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Posted: 10/9/2023 4:09:42 PM EDT
[#1]
OP. I posted this in the ammo section of my test done with a PRI built Mod 0 upper testing out various ammo. Pretty interesting to see the differences with the SMK/TMK ammos out of the 2 uppers.
https://www.ar15.com/forums/ar-15/Various-5-56-AAC-Ammo-Testing-and-Others/16-782795/ |
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Posted: 10/9/2023 4:14:16 PM EDT
[#2]
Quote HistoryQuoted: OP. I posted this in the ammo section of my test done with a PRI built Mod 0 upper testing out various ammo. Pretty interesting to see the differences with the SMK/TMK ammos out of the 2 uppers. https://www.ar15.com/forums/ar-15/Various-5-56-AAC-Ammo-Testing-and-Others/16-782795/ Oh nice! Those are very interesting results indeed. I have no idea why the TMK wouldn't group any better. I usually have really good results w/ it in several other uppers. I was getting fatigued at the end and I shot the TMK fifth followed by the IMI last. Next time I make it to the range w/ this upper (after I get the H&R A1 lower and the SSA-E trigger), I'll shoot them first to see if that had anything to do w/ it or not. I'm also interested to see if this upper shoots any better w/o the AEM5. Have you done any testing with same? I know 9 Hole Reviews did and found the can made theirs more accurate. |
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Posted: 10/9/2023 4:15:46 PM EDT
[#3]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Ok. Today's my birthday so I took off and decided to spend three hours at the range testing 6 total loads. The same three from Friday plus Norma 77, Hornady Frontier 75, and IMI's Mk262 Mod 1 clone. Here's the set up. Prone, off a pack. Much more stable and I was much more confident of my position. Not nearly as many called bad shots as the first go around: https://i.imgur.com/7FUg69V.jpg Through the scope while the can was cooling off between groups. My eyes are fucked so the eye piece is set for my corrective lenses. Also, reticle pics are hard.: https://i.imgur.com/Oux0ZBn.jpg After the last grouping while still on the board: https://i.imgur.com/srGTyMS.jpg And with all the groups measured w/ my calipers: https://i.imgur.com/ClfkJgk.jpg All in all I think it performed better with a few sub-minute groups, but it's pretty obvious that myself, the upper, or both are not capable of MOA groups right now. I'm putting it more on myself because I'd have the makings of a good group, and then grow a round high or whatever. But, it is what it is. As it is, I think it likes the Norma the best w/ AAC SMK a close second. The SMK's were grouping well and then I didn't give the can enough time to cool off and the groups opened up. All loadings did that. The mirage was hell. It also absolutely fucking hates the AAC TMKs. I just could not get those things to group at all. Very interesting result because my DD 11.5 barrel on my home-build home-defense gun puts five rounds almost touching. If anyone has a PRI, BCM, or built upper they want to compare this one to w/ similar ammo during a range session, let me know, I'll send it to you if you have enough positive feedback. Anyways, there you fuckers go. I won't be able to get to the range again for a while. If anyone else has one of these uppers and wants to post their results to confirm mine or confirm how much I suck, feel free. I still don't want to get shot by it, but the AAC TMK groups are disappointing. You're obviously at least a 1ish MOA shooter and its a 1ish MOA barrel, so that definitely seems like its an ammo issue with that round. I haven't read the entire thread. Have you tried FGMM, or any flavor of Black Hills 77gr? |
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Posted: 10/9/2023 4:19:11 PM EDT
[#4]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I still don't want to get shot by it, but the AAC TMK groups are disappointing. You're obviously at least a 1ish MOA shooter and its a 1ish MOA barrel, so that definitely seems like its an ammo issue with that round. I haven't read the entire thread. Have you tried FGMM, or any flavor of Black Hills 77gr? Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Ok. Today's my birthday so I took off and decided to spend three hours at the range testing 6 total loads. The same three from Friday plus Norma 77, Hornady Frontier 75, and IMI's Mk262 Mod 1 clone. Here's the set up. Prone, off a pack. Much more stable and I was much more confident of my position. Not nearly as many called bad shots as the first go around: https://i.imgur.com/7FUg69V.jpg Through the scope while the can was cooling off between groups. My eyes are fucked so the eye piece is set for my corrective lenses. Also, reticle pics are hard.: https://i.imgur.com/Oux0ZBn.jpg After the last grouping while still on the board: https://i.imgur.com/srGTyMS.jpg And with all the groups measured