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Posted: 1/27/2022 4:44:10 PM EST
[#1]
Quote HistoryQuoted: This is my Glock 18 https://media12.s-nbcnews.com/i/MSNBC/Components/Video/201910/NC_fingergun_1920x1080.jpg Kids get suspended or in some cases expelled from school for that jester. |
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Posted: 1/27/2022 4:44:26 PM EST
[#2]
Quote HistoryQuoted: The ATF is out of control. Yes they are, but, rightfully this should be packed up their ass. In a just world. Which would be good. However, whether or not he'll receive justice remains to be seen. I wouldn't put money on it. |
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Posted: 1/27/2022 4:45:25 PM EST
[#3]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I don't think you understand the term conspiracy, nor have you read the charging documents. They list them as "Machine gun conversion devices constituting machine guns" and while left in the blank card form no, they are not conversion devices. But when you tell someone and show someone exactly how to make that item you just sold into a lighting link, that act is conspiracy. Quote HistoryQuoted: I don't think you understand the term conspiracy, nor have you read the charging documents. They list them as "Machine gun conversion devices constituting machine guns" and while left in the blank card form no, they are not conversion devices. But when you tell someone and show someone exactly how to make that item you just sold into a lighting link, that act is conspiracy. https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/18/371 If two or more persons conspire either to commit any offense against the United States, or to defraud the United States, or any agency thereof in any manner or for any purpose, and one or more of such persons do any act to effect the object of the conspiracy, each shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than five years, or both. If, however, the offense, the commission of which is the object of the conspiracy, is a misdemeanor only, the punishment for such conspiracy shall not exceed the maximum punishment provided for such misdemeanor. Um, I think it's you who might be on the wrong side of 'conspiracy' here. If we're talking about the law anyway. Because if this is consipracy, so is a whole lot of other stuff that we quite plainly know isn't. |
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Posted: 1/27/2022 4:45:47 PM EST
[#4]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Wait, so if he made a video on clothes hangar auto sears, and also sold clothes hangers, in your mind that's a crime? What are you talking about? Clothes hangers are not an NFA item. You took a leap off into the deep end on that one.. come back when you have taken your meds. |
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Posted: 1/27/2022 4:45:53 PM EST
[#5]
Quote HistoryQuoted: It ceased to be just 1A right after he started manufacturing, selling and pimping out his auto cards. ….snip. I guess the courts will have to decide this one; but there appears to be a disturbing pattern of behavior on the part of the Biden Administration and the Democrat Party to abuse the power of government. |
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Posted: 1/27/2022 4:46:43 PM EST
[#6]
Guess that new Ctrl pew shirt is next?
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Posted: 1/27/2022 4:46:56 PM EST
[#7]
Quote HistoryQuoted: What are you talking about? Clothes hangers are not an NFA item. You took a leap off into the deep end on that one.. come back when you have taken your meds. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Wait, so if he made a video on clothes hangar auto sears, and also sold clothes hangers, in your mind that's a crime? What are you talking about? Clothes hangers are not an NFA item. You took a leap off into the deep end on that one.. come back when you have taken your meds. A drawing of an NFA item is also not an NFA item. I think it might be you who needs to take some medicine to focus here. |
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Posted: 1/27/2022 4:47:32 PM EST
[#8]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I guess the courts will have to decide this one. Agreed, and I hope he wins in court. He is in Florida so there is a chance. |
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Posted: 1/27/2022 4:48:14 PM EST
