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Posted: 9/21/2017 6:25:48 AM EST
[#1]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Pigeye:
I'm looking at getting both the HF3500 for home and the HF2000 for camping. Is it possible to run them both in parallel if I should need the extra power? My gut says i should only use matching sizes but I really have no idea. |
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Posted: 9/21/2017 7:01:42 AM EST
[#2]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By pdm:
FWIW just found one, brand new and in stock, on eBay for about $55 less than HF. https://www.AR15.Com/media/mediaFiles/696/Screen_Shot_2017-09-20_at_10-312803.JPG |
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Posted: 9/21/2017 7:33:07 AM EST
[#3]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By FL4REAL:
I cancelled my HF order and ordered a Champion for $469 shipped and no tax. |
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Posted: 9/21/2017 7:43:44 AM EST
[#4]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By mitsuman47:
Link? |
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Posted: 9/21/2017 7:44:37 AM EST
[#5]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By pdm:
FWIW just found one, brand new and in stock, on eBay for about $55 less than HF. https://www.AR15.Com/media/mediaFiles/696/Screen_Shot_2017-09-20_at_10-312803.JPG |
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Posted: 9/21/2017 8:32:06 AM EST
[#6]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By mattellis2:
$399 with coupon at HF |
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Posted: 9/21/2017 8:55:57 AM EST
[Last Edit: Desert_AIP]
[#7]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By lowcountry:
It is my understanding that you must have the same generators to run in parallel. I just bought the HF3500 and I was amazed at how quiet the thing really is. It was quieter than a friend of mines eu2000. I was impressed with the overall build quality as well. I do have one complaint about it though. It has a wheel lock that is a true PITA. It is hard to engage and hard to disengage. It also produces a metal on metal rattle if not locked that I just stick a piece of paper in to stop until I can figure out a solution. When paralleled the load is pulled proportionately from each or the several generators. That's why you can have 12GA parallel cables between the generators even though the total out put is 26A (for a pair of EU2000s). You can parallel multiple generators together in this fashion. For instance you could have 4 Honda EU2000s, each with a 12GA lead to a combiner box powering a 50A output. The current in each of the generator lines would never be over 13 Amps (max capability of the individual generator) even though the total output would be ~52A (limited to 50A with the appropriate CB at the combiner box). You can also parallel dissimilar generators. An EU2000 and an EU1000 together for instance, or other combinations. Four EU2000s  Failed To Load Title Dissimilar Hondas  How to triple parallel honda eu series generators You can also parallel a Honda with a battery based Inverter.  Failed To Load Title |
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Posted: 9/21/2017 9:00:18 AM EST
[#8]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By FL4REAL:
Acme Tools. Not sure how reputable they are so I'm not recommending them but they are an official Champion dealer. |
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Posted: 9/21/2017 9:01:45 AM EST
[Last Edit: pdm]
[#9]
I had about $35 in tax as well.
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Posted: 9/21/2017 9:25:42 AM EST
[#10]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By mk4dubbin:
Seems sketchy. 75% feedback rating, no other auctions, canned item description, the negative review says seller never sent item. Yikes |
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Posted: 9/21/2017 9:32:23 AM EST
[#11]
that looks the same as the WEN 2000w on amazon, $460
 
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Posted: 9/21/2017 9:50:29 AM EST
[#12]
Decisions, decisions - the HF for $399, the Wen for $460+, the Champion for $469, or the Honda for $1000?
Given the better warranty and rep, I'm tempted bby the Champion, although it looks a little less compact. Anyone have/use a Champion and like it? |
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Posted: 9/21/2017 9:57:49 AM EST
[#13]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Lhotse:
Decisions, decisions - the HF for $399, the Wen for $460+, the Champion for $469, or the Honda for $1000? Given the better warranty and rep, I'm tempted bby the Champion, although it looks a little less compact. Anyone have/use a Champion and like it? 
By the way, if you parallel the gens and have the ground lead connected... Shouldn't you also run a ground lead out to your ground rod....? Sometimes I wonder about manufacturer/retailer pictures. |
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Posted: 9/21/2017 10:49:32 AM EST
[#14]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By phatmax:
By the way, if you parallel the gens and have the ground lead connected... Shouldn't you also run a ground lead out to your ground rod....? Sometimes I wonder about manufacturer/retailer pictures. link |
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Posted: 9/21/2017 10:54:05 AM EST
[#15]
Quote HistoryAHHH! Good information! So running appliances I am good... What I get from that, f I decided to go through a transfer switch or panel interlock, it should run to a ground rod also.
