Hey y'all, I have not abandoned you! I'm working up a review for Göteborgs Prima Fint lös to post here, which I'll put up as soon as IRL duties allow. Very happy to see that this thread has been in good hands in my absence!

ARFers kick ass!

PWNing page 3!!

It's not for me.  The General that tastes like vomit mixed with Blue Moon beer is particularly off-putting.  



You do know they make this stuff called Grizzly wintergreen and it's fucking awesome.

Grizzly is trash

The General Smokey Oak is decent the taste is mild but nice.  I'm not sure which can I'll pull out next but I know I'll be ordering another log of Islay Whiskey.  I'm going to try the Probe Whiskey when I place my next order.

I've been snusing for almost 9 yrs,was into snuff for awhile but quit. Not trying to butt in but to answer or elaborate on a few questions that came up in the thread.
1. Is snus safer than smoking or using chew?- Sweden has the highest (per capita rate) of oral tobacco use in the world and also has the lowest rate (per capita) of





related cancers, ie. mouth, esophageal, and stomach cancers. There have been no studies done as of yet that show that Swedish snus contributes to heart disease.





The highest oral cancer rates are...In the American south where coincidentally enough, dip and chew are very popular.  
2. Whats the difference between Swedish snus and dip or chew?- the main difference is in the curing process. Most, if not all of American oral tobacco products are





fire cured whereas Swedish are pasteurized which reduces the level of nitrosamines. Heat raises the levels which is one of the many reasons why cigarettes are so cancerous.





Sweden also uses salt as a preservative rather than... WTF! American producers won't/don't tell you what they're using? Wait they don't tell you what any of the in-





gredients are. Hm, I wonder why? Sweden lists all the ingredients on the label. Anyway the salt is the hardest thing to get used but after a week you won't notice it.




Also the salt level per portion is about 1/4-1/3 the amount that is in a slice of bread. Negligible.
3. Why is the shipping so high?- At the time I started,shipping was very cheap. Reasonable enough that you could order 2-3 cans of different snus's to try out without





having to eat Top Ramen for a week. $5-$6 from a US warehouse. Then came the PACT act. "Prevent All Cigarette Trafficking" act which was touted to stop tobacco smuggling because it funds





terrorism. And of course because the children. Well mainly it was because states were missing out on collecting tobacco taxes. The US mail was no longer an option for shipping,rather it legally





has to be transported via UPS. Quite a smart thing to do considering at the time USPS was already struggling. Take away some more of their biz amirite?





Be aware that if you order from Sweden you're responsible for paying state and federal tobacco taxes which I'm sure everyone does as the US has no way or interest in tracking it federally or at the state level.
PSA's
White portions are more mildly flavored than regular or "Original" portions but will stay fresh longer. If you don't like your Ettan whites try the Original portions.



Store your snus in the fridge or ideally in the freezer sealed in freezer bags.
If your'e trying to quit smoking have some some "Sterk" or strong portions on hand for your morning coffee and/or after meals. The times when that cigarette really tastes good and your nicotine cravings are at their highest.




Also keep in mind that high amounts of nicotine will fuck with your sleep so sterks aren't a good idea late at night.
Snus Central changed up their shipping fees awhile back and while it worked out for some people others were classified as being in "outlying areas" which actually doubled their shipping costs. Even though Snus Central is a subsidiary




of Buysnus, Buysnus hasn't done this so check them out.





 

 

Great post NW, thank you!

Happy to help an ARF buddy! Plz pardon the quote snip.  

Do you guys think we have a strong enough network on ARFCOM that we can help each other out with shipping? I was already planning on ordering a good amount of snus (three logs plus some individual cans), so I tacked wtturn's order on to mine and asked him to pay for his snus cans plus the difference in shipping, then the shipping charge to send it USPS to him. I'm not doing this to make money off of other ARFers. Without giving away wtturn's AO, I can say that he does not live in BFE, but the charge for direct shipment to him was ridiculous expensive. Like, twice as much as it should have been.

IIRC, the snus e-tailer wanted $60-ish to ship directly to him. How we worked it out, wtturn's shipping cost from Sweden to the US was about $3, and another $13 to USPS from my AO to his. My order by itself was $40 to ship from Sweden, and our combined order had a shipping charge of $43-ish. We could also look into doing group buys. I probably won't need to order any snus for a month or two, but would definitely be down for that in the future!

wtturn: I was very curious how that Lab Lemon would taste, and bummers that it sucks. If you're feeling curious, I'd point you in the direction of Nick & Johnny, Oden's and Thunder snus. Lots of minty snus in there, and no shortage of sterk! You might also like Göteborgs Rapé Hjortron. Whatever the hell cloudberry is, it's freakin tasty. I'm really hoping you like the General Onyx. It is a white portion, but is a sterk/strong snus. It's got a good natural lemon flavor with some cracked black pepper. Delicious! Says me, anyways.

