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Posted: 3/31/2019 8:25:03 PM EDT
[#1]
Quote HistoryQuoted: RIIIIIIGHT. My very first match. Shot it with my duty gear. A stock M&P and AR with Eotech. Went at it cold, didn't even walk the stages beforehand. Completely blew one stage since I failed to engage a line of plates. I didn't even notice tucked in below another. Placed 81 out of 134. The old guy that shot a standard A1 with iron sights, 20 rd mags and a RA 1911 in a military FLAP HOLSTER hanging from a GI pistol belt placed 66 and he could not even run. Yeah, go on and tell me how hard it is.  And you're using that experience to say that 3 gun isn't that hard? That's a level of derp that's even a bit much for GD. 81 out of 134 is like, 60th percentile. If a kid graduated high school with that GPA, I'd say he sucked at school. If he graduated with that GPA and then said High School wasn't that hard, I'd assume that he was in the special ed class. |
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Posted: 3/31/2019 8:29:02 PM EDT
[#2]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I’m sure he told you that. 
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Posted: 3/31/2019 8:29:18 PM EDT
[#3]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Appearently it's hard enough that you got smoked by an old guy running irons that had mobility issues. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted: RIIIIIIGHT. My very first match. Shot it with my duty gear. A stock M&P and AR with Eotech. Went at it cold, didn't even walk the stages beforehand. Completely blew one stage since I failed to engage a line of plates. I didn't even notice tucked in below another. Placed 81 out of 134. The old guy that shot a standard A1 with iron sights, 20 rd mags and a RA 1911 in a military FLAP HOLSTER hanging from a GI pistol belt placed 66 and he could not even run. Yeah, go on and tell me how hard it is. |
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Posted: 3/31/2019 8:30:11 PM EDT
[#4]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
ITT: a bunch of non-shooting Timmies, who say they would shoot competition BUT....*insert excuse here* All you guys who TRAIN instead of competing, and all of you would like physical 2 gun; are you going to show up at The Tactical Games? https://thetacticalgames.com/ |
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Posted: 3/31/2019 8:31:13 PM EDT
[#5]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Wait. You shot a single match. Presumably a club level match. Barely made it out of the bottom third. And got beat by an old man using less than optimal gear...who was a cripple. And you're using that experience to say that 3 gun isn't that hard? That's a level of derp that even a bit much for GD. 81 out of 134 is like, 60th percentile. If a kid graduated high school with that GPA, I'd say he sucked at school. If he graduated with that GPA and then said High School wasn't that hard, I'd assume that he was in the special ed class. |
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Posted: 3/31/2019 8:39:21 PM EDT
[#6]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Yes I was. He had been shooting since the match came to Texas too so I don't feel so bad. That man could REALLY shoot that 45. . I still beat out a hell of a lot of "seasoned competitors". When you score worse than a first timer who dropped 6 plates and was slower than a turtle, your shooting skills match is just not that hard or you REALLY should take up golf. |
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Posted: 3/31/2019 8:44:33 PM EDT
[#7]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Hush you. This is a shooting forum where we make fun of people that actually get out and shoot. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Looks fun. Day of shooting, I’d be in. ashamed of............. |
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Posted: 3/31/2019 8:45:34 PM EDT
[#8]
Quote HistoryQuoted: If you placed 81st, you weren't beating any seasoned competitors unless they had catastrophic failures and were zeroing out stages. 
