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Link Posted: 12/18/2018 10:42:47 PM EST
[#1]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Why does the press always equate health insurance as health care (see article title)?

The stipend may be a better deal for all involved. It certainly puts more power in the hands of the individual.
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Lol. Guess how I know you haven’t had to buy your own health insurance within the past 6-7 years
Link Posted: 12/18/2018 10:53:52 PM EST
[#2]
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Quoted:
Am I supposed to be outraged? Because I’m not.
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Link Posted: 12/18/2018 10:59:07 PM EST
[#3]
I was in business for myself for 10 years and couldn't afford health insurance.  Fortunately my wife worked for the city/county government so we had health insurance.  When she retired the city no longer paid for health care but they let retired employees tag along with all the working employees so far as premiums were concerned.  We now pay for our own health care at he same rate the city/county negotiated with health care providers for those still working.
Link Posted: 12/18/2018 11:01:36 PM EST
[#4]
Quoted:
Don't want to see any more edgy "muh healthcare" posts around here now.

https://www.daytondailynews.com/news/retiree-health-care-cuts-looming-for-cops-and-firefighters-ohio/znKbsUFZtZfPOHsi2xbbFO/

COLUMBUS —
Starting in 2019, retired cops and firefighters will no longer receive health care benefits through the Ohio Police & Firefighters Pension Fund but instead will receive a stipend to buy coverage on the open market.

The OP&F board of trustees voted this week in favor of the major change as a means to preserving the health care fund for the next 15 years. It will impact 58,000 current and retired police and firefighters.

Currently, OP&F covers 75 percent of premium costs for its retirees and 25 percent of the costs for their spouses. That deal will end and be replaced with the yet-to-be-determined stipend amounts.

“No dollar amounts have even been discussed,” said OP&F spokesman David Graham. “Really, no details are available on it right now.”

OP&F leaders are making no promises that even stipends will be available after 2032.

Though it is not mandated by state law, the retirement system has provided retiree health care coverage since 1974. Starting in 2003, retirees started shouldering more costs as the health care plan became more expensive for OP&F and its members.

If OP&F does nothing, its $900 million health care fund will be drained within nine years, consultants told the system. In 2016, OP&F health care costs hit $223 million.

“Even with these significant changes, current trends in health care and prescription drug costs, health care support beyond a 15-year projection may not be possible without a new income stream,” said OP&F Executive Director John Gallagher in a written release. “The OP&F Board, staff and our outside partners are all dedicated to searching for that funding source to assist future generations of retirees with their health care needs.”

Gary Monto, president of Police & Fire Retirees of Ohio, said he is reserving comment on the matter until more details are released.

Related: Pension cuts looming for Ohio teachers and retirees

OP&F has $14.8 billion invested for the benefit of 58,000 police, firefighters, retirees and beneficiaries.

Among the system’s assumptions is an expected annual rate of return of 8.25 percent — the highest of the five public pension systems in Ohio. That rate will be reviewed this fall. The other four systems recently reviewed and lowered their expected rate of returns to between 7.45- and 7.75-percent, based on recommendations from consultants and actuaries.

A big drop in the expected rate of return can mean unfunded liabilities balloon, which force pension fund trustees to consider cuts in benefits or other changes.
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Attachment Attached File
Link Posted: 12/18/2018 11:01:41 PM EST
[#5]
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Quoted:
Went right OVER YOUR HEAD.  I am 50-55, I am a firefighter, and he basically called me an old guy.  Do you get it now???

ETA: Yea I know I am 27 in, just more FYI
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Fire/police jobs are a young mans game.

In the grand scheme of life that’s not “old” but for police or FF it’s damn near ancient!
Link Posted: 12/18/2018 11:03:36 PM EST
[#6]
Wish I had a pension for the insurance to go up on.
Link Posted: 12/18/2018 11:08:47 PM EST
[#7]
I assume it will be sometime in 2019... not 1/1/19.

