I don't have kids, but I do recall when my sibling had them and they behaved badly, my Father laughed at the concept of "Time Outs".

He laughed at the concept of time out for us as well.  

I believe spanking is:
-a sign of poor parenting theretofore.  Either is used as a desperate when the parent has been an inconsistint disciplinarian to that point or b/c of a lack of creativity and awareness of what privilidges the child enjoys that may be revoked.
-wrong b/c there is really no more relationship of a disparity of power than the parent/child relationship w/ the child being in the vulnerable/powerless position.
-wrong (unless used in self defesense basically lol) b/c it violates the principle of non-aggression.
-good for training your child to be a statist bootlicker who looks for an authority to yeild to rather than taking personal responsibility.
-does not train your child to deal w/ others in voluntary, non-coercive, ways through negotiation.


To those who say: "in only spank as a last resort." I say:
"I only rape as a last resort, like if I ask her out and she says no."  

Hyperbolic and absurd comparison but it is illustrive.  If a guy had rape on the back of his mind while asking the woman out, do you think that maybe she would be creeped out?  

Or: I really want that car, so I'm a gonna try and get some job, or play the lottery to buy it, but if not, I'll just steal it.  

sure. but at what cost?  

 
don't think for a minute, that all those "urban youths" didn't get beat by their mothers constantly.

Spank for immediate results to make the point. Then removal of privileges and stuff for long lasting effect.

hehe, wife just got back from thrift store w/ 2yo.  An old man was flabbergasted at how well she behaved and gave  her a dollar to put in her piggy bank.  After she thaked him, he told her mom that if he had more he would have given it to her   This is all w/o spanking, physical force of any sort, or physical intimadation.

and don't you guys posit a faulty dilemma that either:
1. spank you kids and they turn out good
2. do some non-spanking hippie bullshit and they end up teen pregnant, in jail etc.

These are not the only two options. it is far more important that you are clear and consistent in your rules and punishments than the particular nature of those punishments, provided that they are sufficient to deter said behavior.

LOL

arfcom only groks two options on any given topic

my 4 year old got the belt for the first time last weekend.  i didn't know how hard was too hard, so i didn't swing for the fences, just a smacking sound.  so after he had calmed down a few hours, he told me to do it a "little bit harder next time"

Definitely not either/or.

My kids get an "all-of-the-above" approach to discipline and punishment (yes, they're distinct), but all methods are administered within strict, safe, and effective guidelines set up by their loving parents.

I did when he was young, less than 10. Then I remembered that it just pissed me off. It was more punishment for me the take away my dirt bike or rifle or shotgun depending on the time of year it was. So as he became a teen I started grounding him from the things he most liked. In his case iPod, Playstation, etc. Then after he got his drivers license taking away  his car worked even better. So punishment progressed as he aged. Now he's 19 and is a good kid. Works and attends the community college.

Tell that to my wife.  According to her our three year old dosn't understand anything when you try to explain it to her.  



For the most part she's a good kid and when she needs them time outs work.  Also the threat of taking something away.  There have been a few times when she is just out of control and a quick spank seems to bring her back to reality.  



 

I tried that a couple times.  Turns out it reminds me of my dad (he passed away 12 years ago) and how much I am turning into him and I just can't keep a straight face.  



 

My daddy instilled discipline in my brother and I via spankings.

We turned out OK.

I do the same with my kids when warranted.

Spanking is not the logical conclusion of anything but the decision to spank. It's a single tool in the box, and for me and my wife the very last one we ever resorted to. 2 times in 17 years was it necessary. 99 times out of 100, it was not the "logical" conclusion of incorrect behavior, any more than putting a cigarette out on a kid's forehead is.





I considered it a failure when I had to resort to it....as should any parent. If you're left with that as an option, you failed to think of anything else, or control your child with more rational and considerate means.





 

Not even close to being in before "you shouldn't hit your kids".

It was a tool in the toolbox. It's stupid if that's your only tool, and it's stupid to automatically exclude it because you listened to dr oz.

We save it for really vile behavior like biting or spitting. It's definitely not as common in my house as it was when I was a kid.

Never had to. When very young he was grounded and did the stand in the corner thing. I did'nt plan it this way but I did explain myself and made my son understand his mistakes.

I used to think it woudl b e agood idea to "spank" (which is a euphamism for hit) my child, before I had any, b/c ultimately, that is how the worl works, you break the man's rules, the police will cage you and give you a beating/shooting if you don't go along w/ the "consequences."  

That is true, that if you come up against the man, force will  be applied.  Unfortunately, this occurs for any number of arbitrary rules of hte man, not just for real crimes w/ real victims.  The state uses violence for any many of arbitray malun prohibito BS.  I want my kids to understand that if they commit aggression, the will, and should be met with force, but I don't want teach htem that it is right for force to be applied to them for breaking arbitrary rules and to view all reltion ships in terms of a struggle for domination rathar than negotiation and comproise.

I WILL NOT be accessory to the state in forming my children to arrange themselves in world in victim/victimizer dynamic.  They will be formed to NEVER be an aggressor NOR a victim.

Haha, I don't know.

They have never refused.