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OK, USA
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Posted: 11/1/2015 7:02:09 PM EST
[#1]
I have a couple of questions for you guys that went SubQ. Is there more or less discomfort than IMJ? Also, what size/length of needles are readily available for SubQ injection of Testosterone Cypionate? I currently use 3ml syringes.
I have a couple of reasons to ask. I've been on TRT for 5 years and injections for one year. I recently went from getting them at the doctors office to doing them at home. I have a huge needle phobia so my wife usually gives them to me. I want to move towards giving them to myself. I think I can deal with SubQ. My phobia is more of a foreign object phobia. The other reason is because of what I've read about the possibility of not needing an aromatase inhibitor by going SubQ. At my dose, 150mg/10 days, I don't have any major problems with E but I'd like to head any problems off. My doctor isn't cozy to the idea of using an aromatase inhibitor. Thanks |
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Posted: 11/1/2015 7:21:25 PM EST
[#2]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By jmills224:
I have a couple of questions for you guys that went SubQ. Is there more or less discomfort than IMJ? Also, what size/length of needles are readily available for SubQ injection of Testosterone Cypionate? I currently use 3ml syringes. I have a couple of reasons to ask. I've been on TRT for 5 years and injections for one year. I recently went from getting them at the doctors office to doing them at home. I have a huge needle phobia so my wife usually gives them to me. I want to move towards giving them to myself. I think I can deal with SubQ. My phobia is more of a foreign object phobia. The other reason is because of what I've read about the possibility of not needing an aromatase inhibitor by going SubQ. At my dose, 150mg/10 days, I don't have any major problems with E but I'd like to head any problems off. My doctor isn't cozy to the idea of using an aromatase inhibitor. Thanks I use either a 1ml or 1/2ml barrel with 26-29ga 1/2-5/8 needle. Whichever is on sale at the time. An ai is easily obtained with a little research if your doctor won't prescribe it for you. |
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Posted: 11/1/2015 9:01:16 PM EST
[Last Edit: EXPY37]
[#3]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By jmills224:
I have a couple of questions for you guys that went SubQ. Is there more or less discomfort than IMJ? Also, what size/length of needles are readily available for SubQ injection of Testosterone Cypionate? I currently use 3ml syringes. I have a couple of reasons to ask. I've been on TRT for 5 years and injections for one year. I recently went from getting them at the doctors office to doing them at home. I have a huge needle phobia so my wife usually gives them to me. I want to move towards giving them to myself. I think I can deal with SubQ. My phobia is more of a foreign object phobia. The other reason is because of what I've read about the possibility of not needing an aromatase inhibitor by going SubQ. At my dose, 150mg/10 days, I don't have any major problems with E but I'd like to head any problems off. My doctor isn't cozy to the idea of using an aromatase inhibitor. Thanks Very little pain, at times no sensation in areas. As far as the needle, ideally 1/2" That said, ANY LONGER length works just fine, just sick it in about 1/2 inch. For T-C I use 26 ga of varying lengths that I buy on eBay. Skip the doc then and get it anyway. It's cheap and available. I had a phobia yrs ago and overcame it. You likely can too, just man up and stick it in without pissing around. I was a little bitch at first... Only took a couple times. Your wife will respect you more... |
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Posted: 11/1/2015 9:02:36 PM EST
[#4]
I need to look around for a cheaper source of needles. I've got enough for another few weeks, but I'll need to restock pretty soon.
