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Posted: 10/1/2019 3:40:21 PM EDT
[#1]
Quote HistoryQuoted: The culprit, regardless of being a carrier for THC, nicotine, or CBD, is tocopheryl-acetate (vitamin E oil). A recent addition to the vape world because it's cheaper, and that's all the illicit cart market cares about. Up until recently, only food safe carriers vegetable glycerin and PG were used. The amount of ignorance posing as expertise in these threads is hilarious. |
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Posted: 10/1/2019 5:02:35 PM EDT
[#2]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Did you eat a lot of paint chips when you were a child? So sweet and tasty! If you like eating paint chips, you can keep eating paint chips.  |
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Posted: 10/1/2019 6:12:32 PM EDT
[#3]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Your entire argument is that you know better for someone else than themselves...tell me again how that argument is any different than those attempting to actively disarm us know? https://www.cdc.gov/drugoverdose/images/pbss/CDC-Fentanyl-overdoses-rise-400w.jpg Ban fentanyl... oh, wait. Banning anything doesn't help. By banning it, it automatically becomes unregulated. Edit:fix image Banning it does reduce its use. If you ended the WoD overnight, and said tomorrow you can set up a table on the sidewalk in front of your house selling oxys and heroin, you don't think we'd see a rise in use? |
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Posted: 10/1/2019 6:13:58 PM EDT
[#4]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Does not fucking matter. Free society and all. But you have repeatedly shown a favoritism for state sponsored control over people's lives some I'm not surprised you would take that position. |
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Posted: 10/1/2019 6:21:07 PM EDT
[#5]
15 now, classifying an earlier death back in May as a vape death. https://people.com/health/vaping-related-death-nebraska-national-total-15/
Nebraska’s first victim of a vaping-related illness has brought the national death toll to 15 people.
The state’s Department of Health and Human Services said that the victim was 65-years-old and from the Douglas County area. The person had died in May, before doctors and health agencies realized that people were developing lung illnesses from vaping, and Nebraska officials did not classify the death as such until now. Of the 805 cases, the CDC has closely analyzed 373 and determined that that two-thirds of people with severe lung illnesses, or 67 percent, are 18 to 34 years old, and 16 percent are under 18. The majority, 72 percent, are male. The CDC said that stopping teen e-cigarette use is one of their priorities. |
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Posted: 10/1/2019 6:37:07 PM EDT
[#6]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
How many murders in Chicago this passed weekend? Maybe some of us care. If you don't care about vaping deaths, don't visit this thread. |
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Posted: 10/1/2019 6:56:04 PM EDT
[#7]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Except the fact that thc is fat soluble, and is suspended in OIL. So yea theres at least that difference. Have yet to see a linked example of a multi year user of nic vape dying. Anyways, 17 % of the cases reported in this case study were nicotine only vapers https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMoa1911614?query=featured_home#article_Abstract |
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Posted: 10/1/2019 9:44:52 PM EDT
[#8]
Quote HistoryQuoted: ??? Did you read the subject of the thread? Anyways, 17 % of the cases reported in this case study were nicotine only vapers https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMoa1911614?query=featured_home#article_Abstract You conflating backstreet counterfeit shit with legit shit as the same as the low information soccer mom who conflates an ar15 af full auto. Ban it all. Do it. Call your legislators, and lobby the fuck out of them. The backstreet illegal shit that's already illegal will still continue to be made, and consumed. Look at heroin/fentanyl deaths, ain't that banned already? Go ahead and lobby for alcohol bans while your at it. It is an addictive drug that cause more deaths. Oh yeah and tobacco. This will be my last post in this thread, as one of us is insane, and the other is beating his head on the wall. |
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Posted: 10/1/2019 9:55:01 PM EDT
[#9]
Michigans ban goes into effect at midnight,tonight.