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Posted: 9/21/2017 11:00:31 AM EST
[#16]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By phatmax:
AHHH! Good information! So running appliances I am good... What I get from that, f I decided to go through a transfer switch or panel interlock, it should run to a ground rod also. |
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Posted: 9/21/2017 11:18:17 AM EST
[Last Edit: Desert_AIP]
[#17]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By phatmax:
AHHH! Good information! So running appliances I am good... What I get from that, f I decided to go through a transfer switch or panel interlock, it should run to a ground rod also. So the ground lug on you your generator cord connects to the ground bus in the CB panel which connects to the grounding rod for the panel. Same goes for the neutral lug on the cord. The neutral and grounds are bonded in the panel. Some of the transfer switches for the larger autostart whole house generators DO switch the neutral, and the genset has it's own grounding rod. |
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Posted: 9/21/2017 11:19:43 AM EST
[#18]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By phatmax:
Or you could spend more and go with the same stuff but from Northern: 699 and 999 respectively http://www.northerntool.com/images/product/700x700/792/792220_8_700x700.jpg By the way, if you parallel the gens and have the ground lead connected... Shouldn't you also run a ground lead out to your ground rod....? Sometimes I wonder about manufacturer/retailer pictures. They're set up like the Honda EU2000 companion, with a 30A twist lock plug installed on the control panel. They don't require a parallel kit beyond the pigtail wiring, which is apparently included. They dispense with the 12VDC output which is a waste of time anyway. At max 8A output, you're better off running a 120VAC battery charger from the AC output and pay a little bit in terms of efficiency loss to get higher amperage output at 12VDC. I don't know that that is worth the $200 each over the HF version (with coupon). Maybe get one Northern and one HF - total $998 vs two HF with external parallel kit at $847. 
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Posted: 9/21/2017 11:24:41 AM EST
[#19]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Desert_AIP:
Most of the interlock or transfer switch kits are not separately derived systems, they only switch the hots. So the ground lug on you your generator cord connects to the ground bus in the CB panel which connects tot he grounding rod for the panel. Same goes for the neutral lug on the cord. The neutral and grounds are bonded in the panel. Some of the transfer switches for the larger autostart whole house generators DO switch the neutral, and the genset has it's own grounding rod. |
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Posted: 9/21/2017 11:30:53 AM EST
[#20]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Desert_AIP:
Interesting modification on the Northern Tool versions. They're set up like the Honda EU2000 companion, with a 30A twist lock plug installed on the control panel. They don't require a parallel kit beyond the pigtail wiring, which is apparently included. They dispense with the 12VDC output which is a waste of time anyway. At max 8A output, you're better off running a 120VAC battery charger from the AC output and pay a little bit in terms of efficiency loss to get higher amperage output at 12VDC. I don't know that that is worth the $200 each over the HF version (with coupon). Maybe get one Northern and one HF - total $998 vs two HF with external parallel kit at $847. http://www.northerntool.com/images/product/700x700/424/42411_700x700.jpg 
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Posted: 9/21/2017 12:14:46 PM EST
[Last Edit: Desert_AIP]
[#21]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By phatmax:
The A-iPower 2000 has the L5-30 plug on the face and is only 399. It is not the exact copy, but I would love to see one in person and check the guts. I have their 12000 watt noisemaker and it is well put together, especially for the sub 900 price. http://www.homedepot.com/p/A-iPower-1600-Watt-Gasoline-Powered-inverter-Portable-Generator-SUA2000i/300199211 https://target.scene7.com/is/image/Target/51011829_Alt03?wid=520&hei=520&fmt=pjpeg I might jump on that. This thread is making me consider another genny (as if I need another) for dedicated camping/off site use so I don't cart my EU2000s with me. (Out of stock at HD) $360 shipped from the UK. http://www.bestebayequipment.com/A-iPower-2000-Watt-Gasoline-Powered-Inverter-Portable-Generator-with-Yamaha-MZ80-Engine Bank wire transfer though - nope. Owner/CEO Bank Account Details : - Beneficiary Name: BAHARI PERDANA - Beneficiary Number/IBAN: 20-100-46694-9 - Bank Name: PT. Bank Mestika Dharma, Tbk - Swift Code: BMDMIDJA - Bank Address: JL. H. Z. Arifin No.118, Medan - Country: INDONESIA |
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Posted: 9/21/2017 12:51:23 PM EST
[#22]
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FL, USA