Islay Whisky snus concern: I love this stuff, the taste is incredible and I'll keep a can in the rotation for occasional use. However, I do need to mention that this snus is not made like the overwhelming majority of modern Swedish snuses. The tobacco in Islay Whisky is fire cured, and then fermented - very similar to how American dip is manufactured. I am guessing that the TSNA levels are higher in Islay Whisky than other snuses, but I am not a rocket surgeon, nor did I sleep at the Holiday Inn last night. I'll continue to keep a can in my fridge, and I'm looking forward to the lös version when it comes out in a couple of months. It just won't be a daily snus for me.

Cathan: Smokes really trash your taste buds, and I'm not surprised that you're not getting the full flavor of the snus. I fully encourage you to try out some snuses that are a little out of your normal flavor range. There are a number of mint, berry and/or fruit flavors - those may be better for your tastes. I normally don't like licorice at all, but I tried General's G3 Licorice Mint and it was pretty good. More mint than licorice, and damn tasty! When you tried the Kronan, did you get any dill flavor out of it? I've read online that Kronan has a bit of that taste.

Re: after work smoking: I'd say just put a portion in your face every time you start craving, instead of vaping maybe? To be honest, I don't remember how vaping affected my taste buds, but I do know that going to snus only caused them to regenerate (for lack of a better word) very quickly. I noticed a drastic improvement in a day or two. Congrats on cutting down on the smokes, dude!

My main concern with the Camel snus is the lingering uncertainty about how they process/manufacture the product. Just my opinion, but I flat do not trust big American tobacco. I'll place my faith in the Swedes and their version of the FDA, who oversees snus regulation. I also find the Camel stuff to be too sweet, and prefer the simpler flavor profile of the Swedish product. Not passing judgement based on snus flavor preference; I'll forgive the heresy!

Nehi: Grizzly =  Have you tried Jakobsson's Wintergreen? Northerner has a warehouse in the US, so you won't have to pay the Sweden to US shipping rape. It's strong, and it tastes really really good.

harleyrkc: I grabbed a can of the General Smoky Oak, and it's quite good for a portion snus. The flavor reminds me a lot of Ettan lös, which is in my top 3. I'd really like to try Smoky Oak in lös if General ever decided to go that route. And regardless of my concern about Islay Whisky's production, man that is some good shit! Can't wait to treat myself to an occasional pinch of the lös! I'd enjoy hearing your thoughts on the Probe Whiskey when you get it ordered.

RWC: How do you like the stainless Icetool? Functionally speaking, how different is it compared with the Mortar? How do you like the waterproof cans, worth the price? I'm back/forth on getting one of those pre-filled with General lös from SnusCentral.

NorWester: You're not butting in at all, man. Welcome to the conversation! My only concern is storing snus in the freezer, but that's probably mostly because my freezer sucks ass and ruins everything. I didn't know that SnusCentral was related to BuySnus, I'll do some comparison shopping and see where I get the best price. So, if I may ask, what are your favorite snuses? Anything you absolutely can't stand? Thank you for the shared knowledge!

Wishing I could find some wintergreen thunder locally

Which completely contradicts a lot of "conventional wisdom" about tobacco use.

Interesting...

Northerner carries three different Thunder flavors including Wintergreen. Ships from the US, so you won't get raped by shipping charges. You'd only have trouble ordering snus off the Interwebs if you live in fucking Oklahoma, of all places. K5FAL posted on page 2 that OK does not permit online tobacco sales. Can someone explain the sense behind that law?

V2 Tobacco (Thunder manufacturer) has a snus store locator on their website. It looks like there's at least one store in each of the lower 48, and Hawaii is represented also. Here's hoping you can find a local!

It's all in the manufacturing method, my plate-lipped friend. There's no fire curing, nor any fermentation in the Swedish process.

Here's a page on snus and health, and GOTHIATEK, the manufacturing standard used by Swedish Match. You'll find pretty much everything you'd want to know (and probably more) about Swedish snus and health. It is ABSOLUTELY worth the time to read all of the data from the links on the left of that page.

Swedish Match produces most of the well known snus products, including General, Grov, Ettan, Göteborgs and a bunch of others. These dudes know what's up.

