. The Big Bang is the birth of the universe. We don't know that nothing exists before the big bang, we currently can't know because our state of math and physics falls apart as you approach T=0, just because we can't deduce what was there to preceed the big bang doesn't mean it was nothing. In fact in the absence of proof there was nothing it has to be assumed that there was something there, we just have no way of knowing yet. We also haven't exactly determined if it's possible or impossible to know. |
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Posted: 9/30/2021 11:38:35 PM EDT
[#15]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Ok, now we are back to an infinite by successive addition. If the universe is infinite, this includes multiverses, how would you ever arrive at this universe if there are an infinite number of universes created before this one? Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: Then you are arguing for an infinite universe, which goes against not only modern science, but the metaphysical problem of an infinite by successive addition, which you failed to deal with. Again, science generally accepts the Big Bang theory which is the creation of the universe. Therefore, saying the universe can exist without being created is a contradiction. The Bible is specific that god is eternal. God has no beginning or end. It sounds like you just dislike infinity unless it suits you. Yeah, I have been arguing for an infinite universe this whole time. Again, Big Bang theory applies to the observable universe. Saying a god can exist without being created is a contradiction. That one word that can be exchanged in your thought experiment throws your whole argument off. The Bible also talks about a whale swallowing a man whole, having this man in its digestive tract for three days and then spitting this man out. A talking snake, a virgin getting pregnant by a spirit. The Bible is specific on many things, that doesn’t make them true. Ok, now we are back to an infinite by successive addition. If the universe is infinite, this includes multiverses, how would you ever arrive at this universe if there are an infinite number of universes created before this one? Warp speed? |
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Posted: 9/30/2021 11:40:19 PM EDT
[#16]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Now the Lord had prepared a great fish to swallow up Jonah. And Jonah was in the belly of the fish three days and three nights. For the lord told Mary, drop thy panties. I can make up verses, the thing is mine won’t get put into your Bible. Quoting one source isn’t going to help your argument. |
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Posted: 9/30/2021 11:43:33 PM EDT
[#17]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Ok, now we are back to an infinite by successive addition. If the universe is infinite, this includes multiverses, how would you ever arrive at this universe if there are an infinite number of universes created before this one? We arrive at this universe because we are experiencing it right now. We’re not experiencing what’s happening in other universes because we’re not in them, we’re in this one. If god is infinite, this includes multi gods. Again, your thought experiment fails by merely swapping out one word for another. |
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Posted: 9/30/2021 11:43:58 PM EDT
[#18]
Quote HistoryQuoted: There is no way an intellectually honest athiest can answer that question honestly. To deny the existence of a thing without proof is lunacy. Only the agnostic is honest enough to admit that there may or not be a higher power but that they are not able to prove or disprove their existence. Screw athiests. It's like fighting with a pig. You both get muddy but the pig likes it. Denying the existence of something without proof is how it works. The claim of existence requires proof. |
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Posted: 9/30/2021 11:48:50 PM EDT
[#19]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Ok, now we are back to an infinite by successive addition. If the universe is infinite, this includes multiverses, how would you ever arrive at this universe if there are an infinite number of universes created before this one? That would be determined if our universe ever collides with another expanding universe, then we'll get to see the formation of a universe, and prove the existence of multiverse. Until then it's just a speculative theory. |
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Posted: 9/30/2021 11:49:22 PM EDT
[#20]
Quote HistoryQuoted: We don't know that nothing exists before the big bang, we currently can't know because our state of math and physics falls apart as you approach T=0, just because we can't deduce what was there to preceed the big bang doesn't mean it was nothing. In fact in the absence of proof there was nothing it has to be assumed that there was something there, we just have no way of knowing yet. We also haven't exactly determined if it's possible or impossible to know. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: That’s a misunderstanding of the Big Bang. Nothing exists before the Big Bang. The Big Bang is the birth of the universe. We don't know that nothing exists before the big bang, we currently can't know because our state of math and physics falls apart as you approach T=0, just because we can't deduce what was there to preceed the big bang doesn't mean it was nothing. In fact in the absence of proof there was nothing it has to be assumed that there was something there, we just have no way of knowing yet. We also haven't exactly determined if it's possible or impossible to know. Let me amend my original statement. The cause of the origin of the universe is causally prior to the Big Bang. This is referring to the Big Bang as - all the matter in the cosmos, all of space itself, existed in a form smaller than a subatomic particle. |