Bit surprised they can do that to current retirees. Sucks though.
Link Posted: 12/18/2018 11:10:54 PM EST
[#8]
Link Posted: 12/18/2018 11:11:55 PM EST
[#9]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Tons of 50-55 year olds working in the trade industry with hard physical jobs. 20-25 and out was NEVER sustainable long term.
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Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:

old guys at the FD seem fairly common

It's not uncommon to see a 50-55 year old driving an engine for a FD

I suppose here we will see alot more police that age continuing to work so they don't lose their health insurance
Tons of 50-55 year olds working in the trade industry with hard physical jobs. 20-25 and out was NEVER sustainable long term.
There is also an exponentially greater injury and death risk in the trades not to mention typically poorer benefits.

It would be interesting if we had data points on the amount of complaining each respective group does
Link Posted: 12/18/2018 11:13:10 PM EST
[#10]
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Quoted:
Before it’s over we will all be paying cash for Doctors and medicine and insurance will be unaffordable.

It is unrealistic for private citizens to work till they die to pay for health care for public employees who retire  at 55 years or less age. Some only working for 20 years and then collecting a life pension and healthcare.
It cannot continue.
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Isn't that what the military has?
Link Posted: 12/18/2018 11:22:34 PM EST
[#11]
Yep.. scumbags @ Liberty Mutual did that to all the retirees when they purchased Ohio Casualty.
They got significantly less coverage and, or not enough to pay for comparable insurance they were originally offered in their retirement packages. Not to mention the policy’s they had while working were contributory to begin with. They were not free.
Fucked my dad pretty good after 27 years as employee. 6 years into the merger/acquisition the assholes are fucking with retirement benefits already offered and accepted.

Honor your fucking contracts with your employees. Don’t offer shit you either can’t support or have no intention of completing because you are thieving the funds that support it.

When SHTF someday and the general public strikes back Insurance executives can leave the roof right next to Attorneys !
Link Posted: 12/18/2018 11:51:41 PM EST
[#12]
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Quoted:
A pension without guaranteed heath benefits is junk.  
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Yep, why so many guys are still working when they really should have retired.

We have no healthcare with our pension in WA
Link Posted: 12/19/2018 12:05:34 AM EST
[#13]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Yep.. scumbags @ Liberty Mutual did that to all the retirees when they purchased Ohio Casualty.
They got significantly less coverage and, or not enough to pay for comparable insurance they were originally offered in their retirement packages. Not to mention the policy’s they had while working were contributory to begin with. They were not free.
Fucked my dad pretty good after 27 years as employee. 6 years into the merger/acquisition the assholes are fucking with retirement benefits already offered and accepted.

Honor your fucking contracts with your employees. Don’t offer shit you either can’t support or have no intention of completing because you are thieving the funds that support it.

When SHTF someday and the general public strikes back Insurance executives can leave the roof right next to Attorneys !
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Unfunded pensions ought to be illegal, or at least disclosed.
Link Posted: 12/19/2018 12:17:10 AM EST
[#14]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Slowly you will realize the BOSS is right about most things. Doesn’t sugarcoat, can be brash, is direct and to the point, straight shooter, doesn’t lie, but time and time again is correct.

BOSS OUT

BOSS OUT

BOSS OUT

BOSS OUT

BOSS OUT!!
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Like the moon landings being fake?  Yeah, he's brilliant.
Link Posted: 12/19/2018 1:47:30 AM EST
[#15]
this will happen more and more and more

government pensions are unsustainable
Link Posted: 12/19/2018 1:54:17 AM EST
[#16]
A sow's teats eventually dry up

If they had stuck to farming, they may have been the wiser
Link Posted: 12/19/2018 6:10:46 AM EST
[#17]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Isn't that what the military has?
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Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Quoted:
Before it’s over we will all be paying cash for Doctors and medicine and insurance will be unaffordable.