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Posted: 10/1/2019 10:01:58 PM EDT
[#10]
Yawn
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Posted: 10/1/2019 10:24:21 PM EDT
[#11]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Michigans ban goes into effect at midnight,tonight. But I've been making my own juice for a few years now, so it won't affect me, and there's no ban on the individual ingredients...yet. |
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Posted: 10/1/2019 10:25:41 PM EDT
[#12]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Cigarettes killed my grandfather at 62 and my 55 year old aunt 2 months ago.  I'll send the obituary to a mod if people don't believe me. If it was banned, neither my grandfather or aunt would have taken it up. They were not the law breaking type. They wouldn't have found some dealer to go get it from. Being illegal really does make an impact.
There's something about vaping that people just don't see it as dangerous. Maybe this epidemic will change that, but I think its a fundamental problem with vape being worse than smoke as I've posted numerous times. The number of young people taking up vaping is scary. Cigarette smoking has declined in the last 50 years, we don't need a worse replacement. At least people understand the dangers in cigarettes. Never having a tobacco product in her entire life. Death is bad. And it happens to everyone, including me and you. You can't ban your way to immortality. Quit telling people how to live their lives based on YOUR feelings. |
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Posted: 10/1/2019 10:26:08 PM EDT
[#13]
15 people out of hundreds of thousands.....
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Posted: 10/1/2019 10:28:35 PM EDT
[#14]
Any theories as to why no other countries are reporting illnesses/deaths like the recent spike in the US?
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Posted: 10/1/2019 10:38:45 PM EDT
[#15]
15 in a group this size is a statistical anamoly.
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Posted: 10/1/2019 10:39:46 PM EDT
[#16]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
15 people out of hundreds of thousands..... Now if you look at the number of mass shootings - it is even more interesting - as as a percentage, more people are dying due to ar15’s. |
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Posted: 10/2/2019 5:36:35 AM EDT
[#17]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Yes I did, again reputable nic juice DOES NOT contain oil. You conflating backstreet counterfeit shit with legit shit as the same as the low information soccer mom who conflates an ar15 af full auto. Ban it all. Do it. Call your legislators, and lobby the fuck out of them. The backstreet illegal shit that's already illegal will still continue to be made, and consumed. Look at heroin/fentanyl deaths, ain't that banned already? Go ahead and lobby for alcohol bans while your at it. It is an addictive drug that cause more deaths. Oh yeah and tobacco. This will be my last post in this thread, as one of us is insane, and the other is beating his head on the wall. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Yes I did, again reputable nic juice DOES NOT contain oil. You conflating backstreet counterfeit shit with legit shit as the same as the low information soccer mom who conflates an ar15 af full auto. Ban it all. Do it. Call your legislators, and lobby the fuck out of them. The backstreet illegal shit that's already illegal will still continue to be made, and consumed. Look at heroin/fentanyl deaths, ain't that banned already? Go ahead and lobby for alcohol bans while your at it. It is an addictive drug that cause more deaths. Oh yeah and tobacco. This will be my last post in this thread, as one of us is insane, and the other is beating his head on the wall. Then you ignored my 17% stat and went right on some tangent about soccer mom's and full auto ar15s. I'd like to debate you, but I can't understand what you're saying. Vitamin E acetate is not a oil for petes sake. I have some liquid vitamin E that I take as a vitamin right in front of me. It says Ingredient: Glycine Soja (soybean) oil, Vitamin E (tocopheryl acetate), Cocos nuciferia (coconut) oil) From wiki On September 5th, 2019, the United States Food and Drug Administration (US FDA) announced that 10 out of 18, or 55.56% of the samples of cannabis-containing vape liquids sent in by states, linked to recent vaping related lung disease outbreak in the United States, tested positive for vitamin E acetate  which is being used as a thickening agent by some manufacturers.[9][10] The Centers for Disease Control and Prevention announced that some state labs have found vitamin E acetate, but stressed that "at this time, no one device, product, or substance has been linked to all cases."[11] 
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Posted: 10/2/2019 5:48:20 AM EDT
[#18]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