Freezer storage is the best way to go if you're buying in quantity. The fridge is OK for up to a month for regular portions and los but I notice them starting to dry out within a few weeks.


White portions will last longer of course since they're already pretty dry. The word is that the nicotine will start to degrade after a year or so in the freezer but cleaning and defrosting


mine a month ago I found 3 rolls buried at the bottom and the "best by" date is mid 2012. Still has a good strong nic hit and long lasting flavor and they've been a part of my daily rotation


since. Actually I've only run across one snus flavor I really hate and that was something I included in my very 1st order. Gotesburg Rape. Can't stand juniper or gin.





Probably my favorite lately is Jacobsens Classic Strong. Jacobsens Classic is OK but they added a light hint of honey to the strong. And of course nobody has it in stock lately.  Jacs Melon


is pretty good for a dessert snus but its pretty sweet. Other than that I pretty much stick with Ettan, General Sterk, Grov Strong, and Grov regular. Isly Whiskey is pretty good too but I burnt myself out on it when


it first came out.



The owner of Snuscentral (Larry) is a dealer for Buysnus. If you receive orders from both you'll notice that they ship from the same place, Makewebo which is Buysnus. SC usually has better prices

but their new shipping setup makes Buysnus a better option if you're in an "outlying area". It doesn't make sense as the next town over is further off the beaten path then I am and the shipping prices stayed the

same there.




 
 

Mason: The stainless mortar tool isn't really that different. It's heavier obviously. The only thing different is the clicks. There are fewer of them, but they are further apart. I find that 2 clicks is just right to make a slim "portion" pris. I bought one just because, but it will last a lifetime. It also comes with an extra o-ring for replacement. When I clean it with soap, I drop a little vg on it to keep it running smooth. Probably not necessary though.

The waterproof cans are pretty awesome, I'm not gonna lie. I have 2 of them now. They don't come filled, but a can is included. Since I switched to a slim white portion for my daily snus, I carry one filled with portions and leave one at home with los. At first, I just dumped the los in and used my mortar straight out of the can. However, I couldn't find what the coating of the can was, so I put a plastic can inside and filled it with los. Not it's intended purpose, but it works. Really the only plastic can that will fit it height wise is a General can. I guess it's made by them, and for their products. Makes sense.

As far a networking shipping costs, I'm down. I've spent 120 bucks so far on shipping with the 3 orders I placed. I bought 2 orders from buysnus, and one from snuscentral. I have one coming today to South Florida that is one roll of Skruf Stark slim white and 2 cans of general G.3. It was 30 bucks for shipping for not a lot of product. By the way, the G.3 is awesome!

As far as storage goes, here's my opinion. I store mine in the same air tight container I use for cigars. It's actually one of those ar mag containers I found at bass pro. I have the same humidifier and gauge in it to watch the humidity. My reason was one, it works great for cigars, like years and still fresh. And two, my s.o. would probably freak out if she saw all the cans I've acquired on my snus quest. I can't put all of that in the fridge! Input on my storage method is appreciated, good or bad. They are all in sealed cans, so I figured it would work fine and has so far. Hell, I've left a sealed can of cope in my truck for weeks and it still be good. Even with the heat we have here. Once opened though, all bets were off. My only problem with the fridge is that it works much like your ac. Parts of it's job is to dry the air, then cool it. I'd be willing to bet it would help dry out snus cans in short order.

I read through most of that link. Good info! I wondered how much "safer" it is than american dip. While not totally safe, 200 years of study info works for me! I've had some weird reactions over the years to some tobacco products. Smoking was just bad. I use to smoke reds. Copenhagen use to give me heartburn like a mofo. It reminds me of a joke where 2 country boys had a conversation why they couldn't dip anymore because of heartburn. They're remedy was dip on one side, rolaids on the other! Anyway, it use to give me bad neck cramps. I would also get tension headaches almost daily. So cope, zantac, and advil. Nasty combo.

Most recently I had to quit vaping. I had a really bad reaction a kin to vertigo. I could barely drive home I was so dizzy. I sat in my chair for about 4 hours before I could walk and I couldn't eat for almost 2 days. I have vaped for years, but for whatever reason, my body said no mas. I was vaping literally all day at 20mg. I'd start in the am with my coffee, and end just before I brushed my teeth and got in bed.  
I read somewhere that nicotine can also mess with your sleep patterns. I had issues when vaping, well, I attribute it to vaping in that I couldn't get out of bed in the morning. I use to wake up before my alarm went off at 5:30. Since I stopped vaping, it only took 2 days and I was waking up again like I use to. It may be in my head, but I happened pretty quickly. It's a great alternative to smoking and such, but it didn't agree with me at all. Just thought I'd share.

