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Link Posted: 8/17/2023 9:15:04 PM EDT
[#1]
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Quoted:
It sounded more like Massa going after compensation, “lost wages” sort of thing.
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Doesn’t really matter.  He still would have to prove the same thing, that the results would have been different had Piquet not crashed.  Who knows what would have happened in the race had that not happened.  Maybe someone else would have brought out a safety car.  Maybe the same pit stop mistake would happened anyway.  Maybe Massa would have binned it.  Maybe Massa would have been caught up in someone else’s incident.  Again, other people more responsible for what happened to him that race.
Link Posted: 8/18/2023 8:07:33 AM EDT
[#2]
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Quoted:
Massa's lawyers seek compensation for lost 2008 F1 title

It's not about Timo Glock in Brazil, it's about Crashgate.

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Quoted:
Massa's lawyers seek compensation for lost 2008 F1 title

It's not about Timo Glock in Brazil, it's about Crashgate.

Aug 17 (Reuters) - Lawyers for former Ferrari driver Felipe Massa have started legal action against Formula One bosses and the governing FIA seeking substantial damages resulting from an alleged "conspiracy" that denied him the 2008 championship.

A formal eight-page Letter Before Claim, seen by Reuters, was sent to Formula One chief executive Stefano Domenicali and Paris-based FIA president Mohammed Ben Sulayem on Aug. 15.

Such a letter is a required formal legal notice before court proceedings.

London-based Enyo Law said Brazilian Massa, now 42, had been "the victim of a conspiracy committed by individuals at the highest level of F1 together with the FIA and Formula One Management".

It said Massa had lost out on tens of millions of euros in lost earnings and bonuses as a result of another driver's deliberate crash at the 2008 Singapore Grand Prix that was allegedly covered up before becoming a scandal in 2009.

The crash cost Massa vital points in a season where he ultimately lost out by a single point to McLaren's Lewis Hamilton, the first of the Briton's record-equalling seven.

"Simply put, Mr Massa is the rightful 2008 Driver's Champion, and F1 and FIA deliberately ignored the misconduct that cheated him out of that title," said the letter.

"Mr Massa is unable to fully quantify his losses at this stage but estimates that they are likely to exceed tens of millions of Euros.

"This amount does not cover the serious moral and reputational losses suffered by Mr Massa."

Massa sought legal advice after former F1 supremo Bernie Ecclestone was quoted in March as saying he and former FIA president Max Mosley knew in 2008 that then-Renault driver Nelson Piquet's crash was deliberate but had not acted.

An FIA spokesperson said the governing body acknowledged receipt of "correspondence" from Massa's representatives, and added: "The matter is under review and we will not be providing comment at this stage."

There was no immediate response from Formula One, which is on an August shutdown. Domenicali was previously Massa's team boss at Ferrari.

Ecclestone, 92, told Reuters by telephone from Switzerland he could not remember saying the key quotes attributed to him.

"I don't remember any of this, to be honest," said the Briton, who was replaced as F1 supremo in 2017 after U.S.-based Liberty Media took over as commercial rights holders.

"I don't remember giving the interview for sure."

He said neither Massa nor the Brazilian's lawyers had approached him to ask what he might have said.

PIQUET CRASH
Massa was leading the 2008 Singapore Grand Prix from pole position when fellow Brazilian Piquet crashed into the wall on lap 14 of 61.

The crash triggered the safety car and benefited Piquet's Spanish team mate Fernando Alonso, who won the race. Massa failed to score after a bungled pitstop.

Piquet revealed in 2009 that he had been told to crash by Renault team bosses, who were subsequently banned.

In this year's interview with www.f1-insider.com Ecclestone was quoted as saying he still felt sorry for Massa: "He was cheated out of the title he deserved, while Hamilton had all the luck in the world and won his first championship."

Massa told Reuters in May that he wanted justice.

"If the most important people from Formula One and the FIA knew in 2008 and didn’t do anything, you think that was fair? It’s not fair," he said.

