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Posted: 5/28/2021 9:40:58 AM EDT
[#1]
Quote HistoryQuoted: You are missing the ENTIRE point.......it is a self contained charging system. From the standpoint of a consumer, f you have a PHEV, you don't want to use gasoline unless you absolutely have to, because it costs 3x more than electricity per mile. From the standpoint of a manufacturer, the added manufacturing cost throwing in a genset will provide a lot less capability than simply adding more batteries, especially as batteries get cheaper and more energy dense. |
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Posted: 5/28/2021 9:41:07 AM EDT
[#2]
Quote HistoryQuoted: You are missing the ENTIRE point.......it is a self contained charging system. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Because "just add more batteries" will make more sense as batteries get cheaper. You are missing the ENTIRE point.......it is a self contained charging system. For the high performance world where costs is no concern hybrid is the best of both worlds Is long range endurance of gasoline with high speed performance EV It's perfect |
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Posted: 5/28/2021 9:42:52 AM EDT
[#3]
Quote HistoryQuoted: So, as demand increases, prices will go down? Interesting. The same thing that happened with solar and semiconductors. The same thing that has already been happening in the battery industry for decades now. Demand skyrocketed. Prices plummeted. Capitalism... Science... The learning curve is a real thing. 
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Posted: 5/28/2021 9:44:48 AM EDT
[#4]
Quote HistoryQuoted: For the high performance world where costs is no concern hybrid is the best of both worlds Is long range endurance of gasoline with high speed performance EV It's perfect for high performance electric blows them both out of the water. hybrids are heavy. the only place hybrids win is distance, and only by a little bit over gas. the extra complexity and cost does not make it worth it. the only reason hybrids even existed in reasonable numbers is so Toyota could sell the tacoma in california. |
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Posted: 5/28/2021 9:45:03 AM EDT
[#5]
Quote HistoryQuoted: everyone is reaching so hard to find the extenuating circumstance where the vehicle won't work, they refuse to accept the fact it already does. there may be some changes around how travel is done, a chain of coffee shop/chargers off highway at select distances between major cities would be a superb business plan. Those changes, along with daddy government forcing it, are where the pushback will be. The benefits will have to appear to be better than the offset, and when the GD EV purists start with "Well you not having the capability to charge it is your problem, not mine" as their sales pitch it's a real damn wonder why people continue to think sticking with what they already have is a good idea. |
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Posted: 5/28/2021 9:46:28 AM EDT
[#6]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Because, in reality, if you remove all the hybrid shit and use a smaller more efficient engine, you get the similar mileage at a reduced cost. IIRC the jetta hybrid only got about 4mpg better in real life over the regular 1.4tsi. when you factor in the chart with mileage/ mpg the hybrid doesn't make much sense. the only logical next step is total elimination of the gas engine. I cannot believe these results you speak of are etched in stone and not able to be improved upon. Seems this is mainly an agenda driven issue. |
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Posted: 5/28/2021 9:47:04 AM EDT
[#7]
Quote HistoryQuoted: For the high performance world where costs is no concern hybrid is the best of both worlds Is long range endurance of gasoline with high speed performance EV It's perfect Thank you!!! This is too much of an agenda driven issue. |
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Posted: 5/28/2021 9:50:29 AM EDT
[#8]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Those changes, along with daddy government forcing it, are where the pushback will be. The benefits will have to appear to be better than the offset, and when the GD EV purists start with "Well you not having the capability to charge it is your problem, not mine" as their sales pitch it's a real damn wonder why people continue to think sticking with what they already have is a good idea. If they could just come up with a self contained charging system with electric vehicles it would be wonderful.........I wonder if they ever will? |
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Posted: 5/28/2021 9:51:45 AM EDT
[#9]
Quote HistoryQuoted: For the high performance world where costs is no concern hybrid is the best of both worlds Is long range endurance of gasoline with high speed performance EV It's perfect In the real world, where cost is a concern for 99% of people, "just add more batteries" will make more and more sense as batteries get better and cheaper. There are 500 mile EVs coming out next year |
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Posted: 5/28/2021 9:51:59 AM EDT
[#10]
