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Posted: 9/30/2019 8:43:49 AM EDT
[#1]
Quoted:
edit Now a 12th victim, and 805 cases as of 9/29/2019 Pew resurfaced these charts and figures as the death toll stemming from vaping-related breathing illness hit 12 on Thursday, the CDC reported, along with 805 confirmed or probable cases of the mysterious illness that has stricken the nation. Two more people have died from a severe lung illness linked to vaping, bringing the total number of deaths in the U.S. to 11. The 10th victim was in Georgia and the 11th was in Florida. While the Georgia patient had a history of heavy e-cigarette use, doctors said the patient didn't vape THC, the active ingredient in marijuana.
No information regarding the individual who died in Florida has been made available by the Florida Department of Health. Out of the 530 cases, the CDC has analyzed 373 and determined that that two-thirds of people with severe lung illnesses, or 67 percent are 18 to 34 years old, and 16 percent are under 18. The majority, 72 percent, are male. The CDC said symptoms include cough, shortness of breath, fatigue, chest pain, nausea, vomiting and diarrhea. These worsen over time. At the business end of things, Altria and Philip Morris International said Wednesday that they were calling off merger talks a month after floating a deal that would have created the world's largest tobacco company.
The makers of Marlboro cigarettes said last month that they were in discussions to become a single company, more than a decade after splitting into two as lawsuits mounted. Altria has exclusively sold Marlboro cigarettes and other tobacco brands in the US, while Philip Morris has handled international sales. TIMELINE OF THE ELEVEN VAPING DEATHS IN THE US
FIRST VICTIM An Illinois man said to be using e-cigarettes to smoke THC died on August 24 after his lungs failed when he developed a mystery lung illness. SECOND VICTIM The second person to die after vaping was a 'middle-aged' Oregon resident. They were said to have recently started using an e-cigarette containing cannabis oil from a legal dispensary and passed away sometime at the end of August. THIRD VICTIM A third victim in Indiana passed away from the mysterious lung disease in August. The patient was described only as 'elderly' and little else is known about them. FOURTH VICTIM The fourth victim, a 65-year-old man, died sometime in August but his death wasn't confirmed until September 6. Minnesota officials said the patient had been using the electronic devices to smoke THC. FIFTH VICTIM A 55-year-old man from Los Angeles was the fifth person to lose his life after smoking the e-cigarettes. He died on September 7. SIXTH VICTIM A woman in her fifties was the sixth person to succumb to vaping-related illnesses. The Kansas-born woman, who had a history of health problems, passed away on September 12. SEVENTH VICTIM A California man became the seventh person to pass away after using the devices. The 40-year-old from Tulare County died on September 17. EIGHTH VICTIM The Missouri man in his forties became the eighth victim to die from vaping. He had normal lung function until he started using the devices in May. The victim began experiencing trouble breathing which gradually got worse before he was taken to hospital in St Louis on August 22. He passed away on September 19. NINTH VICTIM A man in his fifties became the second Kansas resident to die to the vaping-related illness. He was said to be a regular vaper who had 'underlying health issues'. He passed on September 24. TENTH VICTIM Georgia identified the state's first death from a vaping-associated illness. The patient had a history of heavy nicotine vaping, but no reported history of vaping THC, the active ingredient in marijuana. ELEVENTH VICTIM No information regarding the individual who died in Florida has been made available by the Florida Department of Health Vaping is helping people. Don't believe the misinformation. |
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Posted: 9/30/2019 8:48:15 AM EDT
[#2]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
If it was banned, we wouldn't have 27% of 12th graders vaping (see graph up a few posts). Maybe not zero, but you can't argue it doesn't have an effect. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
They should ban heroin then no one could get it. |
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Posted: 9/30/2019 8:49:09 AM EDT
[#3]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I've posted a few times my feelings on this. I'd ban cigarettes and vape products, and people would get nicotine inhalers (lowest harm potential) from their doctor in order to kick the habit. Nobody has died after only a year or two of cigarette smoking. Something in this vape might be worse than smoking. I don't get the continued feeling that its less dangerous in the face of this epidemic. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Oh? My last cigarette was 4/1/14. I started vaping instead, knowing that I could wean myself down to 0% nicotine. I quit vaping a couple of years ago. As far as smoking goes, I've tried the patch, gum, Chantix, and Zyban with no success - I was a two pack per day smoker. Thanks to vaping, kicking the nicotine habit was painless and I wasn't a complete prick to live with while I detoxed. Could you not make the argument that vaping might have saved my life, because it helped me to kick cigarettes and nicotine? Do you have any idea how many people are in the same boat as me? Millions. Either your math skills leave a helluva lot to be desired, or you have an irrational hard-on against vaping. Eleven people have died. That's bad, but literally millions of people have stopped smoking tobacco by way of vaping. Millions. No matter how you might feel about it, the invention of vaping has been fantastic when used for smoking cessation. @MrYar |
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Posted: 9/30/2019 8:54:11 AM EDT
[#4]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Cigarettes killed my grandfather at 62 and my 55 year old aunt 2 months ago.  I'll send the obituary to a mod if people don't believe me. If it was banned, neither my grandfather or aunt would have taken it up. They were not the law breaking type. They wouldn't have found some dealer to go get it from. Being illegal really does make an impact.
