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Posted: 9/10/2018 9:37:26 AM EDT
[#1]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
nvm Powder is bought in large casks at places that load ammo. That powder is likely similar to commercially packaged powers but is NOT the same. They then work up loads with that powder before loading vast sums of ammo. Hornaday doesn't load pussy ammo. Buy their 5.56 and shoot it in tighter chambered 223s and you will get poped primers. I had it happen. Not saying that this happened to the op. Those cases are ass out bada bing pressure. |
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Posted: 9/10/2018 9:37:48 AM EDT
[#2]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I concur. Primer pocket blow out, and case heads look  |
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Posted: 9/10/2018 9:44:01 AM EDT
[#3]
Wow...in for the results.
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Posted: 9/10/2018 9:45:07 AM EDT
[#4]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Another picture of a spent case up close. https://www.AR15.Com/media/mediaFiles/126115/20180909_221036-666954.JPG |
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Posted: 9/10/2018 9:48:29 AM EDT
[#5]
Thanks for the heads up OP.
Will keep an eye on here. |
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Posted: 9/10/2018 9:54:29 AM EDT
[#6]
OST for Hornady's response.
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Posted: 9/10/2018 9:55:42 AM EDT
[#7]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
In before it's because piston guns "shit where they eat." |
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Posted: 9/10/2018 9:57:00 AM EDT
[#8]
I don't reload, so I'm not about to disassemble a round. if someone was local in W. PA or E. OH, I would be more than happy to bring a few rounds to be pulled and checked.
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Posted: 9/10/2018 9:57:44 AM EDT
[#9]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
i know but is it really worth it? |
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Posted: 9/10/2018 9:58:09 AM EDT
[#10]
tag for followup with manufacture
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Posted: 9/10/2018 10:11:11 AM EDT
[#11]
wow
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Posted: 9/10/2018 10:17:20 AM EDT
[#12]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Here are a few empty cases we found after the Kaboom.https://www.AR15.Com/media/mediaFiles/126115/20180909_215804-666944.JPG Chance number two to stop shooting the ammo... Chance number three to stop shooting the ammo . Chance number four to stop shooting the ammo . Chance number Kaboom. I have only seen one kaboom but there were signs that something was wrong and with those primers being blown out that is a huge sign the ammo is over charged. I am glad you friend is okay but send those cart and the ammo back and ask for a replacement AR. The ammo manufacturer really screwed the Pooh on those carts |
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Posted: 9/10/2018 10:23:53 AM EDT
[#13]
Hornady loads it ammo pretty warm.
Some of the 30-30 ammo will throw out bullets almost as fast 300 savage. |
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Posted: 9/10/2018 10:33:15 AM EDT
[#14]
 Attached FileI had some Hornady 300 Whisper/300BLK 110 grain Vmax do the same thing. This was the worst one but probably one out of every 20 blew the primer. 1 out of 2 deformed the rim enough that it wouldn't fit into a shell holder. |
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Posted: 9/10/2018 10:41:42 AM EDT
[#15]
I have several thousand rounds of Frontier loaded 75 gr BTHP ammo from years ago. It was some stuff loaded up for the High Power guys and was loaded on LC or some foreign brass. It'll pop primers or have a case head separation in anything other than a 5.56 chamber. It doesn't even like my Wylde chambers.
I shoot it in a Mossberg MVP now. Don't want to deal with it in my ARs. 
CHRIS |
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Posted: 9/10/2018 10:45:55 AM EDT
[#16]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I have several thousand rounds of Frontier loaded 75 gr BTHP ammo from years ago. It was some stuff loaded up for the High Power guys and was loaded on LC or some foreign brass. It'll pop primers or have a case head separation in anything other than a 5.56 chamber. It doesn't even like my Wylde chambers.
I shoot it in a Mossberg MVP now. Don't want to deal with it in my ARs.
CHRIS 
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Posted: 9/10/2018 10:50:09 AM EDT
[#17]
This archived thread seems relevant: https://www.ar15.com/forums/ar-15/-ARCHIVED-THREAD----Extraction-problem-w--POF-P-415-16-P9X---questions/66-346072/?page=1
edited to add: or this one: https://www.ar15.com/forums/ar-15/-/66-339212/?page=1 |
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Posted: 9/10/2018 10:53:29 AM EDT
[#18]
OP and his friends are having the same issue when fired from a Stag rifle too.
