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Posted: 10/23/2023 8:03:26 PM EDT
[#1]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Sorry this happened OP. Especially in today's economy, businesses are going tits up all the time. This, and the desire to know how to do things properly, is why I will spend money on tools and spend time on learning, in order to do most gun work myself. This is the way. I will buy a lathe and mill before paying a “gunsmith” |
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Posted: 10/23/2023 8:21:35 PM EDT
[#2]
Quote HistoryQuoted: From page 1.... Quote HistoryQuoted: From page 1.... Quoted: To answer, I’ve called, texted and messaged their business and owner on Facebook. No reply yet. Which doesn't answer my questions. You can call all day, but that doesn't mean a VM system took a message. Texting to cell yes, but if the business has a landline its doesn't work. Messaging on Facebook only works if Facebook messages are being monitored or forwarded. |
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Posted: 10/23/2023 8:22:42 PM EDT
[#3]
Quote HistoryQuoted: State of residence is Washington state. I did email the ATF, here’s their reply: “Under the assumption that you've reached out to them and they're not responding to you, I recommend looking the business up here: https://www.atf.gov/firearms/listing-federal-firearms-licensees and using the associated phone number to attempt to contact them. If that is unsuccessful there is nothing at the federal level we could do, as no federal law would necessarily been broken. However, I would check with your state attorney general office to see if there is any recourse you can take. Thanks Seattle Field Division” From the RUMINT I’ve gathered, this was not an ATF shutdown. With the current AWB in the state, there wasn’t enough cash flow to keep the business open. Which I can understand. But the ghosting is really what’s pissing me off. Willing to name the shop? I used to live in Sammamish, curious to know if it's a shop I've been to before that's now closed shop. |
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Posted: 10/23/2023 8:53:34 PM EDT
[#4]
I-5 guns in Lacey. I left messages on their voicemail until it said it was full. I emailed their webpage, I messaged their Facebook. I called their owner and left a voicemail, I texted the owner, all with no results.
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Posted: 10/23/2023 9:12:05 PM EDT
[#5]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I-5 guns in Lacey. I left messages on their voicemail until it said it was full. I emailed their webpage, I messaged their Facebook. I called their owner and left a voicemail, I texted the owner, all with no results. Yelp isn’t looking to good either. No positive reviews in over a year. |
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Posted: 10/23/2023 9:28:07 PM EDT
[#6]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I-5 guns in Lacey. I left messages on their voicemail until it said it was full. I emailed their webpage, I messaged their Facebook. I called their owner and left a voicemail, I texted the owner, all with no results. You got any friends or family that might be able to knock on a door? That seems to be the only option to make contact. From looking at his Facebook it looks like he was closed more than he was open. |
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Posted: 10/23/2023 9:57:41 PM EDT
[#7]
I-5 Guns was their DBA the business was under I-5 Enterprises LLC which went administratively inactive in 2021.
Book of Faces comments going back four weeks show OP is not the only one with guns MIA. Former employees started KP Gunworks so they might have another method of contacting the owner of I-5. Otherwise... I'm smelling fuckery afoot. |
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Posted: 10/23/2023 10:24:11 PM EDT
[#8]
Where to go a knockin' Contact Information 11120 Eustis Hunt Rd E Graham, WA 98338
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Posted: 10/23/2023 10:44:05 PM EDT
[#9]
On the other site you posted on, if you searched for I5 Guns, you'd see a thread about how they plan to reopen in a different city in a couple months.
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Posted: 10/23/2023 10:59:35 PM EDT
[#10]
Quote HistoryQuoted:  Never. You're just out the gun. Damn This is dumb, you don't want to have a gun of yours just floating around that's likely tied to you in someway. |
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Posted: 10/23/2023 11:03:32 PM EDT
[#11]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I can't make you transfer it I can surely make you wish you had Harumph! |
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Posted: 10/23/2023 11:04:16 PM EDT
[#12]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Civil matter. Send a certified letter demanding your gun back or you will be forced to file a suit in claims court. This ^^ Include your telephone number and an address so he doesn't have any excuse for not contacting you. kwg |
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Posted: 10/23/2023 11:06:12 PM EDT
[#13]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Tell us how often you threaten FFL's to transfer a firearm without you completing a Form 4473 and NICS. This should be funny. The thing is, an FFL should allow the customer to fill out a 4473 to satisfy Federal law and thus retrieve THEIR property rather than the FFL hiding behind Fedral law and being a theif. |
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Posted: 10/23/2023 11:15:20 PM EDT
[#14]
I would report it so if it pops up in a crime you have record of the loss.
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Posted: 10/23/2023 11:16:48 PM EDT
[#15]
Live by the 10x rule, if you screw me over for $1 I WILL get you back in some fashion for $10. Consequences be damned
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Posted: 10/23/2023 11:21:03 PM EDT
[#16]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Sooner rather than later. Time is not your friend. Yep! |
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Posted: 10/24/2023 12:07:57 AM EDT
[#17]
Quote HistoryQuoted: [/b] This is the way. I will buy a lathe and mill before paying a “gunsmith” Same here, good reputable long-term viable gunsmiths are backed up. I learned a long time ago to work on my own guns in such a way you cannot easily tell it has been touched. I just bought a muzzle loader that had been improperly stored (bore was great but the area around the nipple was roached). I took a series of files and then different grits of sandpaper and got most of the corrosion pock marks eliminated and "grained" the surface, finishing it up with plumb brown to match the original finish. It took me about three hours on a Saturday evening. A good smoke pole smith would have had it for months and would not be a bit better. |
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Posted: 10/24/2023 12:20:54 AM EDT
[#18]
Quote HistoryQuoted: maybe if you lived in an actual state, instead of just the "usa"? since you seem to live at the federal level, it seems to be a federal matter. 