[#9]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Perhaps you are misunderstanding. Nobody sold anyone else a completed lightning link, or even a partially completed one. What was being sold was the outline of a lightning link on a piece of metal. A schematic of a "mAcHiNe gUn" doesn't magically become a machine gun because it's printed on metal. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: For what it's worth, he didn't manufacture them. Someone else did who he partnered with. I can make videos on how to commit all kinds of crimes, doesn't make ME a criminal. For example, if I do a video on how to pick locks, and I sell a lockpicking kit, the feds can't charge me with burglary. I didn't commit a crime, even if I gave very clear instructions and even supplied the tools to do so. Again, its the fact he owns a company that has an FFL+SOT that is an issue. The fact he didn't manufacture them is worse and proves further his conspiracy charge. He is an SOT holder that knows what a lighting link is, see youtube video evidence. He paid someone else to make the item because he knows as an FFL+SOT holder he legally can't manufacture them without proper documentation. He then sells the items and provides instructions on how to convert the item into an illegal NFA item. Furthermore, picking locks is not regulated by the National Firearms act. If you manufactured explosives c4 for instance, and sold each part needed to manufacture an C4 on a website. Then made a videos for youtube on how to mix the parts to create a regulated explosive, you too would be charged. Perhaps you are misunderstanding. Nobody sold anyone else a completed lightning link, or even a partially completed one. What was being sold was the outline of a lightning link on a piece of metal. A schematic of a "mAcHiNe gUn" doesn't magically become a machine gun because it's printed on metal. They will probably try to construe the laser etching as a machining step. They have done it before with AR-15 lowers with 3rd pin marks. |
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Posted: 1/27/2022 4:48:32 PM EST
[#10]
CRS channel Live feed
 CRS EMERGENCY LIVESTREAM - CRS ARRESTED BY US MARSHALLS |
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Posted: 1/27/2022 4:48:34 PM EST
[#11]
Quote HistoryQuoted: What are you talking about? Clothes hangers are not an NFA item. You took a leap off into the deep end on that one.. come back when you have taken your meds. Bro, How up to date are you about machineguns, auto sears and stuff like that? |
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Posted: 1/27/2022 4:49:22 PM EST
[#12]
FATF
Part of me wants to become a local cop just so I might get a chance to tase the ever loving shit out of one of them.  ATF Agent tased, arrested at gunpoint by Columbus Police - new bodycam footage |
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Posted: 1/27/2022 4:49:41 PM EST
[#13]
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Posted: 1/27/2022 4:50:46 PM EST
[#14]
Quote HistoryThat is the attitude our founding fathers had. |
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Posted: 1/27/2022 4:51:18 PM EST
[#15]
I have this hanging up in my office.
Am I in violation of the EPA ODP 40 CFR Section 279.11 because I get it out of the ground. 
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Posted: 1/27/2022 4:51:32 PM EST
[#16]
Quote HistoryQuoted: What are you talking about? Clothes hangers are not an NFA item. You took a leap off into the deep end on that one.. come back when you have taken your meds. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Wait, so if he made a video on clothes hangar auto sears, and also sold clothes hangers, in your mind that's a crime? What are you talking about? Clothes hangers are not an NFA item. You took a leap off into the deep end on that one.. come back when you have taken your meds. tell me you're not a metal wire origami fanatic without telling me you're not a metal wire origami fanatic |
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Posted: 1/27/2022 4:52:25 PM EST
[#17]
Quote HistoryQuoted: What are you talking about? Clothes hangers are not an NFA item. You took a leap off into the deep end on that one.. come back when you have taken your meds. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Wait, so if he made a video on clothes hangar auto sears, and also sold clothes hangers, in your mind that's a crime? What are you talking about? Clothes hangers are not an NFA item. You took a leap off into the deep end on that one.. come back when you have taken your meds. Flat pieces of metal with black lines on them aren't NFA items either. |
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Posted: 1/27/2022 4:53:44 PM EST
[#18]
Hey ATF... Go fuck yourselves!
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Posted: 1/27/2022 4:53:59 PM EST
[#19]
Quote HistoryQuoted: The process is the punishment. They don't have to actually prove any of the charges to utterly ruin someone. The only way I see to fight this is with organized legal defense like antifa uses. Lawyers and bail funds set up waiting to defend whoever gets pulled into the system. would Soros & Gates help us if we asked them real nice like? |
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Posted: 1/27/2022 4:54:24 PM EST
[#20]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Bro, How up to date are you about machineguns, auto sears and stuff like that? Up to date enough that and I don't know of any Pre-86 clothes hanger that are registered as an auto sear/Lighting link. I do know that some FFL/SOT have manufactured them in the past 5 years or so, to test and make youtube videos about the functionality. They don't sell AutoHangers on their videos... |
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Posted: 1/27/2022 4:55:34 PM EST
[#21]
Retard structured withdrawals. He'll plead to something and ATF will get a conviction.
