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Posted: 2/12/2024 1:47:23 AM EDT
[#1]
Quote HistoryQuoted: What do you mean it's see through? like you can look through it? |
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Posted: 2/12/2024 1:53:36 AM EDT
[#2]
Quote HistoryQuoted: When it adds night vision and thermal, I’ll buy it. Just wait until the Holosun booth at Shotshow 2025 |
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Posted: 2/12/2024 1:55:40 AM EDT
[#3]
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Posted: 2/12/2024 1:58:57 AM EDT
[#4]
I can safely say, I will never buy one of these:
And I am an accidental Apple whore. |
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Posted: 2/12/2024 2:03:07 AM EDT
[#5]
Flex/Brag thread. I have much better things to waste $3500 on. Glad you're in the 1%, OP. Want to share the wealth?
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Posted: 2/12/2024 2:04:31 AM EDT
[#6]
Quote HistoryQuoted: The system has just enough latency that the driving ones are probably a dumb idea no matter how you look at it, even if nothing else works but the vision pass through. Latency from the photon hitting the outside camera sensor to the reproduction being sent out the screen is something like 12 ms. A fast human prepared response something like 200 ms, with a physical boundary of 100ms minimum just for the biophysical electrical signals. Lots of good reasons to not drive with the thing. (And no I haven’t tried it). But the signal input/output latency is fast enough to be a non-factor. |
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Posted: 2/12/2024 2:58:55 AM EDT
[#7]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Latency from the photon hitting the outside camera sensor to the reproduction being sent out the screen is something like 12 ms. A fast human prepared response something like 200 ms, with a physical boundary of 100ms minimum just for the biophysical electrical signals. Lots of good reasons to not drive with the thing. (And no I haven’t tried it). But the signal input/output latency is fast enough to be a non-factor. I've tried both of the 'current gen' pass throughs headsets and I've noticed a delayed response on both, more so than what 'just 12ms' may suggest. Taking that an extra step beyond just pass through, connecting the Quest 3 for a Remote Desktop via WIFI is only a few ms slower than USB and there is ever so slightly a delay while doing so. Not enough for me to warrant the USB cord, but it's still arguably there. It's well past 'usable', don't get me wrong. Walking around the house is no issue and I've already had to play the 'don't fall down the stairs after the cat tripped you' game. I just can't help but noticed that something is just slightly off every time I put the headsets on and get a bearing with having my hands in front, and while that feeling does go away I just wouldn't trust it for any critical hand/eye coordination tasks. But as you said, plenty of other reasons why it shouldn't be done no matter the thoughts on latency. |
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Posted: 2/12/2024 3:44:03 AM EDT
[#8]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I've tried both of the 'current gen' pass throughs headsets and I've noticed a delayed response on both, more so than what 'just 12ms' may suggest. Taking that an extra step beyond just pass through, connecting the Quest 3 for a Remote Desktop via WIFI is only a few ms slower than USB and there is ever so slightly a delay while doing so. Not enough for me to warrant the USB cord, but it's still arguably there. It's well past 'usable', don't get me wrong. Walking around the house is no issue and I've already had to play the 'don't fall down the stairs after the cat tripped you' game. I just can't help but noticed that something is just slightly off every time I put the headsets on and get a bearing with having my hands in front, and while that feeling does go away I just wouldn't trust it for any critical hand/eye coordination tasks. But as you said, plenty of other reasons why it shouldn't be done no matter the thoughts on latency. I don’t know what you mean by “both of the current gen”. If you aren’t speaking of the Vision Pro specifically, we aren’t speaking of the same thing. |
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Posted: 2/12/2024 3:51:40 AM EDT
[#9]
Quote HistoryQuoted: What do you mean it's see through? like you can look through it? |
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Posted: 2/12/2024 3:57:18 AM EDT
[#10]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I don’t know what you mean by “both of the current gen”. If you aren’t speaking of the Vision Pro specifically, we aren’t speaking of the same thing. Both Quest 3 and Apple Vision Pro are what I'd consider the current gen offerings with the best pass through, so that's what I refer to when I mean 'both of the current gen'. Hope this helps to clarify. |
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Posted: 2/12/2024 4:04:13 AM EDT
[#11]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Outward facing cameras reconstruct your vision. When using it, you essentially see the world normally, but apps will appear to hover in the air. There is a mode to turn off the cameras and switch to a virtual environment, and I would be leary of using that in public, because at that point you are actually blinding yourself. On a plane like in OP's case though, that wouldn't matter as much as he's highly unlikely to be assaulted or mugged mid flight. right_rudder may (or may not) have been part of the development of this headset.  I'm not sure I understand the context of his question though. |
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Posted: 2/12/2024 5:03:44 AM EDT
[#12]
Since it is simulated AR (via the cameras) as opposed to direct see through - it is apparently not only dangerous to drive with, but illegal. While you might still get stereo vision, everything will be on the same focal plane, so you will loose some depth perception.