It is unrealistic for private citizens to work till they die to pay for health care for public employees who retire  at 55 years or less age. Some only working for 20 years and then collecting a life pension and healthcare.
It cannot continue.
Isn't that what the military has?
I don’t know what they have now but I still stand by the statement.

Health care is killing our company’s and people are living longer.  Unless we have some great breakthroughs in cancer, diabetes and other areas this cannot go on.

People will have to work longer.  Firemen and police may be a young mans game as some said but there are other jobs they can do in the fire and police service that are not as vigorous and who is to say they cannot do other trades.

We are going to change or go broke.  People need to look at the Great Depression and decide what it’s going to be.
Link Posted: 12/19/2018 6:19:55 AM EST
[#18]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:

old guys at the FD seem fairly common

It's not uncommon to see a 50-55 year old driving an engine for a FD

I suppose here we will see alot more police that age continuing to work so they don't lose their health insurance
View Quote
Already happening here.
One of our guys just went to another agency halfway through his career with us and willingly reset his retirement clock to zero because his new agency has a better retirement health package than we do.
Another person just withdrew their retirement paperwork when they found out what the actual cost of retirement health insurance would be for them...
In the long run it'll result in officers working more years, getting hurt more often than a younger officer would, which will drive overtime costs and the number of injury driven disability retirements. Which are more costly to the taxpayers in the long run.
LOL at fifty being "old"
Link Posted: 12/19/2018 6:20:29 AM EST
[#19]
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Quoted:
A pension without guaranteed health benefits is junk.
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Yeah, no thanks.
Link Posted: 12/19/2018 6:21:13 AM EST
[#20]
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Quoted:
I’m in a state wide pension plan for municipal employees and we have zero provision for healthcare.
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How is that even possible, that it's never been a negotiated benefit ever for you guys
Link Posted: 12/19/2018 6:24:40 AM EST
[#21]
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Quoted:

And since it is hard to recruit cops now you should see departments creating inducements to retain older cops, or hire them back after retirement.

Think about that hypothetical police department.
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We created several positions for retired guys  for functions like the airport security gig. It frees up younger guys to work the road positions, which they prefer over the airport gig anyways
Link Posted: 12/19/2018 6:30:29 AM EST
[#22]
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Quoted:
You think McLegal aliens are free to treat?
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The good of the illegal border jumper comes before the hard working taxpayer, didn’t you already know this taxslave?
Link Posted: 12/19/2018 7:07:08 AM EST
[#23]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Isn't that what the military has?
View Quote View All Quotes
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Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Quoted:
Before it’s over we will all be paying cash for Doctors and medicine and insurance will be unaffordable.

It is unrealistic for private citizens to work till they die to pay for health care for public employees who retire  at 55 years or less age. Some only working for 20 years and then collecting a life pension and healthcare.
It cannot continue.
Isn't that what the military has?
ARFCOM will defend that^^ to their dying breath though, lol.
Link Posted: 12/19/2018 7:16:46 AM EST
[#24]
I told my wife she is going to have to work long after I retire so she can carry our insurance.
Link Posted: 12/19/2018 7:27:44 AM EST
[#25]
My 30 years will be in at age 53. Wont be able to afford HC so I'll work until 65, by the time 65 comes around I figure it will actually be age 70. So I plan on doing about 47 years at the S.O.
Link Posted: 12/19/2018 7:28:01 AM EST
[#26]
Quoted:
Don't want to see any more edgy "muh healthcare" posts around here now.

https://www.daytondailynews.com/news/retiree-health-care-cuts-looming-for-cops-and-firefighters-ohio/znKbsUFZtZfPOHsi2xbbFO/

COLUMBUS —
Starting in 2019, retired cops and firefighters will no longer receive health care benefits through the Ohio Police & Firefighters Pension Fund but instead will receive a stipend to buy coverage on the open market.

The OP&F board of trustees voted this week in favor of the major change as a means to preserving the health care fund for the next 15 years. It will impact 58,000 current and retired police and firefighters.