My niece died of lung cancer at 20 after Never having a tobacco product in her entire life. Death is bad. And it happens to everyone, including me and you. You can't ban your way to immortality. Quit telling people how to live their lives based on YOUR feelings. We're all gonna die but should it be because of a vape product at age 20? With widespread thinking is its safer than smoking. Should we lift the ban on lead paint? Abestos insulation? Bring back the xray machines in shoe stoes? |
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Posted: 10/2/2019 5:52:52 AM EDT
[#19]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Any theories as to why no other countries are reporting illnesses/deaths like the recent spike in the US? Quote HistoryQuoted:
Any theories as to why no other countries are reporting illnesses/deaths like the recent spike in the US? The increase in teen vaping is the biggest one-year spike of any substance in the 44 years the Monitorithe Future (MTF) survey has been conducted. This year’s study included responses from 44,482 students at 392 public and private schools and found 37.3 percent of twelfth graders reported “any vaping” in the past 12 months, compared to 27.8 percent in 2017. It is the biggest year-to-year increase in substance use ever recorded in the survey’s 44 years. |
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Posted: 10/2/2019 5:58:37 AM EDT
[#20]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
CDC statistics show 3.7% of Adults in the US use vapes. That is about 9million. Not hundreds of thousands. Honestly, I suspect it is comparable to the number of adults who own ar15’s. IIRC India (which effectively banned vape sales a week or so ago) had about 52million users. Now if you look at the number of mass shootings - it is even more interesting - as as a percentage, more people are dying due to ar15’s. |
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Posted: 10/2/2019 5:59:10 AM EDT
[#21]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
A ban on in-state vendors selling any flavored juices besides tobacco and menthol goes into effect here on the 4th. It's a 90 day ban for now. It'll probably become permanent afterwards though, being New York and all. But I've been making my own juice for a few years now, so it won't affect me, and there's no ban on the individual ingredients...yet. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Michigans ban goes into effect at midnight,tonight. But I've been making my own juice for a few years now, so it won't affect me, and there's no ban on the individual ingredients...yet. A few pre ban mags and some pre ban vape juice and you are in NY heaven!
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Posted: 10/2/2019 6:04:17 AM EDT
[#22]
Quote HistoryQuote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Any theories as to why no other countries are reporting illnesses/deaths like the recent spike in the US? The increase in teen vaping is the biggest one-year spike of any substance in the 44 years the Monitorithe Future (MTF) survey has been conducted. This year’s study included responses from 44,482 students at 392 public and private schools and found 37.3 percent of twelfth graders reported “any vaping” in the past 12 months, compared to 27.8 percent in 2017. It is the biggest year-to-year increase in substance use ever recorded in the survey’s 44 years. |
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Posted: 10/2/2019 6:05:00 AM EDT
[#23]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Pre ban vape juice is best vape juice! A few pre ban mags and some pre ban vape juice and you are in NY heaven! Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Michigans ban goes into effect at midnight,tonight. But I've been making my own juice for a few years now, so it won't affect me, and there's no ban on the individual ingredients...yet. A few pre ban mags and some pre ban vape juice and you are in NY heaven!
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Posted: 10/2/2019 6:05:29 AM EDT
[#24]
Quote HistoryQuoted: So any drug should be available to anyone over what, age 12, from the corner store? Maybe in Ron Pauls fantasy world. No limits on anything, should there be only one amendment to the constitution- thall shall not infringe upon my freedom? Banning it does reduce its use. If you ended the WoD overnight, and said tomorrow you can set up a table on the sidewalk in front of your house selling oxys and heroin, you don't think we'd see a rise in use? These are the exact same arguments gun grabbers make. I don't understand how you're the only one that doesn't see this. And in your typical "the government must solve this" mentality you fail to recognize the unintended consequences, which there always are. That are often even worse than the initial problem. If these illnesses/deaths are cause by some unregulated black market product what do you think will happen in a ban when everything becomes unregulated black market product?? 