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Posted: 11/1/2015 9:04:04 PM EST
[Last Edit: EXPY37]
[#5]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By CLICKBANGBANG:
I need to look around for a cheaper source of needles. I've got enough for another few weeks, but I'll need to restock pretty soon. Look on ebay and search these words: BD 26 needle ---trivial Get any length over 1/2" for SQ UK Sellers are GTG Watch for case lots for the best price, not lots of 100 or so... They will be a premium $ 26 |
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Posted: 11/1/2015 9:17:27 PM EST
[#6]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By EXPY37:
Look on ebay and search these words: BD 26 needle ---trivial Get any length over 1/2" for SQ UK Sellers are GTG Watch for case lots for the best price, not lots of 100 or so... They will be a premium $ Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By EXPY37:
Originally Posted By CLICKBANGBANG:
I need to look around for a cheaper source of needles. I've got enough for another few weeks, but I'll need to restock pretty soon. Look on ebay and search these words: BD 26 needle ---trivial Get any length over 1/2" for SQ UK Sellers are GTG Watch for case lots for the best price, not lots of 100 or so... They will be a premium $ I got 300 needles for $57 from gpz meds. |
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Posted: 11/1/2015 9:18:30 PM EST
[Last Edit: EXPY37]
[#7]
See above--- 1000 for $60 free shipping...
That's the first one I saw... eBay beats all the rest if you're careful. |
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Posted: 11/1/2015 9:25:15 PM EST
[#8]
That's a good deal. Thanks for the heads up on eBay. I was looking at Amazon and was like
 .
I'm using a 1" 26 gauge for HCG injections in the hip. Not taking T right now. |
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Posted: 11/1/2015 9:31:28 PM EST
[Last Edit: EXPY37]
[#9]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By CLICKBANGBANG:
That's a good deal. Thanks for the heads up on eBay. I was looking at Amazon and was like .
I'm using a 1" 26 gauge for HCG injections in the hip. Not taking T right now. Hip??? Why not the belly area slightly below the navel and to one side or the other 4 +/- inches or so, no big deal. Pinch up a fatty area gently and stick it in. For HCG I use 30 ga... T-C 26 ga... Stick it in ~1/2" and if you can, move the needle a bit in and out to distribute the material. |
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OK, USA
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Posted: 11/1/2015 9:47:42 PM EST
[#10]
Thanks for the help guys, I appreciate it.
Expy37, would you mind if I PM'd you? |
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Posted: 11/1/2015 9:48:07 PM EST
[#11]
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Posted: 11/1/2015 9:48:21 PM EST
[Last Edit: EXPY37]
[#12]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By jmills224:
Thanks for the help guys, I appreciate it. Expy37, would you mind if I PM'd you? No |
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Posted: 11/1/2015 10:36:16 PM EST
[#13]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By CLICKBANGBANG:
That's a good deal. Thanks for the heads up on eBay. I was looking at Amazon and was like .
I'm using a 1" 26 gauge for HCG injections in the hip. Not taking T right now. I use allegro medical and have to place an order about once a year. I buy alcohol wipes off of amazon. |
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WA, USA
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Posted: 11/2/2015 12:24:51 AM EST
[#14]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By SWIRE:
They didn't say there was no limit to how high it should be. I recall them saying something about keeping it "under 75". I wasn't paying close attention when they were going on about it because I thought they were full of it. Having personally experienced an E level of 224 pg/mL I know what it feels to break down emotionally over every little thing. That high level was under a different doctor, a urologist, who said it was fine. When he said there was no need to check it in the future I decided that would my last visit to him. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By SWIRE:
Originally Posted By pumbaajk:
Originally Posted By SWIRE:
Originally Posted By EXPY37:
Interesting... I just read on T Nation that high E levels enlarge the prostrate... So, I'm going to try doubling my Arimidex to every 4 days, same amt as every 8 now. The hormone balancing doctor that I go to recently came back from a conference saying that new research shows a higher E level is actually beneficial for men. They want me to stop taking Arimidex all together. I need to get the source of their information so I can do further research on it. Estrogen is critical for men but not anything higher than 60-70. bone and joint health is the basic functions of estrogen in men. Beyond that, increased estrogen is unhealthy and hard on mental health expecially. Why do you women are so fucked in the heads? At 29 I have arthritis in my knees and shoulders from playing baseball 10 months out of the year for 19 years and the 2 months I did have off I was consistently training. Joints, ligaments, muscles, tendons all have extreme wear even to the point my orthopedic surgeon asked when I wanted to schedule my knee replacements. I run a touch higher estrogen because my joints require it and so I don't feel like I have sand in my joints. I am experimenting with other compounds and protocols to see how they effect my joint health and overall longevity. I see myself as a liability to my family if I can not preform in a stressful situation. Eta-your doctor is an idiot if he thinks high and unsafe levels of estrogen is OK for men. They didn't say there was no limit to how high it should be. I recall them saying something about keeping it "under 75". I wasn't paying close attention when they were going on about it because I thought they were full of it. Having personally experienced an E level of 224 pg/mL I know what it feels to break down emotionally over every little thing. That high level was under a different doctor, a urologist, who said it was fine. When he said there was no need to check it in the future I decided that would my last visit to him. The juice heads aim for an E level of 20 pg/mL. Thats probably not too bad, but Id try to stay under 50 for sure. |
