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Posted: 6/23/2015 5:45:31 PM EDT
[#1]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
... if gravity has a speed or if it is instantaneous. I've heard it both ways, heard it settled on "speed of gravity = c", then a few years later as "speed of gravity is spooky action at a distance", then back to having speed.... ....  The answer lies in the difference between Newton's and Einstein's equations describing gravity. Newton's equation has no time delay in it, in other words, the force of gravity would be felt everywhere all instantaneously (which is not how the universe works). Einstein's equation has a time delay factor in it due to the message carrier, similar to the time delay built into Maxwell's equations. Think about it this way, if the sun were to magically disappear in an instant, we would lose the source of light and of gravity. However, we would not know that right away because "information" does not travel instantaneously. It would take just over 8 minutes for that "information" to come to us as the last photon left the sun. The question is when would we "know" that gravity was gone and the earth would fly off its orbit? If we felt the loss of gravity the same instant the sun disappeared (and before the last photon from the sun brought us that "information") it would mean that information / gravity traveled faster than light, and earth, and all the other planets really, would be flung off their orbits instantly because they would all "feel" the loss of gravity instantly. Instead the equations tell us that both the electromagnetic force (carried by photons) and the gravitational force would arrive at us together, traveling at c. |
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Posted: 6/24/2015 4:22:35 AM EDT
[#2]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
The answer lies in the difference between Newton's and Einstein's equations describing gravity. Newton's equation has no time delay in it, in other words, the force of gravity would be felt everywhere all instantaneously (which is not how the universe works). Einstein's equation has a time delay factor in it due to the message carrier, similar to the time delay built into Maxwell's equations. Think about it this way, if the sun were to magically disappear in an instant, we would lose the source of light and of gravity. However, we would not know that right away because "information" does not travel instantaneously. It would take just over 8 minutes for that "information" to come to us as the last photon left the sun. The question is when would we "know" that gravity was gone and the earth would fly off its orbit? If we felt the loss of gravity the same instant the sun disappeared (and before the last photon from the sun brought us that "information") it would mean that information / gravity traveled faster than light, and earth, and all the other planets really, would be flung off their orbits instantly because they would all "feel" the loss of gravity instantly. Instead the equations tell us that both the electromagnetic force (carried by photons) and the gravitational force would arrive at us together, traveling at c. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
... if gravity has a speed or if it is instantaneous. I've heard it both ways, heard it settled on "speed of gravity = c", then a few years later as "speed of gravity is spooky action at a distance", then back to having speed.... .... The answer lies in the difference between Newton's and Einstein's equations describing gravity. Newton's equation has no time delay in it, in other words, the force of gravity would be felt everywhere all instantaneously (which is not how the universe works). Einstein's equation has a time delay factor in it due to the message carrier, similar to the time delay built into Maxwell's equations. Think about it this way, if the sun were to magically disappear in an instant, we would lose the source of light and of gravity. However, we would not know that right away because "information" does not travel instantaneously. It would take just over 8 minutes for that "information" to come to us as the last photon left the sun. The question is when would we "know" that gravity was gone and the earth would fly off its orbit? If we felt the loss of gravity the same instant the sun disappeared (and before the last photon from the sun brought us that "information") it would mean that information / gravity traveled faster than light, and earth, and all the other planets really, would be flung off their orbits instantly because they would all "feel" the loss of gravity instantly. Instead the equations tell us that both the electromagnetic force (carried by photons) and the gravitational force would arrive at us together, traveling at c. It would be very easy to test if we ever find a mass that can be "Switched ON" or "OFF" like a light bulb. 