Currently, OP&F covers 75 percent of premium costs for its retirees and 25 percent of the costs for their spouses. That deal will end and be replaced with the yet-to-be-determined stipend amounts.

“No dollar amounts have even been discussed,” said OP&F spokesman David Graham. “Really, no details are available on it right now.”

OP&F leaders are making no promises that even stipends will be available after 2032.

Though it is not mandated by state law, the retirement system has provided retiree health care coverage since 1974. Starting in 2003, retirees started shouldering more costs as the health care plan became more expensive for OP&F and its members.

If OP&F does nothing, its $900 million health care fund will be drained within nine years, consultants told the system. In 2016, OP&F health care costs hit $223 million.

“Even with these significant changes, current trends in health care and prescription drug costs, health care support beyond a 15-year projection may not be possible without a new income stream,” said OP&F Executive Director John Gallagher in a written release. “The OP&F Board, staff and our outside partners are all dedicated to searching for that funding source to assist future generations of retirees with their health care needs.”

Gary Monto, president of Police & Fire Retirees of Ohio, said he is reserving comment on the matter until more details are released.

Related: Pension cuts looming for Ohio teachers and retirees

OP&F has $14.8 billion invested for the benefit of 58,000 police, firefighters, retirees and beneficiaries.

Among the system’s assumptions is an expected annual rate of return of 8.25 percent — the highest of the five public pension systems in Ohio. That rate will be reviewed this fall. The other four systems recently reviewed and lowered their expected rate of returns to between 7.45- and 7.75-percent, based on recommendations from consultants and actuaries.

A big drop in the expected rate of return can mean unfunded liabilities balloon, which force pension fund trustees to consider cuts in benefits or other changes.
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Dude we need 5 Billion for Central Americans...no one has time to hear your whining....
Link Posted: 12/19/2018 7:50:46 AM EST
[#27]
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Quoted:

Pretty much this... Buy your own f'n health insurance and stop expecting tax payers to pay for it. While we're at it, kill the taxpayer funded pensions and get a 401k like the rest of us.
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The taxpayers are not on the hook for this as in California, Illinois, or other places where the public pension funding is built on wishes and dreams. Ohio's public pensions are required by law to remain solvent, and cutting benefits is what they are doing to remain so. This does not represent a hit on the taxpayers.
Link Posted: 12/19/2018 7:58:21 AM EST
[#28]
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Quoted:
Happens all the time in the private sector.
I worked for 37 years, now retired...my company provided health insurance goes up every year, and could be cancelled at any time.
Is it somehow different because I'm not a cop or FF?
I don't like what is happening to them, but why should they be any different?
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Around here!? Ha!...
Link Posted: 12/19/2018 8:17:30 AM EST
[#29]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
If the agreement 25 or 30 years ago when they signed up was health premiums for life it should stand.  Why should they be different?  I don't know what your career was but did it entail the possibility of being killed every day?  I see your from WI like me.  In case you didn't know pension benefits are considered private property rights and can't be touched once you retire in our great state.
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Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Quoted:
Happens all the time in the private sector.
I worked for 37 years, now retired...my company provided health insurance goes up every year, and could be cancelled at any time.
Is it somehow different because I'm not a cop or FF?
I don't like what is happening to them, but why should they be any different?
If the agreement 25 or 30 years ago when they signed up was health premiums for life it should stand.  Why should they be different?  I don't know what your career was but did it entail the possibility of being killed every day?  I see your from WI like me.  In case you didn't know pension benefits are considered private property rights and can't be touched once you retire in our great state.
Agreed.   Without the promise of a pension and insurance after retirement, these public services would have a more difficult time finding quality employees willing to do those jobs for 30 years.
Link Posted: 12/19/2018 8:18:25 AM EST
[#30]
I wonder if private insurance policy pricing will be biased against firefighters given their testicular cancer rates from all of the shit they’re exposed to on the job.  Save lives then hung out to dry.  Kinda fucked up.
Link Posted: 12/19/2018 8:18:25 AM EST
[#31]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
If the agreement 25 or 30 years ago when they signed up was health premiums for life it should stand.  Why should they be different?  I don't know what your career was but did it entail the possibility of being killed every day?  I see your from WI like me.  In case you didn't know pension benefits are considered private property rights and can't be touched once you retire in our great state.
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Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Quoted:
Happens all the time in the private sector.
I worked for 37 years, now retired...my company provided health insurance goes up every year, and could be cancelled at any time.
Is it somehow different because I'm not a cop or FF?
I don't like what is happening to them, but why should they be any different?
If the agreement 25 or 30 years ago when they signed up was health premiums for life it should stand.  Why should they be different?  I don't know what your career was but did it entail the possibility of being killed every day?  I see your from WI like me.  In case you didn't know pension benefits are considered private property rights and can't be touched once you retire in our great state.
I agree that if it was the contract signed with them it should be honored as long as the government remains solvent.  It should come before any other expenses.  As far as the bs " possibility of being killed"  argument.  Total emotional garbage.
Link Posted: 12/19/2018 8:19:38 AM EST
[#32]
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Quoted:

