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Posted: 4/20/2014 5:27:15 PM EST
[#1]
Dude you are on ARF. Chances are a third of the guys here would struggle to count to potato.
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Posted: 4/20/2014 5:27:17 PM EST
[#2]
Because it is prophetic
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Posted: 4/20/2014 5:27:39 PM EST
[#3]
I like both, but agree The Fountainhead was better.
There is a certain scene in the book that seems to turn a lot of people off to the book, I'm guessing you know which one. |
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Posted: 4/20/2014 5:28:43 PM EST
[#4]
I agree.
ETA: 
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Posted: 4/20/2014 5:29:24 PM EST
[#5]
Fountainhead was better
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Posted: 4/20/2014 5:29:24 PM EST
[#6]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I like both, but agree The Fountainhead was better. There is a certain scene in the book that seems to turn a lot of people off to the book, I'm guessing you know which one. Hell, I liked We the Living better than any of the others, at least it was short, comparatively speaking that is. |
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Posted: 4/20/2014 5:29:55 PM EST
[#7]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Dude you are on ARF. Chances are a third of the guys here would struggle to count to potato. Many here will talk about "going galt" and hold up Ayn Rand as their libertarian/conservative intellectual inspiration. As a young kid, reading the Fountainhead shaped the way I looked at the world, myself, other people, government, and society. |
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Posted: 4/20/2014 5:30:05 PM EST
[#8]
I have read one but not the other. I'll get back to you when I have finished the 2nd.
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Posted: 4/20/2014 5:31:36 PM EST
[#9]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Because it is prophetic Sad but true 
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Posted: 4/20/2014 5:32:12 PM EST
[#10]
If that was her best I would hate to read her worst.
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Posted: 4/20/2014 5:32:46 PM EST
[#11]
Because so many on arfcom have trouble stringing more then one or two words together in a coherent sentence that when someone writes a book with a 50 page speech it blows their minds.
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Posted: 4/20/2014 5:34:46 PM EST
[#12]
Because many folks fancy themselves George Washington, but war is scary and hard work.
So they leap at the opportunity to "Go Galt" which is basically the lazy cowards version of that. |
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Posted: 4/20/2014 5:38:23 PM EST
[#13]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Because many folks fancy themselves George Washington, but war is scary and hard work. So they leap at the opportunity to "Go Galt" which is basically the lazy cowards version of that. Yeah. Wait, no. Maybe. Anthem was her best work, then Fountainhead, then AS. |
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Posted: 4/20/2014 5:39:11 PM EST
[#14]
Personally I think AS flows better (yes I just said that out loud), and is the more relevant work, as is it expresses
objectivism on the societal, rather than just the personal level. TF is " here's what I believe", AS is "here's why it matters, to me you, & everyone else". |
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Posted: 4/20/2014 5:49:44 PM EST
[#15]
I think Rand was spot on for many things....and not even In the same universe for others.
An intelligent woman....who was jaded and without compassion in my opinion. But spot on with personal liberty. |
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Posted: 4/20/2014 5:56:51 PM EST
[#16]
Because she said so.
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Posted: 4/20/2014 6:01:37 PM EST
[#17]
Let's be honest and admit that it's a terrible read. As is Fountainhead (although it is better).
The reason it's so popular is because of people born into money and a family business who put "who is John Galt" stickers on the back of their Harley F-150s or Escalades. |
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Posted: 4/20/2014 6:02:44 PM EST
[#18]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Because many folks fancy themselves George Washington, but war is scary and hard work. So they leap at the opportunity to "Go Galt" which is basically the lazy cowards version of that. I believe I have read you stating that Galt is a bitch. Yup.
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Posted: 4/20/2014 6:04:46 PM EST
[#19]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I think Rand was spot on for many things....and not even In the same universe for others. An intelligent woman....who was jaded and had a rape fetish. But spot on with personal liberty. Fixed it for you!
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Posted: 4/20/2014 6:09:23 PM EST
[#20]
Not a fan of hers by any stretch, but I did like TF better than AS (the only two I have read, and many years ago in both cases).
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Posted: 4/20/2014 6:09:29 PM EST
[#21]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Let's be honest and admit that it's a terrible read. As is Fountainhead (although it is better). The reason it's so popular is because of people born into money and a family business who put "who is John Galt" stickers on the back of their Harley F-150s or Escalades. Holy shit that's a lot of fail in one post. |
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Posted: 4/20/2014 6:10:10 PM EST
[#22]
Because it was anti-communist and came out shortly after the Red Scare.