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WA, USA
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Posted: 11/2/2015 12:33:40 AM EST
[#15]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By jmills224:
I have a couple of questions for you guys that went SubQ. Is there more or less discomfort than IMJ? Also, what size/length of needles are readily available for SubQ injection of Testosterone Cypionate? I currently use 3ml syringes. I have a couple of reasons to ask. I've been on TRT for 5 years and injections for one year. I recently went from getting them at the doctors office to doing them at home. I have a huge needle phobia so my wife usually gives them to me. I want to move towards giving them to myself. I think I can deal with SubQ. My phobia is more of a foreign object phobia. The other reason is because of what I've read about the possibility of not needing an aromatase inhibitor by going SubQ. At my dose, 150mg/10 days, I don't have any major problems with E but I'd like to head any problems off. My doctor isn't cozy to the idea of using an aromatase inhibitor. Thanks SQ is basically painless. I use 28g 5/8" .5 ml insulin pins. You need to get off the 10 day interval. Anything over 5 days is nuts. Id do 60mg/ 4 days. No reason not to. I hate IM, but SQ is really nothing. I have zits that hurt worse than that. |
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Posted: 11/2/2015 12:42:09 AM EST
[#16]
I've been doing 31g 1/2" needles with a 1ml syringe for HCG. I'm going to switch to SQ for T after my next lab follow-up with the doc. I'll go a little bigger on the needle for T.
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Posted: 11/2/2015 12:55:24 AM EST
[#17]
25 ga for draw and inj for T-C works great for me...
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WA, USA
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Posted: 11/2/2015 9:22:43 AM EST
[#18]
I'm starting sub q today. Will be using 29g which is what i use for HCG. We'll see if it takes too long to draw. Going to go with 40 mg monday and thursday. Still undecided on whether i should do .25 mg AI tuesday/friday. Should i try w/o to start, see where my E goes between shots?
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WA, USA
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Posted: 11/2/2015 10:30:11 AM EST
[#19]
Ok that was slow. Need to find bigger needles.
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Posted: 11/2/2015 10:39:26 AM EST
[#20]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By powder007:
Ok that was slow. Need to find bigger needles. Walmart is a quick source... |
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Posted: 11/2/2015 12:33:58 PM EST
[#21]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By pumbaajk: I got 300 needles for $57 from gpz meds. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By pumbaajk: Originally Posted By EXPY37: Originally Posted By CLICKBANGBANG: I need to look around for a cheaper source of needles. I've got enough for another few weeks, but I'll need to restock pretty soon. Look on ebay and search these words: BD 26 needle ---trivial Get any length over 1/2" for SQ UK Sellers are GTG Watch for case lots for the best price, not lots of 100 or so... They will be a premium $ I got 300 needles for $57 from gpz meds. In Pa no Rx needed |
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Posted: 11/2/2015 12:35:17 PM EST
[#22]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By EXPY37: Hip??? Why not the belly area slightly below the navel and to one side or the other 4 +/- inches or so, no big deal. Pinch up a fatty area gently and stick it in. For HCG I use 30 ga... T-C 26 ga... Stick it in ~1/2" and if you can, move the needle a bit in and out to distribute the material. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By EXPY37: Originally Posted By CLICKBANGBANG: That's a good deal. Thanks for the heads up on eBay. I was looking at Amazon and was like . I'm using a 1" 26 gauge for HCG injections in the hip. Not taking T right now. Hip??? Why not the belly area slightly below the navel and to one side or the other 4 +/- inches or so, no big deal. Pinch up a fatty area gently and stick it in. For HCG I use 30 ga... T-C 26 ga... Stick it in ~1/2" and if you can, move the needle a bit in and out to distribute the material. I tried it with a 30 ga, forget it |
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Posted: 11/2/2015 12:37:37 PM EST
[#23]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By jrzy:
How is the draw on the 26 ga with T? I tried it with a 30 ga, forget it Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By jrzy:
Originally Posted By EXPY37:
Originally Posted By CLICKBANGBANG:
That's a good deal. Thanks for the heads up on eBay. I was looking at Amazon and was like .
