Women were added to the workforce to dilute wages and increase the tax base. Destruction of society was just an added benefit for the elites.

I’m going with public education & fiscal policy/western consumerism as being front runners.

24 cuck infiltrators from DU

Probably some Boomer who clicked the wrong box & voted….

It’s always the Boomer’s fault.

User name is fitting.

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Ayup. The elites factories need workers. What better way to grow an economy.

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I did.

His poll options are bullshit.

There is not a single thing wrong with a woman staying home and raising children. That is an honorable, full-time job on its own.

But if he wants to do this without a hint of nuance and ignore a host of other major issues. Yeah, I'll vote that he's wrong.

Enforcing a system where women are compelled to stay home or suffer consequences is bullshit and it is wrong.

Not for Western society it isn't. Not by a long shot.

Yep. We think we’ve got it all figured out and those that came before were backwards barbarians, we’re so much more noble and enlightened than they were.

Bullshit. They knew. There were damned good reasons for things, and we get to learn the truth of that firsthand.

Every individual being a sovereign being and being able to choose their own path is bad for Western society?

I guess I was a shit father for teaching my daughter that being an educated woman with your own career path. was a great thing.
If there's a guy in your life it should be because you want him there NOT because you NEED him.

Oh well, it worked great for her.

Bam.

I have been with my partner for 13 years and intend on dying next to her.

But there isn't a thing keeping either one of us from rolling out in a heart beat and living comfortably.

There is no room for seething resentment or passive aggressive behavior in a relationship like that.

Yup

I think this is a silly thread to have a poll on, because this is an incredibly complex issue and it's hard to paint it as being so binary between "OP has it right" or "OP has it wrong."

I could be wrong, but I personally think that two-income households and/or having divorced parents could possibly create an environment where kids are estranged from their parents and are raised by a combination of teachers, baby-sitters/nannies, and possibly multiple step-parents; which in turn is probably not the best thing for society's youths. However, I think the idea of defining which parent has to be the bread winner is problematic. After infancy (a dad obviously can't breast feed), I personally don't see why a dad couldn't raise their kids while the mother worked (or one parent raises the kids while the other works in same gendered households). I am no sociologist, but if someone told me that a lot of this non-binaryism or trans-genderism was a result of placing societal expectations about which gender has X-role, I would certainly believe it to be true. I mean if a woman wants to serve her country in the military or pursue a career as an engineer or doctor or lawyer while her spouse raises her kids, who are we to really stand in her way? Why should we care how another household chooses to handle their own affairs as long as they aren't a burden on society?

I personally believe that social shaming is alive and well... that we have way too much of it in fact... and that chances are most of us conservative folks just don't like being on the other end of it. How is cancel culture not just the ultimate form of social shaming? Can't shunning be a form of shaming? People used to avoid adulterers (ever read the Scarlet Letter?). Progressives used to scald (and publicly shame) people who they didn't agree with. Remember people saying "oh, that's body shaming?" Couldn't cancel culture be described as groups of like-minded people shutting out, ignoring, and refusing to give a voice to (therefore shunning) people they disagree with?

I wouldn't be surprised if people have a strong impulse to be intolerant and only see or listen to things that reinforce their own opinions. I believe our country was founded on the ideas of individual responsibility and freedom of conscience and that part of that is respecting the right of others to hold different points of view and respecting people. I also believe that most problems in our country are a result of people on both sides of the aisle straying from these principles and giving into intolerance.

That's why Hollywood started pushing independent wahmens who were single moms, executives with corner offices, etc. People are so brainwashed they think a womans career is important when it's completely irrelevant for society. Trading raising a family for a shitty job dooms our country.

Look into who runs the institutions pushing all this wahmen in the workplace stuff.

We have plenty of posters here who demand their wives work to fund their lifestyle.

Tolerance and apathy are the last virtues of a dying society.


The lack of shame in the modern day astounds me.

that's funny

You ain’t wrong.

Financially, as the risk of divorce increases and more and more women have to pay alimony, men and women are incentized not to marry each other. Depending on the laws of course.
I think we'll see more and more arrangements which emulate certain aspects of old-order marriage (up to and including full-time cohabitation), but without marriage certificates.

ETA: marriage 2.0, no government involvement, contracts between individuals (and their divine higher power(s))

I wonder what the data on outcomes of children raised by unmarried cohabitating couples vs. those raised by married couples vs. those raised by single mothers vs. those raised by single fathers looks like.

Technology and economic development.

Traditional gender roles resulted from the interaction between sexual dimorphism, sperm being cheaper than eggs and manual/physical labor.
Cavechads are better at hunting mammoths than cavestacies

Religion can be a variable, but definitely not the only one.

Local optima generally do not optimize a system.  Society being a system, there is a delicate balance between incentives, forcing functions, fraudulent or untrue beliefs, value judgements, and stable and unstable optima.  Be careful what you wish for.  If your functional culture can’t replicate past one generation consistently, your culture’s longevity is well and truly fucked.

100%... unequivocally correct!!!

Tard-me: so, welcome to the Churn?

Pls translate to smoothbrain

I cut out quite a bit to focus on the items I wanted to directly respond to.