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Posted: 9/21/2017 1:16:49 PM EST
[#23]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By phatmax:
The A-iPower 2000 has the L5-30 plug on the face and is only 399. It is not the exact copy, but I would love to see one in person and check the guts. I have their 12000 watt noisemaker and it is well put together, especially for the sub 900 price. http://www.homedepot.com/p/A-iPower-1600-Watt-Gasoline-Powered-inverter-Portable-Generator-SUA2000i/300199211 https://target.scene7.com/is/image/Target/51011829_Alt03?wid=520&hei=520&fmt=pjpeg Of coarse, I'm feeling patriotic after Trump's UN speech so I might buy American and go with the Honda. It's only money... |
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IN, USA
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Posted: 9/21/2017 1:42:51 PM EST
[#24]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Lhotse:
Decisions, decisions - the HF for $399, the Wen for $460+, the Champion for $469, or the Honda for $1000? Given the better warranty and rep, I'm tempted bby the Champion, although it looks a little less compact. Anyone have/use a Champion and like it? The third call I made to them was for a fuel issue with a 10 year old 4K unit well out of warranty and they hooked me up with a new carb no charge and overnight shipped it to me as we were using it to run my neighbors oxygen machine when he got out of the hospital and an outage hit us in single digit winter temps that lasted for 3 days. I still can't believe they did that and I had successfully cleaned it and got it running right with their help but the next day there it was on a Fedex truck for early morning delivery. The $399 deal for the HF freight unit is pretty sweet, but Champion stocks and ships all their parts from the US and they have lifetime tech support right here in the states free on any product you buy from them. |
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Posted: 9/21/2017 2:17:51 PM EST
[#25]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Desert_AIP:
Some of the transfer switches for the larger autostart whole house generators DO switch the neutral, and the genset has it's own grounding rod. |
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Posted: 9/21/2017 2:32:06 PM EST
[#26]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Gamma762:
Which is presumably why people have trouble with the inverter type generators run through (some) transfer switches, and have to bond their neutral and ground at the generator to get them to work. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Gamma762:
Originally Posted By Desert_AIP:
Some of the transfer switches for the larger autostart whole house generators DO switch the neutral, and the genset has it's own grounding rod. If you open the panel, a switched neutral is readily apparent if you know what you're looking for. Otherwise, seek professional assistance. |
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FL, USA
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Posted: 9/21/2017 3:18:37 PM EST
[Last Edit: frankiebagadonuts]
[#27]
My list changes daily based on availability (i.e. HF backordered) and new information (Champion's excellent customer service). Here is my current list:
1. Honda EG2800i: 2500 running watts, 67 lbs, made in USA, currently available locally, $999 2. Champion 2000 watt inverter, 1700 running watts, great customer service, $449 3. A-iPower 2000 watt inverter, 1600 running watts, Yamaha engine, $499 4. HF 2000 watt inverter, 1600 running watts, back ordered, $399 with coupon You may ask why that model Honda is being compared to the suitcase inverters. My criteria is an inverter generator that is light enough to pick up and throw in my truck by myself. Jumping up to the higher wattage inverters from the other brands carries a weight penalty that knocks them out of consideration. The Honda, being an open frame inverter, remains light enough to pick up easily. Plus, being the same price as Honda's own 2000 watt, makes it seem like a much better value. 
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Posted: 9/21/2017 3:44:22 PM EST
[#28]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By frankiebagadonuts:
My list changes daily based on availability (i.e. HF backordered) and new information (Champion's excellent customer service). Here is my current list: 1. Honda EG2800i: 2500 running watts, 67 lbs, made in USA, currently available locally, $999 2. Champion 2000 watt inverter, 1700 running watts, great customer service, $449 3. A-iPower 2000 watt inverter, 1600 running watts, Yamaha engine, $499 4. HF 2000 watt inverter, 1600 running watts, back ordered, $399 with coupon You may ask why that model Honda is being compared to the suitcase inverters. My criteria is an inverter generator that is light enough to pick up and throw in my truck by myself. Jumping up to the higher wattage inverters from the other brands carries a weight penalty that knocks them out of consideration. The Honda, being an open frame inverter, remains light enough to pick up easily. Plus, being the same price as Honda's own 2000 watt, makes it seem like a much better value. 
