User Panel
User Panel
User Panel
|
Posted: 10/30/2023 11:58:49 AM EDT
[#1]
Watched a tv show that had some seal snipers try to make the shots and they could not hit the number of shots in the timeframe either. I’ve been to the location and looked out the window… first shot would seem easy, but the follow ups in the time he did with a shit Italian rifle seems a bit off… especially with the adrenaline he would have had pumping through him.
|
|
|
|
Posted: 10/30/2023 12:00:04 PM EDT
[#2]
Quote HistoryQuoted: The issue is the absolute impossibility that one pristine bullet caused all that carnage while defying the laws of physics a couple three times. The Swamp killed Kennedy because he was not going to cave to the military industrial complex . Ain’t seen many people shot in the head with a rifle have you? |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/30/2023 12:01:26 PM EDT
[#3]
Quoted: Carlos Hathcock Couldn't Duplicate Lee Harvey Oswald's Feat I was a Lieutenant at the Basic School when Hathcock was an instructor there. Ate some meals with him, too. I'll just say that he no doubt had some amazing combat experiences, but he was also a bullshit artist. Decades ago, when you could still actually sit in the book depository's window, I visited it and didn't think it was an impossible shot. |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/30/2023 12:02:33 PM EDT
[#4]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Mitchell Werbell delivered a suppressed rifle to a hotel room in Dallas a few days before the assassination and he recognized 3 of 5 individuals in the room as people he knew or previously worked with including E. Howard Hunt. He told this to an investigator for the Select Committee on Assassinations in an interview at his home in Georgia. I have never heard this story before. Was this in the Warren Report? |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/30/2023 12:03:10 PM EDT
[#5]
Quote HistoryQuoted: You've never shot birds or game that is moving? lol this dudes shooting trap with a fucking AR.  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gG7dfxk8bvMQuote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: I've been there, and looked out the window to the X they have painted on the street. A half ass rifle shooter could make that shot easy. Sure, that one shot, in a vacuum, on a stationary target. But it wasn't one shot, it was three shots. It wasn't in a vacuum, it was on a president. And, he wasn't stationary. I've never believed in the lone gunman theory and probably never will. lol this dudes shooting trap with a fucking AR. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gG7dfxk8bvMThere are so many factors that you guys aren't including. This isn't a simple case of "Heheh, my buddies and I shot a paper target at 88 yards from an elevated position and we hit the X ring." For example: 1. Oswald didn't know where the motorcade was going. It made a left turn and then a right turn to enter Dealey Plaza unannounced. 2. Building off #1, the motorcade, and obviously the target, was moving, and was moving in different directions within the span of seconds. 3. The target wasn't paper. It wasn't clay. It wasn't quail. It wasn't a deer. It was a human being who was also the President of the United States. 4. When you're "recreating" the shot in your deer stand, there aren't 30 different people all around you who you know are trying to kill you within seconds of firing your weapon. 5. It wasn't one shot. It was three shots at minimum (and some experts are convinced it was actually four shots that were taken). 6. Finally, Oswald himself said to the world that he was "a patsy" just hours before being killed himself while in police custody. We're not talking about recreating those shots, because you can't recreate the circumstances surrounding those shots...unless you really are trying to shoot and kill the sitting President of the United States and all that goes with that. It's like watching Steph Curry or Larry Bird taking (but not necessarily making) a 3pt shot to win game 7 of the finals and then saying, "Meh. Almost anybody with a little bit of skill could've made that shot" while ignoring it's at the end of an 82 game regular season and another 20 playoff games, at the end of game 7 where you've been playing your ass off for 40 minutes against the best players in the world and then having the pressure of the entire season resting your shoulders as you release the ball towards the net with one second remaining. Standing in your backyard behind a 3pt line and taking a shot at the basket isn't recreating shit. |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/30/2023 12:03:27 PM EDT