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Posted: 4/20/2014 6:12:40 PM EST
[#23]
Quoted:
I just re read Atlas Shrugged for the first time in ten years, and have almost finished The Fountainhead. Atlas Shrugged is crude compared to The Fountainhead. The story, the characters, the messages in AS are caricatures compared to TF. Howard Roark and Dominique's battles are far more subtle and Ellsworth Toohey is a far more insipid and destructive force than the simple forces at play in AS. Reading both these books in my childhood I didn't see such a discrepancy. Reading them again as an adult I do not understand why The Fountainhead is not considered Ayn Rand's magnum opus. This was bothering me today. Discuss. Fountainhead was better imo too. |
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Posted: 4/20/2014 6:14:13 PM EST
[#24]
what Rand needed was a good editor. Atlas Shrugged would have worked as an 80 page novella and had more impact.
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Posted: 4/20/2014 6:15:12 PM EST
[#25]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Because many folks fancy themselves George Washington, but war is scary and hard work. So they leap at the opportunity to "Go Galt" which is basically the lazy cowards version of that. Go Ace? |
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Posted: 4/20/2014 6:16:58 PM EST
[#26]
Because Atlas Shugged is twice the size as The Fountainhead.... idk.
If I'm not mistaken, Rand herself considered it her own masterpiece. |
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Posted: 4/20/2014 6:17:26 PM EST
[#27]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Holy shit that's a lot of fail in one post. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Let's be honest and admit that it's a terrible read. As is Fountainhead (although it is better). The reason it's so popular is because of people born into money and a family business who put "who is John Galt" stickers on the back of their Harley F-150s or Escalades. Holy shit that's a lot of fail in one post. I'm not saying that she's wrong, I just think her writing was lousy. |
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Posted: 4/20/2014 6:17:56 PM EST
[#28]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
what Rand needed was a good editor. Atlas Shrugged would have worked as an 80 page novella and had more impact. But how could you fit a 60-70 page speech into an 80 page book? 
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Posted: 4/20/2014 6:18:38 PM EST
[#29]
It might not be her best work (needs an editor like a mofo) but it is her Magnum Opus.
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Posted: 4/20/2014 6:20:42 PM EST
[#30]
I don't even care which book of hers is best, I'd just like people in America today to turn off the iPhone/tv and read a book. Then go a step further and set down the Stephen King/super market checkout novels, or Dreams of My Father/Audacity Of Hope and try reading something where the author has not appeared on The View or John Stewart Show.
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Posted: 4/20/2014 6:23:40 PM EST
[#31]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Let's be honest and admit that it's a terrible read. As is Fountainhead (although it is better). The reason it's so popular is because of people born into money and a family business who put "who is John Galt" stickers on the back of their Harley F-150s or Escalades. You do realize your post makes absolutely no sense considering John Galt was not born into money, nor was he by any means "rich" in the book. Hank Reardon too for that matter did not come from money but amassed his own empire. You probably also think that greed is a bad word. |
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Posted: 4/20/2014 6:28:36 PM EST
[#32]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
You do realize your post makes absolutely no sense considering John Galt was not born into money, nor was he by any means "rich" in the book. Hank Reardon too for that matter did not come from money but amassed his own empire. You probably also think that greed is a bad word. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Let's be honest and admit that it's a terrible read. As is Fountainhead (although it is better). The reason it's so popular is because of people born into money and a family business who put "who is John Galt" stickers on the back of their Harley F-150s or Escalades. You do realize your post makes absolutely no sense considering John Galt was not born into money, nor was he by any means "rich" in the book. Hank Reardon too for that matter did not come from money but amassed his own empire. You probably also think that greed is a bad word. These are the type of people who put John Galt stickers on their vehicles. I know a few and I think it's hilarious. I've read the fountainhead and atlas shrugged and both were bad. I honestly do not know why people think she was a good writer. |
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Posted: 4/20/2014 6:29:43 PM EST
[#33]
Quote HistoryQuoted: You do realize your post makes absolutely no sense considering John Galt was not born into money, nor was he by any means "rich" in the book. Hank Reardon too for that matter did not come from money but amassed his own empire. You probably also think that greed is a bad word. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Let's be honest and admit that it's a terrible read. As is Fountainhead (although it is better). The reason it's so popular is because of people born into money and a family business who put "who is John Galt" stickers on the back of their Harley F-150s or Escalades. You do realize your post makes absolutely no sense considering John Galt was not born into money, nor was he by any means "rich" in the book. Hank Reardon too for that matter did not come from money but amassed his own empire. You probably also think that greed is a bad word. I think he's talking about children of privilege latching onto the lip service of Rand/Objectivism as a form of "rebelling" against their parents without actually embracing or understanding it... all while still enjoying the trappings of their privilege. It happens, I've seen it myself. |
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Posted: 4/20/2014 6:30:21 PM EST
[#34]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I'm not saying that she's wrong, I just think her writing was lousy. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Let's be honest and admit that it's a terrible read. As is Fountainhead (although it is better). The reason it's so popular is because of people born into money and a family business who put "who is John Galt" stickers on the back of their Harley F-150s or Escalades. Holy shit that's a lot of fail in one post. I'm not saying that she's wrong, I just think her writing was lousy. Lotta truth in his post. |
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Posted: 4/20/2014 6:32:40 PM EST
[#35]
Atlas Shrugged is terrible. It has an exceedingly simple point, that could have been easily (and likely more effectively) communicated in a book the size of Fountainhead, but instead the book is a long and boring (and often poorly written) self-indulgent exercise on the part of Ayn Rand. If she was an excellent writer, that would have been okay, but she is not.