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Posted: 9/10/2018 10:56:14 AM EDT
[#19]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I don’t know how much reloading you guys do, but I would say it was more likely UNDER charged instead of over charged with powder. I’ve experimented with loading 5.56 nearly up to the neck with powder, compressing the powder with the bullet when seating, and never once had any problems other than a slightly flatter than normal primer. However, when experimenting with subsonic loads, I undercharged one that really went kaboom (in a controlled environment for the purpose of testing). From what I know, too little powder is far more dangerous and causes detonation than too much powder IN .223/5.56 AT LEAST due to the case design, it’s pretty much designed to be filled up dang near to the top. |
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Posted: 9/10/2018 10:57:48 AM EDT
[#20]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Here are a few empty cases we found after the Kaboom.https://www.AR15.Com/media/mediaFiles/126115/20180909_215804-666944.JPG |
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Posted: 9/10/2018 11:06:41 AM EDT
[#21]
Quote HistoryQuoted: While I don't think that's the issue here, I remember back in the day people were blowing up cowboy revolvers due to this issue (super-soft, downloaded loads) in .38 spl. and 45 lc. The issue, if I remember correctly, was there was so little powder in the case, that it all settled at the 'bottom' of the case (long east-west, the position it would be in when the gun was held in a shooting position), and, when the powder ignited, it didn't burn correctly / consistently, from the back to the front of the case, like would normally be encountered with a case full or mostly full of powder, and caused KBs. |
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Posted: 9/10/2018 11:18:25 AM EDT
[#22]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Perfect, my work rifle is a POS, i mean POF...fuck eta; cause spelling |
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Posted: 9/10/2018 11:21:22 AM EDT
[#23]
I have never actually seen it in person. Glad that everyone is ok.
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Posted: 9/10/2018 11:24:57 AM EDT
[#24]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Out of curiousity, do you know what the rifle was chambered in? 5.56 or 223? |
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Posted: 9/10/2018 11:33:01 AM EDT
[#25]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Primer indentation on the case head? Is it possible that a blown primer welded itself to bolt face and the gun was firing while not completely locked or OOB? |
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Posted: 9/10/2018 11:44:58 AM EDT
[#26]
That's impressive.
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Posted: 9/10/2018 12:01:16 PM EDT
[#27]
Some things to keep in mind:
We have no evidence the cartridge is "overcharged". Kaboom, blown primers, and strong ejector flow as seen can be caused by: 1. Overcharge 2. Incorrect burn rate of powder 3. Incorrect brass hardness/composition. If the case is annealed improperly this cause cause ejector flow and case failure as well, even with a proper charge level. |
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Posted: 9/10/2018 12:03:13 PM EDT
[#28]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
https://www.AR15.Com/media/mediaFiles/116433/IMG_4128-667190.JPG I had some Hornady 300 Whisper/300BLK 110 grain Vmax do the same thing. This was the worst one but probably one out of every 20 blew the primer. 1 out of 2 deformed the rim enough that it wouldn't fit into a shell holder. |
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Posted: 9/10/2018 12:05:39 PM EDT
[#29]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Some things to keep in mind: We have no evidence the cartridge is "overcharged". Kaboom, blown primers, and strong ejector flow as seen can be caused by: 1. Overcharge 2. Incorrect burn rate of powder 3. Incorrect brass hardness/composition. If the case is annealed improperly this cause cause ejector flow and case failure as well, even with a proper charge level. |
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Posted: 9/10/2018 12:08:39 PM EDT
[#30]
Quote HistoryQuoted: more like the plunger for the extractor is making the mark... |
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Posted: 9/10/2018 12:21:10 PM EDT
[#31]
The bullet and the headstamp are literally the only difference between a run of this stuff and Lake City M193. That’s it. My first thought is something to do with the bullet.
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Posted: 9/10/2018 12:22:21 PM EDT
[#32]
I suppose the alarm sounded.
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Posted: 9/10/2018 12:25:17 PM EDT
[#33]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Move over buffalo bore, Hornady is making everything +++p
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Posted: 9/10/2018 12:26:40 PM EDT
[#34]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
The bullet and the headstamp are literally the only difference between a run of this stuff and Lake City M193. That’s it. My first thought is something to do with the bullet. Clearly wasn't a squib as all of his brass shows severe over pressure signs |
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Posted: 9/10/2018 12:46:25 PM EDT
[#35]
Tagged to check lot # of 500 rounds when I get home tonight.
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Posted: 9/10/2018 12:50:52 PM EDT
[#36]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Hornady isn't afraid to play with pressure. Superformance is some peppy stuff. |
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Posted: 9/10/2018 12:54:59 PM EDT
[#37]
Wow classic over pressure signs.... I start to sweat when I see a little primer flattening in my handloads lol.
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Posted: 9/10/2018 1:24:50 PM EDT
[#38]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Reloaded ammo blows up WAY more guns than Factory ammo does. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Learn to roll your own, unless you're a tard. Chris |
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Posted: 9/10/2018 1:43:13 PM EDT
[#39]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
It depends on whether the reloader is competent or not. I've loaded tens of thousands of rounds over the past 20 plus years with no issues. I can't say the same about factory ammo. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Learn to roll your own, unless you're a tard. Chris |
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Posted: 9/10/2018 1:45:21 PM EDT
[#40]
How many rounds did the upper have through it before the boom?