There's something about vaping that people just don't see it as dangerous. Maybe this epidemic will change that, but I think its a fundamental problem with vape being worse than smoke as I've posted numerous times. The number of young people taking up vaping is scary. Cigarette smoking has declined in the last 50 years, we don't need a worse replacement. At least people understand the dangers in cigarettes. But trying to ban vaping because you think or feel it is worse than smoking is not a valid reason. There is no epidemic except for the made up hysteria. It appears for all available information these deaths are from tainted products not vaping in general. Your logic is flawed an irrational. Should we ban parachutes because they don't open because they were mis-packed. No. You are either trolling or a zelot. Sorry but I'm a free man. I make my own choices good or bad. |
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Posted: 9/30/2019 9:16:43 AM EDT
[#5]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I'm sorry for your loss, I truly am. But crusading to save people against their will is truly tyranny. If your trying to do it for the public good there are far far better options to fight. Abortion, alcohol related deaths, and obesity related deaths rank way way higher on the death scale. This in the grand scheme of things is truly a non issue. Hell medical misdiagnosis killed approximately 100,000 last year alone, probably closer to 300,000 if properly accounted for. Of all tyrannies, a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It would be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end for they do so with the approval of their own conscience. They may be more likely to go to Heaven yet at the same time likelier to make a Hell of earth. This very kindness stings with intolerable insult. To be "cured" against one's will and cured of states which we may not regard as disease is to be put on a level of those who have not yet reached the age of reason or those who never will; to be classed with infants, imbeciles, and domestic animals. -C.S. Lewis |
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Posted: 9/30/2019 9:41:45 AM EDT
[#6]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Call it tough love. The only reason its against their will is because the drug is addictive. I don't think we should ban skiing, atving, skateboarding, rock climbing, 1/4 mile drag strips, etc because people are able to make a choice unaffected. Drugs change the way people behave and drive them to continue consuming the drug. I studied it in depth back in college. Its very tough to overcome, even some of the strongest willed people succumb to addiction. The best way to avoid it is to not go near the stuff to begin with, which is why I think it should be banned. Then ban alcohol, sugar, caffeine, sex, gambling, etc. . They are all addicting. It's nicotine not heroin. It's not a psychotropic. It's a stimulate similar caffeine. Bless your heart. I don't want or need you to save me. Thanks I'm good. (you've got to be trolling) |
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Posted: 9/30/2019 9:49:18 AM EDT
[#7]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Call it tough love. The only reason its against their will is because the drug is addictive. I don't think we should ban skiing, atving, skateboarding, rock climbing, 1/4 mile drag strips, etc because people are able to make a choice unaffected. Drugs change the way people behave and drive them to continue consuming the drug. I studied it in depth back in college. Its very tough to overcome, even some of the strongest willed people succumb to addiction. The best way to avoid it is to not go near the stuff to begin with, which is why I think it should be banned. Do you hear how ludicrous you sound? Less than 2 dozen people out of MILLIONS over a period of 2 Decades and you're willing to fuck over every single person that vapes (multiple millions) and send them all back to a high probability of getting cancer, and then dying a slow painful death. Go back to crying because your cheerios were soggy, the rest of us will decide what's good for us or not. Come back when those numbers are even half of what smoking, alcohol, or opiates kill every year...seems like no one has a real problem with them. |
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Posted: 9/30/2019 9:50:57 AM EDT
[#8]
Quote HistoryQuoted: ... I don't think we should ban skiing, atving, skateboarding, rock climbing, 1/4 mile drag strips, etc because people are able to make a choice unaffected. Drugs change the way people behave and drive them to continue consuming the drug. ... |
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Posted: 9/30/2019 9:52:56 AM EDT
[#9]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Just saying, based on sample size alone compared to total vape users 11 deaths is meaningless. Tell me when it gets to a statistically significant number. And that’s assuming these 11 are even due to vapes and not any other myriad of possible illnesses. ETA never have a never will vape or smoke but I don’t care if someone does and think this is silly. |
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Posted: 9/30/2019 10:02:29 AM EDT
[#10]
I don’t know much about the technology involved in caping. However question for those that do. You have a liquid which is then turned into a gas or atleast semi gaseous. It then goes through the tube and into the lungs. I would presume these need to be cleaned from time to time. Could this be a mold issue of some sort? Such as these spores in the mouthpiece which are being inhaled causing issue? Or could turning an ingredient that a person has a very faint underlying allergy to into a breathable state create a harsher reaction. For instance someone has a allergic reaction to peanuts they shouldn’t consume peanuts. They also shouldn’t go to a place that process peanuts because the dust alone getting into the lungs and being absorbed could kill them. Could it be something as simple as someone’s allergic to an ingredient within the liquid “juice” or whatever? I would guess the readily available nature of these liquids they aren’t regulated as to ingredients or a label of some kind to show what’s in the bottle.