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Posted: 1/27/2022 4:55:55 PM EST
[#22]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Agreed, and I hope he wins in court. He is in Florida so there is a chance. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: I guess the courts will have to decide this one. Agreed, and I hope he wins in court. He is in Florida so there is a chance. Considering it isn't just the machine gun thing but also the fact he was stupid enough to structure his transactions under 10k to avoid reporting he is probably screwed. It isn't unlikely he will escape a conviction for something. |
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Posted: 1/27/2022 4:56:05 PM EST
[#23]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Up to date enough that and I don't know of any Pre-86 clothes hanger that are registered as an auto sear/Lighting link. I do know that some FFL/SOT have manufactured them in the past 5 years or so, to test and make youtube videos about the functionality. They don't sell AutoHangers on their videos... Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Bro, How up to date are you about machineguns, auto sears and stuff like that? Up to date enough that and I don't know of any Pre-86 clothes hanger that are registered as an auto sear/Lighting link. I do know that some FFL/SOT have manufactured them in the past 5 years or so, to test and make youtube videos about the functionality. They don't sell AutoHangers on their videos... You still haven't showed me where having an FFL/SOT means you aren't allowed to discuss how to manufacture or convert things to machine guns. |
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Posted: 1/27/2022 4:57:27 PM EST
[#24]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Retard structured withdrawals. He'll plead to something and ATF will get a conviction. Fuck structured withdrawals while we are at it too. Too many people just love them some government in people's lives. |
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Posted: 1/27/2022 4:57:37 PM EST
[#25]
Quote HistoryQuoted: You still haven't showed me where having an FFL/SOT means you aren't allowed to discuss how to manufacture or convert things to machine guns. Rules 1 and 2 of Fight Club now apply to federal law for FFL/SOT. 
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Posted: 1/27/2022 4:57:38 PM EST
[#26]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I have this hanging up in my office. Am I in violation of the EPA ODP 40 CFR Section 279.11 because I get it out of the ground. https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/238973/Lucas_gusher-2256719.jpg Under the same legal interpretation, you would be in violation if you have diagrams on the construction of such a device that would provide the information to allow you to violate that order. |
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Posted: 1/27/2022 4:57:56 PM EST
[#27]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Most of the federal government is out of control. The ATF's actions are just another example. This. Most Federal agencies need to be terminated. |
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Posted: 1/27/2022 4:58:08 PM EST
[#28]
What if it's on a hat or a tee-shirt?
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Posted: 1/27/2022 4:59:04 PM EST
[#29]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Considering it isn't just the machine gun thing but also the fact he was stupid enough to structure his transactions under 10k to avoid reporting he is probably screwed. It isn't unlikely he will escape a conviction for something. If he fights it, then its going to be costly which I doubt they have the funds for. Plea deal would be the way and with the current admin, likely some prison time. |
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Posted: 1/27/2022 4:59:53 PM EST
[#30]
Quote HistoryQuoted: So the documents state that one of the guys Matt Hoover owned a store called Coloma Resale. Coloma Resale was an FFL and held a SOT license. He made a video "Is this An ATF Trap And How Does It Work" which described how to order an auto key card and described how to cut the lighting link from the auto key card and install it into an AR-15 style rifle, thus converting the AR-15 style rifle into a machine gun. Ok, there are numerous videos where he is talking about how to make illegal machine guns, untraceable guns, and his auto key cards. All while he is holding an SOT license. If you haven't read the charging documents, they have been following this guy for awhile. The fact he held an SOT is likely the catalyst to this shit. I don't agree with the "cards are machine guns" but if you hold an FFL+SOT you don't do shit like this. Legally, you lose the first amendment when you become an SOT? ETA: already pointed out. |
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Posted: 1/27/2022 5:01:31 PM EST
[#31]
Write a how to book about explosives you can make is OK, pictures on metal are not.
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Posted: 1/27/2022 5:03:54 PM EST
[#32]
Hey, look...
