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Posted: 3/30/2018 2:24:22 PM EDT
[#1]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I'm going to be in them minority here, but demanding fuel economy standards have made vehicles better than ever before. Cities have smog problems largely because of cars sitting in bumper to bumper traffic. In the 1970s, those idling cars were polluting worse than the same cars doing 55mph on the highway, because they idled rich. Since then, a lot of the gasoline engine emissions development has been toward making gasoline engines idle leaner. Diesels have always idled lean. At idle, a diesel is running so lean that it is almost completely running on air, because you throttle them down by leaning them out. I have taken a 1980s F-250 diesel through emissions testing and gotten a result of 'zero measurable emissions', because the testing is done at idle (the condition where cars are cranking out smog in the cities). I've done the same with 1980s VW diesels. Putting dipshit, brain damaged, liberal activists in positions where they set government policies on industry regulations, is what has been killing the economy in this country. It doesn't save the environment, doesn't really advance technology (though it does occasionally do it by accident), and doesn't make life better, because it results in government by 'feels', and that leads to tossing out what actually works, in favor of unicorn farts and rainbows. |
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Posted: 3/30/2018 2:27:39 PM EDT
[#2]
Ive been skimming this thread, Will toyota hiluxes be importable now?
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Posted: 3/30/2018 2:28:49 PM EDT
[#3]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I don't really care if you consider solar energy as the primary sustainable source of energy, but its not accurate to characterize sustainable energy that way. The economics for solar can make sense in many cases. I haven't looked into this for some time, but in a place like Arizona, where there is ~220 W/m2 of solar (based on memory, this could be wrong), the NPV of installing solar panels can make sense. The research side of conversion efficiency is still strong, which is great. At the end of they day, a super long term plan focuses on finite resources that outweigh other finite resources. FWIW I'm a chemical engineer by education, where thermodynamics and economics are the primary bases of my education. I won't touch on the logical fallacies that can be drawn Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted: That's a viewpoint backed up by the laws of thermodynamics and economics, meaning it's neither "sad" nor "happy"; it's simply that things like solar at this point are boondoggle projects that get fewer watts of energy into the grid per unit expended than drilling wells. Maybe one day, but every government subsidy pushes that day further off because why improve your efficiency when you're getting bukkaked with taxpayer money? FWIW I'm a chemical engineer by education, where thermodynamics and economics are the primary bases of my education. I won't touch on the logical fallacies that can be drawn |
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Posted: 3/30/2018 2:30:53 PM EDT
[#4]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Curious.. what are the negatives for consumers for higher gas milage standards? How is this a win for us? Make the vehicle lighter, or obscene and expensive technology. Since most huge vehicles are still in the 10-12 MPG range today, I dont see how this would have even been possible to achieve so your big trucks and SUVs would have likely been banned. Which is what the communists wanted in the first place. |
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Posted: 3/30/2018 2:32:58 PM EDT
[#5]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I suspect this is untrue. They really do hold a TON of potential, over IC cars. There are so many fewer moving parts and less friction and heat wastes. It's just a matter of time for the MARKET to get us there, and FBHO for pushing this on us (and his predecessors) |
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Posted: 3/30/2018 2:35:14 PM EDT
[#6]
this gives me a chubby. now let's make diesels great again
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Posted: 3/30/2018 2:35:46 PM EDT
[#7]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I'm going to be in them minority here, but demanding fuel economy standards have made vehicles better than ever before. |
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Posted: 3/30/2018 2:36:08 PM EDT
[#8]
I'm just hoping that this allows for more design options. All cars and trucks look alike now because of air resistance standards (I think that's why anyway).
All I want is a 1940's looking pickup truck with airbags and air conditioning. |
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Posted: 3/30/2018 2:36:30 PM EDT
[#9]
Quote HistoryQuoted: The energy to operate them. Go to a machine shop that builds engines and try to spin an installed cam by hand .... |
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Posted: 3/30/2018 2:37:23 PM EDT
[#10]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Americans don't want what the government wants in the auto sector. I'll debate anyone on this. 