ETA: I chewed 2-3 cans of Copenhagen a day when I quite. Chewed for 10+ years. Still on occasion smoke a Pipe or a Cigar. I don’t advocate the banning of this nor tobacco. However, if there’s a problem which can be figured out to educate people choosing to do them, or prior to there starting I’m all for figuring it out and putting it out there so they can make an educated decision. |
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Posted: 9/30/2019 10:37:24 AM EDT
[#11]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I don’t know much about the technology involved in caping. However question for those that do. You have a liquid which is then turned into a gas or atleast semi gaseous. It then goes through the tube and into the lungs. I would presume these need to be cleaned from time to time. Could this be a mold issue of some sort? Such as these spores in the mouthpiece which are being inhaled causing issue? Or could turning an ingredient that a person has a very faint underlying allergy to into a breathable state create a harsher reaction. For instance someone has a allergic reaction to peanuts they shouldn’t consume peanuts. They also shouldn’t go to a place that process peanuts because the dust alone getting into the lungs and being absorbed could kill them. Could it be something as simple as someone’s allergic to an ingredient within the liquid “juice” or whatever? I would guess the readily available nature of these liquids they aren’t regulated as to ingredients or a label of some kind to show what’s in the bottle. ETA: I chewed 2-3 cans of Copenhagen a day when I quite. Chewed for 10+ years. Still on occasion smoke a Pipe or a Cigar. I don’t advocate the banning of this nor tobacco. However, if there’s a problem which can be figured out to educate people choosing to do them, or prior to there starting I’m all for figuring it out and putting it out there so they can make an educated decision. As far as mold; I guess that could be an issue in extreme cases of filthy ecig gear (but it you aren't cleaning your shit, then whatever you're vaping on will taste like shit, so frequent cleaning is common with most people). But propylene glycol is actually used to kill/prevent mold and disinfect, in other areas. People use a distilled water/propylene glycol mixture in humidors to prevent mold. |
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Posted: 9/30/2019 10:39:20 AM EDT
[#12]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I don’t know much about the technology involved in caping. However question for those that do. You have a liquid which is then turned into a gas or atleast semi gaseous. It then goes through the tube and into the lungs. I would presume these need to be cleaned from time to time. Could this be a mold issue of some sort? Such as these spores in the mouthpiece which are being inhaled causing issue? Or could turning an ingredient that a person has a very faint underlying allergy to into a breathable state create a harsher reaction. For instance someone has a allergic reaction to peanuts they shouldn’t consume peanuts. They also shouldn’t go to a place that process peanuts because the dust alone getting into the lungs and being absorbed could kill them. Could it be something as simple as someone’s allergic to an ingredient within the liquid “juice” or whatever? I would guess the readily available nature of these liquids they aren’t regulated as to ingredients or a label of some kind to show what’s in the bottle. ETA: I chewed 2-3 cans of Copenhagen a day when I quite. Chewed for 10+ years. Still on occasion smoke a Pipe or a Cigar. I don’t advocate the banning of this nor tobacco. However, if there’s a problem which can be figured out to educate people choosing to do them, or prior to there starting I’m all for figuring it out and putting it out there so they can make an educated decision. FYI Propylene Glycol is also an Anti-Bacterial |
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Posted: 9/30/2019 10:40:01 AM EDT
[#13]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I don’t know much about the technology involved in caping. However question for those that do. You have a liquid which is then turned into a gas or atleast semi gaseous. It then goes through the tube and into the lungs. I would presume these need to be cleaned from time to time. Could this be a mold issue of some sort? Such as these spores in the mouthpiece which are being inhaled causing issue? Or could turning an ingredient that a person has a very faint underlying allergy to into a breathable state create a harsher reaction. For instance someone has a allergic reaction to peanuts they shouldn’t consume peanuts. They also shouldn’t go to a place that process peanuts because the dust alone getting into the lungs and being absorbed could kill them. Could it be something as simple as someone’s allergic to an ingredient within the liquid “juice” or whatever? I would guess the readily available nature of these liquids they aren’t regulated as to ingredients or a label of some kind to show what’s in the bottle. ETA: I chewed 2-3 cans of Copenhagen a day when I quite. Chewed for 10+ years. Still on occasion smoke a Pipe or a Cigar. I don’t advocate the banning of this nor tobacco. However, if there’s a problem which can be figured out to educate people choosing to do them, or prior to there starting I’m all for figuring it out and putting it out there so they can make an educated decision. The ingredients are listed on the bottles or packaging if they are prefilled cartridges. Generally the only ingredient that some people have a reaction too is the PG (propylene glycol). It can cause minor irritation in very rare cases. Keep in mind PG is used in some medical treatments as a carrier agent for the medicine. Pods can be one time use, meaning when the e-liquid is empty the pod is disposed and replaced with a new one. Refillable pods can be refilled a number of times before they have to be disposed because of the limited life of the atomizer (heating element and wick). Tank systems can be reused and rebuilt. Normally I wash the tank when I replace the atomizer. Overall the only part that really needs to be cleaned regularly is the mouth piece. If a tank has been sitting around I wash it before I use it as a precaution. |