I'm using a 1" 26 gauge for HCG injections in the hip. Not taking T right now. Hip??? Why not the belly area slightly below the navel and to one side or the other 4 +/- inches or so, no big deal. Pinch up a fatty area gently and stick it in. For HCG I use 30 ga... T-C 26 ga... Stick it in ~1/2" and if you can, move the needle a bit in and out to distribute the material. I tried it with a 30 ga, forget it It takes time but try running your vial under some hot water. Makes it easier. |
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WA, USA
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Posted: 11/2/2015 1:13:19 PM EST
[#24]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By powder007:
I'm starting sub q today. Will be using 29g which is what i use for HCG. We'll see if it takes too long to draw. Going to go with 40 mg monday and thursday. Still undecided on whether i should do .25 mg AI tuesday/friday. Should i try w/o to start, see where my E goes between shots? You probably wont need any AI. |
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WA, USA
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Posted: 11/2/2015 1:15:49 PM EST
[#25]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By pumbaajk:
It takes time but try running your vial under some hot water. Makes it easier. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By pumbaajk:
Originally Posted By jrzy:
Originally Posted By EXPY37:
Originally Posted By CLICKBANGBANG:
That's a good deal. Thanks for the heads up on eBay. I was looking at Amazon and was like .
I'm using a 1" 26 gauge for HCG injections in the hip. Not taking T right now. Hip??? Why not the belly area slightly below the navel and to one side or the other 4 +/- inches or so, no big deal. Pinch up a fatty area gently and stick it in. For HCG I use 30 ga... T-C 26 ga... Stick it in ~1/2" and if you can, move the needle a bit in and out to distribute the material. I tried it with a 30 ga, forget it It takes time but try running your vial under some hot water. Makes it easier. I just fill 3 pins at a time. It takes a few minutes a week. Not a big deal. |
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Posted: 11/2/2015 6:05:33 PM EST
[#26]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By jrzy:
How is the draw on the 26 ga with T? I tried it with a 30 ga, forget it Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By jrzy:
Originally Posted By EXPY37:
Originally Posted By CLICKBANGBANG:
That's a good deal. Thanks for the heads up on eBay. I was looking at Amazon and was like .
I'm using a 1" 26 gauge for HCG injections in the hip. Not taking T right now. Hip??? Why not the belly area slightly below the navel and to one side or the other 4 +/- inches or so, no big deal. Pinch up a fatty area gently and stick it in. For HCG I use 30 ga... T-C 26 ga... Stick it in ~1/2" and if you can, move the needle a bit in and out to distribute the material. I tried it with a 30 ga, forget it I used 29G 1/2" 1/2mL syringes. I tie a shoestring around the vial, loop the other end around the knob on the medicine cabinet door and hang the vial upside down wedged between the door and the cabinet. By the time I'm out of the shower it's loaded. 
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Posted: 11/2/2015 7:10:25 PM EST
[#27]
Newest labs are in. These were taken early Wednesday morning (farthest point from my last shot). Hematocrit has been slowly climbing but is only up 4 since February. High enough I should consider donating blood? My E2 has dipped from a high of 45 in June. When do you worry about taking some anastrozole? I am seeing some of the side effects of high E2 (emotional, oily skin, water weight, etc.)
