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Posted: 12/18/2018 7:11:18 PM EST
Don't want to see any more edgy "muh healthcare" posts around here now.

https://www.daytondailynews.com/news/retiree-health-care-cuts-looming-for-cops-and-firefighters-ohio/znKbsUFZtZfPOHsi2xbbFO/

COLUMBUS —
Starting in 2019, retired cops and firefighters will no longer receive health care benefits through the Ohio Police & Firefighters Pension Fund but instead will receive a stipend to buy coverage on the open market.

The OP&F board of trustees voted this week in favor of the major change as a means to preserving the health care fund for the next 15 years. It will impact 58,000 current and retired police and firefighters.

Currently, OP&F covers 75 percent of premium costs for its retirees and 25 percent of the costs for their spouses. That deal will end and be replaced with the yet-to-be-determined stipend amounts.

“No dollar amounts have even been discussed,” said OP&F spokesman David Graham. “Really, no details are available on it right now.”

OP&F leaders are making no promises that even stipends will be available after 2032.

Though it is not mandated by state law, the retirement system has provided retiree health care coverage since 1974. Starting in 2003, retirees started shouldering more costs as the health care plan became more expensive for OP&F and its members.

If OP&F does nothing, its $900 million health care fund will be drained within nine years, consultants told the system. In 2016, OP&F health care costs hit $223 million.

“Even with these significant changes, current trends in health care and prescription drug costs, health care support beyond a 15-year projection may not be possible without a new income stream,” said OP&F Executive Director John Gallagher in a written release. “The OP&F Board, staff and our outside partners are all dedicated to searching for that funding source to assist future generations of retirees with their health care needs.”

Gary Monto, president of Police & Fire Retirees of Ohio, said he is reserving comment on the matter until more details are released.

Related: Pension cuts looming for Ohio teachers and retirees

OP&F has $14.8 billion invested for the benefit of 58,000 police, firefighters, retirees and beneficiaries.

Among the system’s assumptions is an expected annual rate of return of 8.25 percent — the highest of the five public pension systems in Ohio. That rate will be reviewed this fall. The other four systems recently reviewed and lowered their expected rate of returns to between 7.45- and 7.75-percent, based on recommendations from consultants and actuaries.

A big drop in the expected rate of return can mean unfunded liabilities balloon, which force pension fund trustees to consider cuts in benefits or other changes.
View Quote
Link Posted: 12/18/2018 7:12:49 PM EST
[#1]
You're on a roll tonight, BOSS.
Link Posted: 12/18/2018 7:14:05 PM EST
[#2]
You going for 2 locked threads in one afternoon?
Link Posted: 12/18/2018 7:14:41 PM EST
[#3]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
You're on a roll tonight, BOSS.
View Quote
He's always on a roll, but, he's one of my favorite posters.  
Link Posted: 12/18/2018 7:15:31 PM EST
[#4]
Link Posted: 12/18/2018 7:17:31 PM EST
[#5]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
He's always on a roll, but, he's one of my favorite posters.  
View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Quoted:
You're on a roll tonight, BOSS.
He's always on a roll, but, he's one of my favorite posters.  
By far!  
Link Posted: 12/18/2018 7:18:34 PM EST
[#6]
Link Posted: 12/18/2018 7:19:47 PM EST
[#7]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Well they do get a stipend

young firefighters: "Good luck old guys. Get on the iceflow"
View Quote
Well, in his last locked thread we worked on expanding his vocabulary.

In this thread, he should practice his reading comprehension.
Link Posted: 12/18/2018 7:20:24 PM EST
[#8]
Happens all the time in the private sector.
I worked for 37 years, now retired...my company provided health insurance goes up every year, and could be cancelled at any time.
Is it somehow different because I'm not a cop or FF?
I don't like what is happening to them, but why should they be any different?
Link Posted: 12/18/2018 7:22:40 PM EST
[#9]
This should be good
Link Posted: 12/18/2018 7:24:13 PM EST
[#10]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
This should be good
View Quote
Off to a slow start but the penguin is present and I'm hopeful for an after-dinner rush of shitposting. Time will tell.
Link Posted: 12/18/2018 7:24:39 PM EST
[#11]
AT&T did that to us years ago. They're called HRAs (healthcare reimbursement accounts).
Link Posted: 12/18/2018 7:26:49 PM EST
[#12]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Off to a slow start but the penguin is present and I'm hopeful for an after-dinner rush of shitposting. Time will tell.
View Quote
Hopefully he doesn't get tied up in the shady lawyer thread