Yep, why so many guys are still working when they really should have retired.

We have no healthcare with our pension in WA
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They’ll be working until they die at their desk/cruiser now
Link Posted: 12/19/2018 8:21:43 AM EST
[#33]
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Quoted:

Not over my head, it's just the system just can't handle the percentage of pensioned and health care retirees VS working employees anymore.

They [company I work for] dumped the pension plan well over a decade ago for new hires and went to a 401K with match. They have changed the retiree health care numerous times. Initially they promised it until 65/SSI age. I doubt it'll get better with time and most retirees had 35+ years working, some closer to 40.
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They should pay the pensions before hiring people they obviously cant afford.
Link Posted: 12/19/2018 8:22:09 AM EST
[#34]
Funny how those on the public purse have such a sense of entitlement... welcome to the reality of life where the rest of us dont get such largesse
Link Posted: 12/19/2018 8:23:08 AM EST
[#35]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Happens all the time in the private sector.
I worked for 37 years, now retired...my company provided health insurance goes up every year, and could be cancelled at any time.
Is it somehow different because I'm not a cop or FF?
I don't like what is happening to them, but why should they be any different?
View Quote
unions of course, everybody else pays for it.
Link Posted: 12/19/2018 8:24:50 AM EST
[#36]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
old guys at the FD seem fairly common

It's not uncommon to see a 50-55 year old driving an engine for a FD

I suppose here we will see alot more police that age continuing to work so they don't lose their health insurance
View Quote View All Quotes
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Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Quoted:
Well they do get a stipend

young firefighters: "Good luck old guys. Get on the iceflow"
old guys at the FD seem fairly common

It's not uncommon to see a 50-55 year old driving an engine for a FD

I suppose here we will see alot more police that age continuing to work so they don't lose their health insurance
We have a few of those guys. Too damn old and out of shape but most of them lost their ass in divorce court which is the real reason they stay.
Link Posted: 12/19/2018 8:25:39 AM EST
[#37]
Dems have seen to it that the only solution to healthcare is the .gov.  Don't need insurance then and it explains why healthcare has gotten so expensive.
Link Posted: 12/19/2018 8:26:17 AM EST
[#38]
When I first started at Delta Airlines almost 19 years ago my healthcare was paid for, a whopping $37 per pay day that my company paid for.  I now pay $330 per pay day ($660 per month) and my healthcare is worse.
Link Posted: 12/19/2018 8:27:17 AM EST
[#39]
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Quoted:
There's an end date on the stipend.   And new retirees after 2019 don't get it.  
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Quoted:
Quoted:
Well they do get a stipend

young firefighters: "Good luck old guys. Get on the iceflow"
There's an end date on the stipend.   And new retirees after 2019 don't get it.  
And just like that hundreds of police and firefighters in Ohio retired all at once.
Link Posted: 12/19/2018 8:29:50 AM EST
[#40]
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Quoted:
They’ll be working until they die at their desk/cruiser now
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Quoted:

Yep, why so many guys are still working when they really should have retired.