[#6]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Ain’t seen many people shot in the head with a rifle have you? Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: The issue is the absolute impossibility that one pristine bullet caused all that carnage while defying the laws of physics a couple three times. The Swamp killed Kennedy because he was not going to cave to the military industrial complex . Ain’t seen many people shot in the head with a rifle have you? More than I’ve cared to, actually, but the Magic Bullet was not the head shot. The Swamp killed Kennedy and the head shot came from the front. _ |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/30/2023 12:05:17 PM EDT
[#7]
Quote HistoryQuoted: It was what... a miss, a head shot, and upper back, hit? That's a spread of probably... 12 inches or more? At ~80 yards? He got lucky with the head shot. But that was one of three. The "upper back" shot was the back of his neck, which is an even smaller target than his head. |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/30/2023 12:05:18 PM EDT
[#8]
|
|
|
|
Posted: 10/30/2023 12:13:20 PM EDT
[#9]
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=ghmY6HmR4fs&pp=ygUXSmZrIHNob290aW5nIHJlY3JlYXRpb24%3D
11 different shooters, all of them familiar with bolt actions but unfamiliar with the exact rifle (fitted with the same 4x scope as Oswald had) Shooting tower at the correct height, target on rails moving away at the exact angle and traveling 11 mph. Shooters given 6 seconds to fire 3 shots. Not only was it shown to be doable, but two shooters beat the time while scoring 2 out of 3 hits. One shooter beat the time and hit 3 of 3. |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/30/2023 12:14:04 PM EDT
[#10]
Quote HistoryQuoted: More than I’ve cared to, actually, but the Magic Bullet was not the head shot. The Swamp killed Kennedy and the head shot came from the front. _ The head is a vacuum. It’s been my experience that when a human head is stuck with a high power rifle round everything inside of it tends to go outside and in a very rapid and violent manner. Not so much with a pistol round, but a rifle round is devastating. And it doesn’t have to deform the bullet to accomplish that. If the bullet had deformed or came apart it would have likely been a much more gruesome outcome. |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/30/2023 12:16:49 PM EDT
[#11]
Quote HistoryQuoted: The issue is the absolute impossibility that one pristine bullet caused all that carnage while defying the laws of physics a couple three times. The Swamp killed Kennedy because he was not going to cave to the military industrial complex . You’re basing your sentiment on lies. The bullet wasn’t pristine, far from it in fact. It never defied the laws of physics. |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/30/2023 12:16:55 PM EDT
[#12]
Quote HistoryQuoted: The head is a vacuum. It’s been my experience that when a human head is stuck with a high power rifle round everything inside of it tends to go outside and in a very rapid and violent manner. Not so much with a pistol round, but a rifle round is devastating. And it doesn’t have to deform the bullet to accomplish that. If the bullet had deformed or came apart it would have likely been a much more gruesome outcome. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: More than I’ve cared to, actually, but the Magic Bullet was not the head shot. The Swamp killed Kennedy and the head shot came from the front. _ The head is a vacuum. It’s been my experience that when a human head is stuck with a high power rifle round everything inside of it tends to go outside and in a very rapid and violent manner. Not so much with a pistol round, but a rifle round is devastating. And it doesn’t have to deform the bullet to accomplish that. If the bullet had deformed or came apart it would have likely been a much more gruesome outcome. The pristine magic bullet was not the head shot. _ |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/30/2023 12:18:18 PM EDT
[#13]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I had never heard of that before either. Back in the day I heard that the Warren Commission had used two if not more rifle experts in order to test the rifle and approximately the same conditions out. Maybe Hathcock was one of those. Hathcock was a LCpl Marine MP at the time. |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/30/2023 12:18:31 PM EDT
[#14]
How many books would he have sold otherwise?