The lawyers' letter warned that, without a satisfactory response, Massa intended to "pursue legal action in order to seek compensation for the harm he has suffered."

He also wanted "recognition that, but for those unlawful acts, he would have been awarded the 2008 Championship."

The lawyers said that, in the absence of a substantive reply within 14 days, they expected to be instructed "to commence legal proceedings in the English courts without further notice to you".

Massa did not win again after 2008, with the Brazilian suffering a near-fatal head injury at the 2009 Hungarian Grand Prix. He retired in 2017.

Mosley, who worked closely with Ecclestone, died in 2021 while FIA race director Charlie Whiting, another key figure, died in 2019.

Reporting by Rory Carroll and Alan Baldwin; Editing by Ken Ferris and Ed Osmond



Attachment Attached File


Let it go, man.
Link Posted: 8/18/2023 11:06:24 AM EDT
[#3]
The lease silly silly season for awhile...

Link Posted: 8/18/2023 12:52:47 PM EDT
[#4]
Who among us attended a British GP?

I've been lurking' since the beginning of the thread.  I thought someone posted about their trip to Silverstone but I'm not finding it in search.

I'm shooting for grandstand seats in 2024.  Any pointers specific to a good 1 day experience @ Silverstone?
Link Posted: 8/18/2023 1:09:26 PM EDT
[#5]
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Quoted:
The lease silly silly season for awhile...

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/F30mVV-WoAIb0bi?format=png&name=900x900
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No kidding. They couldn't have waited until break to replace de Vries?
Link Posted: 8/18/2023 1:18:05 PM EDT
[#6]
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Quoted:
Who among us attended a British GP?

I've been lurking' since the beginning of the thread.  I thought someone posted about their trip to Silverstone but I'm not finding it in search.

I'm shooting for grandstand seats in 2024.  Any pointers specific to a good 1 day experience @ Silverstone?
View Quote




I attended qualifying at Silverstone in 2012. I can't imagine much of what I did is relevant anymore.

It was rainy and cold (for summer). I took a train from London Euston to either Milton Keynes or Banbury (I forget). I hopped on a shuttle bus in the carpark at the station which dropped us in the middle of the town of Silverstone. From there we walked 10-15 minutes to the circuit.

It was my first F1 experience. I'll never forget first hearing the din of F1 motors in the distance once in Silverstone, which only got louder as we walked towards the track entrance

Bring a rain jacket and wellies!
Link Posted: 8/18/2023 1:35:43 PM EDT
[#7]
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Quoted:


No kidding. They couldn't have waited until break to replace de Vries?
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Quoted:
Quoted:
The lease silly silly season for awhile...

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/F30mVV-WoAIb0bi?format=png&name=900x900


No kidding. They couldn't have waited until break to replace de Vries?


Yeah really. The only other drama was at Alpine with Otmar, that too couldn't even wait for the break.
Link Posted: 8/18/2023 4:42:46 PM EDT
[#8]
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Quoted:


Yeah really. The only other drama was at Alpine with Otmar, that too couldn't even wait for the break.
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It feels like the quiet before the storm type of moment at this point......something big is coming.....
Link Posted: 8/20/2023 6:57:45 AM EDT
[#9]
Can we get a link to the survey?

I would like to see how pitiful I am doing for the season so far.
Link Posted: 8/20/2023 10:57:13 AM EDT
[#10]
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Quoted:
Can we get a link to the survey?

I would like to see how pitiful I am doing for the season so far.
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Link to results excel doc

Right now @Tobysi is leading with 304 points.
Link Posted: 8/20/2023 12:25:26 PM EDT
[#11]
Not last, yea me.
Link Posted: 8/20/2023 4:17:29 PM EDT
[#12]
Link Posted: 8/20/2023 8:29:16 PM EDT
[#13]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History


As much as I enjoy the racing, F1 is just as namby pamby woke as any other sports league.  Maybe more.
Link Posted: 8/20/2023 10:51:02 PM EDT
[#14]
A little bit of fun and intrigue coming out of the break.

Zak Brown and Newey hat swap.

Zak has his arm around Jim Farley, CEO of Ford.