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Posted: 9/21/2017 4:16:45 PM EST
[Last Edit: 2tired2run]
[#29]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Gamma762:
Which is presumably why people have trouble with the inverter type generators run through (some) transfer switches, and have to bond their neutral and ground at the generator to get them to work. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Gamma762:
Originally Posted By Desert_AIP:
Some of the transfer switches for the larger autostart whole house generators DO switch the neutral, and the genset has it's own grounding rod. So this is a Honda schematic. based on this the unit has frame ground which is different from a ground reference. It looks like this system as a floating neutral and relies on the system it is connected to, to bond the neutral. Which is exactly what most are doing when they install the interlock kits with an exterior plug. That 10/3, similar to the picture below, you ran from the panel to the plug should have the neutral landed on the neutral bar in your home's panel and that neutral bar should be bonded to ground in the panel. In addition the ground in that 10/3 should be landed on the ground bar in the panel. In doing all of this you have effectively integrated the generator into your homes electrical system. 
As I said earlier unless you're going to drive a ground rod into the earth next to your gen your only choice to to tie it all together. |
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Posted: 9/21/2017 4:56:52 PM EST
[#30]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Fourays2:
when did you order it? |
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Posted: 9/21/2017 5:50:11 PM EST
[#31]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By 2tired2run:
As I said earlier unless you're going to drive a ground rod into the earth next to your gen your only choice to to tie it all together. |
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Posted: 9/21/2017 6:20:25 PM EST
[#32]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By phatmax:
The A-iPower 2000 has the L5-30 plug on the face and is only 399. It is not the exact copy, but I would love to see one in person and check the guts. I have their 12000 watt noisemaker and it is well put together, especially for the sub 900 price. http://www.homedepot.com/p/A-iPower-1600-Watt-Gasoline-Powered-inverter-Portable-Generator-SUA2000i/300199211 https://target.scene7.com/is/image/Target/51011829_Alt03?wid=520&hei=520&fmt=pjpeg
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Posted: 9/21/2017 6:21:06 PM EST
[#33]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By feedmyAR:
I've called Champion twice to order accessories and ask some questions, flat out world class customer service hands down the best experience I have ever had with a company. The third call I made to them was for a fuel issue with a 10 year old 4K unit well out of warranty and they hooked me up with a new carb no charge and overnight shipped it to me as we were using it to run my neighbors oxygen machine when he got out of the hospital and an outage hit us in single digit winter temps that lasted for 3 days. I still can't believe they did that and I had successfully cleaned it and got it running right with their help but the next day there it was on a Fedex truck for early morning delivery. The $399 deal for the HF freight unit is pretty sweet, but Champion stocks and ships all their parts from the US and they have lifetime tech support right here in the states free on any product you buy from them. 
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Posted: 9/21/2017 7:58:03 PM EST
[#34]
Tag, great thread
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VA, USA
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Posted: 9/21/2017 8:09:11 PM EST
[#35]
The natural gas hookup rustles my jimmies, as my hookup and gas meter ate on the same side of my house.
I see a t, shutoff valve, a quick connect and a gas specific hose (?). I'm down for a tripower coversion, just waiting on the 50% off sale thread. Can someone enlighten me on the specifics of this setup? I guess I need a contractor to do the pipe break (?) but where does the other stuff come from? Is there a max length of hose? |
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DE, USA
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Posted: 9/21/2017 8:17:52 PM EST
[Last Edit: astro_wanabe]
[#36]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By EXPY37:
Sure are skinny wires!!! Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By EXPY37:
Originally Posted By phatmax:
The A-iPower 2000 has the L5-30 plug on the face and is only 399. It is not the exact copy, but I would love to see one in person and check the guts. I have their 12000 watt noisemaker and it is well put together, especially for the sub 900 price. http://www.homedepot.com/p/A-iPower-1600-Watt-Gasoline-Powered-inverter-Portable-Generator-SUA2000i/300199211 https://target.scene7.com/is/image/Target/51011829_Alt03?wid=520&hei=520&fmt=pjpeg |
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Posted: 9/21/2017 9:03:42 PM EST
[Last Edit: Desert_AIP]
[#37]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By EXPY37:
Sure are skinny wires!!! I'm pretty sure the Honda kit is 14 AWG. I used 12 AWG to build my parallel cables just to be sure. You need 10 AWG coming out of the 30A outlet. ETA - i didn't note who I was replying to.
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Posted: 9/21/2017 9:05:18 PM EST
[Last Edit: 2tired2run]
[#38]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By 9mmmac:
The natural gas hookup rustles my jimmies, as my hookup and gas meter ate on the same side of my house. I see a t, shutoff valve, a quick connect and a gas specific hose (?). I'm down for a tripower coversion, just waiting on the 50% off sale thread. Can someone enlighten me on the specifics of this setup? I guess I need a contractor to do the pipe break (?) but where does the other stuff come from? Is there a max length of hose? 