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Posted: 9/30/2019 10:50:02 AM EDT
[#14]
Quoted: Could be. I've heard of many stories of allergies to certain, standard ejuice ingredients. Like propylene glycol (which is in almost every ejuice), for example. Never heard of any serious reactions or deaths from said allergy, though. As far as mold; I guess that could be an issue in extreme cases of filthy ecig gear (but it you aren't cleaning your shit, then whatever you're vaping on will taste like shit, so frequent cleaning is common with most people). But propylene glycol is actually used to kill/prevent mold and disinfect, in other areas. People use a distilled water/propylene glycol mixture in humidors to prevent mold. Quoted:
There arent any chemicals in eliquid that people arent already using in other medical uses, its the same ingredients that are used in Inhalers, Nebulizers, and Vaporizers....Propylene Glycol, Vegetable Glycerin, Nicotine (optional), and flavoring. FYI Propylene Glycol is also an Anti-Bacterial Quoted: Good questions. The ingredients are listed on the bottles or packaging if they are prefilled cartridges. Generally the only ingredient that some people have a reaction too is the PG (propylene glycol). It can cause minor irritation in very rare cases. Keep in mind PG is used in some medical treatments as a carrier agent for the medicine. Pods can be one time use, meaning when the e-liquid is empty the pod is disposed and replaced with a new one. Refillable pods can be refilled a number of times before they have to be disposed because of the limited life of the atomizer (heating element and wick). Tank systems can be reused and rebuilt. Normally I wash the tank when I replace the atomizer. Overall the only part that really needs to be cleaned regularly is the mouth piece. If a tank has been sitting around I wash it before I use it as a precaution. |
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Posted: 9/30/2019 10:57:11 AM EDT
[#15]
Something else that’s important to note is that these recent “vaping related” illnesses are exclusive to the US market. European nations have said they haven’t noticed the symptoms here, which suggests it’s something exclusive to the US market: IE The black market cartridges.
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Posted: 9/30/2019 10:58:00 AM EDT
[#16]
I nominate this the most ignorant thread of the year.
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Posted: 9/30/2019 11:02:05 AM EDT
[#17]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Something else that's important to note is that these recent "vaping related" illnesses are exclusive to the US market. European nations have said they haven't noticed the symptoms here, which suggests it's something exclusive to the US market: IE The black market cartridges. As Leafly reported in early September, a new diluent known as Honey Cut entered the illicit vape cart market in late 2018. The product, which dilutes THC oil without thinning the viscosity, is manufactured by Honey Cut LLC registered to a Joshua Temple of Los Angeles. Officials at the terpene manufacturer True Terpenes, based in Portland, OR, told Leafly they tested Honey Cut earlier this year and found it to contain Vitamin E oil, aka tocopheryl-acetate. Two brandsMr. Extractor of Oregon and Constance Therapeutics of Californiatold Leafly they've been selling forms of vitamin E oil into the vape cart market. Mr Extractor's Drew Jones told Leafly he believes up to 40 companies sold a copycat oil, and the oil is in 60% of carts in the US. Lab tests have found the oil in multiple thickener products, including Peak Terpenes' Thicc Stretch. From here - https://www.leafly.com/news/health/vape-pen-lung-disease-advice-consumers |
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Posted: 9/30/2019 11:15:51 AM EDT
[#18]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Call it tyrannical. I bet you support red flag laws too. Then ban alcohol, sugar, caffeine, sex, gambling, etc. . They are all addicting. It's nicotine not heroin. It's not a psychotropic. It's a stimulate similar caffeine. Bless your heart. I don't want or need you to save me. Thanks I'm good. (you've got to be trolling) |
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Posted: 9/30/2019 11:17:09 AM EDT
[#19]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
And here is why. This also explains "why all of a sudden". As Leafly reported in early September, a new diluent known as Honey Cut entered the illicit vape cart market in late 2018. The product, which dilutes THC oil without thinning the viscosity, is manufactured by Honey Cut LLC registered to a Joshua Temple of Los Angeles. Officials at the terpene manufacturer True Terpenes, based in Portland, OR, told Leafly they tested Honey Cut earlier this year and found it to contain Vitamin E oil, aka tocopheryl-acetate. Two brandsMr. Extractor of Oregon and Constance Therapeutics of Californiatold Leafly they've been selling forms of vitamin E oil into the vape cart market. Mr Extractor's Drew Jones told Leafly he believes up to 40 companies sold a copycat oil, and the oil is in 60% of carts in the US. Lab tests have found the oil in multiple thickener products, including Peak Terpenes' Thicc Stretch. From here - https://www.leafly.com/news/health/vape-pen-lung-disease-advice-consumers |
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Posted: 9/30/2019 11:20:23 AM EDT
[#20]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Thank you all for the answers. Simply a thought as to what maybe the cause. I myself am allergic to Sulpha drugs. Thus I know not to take them. But I’d someone didn’t know and had a bad allergy it could cause serious issues. I would also assume that the pods which are simply cartridges of the liquid I presume? Are controlled more then say 8 balls swap shop and smoke stores home brew bottles? I personally wouldn't use anything that is not factory sealed. |
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Posted: 9/30/2019 11:22:49 AM EDT
[#21]
The last figure I saw 89% of the vapers who got sick admitted to vaping underground THC products.