One video I watched gave me a bit of insight into a possible strategy of Apple. Apple has released products ahead of their times and priced outside the market before. Take Lisa - ultimately a marketing failure - but it's lite version, the original Mac was a market success. But the Mac probably would not have been if the Lisa had not primed the market first. Lisa was a vision - but not the final product. The Vision Pro is priming the market. There are already leaks of a Vision Air - probably in 2 years. Hard to say if and when Apple Glass might finally be made. |
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Posted: 2/12/2024 5:11:17 AM EDT
[#13]
Personally I will wait for the Apple Vision Contacts.
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Posted: 2/12/2024 5:40:41 AM EDT
[#14]
Can you read a book with them?
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Posted: 2/12/2024 6:00:17 AM EDT
[#15]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Latency from the photon hitting the outside camera sensor to the reproduction being sent out the screen is something like 12 ms. A fast human prepared response something like 200 ms, with a physical boundary of 100ms minimum just for the biophysical electrical signals. Lots of good reasons to not drive with the thing. (And no I haven't tried it). But the signal input/output latency is fast enough to be a non-factor. 12ms latency is enough to get you killed in a FPS game. Go ahead and do real life. |
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Posted: 2/12/2024 6:40:34 AM EDT
[#16]
Quote HistoryQuoted: 12ms latency is enough to get you killed in a FPS game. Go ahead and do real life. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Latency from the photon hitting the outside camera sensor to the reproduction being sent out the screen is something like 12 ms. A fast human prepared response something like 200 ms, with a physical boundary of 100ms minimum just for the biophysical electrical signals. Lots of good reasons to not drive with the thing. (And no I haven't tried it). But the signal input/output latency is fast enough to be a non-factor. 12ms latency is enough to get you killed in a FPS game. Go ahead and do real life. This. Like 15 years ago or so in COD4 college days I had almost a 4.0 kill:death ratio and used to just hang out in free for all lobbies shitting on everyone. Not because I was amazing but because my reaction time with 200 microseconds of input lag playing on an old Zenith CRT made me a virtual terminator compared to the other 95% of gamers playing on mid-2000s HDTVs with tens of milliseconds of input lag. Shoot, I still game occasionally now that I'm in my 40s, and can witness a similar effect making the jump from LCD to monitor-grade OLED once those finally started hitting the market in 2022. The reaction time difference lets me munch people half my age. Anything >10ms is considered non-competitive in modern gaming these days. Anything where split-second reaction times are going to matter in real life is going to be subject to the same effects. |
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Posted: 2/12/2024 6:44:03 AM EDT
[#17]
I wouldn’t be troubled by spending $3500 on one of these systems if it lives up to graphic expectations and stays relevant for say 10 years. Also whatever VR system it is needs a VAST library of realistic travel sim apps, flight sims and of course games. I believe that’s the case with most. I have an old Oculus Quest. It was cool at the time but as everyone knows graphics were a bit disappointing. They quickly came out with newer units with much better graphics. Already coming out with sunglasses that approach the same performance as the good goggles. Plus you don’t look like the village idiot while using one of the sunglass version.
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Posted: 2/12/2024 8:39:55 AM EDT
[#18]
The latency isn't constant. The system can get in conditions where latency suffers (increases).