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Posted: 3/30/2018 2:38:34 PM EDT
[#11]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I'm going to be in them minority here, but demanding fuel economy standards have made vehicles better than ever before.  Attached File |
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Posted: 3/30/2018 2:38:46 PM EDT
[#12]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I suspect this is untrue. They really do hold a TON of potential, over IC cars. There are so many fewer moving parts and less friction and heat wastes. It's just a matter of time for the MARKET to get us there, and FBHO for pushing this on us (and his predecessors) But it's far from clear that this story embodies a wholesale shift in consumer behavior. People continue to own stuff. And people continue to not use everything they own in the most economically advantageous manner.
Even more telling is the non-growth of the EV market, at the same time the internal-combustion market has boomed. Almost 34 million vehicles have been sold over the past two years in the US alone - and nearly all them run on gas. |
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Posted: 3/30/2018 2:39:37 PM EDT
[#13]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
One of the first 5 posts in this thread was someone saying this was a bad idea, and implying that they want more government involvement in the auto sector. |
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Posted: 3/30/2018 2:40:20 PM EDT
[#14]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Please, for the love of God, I hope this brings back V8 engines and retards the trend for small turbo engines. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Please, for the love of God, I hope this brings back V8 engines and retards the trend for small turbo engines. Quoted:
Quoted:
I'd love to run a diesel again if they'd ditch the cow piss and exhaust filter Fack just wasted my 7777 post on this? |
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Posted: 3/30/2018 2:42:10 PM EDT
[#15]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Please, for the love of God, I hope this brings back V8 engines and retards the trend for small turbo engines. Late 60's V-8's, or mid-80's V8's? The last thing the world needs is more 160 horse, 0-60 in 10 seconds V-8's. |
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Posted: 3/30/2018 2:44:07 PM EDT
[#16]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I have always wondered how in the hell the government has the power to mandate fuel efficiency standards. |
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Posted: 3/30/2018 2:44:41 PM EDT
[#17]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Which V-8's? Late 60's V-8's, or mid-80's V8's? The last thing the world needs is more 160 horse, 0-60 in 10 seconds V-8's. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Please, for the love of God, I hope this brings back V8 engines and retards the trend for small turbo engines. Late 60's V-8's, or mid-80's V8's? The last thing the world needs is more 160 horse, 0-60 in 10 seconds V-8's. |
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Posted: 3/30/2018 2:45:08 PM EDT
[#18]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Which V-8's? Late 60's V-8's, or mid-80's V8's? The last thing the world needs is more 160 horse, 0-60 in 10 seconds V-8's. 
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Posted: 3/30/2018 2:48:55 PM EDT
[#19]
I would like a truck that gets 100mpg and 1000hp
 
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Posted: 3/30/2018 2:55:00 PM EDT
[#20]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I'm going to be in them minority here, but demanding fuel economy standards have made vehicles better than ever before. The current epa mpg regs and the nhtsa safety regs that are adding weight to vehicles are at odds. The outcome of this is increased cost of vehicles, demanding that you go farther into debt to buy the most basic of vehicles, limiting your financial freedom. And eventually making vehicles too costly for average people. |
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Posted: 3/30/2018 2:56:46 PM EDT
[#21]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I would like a truck that gets 100mpg and 1000hp 
Compact fusion reactor trucks! Thanks SkunkWorks! |
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Posted: 3/30/2018 3:00:53 PM EDT
[#22]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I would like a truck that gets 100mpg and 1000hp As I recall, the dyno was showing something in the 700 to 800 hp range, and the highway mpg (keeping a light foot on the throttle) was around 30. People have been doing engine swaps to put Cummins 3.9 (4BT) engines into half ton pickups. Should be interesting to see what could be done with those, if somebody wanted to sink some money into optimizing it. |
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Posted: 3/30/2018 3:02:26 PM EDT