 Attached FileI |
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Posted: 3/31/2019 8:46:46 PM EDT
[#9]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Well I was there with him. So he didn't have to. |
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Posted: 3/31/2019 8:50:50 PM EDT
[#10]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
If you placed 81st, you weren't beating any seasoned competitors unless they had catastrophic failures and were zeroing out stages. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted: Yes I was. He had been shooting since the match came to Texas too so I don't feel so bad. That man could REALLY shoot that 45. . I still beat out a hell of a lot of "seasoned competitors". When you score worse than a first timer who dropped 6 plates and was slower than a turtle, your shooting skills match is just not that hard or you REALLY should take up golf. |
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Posted: 3/31/2019 8:51:22 PM EDT
[#11]
Quote HistoryQuoted: RIIIIIIGHT. My very first match. Shot it with my duty gear. A stock M&P and AR with Eotech. Went at it cold, didn't even walk the stages beforehand. Completely blew one stage since I failed to engage a line of plates. I didn't even notice tucked in below another. Placed 81 out of 134. The old guy that shot a standard A1 with iron sights, 20 rd mags and a RA 1911 in a military FLAP HOLSTER hanging from a GI pistol belt placed 66 and he could not even run. Yeah, go on and tell me how hard it is. |
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Posted: 3/31/2019 8:54:31 PM EDT
[#12]
Quote HistoryQuoted: So? Your point? Did you place in the %60 at your first match without a shred of preparation? Then the match was just not that hard, "seasoned" or not. If I had dropped an entire stage at High Power I flat out guarantee my name would be last on the back page. I'm not going to say that makes High Power easy because I'm smarter than that. |
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Posted: 3/31/2019 8:54:51 PM EDT
[#13]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Why practice when you can get an expensive, magazine fed shotgun that reloads in 2 seconds? $$$$$$ Oh and then you'll still have to practice. I watched a guy who normally runs open/unlimited still take first shooting his quad load shotgun leaving his saiga (or vepr or whatever) in the truck. Yes some of the equipment is ridiculous, but it's still a shooting sport that requires a certain level of mastering to be on the top tier. There are plenty of us who can hang out in the middle, have fun, shoot the shit with some hilarious people, and spend a day shooting our guns. I've never not had a good time because I felt my equipment wasn't as good as the next guy. Had a magazine cause jams and lack of lube cause some FTF issues that really upset me because equipment malfunction isn't what I consider to be a shooter error. |
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Posted: 3/31/2019 8:59:55 PM EDT
[#14]
Quote HistoryQuoted: 300 yards isn't long range. Pistol at E6 was at that damn Polish rack with 8 inch plate at 25 yards. That is way harder than two hits on IPSC paper. After the other stuff, less the chug. I have seen nothing like this in the 3G Ranges on the Tube. Perhaps they don't post those videos that show the tougher ranges. |
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Posted: 3/31/2019 9:02:12 PM EDT
[#15]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I'm the MD of an annual LE/MIL only multi-gun match that brings in competitors from all over the US. It's really a 2-gun match, but we always have one stage that starts with a prop 870 initially used to breach a door then engage some shotgun plates before transitioning to a pistol and/or rifle. We provide ammo and bring four shotguns to keep the stage running. Two shotguns will keep the stage running smoothly, but we always start with four since we're often down to two by the end of the match due to parts breakages. Here's a competitor's video of last year's match (shotgun stage starts at 5:56) that I found on youtube (paper targets on that stage require 2 body / 1 head shot to neutralize):  2018 Texas Law Enforcement Multi-gun Championship Cpl. Jeremy Dunn 80% of our competitors have never and will never shoot another match besides ours, so we tailor our stages for them knowing that it will end up being a hose-fest for the top shooters. We've actually changed our equipment rules every year to try to accommodate the most amount of people, but honestly most of them don't really care--they just want to shoot, have fun, and test their skills as this is the only place most of them get to shoot like this. 
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Posted: 3/31/2019 9:02:37 PM EDT
[#16]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
We shot to 450+ in the rain at East6, 220 sideways between trees and a barrier at SE3, the range at SE2 was weak sauce. Pistol at E6 was at that damn Polish rack with 8 inch plate at 25 yards. That is way harder than two hits on an IPSC paper. I have seen nothing like this in the 3G Ranges on the Tube. Perhaps they don't post those videos that show the tougher ranges. |
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Posted: 3/31/2019 9:04:04 PM EDT
[#17]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
No we make fun of people who look like fucking retards shooting gay ass gun games they should be fucking ashamed of............. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Looks fun. Day of shooting, I’d be in. ashamed of............. Look up the results for the "world shoot" all ammo and guns are provided and all major disciplines are represented. Guess who won? Guess who the Top 50% of shooters were comprised of.... All the gear in the world dosnt mean snot if your not a strong shooter, ive seen it countless times and its kinda sad.... You cant spend your way to being a respected shooter. |
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Posted: 3/31/2019 9:05:40 PM EDT
[#18]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Did he finish in 81st place, by any chance? He was just really good with a pistol and good enough with the 870 he could load it fast and didn't miss often. Best shot I ever saw him take was a running one hand no look shot on a lollipop at 10 yards. Now the gamers would have those 13+1 guns and the long tube loader things. It was always fun to watch then miss the load and shells would go flying everywhere. But that was before ammo got crazy expensive and everyone quit shooting as much. |