It's funny because I had just bought 2 cans of cope begrudgingly before I saw this thread. I went without nicotine for a few days while my order shipped. Since the snus, no headaches, no heartburn, and a great tasting nicotine alternative!

Hmmmm...might have to get back into snus.

Was into General and General Mint portions. The mint is like chewing gum.

Right now I'm hooked on Cope Wintergreen, at least a pinch a day after work to keep me awake on the ride home.

 

US snus or Swedish? Many Swedish snus users (and their dentists) report that their gums seem to be in better shape than ever possibly due to the salt in snus.


US dip has a large amount of sugar in it which contributes to tooth decay and gum erosion.





The snus-pancreatic cancer link is actually pretty old and has been largely discounted. They don't really know what causes it and the largest group of those that do


get it,don't have any of the risk factors that they associate with it. Sorry to hear about your friend though,its really a brutal disease.





http://www.harmreductionjournal.com/content/pdf/1477-7517-10-36.pdf





http://www.estoc.org/uploads/Documents/documents/Snus--Pancreatic_Cancer-Nov2008.pdf





http://www.rstreet.org/op-ed/how-dangerous-is-swedish-snus-dont-ask-the-new-york-times/




 
 

That's why you want to use freezer bags or ideally vacuum seal for large amounts. I don't bag the few cans I keep in the fridge which is probably why I see the drying. Definitely seal the ones you freeze though.


Here's a video a snus buddy made re storage. Gotta give him some crap about the intro music. Chad got banned from the SC forums when he first started for being too effusive. Hes still at it though.










 
 

Right on. I may just put the whole damn airtight box I have in the fridge and be done with it.

First, and most importantly, I am very sorry for the loss of your friend. That's some rough shit.

I have not experienced the receding gums, mine actually look better now than they did when I was smoking. In this very informal thread on /r/Snus, people are reporting some gum recession, but not to the point of losing teeth or requiring dental work. It seems a lot like the prevailing thought is "take care of your mouth, and you'll be fine." On my end, I brush my teeth after meals, swish some water after removing a pinch, and switch sides every other pinch. I don't put snus in my bottom lip, upper deck only.

Did you also use American dip or chewing tobacco? Was the snus you used Swedish, or was it Camel or other American types? Purely out of curiosity, why did you place your snus in your bottom lip? On page 2, Cathan91 said he puts snus in his lower lip, so please don't take my question the wrong way. I'm in favor of you doing what works best for you, and am not being critical.

Please excuse me if this is crossing any lines, I respectfully apologize if so. Did your friend use Swedish snus? Did he ever smoke cigars or cigarettes? Was your friend diabetic?

Diabetes appears to be a cause AND effect of pancreatic cancer. Another study from 2011 showed that people who smoke cigars or cigarettes are at much higher risk of developing pancreatic cancer than people who never smoked at all. In the same study, people who only ever used smokeless tobacco were in line with people who never used any tobacco at all. This study was conducted by 30 researchers.

From the World Health Organization's cancer page, specifically the section on pancreatic cancer:



Here's a graphic from 2012 showing instances of pancreatic cancer in European males. Note that Sweden's rate is less than 10.4 instances per 100,000 people.

NorWester: I'm with you on Göteborgs Rapé. It came highly recommended by the Webernets, so I added a can to my first ever snus order. I gave it an honest shot, at least half of the can, but it was too flowery tasting for me. However, I am a fan of their Lingon and Hjortron variations. Both are very mild snuses with their respective fruit flavors, excellent for a change of pace. That Jakobsson's Classic Strong sounds pretty good, I wonder why SnusCentral and BuySnus don't carry it? Are those Ziploc vacuum bags good quality? I've not used them before.

RWC: Haha, yep, thinking I see one of those waterproof cans in my future. Just my opinion here, but I think you're 100% correct to clean and lube the o-ring on your Icetool. The Mortar instructions specifically say to lube the ring at least once a week, I do mine at least twice as often, and would do the same with the Icetool. Did you get the 3ml, 4ml or 5ml Icetool?

About the G.3 snuses, do the non-licorice/mint ones taste like a regular General portion/white portion, or are they different? What do you think about the G.3 Mint? The description mentions eucalyptus, peppermint and cedar. You said on page 2 that you'd ordered pretty much the entire store, and I really dig your idea of a chilled humidor. You, sir, are dedicated!