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Posted: 2/12/2024 8:46:25 AM EDT
[#19]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I really look forward to when the price point halves. It’s only $3499 or $291 a month. Most of the tier 1 LARPers here spend double that on thermals and NVG and IR lasers that are never used except to show other LARPers. The shut ins and basement dwellers could use this daily |
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Posted: 2/12/2024 8:51:11 AM EDT
[#20]
Gay as fuck……..now I’m going to have to watch and deal with more idiots becoming even more antisocial and lack any sort of social interaction skills. Don’t feed into this stupid shit they just trying to make you all fat, lazy and stupid.
Op go SEE the mountains and talk to people |
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Posted: 2/12/2024 8:53:36 AM EDT
[#21]
Quote HistoryQuoted: https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/68059/IMG_1749_jpeg-3126232.JPG This is what we are becoming. It’s sad and terrifying. We were so obsessed with whether or not we could, we never paused to ask whether or not we should. Nailed it. 
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Posted: 2/12/2024 9:03:36 AM EDT
[#22]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Some better way to type. I know Siri is the thing but… You don't like having to type on a physical keyboard? The wireless keyboard, mouse, and trackpads all link wirelessly correct? Supported Input Accessories Keyboards Trackpads Game controllers |
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Posted: 2/12/2024 9:04:13 AM EDT
[#23]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Since it is simulated AR (via the cameras) as opposed to direct see through - it is apparently not only dangerous to drive with, but illegal. While you might still get stereo vision, everything will be on the same focal plane, so you will loose some depth perception. One video I watched gave me a bit of insight into a possible strategy of Apple. Apple has released products ahead of their times and priced outside the market before. Take Lisa - ultimately a marketing failure - but it's lite version, the original Mac was a market success. But the Mac probably would not have been if the Lisa had not primed the market first. Lisa was a vision - but not the final product. The Vision Pro is priming the market. There are already leaks of a Vision Air - probably in 2 years. Hard to say if and when Apple Glass might finally be made. |
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Posted: 2/12/2024 9:05:02 AM EDT
[#24]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Is it powerful enough to use ai processing to make everyone naked in real time? /killer app |
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Posted: 2/12/2024 9:12:39 AM EDT
[#25]
Try a Quest 3. Less than $500 and much more refined.
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Posted: 2/12/2024 9:14:52 AM EDT
[#26]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Is it powerful enough to use ai processing to make everyone naked in real time? At first I thought "brilliant!" Then I thought about the average BMI right now, and now I'm not so sure this would be a great idea. |
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Posted: 2/12/2024 9:14:56 AM EDT
[#27]
I’m in whenever it supports Call of Duty.
I guess eventually shit like this will interface with neuralink. You’ll have real time and minimally visible augmentation. Be able to interact with everything. Be more efficient etc. Pretty much the book thin air. Poors have goggles. Rich have implants. |
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Posted: 2/12/2024 9:16:05 AM EDT
[#28]
Quote HistoryQuoted: When it adds night vision and thermal, I’ll buy it. Only a crazy, right-wing militia type would want that. 
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Posted: 2/12/2024 9:17:59 AM EDT
[#29]
Does it have a mum’s basement landscape? If so I’m in
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Posted: 2/12/2024 9:22:50 AM EDT
[#30]
Be careful .
https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/technology/ar-BB1i6Hln Researchers have found that widespread, long-term immersion in VR headsets could literally change the way we perceive the world and each other. "We now have companies who are advocating that you spend many hours each day in them," says Jeremy Bailenson, director of the Virtual Human Interaction Lab at Stanford. "You've got many, many people, and they're wearing it for many, many hours. And everything magnifies at scale." |
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Posted: 2/12/2024 9:26:27 AM EDT
[#31]
I'm not really sure what's the point of this. What does it do that a phone wont, besides the VR experience? To watch movies on your own? Or to play on it just as you would on your phone? The concept is cool, it just looks limited.
I just want a phone with a mini drone. |
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Posted: 2/12/2024 9:43:54 AM EDT
[#32]
No way in hell I’d completely cover my vision of reality in a public place.