Because many of her fans/followers/cultists are so enamored with her, they convince themselves that it MUST be good, instead of looking at her works objectively (get it?  ), and admitting to themselves that Atlas Shrugged is unnecessarily long, boring and poorly written.
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Posted: 4/20/2014 6:34:12 PM EST
[#36]
Why is anything she did considered great work?
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Posted: 4/20/2014 6:34:56 PM EST
[#37]
I read the Fountainhead and enjoyed it, minus the rapey part. I have Atlas Shrugged in the queue.
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Posted: 4/20/2014 6:35:52 PM EST
[#38]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I think he's talking about children of privilege latching onto the lip service of Rand/Objectivism as a form of "rebelling" against their parents without actually embracing or understanding it... all while still enjoying the trappings of their privilege. It happens, I've seen it myself. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Let's be honest and admit that it's a terrible read. As is Fountainhead (although it is better). The reason it's so popular is because of people born into money and a family business who put "who is John Galt" stickers on the back of their Harley F-150s or Escalades. You do realize your post makes absolutely no sense considering John Galt was not born into money, nor was he by any means "rich" in the book. Hank Reardon too for that matter did not come from money but amassed his own empire. You probably also think that greed is a bad word. I think he's talking about children of privilege latching onto the lip service of Rand/Objectivism as a form of "rebelling" against their parents without actually embracing or understanding it... all while still enjoying the trappings of their privilege. It happens, I've seen it myself. meh. I guess I just don't see it. |
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Posted: 4/20/2014 6:38:29 PM EST
[#39]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Why is anything she did considered great work? Gotta look at the era in which her stuff was written. The Fountainhead was released in 1943, when the west had just begun to understand and encounter socialism. |
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Posted: 4/20/2014 6:39:35 PM EST
[#40]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Dude you are on ARF. Chances are a third of the guys here would struggle to count to potato. Uh... Tomato? |
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Posted: 4/20/2014 6:40:01 PM EST
[#41]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I don't even care which book of hers is best, I'd just like people in America today to turn off the iPhone/tv and read a book. Then go a step further and set down the Stephen King/super market checkout novels, or Dreams of My Father/Audacity Of Hope and try reading something where the author has not appeared on The View or John Stewart Show. You're either joking, or you haven't seen Rand's various appearances on Johnny Carson, Phil Donahue, Tom Snyder, Mike Wallace, etc., etc., back in her day (when there were far fewer such shows, I'll add). The only thing keeping her off Jon Stewart or the View is six feet of dirt.
 |
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Posted: 4/20/2014 6:42:06 PM EST
[#42]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
You're either joking, or you haven't seen Rand's various appearances on Johnny Carson, Phil Donahue, Tom Snyder, Mike Wallace, etc., etc., back in her day (when there were far fewer such shows, I'll add). The only thing keeping her off Jon Stewart or the View is six feet of dirt.
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
I don't even care which book of hers is best, I'd just like people in America today to turn off the iPhone/tv and read a book. Then go a step further and set down the Stephen King/super market checkout novels, or Dreams of My Father/Audacity Of Hope and try reading something where the author has not appeared on The View or John Stewart Show. You're either joking, or you haven't seen Rand's various appearances on Johnny Carson, Phil Donahue, Tom Snyder, Mike Wallace, etc., etc., back in her day (when there were far fewer such shows, I'll add). The only thing keeping her off Jon Stewart or the View is six feet of dirt.
shhhh |
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Posted: 4/20/2014 6:44:10 PM EST
[#43]
I have only read Anthem and I absolutely loved it!
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Posted: 4/20/2014 6:44:36 PM EST
[#44]
Quoted: I just re read Atlas Shrugged for the first time in ten years, and have almost finished The Fountainhead. Atlas Shrugged is crude compared to The Fountainhead. The story, the characters, the messages in AS are caricatures compared to TF. Howard Roark and Dominique's battles are far more subtle and Ellsworth Toohey is a far more insipid and destructive force than the simple forces at play in AS. Reading both these books in my childhood I didn't see such a discrepancy. Reading them again as an adult I do not understand why The Fountainhead is not considered Ayn Rand's magnum opus. This was bothering me today. Discuss. just kidding I read all of her books
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Posted: 4/20/2014 6:56:33 PM EST
[#45]
Objectivism isn't a philosophy. It fails in that regard.