Here is a diagram showing how you can make a car go faster:  Attached FileYou are now all guilty of conspiracy to exceed the speed limit. |
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Posted: 1/27/2022 5:04:41 PM EST
[#33]
Quote HistoryQuoted: The process is the punishment. They don't have to actually prove any of the charges to utterly ruin someone. The only way I see to fight this is with organized legal defense like antifa uses. Lawyers and bail funds set up waiting to defend whoever gets pulled into the system. The big problem with this is the enemy controls the machine. All they have to do is keep throwing people into the gears until the fund runs out of money. |
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Posted: 1/27/2022 5:04:56 PM EST
[#34]
Quote HistoryQuoted: You must not have been living in the same US I have for the past few years. In all seriousness, when you pay the government for a SOT license, you don't get to manufacture and sell items called "auto key cards", with video instructions on how to convert the item you just sold into an illegal NFA item. Edit: I don't agree with it, but the charge of Conspiracy is correct. They are conspiring to break the law... Weird, you just sided with the ATF... Interesting. |
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Posted: 1/27/2022 5:05:21 PM EST
[#35]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Up to date enough that and I don't know of any Pre-86 clothes hanger that are registered as an auto sear/Lighting link. I do know that some FFL/SOT have manufactured them in the past 5 years or so, to test and make youtube videos about the functionality. They don't sell AutoHangers on their videos... Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Bro, How up to date are you about machineguns, auto sears and stuff like that? Up to date enough that and I don't know of any Pre-86 clothes hanger that are registered as an auto sear/Lighting link. I do know that some FFL/SOT have manufactured them in the past 5 years or so, to test and make youtube videos about the functionality. They don't sell AutoHangers on their videos... respectfully, dude? - NFA is bullshit and deserves to be bent and/or broken. I get your point, as well as others do to; our point is "fuck yo laws" |
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Posted: 1/27/2022 5:05:29 PM EST
[#36]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Hey, look... Here is a diagram showing how you can make a car go faster: https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/72701/OIP__4__jpeg-2256731.JPG You are now all guilty of conspiracy to exceed the speed limit. No, you see you have to own a licensed car dealership and sell frames of cars and THEN it's a crime when you tell people how to step on the gas |
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Posted: 1/27/2022 5:08:58 PM EST
[#37]
Quote HistoryQuoted: You still haven't showed me where having an FFL/SOT means you aren't allowed to discuss how to manufacture or convert things to machine guns. Take your meds my guy. Told you, come back later when they kick in and you have some cohesive thought process. Once more, its NOT JUST the act of talking about it, its NOT JUST the act of manufacturing the AutoCards, its NOT JUST selling the Autocards, its NOT JUST showing on youtube how to cut said autocards out and manufacture an NFA item, its NOT JUST the FFL+SOT, its NOT JUST the under 10k withdraws at the banks to avoid being flagged, this list goes on... it is the culmination of all of it. |
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Posted: 1/27/2022 5:08:59 PM EST
[#38]
Quote HistoryQuoted: What are you talking about? Clothes hangers are not an NFA item. You took a leap off into the deep end on that one.. come back when you have taken your meds. Yeah, about that... |
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Posted: 1/27/2022 5:09:40 PM EST
[#39]
Fuck the ATF. they’re just another lawless organization in the .gov, they all ignore the law and constitution, yet expect us to bow down to them and their whims. Fuck them. Fuck them all
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Posted: 1/27/2022 5:09:54 PM EST
[#40]
The comp!are ar15/m16 source book had the auto disconnector, and machine drawings of the drop in auto sear, is the publisher, or author going to be arrested, this is just insane, you can buy a stem unfinished tube with a blueprint glued to it, that doesn't make it a machine gun.