Where's the Marine study? It has to be public domain or he wouldn't have seen it. People think bolt guns are Fuddly slow but they can be manipulated with the off hand very fast while your eyes never leave the target and your finger the trigger. Another no proof "what else could it be" conspiracy theory, take your place in line. |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/30/2023 12:18:36 PM EDT
[#15]
Quote HistoryQuoted: There are so many factors that you guys aren't including. This isn't a simple case of "Heheh, my buddies and I shot a paper target at 88 yards from an elevated position and we hit the X ring." For example: 1. Oswald didn't know where the motorcade was going. It made a left turn and then a right turn to enter Dealey Plaza unannounced. 2. Building off #1, the motorcade, and obviously the target, was moving, and was moving in different directions within the span of seconds. 3. The target wasn't paper. It wasn't clay. It wasn't quail. It wasn't a deer. It was a human being who was also the President of the United States. 4. When you're "recreating" the shot in your deer stand, there aren't 30 different people all around you who you know are trying to kill you within seconds of firing your weapon. 5. It wasn't one shot. It was three shots at minimum (and some experts are convinced it was actually four shots that were taken). 6. Finally, Oswald himself said to the world that he was "a patsy" just hours before being killed himself while in police custody. We're not talking about recreating those shots, because you can't recreate the circumstances surrounding those shots...unless you really are trying to shoot and kill the sitting President of the United States and all that goes with that. It's like watching Steph Curry or Larry Bird taking (but not necessarily making) a 3pt shot to win game 7 of the finals and then saying, "Meh. Almost anybody with a little bit of skill could've made that shot" while ignoring it's at the end of an 82 game regular season and another 20 playoff games, at the end of game 7 where you've been playing your ass off for 40 minutes against the best players in the world and then having the pressure of the entire season resting your shoulders as you release the ball towards the net with one second remaining. Standing in your backyard behind a 3pt line and taking a shot at the basket isn't recreating shit. Sounds like an awful lot of excusing away an inability to do what Oswald was able to do. |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/30/2023 12:18:50 PM EDT
[#16]
Quote HistoryQuoted: You’re basing your sentiment on lies. The bullet wasn’t pristine, far from it in fact. It never defied the laws of physics. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: The issue is the absolute impossibility that one pristine bullet caused all that carnage while defying the laws of physics a couple three times. The Swamp killed Kennedy because he was not going to cave to the military industrial complex . You’re basing your sentiment on lies. The bullet wasn’t pristine, far from it in fact. It never defied the laws of physics. Do you agree that the Warren Commission is the swamp ? _ |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/30/2023 12:20:54 PM EDT
[#17]
Quote HistoryQuoted: How did you duplicate the stress levels that would be induced by taking the shot in broad daylight with the intended target being the leader of the free world? It's not a difficult shot when done on paper with range conditions. I think the psychological aspect of the shot is often overlooked/rarely considered. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: BS. Been recreated mnay times. My high school buddies did it with a deer stand shooting into a draw with paper targets. Rifle was an iron sighted #4 Enfield since none of us owned a Carcano.  For the record, we also duplicated the MLK shooting with the same rifle. This is the sort of thread that convinces me that a hell of a lot of GD has never touched a rifle outside a video game. How did you duplicate the stress levels that would be induced by taking the shot in broad daylight with the intended target being the leader of the free world? It's not a difficult shot when done on paper with range conditions. I think the psychological aspect of the shot is often overlooked/rarely considered. You are projecting your own nervousness here. According to your theory, Nobody could ever be shot. Not everybody is you. For some people, extra pressure helps them focus. |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/30/2023 12:22:32 PM EDT
[#18]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I had never heard of that before either. Back in the day I heard that the Warren Commission had used two if not more rifle experts in order to test the rifle and approximately the same conditions out. Maybe Hathcock was one of those. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Have we been able to even confirm which of those two sources supposedly cited Hathcock? I had never heard of that before either. Back in the day I heard that the Warren Commission had used two if not more rifle experts in order to test the rifle and approximately the same conditions out. Maybe Hathcock was one of those. If Hathcock were crying foul about how the Warren Commission captured his expert opinion, I think we'd have heard of that by now. At this point, I remain highly dubious. |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/30/2023 12:22:34 PM EDT
[#19]
Quote HistoryQuoted: The pristine magic bullet was not the head shot. _ According to the Warren Commissions theory. In reality we really don’t know which one it actually was. |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/30/2023 12:23:04 PM EDT
[#20]
I had an Carcano just like LHO's. Made in the same factory (Terni IIRC) however I did not have a crappy scope, I had the crappy iron sights. At the range I set up three targets, 26yds, 50yds and 75yds (probably not the exact distances, this was long ago but I did set them up at the range LHO made his shots.