w/ my calipers: https://i.imgur.com/ClfkJgk.jpg All in all I think it performed better with a few sub-minute groups, but it's pretty obvious that myself, the upper, or both are not capable of MOA groups right now. I'm putting it more on myself because I'd have the makings of a good group, and then grow a round high or whatever. But, it is what it is. As it is, I think it likes the Norma the best w/ AAC SMK a close second. The SMK's were grouping well and then I didn't give the can enough time to cool off and the groups opened up. All loadings did that. The mirage was hell. It also absolutely fucking hates the AAC TMKs. I just could not get those things to group at all. Very interesting result because my DD 11.5 barrel on my home-build home-defense gun puts five rounds almost touching. If anyone has a PRI, BCM, or built upper they want to compare this one to w/ similar ammo during a range session, let me know, I'll send it to you if you have enough positive feedback. Anyways, there you fuckers go. I won't be able to get to the range again for a while. If anyone else has one of these uppers and wants to post their results to confirm mine or confirm how much I suck, feel free. I still don't want to get shot by it, but the AAC TMK groups are disappointing. You're obviously at least a 1ish MOA shooter and its a 1ish MOA barrel, so that definitely seems like its an ammo issue with that round. I haven't read the entire thread. Have you tried FGMM, or any flavor of Black Hills 77gr? Check out metalsaber's groups in the thread he just linked. He gets what I get out of my 11.5 DD barreled upper and several other uppers. These groups are an outlier to me. I appreciate your comments on my skill. I have not tried any FGMM or BH. I would very much like to, especially the BH Mk262 Mod 1-C but it is only available by the case at $800 for 460 rounds and I can't swing that right now. |
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Posted: 10/9/2023 4:25:33 PM EDT
[#5]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Ok. Today's my birthday so I took off and decided to spend three hours at the range testing 6 total loads. The same three from Friday plus Norma 77, Hornady Frontier 75, and IMI's Mk262 Mod 1 clone. Here's the set up. Prone, off a pack. Much more stable and I was much more confident of my position. Not nearly as many called bad shots as the first go around: https://i.imgur.com/7FUg69V.jpg Through the scope while the can was cooling off between groups. My eyes are fucked so the eye piece is set for my corrective lenses. Also, reticle pics are hard.: https://i.imgur.com/Oux0ZBn.jpg After the last grouping while still on the board: https://i.imgur.com/srGTyMS.jpg And with all the groups measured w/ my calipers: https://i.imgur.com/ClfkJgk.jpg All in all I think it performed better with a few sub-minute groups, but it's pretty obvious that myself, the upper, or both are not capable of MOA groups right now. I'm putting it more on myself because I'd have the makings of a good group, and then grow a round high or whatever. But, it is what it is. As it is, I think it likes the Norma the best w/ AAC SMK a close second. The SMK's were grouping well and then I didn't give the can enough time to cool off and the groups opened up. All loadings did that. The mirage was hell. It also absolutely fucking hates the AAC TMKs. I just could not get those things to group at all. Very interesting result because my DD 11.5 barrel on my home-build home-defense gun puts five rounds almost touching. If anyone has a PRI, BCM, or built upper they want to compare this one to w/ similar ammo during a range session, let me know, I'll send it to you if you have enough positive feedback. Anyways, there you fuckers go. I won't be able to get to the range again for a while. If anyone else has one of these uppers and wants to post their results to confirm mine or confirm how much I suck, feel free. I’d be happy with those groups, save for the TMK ones. I think people make too big of a deal with regards to tiny groups out of an AR. I can put my TMK handloads into 1.25” 5 shot groups when I’m on, but even a 2MOA load can do well out to 500-600yds, so long as the ES/SD aren’t atrocious. Hell, the Marines go to 600m with M855 and 4MOA capable M16s… |
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Posted: 10/9/2023 4:25:34 PM EDT
[#6]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Check out metalsaber's groups in the thread he just linked. He gets what I get out of my 11.5 DD barreled upper and several other uppers. These groups are an outlier to me. I appreciate your comments on my skill. I have not tried any FGMM or BH. I would very much like to, especially the BH Mk262 Mod 1-C but it is only available by the case at $800 for 460 rounds and I can't swing that right now. Just read through his thread, that just makes your grouping with it more interesting. 