I'm currently doing 50mg IM Test Cyp 2x a week but switching to SQ next week. Also doing 500IU HCG 2x a week (the day before my T shots). I'm doing HCG 3 weeks on, 1 week off. Hematocrit 53.1 Estradiol 35.1 Total T 719 (901 in June) PSA 1.0 (up from 0.5 in June) |
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Posted: 11/2/2015 7:16:40 PM EST
[Last Edit: EXPY37]
[#28]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By 2tired2run:
I used 29G 1/2" 1/2mL syringes. I tie a shoestring around the vial, loop the other end around the knob on the medicine cabinet door and hang the vial upside down wedged between the door and the cabinet. By the time I'm out of the shower it's loaded. http://i.imgur.com/EulqsJH.jpg?1 Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By 2tired2run:
Originally Posted By jrzy:
Originally Posted By EXPY37:
Originally Posted By CLICKBANGBANG:
That's a good deal. Thanks for the heads up on eBay. I was looking at Amazon and was like .
I'm using a 1" 26 gauge for HCG injections in the hip. Not taking T right now. Hip??? Why not the belly area slightly below the navel and to one side or the other 4 +/- inches or so, no big deal. Pinch up a fatty area gently and stick it in. For HCG I use 30 ga... T-C 26 ga... Stick it in ~1/2" and if you can, move the needle a bit in and out to distribute the material. I tried it with a 30 ga, forget it I used 29G 1/2" 1/2mL syringes. I tie a shoestring around the vial, loop the other end around the knob on the medicine cabinet door and hang the vial upside down wedged between the door and the cabinet. By the time I'm out of the shower it's loaded. http://i.imgur.com/EulqsJH.jpg?1 Now that's thinking with your dipstick! 
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Posted: 11/2/2015 7:17:12 PM EST
[#29]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By medicmandan:
Newest labs are in. These were taken early Wednesday morning (farthest point from my last shot). Hematocrit has been slowly climbing but is only up 4 since February. High enough I should consider donating blood? My E2 has dipped from a high of 45 in June. When do you worry about taking some anastrozole? I am seeing some of the side effects of high E2 (emotional, oily skin, water weight, etc.) I'm currently doing 50mg IM Test Cyp 2x a week but switching to SQ next week. Also doing 500IU HCG 2x a week (the day before my T shots). I'm doing HCG 3 weeks on, 1 week off. Hematocrit 53.1 Estradiol 35.1 Total T 719 (901 in June) PSA 1.0 (up from 0.5 in June) HCT ---YES! |
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Posted: 11/2/2015 7:18:43 PM EST
[#30]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By 2tired2run:
I used 29G 1/2" 1/2mL syringes. I tie a shoestring around the vial, loop the other end around the knob on the medicine cabinet door and hang the vial upside down wedged between the door and the cabinet. By the time I'm out of the shower it's loaded. http://i.imgur.com/EulqsJH.jpg?1 Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By 2tired2run:
Originally Posted By jrzy:
Originally Posted By EXPY37:
Originally Posted By CLICKBANGBANG:
That's a good deal. Thanks for the heads up on eBay. I was looking at Amazon and was like .
I'm using a 1" 26 gauge for HCG injections in the hip. Not taking T right now. Hip??? Why not the belly area slightly below the navel and to one side or the other 4 +/- inches or so, no big deal. Pinch up a fatty area gently and stick it in. For HCG I use 30 ga... T-C 26 ga... Stick it in ~1/2" and if you can, move the needle a bit in and out to distribute the material. I tried it with a 30 ga, forget it I used 29G 1/2" 1/2mL syringes. I tie a shoestring around the vial, loop the other end around the knob on the medicine cabinet door and hang the vial upside down wedged between the door and the cabinet. By the time I'm out of the shower it's loaded. http://i.imgur.com/EulqsJH.jpg?1 Damn that's some Mexican ingenuity if I ever did see.... 