That level of admission implies the other 11% are lying. I don't smoke or vape anything and have never understood the attraction. I've lost all sorts of relatives to addictions, mostly cigarettes. When heavy cigarette smokers in your gene pool die in their 50's from lung cancer, heart attacks and strokes it tends to be a clarion call. Other relatives who drank too much only lasted a little longer. I haven't drank in 23 years. The people who engage in these activities lie to themselves daily. They do so to justify their actions and to allow themselves to continue the long decline. I have heard every excuse under the sun as to why they felt they were different. There's no history.of liver disease/lung cancer in our family. Some people live to be 90 drinking and smoking daily. If I get sick I'll stop. (A little late IMO) I feel fine. (For now). The laws of man and nature apply to everyone. Another astounding fact is that most of people that are economically challenged use these substances. The people who can least afford it tend to smoke at higher percentages then the rest of society. A heavy smoker and drinker can easily waste $10,000 a year. |
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Posted: 9/30/2019 11:24:31 AM EDT
[#22]
Studies have shown Sugar is more addicting than cocaine....certainly kills more people than vaping, you should push a sugar ban...for the children.
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Posted: 9/30/2019 11:28:06 AM EDT
[#23]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
There arent any chemicals in eliquid that people arent already using in other medical uses, its the same ingredients that are used in Inhalers, Nebulizers, and Vaporizers....Propylene Glycol, Vegetable Glycerin, Nicotine (optional), and flavoring. FYI Propylene Glycol is also an Anti-Bacterial And as I said before I'm happy with Darwin sorting this crap out but it really pisses me off so many little kids are doing it. and it really pisses me off that all these people will need my tax payer funded healthcare and welfare after they fall apart. |
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Posted: 9/30/2019 11:28:20 AM EDT
[#24]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Call it tough love. The only reason its against their will is because the drug is addictive. I don't think we should ban skiing, atving, skateboarding, rock climbing, 1/4 mile drag strips, etc because people are able to make a choice unaffected. Drugs change the way people behave and drive them to continue consuming the drug. I studied it in depth back in college. Its very tough to overcome, even some of the strongest willed people succumb to addiction. The best way to avoid it is to not go near the stuff to begin with, which is why I think it should be banned. Let me quote some of the founding fathers for you. “Is life so dear, or peace so sweet, as to be purchased at the price of chains and slavery? Forbid it, Almighty God! I know not what course others may take, but as for me, give me liberty or give me death!”
Patrick Henry “Those that can give up essential liberty to gain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety.”
Benjamin Franklin “Rightful liberty is unobstructed action according to our will within limits drawn around us by the equal rights of others. I do not add 'within the limits of the law' because law is often but the tyrant's will, and always so when it violates the rights of the individual.”
Thomas Jefferson “The natural progress of things is for liberty to yield, and government to gain ground.”
Thomas Jefferson “Guard with jealous attention the public liberty. Suspect everyone who approaches that jewel. Unfortunately, nothing will preserve it but downright force. Whenever you give up that force, you are ruined...The great object is that every man be armed. Everyone who is able might have a gun.”
Patrick Henry If ye love wealth better than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, go home from us in peace. We ask not your counsels or arms. Crouch down and lick the hands which feed you. May your chains set lightly upon you, and may posterity forget that ye were our countrymen.
Samuel Adams |
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Posted: 9/30/2019 11:28:26 AM EDT
[#25]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Studies have shown Sugar is more addicting than cocaine....certainly kills more people than vaping, you should push a sugar ban...for the children. |
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Posted: 9/30/2019 11:29:14 AM EDT
[#26]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Have you ever read the MSDS on that stuff? You're not supposed to inhale it especially after cooking it in a vap. |
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Posted: 9/30/2019 11:39:50 AM EDT
[#27]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Citation pls. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Studies have shown Sugar is more addicting than cocaine....certainly kills more people than vaping, you should push a sugar ban...for the children. https://www.seattletimes.com/nation-world/rats-pick-sweets-over-cocaine/ We need a ban....for the children |
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Posted: 9/30/2019 11:46:32 AM EDT
[#28]
Quote HistoryInteresting info. I scanned it. When I have time after work I will read it more thoroughly. But from what I read it suggests PG is safe, unless your a rat pumped with much higher levels than what's in e-cigs. A lot of people confuse PG with ethylene glycol (antifreeze). |
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Posted: 9/30/2019 11:47:41 AM EDT
[#29]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Have you ever read the MSDS on that stuff? You're not supposed to inhale it especially after cooking it in a vape. And as I said before I'm happy with Darwin sorting this crap out but it really pisses me off so many little kids are doing it. and it really pisses me off that all these people will need my text payer funded healthcare and welfare after they fall apart. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