Quote HistoryQuoted: From the standpoint of a consumer, f you have a PHEV, you don't want to use gasoline unless you absolutely have to, because it costs 3x more than electricity per mile. From the standpoint of a manufacturer, the added manufacturing cost throwing in a genset will provide a lot less capability than simply adding more batteries, especially as batteries get cheaper and more energy dense. That's fine for some people but a self charging system will be the holy grail of this new sort of propulsion system(s). For many people, charging the system is a problem. |
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Posted: 5/28/2021 9:52:13 AM EDT
[#11]
Quote HistoryQuoted: for high performance electric blows them both out of the water. hybrids are heavy. the only place hybrids win is distance, and only by a little bit over gas. the extra complexity and cost does not make it worth it. the only reason hybrids even existed in reasonable numbers is so Toyota could sell the tacoma in california. Not completely true An EV can win any drag race in the world But it will not win the 24 hours of Lemans Their endurance under high speed full load conditions is poor |
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Posted: 5/28/2021 9:52:19 AM EDT
[#12]
Quote HistoryQuoted: everyone is reaching so hard to find the extenuating circumstance where the vehicle won't work, they refuse to accept the fact it already does. there may be some changes around how travel is done, a chain of coffee shop/chargers off highway at select distances between major cities would be a superb business plan. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: No electric cars will never, ever, ever work unless they have 3,000 mile ranges and can recharge in 38 seconds. Also, putting outlets at parking spaces is literally impossible so they will never work anyway. It's an insurmountable task. everyone is reaching so hard to find the extenuating circumstance where the vehicle won't work, they refuse to accept the fact it already does. there may be some changes around how travel is done, a chain of coffee shop/chargers off highway at select distances between major cities would be a superb business plan. I have a coworker that has a Tesla model 3, and the only charge it once a week, on a 240V charger set on one of the lower amperage settings on Sundays. They don't even bother to mess with keeping it topped off, nor do they take advantage of charging it at work. I think they put about a little less than 100 miles a week on it, knowing their commute. I have another coworker that has a BMWi3, they do sometimes charge it at work, but otherwise use a 120V trickle charger at home, a couple times a week. I would guess they put 6 miles a day on it. For the majority of people an EV is probably doable right now, and that number will increase as prices drop and 480V chargers become more common on interstate routes. I get that it is not doable for a guy in the middle of Montana or Texas, but those people are over represented here. |
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Posted: 5/28/2021 9:53:40 AM EDT
[#13]
Quote HistoryQuoted: In the real world, where cost is a concern for 99% of people, "just add more batteries" will make more and more sense as batteries get cheaper. There are 500 mile EVs coming out next year Well, that's good. As time goes on if they can improve on that mileage range even more it will be a game changer. The charging will always remain a problem though for quite a few people. Too many people IMHO. That's a big "snag" that has to be overcome. |
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Posted: 5/28/2021 9:54:02 AM EDT
[#14]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I cannot believe these results you speak of are etched in stone and not able to be improved upon. Seems this is mainly an agenda driven issue. my agenda would be for everyone to be driving turbo gas cars. that's where I make my money. my intellectually honest side see's what's coming. The results, are basically the results. one of the issues of extending distance driven on hybrids is fuel ageing in the tank. if you really only drive 12 miles a day, plug in at night because its way cheaper, and your gas engine only starts every few months for a short while, the fuel in the tank becomes stale, after about a month its already started to degrade. in 8 months its garbage, in a year its problems. the split on this is using a system that has to start the gas engine constantly on and off, like most hybrids, which uses more fuel, which pushes them back down to where they aren't much more efficient then a lighter simpler gas engine, especially once cost is factored in. its not a solvable problem, it was a stop-gap. the next logical step is elimination of the gas engine. |
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Posted: 5/28/2021 9:55:22 AM EDT
[#15]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Not completely true An EV can win any drad race in the world But it will not win the 24 hours of Lemans Is their endurance under high speed full load conditions is poor lol How many people who own cars drag race them? How many people who own cars race them for 24 fucking hours straight? It's a performance metric that is meaningless irl The Model S Plaid, a four-door large sedan, already ties the Porsche 918 at Laguna Seca. |
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Posted: 5/28/2021 9:56:53 AM EDT
[#16]
Quote History |
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Posted: 5/28/2021 9:57:58 AM EDT
[#17]
Didn't read the whole thread. I'm going to guess these new "green" vehicles will only work with an internet connection. Phase 2 will only have the vehicles running when your social credit score is above some certain threshold.