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Posted: 11/2/2015 7:22:05 PM EST
[Last Edit: CLICKBANGBANG]
[#31]
Everything I've seen says 250iu hCG every other day and 1.0mg Arimidex/anastrozole per week in divided doses with 100mg of test C per week spread into two or more doses.
The hCG burns off quick enough that three times a week or eod might be better than 2x of 500. And the lower doses spread out through the week might help to keep the E2 down just a hair. You might not need a full mg of AI. Guys that are taking 1mg of AI are usually taking 100-200mg of test C. You might get away with less. Edit- The bodybuilders up AI when it gets much over 25. But I've read of others that are fine up to 40. |
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WA, USA
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Posted: 11/2/2015 8:32:44 PM EST
[#32]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By medicmandan:
Newest labs are in. These were taken early Wednesday morning (farthest point from my last shot). Hematocrit has been slowly climbing but is only up 4 since February. High enough I should consider donating blood? My E2 has dipped from a high of 45 in June. When do you worry about taking some anastrozole? I am seeing some of the side effects of high E2 (emotional, oily skin, water weight, etc.) I'm currently doing 50mg IM Test Cyp 2x a week but switching to SQ next week. Also doing 500IU HCG 2x a week (the day before my T shots). I'm doing HCG 3 weeks on, 1 week off. Hematocrit 53.1 Estradiol 35.1 Total T 719 (901 in June) PSA 1.0 (up from 0.5 in June) Thats too high. Id suggest donating every 3 months, until you have more labs. Or get on the guinea pig train and break out the diotomacious earth. |
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Posted: 11/2/2015 9:20:28 PM EST
[#33]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By medicmandan:
Newest labs are in. These were taken early Wednesday morning (farthest point from my last shot). Hematocrit has been slowly climbing but is only up 4 since February. High enough I should consider donating blood? My E2 has dipped from a high of 45 in June. When do you worry about taking some anastrozole? I am seeing some of the side effects of high E2 (emotional, oily skin, water weight, etc.) I'm currently doing 50mg IM Test Cyp 2x a week but switching to SQ next week. Also doing 500IU HCG 2x a week (the day before my T shots). I'm doing HCG 3 weeks on, 1 week off. Hematocrit 53.1 Estradiol 35.1 Total T 719 (901 in June) PSA 1.0 (up from 0.5 in June) What was your HCT baseline before TRT? Being in Utah if you live at a high elevation your may just be closer to normal than you think. Remember athletes train at higher altitudes to up HCT to better low altitude performance. So if you're cardio trained athlete and living at a high altitude you may not be as bad as you think. |
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WA, USA
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Posted: 11/2/2015 10:05:32 PM EST
[#34]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By 2tired2run:
What was your HCT baseline before TRT? Being in Utah if you live at a high elevation your may just be closer to normal than you think. Remember athletes train at higher altitudes to up HCT to better low altitude performance. So if you're cardio trained athlete and living at a high altitude you may not be as bad as you think. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By 2tired2run:
Originally Posted By medicmandan:
Newest labs are in. These were taken early Wednesday morning (farthest point from my last shot). Hematocrit has been slowly climbing but is only up 4 since February. High enough I should consider donating blood? My E2 has dipped from a high of 45 in June. When do you worry about taking some anastrozole? I am seeing some of the side effects of high E2 (emotional, oily skin, water weight, etc.) I'm currently doing 50mg IM Test Cyp 2x a week but switching to SQ next week. Also doing 500IU HCG 2x a week (the day before my T shots). I'm doing HCG 3 weeks on, 1 week off. Hematocrit 53.1 Estradiol 35.1 Total T 719 (901 in June) PSA 1.0 (up from 0.5 in June) What was your HCT baseline before TRT? Being in Utah if you live at a high elevation your may just be closer to normal than you think. Remember athletes train at higher altitudes to up HCT to better low altitude performance. So if you're cardio trained athlete and living at a high altitude you may not be as bad as you think. He said its up 4%. Thats consistent with TRT. Thats about where Im at with it also. |