I got the 3 mil icetool. Honestly, if you can fit more than 3 mil in your upper lip, more power to ya! I think the 3 mil is plenty in my opinion. I'd just bite the bullet and get one of the waterproof cans, they are worth it. Between the 2, best 50 bucks I've spent on dip/snus accessories. Also, check out that spittoon link I posted on page 2 I think. That thing is awesome if you have to spit.

The G.3 portions pretty much all taste the same. White or not. Love that General saltiness! I haven't tried any of the mint varieties, just not my thing. The extra strong portions are definitely strong enough though. I've settled on the skruf es slim white portions and grov loose. Those are my 2 favorites. Everything else will probably get given to friends to try out to get them off of dip.

I put my humidor container in the fridge when I got home. I'll give it a go, even though I think it may be overkill. If you're gonna do it, gotta go all the way man!

Okay, I'm curious who these studies were conducted on.

Are they Swedish studies of Swedish snus on Swedish men? Are there any studies of Swedish snus on non-swedes?
Long term studies of non-swedes using Swedish snus?

Is there a gene the swedes have that drastically decrease cancer risks?

I've already got a freezer full and feel much better on it than I do on Copenhagen. All because of this thread. But I'm not buying the no cancer thing unless there are a few studies of non swedes using snus, people with no Swedish genes using snus, etc.

It was until the FDA and the PACT bullshit fucked it all sorts of up.
Some of my favs are no longer made and tricky and costly to get from over seas unless you do a multi log order.

 
Onyx is good stuff.  

I haven't tried the Hjorten yet,might give it a shot next order along with some Gotlands Summer snus. Their fall version,Hostsnus is extremely good. Apple and Pear flavored. Its good enough that it actually weaned me off from Sterks for awhile just because I like the taste so much. I'll buy a years supply this fall. Jacs Strong Classic is out of stock right now supposedly because of manufacturing issues. I ordered a roll along with a couple others from Mysnus awhile ago but not sure what I'm gonna get. Ordered on the 13th and hadn't heard anything from them re shipping and no replys to my emails until I sent a WTF note yesterday. "Nobody else has it in stock,if you don't either send Jacs Melon instead...But just F-ing send it!" It shipped today. They're cheaper than both SC and Buysnus but they've had issues in the past. I wouldn't place a huge order with them.




I've never used the vacuum bags,just regular freezer bags. They do a good job if you sqeeze the air out of them, but I'd guess the vacuum type do work better. The main thing is having some protection against dessication in the freezer.



ETA Just got the confirmation. They're sending Melon,don't have the Classic Strong in stock. why didn't they just say so?
 

NorWester: I was poking around on MySnus, and they have Jakobsson's Classic Strong Portion in stock @ $3.29/can or $29.09/log.

Also, what do you know about the MySnus site? I'm asking because you seem to know some of the behind the scenes type stuff. Their prices seem really good, wondering if maybe they're too good?

tex: I wanted to make sure your questions didn't linger without recognition. They are excellent questions, but at the moment, I don't have excellent answers. You can see from other posts in the thread that I like to link the source of my info as often as possible, and I plan to do the same for you. I will do some digging and try to get you a quality, accurate response ASAP.

Doc: this is exactly why I order in bulk. My last order a couple of weeks ago was for 50 cans: 3 logs and a bunch of individual cans. I'm hoping that we can establish a network here, group buys or similar, so we can help each other get snus at a reasonable cost. Post up and see if anyone wants to split an order, or shoot a PM if you don't want to post about it.

I used to before I deployed.  You can't find that shit anywhere around here.

I'd bet it is something that isn't studied, and if it is, not in detail with good sample groups.

Probably get somebody published if they did a research study. Either it's a great product and would see wild popularity increases, or the swedes have a reduced risk of cancer. Either way results would be interesting.

Both/either of those conclusions would be pretty amazing.

From my last post... Jacs Strong Classic is out of stock right now supposedly because of
manufacturing issues. I ordered a roll along with a couple others from
Mysnus awhile ago but not sure what I'm gonna get. Ordered on the 13th
and hadn't heard anything from them re shipping and no replys to my
emails until I sent a WTF note yesterday. "Nobody else has it in
stock,if you don't either, send Jacs Melon instead...But just F-ing send
it!" It shipped today. They're cheaper than both SC and Buysnus but they've had issues in the past. I wouldn't place a huge order with them.





ETA Just got the confirmation. They're sending Melon,don't have the Classic Strong in stock. why didn't they just say so?"