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Posted: 9/30/2021 11:51:03 PM EDT
[#21]
Quote HistoryQuoted: We arrive at this universe because we are experiencing it right now. We’re not experiencing what’s happening in other universes because we’re not in them, we’re in this one. If god is infinite, this includes multi gods. Again, your thought experiment fails by merely swapping out one word for another. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Ok, now we are back to an infinite by successive addition. If the universe is infinite, this includes multiverses, how would you ever arrive at this universe if there are an infinite number of universes created before this one? We arrive at this universe because we are experiencing it right now. We’re not experiencing what’s happening in other universes because we’re not in them, we’re in this one. If god is infinite, this includes multi gods. Again, your thought experiment fails by merely swapping out one word for another. You could never “arrive” to this universe to “experience” it if there is an infinite causal chain of prior universes that proceed it. |
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Posted: 9/30/2021 11:52:26 PM EDT
[#22]
Quote HistoryQuoted: That’s a misunderstanding of the Big Bang. Nothing exists before the Big Bang. The Big Bang is the birth of the universe. on its face, that's an anti-scientific claim. there is no possible way to observe--or even to infer--what may or may not have happened 'prior to' the big bang. science can only operate based on observable evidence and the uniformity of nature. since nothing prior to the big bang can be observed, and since the uniformity of nature cannot validly be inferred prior to the BB (since the laws of physics breaks down the further back we go), it represents an absolute horizon beyond which science can make no claims. whatever may or may not have been the state of affairs before the BB is simply opaque to empirical reasoning. in other words, your claim is empirically unsupportable. |
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Posted: 9/30/2021 11:53:09 PM EDT
[#23]
It’s okay to just not know the answer to stuff.
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Posted: 10/1/2021 12:01:44 AM EDT
[#24]
Quote HistoryQuoted: on its face, that's an anti-scientific claim. there is no possible way to observe--or even to infer--what may or may not have happened 'prior to' the big bang. science can only operate based on observable evidence and the uniformity of nature. since nothing prior to the big bang can be observed, and since the uniformity of nature cannot validly be inferred prior to the BB (since the laws of physics breaks down the further back we go), it represents an absolute horizon beyond which science can make no claims. whatever may or may not have been the state of affairs before the BB is simply opaque to empirical reasoning. in other words, your claim is empirically unsupportable. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: That’s a misunderstanding of the Big Bang. Nothing exists before the Big Bang. The Big Bang is the birth of the universe. on its face, that's an anti-scientific claim. there is no possible way to observe--or even to infer--what may or may not have happened 'prior to' the big bang. science can only operate based on observable evidence and the uniformity of nature. since nothing prior to the big bang can be observed, and since the uniformity of nature cannot validly be inferred prior to the BB (since the laws of physics breaks down the further back we go), it represents an absolute horizon beyond which science can make no claims. whatever may or may not have been the state of affairs before the BB is simply opaque to empirical reasoning. in other words, your claim is empirically unsupportable. Fair enough. For the discussion will place this in deductive form. 1) Everything that begins to exist has a cause. 2) The universe began to exist 3) Therefore, the universe has a cause. |
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Posted: 10/1/2021 12:08:52 AM EDT
[#25]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Let me amend my original statement. The cause of the origin of the universe is causally prior to the Big Bang. This is referring to the Big Bang as - all the matter in the cosmos, all of space itself, existed in a form smaller than a subatomic particle. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: That’s a misunderstanding of the Big Bang. Nothing exists before the Big Bang. The Big Bang is the birth of the universe. We don't know that nothing exists before the big bang, we currently can't know because our state of math and physics falls apart as you approach T=0, just because we can't deduce what was there to preceed the big bang doesn't mean it was nothing. In fact in the absence of proof there was nothing it has to be assumed that there was something there, we just have no way of knowing yet. We also haven't exactly determined if it's possible or impossible to know. Let me amend my original statement. The cause of the origin of the universe is causally prior to the Big Bang. This is referring to the Big Bang as - all the matter in the cosmos, all of space itself, existed in a form smaller than a subatomic particle. So, what is this? Huh? Looks like some community college bullshit to me. 