We have no healthcare with our pension in WA
They’ll be working until they die at their desk/cruiser now
I’ve just just over 20 years in a “cruiser” now and can’t fucking fathom the thought of doing 20 more years...even 10 more.
Link Posted: 12/19/2018 8:31:46 AM EST
[#41]
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Quoted:

We have a few of those guys. Too damn old and out of shape but most of them lost their ass in divorce court which is the real reason they stay.
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I suppose for bigger PDs they will be easier to hide away but for smaller ones do we really want 65 year olds running a cruiser on the front line?
Link Posted: 12/19/2018 8:39:31 AM EST
[#42]
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Quoted:
They should pay the pensions before hiring people they obviously cant afford.
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Quoted:
Quoted:

Not over my head, it's just the system just can't handle the percentage of pensioned and health care retirees VS working employees anymore.

They [company I work for] dumped the pension plan well over a decade ago for new hires and went to a 401K with match. They have changed the retiree health care numerous times. Initially they promised it until 65/SSI age. I doubt it'll get better with time and most retirees had 35+ years working, some closer to 40.
They should pay the pensions before hiring people they obviously cant afford.
Maybe they should fire all the employees of working age and just pay all the retirees.

The older 20 or so and out pensions are what is killing the system. No company or government entity can afford to pay for people to retire for around twice as long as they worked. Add in some that pay for spouse health insurance and you have a unsustainable retirement scheme that has now financially overloaded the system.

The chickens have come home to roost. I don't say it with glee or happiness it's just factual.

As a disclaimer, I'm a long term employee that has a pension [and I pay into a matching 401K to boot plus a HSA] but I'll likely take the lump sum option upon retirement and place it into a retirement fund over trusting the long term viability of the pension fund itself. The pension is funded quite well but employees of less  then 10-12 years of employment don't get any pension at all, just the 401K. Watching those employees with a 401K in a market downturn is depressing..............one reason why you never put all your eggs in one basket.
Link Posted: 12/19/2018 8:39:37 AM EST
[#43]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
I suppose for bigger PDs they will be easier to hide away but for smaller ones do we really want 65 year olds running a cruiser on the front line?
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Quoted:
Quoted:

We have a few of those guys. Too damn old and out of shape but most of them lost their ass in divorce court which is the real reason they stay.
I suppose for bigger PDs they will be easier to hide away but for smaller ones do we really want 65 year olds running a cruiser on the front line?
“Stop resisting, stop resisting, stop....oh fuck it “bang, , bang”.

Old guys are going to be a lot less likely to go hands on and will either go to the gun quicker or smile and wave.

Mandatory retirement age for me is 62 unless I makes Chief but I have no aspirations for that.
Link Posted: 12/19/2018 8:41:40 AM EST
[#44]
If that benefit was part of their employment then they should get it.
Link Posted: 12/19/2018 8:42:34 AM EST
[#45]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:

I suppose for bigger PDs they will be easier to hide away but for smaller ones do we really want 65 year olds running a cruiser on the front line?
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LOL "front line"  Maybe you should make use of more airstrikes so your front line doesn't get overrun.
Link Posted: 12/19/2018 8:44:52 AM EST
[#46]
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Quoted:
Maybe they should fire all the employees of working age and just pay all the retirees.

The older 20 or so and out pensions are what is killing the system. No company or government entity can afford to pay for people to retire for around twice as long as they worked. Add in some that pay for spouse health insurance and you have a unsustainable retirement scheme that has now financially overloaded the system.