[#23]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Nationwide the grid is already in the shitters. Now add another billion watts of load every day, sure it's gonna work out just fine. When was the last new power plant built in California? What's paying for the hundreds of thousands charging stations and how long it's going to take? Be real. Who'd have imagined the ability to make microprocessors that exists now, only 25 years ago? New York 5th Ave, 1900 & 1920. Look at the change.  Attached File Attached File |
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Posted: 3/30/2018 3:06:13 PM EDT
[#24]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Electric vehicles are going nowhere until they can charge on the fly from the road, like a slot car or electric trolley. What about faster charging? Something more balanced between a capacitor and a battery? I believe technology will get us there. But when? (I'm not arguing for the government to mandate it) |
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Posted: 3/30/2018 3:08:29 PM EDT
[#25]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Here's just one quick article that thinks like me so I don't have to type three pages on my phone to present my case. Goes over a fair bit of why they won't |
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Posted: 3/30/2018 3:09:09 PM EDT
[#26]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
You're right... but you also underestimate how fast industry and technology move when there is money to be made? Who'd have imagined the ability to make microprocessors that exists now, only 25 years ago? New York 5th Ave, 1900 & 1920. Look at the change. https://www.AR15.Com/media/mediaFiles/46582/1900-499192.JPG https://www.AR15.Com/media/mediaFiles/46582/1920-499193.JPG Look at the public transportation, that's what you gonna get. Electric vehicle manufacturers are just like the solar/wind energy industry, they are not self-sustainable. |
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Posted: 3/30/2018 3:14:08 PM EDT
[#27]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Who gonna pay for all of these things? Look at the public transportation, that's what you gonna get. Electric vehicle manufacturers are just like the solar/wind energy industry, they are not self-sustainable. |
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Posted: 3/30/2018 3:24:19 PM EDT
[#28]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Thanks. I'll read it. But, it is unfair to point out no one is buying EVs right now, as they aren't that great yet... they are in their infancy. - Charging time vs refueling time. - Infrastructure for recharging - Cost to purchase - Range (and loss of range to cold weather) And that's with MILLIONS of taxpayer money going into all that... they still aren't gaining market share. |
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Posted: 3/30/2018 3:24:54 PM EDT
[#29]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
You're right... but you also underestimate how fast industry and technology move when there is money to be made? Who'd have imagined the ability to make microprocessors that exists now, only 25 years ago? If it's viable enough for them to make bank, then do it. being funneled to these 'green' industries. The 'changes' in your pictures had nothing to do with government force |
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Posted: 3/30/2018 3:29:53 PM EDT
[#30]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Not a fan of this. I would rather my vehicle get 50mpg than 15mpg...but this isn't gonna ruin my life. |
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Posted: 3/30/2018 3:33:58 PM EDT
[#31]
I don’t think this decision is going to make much of a difference. I’ve sat down with the heads of three of the Alabama OEM facilities and everyone of them said the same thing. They are too far down the road in development and investment to just stop the path towards better fuel efficiency. The introduction of new materials to light-weight vehicles, new engine tech, electric tech, etc. is still moving forward. It will allow them to throttle back expectations as the EPA targets were damn near impossible to hit, but the things they have been working on will get refined and implemented in product models moving forward.
The introduction of electric vehicles has done more to further hybrid development than 100% EV development. Most cars produced in the next 20years will still be gas powered but with hybrid tech seeing strong emergence. This could however open the doors to other competition from afar from new manufacturers not yet in the US or models currently not sold in the US via Mehindra, Toyota (Hilux), etc. |
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Posted: 3/30/2018 3:37:20 PM EDT
[#32]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Good start stop fuck off There's government thinking for you. 
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Posted: 3/30/2018 3:38:37 PM EDT
[#33]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Not a fan of this. I would rather my vehicle get 50mpg than 15mpg...but this isn't gonna ruin my life.