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Posted: 6/24/2015 10:34:40 AM EDT
[#3]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
if the sun were to magically disappear in an instant, we would lose the source of light and of gravity. However, we would not know that right away because "information" does not travel instantaneously. . Not even with "spooky action at a distance"? |
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Posted: 6/24/2015 11:08:55 AM EDT
[#4]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
+1 i'm way more excited for new horizon's approach to pluto on july 14th than i should be. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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NASA is now uploading 4k ultra HD video from the ISS. http://www.blastr.com/2015-6-16/nasa-now-uploading-4k-ultra-hd-video-international-space-station I want to go to space so bad  I have hoped for as long as I remember, that when we die we get to take a "tour" through the universe on the way to where we are going. There is so, so, so much we will never get to see unless something like that happens. +1 i'm way more excited for new horizon's approach to pluto on july 14th than i should be. you should be excited
I have been going out of my mind with excitement, I've always love Pluto |
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Posted: 6/24/2015 12:48:24 PM EDT
[#5]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Not even with "spooky action at a distance"? Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: if the sun were to magically disappear in an instant, we would lose the source of light and of gravity. However, we would not know that right away because "information" does not travel instantaneously. . Not even with "spooky action at a distance"?  |
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Posted: 6/24/2015 1:30:43 PM EDT
[#6]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Spooky action at a distance is limited to the speed of light. What makes it spooky is that it involves two particles exchanging information despite an apparent lack of any contact. This video may or may not make your head hurt:  https://youtu.be/ZuvK-od647c
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if the sun were to magically disappear in an instant, we would lose the source of light and of gravity. However, we would not know that right away because "information" does not travel instantaneously. . Not even with "spooky action at a distance"? https://youtu.be/ZuvK-od647c
Most quantum mechanics makes my head hurt, I much prefer working with Newtonian physics. |
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Posted: 6/24/2015 3:36:51 PM EDT
[#7]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Spooky action at a distance is limited to the speed of light. What makes it spooky is that it involves two particles exchanging information despite an apparent lack of any contact. This video may or may not make your head hurt: Quote HistoryQuoted:
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if the sun were to magically disappear in an instant, we would lose the source of light and of gravity. However, we would not know that right away because "information" does not travel instantaneously. . Not even with "spooky action at a distance"? I thought that spooky action at a distance happened near instantaneously. Wasn't it measured at more than 10,000 times the speed of light? http://www.livescience.com/27920-quantum-action-faster-than-light.html |
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Posted: 6/24/2015 5:02:00 PM EDT
[#8]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I thought that spooky action at a distance happened near instantaneously. Wasn't it measured at more than 10,000 times the speed of light? http://www.livescience.com/27920-quantum-action-faster-than-light.html Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: if the sun were to magically disappear in an instant, we would lose the source of light and of gravity. However, we would not know that right away because "information" does not travel instantaneously. . Not even with "spooky action at a distance"? I thought that spooky action at a distance happened near instantaneously. Wasn't it measured at more than 10,000 times the speed of light? http://www.livescience.com/27920-quantum-action-faster-than-light.html |
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Posted: 6/29/2015 1:12:49 PM EDT
[#9]
Two more weeks:
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Posted: 6/29/2015 1:17:00 PM EDT
[#10]
ISS transit in real time:
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Posted: 6/29/2015 1:27:15 PM EDT
[#11]
Quote Historywhere did you get this image? I checked nasa this morning and didn't see it |
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Posted: 6/29/2015 1:39:13 PM EDT
[#12]
Quote HistoryQuoted: where did you get this image? I checked nasa this morning and didn't see it Quote HistoryQuoted: where did you get this image? I checked nasa this morning and didn't see it |
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Posted: 6/29/2015 1:52:46 PM EDT
[#13]
Quote HistoryQuote HistoryQuoted:
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where did you get this image? I checked nasa this morning and didn't see it thanks
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Posted: 6/29/2015 7:03:59 PM EDT
[#14]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Spooky action at a distance is limited to 10,000x faster than the speed of light. What makes it spooky is that it involves two particles exchanging information despite an apparent lack of any contact. This video may or may not make your head hurt: https://youtu.be/ZuvK-od647c
Quote HistoryQuoted:
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if the sun were to magically disappear in an instant, we would lose the source of light and of gravity. However, we would not know that right away because "information" does not travel instantaneously. . Not even with "spooky action at a distance"? https://youtu.be/ZuvK-od647c
I assume there is no detectable "transmission of information" between the particles, right? No radio waves or anything we can detect? |
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Posted: 6/29/2015 7:09:27 PM EDT
[#15]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I assume there is no detectable "transmission of information" between the particles, right? No radio waves or anything we can detect? |
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Posted: 6/29/2015 10:18:40 PM EDT
[#16]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Any type of transmission information we know of would be bound by the speed of light. Explaining it would require some radical new theories. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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I assume there is no detectable "transmission of information" between the particles, right? No radio waves or anything we can detect? That is the awesome part... There is a mechanism out there that we have no idea how it works or what else it controls / does... Like dark matter and dark energy... The dark speed... |
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Posted: 7/1/2015 6:20:24 PM EDT
[#17]
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Posted: 7/1/2015 11:26:53 PM EDT
[#18]
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Posted: 7/1/2015 11:45:21 PM EDT
[#19]
Last night (Tuesday, 6/30), when Jupiter and Venus were closest together in the sky from our point of view on Earth, Venus was actually about 48 million miles away. Jupiter was about 11 3/4 times farther away, at 560 million miles or so. Though we saw them (and still do tonight) along the same line of sight, Venus is on the same side of the Sun as Earth, and drawing closer night by night as it moves to pass between Earth and Sun (aka inferior conjunction). Meanwhile Jupiter is clean on the far side of the Sun, the other side of the solar system.