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Posted: 10/24/2023 12:37:04 AM EDT
[#19]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I-5 guns in Lacey. I left messages on their voicemail until it said it was full. I emailed their webpage, I messaged their Facebook. I called their owner and left a voicemail, I texted the owner, all with no results. Your Attorney General's office of Consumer Affairs, or some such name, may also be able to help. As others have said, do it sooner rather than later. This case won't improve with age. |
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Posted: 10/24/2023 12:42:34 AM EDT
[#20]
A highly knowledgeable FFL comes on and tries to provide some help and useful, FACTUAL info and is attacked on all sides by ignorant cretins.
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Posted: 10/24/2023 1:15:42 AM EDT
[#21]
Well at least I’m not the only one apparently.
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Posted: 10/24/2023 1:27:26 AM EDT
[#22]
Call local law enforcement. Sounds kinda stole to me. Atf is probably a waste of time. They want to close ffls this ones already closed. No longer their problem. Local leo may tell you to sue them depending on state law but its a start.
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Posted: 10/24/2023 2:06:07 AM EDT
[#23]
Hire a private investigator to go and roust him. |
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Posted: 10/24/2023 11:09:00 AM EDT
[#24]
Quote HistoryQuoted: The thing is, an FFL should allow the customer to fill out a 4473 to satisfy Federal law and thus retrieve THEIR property rather than the FFL hiding behind Fedral law and being a theif. Well thank you Captain Obvious. |
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Posted: 10/24/2023 11:10:01 AM EDT
[#25]
Quote HistoryQuoted: A highly knowledgeable FFL comes on and tries to provide some help and useful, FACTUAL info and is attacked on all sides by ignorant cretins. Try six or more knowledgeable FFL's. |
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Posted: 10/24/2023 1:14:12 PM EDT
[#26]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Well thank you Captain Obvious. The problem is that you are not coming across as being reasonable. Based on your comments you appear to be willing to fuck with someone and their property while hiding behind Federal regulations. There is a WIDE gulf between you not completing the transfer due to the owner not qualifying for the firearm VS you slow rolling or outright not making yourself available for the property owner to satisfy Federal requirements for the transfer and thus retaining their property via fuckery. |
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Posted: 10/24/2023 1:34:38 PM EDT
[#27]
I like the idea of calling other FFLs on the theory that they gossip like old women and might know what happened with the guy. It's also possible that local LEOs spend spare time hanging out at gun shops exchanging gossip and might know what's up with the guy.
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Posted: 10/24/2023 1:47:10 PM EDT
[#28]
If he is married send the wife a message and mention filing a police report.
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Posted: 10/24/2023 2:01:30 PM EDT
[#29]
Quote HistoryQuoted: If he is married send the wife a message and mention filing a police report. after you've slept with said wife, of course. |
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Posted: 10/24/2023 2:55:46 PM EDT
[#30]
Quote HistoryQuoted: The problem is that you are not coming across as being reasonable. Based on your comments you appear to be willing to fuck with someone and their property while hiding behind Federal regulations. Quote HistoryQuoted: The problem is that you are not coming across as being reasonable. Based on your comments you appear to be willing to fuck with someone and their property while hiding behind Federal regulations. Did you read the thread? Again.........my comment was in response to posts by Krombompulos_Michael: "Not if he reports the gun as stolen and has it entered in NCIC." and "It’s not a false report if the owner is depriving him of his property." To those two bits of genius I wrote: "I'm an FFL, meaning I can lawfully deprive you of something you own as long as I want. You aren't getting your gun until you fillout the Form 4473 and pass NICS. For gunsmithing, you pay me before I return the firearm." If you stopped reading after the first sentence, sure, I understand your point. But my man, there's that whole second sentence. You can choose to ignore it, but there it is, explaining exactly why an FFL CANNOT lawfully transfer a firearm "you own". That second sentence explains exactly WHEN you get your gun....when you fill out the 4473! And the third sentence covers the gunsmithing exception. Nothing incorrect. Nothing unlawful. Nothing unbusinesslike. It's literally the standard business practice of every gun dealer in the country since 1968. Even more simply, just because it's your property doesn't necessarily mean the FFL can hand it to you. There is a WIDE gulf between you not completing the transfer due to the owner not qualifying for the firearm VS you slow rolling or outright not making yourself available for the property owner to satisfy Federal requirements for the transfer and thus retaining their property via fuckery. Again, no shit. Nothing I wrote says I "slow roll" or don't make myself available for the transfer. If I don't do the transfer, I don't get paid. I'm a business and guess what? GETTING PAID is the point. Unbelievable. |
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