In other news, my insurance costs are going down in 2019
Link Posted: 12/18/2018 7:27:18 PM EST
[#13]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Well they do get a stipend

young firefighters: "Good luck old guys. Get on the iceflow"
View Quote
old guys at the FD seem fairly common

It's not uncommon to see a 50-55 year old driving an engine for a FD

I suppose here we will see alot more police that age continuing to work so they don't lose their health insurance
Link Posted: 12/18/2018 7:29:37 PM EST
[#14]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Happens all the time in the private sector.
I worked for 37 years, now retired...my company provided health insurance goes up every year, and could be cancelled at any time.
Is it somehow different because I'm not a cop or FF?
I don't like what is happening to them, but why should they be any different?
View Quote
This
Link Posted: 12/18/2018 7:32:31 PM EST
[#15]
I’m in a state wide pension plan for municipal employees and we have zero provision for healthcare.
Link Posted: 12/18/2018 7:38:40 PM EST
[#16]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:

old guys at the FD seem fairly common

It's not uncommon to see a 50-55 year old driving an engine for a FD

I suppose here we will see alot more police that age continuing to work so they don't lose their health insurance
View Quote
And since it is hard to recruit cops now you should see departments creating inducements to retain older cops, or hire them back after retirement.

Think about that hypothetical police department.
Link Posted: 12/18/2018 7:39:17 PM EST
[#17]
Chicago did it 5 years ago. Ohio is behind the times.
Link Posted: 12/18/2018 7:41:04 PM EST
[#18]
Quoted:
Don't want to see any more edgy "muh healthcare" posts around here now.

https://www.daytondailynews.com/news/retiree-health-care-cuts-looming-for-cops-and-firefighters-ohio/znKbsUFZtZfPOHsi2xbbFO/

COLUMBUS  
Starting in 2019, retired cops and firefighters will no longer receive health care benefits through the Ohio Police & Firefighters Pension Fund but instead will receive a stipend to buy coverage on the open market.

The OP&F board of trustees voted this week in favor of the major change as a means to preserving the health care fund for the next 15 years. It will impact 58,000 current and retired police and firefighters.

Currently, OP&F covers 75 percent of premium costs for its retirees and 25 percent of the costs for their spouses. That deal will end and be replaced with the yet-to-be-determined stipend amounts.

"No dollar amounts have even been discussed," said OP&F spokesman David Graham. "Really, no details are available on it right now."

OP&F leaders are making no promises that even stipends will be available after 2032.

Though it is not mandated by state law, the retirement system has provided retiree health care coverage since 1974. Starting in 2003, retirees started shouldering more costs as the health care plan became more expensive for OP&F and its members.

If OP&F does nothing, its $900 million health care fund will be drained within nine years, consultants told the system. In 2016, OP&F health care costs hit $223 million.

"Even with these significant changes, current trends in health care and prescription drug costs, health care support beyond a 15-year projection may not be possible without a new income stream," said OP&F Executive Director John Gallagher in a written release. "The OP&F Board, staff and our outside partners are all dedicated to searching for that funding source to assist future generations of retirees with their health care needs."

Gary Monto, president of Police & Fire Retirees of Ohio, said he is reserving comment on the matter until more details are released.

Related: Pension cuts looming for Ohio teachers and retirees

OP&F has $14.8 billion invested for the benefit of 58,000 police, firefighters, retirees and beneficiaries.

Among the system's assumptions is an expected annual rate of return of 8.25 percent  the highest of the five public pension systems in Ohio. That rate will be reviewed this fall. The other four systems recently reviewed and lowered their expected rate of returns to between 7.45- and 7.75-percent, based on recommendations from consultants and actuaries.

A big drop in the expected rate of return can mean unfunded liabilities balloon, which force pension fund trustees to consider cuts in benefits or other changes.
View Quote
View Quote
Meh....I gotta buy my own insurance when I retire here.