I made three good hits and beat LHO's time by 1 1/2 seconds. My targets were stationary, couldn't find a friend who would drive a convertible limo down range with a few watermelons on the trunk but the shots were not difficult. So either I am better than Hathcock (No freakin' way in hell) or someone is lying to you. I bet any of our C&R guys with the same rifle (only a collector would have a M39 Carcano) and our good shooters could probably cut the time in half. |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/30/2023 12:23:35 PM EDT
[#21]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Do you agree that the Warren Commission is the swamp ? _ Deflection: a common tactic of conspiracy theorists when shown to be wrong. |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/30/2023 12:23:55 PM EDT
[#22]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I've been there, and looked out the window to the X they have painted on the street. A half ass rifle shooter could make that shot easy. |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/30/2023 12:25:33 PM EDT
[#23]
Quote HistoryQuoted: The issue is the absolute impossibility that one pristine bullet caused all that carnage while defying the laws of physics a couple three times. The Swamp killed Kennedy because he was not going to cave to the military industrial complex . Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: CBS recreated this in 1967 and an old man was able to get three head shots on 5.2 seconds. What's the issue here? The issue is the absolute impossibility that one pristine bullet caused all that carnage while defying the laws of physics a couple three times. The Swamp killed Kennedy because he was not going to cave to the military industrial complex . No, the issue in this thread is whether those shots were possible. Another issue common to any topic involving conspiracy theories is the inability to stay on subject. We are looking at but one aspect of the claims rejecting the prevailing account. That aspect is whether the shots would have been possible by a semi-competent marksman, so equipped. |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/30/2023 12:25:35 PM EDT
[#24]
Quote HistoryQuoted: More than I’ve cared to, actually, but the Magic Bullet was not the head shot. The Swamp killed Kennedy and the head shot came from the front. _ Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: The issue is the absolute impossibility that one pristine bullet caused all that carnage while defying the laws of physics a couple three times. The Swamp killed Kennedy because he was not going to cave to the military industrial complex . Ain’t seen many people shot in the head with a rifle have you? More than I’ve cared to, actually, but the Magic Bullet was not the head shot. The Swamp killed Kennedy and the head shot came from the front. _ I’m willing to bet good money you’ve never read even the summary of the Warren report, let alone its entirety. And that you’re making all of these statements based on an amalgamation of conspiracy theories that have zero basis in fact, have already been debunked many times over, and are perpetuated repeatedly on this site every time this conversation comes up. The truth, as they say, is out there. The best part is, were this to happen today, no one would question the shot came from the Texas School Book Depository. Applying the technology that would prove that now to what happened on November 22, 1963 is never good enough for people, though, because they’ve been jaded and twisted by 60 years of conspiracies. Even though this mystery has been easily solved for at least 10 of those 60 years now Nothing I can say here will change your mind. I stopped trying in GD several of these discussions ago. Now I just sit back with the popcorn like Michael Jackson So, please continue….from the front, you were saying? |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/30/2023 12:26:16 PM EDT
[#25]
Quote HistoryQuoted: According to the Warren Commissions theory. In reality we really don’t know which one it actually was. They recovered frag from his head and the "stretcher" bullet that is far from pristine. Unless you believe the evidence is falsified it's pretty obvious both of the recovered projectiles hit stuff. |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/30/2023 12:28:39 PM EDT
[#26]
Quote HistoryQuoted: You are projecting your own nervousness here. According to your theory, Nobody could ever be shot. Not everybody is you. For some people, extra pressure helps them focus. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: BS. Been recreated mnay times. My high school buddies did it with a deer stand shooting into a draw with paper targets. Rifle was an iron sighted #4 Enfield since none of us owned a Carcano. For the record, we also duplicated the MLK shooting with the same rifle. This is the sort of thread that convinces me that a hell of a lot of GD has never touched a rifle outside a video game. How did you duplicate the stress levels that would be induced by taking the shot in broad daylight with the intended target being the leader of the free world? It's not a difficult shot when done on paper with range conditions. I think the psychological aspect of the shot is often overlooked/rarely considered. You are projecting your own nervousness here. According to your theory, Nobody could ever be shot. Not everybody is you. For some people, extra pressure helps them focus. He’s actually spot on as to why Oswald totally missed the first ( easiest ) shot. He scored a hit with the next shot and high tailed it outta there. The Swamp green lighted the frontal shot when it became instantly apparent that the peacenik Catholic President was still alive. |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/30/2023 12:29:40 PM EDT