There arent any chemicals in eliquid that people arent already using in other medical uses, its the same ingredients that are used in Inhalers, Nebulizers, and Vaporizers....Propylene Glycol, Vegetable Glycerin, Nicotine (optional), and flavoring. FYI Propylene Glycol is also an Anti-Bacterial And as I said before I'm happy with Darwin sorting this crap out but it really pisses me off so many little kids are doing it. and it really pisses me off that all these people will need my text payer funded healthcare and welfare after they fall apart. Ban high fat food! Obesity and heart problems are a drain on my tax payer funded healthcare... Seriously you'd rather people burn organic material with god knows how many carcinogens vs vaping? Tell me again how many people died just last year, not just long term care, from the affects of smoking? 400,000 I think it was. Which one should be attempting to ban? |
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Posted: 9/30/2019 12:01:37 PM EDT
[#30]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
You ever see what a high cholesterol diet will do to the circulatory system? Ban high fat food! Obesity and heart problems are a drain on my tax payer funded healthcare... Seriously you'd rather people burn organic material with god knows how many carcinogens vs vaping? Tell me again how many people died just last year, not just long term care, from the affects of smoking? 400,000 I think it was. Which one should be attempting to ban? Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
There arent any chemicals in eliquid that people arent already using in other medical uses, its the same ingredients that are used in Inhalers, Nebulizers, and Vaporizers....Propylene Glycol, Vegetable Glycerin, Nicotine (optional), and flavoring. FYI Propylene Glycol is also an Anti-Bacterial And as I said before I'm happy with Darwin sorting this crap out but it really pisses me off so many little kids are doing it. and it really pisses me off that all these people will need my text payer funded healthcare and welfare after they fall apart. Ban high fat food! Obesity and heart problems are a drain on my tax payer funded healthcare... Seriously you'd rather people burn organic material with god knows how many carcinogens vs vaping? Tell me again how many people died just last year, not just long term care, from the affects of smoking? 400,000 I think it was. Which one should be attempting to ban? |
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Posted: 9/30/2019 12:06:26 PM EDT
[#31]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Could be. I've heard of many stories of allergies to certain, standard ejuice ingredients. Like propylene glycol (which is in almost every ejuice), for example. Never heard of any serious reactions or deaths from said allergy, though. As far as mold; I guess that could be an issue in extreme cases of filthy ecig gear (but it you aren't cleaning your shit, then whatever you're vaping on will taste like shit, so frequent cleaning is common with most people). But propylene glycol is actually used to kill/prevent mold and disinfect, in other areas. People use a distilled water/propylene glycol mixture in humidors to prevent mold. |
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Posted: 9/30/2019 12:08:07 PM EDT
[#32]
Vaping has got to go it's making too many people quit smoking thus no more huge tobacco taxes
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Posted: 9/30/2019 12:10:47 PM EDT
[#33]
Quote HistoryQuoted: No I don't support red flag laws. I wouldn't care if they banned alcohol, but the rest isn't in the same category. Caffeine isn't as addicting, its not even a DSM defined illness as many doctors do not recognise it as having much addictive potential. Caffeine also hasn't been shown to kill people like vaping has. Smoking definitely kills, but its over many decades, and its users know full well what they're doing and how bad it is. Every cigarette user I've talked to wishes they never started. With vaping, the young people, as I've posted graphs, are taking a liking to this vaping and at the same time downplaying its harm potential. I could see a hands off approach leading to a huge resurgence in nicotine use with young vaping continuing to increase. Cigarette use rates were very high decades ago. Now its low but this vaping this has a potential to make this shit come back. Its a trojan horse. People think its something benign, but its really going to kill them or f them up more than they realized. In the last analysis, what someone else puts into their body is none of your damned business. |
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Posted: 9/30/2019 12:12:29 PM EDT
[#34]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Have you ever read the MSDS on that stuff? You're not supposed to inhale it especially after cooking it in a vape. And as I said before I'm happy with Darwin sorting this crap out but it really pisses me off so many little kids are doing it. and it really pisses me off that all these people will need my text payer funded healthcare and welfare after they fall apart. |
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Posted: 9/30/2019 12:17:50 PM EDT
[#35]
Quote HistoryQuoted: No I don't support red flag laws. I wouldn't care if they banned alcohol, but the rest isn't in the same category. Caffeine isn't as addicting, its not even a DSM defined illness as many doctors do not recognise it as having much addictive potential. Caffeine also hasn't been shown to kill people like vaping has. Smoking definitely kills, but its over many decades, and its users know full well what they're doing and how bad it is. Every cigarette user I've talked to wishes they never started. With vaping, the young people, as I've posted graphs, are taking a liking to this vaping and at the same time downplaying its harm potential. I could see a hands off approach leading to a huge resurgence in nicotine use with young vaping continuing to increase. Cigarette use rates were very high decades ago. Now its low but this vaping this has a potential to make this shit come back. Its a trojan horse. People think its something benign, but its really going to kill them or f them up more than they realized. 
