100%

. I'm kind of liking the captured wolf I think it'll be a good matchup for Morgan to get back into the swing of things



As it was mentioned earlier Morgan is definitely a timebomb you just never know when he is going to go off.
He may become one of the best of the good guys or one of the worst of the bad guys you just don't know.
Keep in mind he was killing people just for being people .he didn't want anybody around.Definitely
a double edge sword with a lot of blood in the middle. The Wolf in a box might end up being
a dog food we'll see.

I think you and I have a true understanding of this situation....

Would have been more interesting if I cared about that character more.



 

Yep, he'll give Morgan no choice.

Well, alot of us do.

So, I wonder if the captured wolf will end up killing Judith, causing Morgan to kill the wolf  and get back into the "clear" mode?  Then Morgan could take Judith's body back to Rick, giving Morgan the opportunity to hold a baby again.  

nah. Carol Team 6 offed the guy that Morgan stopped from killing preacher man.

He picked up the Wolf in that house when he was by himself.

I was bored to death with the last episode.

there is always a choice!  it enrages me every time i hear a character in TWD whine "i had no choice".

sometimes the choices are all shitty, but there is always a choice.  the ability to choose is what makes us adults.  to say that there isn't a choice is to willingly become a child, and to completely surrender control of one's life.  it is the creed of willed helplessness, and the excuse of victims.



i'm only half joking--this really makes me rage.

I agree with that. I think everyone is terribly disappointed in who he has become.
He seems to swing too far every way he goes. Hopefully he can find a happy medium.
I don't know what good he would be against another group who had guns and its only a matter of time till that happens again.

 
Holy shit that was retarded.

Winter's coming.

Ok.

But bear in mind that Morgan more than likely still has an underlying psychosis that he's keeping at bay with his "all life matters" thing, as mentioned on Talking Dead. And we all know that this Wolf dude is going to keep pushing Morgan's buttons until he finds the right one, and Morgan's choice will be all but made, because then, the pent up rage will have taken over.......and Morgan will kill him.

Now they've jumped the shark

i understand the point that you're making about the show, and i don't disagree at all.  but just the words "no choice" make me irrationally angry.  that's purely liberal thinking.  capitalism makes people into thieves--they have "no choice".  colonialism makes people into suicide bombers--they have "no choice".

those words are just weakness--blaming the big bad world for making the decision, so the individual can't be held accountable.

there is always a choice, and we are the sum of our choices.

here endeth the rant.

Blessed are the cheesemakers.

 
Better keep listening, might be a bit about blessed are the big noses.


 

Watched the episode again and came away with a few observations. Someone had asked how Eastman got bitten by a walker given his ninja skills. From what he said in the episode it sounded like he was still a beginner or intermediate student. He came off as very zen but his whole philosophy was very recently adopted. Morgan was likely the first person he had much contact with since he killed the psycho. He probably hasn't encountered all that many walkers or hostile people. Morgan was already beating walker's heads in with a stick before Eastman showed up. He just showed him some technique and how practice could help him find some tranquility.

Eastman may not have been all that great of a fighter but he was the perfect person to get though to Morgan. One of the first things Morgan sees Eastman doing is killing a walker with a stick and dragging the body off. Just as Morgan had been doing in the beginning of the episode. Eastman "clears" as Morgan would say. Eastman has the right professional background to treat someone who is in the state Morgan is in. Later we find out that he understands Morgan in a way no other shrink could. He really isn't all that far removed from where Morgan was. Starving someone to death over a period of 47 days takes a tremendous amount of will. It's not like the psycho would have just sat their quietly and died. He would have begged, screamed, threatened, bargained, pleaded, and anything else he could thing of. Being able to sit through that for 47 days and see it through to the end is no small thing.

Someone mentioned the scene where Morgan is protecting the goat and he gets a look on his face like there is something more to it then just the goat. I interpreted the scene as him reliving Duane being killed. The 2nd walker that he kills has what looks like a wedding ring hanging off a necklace. He looks at the ring, looks at the goat that the walker wants to kill and turns back to the walker in full on killing mode. A lot of his gibberish earlier in the episode seemed to be with him blaming himself for not killing his zombie wife, killing the walker to protect the goat allows him to relive the experience but change the ending. Later on in the episode another walker kills that goat, just prior to that Morgan killed a walker that was looking to attack two vulnerable people. I'm hoping this is going to lead into Morgan combining his "all life is precious" belief with the idea that to protect life his purpose is to "clear".

I don't think Morgan is quite in full pacifist mode. He saw what outcome it lead to for Eastman. When Morgan first spoke with Eastwood he said he would kill him and Eastman responded that humans are not natural predators with claws or fangs. Morgan's captive on the other hand self identifies as a Wolf, predator incarnate. He also says he is going to kill the children in the community and relates that to killing Eastman's kids. I don't think the point that he might break out just like Eastman's psycho did was lost on Morgan. I'm hoping Morgan will see past the idea that "killing is wrong" to see that if all life is precious then it may be worth killing to defend it. I think he is going to be a counterpoint to Rick and Carol's belief that you have to do what you have to do to survive and it's best not to take chances. They have been hitting the point hard with both Rick and Carol that they don't place much value on the lives of others outside of their immediate group.