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Posted: 9/21/2017 9:13:57 PM EST
[#39]
Damn... Too rich for my blood...but if you have a house with fuses...
http://www.homedepot.com/p/GenerLink-40-Amp-Meter-Mounted-Transfer-Switch-with-75kA-Per-Phase-Surge-Protection-MA24-S/301962200 |
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Posted: 9/21/2017 9:14:43 PM EST
[#40]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By gaspain:
that looks the same as the WEN 2000w on amazon, $460 www.amazon.com/dp/B00SMNLF4M |
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Posted: 9/21/2017 9:24:01 PM EST
[#41]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By phatmax:
Damn... Too rich for my blood...but if you have a house with fuses... https://www.heartland-rec.com/sites/heartland/files/images/generlink_four.jpg http://www.homedepot.com/p/GenerLink-40-Amp-Meter-Mounted-Transfer-Switch-with-75kA-Per-Phase-Surge-Protection-MA24-S/301962200 This 30A no suppressor is a couple hundred cheaper. Still really spendy! http://www.homedepot.com/p/GenerLink-30-Amp-Meter-Mounted-Transfer-Switch-MA23-N/301961623?MERCH=REC-_-PIPHorizontal1_rr-_-301962200-_-301961623-_-N There has to be an internal ATS to ensure neither the grid nor the genny get back fed. |
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Posted: 9/21/2017 9:32:18 PM EST
[#42]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By feedmyAR:
I've called Champion twice to order accessories and ask some questions, flat out world class customer service hands down the best experience I have ever had with a company. The third call I made to them was for a fuel issue with a 10 year old 4K unit well out of warranty and they hooked me up with a new carb no charge and overnight shipped it to me as we were using it to run my neighbors oxygen machine when he got out of the hospital and an outage hit us in single digit winter temps that lasted for 3 days. I still can't believe they did that and I had successfully cleaned it and got it running right with their help but the next day there it was on a Fedex truck for early morning delivery. The $399 deal for the HF freight unit is pretty sweet, but Champion stocks and ships all their parts from the US and they have lifetime tech support right here in the states free on any product you buy from them. |
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Posted: 9/21/2017 10:00:21 PM EST
[Last Edit: 2tired2run]
[#43]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Gamma762:
For folks running extension cords through their home, they really should do this. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Gamma762:
Originally Posted By 2tired2run:
As I said earlier unless you're going to drive a ground rod into the earth next to your gen your only choice to to tie it all together. The schematic i posted earlier shows a frame ground and a second ground that is on the front panel. I'll have pull the front panel on mine to find out if it's connected to the frame or not. If you're going to ground the gen I'd locate the grounding electrode for your house and bond the grounds there. ETA: meant to say or drive one in the ground near where you plan to setup your gen. They're not expensive Home Depot Ground Rod |
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Posted: 9/21/2017 10:57:30 PM EST
[#44]
Mine was supposed to arrive today, but it went AWOL after it got to Troutdale, OR. It should have headed east to Lewiston, ID after Troutdale. Probably ended up going north.
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IN, USA
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Posted: 9/21/2017 11:35:58 PM EST
[#45]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By jefflebowski:
They wouldn’t help me on a one year old unit. Sorry the big mean CS rep at Champion singled you out of thousands of happy owners to take a giant shit on you there snowflake.
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Posted: 9/22/2017 12:32:48 AM EST
[#46]
So, is there a consensus on the need to get the Extended Warranty from HF?
I typically avoid them but I've seen it recommended several times in this thread. |
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FL, USA
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Posted: 9/22/2017 12:39:25 AM EST
[#47]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By TacticalHeater:
I'd really like to see side by side to a Honda. |
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Posted: 9/22/2017 5:15:23 AM EST
[#48]
Quote HistoryYou might have gotten the wrong link. That is a 6 year old video comparing a 1000 buck Honda inverter to a 90 buck HF Chicago 2 cycle, not the Predator inverter .
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Posted: 9/22/2017 5:31:51 AM EST
[#49]
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FL, USA
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Posted: 9/22/2017 10:01:39 AM EST
[#50]
Can someone help me out with a technical question? I am now zeroing in on the Honda EG2800i and the Champion Digital Hybrid 3500. I'll be using the duplex outlets with extension cords.
It appears to me that the Champion has one 20A breaker for the duplex plug. Won't this limit the total output to 2400 watts through the duplex? It looks like the Honda has a 20A breaker for each plug of the duplex which should allow for the full 2500 rated watts through the duplex. Am I right about this, or am I missing something? |
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