Don't know the ins and outs of your issues up there, but I have never been promised healthcare, only that I could buy it from the city's plan and full price.
Link Posted: 12/18/2018 7:42:24 PM EST
[#19]
But corporate profits are up.

So there’s that.
Link Posted: 12/18/2018 7:42:28 PM EST
[#20]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:

old guys at the FD seem fairly common

It's not uncommon to see a 50-55 year old driving an engine for a FD

I suppose here we will see alot more police that age continuing to work so they don't lose their health insurance
View Quote
Link Posted: 12/18/2018 7:43:09 PM EST
[#21]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Happens all the time in the private sector.
I worked for 37 years, now retired...my company provided health insurance goes up every year, and could be cancelled at any time.
Is it somehow different because I'm not a cop or FF?
I don't like what is happening to them, but why should they be any different?
View Quote
Well, I would like to answer the question, but I don't know what your career was before reitrement.
Link Posted: 12/18/2018 7:43:12 PM EST
[#22]
"muh healthcare"

Whatcha gonna do about it?
Link Posted: 12/18/2018 7:47:19 PM EST
[#23]
Before it’s over we will all be paying cash for Doctors and medicine and insurance will be unaffordable.

It is unrealistic for private citizens to work till they die to pay for health care for public employees who retire  at 55 years or less age. Some only working for 20 years and then collecting a life pension and healthcare.

It cannot continue.
Link Posted: 12/18/2018 7:50:04 PM EST
[#24]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
"muh healthcare"

Whatcha gonna do about it?
View Quote
"The doctor rubs betadine on its skin" is my plan for individualized health care.
Link Posted: 12/18/2018 7:53:01 PM EST
[#25]
Thanks Obama.
Link Posted: 12/18/2018 7:58:04 PM EST
[#26]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Well they do get a stipend

young firefighters: "Good luck old guys. Get on the iceflow"
View Quote
There's an end date on the stipend.   And new retirees after 2019 don't get it.
Link Posted: 12/18/2018 7:59:01 PM EST
[#27]
That affect the Dental Plan as well?
Link Posted: 12/18/2018 8:04:41 PM EST
[#28]
Some animals are more equal than other animals...
Link Posted: 12/18/2018 8:05:35 PM EST
[#29]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Happens all the time in the private sector.
I worked for 37 years, now retired...my company provided health insurance goes up every year, and could be cancelled at any time.
Is it somehow different because I'm not a cop or FF?
I don't like what is happening to them, but why should they be any different?
View Quote
If the agreement 25 or 30 years ago when they signed up was health premiums for life it should stand.  Why should they be different?  I don't know what your career was but did it entail the possibility of being killed every day?  I see your from WI like me.  In case you didn't know pension benefits are considered private property rights and can't be touched once you retire in our great state.
Link Posted: 12/18/2018 8:06:32 PM EST
[#30]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Quoted:

old guys at the FD seem fairly common

It's not uncommon to see a 50-55 year old driving an engine for a FD

I suppose here we will see alot more police that age continuing to work so they don't lose their health insurance
Tons of 50-55 year olds working in the trade industry with hard physical jobs. 20-25 and out was NEVER sustainable long term.
Link Posted: 12/18/2018 8:08:16 PM EST
[#31]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Well they do get a stipend

young firefighters: "Good luck old guys. Get on the iceflow"
View Quote
Floe.
You of all posters should know better.
Link Posted: 12/18/2018 8:10:04 PM EST
[#32]
my wife's uncle is a retired chief of a local FD, i know he's cussing up a storm right now
Link Posted: 12/18/2018 8:10:58 PM EST
[#33]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
And since it is hard to recruit cops now you should see departments creating inducements to retain older cops, or hire them back after retirement.

Think about that hypothetical police department.
View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Quoted:

old guys at the FD seem fairly common

It's not uncommon to see a 50-55 year old driving an engine for a FD

I suppose here we will see alot more police that age continuing to work so they don't lose their health insurance
And since it is hard to recruit cops now you should see departments creating inducements to retain older cops, or hire them back after retirement.