1) I wouldn't say it was all the left. Consumerism is popular on the right side of the aisle as well and it drives women to work, the rise of the dual income household is the cause of the death of the west. A spend spend spend, debt driven society makes the economy look good in the short-term so all of our politicians are for it. If you don't "need" so much, then you wouldn't "need" your spouse to work. However, we're all told to consume, so both parents work, then have less kids, then get in more debt and live the rat race.


2) The 80s were too late seeing a labor participation rate above 50% by women by 1980. Woman were already widely in the workplace by then, which is proven to deflate the wages for the working man against inflation and has caused the wage stagnation we've seen. Wages are subject to the laws of supply and demand like anything. If you cut out 50% of the population, woman, from the labor pool, wages would naturally rise. Covid has been a blessing, forcing woman out of the workplace and back 25+ years in growth. We need that rate to go back into the 30% range though, similar to the 1950s.  
Labor force participation rate among women: https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/LNS11300002

Agree!!!

Yes. "Just let everybody do whatever they want as long as they aren't hurting people" isn't a viable worldview if you want to have a functioning society and culture. When given complete, unrestricted freedom, significant amounts of people fall into a broken state and lose their minds (i.e. transgenderism, drug abuse, obesity, Marxism, excessive materialism, etc). These are not healthy traits, and when they become societally common, they're the sign of a decayed and collapsing civilization. Whether you like it or not, morality and social standards are necessary in order to have a functioning society.

Then lets start playing 4D Chess.

They wanna work, let them take their asses to work!

I'll stay home and bbq with the kids. They love to come hunting and fishing too.

Spoken like a true authoritarian.

Who sets the morals and standards for all society to abide by?

I mean. If we are dividing society into two groups and telling each group what they are and are not allowed to do, I don't want to mess it up.

He also mentioned social shaming and religion, not just the women working thing.

Materialistic hedonism and relativism is now and will continue to lead the country into being a broke shithole.

Society

We could tackle "religion" next, if you'd like.

That’s makes sense LEGALLY, but not socially.

That’s exactly where the “Open Society” title of Soros’s foundation came from. “Everybody believe and do WTF you want!  Every belief  and concept is equal!”

It doesn’t lead to a great “libertarian” society, it leads to Communism in the end.  

Spoken like a true lolbertarian. "Just leave everyone alone" is not a solution or a viable worldview, if it ever was. Regardless of how you personally feel, morality is a part of the state, and the state is not going anywhere. Also regardless of how you feel, we're going to end up with a highly authoritarian form of government. I'd prefer if that government wasn't run by people hostile to me. And, no, "I chose not to participate" isn't a viable worldview either, unless you're cool with getting run over by your enemies, which does actually seem to be the case for lots of libertarians.

If your ideology and worldview treats "liberty" as an absolute, it favors evil, just like treating peace as an absolute does. Judging something by what it tolerates and permits in the name of liberty will ultimately be forgiving to that which evil does - that good by its very nature restricts itself from doing. Your ideology sees no difference between a man in good shape who has a stable marriage and multiple children, and a degenerate asshole. And this isn't even getting into the fact that the true definition of "liberty" is to be free from vices, not do whatever one pleases.

Excellent post, OP.

We've devolved into almost an "anything goes" society and it's killing us. Lewis Black (pinko that he is) has it right when he says we should be able to hit people over the head with a 2x4 when they misbehave and say "NO!".

And they're shitposting in this thread. smh

Men never needed marriage for access to sex. Men needed marriage for access to non-bastard children who had an optimal chance at survival, and also increased access to material wealth.

Society is authoritarian, one of it's values: if kids can't  transition, you're a transphobic

Kids can transition as long as they can pay for the surgeries.

I never suggested forcing women back into the kitchen / out of the work force.

I said changing from home makers to the job market was bad, and a huge mistake for the family unit and society as well, but we’re stuck with it. Women are free to vote ( though suck at it ), free to Perdue careers over family, ( usually regret it ) and currently being a home maker is looked down on, derided, poo pooed in school, looked down on as a job for stupid breeder women with no options, demonized by feminists .  It’s all bullshit, and screwing many, many women out of their true calling as a stable force in the home raising and tending to the children and home. being a stay at home mom is the greatest vocation there is, and stay at home moms should be praised as much as any woman ceo, home making should be pushed heavily in school, there should be trade schools for it, training programs as intensive as nursing programs are. etc.

Any deadbeat can sit home on their ass, however,  it takes a HIGHLY SKILLED motivated woman to be a good stay at home mother , who keeps the house tended, kids fed, home working, bills paid, and husband tended.

That was the effect of women entering the workforce.

when you double the size of your workforce you significantly stagnate wages.

That was the start of the rot.

3/4 of the bad behavior is financed by welfare, and various other gov handouts. welfare and gov bennies allow people to do stupid shit and not suffer the consequences. Like a woman popping out bastard babies, gov sends her rent money, food, child care, free healthcare etc.  so no need to worry about consequences of being a whore, too lazy to work, etc. same goes for a long list of other shit. Gov WILL go broke, and it will prob be the best thing for America as a whole.

This is correct .

OP nailed this one

Lack of shame is exactly what is wrong with the broken 'brains' of liberals.

Shame is what makes a person seek to not be a hypocrite.

Shame is what makes a person stand on consistent principals.

Shame is what makes a person stick to their duty.

Shame is what makes a person not steal, lie, grift and many other things.

That describes my wife and I, 21 years ago.  We made sacrifices, but it was exactly the best and the right thing for us.