Not yet. They knew millions would tune in to find out about Glen. Jumping the shark would be Glenn alive under the dumpster.

The shark hasnt been jumped yet but Fonzie is on the skis at this point.

Without a life vest.

 
Wrong. Not only is he part of the group that terrorized their homestead and murdered several citizens, but he's been bitten. He's dead weight. If they're smart, they'll lead him to believe they can treat his wound in exchange for actionable intel, and then dispose of his savage-ass.


 

ETA: No. More. Half-measures.

john carroll lynch/eastman/drew carey's cross dressing brother isn't in tenacious d.  that's kyle gass

eta:  your sarcasm didn't show very well

we had one back around the farm

I still want to know where the Aikido was in this episode, because I didn't see any.

i think it was the punching.  or maybe the whacking with a stick.  but there was definitely some nonresisting and blending and stuff going on.

i'm just sure of it.

Do you take notes?

Ok, I agree with that. I just think that Morgan will be pushed to the point that he sees red and he will be running on pure instinct, a point where a rational thought and decision making goes out the window. But I see your point. Anybody capable of rational thought does have choices.

Rick seems to have transitioned through that point

Looked like a slice...not a bite...



 

Ok so hear me out here. Remember that if somebody dies they come back no matter what, as a walker. I've been trying to remember if we've seen anybody who was solely bitten and then turned? Usually they die from bleeding out or being killed by other means. I was hoping I would see Eastman turn but he Hitler'd himself. I think if somebody was bitten in this universe, as long as the wound wasn't fatal they would be fine. I can't recall anybody who was bitten and then turned. Unless I'm forgetting somebody.

You are.



 

Who?

I forget the name, but there was that dude in the very first season that they left under the tree to die. Joe or something like that, maybe?





Also pretty sure Andrea's sister died from a bite and turned.



ETA- You kinda have to go back to the point in the story where nobody knew that everyone was already infected. They started braining all the dead/dying after that point.





 

We never see him die though iirc? And her neck was ripped out. She was gonna die regardless

While we never explicitly saw it, Jim from the original Atlanta camp was well on his way to dying and turning. Jenner's wife (the test subject at the CDC) was reported to have been bitten, succumbed to the bite and came back (but again we did not see it on screen).

Edit: I also think there is a bit of a storytelling conundrum with the "bite and turn" scenario... mostly because a person who is bitten is going to be one of two tropes: they are going to be the "I'm bit and I'm going out like a boss" trope (Bob, Tyrese, T Dog, Jim, Andrea, Eastman, shit most of the main cast who get bitten) or you have the "I'm bit bad, they tore my throat or other major artery out and I'll bleed out in ten seconds and come back as a zombie in another ten seconds" such as Andrea's sister, Milton (to some degree) and all the various redshirts the show has had.

The lingering time it takes for someone to receive a non-lethal bloodloss bite and then turn is pretty lengthy and the only reason for that person to stick around until they pass is for story reasons. And with everyone already knowing what fate awaits them unless there is a legitimate reason for that person to die and turn someone is going to knife them in the skull. Shit, Carol was knifing people in the skulls at Alexandria before they even bled out.

Given that they don't have any other prisoner to use to corroborate any information I think I would recommend that they allow the prisoner to "escape" once they have stabilized things at Alexandria and then follow him back to his encampment with maybe two or three men.  Take the one guy and his camera as part of the team.  Attempt to ID their leadership. Set themselves up so that at some point they can capture more than one prisoner for additional intelligence.

Again, we never saw her wounds. It could have been a fatal wound i.e. neck bite or totally mauled

Didn't Jenners wife at the CDC get bitten and turn, I believe Morgan's wife was only bitten as well.

There was the guy they left by the tree on the side of the road in season one, though I don't remember if they killed him or he committed suicide.

Andrea's sister?



And as above...people started figuring out that a bit = death...so they pop themselves.



There's been a couple bites going to full fever and death. Don't remember the names, though.



 

The prison everybody died from the sickness or that 4 eyes walker. I can't recall anybody who got a single bite like Eastman's bite and turn.

Again Andrea's sister's neck was ripped out by a walker. Pretty fatal if you ask me

Yeah that was Jim who was left by the tree, The bites seem to cause the infection to worsen or spread beyond control leading to death. Not sure how they justify everyone being infected yet it takes a bite or natural death to turn you.Maybe the virus is in the brain but a bite introduces it to the blood stream? Either way Im sure Herschel and Tyreese would have preferred some antibiotics and bandages if that was a possibility.

Wow, never thought of that. Idk if these holes were left in the plot on purpose or if they didn't think about this when writing it.

It's been a couple decades since I practiced, so I don't remember the actual technique names...

The wristlock used to subdue Morgan after his choke was broken was one.

The "assisted" throw onto the wall/couch was one.

Can't speak much on the jo kata, but some of it looked familiar from when I took it.

 
True. Slice or bite, the end result was the same.




All thanks to Morgan...

 
lol