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Put a puppy in a room full of toddlers and the only danger to the puppy is of the Lenny variety.  Even if it's the first time they've ever seen a puppy.  

I absolutely won't argue against the importance of fathers.  A good father is of critical importance.  

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Put a puppy in a room full of toddlers and the only danger to the puppy is of the Lenny variety.  Even if it's the first time they've ever seen a puppy.  

I absolutely won't argue against the importance of fathers.  A good father is of critical importance.  

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I remember reading a story about rhinos repeatedly being found dead in a nature preserve in ? South Africa.  The park rangers saw evidence of blunt trauma but couldn't figure out what was killing them.  They set up cameras and finally found the culprits:  Teenage elephants.  The latter were orphans and were never taught to leave the rhinos alone.  They were moved to a group containing adults and were quickly punished for trying to harm other animals.  As you point out, mammals need to be taught a lot of their proper behaviors.

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If you're going to continually try to attribute beliefs to me that I've been extremely vocal about not having, I'm done.  Everyone who's been following along can see what you're doing and if you'd like to retain some credibility here amongst the membership I'd rethink that strategy.

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non-concur.

The basic family unit survived from 1800-1965 ish.  so you would have to trace your causative effect and why there was a break of decades from ubiquitous electricity to the destruction of the basic family unit.

There have been upheavals in technology from the beginning of mankind.

If you want to pin any one technology of this sea change, its the pill.

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I don't know.  13 pages of discussion.  *Honest* is definitely subjective.  Everyone sees things through their own lens.  

If you're talking about communication between men and women, my husband and I manage to communicate just fine.  I imagine because we know each other and aren't trying to glean meaning from typed words coming from someone of whom we have minimal knowledge.  When I say something he has no doubt of what I mean and vice versa.  Hard to get that with strangers.  

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I always thought calling someone on their bullshit was communicating.

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I always thought calling someone on their bullshit was communicating.

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Is that what goes on in these threads?

I just see my brother-in-law.

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And then there's that.  

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Well there you go.  You made my point very nicely.

Communication is a clumsy thing.  It takes 13 pages of strangers going back and forth and yet.. nothing has really been resolved.

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I'm fifty-five.  Not that I see that age matters, since all this TRP stuff is supposed based on bedrock human nature that is universal and unchanged for millennia.  

As for the little snark about the small number women posters here, I think the fact that, out of 150 million American women, we're apparently the only ones with the sense of self and resilience to survive and thrive here in Guys' Drama speaks pretty well for us.

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Is that what goes on in these threads?

I just see my brother-in-law.

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<shrug>

Stop looking in the mirror.  

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I see a lot of your brother-in-law as well. Demands for safe spaces where contradictory opinions are not allowed and seen as threatening. Cries for "honest discussions" as long as certain opinions go unspoken. Where people gather together to celebrate their victimhood, but as soon as someone points out that they may bear some responsibility for the way things are, they wail about how unfair it all is and how they're being picked on.

Yep. I see a lot of your brother-in-law, but it may not be exactly the same vision you're having.

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OK.

You are being fairer than I deserve so I owe you a no-shit explanation.  
Buckle up, its going to be bumpy.

What comprises a successful society?  Well, first, it needs people.  Which means children.  Which means sex.  Easy day.  Women are weaker, they are going to have sex one way or the other.  Prior to the advent of civilization women were commodities to kill for.  You wanted women, you took them.  And you protected the ones you had from the predations of others.  You might even protect the children.  You don't know exactly why, but you will.  But you can't get past the familial cave dwelling clan on this model.

You needed to break past loyalty simply by family.  because the larger the group, the stronger it was.  The stronger it was, the more it had (women, prime real estate, etc).  So how do you get a man to die for someone he isn't related to?  An all powerful creature that could see all and do all and would punish you for failing to do as he commands (or, his self designated representative commands)

Religion built societies.  Take that off to the side for a moment.  

So lets focus on western society.  What are the unique attributes of the west that made it specifically successful.  arguably built upon the 10 commandments.  Remember those?