[#27]
Quote HistoryQuoted: According to the Warren Commissions theory. In reality we really don’t know which one it actually was. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: The pristine magic bullet was not the head shot. _ According to the Warren Commissions theory. In reality we really don’t know which one it actually was. fair enough _ |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/30/2023 12:31:48 PM EDT
[#28]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Deflection: a common tactic of conspiracy theorists when shown to be wrong. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Do you agree that the Warren Commission is the swamp ? _ Deflection: a common tactic of conspiracy theorists when shown to be wrong. Projection says “ hold my vodka “. I’m trying to see where you’re coming from so I know how to educate you. Appreciate my time on this. Do you agree that the Warren Commission is the swamp ? _ |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/30/2023 12:32:46 PM EDT
[#29]
Quote HistoryQuoted: He’s actually spot on as to why Oswald totally missed the first ( easiest ) shot. He scored a hit with the next shot and high tailed it outta there. The Swamp green lighted the frontal shot when it became instantly apparent that the peacenik Catholic President was still alive. So someone knew that Oswald missed and was not going to take another shot, radioed someone to take the shot, and they took the shot. They did all of this in four seconds? |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/30/2023 12:33:17 PM EDT
[#30]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I've been there, and looked out the window to the X they have painted on the street. A half ass rifle shooter could make that shot easy. |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/30/2023 12:34:36 PM EDT
[#31]
Quote HistoryQuoted: No, the issue in this thread is whether those shots were possible. Another issue common to any topic involving conspiracy theories is the inability to stay on subject. We are looking at but one aspect of the claims rejecting the prevailing account. That aspect is whether the shots would have been possible by a semi-competent marksman, so equipped. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: CBS recreated this in 1967 and an old man was able to get three head shots on 5.2 seconds. What's the issue here? The issue is the absolute impossibility that one pristine bullet caused all that carnage while defying the laws of physics a couple three times. The Swamp killed Kennedy because he was not going to cave to the military industrial complex . No, the issue in this thread is whether those shots were possible. Another issue common to any topic involving conspiracy theories is the inability to stay on subject. We are looking at but one aspect of the claims rejecting the prevailing account. That aspect is whether the shots would have been possible by a semi-competent marksman, so equipped. With iron sights the shots were stupid simple. The cheesy optic probably made it less simple ( especially under the stress of totally missing the first shot ) _ |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/30/2023 12:35:11 PM EDT
[#32]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Projection says “ hold my vodka “. I’m trying to see where you’re coming from so I know how to educate you. Appreciate my time on this. Do you agree that the Warren Commission is the swamp ? _ You’ve changed the subject. The comment you made was on the condition of the bullet and the path it took. I’ve informed you that the bullet wasn’t pristine(this is no mystery as there are pictures of it and an ACTUAL unfired one for comparison) and the “magical” path it took, again easily disproven. Now, you want to switch gears. That’s what you people do. Fuck that, I’m not playing the conspiracist’s game. |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/30/2023 12:35:42 PM EDT
[#33]
Quote HistoryQuoted: They recovered frag from his head and the "stretcher" bullet that is far from pristine. Unless you believe the evidence is falsified it's pretty obvious both of the recovered projectiles hit stuff. I think you misjudged what I’m saying. I’m not saying it was pristine or that it didn’t hit anything. My point is that a rifle bullet doesn’t necessarily have to be severely deformed to cause such catastrophic damage. |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/30/2023 12:37:20 PM EDT
[#34]
Quote HistoryQuoted: 1. Oswald didn't know where the motorcade was going. It made a left turn and then a right turn to enter Dealey Plaza unannounced. Oh, and ... The car, a blue Lincoln Continental, is an open air convertible ... |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/30/2023 12:38:40 PM EDT
[#35]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Moving? No. Lol Edit: if I did, then mostlikely not consistently. You seriously cannot hit a target moving slowly away from you at 60 yards?  That's roughly the distance from my kitchen door to the trash can and I routinely kill coyotes with a .22 Magnum bolt gun from a standing position.