Exact same thing happened to another guy at Snuson though he did get an email saying it was out of stock when he asked. As soon as he told them to substitute the Jacs Classic with something else they shipped immediately. Their main issue is communication,they're terrible about answering emails. Plus they should take out of stock items off their "In stock" list. My other orders with them have all shipped within 48 hrs. I'll continue to use them because of the prices but don't expect to chat with them.
 
 

Reading fail on my part, plz accept apologies. In reading your post, somehow MySnus morphed into BuySnus in my brain.

While I'm researching the answers to tex's questions about international cancer studies, and also those not conducted solely on Swedes, I was reminded of something I heard (then read more) about certain genetic immunities. I watched a History Channel program on the Black Death about a genetic mutation that granted some folks immunity, and did some digging on the Interwebs.

A cool conversational branch-out from your idea about Swedes having some genetic immunity to potentially negative consequences as they relate to snus use is very interesting to me. The concept reminds me a lot of the Village of Eyam (pronounced Eem) in England. Long story short: in 1665, Eyam gets hit by bubonic plague. The villagers there chose to isolate themselves, rather than allowing outsiders and commerce which would aid in the spread of the disease. Despite many members of this village dying of plague, as one would expect, a surprisingly large number survived, despite having been related to victims and would have been active in their care and then disposal of the body.

In 2000, researchers tracked down descendants of the people of Eyam and looked for any mutations they might have in common to explain this high survival rate. The common link they found was a mutation in the CCR5 gene called CCR5-Delta 32, effective if passed down by both parents.

HIV and Smallpox are also thwarted by CCR5-Delta 32.

I guess the point here is simply that I agree with tex and Burnsy, and it would be incredible if there is a "safe snus" gene. Similarly awesome would be proof of snus harm reduction outside of Sweden's genetic makeup. Either (or both) would make me very happy.

FYI: it appears that this specific gene mutation is mainly seen in whites with Northern Euro in their bloodlines. Incidences of African, American Indian or Eastern Asian persons with this mutation are very rare. Source.

Sorry for the boring ass history lesson, but it's not often I get the opportunity to theorize on shit like this.

General Smokey Oak I found to be quite enjojable.  It definitely has a more natural flavor that I seem to prefer. The hints of oak where a plesant addition to the natrual flavor.
Nick & Johnny Extra Strong Mint White Portion was ok but not really for me.  Their Americana has been much better.  Its stronger and the mild cherry flavor is more paleteable for me, and though ill finish the can I'm stil not sure that I like any of the flavored snus.

I tried some odins extreme los this morning. It's strong as shit! Didn't taste very good though. I put a pinch in while drinking my coffee so I didn't taste it at first. After the 3rd pinch, I thought it tasted pretty bad. I'm ok with using as a "breakfast" snuff along with my coffee though. I still have the white and vanilla portions to try.

I like pouches and like wintergreen...what do you all recommend?

1)  I've tried it.  It's not bad.  It wasn't enough for me to quit cigs.

2)  Vaping was what got me off of cigs.

3)  Whatever works to get you off of cigs.  Try both, at the same time if you must.  But cigs suck.  And are expensive.

I finished my can of Smoky Oak the other day. You and I are in agreement on that snus, the flavor is natural and I think it's very balanced. No single flavor takes over, there's a perfect blend of the tobacco itself, some salt, campfire/wood smoke and peat. I won't keep it around all the time, but it's made the JV team as a role player coming off the bench. That Americana looks like an interesting one, and reviews on it seem to be mixed. The majority opinion indicates this one as an occasional. I saw a couple reviews that suggested this snus as one to enjoy while you're drinking pop - would you agree?



Haha, I've heard that Oden's strong stuff is STRONG - a breakfast snus like you said, or a mid-afternoon ass kicker to knock you out of a lunch coma. How would you describe the flavor going on here, what do you taste? The taste description on SC makes it sound like a traditional, General-type snus with tobacco and citrus/bergamot and salt. Would you agree with that assessment? I believe you're a big fan of the Skruf Stark lös - how would you compare the flavor of that snus vs. the General? SC gives the Skruf lös a flavor profile of tobacco, bergamot and rose oil. Do you taste the rose oil?



If I want wintergreen, I'm reaching for Jakobsson's Wintergreen Strong. If you're coming from American style wintergreen dip pouches, Jakobsson's is the most natural bridge in taste and effect. You can get it from Northerner, which ships from the US, which should save you a bunch of cash. General also makes a wintergreen flavor, but I strongly dislike it because it tastes artificial and unnatural. I have not tried the wintergreen offerings from Thunder, Offroad or Oden's.