From all these threads I think you've still yet to tell me a ban that has been successful. |
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Posted: 10/2/2019 6:10:04 AM EDT
[#25]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Go climb a rock wall, jump out of a airplane, drive 150 on a closed circuit track for all I care. But drugs take over a person's mind and its something that does need regulating |
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Posted: 10/2/2019 7:16:45 AM EDT
[#26]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Unless you're willing to put a gun to someone's head (and some countries do just that) you can't regulate people into behaving a certain way. The only way is through education and information and people wanting to make better/healthier choices. And even then there will be a group that just doesn't care. And that's on them. You don't think moving the drinking age from 18 to 21 had any effect? I heard it used to be mayhem around my town back in the 80s. IE people passed out drunk on the sidewalks. Not anymore, moving it to 21 had a huge effect. |
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Posted: 10/2/2019 7:32:26 AM EDT
[#27]
Quote HistoryQuoted: How many post 86 machine guns do you see being shot by average people? Can you even talk about owning a post 86 illegal machine gun on this site? Nope. How about bump stocks, are people still using them left and right or are they destroyed/buried in someone's backyard? You don't think moving the drinking age from 18 to 21 had any effect? I heard it used to be mayhem around my town back in the 80s. IE people passed out drunk on the sidewalks. Not anymore, moving it to 21 had a huge effect. 1 single person died without using THC carts (supposedly)...one person out of millions and they dont go over any of the families health concerns of the person, his/her history of drug use, bad choices he/she has made, or any other possible reasons for the death. The person could have died from unknown sources, and being that the person tried vaping - they blame vaping (because that's whats "hot" right now). Your willing to make millions of people who have successfully ran away from a high risk cancer inducing product to be forced to go back to smoking, where their chances of getting cancer or dying is sky high....based on what a media tells you, because a handful of people died. How ignorant and dim can you be? |
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Posted: 10/2/2019 7:38:24 AM EDT
[#28]
Quote HistoryQuoted: You said you have yet to see a nicotine vaper die. Literally right in the subject of this thread is a nicotine non-thc vaper who died. Then you come back with "reputable nic juce does not contain oil?" What's your point? That Georgia death happened without any THC or oil. Explain that. Then you ignored my 17% stat and went right on some tangent about soccer mom's and full auto ar15s. I'd like to debate you, but I can't understand what you're saying. Vitamin E acetate is not a oil for petes sake. I have some liquid vitamin E that I take as a vitamin right in front of me. It says Ingredient: Glycine Soja (soybean) oil, Vitamin E (tocopheryl acetate), Cocos nuciferia (coconut) oil) From wiki But GD scientists know it all from Tom's of Maine about it
How is it made? Our Stewardship Model guides us to select ingredients which have been processed in a manner that supports our philosophy of human and environmental health. Tocopherol and tocopheryl acetate can be made naturally from vegetable oils or synthetically from petroleum products. The two have distinct names for supplement labeling; d-alpha tocopherol or tocopheryl acetate distinguishes a naturally derived supplement while dl-alpha tocopherol or tocopheryl acetate distinguishes a synthetic supplement. As a cosmetic ingredient the name tocopherol or tocopheryl acetate is simply applied so the source can not be determined from the label. The tocopherol we use is naturally derived from either soybean or rapeseed oil. The tocopheryl acetate is produced when this naturally derived d-alpha tocopherol is combined with acetic acid in a process known as esterification. As for 17% percent that said they didn't use thc. Ever arrest someone, pat them down and find dope in their pockets? First thing a lot of them say is, these aren't my pants. I'm saying those 17% lied, or at the very least vaoped some form of toxic bullshit they bought as counterfeits or plain illegal substances. |
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Posted: 10/2/2019 7:42:50 AM EDT
[#29]
Quote HistoryQuoted: And if we had 805 ar15 kabooms killing 15 people in the last few months, we'd be looking into it, wouldn't we? Not posting things minimizing people dying. |