|
|
|
|
Posted: 10/30/2023 12:39:30 PM EDT
[#36]
Quote HistoryQuoted: You’ve changed the subject. The comment you made was on the condition of the bullet and the path it took. I’ve informed you that the bullet wasn’t pristine(this is no mystery as there are pictures of it and an ACTUAL unfired one for comparison) and the “magical” path it took, again easily disproven. Now, you want to switch gears. That’s what you people do. Fuck that, I’m not playing the conspiracist’s game. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Projection says “ hold my vodka “. I’m trying to see where you’re coming from so I know how to educate you. Appreciate my time on this. Do you agree that the Warren Commission is the swamp ? _ You’ve changed the subject. The comment you made was on the condition of the bullet and the path it took. I’ve informed you that the bullet wasn’t pristine(this is no mystery as there are pictures of it and an ACTUAL unfired one for comparison) and the “magical” path it took, again easily disproven. Now, you want to switch gears. That’s what you people do. Fuck that, I’m not playing the conspiracist’s game. You know where I’m going with this and no amount of verbiage is gettin you outta checkmate. Is the Warren Commission the swamp ? _ |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/30/2023 12:40:26 PM EDT
[#37]
Quote HistoryQuoted: You’ve changed the subject. The comment you made was on the condition of the bullet and the path it took. I’ve informed you that the bullet wasn’t pristine(this is no mystery as there are pictures of it and an ACTUAL unfired one for comparison) and the “magical” path it took, again easily disproven. Now, you want to switch gears. That’s what you people do. Fuck that, I’m not playing the conspiracist’s game. They have to protect the hubris and jingosim that people woke up with on 12-7-1941,11-22-1963, and 9-11-2001. Pretending it can't happen fosters the attitude that leads to it happening again. |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/30/2023 12:40:35 PM EDT
[#38]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Unannounced? That very series of turns was published in the newspaper, at least a day prior. A map, and a text description of the route: ... At Main and Houston, it will turn to Elm and then go out Stemmons... Oh, and ... The car, a blue Lincoln Continental, is an open air convertible ... Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: 1. Oswald didn't know where the motorcade was going. It made a left turn and then a right turn to enter Dealey Plaza unannounced. Oh, and ... The car, a blue Lincoln Continental, is an open air convertible ... Exactly. How else would ALL those people be out there and ready to watch him go by? |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/30/2023 12:40:57 PM EDT
[#39]
Quote HistoryQuoted: The "upper back" shot was the back of his neck, which is an even smaller target than his head. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: It was what... a miss, a head shot, and upper back, hit? That's a spread of probably... 12 inches or more? At ~80 yards? He got lucky with the head shot. But that was one of three. The "upper back" shot was the back of his neck, which is an even smaller target than his head. He wasn't aiming at the neck. |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/30/2023 12:42:28 PM EDT
[#40]
A bit of Carcano trivia.
They were originally all 6.5mm, eventually the Italians decided they needed more power and came up with the 7.35mm however war was coming and there wasn't time to rearm so they went back to the 6.5mm. Later in the war ammo and gun shortages forced the axis into rebarreling the Carcanos to 8x57mm, the standard german rifle cartridge. Apparently it worked well enough though today folk are warnd this conversion is a bit on the unsafe side. Oh, the Carcano held one of the Italian militaries secret weapons. Gain twist rifling. Yes it also worked but later the general consensus was it was not worth the effort. The rifles were strong and accurate enough but in my opinion the fixed sights sucked. I know the rifle could do it but have no clue on what the truth might be. This last decade+ has taught me to not believe a damn word the .gov says. |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/30/2023 12:43:00 PM EDT
[#41]
Quote HistoryQuoted: the Carcano is nowhere the crap rifle it was made out to be. It had huge numbers for foreign nation buys. It's a pretty decent rifle. I don't think any nation adopted a crap rifle as standard issue. |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/30/2023 12:44:30 PM EDT
[#42]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I don't think any nation adopted a crap rifle as standard issue. Let me introduce you to the 1888 Chinese Mauser. 