This right here. Every day, and twice on Sunday.

Ok, so I'm sitting on my deck right now smoking while reading this thread. Yall have sparked my interest in this whole thing, and I'm willing to give it a try. I can handle my dip when I'm sol on smokes and have to steal a pinch from a coworker.

I enjoy some of the minty stuff, and a peach skoal (from a female coworker hahaha) every now and then. What would you guys recommend? I smoke camel lights, and enjoy cigars every couple of months too. There's a store down the road that sells general products. Are they worth a shit, or should I place an order with one of the companies listed on here?

The General stuff is absolutely worth it. General is the snus equivalent of Coca-Cola, in that it is the most recognizable brand and that it is considered to be very high quality by the great majority of snusers. If you like mint, try the General Mint - round can, blue stripe. It's a regular strength white portion, with good flavor and nic hit. If the store has it, also pick up a can of General White Portion - round can, silver ring. General White is regular strength, and a great representation of the "classic" Swedish snus flavor: tobacco, citrus/bergamot, and salt. It's not syrupy or sweet like American dip.

If the store has them, give General Original Portion and General lös a shot also. Very similar flavor profiles for General White, General Original and General lös.

If you like one or more of those, then I'd say think about ordering from one of the websites. Check the store websites for product descriptions, read the customer reviews and check in here for opinions if you'd like them. There are some quality posters here who have tried a bunch of snuses, and I'm sure would be happy to chime in!

Thank you for the advice! I'll pick up a couple tins on the way home from work tomorrow. I don't like the super fine cut stuff so I'll probably be sticking with the pouches for now.

To lay it out straight, I have found no long term cancer studies conducted on people of non-Nordic descent who use Swedish snus.

In Sweden, an estimated 20% of males, and 4% of females, use Swedish snus. Combined, those numbers put the country at the top of the list of smokeless tobacco users per capita. However, instances of oral cancers there are reported to be among the lowest on the planet. Do the Swedes know something the rest of the world doesn't? Are they superior tobacconists whose artisans hold hostage the secret formula? Is Sweden populated by genetically superior individuals, allowing them to have all the fun while simultaneously telling Death himself to fuck off?  

Some of the longer-term Nordic studies have issues with consistency and controls, mixing data between those who use only snus, those who snus and smoke, those who quit smoking and use snus, etc. Playing mixup with statistical data like this should erode any trust in the results of the study. The biggest constant in the overwhelming majority of all studies is that people who smoke, or did at one time, are far more likely to develop cancers than people who never used tobacco, or those who have only used snus. Cancer stats for the total abstention groups effectively mirror those of the snus only groups in most research. Further, it is commonly believed by researchers that snus is 90-99% safer to use than cigarettes.

I urge everyone to read the article Snus and Health in its entirety. Click all of the links on the left, and any links in the page bodies. This is an "open book" on how Swedish Match works, the processes it uses, and the science behind the snus. I would challenge anyone to point to a more transparent report on a tobacco company's processes and products. GOTHIATEK should be the standard by which consumers and other tobacco companies judge their tobacco.

This is an excellent article on the dangers of Swedish snus, or lack thereof. It was written by Dr. Brad Rodu, Professor of Medicine and Endowed Chair of Tobacco Harm Reduction Research at the University of Louisville. This link leads to numerous articles written by Dr. Rodu about snus, health, and tobacco harm reduction.

The most comprehensive information I've come across is from the ENVIRON report, a thorough and exhaustive assessment of all scientific peer-reviewed studies on Swedish snus dating to December 31, 2009. The results indicate what we've been told: Swedish snus is probably the safest tobacco product in the world, and is not a contributing factor to cancer, nor does it stunt the healing of broken bones, for example, like cigarettes do. This is particularly important to me, as I am probably going to need surgery to fuse some of the lower vertebrae in my spine. As noted in this post just up the page, more recent studies have debunked the myth that snus increases the risk of pancreatic cancer in users.

Other studies claim to be about snus, like this one, but are not snus studies at all. The study linked appears to be about users of Naswar (or nas/nass), a smokeless tobacco common in eastern Asia that is placed in the lower lip or cheek. Naswar is typically made of sun and heat cured tobaccos, and includes slaked lime (calcium hydroxide), both of which increase naswar's carcinogenic potential.

So, about those questions on the superiority of the Swedes...

Do they know something the rest of the world doesn't? No. While it is true the snus originated in 18th century Sweden, companies in other countries have picked up the snus banner as well. V2 Tobacco in Denmark is an excellent example. V2 produces the popular Thunder and Offroad snuses, as well as budget-brand Phantom. Additionally, they produce SnusX, a DIY snus and related tools for those who wish to be involved in the production of their preferred tobacco.