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Posted: 3/30/2018 3:40:33 PM EDT
[#34]
How long til a judge in Hawaii blocks it.
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Posted: 3/30/2018 3:47:46 PM EDT
[#35]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Provably false. The following graphic shows that the regulatory era only changed a trend that would have self-corrected. https://www.AR15.Com/media/mediaFiles/217005/Fuel_History-499165.JPG Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
I'm going to be in them minority here, but demanding fuel economy standards have made vehicles better than ever before. https://www.AR15.Com/media/mediaFiles/217005/Fuel_History-499165.JPG |
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Posted: 3/30/2018 3:49:26 PM EDT
[#36]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I read an article a year or two back that said "start/stop" will save most drivers two gallons of gasoline per year. Over ten years, it will save drivers 20 gallons, and at $3 per gallon, that's $60 in savings, while "start/stop" costs about an additional $250 per vehicle. There's government thinking for you. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Good start stop fuck off There's government thinking for you. |
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Posted: 3/30/2018 3:56:49 PM EDT
[#37]
If the demand for fuel efficient cars is there then the companies will make them.
Don't force them to make products their consumers don't want. |
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Posted: 3/30/2018 3:58:22 PM EDT
[#38]
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Posted: 3/30/2018 4:08:35 PM EDT
[#39]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
That's fine, but I somehow don't believe the cost of cars is going to drop 20%. |
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Posted: 3/30/2018 5:23:35 PM EDT
[#40]
Wish they’d fix the BS they put on tractors, tier whatever.
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Posted: 3/30/2018 5:45:27 PM EDT
[#41]
I think auto makers have had it wrong all along.
Deisel or gas over electric over the road trucks. Maybe turbine over electric that might burn anything not just Deisel. Hybred pickups. Magpul plastic body panels for complete durability on all cars trucks. {hail damage? fucketh you} Two cycle gas engines. But really Ofuckface and his band of cuntcommiecocksukers had it in mind to limit peoples ability to afford cars and trucks and push them into mass transit. We have no mass transit in most of the country. {they don't care we can just foad} And the fucking government shouldn't dictate what any industry can do. Mahh gas cans, light bulbs and fucking terlets. You guys know those tags that are not to be removed? Yea I pull every fucking one off. Those shower heads that only spray enough water to wet you down? Yea I drill or remove every limiter. Light bulbs that are actually light bulbs? Actually I kind of like the new LEDs.
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Posted: 3/30/2018 6:00:52 PM EDT
[#42]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Inductive Charging. It could happen in cities. What about faster charging? Something more balanced between a capacitor and a battery? I believe technology will get us there. But when? (I'm not arguing for the government to mandate it) |
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Posted: 3/30/2018 6:05:43 PM EDT
[#43]
Make cars not a bunch of overpriced soulless blobs again!
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Posted: 3/30/2018 6:12:33 PM EDT
[#44]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Curious.. what are the negatives for consumers for higher gas milage standards? How is this a win for us? Do you like being lied to? If things keep going....that's what is going to happen. Gov't can set ridiculous standards with the swipe of a pen. Achieving those standards is whole other ball game. |
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Posted: 3/30/2018 6:14:17 PM EDT
[#45]
Can we PLEASE get the ethanol removed from our gas?
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Posted: 3/30/2018 6:32:48 PM EDT
[#46]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Can we PLEASE get the ethanol removed from our gas? |
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Posted: 3/30/2018 6:35:55 PM EDT
[#47]
More good news for Tesla.
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Posted: 3/30/2018 6:51:24 PM EDT
[#48]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Can we PLEASE get the ethanol removed from our gas? |
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Posted: 3/30/2018 6:53:59 PM EDT
[#49]
Good, now Ford can put v8''s back in their trucks, hopefully as twin turbo models.
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Posted: 3/30/2018 7:10:44 PM EDT
[#50]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Curious.. what are the negatives for consumers for higher gas milage standards? How is this a win for us? |
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