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Posted: 10/2/2019 7:44:23 AM EDT
[#30]
Quote History |
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Posted: 10/2/2019 7:44:46 AM EDT
[#31]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quit spouting bullshit. tocopheryl acetate is a fat soluble vitamin, not only is it suspended in oil, it's made with oil. This is tiresome. As for 17% percent that said they didn't use thc. Ever arrest someone, pat them down and find dope in their pockets? First thing a lot of them say is, these aren't my pants. I'm saying those 17% lied, or at the very least vaoped some form of toxic bullshit they bought as counterfeits or plain illegal substances. "Quit spouting bullshit." Right back at ya 
So what we have here is you thinking every bit of information counter to your opinion is a lie or bullshit. We will find out in time. What is your motivation, are you a nicotine vaper? Defending the product you like? |
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Posted: 10/2/2019 7:52:55 AM EDT
[#32]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Deflection, you didn't answer the question. The rise of 10% here does not answer why this is a localized event. The amount of vapers worldwide dwarfs that of the US. Where are these cases? Not localized either, here's a case of a nicotine ONLY vape patient, in the UK, back in 2018. https://casereports.bmj.com/content/2018/bcr-2018-224350 |
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Posted: 10/2/2019 8:04:43 AM EDT
[#33]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Moving goal posts...your advocating the ban of. If we had 805 kabooms would you push for banning all ar15s? |
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Posted: 10/2/2019 8:18:55 AM EDT
[#34]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Page after page, I have yet to see a decent argument from you that isnt based on purely emotion, hyperbole or hysteria. 15 out of 9 million is negligible and your believing everything thats shown by media without question. No one here is going to be able to help you, your cognitive dissonance is too powerful. 1 single person died without using THC carts (supposedly)...one person out of millions and they dont go over any of the families health concerns of the person, his/her history of drug use, bad choices he/she has made, or any other possible reasons for the death. The person could have died from unknown sources, and being that the person tried vaping - they blame vaping (because that's whats "hot" right now). Your willing to make millions of people who have successfully ran away from a high risk cancer inducing product to be forced to go back to smoking, where their chances of getting cancer or dying is sky high....based on what a media tells you, because a handful of people died. How ignorant and dim can you be? Quote HistoryQuoted:
Page after page, I have yet to see a decent argument from you that isnt based on purely emotion, hyperbole or hysteria. 15 out of 9 million is negligible and your believing everything thats shown by media without question. No one here is going to be able to help you, your cognitive dissonance is too powerful. 1 single person died without using THC carts (supposedly)...one person out of millions and they dont go over any of the families health concerns of the person, his/her history of drug use, bad choices he/she has made, or any other possible reasons for the death. The person could have died from unknown sources, and being that the person tried vaping - they blame vaping (because that's whats "hot" right now). Your willing to make millions of people who have successfully ran away from a high risk cancer inducing product to be forced to go back to smoking, where their chances of getting cancer or dying is sky high....based on what a media tells you, because a handful of people died. How ignorant and dim can you be? https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-7518913/British-factory-worker-57-worlds-person-die-disease-linked-VAPING.html IMO I'm one of the few people ITT presenting studies, articles and facts. The people I'm arguing with sound like addicts angry I'm taking away their vice. How ignorant and dim can you be? Want me to go tally the number of news articles and peer reviewed journals I've posted up? That number dwarfs everyone I've argued against.http://scholar.google.com You too can see the same things the scientists read. |
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Posted: 10/2/2019 8:36:02 AM EDT
[#35]
Died after vaping only 8 months? I wonder what other factors were involved, seeing as how some people have been vaping for a decade or more without issue.