Link Posted: 8/20/2023 10:55:54 PM EDT
[#15]
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Quoted:


As much as I enjoy the racing, F1 is just as namby pamby woke as any other sports league.  Maybe more.
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Quoted:


As much as I enjoy the racing, F1 is just as namby pamby woke as any other sports league.  Maybe more.


I follow F1’s official Twitter page and the birthday wishes seem to be random for the 100’s of former drivers.

Also, the first rule of sports marketing in the 21st century is “get the women to shut the fuck up on social media”. Every sport sees it, it always detracts, and it sometimes ends up in court.
Link Posted: 8/21/2023 7:21:58 AM EDT
[#16]
We made it boys

ITS RACE WEEK!
Link Posted: 8/21/2023 8:17:22 AM EDT
[#17]
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Quoted:
We made it boys

ITS RACE WEEK!
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Party on Wayne

Link Posted: 8/21/2023 8:51:44 AM EDT
[#18]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
A little bit of fun and intrigue coming out of the break.

Zak Brown and Newey hat swap.

Zak has his arm around Jim Farley, CEO of Ford.

https://i.imgur.com/qJf646Q.jpg
View Quote


Didn't Newey just reup his RB contract for another few years?
Link Posted: 8/21/2023 9:01:19 AM EDT
[#19]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
We made it boys

ITS RACE WEEK!
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Link Posted: 8/21/2023 9:14:56 AM EDT
[#20]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:


Party on Wayne

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Quoted:
Quoted:
We made it boys

ITS RACE WEEK!


Party on Wayne


Party on Garth!

Link Posted: 8/21/2023 9:34:57 AM EDT
[#21]
Attachment Attached File




WAYNE’S WORLD!  WAYNE’S WORLD!
Link Posted: 8/22/2023 1:34:05 AM EDT
[#22]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Who among us attended a British GP?

I've been lurking' since the beginning of the thread.  I thought someone posted about their trip to Silverstone but I'm not finding it in search.

I'm shooting for grandstand seats in 2024.  Any pointers specific to a good 1 day experience @ Silverstone?
View Quote



Went in 1990.  I'm sure there is nothing the same now.  

Had GA tickets and bought a center transfer.  Got to walk the pit lane with that.  Pretty amazing and we didn't even make it down to the good teams before they were booting people out at the 1 hour to start mark.  Ended up sitting in the grass at Stowe corner.  Amazing to see the cars take the corner at 170mph or so with a downshift.  1 car had brakes glowing coming into the corner.  No way they were winning.  

Back then they had the Marlboro girls outside the entrance enticing you to try/buy their cigs.

A beautiful summer day.  I think I even got a bit of sunburn.
Link Posted: 8/22/2023 7:46:39 AM EDT
[#23]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:


Didn't Newey just reup his RB contract for another few years?
View Quote View All Quotes
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Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Quoted:
A little bit of fun and intrigue coming out of the break.

Zak Brown and Newey hat swap.

Zak has his arm around Jim Farley, CEO of Ford.

https://i.imgur.com/qJf646Q.jpg


Didn't Newey just reup his RB contract for another few years?


At this point, Newey should probably be considered “RB for life”. I have always suspected that both he and Horner were given equity in the team recently.

The intrigue comes from Ford as it has been rumored that McLaren might be looking at running RBPT power units in 2026 (which might include a deal that would bring Lando to RB).
Link Posted: 8/22/2023 8:55:44 AM EDT
[#24]
Link Posted: 8/22/2023 9:00:31 AM EDT
[#25]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History



I saw that this morning. I don't get it. Is taking a hand off the wheel illegal?
Link Posted: 8/22/2023 9:07:24 AM EDT
[#26]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:



I saw that this morning. I don't get it. Is taking a hand off the wheel illegal?
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Quoted:



I saw that this morning. I don't get it. Is taking a hand off the wheel illegal?