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Posted: 5/28/2021 9:58:27 AM EDT
[#18]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Not completely true An EV can win any drag race in the world But it will not win the 24 hours of Lemans Their endurance under high speed full load conditions is poor Lemans (most motorsports) is test ground for technology, not the real world. an electric car will never win the Gumball 3000, but it will work to drive 1200 miles to see granny with a few changes in how travel is done. |
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Posted: 5/28/2021 9:58:29 AM EDT
[#19]
Quote HistoryQuoted: lol How many people who own cars drag race them? How many people who own cars race them for 24 fucking hours straight? It's a performance metric that is meaningless irl To a certain extent you are right Most likely the last hybrid cars that are going to still exist are going to be super cars More affordable hybrids like the prius or the kia niro are going to disappear long before they do |
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Posted: 5/28/2021 10:01:17 AM EDT
[#20]
Quote HistoryQuoted: my agenda would be for everyone to be driving turbo gas cars. that's where I make my money. my intellectually honest side see's what's coming. The results, are basically the results. one of the issues of extending distance driven on hybrids is fuel ageing in the tank. if you really only drive 12 miles a day, plug in at night because its way cheaper, and your gas engine only starts every few months for a short while, the fuel in the tank becomes stale, after about a month its already started to degrade. in 8 months its garbage, in a year its problems. the split on this is using a system that has to start the gas engine constantly on and off, like most hybrids, which uses more fuel, which pushes them back down to where they aren't much more efficient then a lighter simpler gas engine, especially once cost is factored in. its not a solvable problem, it was a stop-gap. the next logical step is elimination of the gas engine. That's a good point.....fuel does not last forever, it degrades and would have to be "bolstered" to stay "fresh" longer. That would probably have to improved upon also. Right now I see quite a few people who have lifestyles and live in areas where EV's are fine. But I do NOT see it becoming 100 percent without answering the charging problem and mileage limits of the 100 percent EV's. Those two things have to be improved upon for it to become feasible for most everyone IMHO. Utility companies will have to be allowed to expand and use an alternative fuel like nuclear for example for their new electrical generators, etc., also. Everyone driving EV's that are not self charging will require HUGE increases in electrical generation and I do NOT see nearly enough of this side of the equation discussed by the government, etc. In fact, all I hear from the libtards is they do NOT want new construction of power plants. |
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Posted: 5/28/2021 10:06:16 AM EDT
[#21]
Quote HistoryQuoted: The average American has a 16 mile each direction commute to work, which is doable with a 120V "trickle charger". Close to 60% of households have 2 cars. The average driver in the U.S. drives a little over 1k miles a year. I have a coworker that has a Tesla model 3, and the only charge it once a week, on a 240V charger set on one of the lower amperage settings on Sundays. They don't even bother to mess with keeping it topped off, nor do they take advantage of charging it at work. I think they put about a little less than 100 miles a week on it, knowing their commute. I have another coworker that has a BMWi3, they do sometimes charge it at work, but otherwise use a 120V trickle charger at home, a couple times a week. I would guess they put 6 miles a day on it. For the majority of people an EV is probably doable right now, and that number will increase as prices drop and 480V chargers become more common on interstate routes. I get that it is not doable for a guy in the middle of Montana or Texas, but those people are over represented here. The average person drives 13,000+ miles a year. Not 1,000. https://www.fhwa.dot.gov/ohim/onh00/bar8.htm |
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Posted: 5/28/2021 10:09:12 AM EDT
[#22]
Quote HistoryQuoted: If they could just come up with a self contained charging system with electric vehicles it would be wonderful.........I wonder if they ever will? I proposed in another thread that if anything, those types of hybrids are just a stop gap to get people over the fear of battery range. I think the Volt is a great example of that. I knew a few people who owned 1st generation Volts who then moved on to full EV's after a few years of ownership and realizing how little they used the gas engine. I think that's also part of why the second generation failed. No one who had bought a Volt prior really cared to upgrade to the same thing, and the 2nd generation Volt wasn't really good enough to push people still on the fence to buy it. Hybrids are still going to be part of the older manufacturers for some time. Most of the goals that they have released over the past year are not forcing 100% EV's but likely a mixed setup where at least everything has a hybrid driveline alongside fully EV options. |
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Posted: 5/28/2021 10:10:30 AM EDT
[#23]
Watch for a "mileage tax" when switching to electric or charging at home , that cuts into the "cheaper than gas" argument.