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Posted: 10/2/2019 8:41:45 AM EDT
[#36]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Died after vaping only 8 months? I wonder what other factors were involved, seeing as how some people have been vaping for a decade or more without issue. I'm thinking the recent surge is because people are putting down their cigarettes completely in favor of vape. I've shown with marijuana how the partial smoke profile does not trigger p53. Just have to find it with nicotine. If I do, I think I've solved it. |
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Posted: 10/2/2019 9:06:38 AM EDT
[#37]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I think its because he switched completely over, no smoke products. IMO the smoke activates genes/pathways that protect (end result is p53 activation and apoptosis of damaged cells). I'm looking on google scholar for studies showing p53 activation with whole nicotine smoke and p53 activation with filtered smoke, but haven't been successful so far. I'm thinking the recent surge is because people are putting down their cigarettes completely in favor of vape. I've shown with marijuana how the partial smoke profile does not trigger p53. Just have to find it with nicotine. If I do, I think I've solved it. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Died after vaping only 8 months? I wonder what other factors were involved, seeing as how some people have been vaping for a decade or more without issue. I'm thinking the recent surge is because people are putting down their cigarettes completely in favor of vape. I've shown with marijuana how the partial smoke profile does not trigger p53. Just have to find it with nicotine. If I do, I think I've solved it. I have been vaping for 6 or 7 years now. Smoked traditional cigs from age 16 or so, until then (so about 29/30ish yrs old). I have always felt better than when I smoked cigs. Never had shortness of breath or any other issues. The only time I had an issue, is when I tried nic salts last year, which is another form of nicotine. It made me cough, so I just stopped using it and went back to regular freebase nicotine, and haven't had a problem since. Never tried THC juices, so I can't comment on that area. There have to be other factors at play here. There's just too much inconsistency. Whether it's simply differing reactions with different people, or the fact that there are countless companies making ejuice and ejuice ingredients these days, making it hard to narrow it down for reliable testing, a combination of those, or something else entirely. I dunno. |
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Posted: 10/2/2019 9:23:28 AM EDT
[#38]
Quote HistoryQuoted: So any drug should be available to anyone over what, age 12, from the corner store? Maybe in Ron Pauls fantasy world. No limits on anything, should there be only one amendment to the constitution- thall shall not infringe upon my freedom? Banning it does reduce its use. If you ended the WoD overnight, and said tomorrow you can set up a table on the sidewalk in front of your house selling oxys and heroin, you don't think we'd see a rise in use? |
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Posted: 10/2/2019 9:24:17 AM EDT
[#39]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Go climb a rock wall, jump out of a airplane, drive 150 on a closed circuit track for all I care. But drugs take over a person's mind and its something that does need regulating |
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Posted: 10/2/2019 9:24:18 AM EDT
[#40]
Quote HistoryQuoted: How many post 86 machine guns do you see being shot by average people? Can you even talk about owning a post 86 illegal machine gun on this site? Nope. How about bump stocks, are people still using them left and right or are they destroyed/buried in someone's backyard? You don't think moving the drinking age from 18 to 21 had any effect? I heard it used to be mayhem around my town back in the 80s. IE people passed out drunk on the sidewalks. Not anymore, moving it to 21 had a huge effect. A much better comparison would be to prohibition. It's all about demand. Where there is demand supply will find a way. It's nothing to do with legal/illegal. I really don't know why you're having such a difficult time with this. We were able to get alcohol under 21 fairly easily maybe my friends and I were around 19/20 so not really young but still underage. And it's not like we were much on partying either. So if it didn't stop us it definitely isn't stopping anyone else even more determined. |
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Posted: 10/2/2019 9:28:34 AM EDT
[#41]
Quote HistoryQuoted: How many post 86 machine guns do you see being shot by average people? Can you even talk about owning a post 86 illegal machine gun on this site? Nope. How about bump stocks, are people still using them left and right or are they destroyed/buried in someone's backyard? You don't think moving the drinking age from 18 to 21 had any effect? I heard it used to be mayhem around my town back in the 80s. IE people passed out drunk on the sidewalks. Not anymore, moving it to 21 had a huge effect. |
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Posted: 10/2/2019 9:37:29 AM EDT
[#42]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Any theories as to why no other countries are reporting illnesses/deaths like the recent spike in the US? |
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Posted: 10/2/2019 9:39:12 AM EDT
[#43]
Quote HistoryQuoted: In my experience, the people who have been vaping the longest, are those who were in the exact same boat as him, though. They are older people who were lifelong smokers, and they quit smoking and went to vaping. These were the early adopters who got into the game when ecigs were almost exclusively used as a smoking replacement. As opposed to nowadays, where it's become a "thing" for teens to do and for those simply wanting to jump on the bandwagon for recreational purposes. So something doesn't jive, IMO. I have been vaping for 6 or 7 years now. Smoked traditional cigs from age 16 or so, until then (so about 29/30ish yrs old). I have always felt better than when I smoked cigs. Never had shortness of breath or any other issues. The only time I had an issue, is when I tried nic salts last year, which is another form of nicotine. It made me cough, so I just stopped using it and went back to regular freebase nicotine, and haven't had a problem since. Never tried THC juices, so I can't comment on that area. There have to be other factors at play here. There's just too much inconsistency. Whether it's simply differing reactions with different people, or the fact that there are countless companies making ejuice and ejuice ingredients these days, making it hard to narrow it down for reliable testing, a combination of those, or something else entirely. I dunno. 