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Posted: 2/12/2024 10:45:44 AM EDT
[#33]
Quote HistoryQuoted: You don't like having to type on a physical keyboard? The wireless keyboard, mouse, and trackpads all link wirelessly correct? Supported Input Accessories Keyboards Trackpads Game controllers I’m not carrying a Bluetooth keyboard around just to type on the thing. If I need a keyboard, I’m probably using my MBP anyway. In which case the remote screen is handy. Example: enable the keyboard on phone as remote entry device. Perhaps. |
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Posted: 2/12/2024 10:50:08 AM EDT
[#34]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I'm not carrying a Bluetooth keyboard around just to type on the thing. If I need a keyboard, I'm probably using my MBP anyway. In which case the remote screen is handy. Example: enable the keyboard on phone as remote entry device. Perhaps. |
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Posted: 2/12/2024 10:53:23 AM EDT
[#35]
This VR crap will be the end of appreciating nature and actual human interaction.
I like tech to a degree but some of you will end up like the people in Wall-E … |
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Posted: 2/12/2024 10:58:17 AM EDT
[#36]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I’m in whenever it supports Call of Duty. I guess eventually shit like this will interface with neuralink. You’ll have real time and minimally visible augmentation. Be able to interact with everything. Be more efficient etc. Pretty much the book thin air. Poors have goggles. Rich have implants. Probably going to be a long time for something like Call of Duty. "AAA" game companies (and now apparently "AAAA" lol) are pretty wary about investing too much into the VR ecosystem and something like a high reflex FPS is going to take a lot more than something like cobbling something together for Skyrim and letting the modders figure it out. It's still a very limited market to begin with and I'm not sure Apple's headset is really going to upset the gaming market all that much to change things. Ubisoft is apparently stopping additional investment into the VR segment for now after they didn't hit their target sales for their latest attempt of a game. Ubisoft Will Not Increase Investment in VR Following Disappointing Sales of Assassin's Creed Nexus VR |
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Posted: 2/12/2024 11:03:51 AM EDT
[#37]
Quote HistoryQuoted: "Strange Days" was prophetic.  The Doors - Strange Days (Official Video) |
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Posted: 2/12/2024 11:13:08 AM EDT
[#38]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I'm not really sure what's the point of this. What does it do that a phone wont, besides the VR experience? To watch movies on your own? Or to play on it just as you would on your phone? The concept is cool, it just looks limited. I just want a phone with a mini drone. It’s a new step forward for VR tech, so, it’s expensive and does not have much for it yet Give it 3-5 years, the price will come down and new functionality/software combined with improved hardware will make the tech incredibly useful. |
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Posted: 2/12/2024 11:26:39 AM EDT
[#39]
Quote HistoryBig difference between this and neural stimulation. And this doesn't use minidisc But I will say, having the ability to lay back on the couch and watch a live stream of a riot and respond to a thread here about the riot is pretty close 
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Posted: 2/12/2024 11:28:44 AM EDT
[#40]
Quote HistoryQuoted: At first I thought "brilliant!" Then I thought about the average BMI right now, and now I'm not so sure this would be a great idea. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Is it powerful enough to use ai processing to make everyone naked in real time? At first I thought "brilliant!" Then I thought about the average BMI right now, and now I'm not so sure this would be a great idea. Just get the 2.0 version. It makes everyone naked AND gives them the body of a Sports Illustrated (the classic, not the modern) swimsuit model. |
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Posted: 2/12/2024 11:30:21 AM EDT
[#41]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Looking at the character and "pinching" is the fastest way to type outside of a physical keyboard. I’ve become decently quick at it, but nowhere near the ~35 WPM I can do with my thumbs on the iPhone keyboard and it’s’ auto correction. And it’s enough of a pain I take the headset off to reply to texts directly on my iPhone, when not sitting at MB. |
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Posted: 2/12/2024 11:32:06 AM EDT
[#42]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I've become decently quick at it, but nowhere near the ~35 WPM I can do with my thumbs on the iPhone keyboard and it's' auto correction. trust me. |
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Posted: 2/12/2024 11:38:37 AM EDT
[#43]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I think the things it does are cool as fuck... but not $3500 cool. I'd rather have something that plugs into my MacBook as a companion or I/O device. The spatial awareness is pretty damn amazing. Same. I’m not spending $3500 on a gadget with an engineered failure interval and a proprietary battery. I will say that playing on my sister’s Meta VR headset was a really awe inspiring experience but it’s Facebook and I don’t allow them in my life soo…. |
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Posted: 2/12/2024 11:52:13 AM EDT
[#44]
I play FS2020 a lot. I'd love to demo this thing to see how well it 'recreates' the peripherals in my cockpit.