Think about that hypothetical police department.
I guess foot chases are out, huh?
Link Posted: 12/18/2018 8:12:06 PM EST
[#34]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Tons of 50-55 year olds working in the trade industry with hard physical jobs. 20-25 and out was NEVER sustainable long term.
View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:

old guys at the FD seem fairly common

It's not uncommon to see a 50-55 year old driving an engine for a FD

I suppose here we will see alot more police that age continuing to work so they don't lose their health insurance
Tons of 50-55 year olds working in the trade industry with hard physical jobs. 20-25 and out was NEVER sustainable long term.
Went right OVER YOUR HEAD.  I am 50-55, I am a firefighter, and he basically called me an old guy.  Do you get it now???

ETA: Yea I know I am 27 in, just more FYI
Link Posted: 12/18/2018 8:12:17 PM EST
[#35]
How much is the stipend?
Link Posted: 12/18/2018 8:13:12 PM EST
[#36]
A pension without guaranteed heath benefits is junk.
Link Posted: 12/18/2018 8:15:20 PM EST
[#37]
Why does the press always equate health insurance as health care (see article title)?

The stipend may be a better deal for all involved. It certainly puts more power in the hands of the individual.
Link Posted: 12/18/2018 8:15:53 PM EST
[#38]
Now it's time to do the same with teachers!
Bring on the flames.
Link Posted: 12/18/2018 8:17:05 PM EST
[#39]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
If the agreement 25 or 30 years ago when they signed up was health premiums for life it should stand.  Why should they be different?  I don't know what your career was but did it entail the possibility of being killed every day?  I see your from WI like me.  In case you didn't know pension benefits are considered private property rights and can't be touched once you retire in our great state.
View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Quoted:
Happens all the time in the private sector.
I worked for 37 years, now retired...my company provided health insurance goes up every year, and could be cancelled at any time.
Is it somehow different because I'm not a cop or FF?
I don't like what is happening to them, but why should they be any different?
If the agreement 25 or 30 years ago when they signed up was health premiums for life it should stand.  Why should they be different?  I don't know what your career was but did it entail the possibility of being killed every day?  I see your from WI like me.  In case you didn't know pension benefits are considered private property rights and can't be touched once you retire in our great state.
Yeah, it doesn't sound quite cricket to do this if an employee bases a decision to work for an entity with an express promise of lifetime health insurance, even after retirement, and then pull the rug after they fulfill their end of the bargain.
Link Posted: 12/18/2018 8:17:30 PM EST
[#40]
You think McLegal aliens are free to treat?
Link Posted: 12/18/2018 8:18:02 PM EST
[#41]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Why does the press always equate health insurance as health care (see article title)?

The stipend may be a better deal for all involved. It certainly puts more power in the hands of the individual.
View Quote
Ding ding ding.

OP is either not very smart, he is trolling, or a combination of both.
Link Posted: 12/18/2018 8:19:57 PM EST
[#42]
Am I supposed to be outraged? Because I’m not.
Link Posted: 12/18/2018 8:32:02 PM EST
[#43]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Went right OVER YOUR HEAD.  I am 50-55, I am a firefighter, and he basically called me an old guy.  Do you get it now???

ETA: Yea I know I am 27 in, just more FYI
View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:

old guys at the FD seem fairly common

It's not uncommon to see a 50-55 year old driving an engine for a FD

I suppose here we will see alot more police that age continuing to work so they don't lose their health insurance
Tons of 50-55 year olds working in the trade industry with hard physical jobs. 20-25 and out was NEVER sustainable long term.
Went right OVER YOUR HEAD.  I am 50-55, I am a firefighter, and he basically called me an old guy.  Do you get it now???

ETA: Yea I know I am 27 in, just more FYI
Not over my head, it's just the system just can't handle the percentage of pensioned and health care retirees VS working employees anymore.

They [company I work for] dumped the pension plan well over a decade ago for new hires and went to a 401K with match. They have changed the retiree health care numerous times. Initially they promised it until 65/SSI age. I doubt it'll get better with time and most retirees had 35+ years working, some closer to 40.
Link Posted: 12/18/2018 8:35:45 PM EST
[#44]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Before it’s over we will all be paying cash for Doctors and medicine and insurance will be unaffordable.

It is unrealistic for private citizens to work till they die to pay for health care for public employees who retire  at 55 years or less age. Some only working for 20 years and then collecting a life pension and healthcare.