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Posted: 7/2/2015 12:40:54 AM EDT
[#20]
Getting ever closer to Pluto
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Posted: 7/2/2015 12:35:16 PM EDT
[#21]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Last night (Tuesday, 6/30), when Jupiter and Venus were closest together in the sky from our point of view on Earth, Venus was actually about 48 million miles away. Jupiter was about 11 3/4 times farther away, at 560 million miles or so. Though we saw them (and still do tonight) along the same line of sight, Venus is on the same side of the Sun as Earth, and drawing closer night by night as it moves to pass between Earth and Sun (aka inferior conjunction). Meanwhile Jupiter is clean on the far side of the Sun, the other side of the solar system.  |
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Posted: 7/2/2015 2:19:53 PM EDT
[#22]
more Pluto
 Also seems there's some Methane on Pluto. Saturn's moon Titan also has large amounts of Methane. |
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Posted: 7/3/2015 7:17:43 PM EDT
[#23]
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Posted: 7/8/2015 7:51:48 AM EDT
[#24]
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Posted: 7/8/2015 10:24:00 AM EDT
[#25]
Quote HistoryIs New Horizons working normally again? I read it was supposed to resume scientific operations yesterday. |
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Posted: 7/8/2015 10:46:36 AM EDT
[#26]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Is New Horizons working normally again? I read it was supposed to resume scientific operations yesterday. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Is New Horizons working normally again? I read it was supposed to resume scientific operations yesterday. Yes, yes it is. http://pluto.jhuapl.edu/ |
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Posted: 7/9/2015 12:14:07 AM EDT
[#27]
What kind of resolutions can we expect of the flyby?
Answered 3 posts above |
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Posted: 7/9/2015 12:53:23 PM EDT
[#28]
5 more days until Pluto flyby. Should be getting new pictures soon.
Meanwhile... 5 Star System Discovered Sun View Composite from Several X-Ray bands shows most active regions 
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Posted: 7/9/2015 1:42:34 PM EDT
[#29]
Quote HistoryQuoted: 5 more days until Pluto flyby. Should be getting new pictures soon. Meanwhile... 5 Star System Discovered Sun View Composite from Several X-Ray bands shows most active regions http://cdnph.upi.com/sv/b/i/UPI-9161436449277/2015/1/14364535208038/New-composite-X-ray-image-reveals-active-regions-of-Sun.jpg Pluto Flyby GIF |
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Posted: 7/9/2015 1:50:09 PM EDT
[#30]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
5 more days until Pluto flyby. Should be getting new pictures soon. I thought comms were going to be minimized during the flyby so the craft can concentrate on science and photos. Downloads will start a couple days after flyby. |
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Posted: 7/9/2015 1:52:17 PM EDT
[#31]
The NuStar project has brought tons of new data and changed the way we look at stuff. They really missed out on a genius marketing chance when they EXTENDED the main boom.
Should have had a Viagra, Extendz or Cialis logo unveil on the main boom.