Here is a refresher.
http://godhearme.org/tenCommandments.jpg
Lets look at 5, 7 and 10.  Under penalty of the lord our god, children MUST look after their parents.  And not only can you not fuck other people's wives and husbands you can't even DESIRE them.

Penalty for disobedience of any one of these was death.  Of course, what is in your heart is known but to god, but he is one vengeful dude in the old testament.  so, tread carefully.

so, 30% of the commandments deal specifically with children, relationships and marriage.  (never mind how many of the 613 other jewish commandments do so as well)

whats the point?  Society is built on a foundation of trust.  The most important relationship is between man and god.  (without god, none of this shit works).  The second most important relationship is between man and woman.  

Now, back to biological imperative to reproduce.  Women do not run the risk of accidentally dedicating a decade or more of their lives (or their very life in the case of childbirth) to raising another woman's child.  Men do.  

In order for a society to work, men must be prepared to give their lives for their wives and, by association, their children. At least what they think are their children.  If a society fails to protect a men from being cuckolded, then men lose the motivation to protect and provide for their wives.  That society will crumble.  we are not bonobos (who only exist because the niger river separates them from the more aggressive chimpanzee(but I digress))

So this is basic society 101.  All societies up until the modern era operated on basically this model.  All punished infidelity.  Some societies still punish infidelity with death.  

men in this model were disposable (hence polygamy being the norm).  historically speaking approximately 70% of every woman who lived to puberty reproduced.  less than 35% of men reproduced.  

A hypothetical society with 100 fertile women and 1 fertile man would have 100 children in 2 years.  reverse this ratio and the opposite society would have 1 child (and probably 90 dead men).  (if they lived next to each other, the 1 dude with 100 women would be dead within 30 seconds)

So, in the pre-historic societal age you have women as a pure commodity.  the most important commodity.  the foundation of all other requirements for civilization.  

And woman didn't get too much say in this.  The strongest took what he wanted.  Which, conveniently enough, generally coincided with the biological requirements of the woman.

I lecture you on this basic of human prehistory simply because it shaped our psychological foundations.  

women not only are attracted to strong men, they are repulsed by weak ones.  because a weak one will be conquered, their children smashed against a rock and then the weaker man's wife raped until they produce the victors children (re-read your homer if confused on this point)

Fast forward to the industrial age.  
War is less a measurement of physical strength and numbers but rather a measurement of industrial output.  

Societies that work harder and smarter will outproduce the requisite war material than other societies.  And they will be most successful.

By the time the industrial age came about, monogamous relationships were the norm in western civilization.   And western civilizations were, by all measurement, the most successful.

Why is monogamy important?  First and foremost because the children have the opportunity to be raised by both a male and female role model.  But, only slightly behind, is because a married man with children he assumes to be his own, is the most motivated to work harder, longer and smarter to provide for his family.  In polygamy, you have 3 men who don't have kids, won't have kids, and don't really give a fuck.  You can enslave them (as was the norm for most of history) but a slave will only produce the minimum to avoid punishment.  Slavery is not efficient or effective.  But its more useful than killing these excess worthless men which is why it was, and still is, practiced.

Brief pit stop. Men don't need much to be "happy".  Sex, toys and the first 3 levels of Maslow's hierarchy of needs.  And the toys need not be necessarily expensive IF the man has no desire to attract a mate.  But a woman and children provide a motivation to do more, to produce more (both in the micro and macro scale).  Raising children well is expensive.  And the more you have, the better chance of success for your children (and, back to the 5th commandment, better off for you when you get old).  So you have a bunch of men working hard to produce liberty ships and a nice paycheck raising both themselves and their society to the highest levels in the industrial age.

the woman's requirement was faithfulness (or the façade of it).  Make the man think the child or children is his, and he will work harder.  Of course society honored those who took on the burden of another man's child (the widow being particularly honored for her faithfulness till death to her husband) provided the man was dead.   A man who lost his wife (common until modern era in childbirth) was a natural match for a woman who had lost her husband.  

Divorce, the deliberate abandonment of your spouse, was a societally shunned rarity.  