Are they superior tobacconists who hold the secret formula? Yes and no. Yes, I believe that the Swedes do produce a tobacco product superior to any other on the market in terms of quality, flavor, and applied scientific research. They source their tobacco globally, but most of the magic happens in the factories in Sweden. However, as noted above, V2 Tobacco is also a major player in the snus game, so Sweden cannot claim to be the only company with the recipe.

I would like to note that, while multiple Scandinavian countries do produce snus, Swedish companies like Swedish Match and Gotlandssnus produce products that are mainly aimed at their home market, whose users prefer more traditionally Swedish flavors. In my opinion, V2 Tobacco has concentrated on producing snus that aims to please the palettes of American smokeless tobacco users who are more accustomed to the intense and powerful flavors found in dip. Far and away, I prefer the approach taken by Swedish Match, but taste is subjective and unique to each snuser.

What about that genetic superiority thing? I have not seen any evidence that would indicate that Swedes are coded to be better than the rest of the world. However, it must be pointed out that, overall, the standard of living in Sweden is higher than most countries. Diets are healthier, more people exercise regularly, the air is cleaner, and stress levels are lower. That all leads to a better quality of life, lower instances of disease, and longer life expectancy. Comparing the most recent data, from 2012, Americans can expect to live 78.74 years on average. Swedes enjoy a life expectancy of 81.7 years. Nobody can tell Death to fuck off completely, but it seems as though Swedes do a much better job of avoiding him.

I hope that this post has answered some questions about the safety of snus and the level of truth in the harm reduction claims about it. In true ARFCOM fashion, I encourage you to post up any questions, concerns or thoughts you have about any of this. Thanks for reading!

I will try to describe it as best I can. I had a friend from Georgia turn me on to some stuff called liquid smoke that Publix sold. You use it to season meats before you grill them. I guess it's mostly for use with gas grills to add flavor. Well, it tastes like that! Smoke! It's a hard flavor to describe. It starts off strong and smokey and leaves a smokey taste in your mouth after. I'm getting more use to it as I go through the can. I imagine the high nic content is probably the reason it tastes like it does. I will say it's growing on me. I'll probably keep a can around. It doesn't compare to anything else I've tasted. Maybe Grov, but way stronger. I don't taste the general saltiness, rose oil, or anything else for that matter. It straight up tastes like tobacco and smoke. I wouldn't say it even compares to a maduro cigar, which is what I smoke. Skruf los is a smooth tobacco flavor and doesn't compare in any way in my opinion. Odins packs well, stays well, and is strong so it's not bad. I just wouldn't order a roll of it first. I'd get a single can. If you make it to the end of it, it may be for you. Took about 5 pinches to finally get use to the taste.

I'd have to taste rose oil and bergamot on their own so I could identify these tastes in the tobacco. It may be unfortunate, but I'm pulling most of my "tobacco" comparisons from copenhagen or levi garret. Both of those taste a close to tobacco as I could imagine. Sfruf los to me, taste as close as you could get to that. The skruf portions I can taste some citrus, but it's light. The general los offerings are second. More salty, but most delicious. Grov and Ettan would be third. Also very delicious. I am finding that portions do cut down on some of the flavors, but not much. Onyx is delicious, however, I don't get the hype. I'm not much of a fan of flavored tobacco, but I am waiting on some Skruf cranberry today to try.

Good write up above as usual! Gave me a few more hours of "homework" to do.

Bergamot is a type of orange,adds the mild citrus flavor. Rose oil I can't say what it would taste like as I've never been able to pick it out of the other flavors in Skruf.

Skruf cranberry is different. Can't say it tastes much like cranberry but there is kind of a sweet banana flavor at first.

 
I second this recommendation.

Ok, so I ended up getting the General mint and white. After looking at the can for a bit I said fuck it, why not? Initial reaction was to almost spit it out because of the salty flavor and weird taste. I thought to myself "what the fuck did those assholes tell me to put in my mouth!" Stuck with it for a couple of min, and its really not half bad! I kinda almost like it! I'll check back in later with an update on the mint when I try that.

Nick & Johnny Americana actually kinda grew on me by the time I finished the can.  The mild cherry flavor is actually quite nice and the it has a little more kick to it then some of the other snus I've tried so far.

Now I only have two more cans from my original order that I haven't tried so I'm hoping to find a decent sale here fairly quick so I can order another batch.