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Posted: 10/1/2021 12:22:12 AM EDT
[#26]
Quote HistoryQuoted: 1) Everything that begins to exist has a cause. causality is a logically unsupportable assumption. hume demonstrated this 300 years ago. |
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Posted: 10/1/2021 12:22:58 AM EDT
[#27]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Let me amend my original statement. The cause of the origin of the universe is causally prior to the Big Bang. This is referring to the Big Bang as - all the matter in the cosmos, all of space itself, existed in a form smaller than a subatomic particle. It looks like the current state of understanding has the size of the universe a little larger than a light year across within the first second, and physics breaks down when it's a little smaller than the distance between the earth and the sun at 0.000000000000315 seconds (10^-20 years in case my math is wrong in covering that to seconds).  I just read about it in Forbes  Although none of that really explains where that original sphere of radiation and matter came from. ETA: from the Forbes article (I should have read past the above figure) at t ~ 10^-35 seconds the universe was ~1.5m across, that's about the smallest it could have been. |
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Posted: 10/1/2021 12:37:07 AM EDT
[#28]
Wikipedia. If I were to make a suggestion and go away again because this is mostly pin head (not pin heads) arguing (What God did and when), there is probably more consensus in the scientific community with respect to the first event (Big Bang if one will) than there is within Christianity and the other Abrahamic religions and the others that might have been around contributing to the local beginning "stories." as to what is meant in Genesis. The first Creation in Genesis.
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Posted: 10/1/2021 1:04:25 AM EDT
[#29]
Quote HistoryQuoted: It’s okay to just not know the answer the stuff. This Being an atheist or agnostic just means you don’t find sufficient evidence for the existence of a god. It doesn’t suppose that you must have a counter claim, just to say “that’s unlikely”. The trouble with a lot of posts I’m seeing is misunderstanding where the burden of proof lies; with the person making an incredible claim, not the person who refuses to believe the incredible claim until sufficient evidence is presented. For me, there are enough points that are falsifiable through basic observation (genetic expression observable in domesticated plants and animals for one) and logical inference to call into question the foundational texts of most major world religions. Therefore, I can say with some certainty that I don’t believe all claims made are factual. And in books that claim to be infallible, that’s enough. Not to mention what I perceive as moral failings of religious texts (slavery, treatment of women, etc) My biggest hurdle is a cultural one. Atheists and Agnostics seem to be predominantly woke and progressives, which I am completely the opposite of. And most freedom-minded people are Christian (that I run into regularly). So the whole thing is very all or nothing and tribal. I can’t let my freedom minded friends and family know that I’m not Christian because I’ll be ostracized nor do I want to be friends with a bunch of goal-post moving progressives. My answer to the moral and cultural issue is to align more with stoicism which works well when you don’t believe in an afterlife. |
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Posted: 10/1/2021 1:29:47 AM EDT
[#30]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I don't know.
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Posted: 10/1/2021 1:32:37 AM EDT
[#31]
Quote HistoryQuoted: It’s okay to just not know the answer the stuff. |
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Posted: 10/1/2021 2:42:50 AM EDT
[#32]
Quote HistoryQuoted: You could never “arrive” to this universe to “experience” it if there is an infinite causal chain of prior universes that proceed it. Says who? In this point in time you’re here in the universe. That doesn’t prove nor disprove whether the universe is infinite or not, that is an unknown. |
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Posted: 10/1/2021 2:53:49 AM EDT
[#33]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Some stuff, yes. All stuff, no. It’s not really possible to unequivocally know anything. Just that an experience is repeatable and yields repeatable results. At least so far. Best anyone can say honestly is, “I understand X to be true because I’ve experienced it to be the case in a repeatable manner” |
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Posted: 10/1/2021 8:07:29 AM EDT
[#34]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Some stuff, yes. All stuff, no. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: It’s okay to just not know the answer the stuff. Sure. But when you can’t answer the question of the bigger mysteries (such as the beginning of the Universe), it’s okay to simply admit that you do not know. |
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Posted: 10/1/2021 2:43:02 PM EDT
[#35]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Sure. But when you can’t answer the question of the bigger mysteries (such as the beginning of the Universe), it’s okay to simply admit that you do not know. It's fine to admit it but it's more fun to argue about it on the internet where the stakes are so low. |
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Posted: 10/1/2021 3:36:59 PM EDT
[#36]
Quote HistoryQuoted: It's fine to admit it but it's more fun to argue about it on the internet where the stakes are so low. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Sure. But when you can’t answer the question of the bigger mysteries (such as the beginning of the Universe), it’s okay to simply admit that you do not know. It's fine to admit it but it's more fun to argue about it on the internet where the stakes are so low. There are “high stakes” somewhere for pondering and discussing these things? |
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Posted: 10/1/2021 6:58:50 PM EDT
[#37]
Quote HistoryQuoted: There are “high stakes” somewhere for pondering and discussing these things? Well there have been times and places where people have been killed for heresy for challenging less. I don't expect there would be a compassionate response if I stood in front of the Taliban today and said "I'm an atheist". |
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Posted: 10/1/2021 7:11:26 PM EDT
[#38]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Well there have been times and places where people have been killed for heresy for challenging less. I don't expect there would be a compassionate response if I stood in front of the Taliban today and said "I'm an atheist". Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: There are “high stakes” somewhere for pondering and discussing these things? Well there have been times and places where people have been killed for heresy for challenging less. I don't expect there would be a compassionate response if I stood in front of the Taliban today and said "I'm an atheist". I suppose that depends on the circumstances. 