I have not seen any stats on reduced battery capacity / range from heater or AC use on electric vehicles . |
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Posted: 5/28/2021 10:18:15 AM EDT
[#24]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Watch for a "mileage tax" when switching to electric or charging at home , that cuts into the "cheaper than gas" argument. I have not seen any stats on reduced battery capacity / range from heater or AC use on electric vehicles . I have read that heating and air conditioning systems in an EV reduces the range by about 50%. No idea if true. Link "If the battery-electric vehicle (BEV) is to enter the affordable mainstream, it has to overcome the challenge of 50-60% loss of range from the impact of cabin heating, ventilation and air-conditioning (HVAC): cabin heating in the winter and A/C cooling in summer inflict an enormous draw on precious battery capacity." |
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Posted: 5/28/2021 10:40:37 AM EDT
[#25]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I have read that heating and air conditioning systems in an EV reduces the range by about 50%. No idea if true. Link "If the battery-electric vehicle (BEV) is to enter the affordable mainstream, it has to overcome the challenge of 50-60% loss of range from the impact of cabin heating, ventilation and air-conditioning (HVAC): cabin heating in the winter and A/C cooling in summer inflict an enormous draw on precious battery capacity." It's all very dependent on ambient temperature |
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Posted: 5/28/2021 10:42:30 AM EDT
[#26]
Quote HistoryQuoted: It's all very dependent on ambient temperature Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: I have read that heating and air conditioning systems in an EV reduces the range by about 50%. No idea if true. Link "If the battery-electric vehicle (BEV) is to enter the affordable mainstream, it has to overcome the challenge of 50-60% loss of range from the impact of cabin heating, ventilation and air-conditioning (HVAC): cabin heating in the winter and A/C cooling in summer inflict an enormous draw on precious battery capacity." It's all very dependent on ambient temperature Those are pretty alarming numbers though. And it does get quite cold up here for many months and quite hot in the South for many months. |
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Posted: 5/28/2021 10:51:01 AM EDT
[#27]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Not completely true An EV can win any drag race in the world But it will not win the 24 hours of Lemans Their endurance under high speed full load conditions is poor My diving is closer to the Lemans case than drag racing. |
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Posted: 5/28/2021 10:51:14 AM EDT
[#28]
Quote HistoryQuoted: That's a good point.....fuel does not last forever, it degrades and would have to be "bolstered" to stay "fresh" longer. That would probably have to improved upon also. Right now I see quite a few people who have lifestyles and live in areas where EV's are fine. But I do NOT see it becoming 100 percent without answering the charging problem and mileage limits of the 100 percent EV's. Those two things have to be improved upon for it to become feasible for most everyone IMHO. Utility companies will have to be allowed to expand and use an alternative fuel like nuclear for example for their new electrical generators, etc., also. Everyone driving EV's that are not self charging will require HUGE increases in electrical generation and I do NOT see nearly enough of this side of the equation discussed by the government, etc. In fact, all I hear from the libtards is they do NOT want new construction of power plants. man, I'm gonna be honest with you, I've tried EVERY argument. all of them, the reality is many are problems (power generation, grid) regardless of electric cars, others will be solved after a generation, there will always be a requirement for liquid fuels but those will quickly be the extenuating circumstances, however the vast, vast majority will be better served by electric cars. it is what it is. |
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Posted: 5/28/2021 10:54:20 AM EDT
[#29]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I have read that heating and air conditioning systems in an EV reduces the range by about 50%. No idea if true. Heating maybe. There are plenty of EVs that use resistive heating to heat the car. The Model Y is the first Tesla with a heat pump. AC/heat pump isn't going to cut your range by 50%. Link "If the battery-electric vehicle (BEV) is to enter the affordable mainstream, it has to overcome the challenge of 50-60% loss of range from the impact of cabin heating, ventilation and air-conditioning (HVAC): cabin heating in the winter and A/C cooling in summer inflict an enormous draw on precious battery capacity." Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Watch for a "mileage tax" when switching to electric or charging at home , that cuts into the "cheaper than gas" argument. I have not seen any stats on reduced battery capacity / range from heater or AC use on electric vehicles . I have read that heating and air conditioning systems in an EV reduces the range by about 50%. No idea if true. Heating maybe. There are plenty of EVs that use resistive heating to heat the car. The Model Y is the first Tesla with a heat pump. AC/heat pump isn't going to cut your range by 50%. Link "If the battery-electric vehicle (BEV) is to enter the affordable mainstream, it has to overcome the challenge of 50-60% loss of range from the impact of cabin heating, ventilation and air-conditioning (HVAC): cabin heating in the winter and A/C cooling in summer inflict an enormous draw on precious battery capacity." Heating maybe. Alot of EVs use resistive heating. The Model Y is the first Tesla with a heat pump. AC/heat pump HVAC isn't going to cut your battery in half. |
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Posted: 5/28/2021 10:57:41 AM EDT
[#30]
Some of these same arguments against it were probably said about the gas powered automobiles vs horses back in the 1920’s
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Posted: 5/28/2021 11:13:03 AM EDT
[#31]
Quote HistoryQuoted: The vast majority of people that own EVs do almost all their charging at home. If you're in a "shitty apartment or at your street parking space" and you buy an EV before charging is available, you're stupid. Quote HistoryQuoted: The vast majority of people that own EVs do almost all their charging at home. If you're in a "shitty apartment or at your street parking space" and you buy an EV before charging is available, you're stupid. Quoted: Very few would be charging at a station. The vast majority would be charging while you're at home/sleeping Quoted: That's part of my point. People using charging stations will likely be charging the full amount and taking 20+ minutes. Home charging will reduce volume but not by 75% I don't think, so you're going to end up with many stations being overcrowded and that's going to be a big factor that no one seems to be considering. The vast majority of people that own EVs do almost all their charging at home. If you're in a "shitty apartment or at your street parking space" and you buy an EV before charging is available, you're stupid. What happens when people can't buy anything else? Revamping our entire nation's infrastructure in a couple of decades isn't as easy as many seem to think. |
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Posted: 5/28/2021 11:19:07 AM EDT
[#32]
Quote HistoryQuoted: What happens when people can't buy anything else? Revamping our entire nation's infrastructure in a couple of decades isn't as easy as many seem to think. Adding plugs in parking lots isn't "Revamping our entire nation's infrastructure" jfc... 
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Posted: 5/28/2021 11:26:30 AM EDT
[#33]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Why would you run it down to 0%? It's statistically unlikely that when your vehicle runs out of range, you'll be within 10 feet or so of a source of refueling. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Let me know when I can recharge my EV from 0% to 100% in 5min anywhere in the country. Until then it’s an urban commuter thing. Why would you run it down to 0%? It's statistically unlikely that when your vehicle runs out of range, you'll be within 10 feet or so of a source of refueling. Whatever <15% Still not possible with EV. Can’t pull anything worth a shit either. Not everybody is an urban microcommuter. |
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Posted: 5/28/2021 11:41:14 AM EDT
[#34]
Quote HistoryQuoted: For the life of me I do NOT understand why hybrid vehicles are not the way of the future??? Some gas, some electricity......seems perfect and a self sustaining energy system with a bit of gasoline. Maybe tweak it and make better batteries eventually but use the gasoline part to charge the batteries. ETA: Also, tell me how semi truck haulers will ever adequately handle the travel with 100% electrical vehicles??? Air on kerosene and the rest on diesel, heavy fuel oils, and LNG. |
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Posted: 5/28/2021 11:41:59 AM EDT
[#35]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Lemans (most motorsports) is test ground for technology, not the real world. an electric car will never win the Gumball 3000, but it will work to drive 1200 miles to see granny with a few changes in how travel is done. "A few changes" might be code for a huge inconvenience. |
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Posted: 5/28/2021 11:45:06 AM EDT
[#36]
Quote HistoryQuoted: lol How many people who own cars drag race them? How many people who own cars race them for 24 fucking hours straight? It's a performance metric that is meaningless irl The Model S Plaid, a four-door large sedan, already ties the Porsche 918 at Laguna Seca. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Not completely true An EV can win any drad race in the world But it will not win the 24 hours of Lemans Is their endurance under high speed full load conditions is poor lol How many people who own cars drag race them? How many people who own cars race them for 24 fucking hours straight? It's a performance metric that is meaningless irl The Model S Plaid, a four-door large sedan, already ties the Porsche 918 at Laguna Seca. I wonder how long the battery would last in the S Plaid under those conditions. |