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Posted: 7/9/2015 1:52:43 PM EDT
[#32]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I thought comms were going to be minimized during the flyby so the craft can concentrate on science and photos. Downloads will start a couple days after flyby. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: 5 more days until Pluto flyby. Should be getting new pictures soon. I thought comms were going to be minimized during the flyby so the craft can concentrate on science and photos. Downloads will start a couple days after flyby. Prometheus in Saturn's F ring:  |
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Posted: 7/10/2015 1:15:58 PM EDT
[#33]
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Posted: 7/10/2015 6:33:33 PM EDT
[#34]
This is frickin' awesome--flying along the Milky Way, as seen through the Spitzer infrared telescope. Spitzer is another of the great space observatories, but doesn't get the press that Hubble does. Well, maybe that should change:
https://youtu.be/3BHDUhX68hs Go full screen and turn it up loud. Mindblowing. ETA: Just watched it again. Wow, just wow. The depth of it is just incredible. Best such thing I've seen in quite a while. I think the center of the galaxy comes into view a little before the 5:00 mark. Here's another of my favorites. Heck, I might've already posted it here. Anyway, here it is again--the sky and the Milky Way from the VLT telescopes down in Chile. You can see the Small and Large Magellanic clouds (satellite galaxies to our Milky Way) rotating around the southern celestial pole. The pole makes a wide triangle with the two clouds; you can pick a star near the center of rotation and watch it all spin.  Also, around the 2:00 mark, look above the second observatory from the left--you can see several geostationary satellites come in and out of view. The music is We Happy Few, by the Calm Blue Sea:
https://youtu.be/wFpeM3fxJoQ Again, go full screen and turn it up. |
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Posted: 7/10/2015 7:20:00 PM EDT
[#35]
The newest Pluto images, as of this time:
https://www.nasa.gov/feature/new-image-of-pluto-houston-we-have-geology |
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Posted: 7/10/2015 9:54:25 PM EDT
[#36]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Not even with "spooky action at a distance"? Quote HistoryQuoted:
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if the sun were to magically disappear in an instant, we would lose the source of light and of gravity. However, we would not know that right away because "information" does not travel instantaneously. . Not even with "spooky action at a distance"? Would Pluto start hurling away immediately, or would it continue to orbit the sun for another 5.5 hours until it flung off? I love thinking about this stuff.
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Posted: 7/10/2015 10:36:22 PM EDT
[#37]
Quote HistoryFor some reason this reminds me of that video of the racoon being tossed down the stairwell, only in reverse. |
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Posted: 7/11/2015 5:34:11 PM EDT
[#38]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
The NuStar project has brought tons of new data and changed the way we look at stuff. They really missed out on a genius marketing chance when they EXTENDED the main boom. Should have had a Viagra, Extendz or Cialis logo unveil on the main boom.
http://cdn.theatlantic.com/static/mt/assets/science/624015main_pia15265-946.jpg The contstrucrion of the sensor globes for that thing is pretty awesome... |
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Posted: 7/11/2015 5:36:11 PM EDT
[#39]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Would Pluto start hurling away immediately, or would it continue to orbit the sun for another 5.5 hours until it flung off? I love thinking about this stuff. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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if the sun were to magically disappear in an instant, we would lose the source of light and of gravity. However, we would not know that right away because "information" does not travel instantaneously. . Not even with "spooky action at a distance"? Would Pluto start hurling away immediately, or would it continue to orbit the sun for another 5.5 hours until it flung off? I love thinking about this stuff. Can gravity waves travel faster than c? It would be moar like a rebound I guess... |
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Posted: 7/11/2015 5:51:03 PM EDT
[#40]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Can gravity waves travel faster than c? It would be moar like a rebound I guess... Quote HistoryQuoted:
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if the sun were to magically disappear in an instant, we would lose the source of light and of gravity. However, we would not know that right away because "information" does not travel instantaneously. . Not even with "spooky action at a distance"? Would Pluto start hurling away immediately, or would it continue to orbit the sun for another 5.5 hours until it flung off? I love thinking about this stuff. Can gravity waves travel faster than c? It would be moar like a rebound I guess... Gravity travels at c. In high school, it was instantaneous, but now they are almost certain it travels at the speed of light. |
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Posted: 7/11/2015 6:08:02 PM EDT