Never mind, was posted later, less than 1000. |
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Posted: 9/10/2018 2:05:17 PM EDT
[#41]
As someone who's never experienced a blown primer....Is it something that is noticeable while shooting without inspecting the brass? Other than when you kaboom the gun.
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Posted: 9/10/2018 2:06:52 PM EDT
[#42]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Wow. I have 1K rounds that I haven't fired yet. I'm probably not going to use that ammo. |
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Posted: 9/10/2018 2:10:31 PM EDT
[#43]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
As someone who's never experienced a blown primer....Is it something that is noticeable while shooting without inspecting the brass? Other than when you kaboom the gun. |
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Posted: 9/10/2018 2:10:54 PM EDT
[#44]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
It's for bolt guns though. The popped crimped primers sure are an eye opener. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Hornady isn’t afraid to play with pressure. Superformance is some peppy stuff. The popped crimped primers sure are an eye opener. |
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Posted: 9/10/2018 2:13:50 PM EDT
[#45]
An AR15 blew up when I was on the range and someone I know was shooting it. The upper receiver looked like a banana peel, the bolt carrier shattered, the extractor was blown off the bolt, magazine blew off the floor plate and it's sides were blown outward from pressure, but the barrel extension, barrel, lower receiver were fine. The case looked as if someone had EDM machined from the primer straight through the extractor rim of the case.
I contacted the powder manufacturer, and they said that the powder was specifically designed for the Ar15 and done in such a way that it was impossible to fill a case to over pressure. They said I could scoop a case full of as much powder I could get into it, and if I could get a bullet on top, it still wouldn't be over pressure. They asked me to send some rounds for them to examine. Their lab report said it must have been just a 1 in a million bad case. Normal operating pressures should have been 50-60K CUP and the rounds I sent were right about 47K CUP and extremely consistent as in match ammo (which it was). They also said there were no metallurgical issues with the bolt carrier that shattered. I was able to use the barrel and lower for many more years with no problems. Some times stuff just happens, but in OP's case I think he got into a lot of ammo that his rifle didn't like. If Hornady has a pattern of hot loading ammo, it may just be a case where the ammo, and OP's rifle together make pressures that become problematic. I thought that most manufacturers load to lower pressures just to compensate for rifles that may be too weak to handle hot ammo...the 6.5 Swede ammo is a great example. The cartridge can be loaded to higher pressures, but most manufacturers deliberately load the Swede ammo to lower pressures because there are still lots of very old rifles that aren't strong enough to handle pressures that the cartridge is capable of handling. |
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Posted: 9/10/2018 5:33:07 PM EDT
[#46]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Some things to keep in mind: We have no evidence the cartridge is "overcharged". Kaboom, blown primers, and strong ejector flow as seen can be caused by: 1. Overcharge 2. Incorrect burn rate of powder 3. Incorrect brass hardness/composition. If the case is annealed improperly this cause cause ejector flow and case failure as well, even with a proper charge level. Oversize bullets Bullet being pushed into case, sometimes yes sometimes not. Shit primers, to thin of skin, which I know Hornady knows better, but accidents happen. heavier case's than the test rounds had, and started production with them. |
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Posted: 9/10/2018 5:38:01 PM EDT
[#47]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
As someone who's never experienced a blown primer....Is it something that is noticeable while shooting without inspecting the brass? Other than when you kaboom the gun. In a bolt gun you know instantly. |
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Posted: 9/10/2018 5:47:15 PM EDT
[#48]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
The only time I've had a blown primer it was very noticeable as I couldn't pull the trigger for the next shot. Primer had made its way under the FCG preventing the trigger from being pulled. Punctured primers is what I have run into, and no I didn't notice it until I picked up brass, it eats your firing pin tip, which I have had happen to me. Using CCI 400's. But when you run at max pressure cci 400's are not the primer to use , so my fault. I kept my powder charge the same {a popular load with Hornady 55gr fmj} but switched primers, and with that same load I've never had another puncture. |
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Posted: 9/10/2018 5:52:42 PM EDT
[#49]
Quoted:
I was telling one of my other friends to be careful using the Frontier ammo because I had seen him use it before. He just texted me this picture. https://www.AR15.Com/media/mediaFiles/126115/20180624_172827-666965.JPG This was shot out of a Stag. Two differant " brands " of Hornady ammo ? |
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Posted: 9/10/2018 5:53:23 PM EDT
[#50]
Has OP's friend contacted Hornady yet? Who is going to take care of OP's friend Hornady or Federal?
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