CDC
Overdose deaths involving synthetic opioids other than methadone, which includes fentanyl, increased almost 47% from 2016 to 2017.3 Roughly 28,400 people died from overdoses involving synthetic opioids other than methadone in 2017.4 Edit:fix image |
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Posted: 9/30/2019 12:24:53 PM EDT
[#36]
https://www.nfpa.org/News-and-Research/Data-research-and-tools/US-Fire-Problem/Smoking-Materials
Report highlights •During 2012-2016, an estimated annual average of 18,100 (5%) reported home structure fires started by smoking materials killed an average of 590 (23%) people annually, injured 1,130 (10%) per year, and caused $476 million in direct property damage (7%) per year. •One in 20 home (5%) home structure fires were started by smoking materials. These fires caused almost one in four (23%) home fire deaths, and one in 10 (10%) home fire injuries. •Smoking was the leading cause of home fire deaths for the five year period of 2012-2016. Overall, one of every 31 home smoking material fires resulted in death. •The leading area of origin for home smoking fires in 2012-2016 was an exterior balcony or open porch (18%). •Forty-three percent of the deaths were caused by fires that started in the living room. One-third (34%) were caused by fires that began in the bedroom. In comparison, approximately 15 e-cigarette related explosion/fires are known to have occurred, with no known fatalities, since e-cigarettes entered the U.S. market in 2007 - 12 years ago. On that basis alone, vaping deaths are far more than offset due to fewer fire deaths than smoking. |
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Posted: 9/30/2019 1:28:36 PM EDT
[#37]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
https://www.nfpa.org/News-and-Research/Data-research-and-tools/US-Fire-Problem/Smoking-Materials Report highlights •During 2012-2016, an estimated annual average of 18,100 (5%) reported home structure fires started by smoking materials killed an average of 590 (23%) people annually, injured 1,130 (10%) per year, and caused $476 million in direct property damage (7%) per year. •One in 20 home (5%) home structure fires were started by smoking materials. These fires caused almost one in four (23%) home fire deaths, and one in 10 (10%) home fire injuries. •Smoking was the leading cause of home fire deaths for the five year period of 2012-2016. Overall, one of every 31 home smoking material fires resulted in death. •The leading area of origin for home smoking fires in 2012-2016 was an exterior balcony or open porch (18%). •Forty-three percent of the deaths were caused by fires that started in the living room. One-third (34%) were caused by fires that began in the bedroom. In comparison, approximately 15 e-cigarette related explosion/fires are known to have occurred, with no known fatalities, since e-cigarettes entered the U.S. market in 2007 - 12 years ago. On that basis alone, vaping deaths are far more than offset due to fewer fire deaths than smoking.  jk Please don't hit me. I couldn't help myself.
Good point. I hadn't even thought of that. |
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Posted: 9/30/2019 3:29:04 PM EDT
[#38]
Alright you sky is falling nimrods, this article clearly lays out the path and ingredients of the tainted carts. There is no relevant difference between THC and nicotine carts, so disregarding cases where only nicotine was used is pointless.
https://www.leafly.com/news/politics/vape-pen-injury-supply-chain-investigation-leafly IMPORTANT PART --> "Most VAPI victims used THC carts purchased in the illicit street market. Many used THC and nicotine carts, and some claim to have used nicotine only. All three products can be manufactured with the same hardware. The same supply chain that produces tainted THC vapes also yields dirty, counterfeit JUUL pods for the nicotine market, and tainted CBD carts for the CBD market. Peter Hackett is the owner of Air Vapor Systems, a Concord, California-based company that imports vaporizer cartridges. He says it takes less effort to get into the fake JUUL or cheap CBD cart game than it does to get into the tainted THC cart game. “It’s ten times easier,” he says. “You can buy nicotine on Amazon. Same for CBD. Every constituent up till the THC oil is exactly the same.” Public health officials have raised the alarm about illicit THC vape cartridges for more than two months now. In early September, Leafly identified the suspected toxic substance—tocopheryl-acetate (vitamin E oil)—and the brand names of the vape cart additives containing it. Although some companies have stopped selling them, tocopheryl-acetate cutting agents remain largely available for purchase and in the illicit THC vape cart market still today." |
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Posted: 9/30/2019 3:52:54 PM EDT
[#39]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Alright you sky is falling nimrods, this article clearly lays out the path and ingredients of the tainted carts. There is no relevant difference between THC and nicotine carts, so disregarding cases where only nicotine was used is pointless. https://www.leafly.com/news/politics/vape-pen-injury-supply-chain-investigation-leafly IMPORTANT PART --> "Most VAPI victims used THC carts purchased in the illicit street market. Many used THC and nicotine carts, and some claim to have used nicotine only. All three products can be manufactured with the same hardware. The same supply chain that produces tainted THC vapes also yields dirty, counterfeit JUUL pods for the nicotine market, and tainted CBD carts for the CBD market. Peter Hackett is the owner of Air Vapor Systems, a Concord, California-based company that imports vaporizer cartridges. He says it takes less effort to get into the fake JUUL or cheap CBD cart game than it does to get into the tainted THC cart game. “It’s ten times easier,” he says. “You can buy nicotine on Amazon. Same for CBD. Every constituent up till the THC oil is exactly the same.” Public health officials have raised the alarm about illicit THC vape cartridges for more than two months now. In early September, Leafly identified the suspected toxic substance—tocopheryl-acetate (vitamin E oil)—and the brand names of the vape cart additives containing it. Although some companies have stopped selling them, tocopheryl-acetate cutting agents remain largely available for purchase and in the illicit THC vape cart market still today." |
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Posted: 9/30/2019 3:56:49 PM EDT
[#40]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
What if it saves lives tho? Its not like a gun. No vape pen has saved someone's life. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
More laws and bans is always the answer |
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Posted: 9/30/2019 4:01:59 PM EDT
[#41]
How many murders in Chicago this passed weekend?