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Posted: 10/9/2023 4:38:19 PM EDT
[#7]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Oh nice! Those are very interesting results indeed. I have no idea why the TMK wouldn't group any better. I usually have really good results w/ it in several other uppers. I was getting fatigued at the end and I shot the TMK fifth followed by the IMI last. Next time I make it to the range w/ this upper (after I get the H&R A1 lower and the SSA-E trigger), I'll shoot them first to see if that had anything to do w/ it or not. I'm also interested to see if this upper shoots any better w/o the AEM5. Have you done any testing with same? I know 9 Hole Reviews did and found the can made theirs more accurate. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: OP. I posted this in the ammo section of my test done with a PRI built Mod 0 upper testing out various ammo. Pretty interesting to see the differences with the SMK/TMK ammos out of the 2 uppers. https://www.ar15.com/forums/ar-15/Various-5-56-AAC-Ammo-Testing-and-Others/16-782795/ Oh nice! Those are very interesting results indeed. I have no idea why the TMK wouldn't group any better. I usually have really good results w/ it in several other uppers. I was getting fatigued at the end and I shot the TMK fifth followed by the IMI last. Next time I make it to the range w/ this upper (after I get the H&R A1 lower and the SSA-E trigger), I'll shoot them first to see if that had anything to do w/ it or not. I'm also interested to see if this upper shoots any better w/o the AEM5. Have you done any testing with same? I know 9 Hole Reviews did and found the can made theirs more accurate. 
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Posted: 10/9/2023 5:55:54 PM EDT
[#8]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I have an OCM5 in jail so no ability to test with the can. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: OP. I posted this in the ammo section of my test done with a PRI built Mod 0 upper testing out various ammo. Pretty interesting to see the differences with the SMK/TMK ammos out of the 2 uppers. https://www.ar15.com/forums/ar-15/Various-5-56-AAC-Ammo-Testing-and-Others/16-782795/ Oh nice! Those are very interesting results indeed. I have no idea why the TMK wouldn't group any better. I usually have really good results w/ it in several other uppers. I was getting fatigued at the end and I shot the TMK fifth followed by the IMI last. Next time I make it to the range w/ this upper (after I get the H&R A1 lower and the SSA-E trigger), I'll shoot them first to see if that had anything to do w/ it or not. I'm also interested to see if this upper shoots any better w/o the AEM5. Have you done any testing with same? I know 9 Hole Reviews did and found the can made theirs more accurate. I get it. I just ordered a Huxwrk 5.56 Flow. Not looking forward to the 400 day wait. It never gets easier. It will be interesting to see if your upper groups tighter w/ the can on it once you get it, though. |
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Posted: 10/9/2023 6:13:11 PM EDT
[#9]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Ok. Today's my birthday so I took off and decided to spend three hours at the range testing 6 total loads. The same three from Friday plus Norma 77, Hornady Frontier 75, and IMI's Mk262 Mod 1 clone. Here's the set up. Prone, off a pack. Much more stable and I was much more confident of my position. Not nearly as many called bad shots as the first go around: https://i.imgur.com/7FUg69V.jpg Through the scope while the can was cooling off between groups. My eyes are fucked so the eye piece is set for my corrective lenses. Also, reticle pics are hard.: https://i.imgur.com/Oux0ZBn.jpg After the last grouping while still on the board: https://i.imgur.com/srGTyMS.jpg And with all the groups measured w/ my calipers: https://i.imgur.com/ClfkJgk.jpg All in all I think it performed better with a few sub-minute groups, but it's pretty obvious that myself, the upper, or both are not capable of MOA groups right now. I'm putting it more on myself