Atlas Shrugged was awful. The characters were flat and two dimensional. The writing was way too verbose. Hopefully, hewn from herp Ayn Randian "philosophy", and it's tautological emptiness, will become completely irrelevant. |
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Posted: 4/20/2014 6:58:43 PM EST
[#46]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Atlas Shrugged is terrible. It has an exceedingly simple point, that could have been easily (and likely more effectively) communicated in a book the size of Fountainhead, but instead the book is a long and boring (and often poorly written) self-indulgent exercise on the part of Ayn Rand. If she was an excellent writer, that would have been okay, but she is not. Because many of her fans/followers/cultists are so enamored with her, they convince themselves that it MUST be good, instead of looking at her works objectively (get it? ), and admitting to themselves that Atlas Shrugged is unnecessarily long, boring and poorly written.
It could have been done as a short story. John Galt's "BIG SPEECH" was painful to read. |
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Posted: 4/20/2014 7:18:41 PM EST
[#47]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Atlas Shrugged is terrible. It has an exceedingly simple point, that could have been easily (and likely more effectively) communicated in a book the size of Fountainhead, but instead the book is a long and boring (and often poorly written) self-indulgent exercise on the part of Ayn Rand. If she was an excellent writer, that would have been okay, but she is not. Because many of her fans/followers/cultists are so enamored with her, they convince themselves that it MUST be good, instead of looking at her works objectively (get it? ), and admitting to themselves that Atlas Shrugged is unnecessarily long, boring and poorly written.
The story had its moments. I think it could have been edited to about 60% of its length and been much better, but a good part of it was devoted to the various enablers and hangers-on that corrupt government one part at a time. The stuff with the death ray could go, along with ninety percent of Galt's speech and the stuff about Reardon's wife. A few of the other characters in the beginning disappeared later. They could be omitted. The whole Dagney is in love with Francisco D'Anconia, no Dagney is in love with Hank Rearden, no Dagney is in love with John Galt routine fits into The Kids In The Hall skit when they robbed the bank. But, she was also dealing with the sexual mores of the day, and I think it did take a while to make the point about the sanction of the victim. It's true that welfare exists largely because of feelings of guilt, and the implications of those feelings are worth exploring. We're watching it happen now. It reads like several of the chapters of Atlas Shrugged. Didn't the U.S. Navy just name an LCS after Emma Chalmers, er, Gabrielle Giffords? |
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Posted: 4/20/2014 7:25:19 PM EST
[#48]
BTW, I forgot which government department Cuffy Meigs operated. I think it was the one that just bought a few million rounds of ammunition.
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Posted: 4/20/2014 7:31:14 PM EST
[#49]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Atlas Shrugged is terrible. It has an exceedingly simple point, that could have been easily (and likely more effectively) communicated in a book the size of Fountainhead, but instead the book is a long and boring (and often poorly written) self-indulgent exercise on the part of Ayn Rand. If she was an excellent writer, that would have been okay, but she is not. Because many of her fans/followers/cultists are so enamored with her, they convince themselves that it MUST be good, instead of looking at her works objectively (get it? ), and admitting to themselves that Atlas Shrugged is unnecessarily long, boring and poorly written.
I like you. I don't care what that goose says. |
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Posted: 4/20/2014 7:38:35 PM EST
[#50]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
You're either joking, or you haven't seen Rand's various appearances on Johnny Carson, Phil Donahue, Tom Snyder, Mike Wallace, etc., etc., back in her day (when there were far fewer such shows, I'll add). The only thing keeping her off Jon Stewart or the View is six feet of dirt.
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
I don't even care which book of hers is best, I'd just like people in America today to turn off the iPhone/tv and read a book. Then go a step further and set down the Stephen King/super market checkout novels, or Dreams of My Father/Audacity Of Hope and try reading something where the author has not appeared on The View or John Stewart Show. You're either joking, or you haven't seen Rand's various appearances on Johnny Carson, Phil Donahue, Tom Snyder, Mike Wallace, etc., etc., back in her day (when there were far fewer such shows, I'll add). The only thing keeping her off Jon Stewart or the View is six feet of dirt.
I guess my point was not made correctly. I was suggesting value in something not of modern pop culture. It was more of a frustrated reaction to the ignorant modern voter. My apologies for the confusion. And yes I've seen her interviews on youtube. I wasn't around back then though ;) edit: I don't believe she would be on any modern talk show. Not because it is super sophisticated, but just doesn't seem like typical modern late night TV. *shrug* I could be wrong. Either way I'll take objectivism over communism, socialism or theism any day. The mind of man is real the rest is idealism and dreams. |
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