It cannot continue.
View Quote
Link Posted: 12/18/2018 8:49:21 PM EST
[#45]
"Among the system’s assumptions is an expected annual rate of return of 8.25 percent — the highest of the five public pension systems in Ohio."

Lol. And we saw in 2008 how fast that assumption can be proven wrong.

And actions have consequences. The young guys complain about funding the older guy's retirement and inch by inch the older guys lose benefits. And that prompts the older guys to keep working beyond their normal retirement age, which means there is less room for young guys to advance. 100 years ago men worked until they were unable to work. The age demographic at most companies matched the general public more so than today as people continued working into old age. Pension plans and social security got people off the job at 65, which makes more room for young guys to come in at the bottom. But if people older than 65 find they have to keep working, there's less room at the bottom and on the way up because the jobs are all filled with older, experienced people.

Be careful what you wish for.
Link Posted: 12/18/2018 8:51:22 PM EST
[#46]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Am I supposed to be outraged? Because I’m not.
View Quote
Pretty much this... Buy your own f'n health insurance and stop expecting tax payers to pay for it. While we're at it, kill the taxpayer funded pensions and get a 401k like the rest of us.
Link Posted: 12/18/2018 8:54:56 PM EST
[#47]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Not over my head, it's just the system just can't handle the percentage of pensioned and health care retirees VS working employees anymore.

They [company I work for] dumped the pension plan well over a decade ago for new hires and went to a 401K with match. They have changed the retiree health care numerous times. Initially they promised it until 65/SSI age. I doubt it'll get better with time and most retirees had 35+ years working, some closer to 40.
View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:

old guys at the FD seem fairly common

It's not uncommon to see a 50-55 year old driving an engine for a FD

I suppose here we will see alot more police that age continuing to work so they don't lose their health insurance
Tons of 50-55 year olds working in the trade industry with hard physical jobs. 20-25 and out was NEVER sustainable long term.
Went right OVER YOUR HEAD.  I am 50-55, I am a firefighter, and he basically called me an old guy.  Do you get it now???

ETA: Yea I know I am 27 in, just more FYI
Not over my head, it's just the system just can't handle the percentage of pensioned and health care retirees VS working employees anymore.

They [company I work for] dumped the pension plan well over a decade ago for new hires and went to a 401K with match. They have changed the retiree health care numerous times. Initially they promised it until 65/SSI age. I doubt it'll get better with time and most retirees had 35+ years working, some closer to 40.
Yet you quoted me.

I work under a 457b.  Very similar to a 401k.  I got skin in the game.  I was never promised health insurance or stipend.  I was not whoa is me'ing about being 50-55 and still working.  I have plans to work a few more years.

You were quoting me and telling me things I have known for the last 27+ years.  Just clearing this up.  Was not sure why you quoted other than your misunderstanding of my emoji's.

ETA:  BOSS new all these things as we have had discussions before, hence the emojis aimed at him for basically calling me old.
Link Posted: 12/18/2018 9:07:05 PM EST
[#48]
Ohio screwed up when it let double-dipping come in ---you could retire after 20-30 years in, start drawing your pension, stay "retired" for 30 days, and then get your old job back.  Public employers thought it was great because they got off the hook for the retirement benefits and would often pay less than the wages you made before.  Big PROBLEM--the retirement funds counted on the money the replacement hires would contribute--but with double-dippers they do not get that back.  Also, Obamacare raised costs through the roof.
Link Posted: 12/18/2018 10:25:00 PM EST
[#49]
Slowly you will realize the BOSS is right about most things. Doesn’t sugarcoat, can be brash, is direct and to the point, straight shooter, doesn’t lie, but time and time again is correct.

BOSS OUT

BOSS OUT

BOSS OUT

BOSS OUT

BOSS OUT!!
Link Posted: 12/18/2018 10:30:11 PM EST
[#50]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Slowly you will realize the BOSS is right about most things. Doesn’t sugarcoat, can be brash, is direct and to the point, straight shooter, doesn’t lie, but time and time again is correct.

BOSS OUT

BOSS OUT

BOSS OUT

BOSS OUT

BOSS OUT!!
View Quote
Arfcom’s very own Trump? We are self loathing.

I’ve got at least 17 years till retirement. I’m sure it will be worse when I get there. They did dick those guys over though.
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