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Posted: 9/30/2019 4:05:23 PM EDT
[#42]
Wow, lot of “I don’t like it, so it should be illegal” in this thread.
Also a lot of hysteria. Over 5,000 people a year choke to death. Maybe we should ban solid food? |
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Posted: 9/30/2019 5:39:19 PM EDT
[#43]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Have you ever read the MSDS on that stuff? You're not supposed to inhale it especially after cooking it in a vape. And as I said before I'm happy with Darwin sorting this crap out but it really pisses me off so many little kids are doing it. and it really pisses me off that all these people will need my text payer funded healthcare and welfare after they fall apart. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
There arent any chemicals in eliquid that people arent already using in other medical uses, its the same ingredients that are used in Inhalers, Nebulizers, and Vaporizers....Propylene Glycol, Vegetable Glycerin, Nicotine (optional), and flavoring. FYI Propylene Glycol is also an Anti-Bacterial And as I said before I'm happy with Darwin sorting this crap out but it really pisses me off so many little kids are doing it. and it really pisses me off that all these people will need my text payer funded healthcare and welfare after they fall apart. |
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Posted: 9/30/2019 6:06:41 PM EDT
[#44]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Except the fact that thc is fat soluble, and is suspended in OIL. So yea theres at least that difference. Have yet to see a linked example of a multi year user of nic vape dying. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Alright you sky is falling nimrods, this article clearly lays out the path and ingredients of the tainted carts. There is no relevant difference between THC and nicotine carts, so disregarding cases where only nicotine was used is pointless. https://www.leafly.com/news/politics/vape-pen-injury-supply-chain-investigation-leafly IMPORTANT PART --> "Most VAPI victims used THC carts purchased in the illicit street market. Many used THC and nicotine carts, and some claim to have used nicotine only. All three products can be manufactured with the same hardware. The same supply chain that produces tainted THC vapes also yields dirty, counterfeit JUUL pods for the nicotine market, and tainted CBD carts for the CBD market. Peter Hackett is the owner of Air Vapor Systems, a Concord, California-based company that imports vaporizer cartridges. He says it takes less effort to get into the fake JUUL or cheap CBD cart game than it does to get into the tainted THC cart game. “It’s ten times easier,” he says. “You can buy nicotine on Amazon. Same for CBD. Every constituent up till the THC oil is exactly the same.” Public health officials have raised the alarm about illicit THC vape cartridges for more than two months now. In early September, Leafly identified the suspected toxic substance—tocopheryl-acetate (vitamin E oil)—and the brand names of the vape cart additives containing it. Although some companies have stopped selling them, tocopheryl-acetate cutting agents remain largely available for purchase and in the illicit THC vape cart market still today." The culprit, regardless of being a carrier for THC, nicotine, or CBD, is tocopheryl-acetate (vitamin E oil). A recent addition to the vape world because it's cheaper, and that's all the illicit cart market cares about. Up until recently, only food safe carriers vegetable glycerin and PG were used. |
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Posted: 9/30/2019 7:05:12 PM EDT
[#45]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I nominate this the most ignorant thread of the year. |
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Posted: 9/30/2019 7:25:07 PM EDT
[#46]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Really? Why do hospitals use it in nebulizers and inhalers? Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Have you ever read the MSDS on that stuff? You're not supposed to inhale it especially after cooking it in a vape. And as I said before I'm happy with Darwin sorting this crap out but it really pisses me off so many little kids are doing it. and it really pisses me off that all these people will need my text payer funded healthcare and welfare after they fall apart. |
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Posted: 9/30/2019 8:48:39 PM EDT
[#47]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Possibly Or it’s the gross overuse (and misuse) of the product. A product that was never intended to be used by people who didn’t have a nicotine habit, but introduced an a cessation aid. Starting vaping is about as retarded as taking up chewing nicotine gum or slapping a bunch of nic patches all of your body. And then there are the “mod boxes” and such which produce a lot more vapor than was ever intended. And people sit there and take drags off these things every 2-3 breaths and then complain about health problems. No shit, Sherlock Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
I still think this is directly related to people using oils instead of glycol. Or it’s the gross overuse (and misuse) of the product. A product that was never intended to be used by people who didn’t have a nicotine habit, but introduced an a cessation aid. Starting vaping is about as retarded as taking up chewing nicotine gum or slapping a bunch of nic patches all of your body. And then there are the “mod boxes” and such which produce a lot more vapor than was ever intended. And people sit there and take drags off these things every 2-3 breaths and then complain about health problems. No shit, Sherlock |
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Posted: 9/30/2019 8:55:17 PM EDT
[#48]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Citation pls. Still waiting on the causal connection here. Millions of air breathers die a year. Every.Body.Panic. |
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Posted: 9/30/2019 11:17:43 PM EDT
[#49]
Eh withdrawn. You wonder how low information people conflate semiautos with full auto?
Happening here. Bootleg illegal shit bad! Ban it all, for the childrens! Jfc, feels like I'm taking crazy pills. Peace out, and good luck. |
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Posted: 10/1/2019 10:50:34 AM EDT
[#50]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
You have already revealed which of us is clueless, and it wasn't me. If you like eating paint chips, you can keep eating paint chips.
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