[#41]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Would Pluto start hurling away immediately, or would it continue to orbit the sun for another 5.5 hours until it flung off? I love thinking about this stuff. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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if the sun were to magically disappear in an instant, we would lose the source of light and of gravity. However, we would not know that right away because "information" does not travel instantaneously. . Not even with "spooky action at a distance"? Would Pluto start hurling away immediately, or would it continue to orbit the sun for another 5.5 hours until it flung off? I love thinking about this stuff. Does gravity effect spacetime, or just mass in spacetime? If it effects spacetime, a instant loss of mass like the sun, there may be residual effects of gravity where orbits around the old mass slowly degrade as spacetime reaches a equilibrium. (Does the fabric of spacetime conserve angular momentum?) Like stopping up a sink with the water circling the drain. If it only effects tangible particles the effect would likely travel at the speed of light and anything being held in orbit will have a instant decay of its orbit and fling off into space. Like swinging a bucket of water at the end of a rope and letting go. We probably need to learn what the actual force carrier for gravity looks like first. Factoring in dark matter, it would probably be a lot more like the sink then the bucket. |
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Posted: 7/11/2015 6:27:02 PM EDT
[#42]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
That is the awesome part... There is a mechanism out there that we have no idea how it works or what else it controls / does... Like dark matter and dark energy... The dark speed... Quote HistoryQuoted:
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I assume there is no detectable "transmission of information" between the particles, right? No radio waves or anything we can detect? That is the awesome part... There is a mechanism out there that we have no idea how it works or what else it controls / does... Like dark matter and dark energy... The dark speed... Quantum Entanglement........?
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Posted: 7/12/2015 1:15:28 PM EDT
[#43]
I am so freaking excited for tuesday
me looking at these images 
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Posted: 7/12/2015 1:40:38 PM EDT
[#44]
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Posted: 7/13/2015 4:08:34 AM EDT
[#45]
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Posted: 7/13/2015 9:13:16 AM EDT
[#46]
Too bad we can't drop into orbit around Pluto.
Hopefully we can reach some KBOs that make it worth the fly-by. |
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Posted: 7/13/2015 11:14:29 AM EDT
[#47]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Too bad we can't drop into orbit around Pluto. Hopefully we can reach some KBOs that make it worth the fly-by. I believe we will have complete elevation data scans, IR scans, as well as visuals in September. We will know more about Pluto and it's moons in one flyby than we did about mars after sending an orbiter. 
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Posted: 7/13/2015 11:34:42 AM EDT
[#48]
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I believe we will have complete elevation data scans, IR scans, as well as visuals in September. We will know more about Pluto and it's moons in one flyby than we did about mars after sending an orbiter. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Too bad we can't drop into orbit around Pluto. Hopefully we can reach some KBOs that make it worth the fly-by. I believe we will have complete elevation data scans, IR scans, as well as visuals in September. We will know more about Pluto and it's moons in one flyby than we did about mars after sending an orbiter. But we won't get good images of the side tidally locked with Charon. We won't be seeing those again. |
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Posted: 7/13/2015 11:40:15 AM EDT
[#49]
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But we won't get good images of the side tidally locked with Charon. We won't be seeing those again. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Too bad we can't drop into orbit around Pluto. Hopefully we can reach some KBOs that make it worth the fly-by. I believe we will have complete elevation data scans, IR scans, as well as visuals in September. We will know more about Pluto and it's moons in one flyby than we did about mars after sending an orbiter. But we won't get good images of the side tidally locked with Charon. We won't be seeing those again. I just hope its demotion gets overturned and it becomes a planet again. |
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Posted: 7/13/2015 1:11:57 PM EDT
[#50]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
But we won't get good images of the side tidally locked with Charon. We won't be seeing those again. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Too bad we can't drop into orbit around Pluto. Hopefully we can reach some KBOs that make it worth the fly-by. I believe we will have complete elevation data scans, IR scans, as well as visuals in September. We will know more about Pluto and it's moons in one flyby than we did about mars after sending an orbiter. But we won't get good images of the side tidally locked with Charon. We won't be seeing those again. yeah I'm kinda bummed about that
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