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Posted: 1/27/2022 5:09:56 PM EST
[#41]
Quote HistoryQuoted: The process is the punishment. They don't have to actually prove any of the charges to utterly ruin someone. The only way I see to fight this is with organized legal defense like antifa uses. Lawyers and bail funds set up waiting to defend whoever gets pulled into the system. They will seize all those assets as fruits of a criminal enterprise. |
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Posted: 1/27/2022 5:10:31 PM EST
[#42]
Quote HistoryQuoted: What are you talking about? Clothes hangers are not an NFA item. You took a leap off into the deep end on that one.. come back when you have taken your meds. The shitty back handed crack you made only detracts from the point you are trying to make. How about showing a little common courtesy next time if you want to be taken seriously. |
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Posted: 1/27/2022 5:10:56 PM EST
[#43]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Take your meds my guy. Told you, come back later when they kick in and you have some cohesive thought process. Once more, its NOT JUST the act of talking about it, its NOT JUST the act of manufacturing the AutoCards, its NOT JUST selling the Autocards, its NOT JUST showing on youtube how to cut said autocards out and manufacture an NFA item, its NOT JUST the FFL+SOT, its NOT JUST the under 10k withdraws at the banks to avoid being flagged, this list goes on... it is the culmination of all of it. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: You still haven't showed me where having an FFL/SOT means you aren't allowed to discuss how to manufacture or convert things to machine guns. Take your meds my guy. Told you, come back later when they kick in and you have some cohesive thought process. Once more, its NOT JUST the act of talking about it, its NOT JUST the act of manufacturing the AutoCards, its NOT JUST selling the Autocards, its NOT JUST showing on youtube how to cut said autocards out and manufacture an NFA item, its NOT JUST the FFL+SOT, its NOT JUST the under 10k withdraws at the banks to avoid being flagged, this list goes on... it is the culmination of all of it. Yeah, I'm definitely the one who needs to take meds and have a "cohesive thought process". Sure buddy.  Attached FileMay your chains rest lightly, special agent. |
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Posted: 1/27/2022 5:11:05 PM EST
[#44]
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Posted: 1/27/2022 5:11:15 PM EST
[#45]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I guess the courts will have to decide this one; but there appears to be a disturbing pattern of behavior on the part of the Biden Administration and the Democrat Party to abuse the power of government. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: It ceased to be just 1A right after he started manufacturing, selling and pimping out his auto cards. ….snip. I guess the courts will have to decide this one; but there appears to be a disturbing pattern of behavior on the part of the Biden Administration and the Democrat Party to abuse the power of government. Nothing he sold was a machine gun, or could even be remotely considered a damned machine gun. I can only hope this shit gets to court. Nothing like the AFT to drop shit to keep avoiding court. And conspiracy is a pretty wide definition from this non-lawyer point of view. Basically means you talked about something that the government considers to be an illegal act. |
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Posted: 1/27/2022 5:11:33 PM EST
[#46]
Quote HistoryQuoted: respectfully, dude? - NFA is bullshit and deserves to be bent and/or broken. I get your point, as well as others do to; our point is "fuck yo laws" 100% agree NFA needs to go away along with the Hughes act from 86! But unfortunately it is still in place. Hell I still want to do mail order firearms! |
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Posted: 1/27/2022 5:11:41 PM EST
[#47]
Not the least bit surprised. Feds ROUTINELY engage in political prosecutions, and bend or outright ignore the Constitution and Federal law to their own benefit. See my sig line for one example of the stunts they pull.
We no longer live in a republic, but a bureaucratic dictatorship. |
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Posted: 1/27/2022 5:11:50 PM EST
[#48]
I don't understand the pulling 9k out of the bank thing?
I can see depositing 9k once but when it's in the bank already it's not like they don't have record. Does withdrawing your own money get reported? |
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Posted: 1/27/2022 5:15:16 PM EST
[#49]
ATF will lose this, and they know it.
They are using the process to punish these men. They are way out of control, as the ATF doesn't serve a legitimate government function. |
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Posted: 1/27/2022 5:17:06 PM EST
[#50]
Quote HistoryQuoted: The shitty back handed crack you made only detracts from the point you are trying to make. How about showing a little common courtesy next time if you want to be taken seriously. I am not trying to make any point, I have made a point. We went from an lighting link/Auto card blank, to left field in an effort to steer the conversation away from the point that was made. I was very courteous in my exchange and I talk and type the same way to everyone. |
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