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Posted: 5/28/2021 11:47:21 AM EDT
[#37]
Quote HistoryQuoted: So, as demand increases, prices will go down? Interesting. Massive Production brings prices down. Advanced production of commodities brings prices down. Fracking stopped obamanomics. These things compete to affect pricing. Prior to the model T, cars were basically for the rich. |
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Posted: 5/28/2021 11:52:42 AM EDT
[#38]
Is it over yet? I don't see the po po coming to my door to grab my ICE vehicle? They dam well better be wearing a mask when they do...
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Posted: 5/28/2021 12:01:38 PM EDT
[#39]
If Kia made a hybrid SUV or CUV that were AWD I'd buy it but they insisted on Fail-Wheel-Drive on them.
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Posted: 5/28/2021 12:04:45 PM EDT
[#40]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Those changes, along with daddy government forcing it, are where the pushback will be. The benefits will have to appear to be better than the offset, and when the GD EV purists start with "Well you not having the capability to charge it is your problem, not mine" as their sales pitch it's a real damn wonder why people continue to think sticking with what they already have is a good idea. Also, 30 years of development changes things. Alot. EV's will become more practical with time. No one here is telling you or anyone else to get used to it. They are telling you that your requirements aren't applicable to everyone so others are adopting and/or will adopt EVs. Market forces should be allowed to operate. Civilization, technology, and economies are interactive and rapidly changing. No one is capable of seeing 30 years into the future. During the Carter years, he wanted to make sure that electricity production was not dependent on natural gas because known reserves had a 10 year life. At the time, little electricity production was natural gas fired. In the 80's, GE started building large Gas turbines. Fracking happened. Boom, electricity production is now moving to modular combined cycle plants. |
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Posted: 5/28/2021 12:09:44 PM EDT
[#41]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I cannot believe these results you speak of are etched in stone and not able to be improved upon. Seems this is mainly an agenda driven issue. The improvements in EV, are making the hybrid advantage disappear. |
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Posted: 5/28/2021 12:11:40 PM EDT
[#42]
Quote HistoryQuoted: man, I'm gonna be honest with you, I've tried EVERY argument. all of them, the reality is many are problems (power generation, grid) regardless of electric cars, others will be solved after a generation, there will always be a requirement for liquid fuels but those will quickly be the extenuating circumstances, however the vast, vast majority will be better served by electric cars. it is what it is. I hope so............. |
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Posted: 5/28/2021 12:13:03 PM EDT
[#43]
Quote HistoryQuoted: We have proved lots of people who didn't think they have the capability to charge it actually do. Also, 30 years of development changes things. Alot. EV's will become more practical with time. No one here is telling you or anyone else to get used to it. They are telling you that your requirements aren't applicable to everyone so others are adopting and/or will adopt EVs. Market forces should be allowed to operate. Civilization, technology, and economies are interactive and rapidly changing. No one is capable of seeing 30 years into the future. During the Carter years, he wanted to make sure that electricity production was not dependent on natural gas because known reserves had a 10 year life. At the time, little electricity production was natural gas fired. In the 80's, GE started building large Gas turbines. Fracking happened. Boom, electricity production is now moving to modular combined cycle plants. And in the same note, we've also proved that some people vastly overstate their actual charging capacities. I mean we have people who don't own electric cars trying to tell people that it's somehow normal to charge off of a 120v household electrical port due to some fuzzy math on limited commuting. And others thinking that a harbor freight generator is a perfectly reasonable way to charge a car. Just because you sit in a house that can easily retrofit extra solar polar and all the wiring to the garage that supports it doesn't mean everyone else can. Just look at our locations, for example. I'd need damn near twice the solar system you would for similar power. And when those issues are pointed out the only thing you can respond with is "Well is it really that much of an inconvenience to charge elsewhere?" and "I guess that's their own problem for not owning a house that can support it". Really, absolutely brilliant responses that are only paled by the new brand new one of "If you don't spend thousands of dollars on retrofitting this shit to buy an EV car you are literally slapping astronauts in the face" from the EV evangelist himself. |