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Posted: 3/31/2019 9:06:50 PM EDT
[#19]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
We shot to 450+ in the rain at East6, 220 sideways between trees and a barrier at SE3, the range at SE2 was weak sauce. Pistol at E6 was at that damn Polish rack with 8 inch plate at 25 yards. That is way harder than two hits on IPSC paper. After the other stuff, less the chug. I have seen nothing like this in the 3G Ranges on the Tube. Perhaps they don't post those videos that show the tougher ranges. |
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Posted: 3/31/2019 9:08:17 PM EDT
[#20]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I've never gotten an invitation to your match... I'd like to come sometime... |
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Posted: 3/31/2019 9:11:29 PM EDT
[#21]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Yep. Super easy. I don't think it's long range until it gets over 700.  Attached File |
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Posted: 3/31/2019 9:16:23 PM EDT
[#22]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Yep. Super easy. I don't think it's long range until it gets over 700. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
We shot to 450+ in the rain at East6, 220 sideways between trees and a barrier at SE3, the range at SE2 was weak sauce. Pistol at E6 was at that damn Polish rack with 8 inch plate at 25 yards. That is way harder than two hits on IPSC paper. After the other stuff, less the chug. I have seen nothing like this in the 3G Ranges on the Tube. Perhaps they don't post those videos that show the tougher ranges. |
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Posted: 3/31/2019 9:17:20 PM EDT
[#23]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Yep. Super easy. I don't think it's long range until it gets over 700. 5.56 at that range, on steel. You can't even call the hits from the clang. I shot to 600 Friday using my Grendel and 5.56. The 5.56 was pretty much useless on steel that far. 700 would be a waste with one. Here is my pop trying my Grendel at 500. You can hear the clang. It is far enough he has his head off the stock before it even gets back to us.  My Pop learned the value of a Grendel, 500 yards on steel |
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Posted: 3/31/2019 9:18:27 PM EDT
[#24]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Yep. Super easy. I don't think it's long range until it gets over 700. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
We shot to 450+ in the rain at East6, 220 sideways between trees and a barrier at SE3, the range at SE2 was weak sauce. Pistol at E6 was at that damn Polish rack with 8 inch plate at 25 yards. That is way harder than two hits on IPSC paper. After the other stuff, less the chug. I have seen nothing like this in the 3G Ranges on the Tube. Perhaps they don't post those videos that show the tougher ranges. Rio Salado in Mesa AZ is very good at getting the high power bays the club matches and we frequently get to shoot farther than 300. |
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Posted: 3/31/2019 9:19:53 PM EDT
[#25]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I finished in the top third of my first High Power match using a denim jacket and a patch of carpet as a mat, and no 600 yard zero. I'm not going to say that makes High Power easy because I'm smarter than that. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted: So? Your point? Did you place in the %60 at your first match without a shred of preparation? Then the match was just not that hard, "seasoned" or not. If I had dropped an entire stage at High Power I flat out guarantee my name would be last on the back page. I'm not going to say that makes High Power easy because I'm smarter than that. The first match above I shot was easy. Not even really stressful. I hit every target I saw. My own fuckup cost me but the only real difficulty was speed and being unfamiliar with the game. That came with repetition. It should have been a hell of a lot harder. |
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Posted: 3/31/2019 9:22:59 PM EDT
[#26]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Ought to be a picture of a bunch of guys sitting on the ground for hours waiting to shoot for 30 seconds |
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Posted: 3/31/2019 9:28:23 PM EDT
[#27]
Quote HistoryQuoted: In my first Hi-power match (1974) I placed third from the bottom. 6 relays with a club Garand. The only reason I did not place next to last was one of them had heat exhaustion and didn't shoot the 600. The real winners in High Power are determined by the numbers of "X" hits. I knew damn well EVERYONE there was better than me. The first match above I shot was easy. Not even really stressful. I hit every target I saw. My own fuckup cost me but the only real difficulty was speed and being unfamiliar with the game. That came with repetition. It should have been a hell of a lot harder. Got a link to the scores? |
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Posted: 3/31/2019 9:29:43 PM EDT
[#28]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
@john-in-austin Got a link to the scores? Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted: In my first Hi-power match (1974) I placed third from the bottom. 6 relays with a club Garand. The only reason I did not place next to last was one of them had heat exhaustion and didn't shoot the 600. The real winners in High Power are determined by the numbers of "X" hits. I knew damn well EVERYONE there was better than me. The first match above I shot was easy. Not even really stressful. I hit every target I saw. My own fuckup cost me but the only real difficulty was speed and being unfamiliar with the game. That came with repetition. It should have been a hell of a lot harder. Got a link to the scores? |
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Posted: 3/31/2019 9:32:03 PM EDT
[#29]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Nope. |
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Posted: 3/31/2019 9:34:16 PM EDT
[#30]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Well, you snagged a picture with JM so you're totes legit. https://www.AR15.Com/media/mediaFiles/241349/IMG_1575_JPG-896911.JPG |
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Posted: 3/31/2019 9:34:26 PM EDT
[#31]
I shoot multigun, USPSA, or PRS at least once a week.