The ideal goal is to have a VR external world with the ability to reach out and manipulate things in the real world around me. Total game changer. |
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Posted: 2/12/2024 12:00:56 PM EDT
[#45]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I play FS2020 a lot. I'd love to demo this thing to see how well it 'recreates' the peripherals in my cockpit. The ideal goal is to have a VR external world with the ability to reach out and manipulate things in the real world around me. Total game changer. Apple Vision links to PC are still in a proof of concept/development phase so you may need to wait awhile before it's good enough for something as demanding as Flight Simulator. Flight Simulator with VR is awesome though. It's really an experience you need to try even if it's not 'perfect'. The hand controls aren't all there yet but it's serviceable. I'm hoping Flight Simulator 2024 really builds on what they've done. |
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Posted: 2/12/2024 12:01:58 PM EDT
[#46]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I play FS2020 a lot. I'd love to demo this thing to see how well it 'recreates' the peripherals in my cockpit. The ideal goal is to have a VR external world with the ability to reach out and manipulate things in the real world around me. Total game changer. I've seen it done! Unfortunately, I've as yet seen no evidence that the VP can be used for that. |
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Posted: 2/12/2024 12:09:45 PM EDT
[#47]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I've seen it done! Unfortunately, I've as yet seen no evidence that the VP can be used for that. I won't say anything is "off the table" since we're only at version 1 of the software I will say those asking for it to be connected to a PC and this and that, it's not likely to happen. it was specifically designed to be a stand alone device. Much the same way an iPad or a phone is a standalone device. where this would really shine in Flight sim is simulating something like the F-35 helmet. Where you have physical controls in a "cockpit" then have the Vision Pro Display the world view thru the "helmet view". |
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Posted: 2/12/2024 12:12:36 PM EDT
[#48]
I will wait year or two for the Vershon Pu knock off on Amazon
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Posted: 2/12/2024 12:40:33 PM EDT
[#49]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Unless someone designs a software package that does flight sim (and they might) it's not going to do it. I won't say anything is "off the table" since we're only at version 1 of the software I will say those asking for it to be connected to a PC and this and that, it's not likely to happen. it was specifically designed to be a stand alone device. Much the same way an iPad or a phone is a standalone device. where this would really shine in Flight sim is simulating something like the F-35 helmet. Where you have physical controls in a "cockpit" then have the Vision Pro Display the world view thru the "helmet view". There are already people getting SteamVR working (kind of) on the AVP so while official support may not be there I wouldn't put it past the furries bank rolling that development (It's always the furries in VR) to get something going. I certainly would place money on betting that Microsoft won't be building out a standalone version for the AVP. Proof of concept if you haven't seen it already: https://www.uploadvr.com/apple-vision-pro-steamvr-alvr-port-demonstrated/ Honestly for it only being about a week or so the progress is pretty amazing. |
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Posted: 2/12/2024 12:45:31 PM EDT
[#50]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Unless someone designs a software package that does flight sim (and they might) it's not going to do it. I won't say anything is "off the table" since we're only at version 1 of the software I will say those asking for it to be connected to a PC and this and that, it's not likely to happen. it was specifically designed to be a stand alone device. Much the same way an iPad or a phone is a standalone device. where this would really shine in Flight sim is simulating something like the F-35 helmet. Where you have physical controls in a "cockpit" then have the Vision Pro Display the world view thru the "helmet view". Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: I've seen it done! Unfortunately, I've as yet seen no evidence that the VP can be used for that. I won't say anything is "off the table" since we're only at version 1 of the software I will say those asking for it to be connected to a PC and this and that, it's not likely to happen. it was specifically designed to be a stand alone device. Much the same way an iPad or a phone is a standalone device. where this would really shine in Flight sim is simulating something like the F-35 helmet. Where you have physical controls in a "cockpit" then have the Vision Pro Display the world view thru the "helmet view". I really hope it eventually supports OpenXR, but that’s not why I got one. I use a Pimax Crystal for flight sim stuff. |
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