|
|
|
|
Posted: 10/30/2023 12:45:35 PM EDT
[#43]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Hathcock was a LCpl Marine MP at the time. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: I had never heard of that before either. Back in the day I heard that the Warren Commission had used two if not more rifle experts in order to test the rifle and approximately the same conditions out. Maybe Hathcock was one of those. Hathcock was a LCpl Marine MP at the time. Boom. |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/30/2023 12:45:57 PM EDT
[#44]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Yes, but you're looking at it from a single-shot perspective. You are quantifying this by thinking, I could easily be here in this window, aim and fire one shot with a rifle at that X and get a hit at that distance. Things you aren't taking into account: - It was 3 shots in just under 6 seconds on a bolt action rifle. Two have to be hits. - Target was moving. Albeit slowly, it was moving. - Stress (time, cover, ensuring you're not seen/stopped by others in the building, etc) - Tree and foliage in the way (at the time). - Crappy rifle and crappy ammo. I'm not saying that Oswald didn't do it - just pointing out the absurdity of simply going to Dealey Plaza, into the TSBD and looking out the window thinking, "wow - what an easy shot". Bullshit. |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/30/2023 12:46:07 PM EDT
[#45]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Unannounced? That very series of turns was published in the newspaper, at least a day prior. A map, and a text description of the route: ... At Main and Houston, it will turn to Elm and then go out Stemmons... Oh, and ... The car, a blue Lincoln Continental, is an open air convertible ... Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: 1. Oswald didn't know where the motorcade was going. It made a left turn and then a right turn to enter Dealey Plaza unannounced. Oh, and ... The car, a blue Lincoln Continental, is an open air convertible ... This. The route was published in advance. And I think it was a 10 mile route in the open air convertible. |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/30/2023 12:46:42 PM EDT
[#46]
In a way it's two shots in six seconds because the timer starts with the first shot.
|
|
|
|
Posted: 10/30/2023 12:47:28 PM EDT
[#47]
Quote HistoryQuoted: You seriously cannot hit a target moving slowly away from you at 60 yards? That's roughly the distance from my kitchen door to the trash can and I routinely kill coyotes with a .22 Magnum bolt gun from a standing position.Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Moving? No. Lol Edit: if I did, then mostlikely not consistently. You seriously cannot hit a target moving slowly away from you at 60 yards? That's roughly the distance from my kitchen door to the trash can and I routinely kill coyotes with a .22 Magnum bolt gun from a standing position.https://www.youtube.com/shorts/vaiRbx4W6Tg https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G1rqtLrXk_U Even under duress this isn't a difficult shot with a supported and scoped battle rifle. |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/30/2023 12:47:40 PM EDT
[#48]
|
|
|
|
Posted: 10/30/2023 12:47:54 PM EDT
[#49]
Quote HistoryQuoted: You know where I’m going with this and no amount of verbiage is gettin you outta checkmate. Is the Warren Commission the swamp ? _ No I actually don’t, and I don’t care. You’ve moved the goalposts. There’s no checkmate, because I’ve left the table after you’ve decided to make your own rules. Argue your falsehoods with someone who is dumb enough to fall for them. |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/30/2023 12:48:04 PM EDT
[#50]
Quote HistoryQuoted: You know where I'm going with this and no amount of verbiage is gettin you outta checkmate. Is the Warren Commission the swamp ? _ Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: Projection says " hold my vodka ". I'm trying to see where you're coming from so I know how to educate you. Appreciate my time on this. Do you agree that the Warren Commission is the swamp ? _ You've changed the subject. The comment you made was on the condition of the bullet and the path it took. I've informed you that the bullet wasn't pristine(this is no mystery as there are pictures of it and an ACTUAL unfired one for comparison) and the "magical" path it took, again easily disproven. Now, you want to switch gears. That's what you people do. Fuck that, I'm not playing the conspiracist's game. You know where I'm going with this and no amount of verbiage is gettin you outta checkmate. Is the Warren Commission the swamp ? _ |
|
|
Win a FREE Membership!
Sign up for the ARFCOM weekly newsletter and be entered to win a free ARFCOM membership. One new winner* is announced every week!
You will receive an email every Friday morning featuring the latest chatter from the hottest topics, breaking news surrounding legislation, as well as exclusive deals only available to ARFCOM email subscribers.
AR15.COM is the world's largest firearm community and is a gathering place for firearm enthusiasts of all types.
From hunters and military members, to competition shooters and general firearm enthusiasts, we welcome anyone who values and respects the way of the firearm.
Subscribe to our monthly Newsletter to receive firearm news, product discounts from your favorite Industry Partners, and more.
Copyright © 1996-2024 AR15.COM LLC. All Rights Reserved.
Any use of this content without express written consent is prohibited.
AR15.Com reserves the right to overwrite or replace any affiliate, commercial, or monetizable links, posted by users, with our own.
Attached File