I have to admit I'd like it more if the established league rules, which is all there seems to be around here, had limited/practical/factory divisions that were actually LIMITED/PRACTICAL/FACTORY. UML "limited" is laughably named. I've actually been having more fun after switching away from supah-extendos, giant magwell funnels, and all that. Strangely enough my scores haven't really suffered much because of that change since I'm shooting more than ever. It's frustrating knowing I could be faster if I switch back to gamer gear but that's OK, I know the game and how it's played going in and I'm the one choosing to play differently. I still shoot it because it's "hella fun" and I've become a much better shooter than I ever was before. I enjoy the time spent with some cool people but again, I do have to admit that spending 10-13 hours sometimes to shoot for less than 5 minutes is a horribly inefficient use of time even if the socializing is fun considering I could always just get a bunch of friends to hit the range, set up a "stage", and shoot non-stop for a few hours and still be home with guns cleaned in less time. Haters gunna hate. Hater haters gunna hate haters. I'm too busy shooting to do either. |
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Posted: 3/31/2019 9:35:36 PM EDT
[#32]
Quote HistoryQuoted: LOL 5.56 at that range, on steel. You can't even call the hits from the clang. I shot to 600 Friday using my Grendel and 5.56. The 5.56 was pretty much useless on steel that far. 700 would be a waste with one. Here is my pop trying my Grendel at 500. You can hear the clang. It is far enough he has his head off the stock before it even gets back to us.  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IcXF3EyKLOA |
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Posted: 3/31/2019 9:35:38 PM EDT
[#33]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I’m thinking of getting into it with a few coworkers but it seems like another equipment race that requires a few grand to be competitive. I could play with a police trade in G17, Palmetto AR, and a stoeger m3000 with a tube and home done loading port. So $450, $400, $600. If you are doing it right, the guns are cheap and the ammo is expensive. |
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Posted: 3/31/2019 9:38:16 PM EDT
[#34]
Quote HistoryQuoted: In my first Hi-power match (1974) I placed third from the bottom. 6 relays with a club Garand. The only reason I did not place next to last was one of them had heat exhaustion and didn't shoot the 600. The real winners in High Power are determined by the numbers of "X" hits. I knew damn well EVERYONE there was better than me. The first match above I shot was easy. Not even really stressful. I hit every target I saw. My own fuckup cost me but the only real difficulty was speed and being unfamiliar with the game. That came with repetition. It should have been a hell of a lot harder. |
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Posted: 3/31/2019 9:38:20 PM EDT
[#35]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Most 3 gun matches are ran at public ranges. High power and 3 gun are usually separate entities within the club. Sometimes they play nice, but the biggest issue is just high power being in use at the same time as your club match. Rio Salado in Mesa AZ is very good at getting the high power bays the club matches and we frequently get to shoot farther than 300. But 300 yards isn't a hard shot. |
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Posted: 3/31/2019 9:39:42 PM EDT
[#36]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Hush you. This is a shooting forum where we make fun of people that actually get out and shoot. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Looks fun. Day of shooting, I’d be in. For those of you gawking, keep in mind you’re looking at open guns. I’m sure you’d criticize open USPSA guns for their “lack of practical applications” but it’s a game. And fun. I love 2 gun and also shoot 3 gun in the Tac Ops division which prohibits brakes, speed loaders, optics, and box magazines on shotguns. This really evens out the playing field. You can also shoot limited or heavy, in which there are even greater restrictions on rifles and shotguns. Either way, whatever you like, I think all the shooting sports are great. Nothing trains you faster than a timer and a bunch of people with all eyes on you! |
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Posted: 3/31/2019 9:42:26 PM EDT
[#37]
I think it’s worth it just to shoot the steel at our club level matches, also shooting on the clock is challenging you’re not just hitting targets, you’re solving problems with guns. I think it’s a good way to develop and excercise your “shooting brain” and learn to take your time in a hurry.
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Posted: 3/31/2019 9:49:23 PM EDT
[#38]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
ITT: a bunch of non-shooting Timmies, who say they would shoot competition BUT....*insert excuse here* All you guys who TRAIN instead of competing, and all of you would like physical 2 gun; are you going to show up at The Tactical Games? https://thetacticalgames.com/ A bunch of 3 gunners showed up and did really well against the tactical timmies because, surprise surprise, when it came time to put bullets on target, they did it fast. |
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Posted: 3/31/2019 9:50:33 PM EDT
[#39]
Herr durr: It's just a shotgun reloading contest!