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Posted: 10/1/2021 7:14:43 PM EDT
[#39]
Don’t care. How do you answer believing in a book?
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Posted: 10/1/2021 7:25:29 PM EDT
[#40]
Quoted: All of modern science points to a finite past. Thus, time and space had a beginning. In an Atheistic worldview, how does one get a beginning to the universe? It seems apparent there needs to be a causal event, “Big Bang” theory, but before time and space existed, how does one get said causal event? It would seem that something would need to exist beyond time and space to create the universe. School me atheists. Not an atheist, not religious. Didn't read a single response. It happened, I don't give one flying fuck how. I'm here, you're where you are. |
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Posted: 10/1/2021 7:32:18 PM EDT
[#41]
Happy Friday Folks!
PhD in physics here. I’ve gone most of my life as an atheist. Encountered many other atheists in the field of course and was always intrigued by some of the brightest folks I’ve known being Mormans or other types of Christians. Folks I respected very much, and now I think they’re on to something… It’s true what others have said all of our physics fails at the beginning because we simply don’t know if our understanding of physics still applies to continue extrapolating backwards. An interesting concept is what is existence and the concept of nothing that could drive you mad! I don’t lose much sleep over that since my lot in life is to toil on and it won’t matter what I think. It could make my head explode and man that would tick the wife off. It’s endless fodder for bar conversations in grad school tho! |
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Posted: 10/1/2021 8:53:47 PM EDT
[#42]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Not an atheist, not religious. Didn't read a single response. It happened, I don't give one flying fuck how. I'm here, you're where you are. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: All of modern science points to a finite past. Thus, time and space had a beginning. In an Atheistic worldview, how does one get a beginning to the universe? It seems apparent there needs to be a causal event, “Big Bang” theory, but before time and space existed, how does one get said causal event? It would seem that something would need to exist beyond time and space to create the universe. School me atheists. Not an atheist, not religious. Didn't read a single response. It happened, I don't give one flying fuck how. I'm here, you're where you are. And YOU know just as much as the most brilliant astrophysicist AND Saint Thomas Aquinas. But no one likes to hear that. |
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Posted: 10/1/2021 10:26:25 PM EDT
[#43]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Now the Lord had prepared a great fish to swallow up Jonah. And Jonah was in the belly of the fish three days and three nights. The Lord didn't know the difference between a fish and a whale? |
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Posted: 10/2/2021 7:20:57 AM EDT
[#44]
Quote HistoryQuoted: And YOU know just as much as the most brilliant astrophysicist AND Saint Thomas Aquinas. But no one likes to hear that. Plot twist: All of those ideas come form the same mind (see solipsism).
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Posted: 10/3/2021 12:17:38 PM EDT
[#45]
Quote HistoryQuoted: The Big Bang theory is based on the universe expanding from an nearly-infinitely compressed locus of energy, not "nothing". Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: I am presented with two options. Option A - the universe springs into existence, uncaused, from nothing Option B - something that exists BEYOND time and space brings the universe into existence Option B seems far more logical to me than Option A Obviously, this is a matter of opinion, but I've provided other scientific reasoning for believing option B to be more plausible. |
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Posted: 10/3/2021 12:48:30 PM EDT
[#46]
I always assumed it is a continuing cycle...always has happened always will.
Universe blows up as soon as all matter collects (via mega black hole) and collapses onto itself. Then it expands as that big bang energy forces it to move away but eventually the BB energy runs out and gravity takes over and all matter is attracted (retracted), universe contracts then blows up, starts all over. Galaxies are nothing more than collections of this exploded matter being sucked together like going down the drain of a black hole. Eventually all of them pull together, then comes the big bang once again. We are in an expanding phase now with hundreds of billions of years left to go, then it all stops and goes back into one giant black hole, then bang again. Probably has happened (big bang) more times than we can count (trillions of times) and will continue to do so forever. Then there are different dimensions going on at the same time all of this is happening which is mind boggling. |
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