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Posted: 5/28/2021 12:13:22 PM EDT
[#44]
Quote History[b]Originally Posted By . No one is capable of seeing 30 years into the future. AT&T did.   AT&T "You Will" Commercials (high quality) |
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Posted: 5/28/2021 12:15:14 PM EDT
[#45]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Range and refill are the only advantage of hybrids. The improvements in EV, are making the hybrid advantage disappear. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: I cannot believe these results you speak of are etched in stone and not able to be improved upon. Seems this is mainly an agenda driven issue. The improvements in EV, are making the hybrid advantage disappear. And I hope that continues to make this a non issue but right now if ONLY we could come up with an effective self charging sort of system. It would be the holy grail IMHO and push this right over the top and into a much more universal new era. |
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Posted: 5/28/2021 12:15:21 PM EDT
[#46]
The free market is a wonderful thing. Those wanting gas will go to a brand that offers it.
Honestly, I do hope Hyundai makes enormous strides in hydrogen and EV tech. I do think that will be better for all makers and models involved. The only thing stopping me from a Tundra is gas mileage... |
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Posted: 5/28/2021 12:16:41 PM EDT
[#47]
Quote HistoryQuoted: my agenda would be for everyone to be driving turbo gas cars. that's where I make my money. my intellectually honest side see's what's coming. The results, are basically the results. one of the issues of extending distance driven on hybrids is fuel ageing in the tank. if you really only drive 12 miles a day, plug in at night because its way cheaper, and your gas engine only starts every few months for a short while, the fuel in the tank becomes stale, after about a month its already started to degrade. in 8 months its garbage, in a year its problems. the split on this is using a system that has to start the gas engine constantly on and off, like most hybrids, which uses more fuel, which pushes them back down to where they aren't much more efficient then a lighter simpler gas engine, especially once cost is factored in. its not a solvable problem, it was a stop-gap. the next logical step is elimination of the gas engine. |
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Posted: 5/28/2021 12:16:43 PM EDT
[#48]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Lemans (most motorsports) is test ground for technology, not the real world. an electric car will never win the Gumball 3000, but it will work to drive 1200 miles to see granny with a few changes in how travel is done. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Not completely true An EV can win any drag race in the world But it will not win the 24 hours of Lemans Their endurance under high speed full load conditions is poor Lemans (most motorsports) is test ground for technology, not the real world. an electric car will never win the Gumball 3000, but it will work to drive 1200 miles to see granny with a few changes in how travel is done. There is no tangible benefit to making travel LESS convenient. |
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Posted: 5/28/2021 12:18:53 PM EDT
[#49]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Adding plugs in parking lots isn't "Revamping our entire nation's infrastructure" Yeah, its as simple as buying some additional outlets at HomeDepot and throwing them on some parking posts. No upgraded power infrastructure needed to add dozens/hundreds of simultaneous-usage 2kw outlets to each and every apartment and condo complex across the nation, right? Everyone knows the outlets come with their own self-contained power source! Your logic is adorable! 
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Posted: 5/28/2021 12:25:50 PM EDT
[#50]
Remember the old NiCad batteries in remote control cars that were huge and only lasted 15 minutes? That's what lithium ion powered EVs are today.
I'll buy an EV when the battery only weighs a few hundred pounds, I can get 500+ miles of range, and I can recharge my battery in a practical amount of time. Modern EVs are a solution to a problem that doesn't exist using battery tech that isn't up to the task of supporting widespread use. Until we see a giant leap to a next gen battery technology I just cannot see EVs replacing ICEs for personal use. |
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