Derpy durr: Hey that shotgun holds so many rounds you don't need to reload! |
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Posted: 3/31/2019 9:53:39 PM EDT
[#40]
Quote HistoryQuoted: But 300 yards isn't a hard shot. 
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Posted: 3/31/2019 9:55:50 PM EDT
[#41]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I’d like to try a 3-gun match. I’d run it with an 870, but I’d probably put a +3 tube extension on it. Shooting stuff is fun, how you place is secondary. |
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Posted: 3/31/2019 9:55:54 PM EDT
[#42]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
75 grains can shoot that far pretty good. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted: LOL 5.56 at that range, on steel. You can't even call the hits from the clang. I shot to 600 Friday using my Grendel and 5.56. The 5.56 was pretty much useless on steel that far. 700 would be a waste with one. Here is my pop trying my Grendel at 500. You can hear the clang. It is far enough he has his head off the stock before it even gets back to us. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IcXF3EyKLOAIMO, once you hit 600 that’s “long range” for 5.56. |
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Posted: 3/31/2019 9:56:50 PM EDT
[#43]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
come on out! Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
I’d like to try a 3-gun match. I’d run it with an 870, but I’d probably put a +3 tube extension on it. Shooting stuff is fun, how you place is secondary. |
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Posted: 3/31/2019 9:56:53 PM EDT
[#44]
Quote HistoryQuoted: That depends on what you’re shooting at, and how quickly everyone else hits it.
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Posted: 3/31/2019 10:00:20 PM EDT
[#45]
Quote HistoryQuoted: RIIIIIIGHT. My very first match. Shot it with my duty gear. A stock M&P and AR with Eotech. Went at it cold, didn't even walk the stages beforehand. Completely blew one stage since I failed to engage a line of plates. I didn't even notice tucked in below another. Placed 81 out of 134. The old guy that shot a standard A1 with iron sights, 20 rd mags and a RA 1911 in a military FLAP HOLSTER hanging from a GI pistol belt placed 66 and he could not even run. Yeah, go on and tell me how hard it is. |
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Posted: 3/31/2019 10:03:46 PM EDT
[#46]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Wait. You shot a single match. Presumably a club level match. Barely made it out of the bottom third. And got beat by an old man using less than optimal gear...who was a cripple. And you're using that experience to say that 3 gun isn't that hard? That's a level of derp that's even a bit much for GD. 81 out of 134 is like, 60th percentile. If a kid graduated high school with that GPA, I'd say he sucked at school. If he graduated with that GPA and then said High School wasn't that hard, I'd assume that he was in the special ed class. Overall placement means jack shit. Percent of performance vs. the match winner tells the real story. If someone legit was there. |
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Posted: 3/31/2019 10:04:35 PM EDT
[#47]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Yep, I beat out %40 of the match and I SUCKED. It's just not that hard, get over it. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted: Wait. You shot a single match. Presumably a club level match. Barely made it out of the bottom third. And got beat by an old man using less than optimal gear...who was a cripple. And you're using that experience to say that 3 gun isn't that hard? That's a level of derp that even a bit much for GD. 81 out of 134 is like, 60th percentile. If a kid graduated high school with that GPA, I'd say he sucked at school. If he graduated with that GPA and then said High School wasn't that hard, I'd assume that he was in the special ed class.
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Posted: 3/31/2019 10:05:03 PM EDT
[#48]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Yep. All you need is a 200 dollar caddie and you will instantly be loading 8 shells in less than 4 seconds. Has nothing to do with hundreds of hours of dryfire practice or anything like that. I almost sprung for a tactical type shotgun or a Mossberg Jam Master, but I have no other use for such a gun. I'll just stick to USPSA/IDPA, pretty easy to just run what you have in those sports. I can just use my night stand P09 or CCW 75 PCR for either and be competitive. |
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Posted: 3/31/2019 10:05:48 PM EDT
[#49]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
This is true. I was shooting at a 4 inch plate in 25 MPH winds today at 300. It was a challange. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted: That depends on what you're shooting at, and how quickly everyone else hits it. |
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Posted: 3/31/2019 10:05:51 PM EDT
[#50]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Yep, I beat out %40 of the match and I SUCKED. It's just not that hard, get over it. |
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