because I'd have the makings of a good group, and then grow a round high or whatever. But, it is what it is. As it is, I think it likes the Norma the best w/ AAC SMK a close second. The SMK's were grouping well and then I didn't give the can enough time to cool off and the groups opened up. All loadings did that. The mirage was hell. It also absolutely fucking hates the AAC TMKs. I just could not get those things to group at all. Very interesting result because my DD 11.5 barrel on my home-build home-defense gun puts five rounds almost touching. If anyone has a PRI, BCM, or built upper they want to compare this one to w/ similar ammo during a range session, let me know, I'll send it to you if you have enough positive feedback. Anyways, there you fuckers go. I won't be able to get to the range again for a while. If anyone else has one of these uppers and wants to post their results to confirm mine or confirm how much I suck, feel free. Happy Birthday dude! It’s not just your b-day today. 
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Posted: 10/9/2023 7:21:14 PM EDT
[#10]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Happy Birthday dude! It’s not just your b-day today. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Ok. Today's my birthday so I took off and decided to spend three hours at the range testing 6 total loads. The same three from Friday plus Norma 77, Hornady Frontier 75, and IMI's Mk262 Mod 1 clone. Here's the set up. Prone, off a pack. Much more stable and I was much more confident of my position. Not nearly as many called bad shots as the first go around: https://i.imgur.com/7FUg69V.jpg Through the scope while the can was cooling off between groups. My eyes are fucked so the eye piece is set for my corrective lenses. Also, reticle pics are hard.: https://i.imgur.com/Oux0ZBn.jpg After the last grouping while still on the board: https://i.imgur.com/srGTyMS.jpg And with all the groups measured w/ my calipers: https://i.imgur.com/ClfkJgk.jpg All in all I think it performed better with a few sub-minute groups, but it's pretty obvious that myself, the upper, or both are not capable of MOA groups right now. I'm putting it more on myself because I'd have the makings of a good group, and then grow a round high or whatever. But, it is what it is. As it is, I think it likes the Norma the best w/ AAC SMK a close second. The SMK's were grouping well and then I didn't give the can enough time to cool off and the groups opened up. All loadings did that. The mirage was hell. It also absolutely fucking hates the AAC TMKs. I just could not get those things to group at all. Very interesting result because my DD 11.5 barrel on my home-build home-defense gun puts five rounds almost touching. If anyone has a PRI, BCM, or built upper they want to compare this one to w/ similar ammo during a range session, let me know, I'll send it to you if you have enough positive feedback. Anyways, there you fuckers go. I won't be able to get to the range again for a while. If anyone else has one of these uppers and wants to post their results to confirm mine or confirm how much I suck, feel free. Happy Birthday dude! It’s not just your b-day today. Ha! Thanks dude. Same to you. |
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Posted: 10/9/2023 8:07:15 PM EDT
[#11]
Quote HistoryQuoted: If I could get a Mk12 Mod 87 chambered in 6.5G or 6ARC I would be very happy. Of course I’d have to get my AEM5 opened up to the correct diameter. I don’t think I’d be able to shoot much better with it though until I’m able to commit to a constant range schedule. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: Alright, finally got it to the range for some initial zeroing. I had hoped to test several other loadings, but grabbed the wrong ammo can leaving the house. Luckily I had a single box of AAC 77gr. SMK, 10 rounds of AAC 77 gr. TMK, and 5 whole rounds of Nosler 73 gr at the bottom of my range bag so all was not lost. Conditions: 65-75* @ ~800' ASL, misting to start, then humid until it burned off and cleared up a little when the sun came out. By then I was shooting the M110. Function: Zero issues. I've changed out the charging handle with a PRI M84 Gasbuster and that seemed to help. I didn't seem to notice near as much gas the face. Highly recommend anyone getting one of these to do the same. Brass ejected at 4 o'clock and with oomph. It is getting the right amount of gas w/ the AEM5 on it (orange bucket is where the cases were landing): https://i.imgur.com/xHspHZR.jpg I haven't shot since anything for precision since March and it shows. The humidity fogging my glasses up didn't help. I was uncomfortable and not able to stay in a good position for most of the rounds so I really think this upper is capable of more (ok, excuses done). I'm going to try and get it to the range again this weekend to try again and have more ammo to work with. As it is, I consistently fucked groups up with the last round(s). I started with the 77gr. SMKs in the center. Bottom four, then threw the last round high. I then shot two 5 round groups in the top left. As you can see, I would drop the last round in each group. Berger 73s (bottom left) were putting a good group together until I yanked on the last shot and sent it way low. Still not used to the Sabre trigger. I plan to change it out for a Geissele in the future. TMKs are all over the fucking place. I shot them last and the mirage was horrible. I should've waited. As it is, I consider those wasted groups and not representative of the upper. https://i.imgur.com/qf2rtVB.jpg As it stands, I'm not calling this an MOA-capable upper, but I think with the right loading and shooter, it might be. It appears to hold roughly what 9 Hole Reviews found with their PRI upper (~1.5 moa) @ the 3:15 mark.  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nQaNR2d7Pb4Loadings I have to test: https://i.imgur.com/ODKbnUn.jpg Will update when I have more groups shot. So it doesn't come close to my 20" 6.5G spitting amax's at the same distance. No Spank you. If I could get a Mk12 Mod 87 chambered in 6.5G or 6ARC I would be very happy. Of course I’d have to get my AEM5 opened up to the correct diameter. I don’t think I’d be able to shoot much better with it though until I’m able to commit to a constant range schedule. I was just teasing since keep trying to convince myself to build a Mod 1 clone with a L-W tube like Molon uses for testing. |
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Posted: 10/10/2023 9:23:49 AM EDT
[#12]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I was just teasing since keep trying to convince myself to build a Mod 1 clone with a L-W tube like Molon uses for testing. |
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Posted: 10/18/2023 7:47:08 PM EDT
[#13]
Finally picked up my H&R A1 lower. Managed to get a Geissele SSA-E trigger NiB off the EE, a Harris 6-9" BRM-S for picatinny rails (not worrying about sourcing the KAC adapter), and some ARMS #22M rings (still have the stops) off r/GAFS to get it to about as close to a clone as it's liable to ever be. I like the scope and all the rivet counting cloner issues I don't care enough about to fix.
Now...on to more pressing matters...to krylon or not to krylon...  Dat Gray Doe: 
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Posted: 10/18/2023 7:53:43 PM EDT
[#14]
krylon for sure
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Posted: 10/18/2023 11:10:36 PM EDT
[#15]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Finally picked up my H&R A1 lower. Managed to get a Geissele SSA-E trigger NiB off the EE, a Harris 6-9" BRM-S for picatinny rails (not worrying about sourcing the KAC adapter), and some ARMS #22M rings (still have the stops) off r/GAFS to get it to about as close to a clone as it's liable to ever be. I like the scope and all the rivet counting cloner issues I don't care enough about to fix. Now...on to more pressing matters...to krylon or not to krylon... https://i.imgur.com/gzx3eyl.jpg Dat Gray Doe: https://i.imgur.com/dmcJmQR.jpg |
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Posted: 10/19/2023 9:14:02 AM EDT
[#16]
What they said. Paint that multi-colored bitch.
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