https://www.ruthlessvapor.com/blogs/ruthless-e-liquid/nicotine-salt-vs-freebase-why-nicotine-salt-is-the-new-craze |
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Posted: 10/2/2019 9:44:48 AM EDT
[#44]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
15 now, classifying an earlier death back in May as a vape death. https://people.com/health/vaping-related-death-nebraska-national-total-15/ |
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Posted: 10/2/2019 9:48:54 AM EDT
[#45]
Quote HistoryQuoted: All those things you list also alter a person's mind. One of the reasons for living is to get enjoyment from activities we do. Our behavior is affected by our anticipated enjoyment. Like a more complex version of Pavlov's dog. When I sink a 3 pointer in someone's face, that action and result is coupled with a positive reinforcement. I'll seek to achieve that good feeling again by mimicing my shooting motion to drain another one. Drugs interfere with this. They provide positive reinforcement of our pleasure system for simply sucking in smoke. Or injecting heroin into ones veins. Meanwhile pleasure gained from doing our everyday things or special things that we get extra enjoyment from are diminished. Why go do X,Y,Z when I can just stand around smoking cigarettes, pot, heroin or whatever and get pleasure that way instead. This is addiction in a nutshell. |
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Posted: 10/2/2019 9:50:23 AM EDT
[#46]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Dude, you are on the wrong fucking site.
Go start a thread something like "Thall shall not touch our vape juice! Pro-vapers unite." I won't intrude |
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Posted: 10/2/2019 9:57:30 AM EDT
[#47]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Wow. Only 85 more and it will match the number of people killed by trees falling on them. What if an arfcommer got sick from this? Would you still make such a comment? |
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Posted: 10/2/2019 10:08:18 AM EDT
[#48]
Quote HistoryQuoted: No, you're in the wrong thread
Go start a thread something like "Thall shall not touch our vape juice! Pro-vapers unite." I won't intrude |
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Posted: 10/2/2019 10:13:53 AM EDT
[#49]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Dude, it's a discussion forum. If you don't want discussion, write all this bullshit down in your diary.
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Posted: 10/2/2019 10:15:26 AM EDT
[#50]
Quoted:
Quoted:
Your entire argument is that you know better for someone else than themselves...tell me again how that argument is any different than those attempting to actively disarm us know? https://www.cdc.gov/drugoverdose/images/pbss/CDC-Fentanyl-overdoses-rise-400w.jpg Ban fentanyl... oh, wait. Banning anything doesn't help. By banning it, it automatically becomes unregulated. Edit:fix image Banning it does reduce its use. If you ended the WoD overnight, and said tomorrow you can set up a table on the sidewalk in front of your house selling oxys and heroin, you don't think we'd see a rise in use? After an initial uptick, you'd see it drop back down. You're trying to sound all reasonable, but your argument is just the same "Freedom is scary!" busybody line anti-gunners push all the time. If your society doesn't punish drug users who hurt others, don't blame the drugs for others getting hurt, blame your society for tolerating it. |
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