There are:

A lot of people who don’t like Max
A lot of people who have class envy

At most, he was just speeding briefly, but this is 2023 and everyone turns into a Karen if there is something they don’t like (see above).
Link Posted: 8/22/2023 9:15:08 AM EDT
[#27]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:


There are:

A lot of people who don’t like Max
A lot of people who have class envy

At most, he was just speeding briefly, but this is 2023 and everyone turns into a Karen if there is something they don’t like (see above).
View Quote View All Quotes
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Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Quoted:



I saw that this morning. I don't get it. Is taking a hand off the wheel illegal?


There are:

A lot of people who don’t like Max
A lot of people who have class envy

At most, he was just speeding briefly, but this is 2023 and everyone turns into a Karen if there is something they don’t like (see above).


I thought that was a Babylon Bee kinda thing. It’s actually serious?
Link Posted: 8/22/2023 9:26:43 AM EDT
[#28]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:


At this point, Newey should probably be considered “RB for life”. I have always suspected that both he and Horner were given equity in the team recently.

The intrigue comes from Ford as it has been rumored that McLaren might be looking at running RBPT power units in 2026 (which might include a deal that would bring Lando to RB).
View Quote


That would be a interesting pairing, I'm sure those 2 would have fun off the track together.  But on track during a race could get interesting.
Link Posted: 8/22/2023 9:27:31 AM EDT
[#29]
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Quoted:


I thought that was a Babylon Bee kinda thing. It’s actually serious?
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Max will end up paying a fine and thats likely it.  The whole thing is stupid.
Link Posted: 8/22/2023 9:48:08 AM EDT
[#30]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:



I saw that this morning. I don't get it. Is taking a hand off the wheel illegal?
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Quoted:



I saw that this morning. I don't get it. Is taking a hand off the wheel illegal?

It is Europe.  Everything is regulated beyond reasonable sense, ie: in favor of government powers.
Link Posted: 8/22/2023 9:58:20 AM EDT
[#31]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:


I thought that was a Babylon Bee kinda thing. It’s actually serious?
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Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:



I saw that this morning. I don't get it. Is taking a hand off the wheel illegal?


There are:

A lot of people who don’t like Max
A lot of people who have class envy

At most, he was just speeding briefly, but this is 2023 and everyone turns into a Karen if there is something they don’t like (see above).


I thought that was a Babylon Bee kinda thing. It’s actually serious?


To the extent that it can actually be considered “serious”.

Somebody submitted the video General Directorate of the National Gendarmerie for investigation.
Link Posted: 8/22/2023 10:05:17 AM EDT
[#32]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:


To the extent that it can actually be considered “serious”.

Somebody submitted the video General Directorate of the National Gendarmerie for investigation.
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Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:



I saw that this morning. I don't get it. Is taking a hand off the wheel illegal?


There are:

A lot of people who don’t like Max
A lot of people who have class envy

At most, he was just speeding briefly, but this is 2023 and everyone turns into a Karen if there is something they don’t like (see above).


I thought that was a Babylon Bee kinda thing. It’s actually serious?


To the extent that it can actually be considered “serious”.

Somebody submitted the video General Directorate of the National Gendarmerie for investigation.

Am I correct in guessing that there are statutes/regulation preventing people from recording (and posting) videos of government malfeasance?  Or are such submissions immediately sequestered in the circular file?
Link Posted: 8/22/2023 10:38:32 AM EDT
[#33]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:

Am I correct in guessing that there are statutes/regulation preventing people from recording (and posting) videos of government malfeasance?  Or are such submissions immediately sequestered in the circular file?
View Quote View All Quotes
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Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:



I saw that this morning. I don't get it. Is taking a hand off the wheel illegal?


There are:

A lot of people who don’t like Max
A lot of people who have class envy

At most, he was just speeding briefly, but this is 2023 and everyone turns into a Karen if there is something they don’t like (see above).


I thought that was a Babylon Bee kinda thing. It’s actually serious?


To the extent that it can actually be considered “serious”.

Somebody submitted the video General Directorate of the National Gendarmerie for investigation.

Am I correct in guessing that there are statutes/regulation preventing people from recording (and posting) videos of government malfeasance?  Or are such submissions immediately sequestered in the circular file?