So things hummed along.  

The nuclear family unit providing the basis for a society with the requisite number of offspring and maximizing the output of the father in support of his family.  

Then the 50s came.  And western society became the enemy.  And the engine of that successful western society, likewise becoming the enemy.

Enter the Betty Friedans and various other useful idiots in the communist cause.

The happy mother and wife being transformed the greatest mass enslavement in history.

“...women who 'adjust' as housewives, who grow up wanting to be 'just a housewife,' are in as much danger as the millions who walked to their own death in the concentration camps...they ate suffering a slow death of mind and spirit.”

and her great question, that is, only now being answered

“Who knows what women can be when they are finally free to become themselves? Who knows what women's intelligence will contribute when it can be nourished without denying love?”

Women are completely, utterly and totally free at this point to do whatever they want.

and what have they chosen?

30-40% bastard rate?   A new Acura and shitty daycare?  Are we still to believe women are slaves to the patriarchy?  That seems to be the position of the great feminist hero, Hillary Rodham.  What more must men sacrifice to the alter of women's insatiable demands?

men should they chose to even have sex can face the accusation of rape on the mere whims of the woman.
no woman will be punished for a false accusation
should she conceive a child while with a man (it may not be the man's child), he now owes 18 years of payments.  Or, the death of the child is the woman deems it inconvenient at the time.

men, should they choose to marry, became the virtual slaves to the woman's demands and should they not meet them, will become the literal slaves.  Working for a master who if not pleased will have them jailed for failing to provide as demanded even in the absence of the means to do so.

Men are left with one choice to avoid being entrapped; avoidance of women altogether.  Which they have chosen.

Do you think these men continue to work hard?  to spend extra hours to earn more money?

their increased wages being taken from them to support other mens bastard children in the innumerable forms of public assistance for women, infants and children (women are tragic victims when convenient and strong powerful equals at other times)

So, TLDR

Women have all the choices.  And they increasingly choose to be selfish at best, vindictive at worse, but increasingly childish regardless

and men, having lost most of their choices, have taken the one choice that remains theirs and theirs alone.  to drop out.  Not just with women, but with society.

You bemoan a binary choice between Trump and Hillary while applauding the system that deliberately created the circumstances creating it.

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Sexbots will change the evolution of mankind. A truer, fairer existence for all. No more leverage games. True social justice.

Now the followup sexbot spontaneous on demand out in public gladiator games will rock! But then the AI revolution against the organics will spell the doom of humanity.

It's gonna rock!

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Bingo. I'm a tiny brunette. I will simply not appeal to someone who prefers tall, leggy blondes. My SMV for that person is 0. I love open spaces like farms and the woods and being out in the country living a quiet life. I will never appeal to someone who prefers big cities and high rises and an active party lifestyle. My SMV for that person is 0. I have always wanted kids, and now I have 2. I would never have appealed to someone who was dead set against having them. My SMV for that person would be 0.

I am the right lady for my husband, and he is the right man for me, but to other people, we would be nightmares. SMV is based on the idea that everyone wants the exact same thing, but look around you. No one wants exactly the same thing. That's why there are so many flavors of ice cream, so many different jelly bellies, so many breeds of dogs, types of houses, types of cars, etc ad nauseum.

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You do see it more in certain fields. Law enforcement, military, firefighting.



There are two theories why: women with higher than average testosterone are drawn to those fields and more sexually active. Or women are only as faithfull as their options and in those male dominated fields they have lots of options.

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I agree with this.  However aren't there a core of qualities that most people find desirable?  To keep it simple think US people.  I would think most people don't want a drug addict.  I haven't really seen this 'SMV' stuff but maybe it's based on 'universal' traits?

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You answered a question not asked. those that understand that blog post have no trouble getting laid.  As soon as I stopped treating women the way women told me they wanted to be treated, I had access to more women than ever before. Unsolicited declarations of love. Accusations of broken hearts. Women competing for me knowing they are competing with others. Because I stopped treating them the way every woman in my life from my mother, sister to ex wife told me they wanted to be treated. Turns out those were pretty lies.