The chickens have come home to roost. I don't say it with glee or happiness it's just factual.

As a disclaimer, I'm a long term employee that has a pension [and I pay into a matching 401K to boot plus a HSA] but I'll likely take the lump sum option upon retirement and place it into a retirement fund over trusting the long term viability of the pension fund itself. The pension is funded quite well but employees of less  then 10-12 years of employment don't get any pension at all, just the 401K. Watching those employees with a 401K in a market downturn is depressing..............one reason why you never put all your eggs in one basket.
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Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:

Not over my head, it's just the system just can't handle the percentage of pensioned and health care retirees VS working employees anymore.

They [company I work for] dumped the pension plan well over a decade ago for new hires and went to a 401K with match. They have changed the retiree health care numerous times. Initially they promised it until 65/SSI age. I doubt it'll get better with time and most retirees had 35+ years working, some closer to 40.
They should pay the pensions before hiring people they obviously cant afford.
Maybe they should fire all the employees of working age and just pay all the retirees.

The older 20 or so and out pensions are what is killing the system. No company or government entity can afford to pay for people to retire for around twice as long as they worked. Add in some that pay for spouse health insurance and you have a unsustainable retirement scheme that has now financially overloaded the system.

The chickens have come home to roost. I don't say it with glee or happiness it's just factual.

As a disclaimer, I'm a long term employee that has a pension [and I pay into a matching 401K to boot plus a HSA] but I'll likely take the lump sum option upon retirement and place it into a retirement fund over trusting the long term viability of the pension fund itself. The pension is funded quite well but employees of less  then 10-12 years of employment don't get any pension at all, just the 401K. Watching those employees with a 401K in a market downturn is depressing..............one reason why you never put all your eggs in one basket.
They actually should fire people they cant afford.  They need to pay their obligations before buying new things.
Link Posted: 12/19/2018 8:45:43 AM EST
[#47]
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If that benefit was part of their employment then they should get it.
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While that is nice to say, how does it get paid for? Serious question..........

And if there is a big market correction, or a recession, underfunded pension schemes are going to be much more fvcked then they are now.
Link Posted: 12/19/2018 8:46:20 AM EST
[#48]
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ARFCOM will defend that^^ to their dying breath though, lol.
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Before it’s over we will all be paying cash for Doctors and medicine and insurance will be unaffordable.

It is unrealistic for private citizens to work till they die to pay for health care for public employees who retire  at 55 years or less age. Some only working for 20 years and then collecting a life pension and healthcare.
It cannot continue.
Isn't that what the military has?
ARFCOM will defend that^^ to their dying breath though, lol.
Some animals etc..
Link Posted: 12/19/2018 8:47:10 AM EST
[#49]
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The taxpayers are not on the hook for this as in California, Illinois, or other places where the public pension funding is built on wishes and dreams. Ohio's public pensions are required by law to remain solvent, and cutting benefits is what they are doing to remain so. This does not represent a hit on the taxpayers.
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Pretty much this... Buy your own f'n health insurance and stop expecting tax payers to pay for it. While we're at it, kill the taxpayer funded pensions and get a 401k like the rest of us.
The taxpayers are not on the hook for this as in California, Illinois, or other places where the public pension funding is built on wishes and dreams. Ohio's public pensions are required by law to remain solvent, and cutting benefits is what they are doing to remain so. This does not represent a hit on the taxpayers.
Pure genius on the part of unions to get the IL Constitution amended to include verbiage that pension benefits cannot be diminished.

Plus the automatic 3% COLA every year was another genius move.

For the life of me I cannot figure out why the pension system is so in the red...
Link Posted: 12/19/2018 8:48:01 AM EST
[#50]
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I wonder if private insurance policy pricing will be biased against firefighters given their testicular cancer rates from all of the shit they’re exposed to on the job.  Save lives then hung out to dry.  Kinda fucked up.
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News to me that FF suffer from increased risk of testicular cancer
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