No clue. In general, the mainland Euro police stance is fuck around and find out.
Link Posted: 8/22/2023 4:52:39 PM EDT
[#34]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History

Such horse shit. Taking your hand off the wheel to use the touch screen is illegal? Wtf?
Link Posted: 8/22/2023 11:45:55 PM EDT
[#35]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:

It is Europe.  Everything is regulated beyond reasonable sense, ie: in favor of government powers.
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Quoted:
Quoted:



I saw that this morning. I don't get it. Is taking a hand off the wheel illegal?

It is Europe.  Everything is regulated beyond reasonable sense, ie: in favor of government powers.

I once turned right at a red light north of Munich.  Came to a stop sign, and some asshole pulled up next to me and cussed me out (in German).  I had no idea that was not allowed.  I assume that's what he was yelling about lol.  Germans get very uptight about their rulez.
Link Posted: 8/23/2023 1:36:23 PM EDT
[#36]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:

I once turned right at a red light north of Munich.  Came to a stop sign, and some asshole pulled up next to me and cussed me out (in German).  I had no idea that was not allowed.  I assume that's what he was yelling about lol.  Germans get very uptight about their rulez.
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I got yelled at by a Carabinero in Chile for that. Apparently right on red is only allowed if there is a specific sign.
Link Posted: 8/23/2023 10:05:36 PM EDT
[#37]
Link Posted: 8/23/2023 11:05:40 PM EDT
[#38]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
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Built by F1 Authentics.

Gross.
Link Posted: 8/24/2023 9:31:04 AM EDT
[#39]
LOL Holy shit....is Lance really thinking of quiting F1 for Tennis..........I can only imagine Papa Stroll right now...
Link Posted: 8/24/2023 9:33:13 AM EDT
[#40]
Link Posted: 8/24/2023 10:32:05 AM EDT
[#41]
Glad to see they were both re-signed.
Link Posted: 8/24/2023 11:18:05 AM EDT
[#42]
Disney+ has released behind the scenes images from its new F1 docuseries about Brawn's incredible championship winning season in 2009.
Keanu Reeves is acting as both producer and host for the project, which is set to premiere later this year ??
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Link Posted: 8/24/2023 12:11:22 PM EDT
[#43]
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Quoted:
LOL Holy shit....is Lance really thinking of quiting F1 for Tennis..........I can only imagine Papa Stroll right now...
View Quote

I've seen several non-raceday interviews with Lance and he always seems miserable.  Maybe he genuinely hates racing.
Link Posted: 8/25/2023 1:28:37 AM EDT
[#44]
DUTCH GRAND PRIX SCHEDULE


FRIDAY 08/25
FP1 6:30AM - ESPN2
FP2 10AM - ESPN2

SATURDAY 08/26
FP3 5:30AM - ESPN2
QUALI 9AM - ESPN

SUNDAY 08/27
RACE 9AM - ESPN

Five Awesome Battles At The Dutch Grand Prix

Top 10 Overtakes Of 2023... So Far!
Link Posted: 8/25/2023 2:04:59 AM EDT
[#45]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History


Incredible …
Watch all the other major teams focus all resources on the current championship.

Buy a full works Honda for pennies on the dollar in development for 2 years.
Put in a banger of a AMG engine.  Create a half shaft so they mate - now win like hell with a car formula that those other teams didn’t have money / time to devote towards because they were focused on previous year’s WCC.
Link Posted: 8/25/2023 7:42:20 AM EDT
[#46]
Link Posted: 8/25/2023 7:56:40 AM EDT
[#47]
Link Posted: 8/25/2023 9:54:45 AM EDT
[#48]
Pretty bizarre to not hear a confused Italian on the Ferrari radio (Schwartzman’s radio).
Link Posted: 8/25/2023 10:13:04 AM EDT
[#49]
Not a good practice session to be an Aussie....
Link Posted: 8/25/2023 10:18:01 AM EDT
[#50]
At first I thought they collided but then I saw the replay. Now I’m perplexed.
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