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Posted: 11/2/2015 10:49:54 PM EST
[#35]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By 2tired2run:
What was your HCT baseline before TRT? Being in Utah if you live at a high elevation your may just be closer to normal than you think. Remember athletes train at higher altitudes to up HCT to better low altitude performance. So if you're cardio trained athlete and living at a high altitude you may not be as bad as you think. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By 2tired2run:
Originally Posted By medicmandan:
Newest labs are in. These were taken early Wednesday morning (farthest point from my last shot). Hematocrit has been slowly climbing but is only up 4 since February. High enough I should consider donating blood? My E2 has dipped from a high of 45 in June. When do you worry about taking some anastrozole? I am seeing some of the side effects of high E2 (emotional, oily skin, water weight, etc.) I'm currently doing 50mg IM Test Cyp 2x a week but switching to SQ next week. Also doing 500IU HCG 2x a week (the day before my T shots). I'm doing HCG 3 weeks on, 1 week off. Hematocrit 53.1 Estradiol 35.1 Total T 719 (901 in June) PSA 1.0 (up from 0.5 in June) What was your HCT baseline before TRT? Being in Utah if you live at a high elevation your may just be closer to normal than you think. Remember athletes train at higher altitudes to up HCT to better low altitude performance. So if you're cardio trained athlete and living at a high altitude you may not be as bad as you think. My HCT 1 month prior to starting TRT was 49.6. I've had labs four times since then but he only tested HCT on this one. |
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AZ, USA
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Posted: 11/3/2015 5:24:05 AM EST
[Last Edit: Misery]
[#36]
Well my TRT debacle continues. My urologist would give me Androgel but not do much to mitigate certain problems I had with it or run a proper panel. I posted about it a few pages back. My issue seemed to be related to DHT and the inability to titrate the dose. One pump just shut off production and two caused problems. The urologist was like "testosterone is testosterone so..." Thanks.
So I tell my PCP and he's like I'll give you injections. That way you can dial in the proper dose. Great. Nope, I get the Rx filled that says 10 mL and they give me 1 mL. So I go in person to the doctor's office with vial and say "I can't get this filled again for one month, and it's only good for 2 injections". If I inject once a week at 50 then fine, but not 100 mg. I provide AACE PDF that says once or twice dosing a month is inadequate (they do suggest a 200 mg bimonthly injection but I feel that's poor too). I mean hell, the leaflet in the test box says half-life is 7-8 days. Hello, that's not two weeks worth, let alone 4! So she takes the paper and says she'll inform the doc and call me. So today they call and say he wants me injecting once every 4 weeks and the AACE paper is wrong, or that the information pertains to a different drug. Uh no, I highlighted it and it's testosterone cypionate. Fuck these doctors. Goddamn PCP knows I'm an RN and not trying to pull shit. Is he really that dumb or did he not look at the paperwork. Now off to find a competent doctor again.... Does Phoenix have one??? |
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WA, USA
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Posted: 11/3/2015 6:21:55 AM EST
[#37]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By jrzy:
How is the draw on the 26 ga with T? I tried it with a 30 ga, forget it Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By jrzy:
Originally Posted By EXPY37:
Originally Posted By CLICKBANGBANG:
That's a good deal. Thanks for the heads up on eBay. I was looking at Amazon and was like .
I'm using a 1" 26 gauge for HCG injections in the hip. Not taking T right now. Hip??? Why not the belly area slightly below the navel and to one side or the other 4 +/- inches or so, no big deal. Pinch up a fatty area gently and stick it in. For HCG I use 30 ga... T-C 26 ga... Stick it in ~1/2" and if you can, move the needle a bit in and out to distribute the material. I tried it with a 30 ga, forget it I tried 29g today and it was like a drip only faucet. Ended up finding some 27g at Target for .20c each but didn't buy a lot just cuz i wanted to see how well they worked. Will know thursday i guess. 29g did it but it literally took like 3 minutes to draw 40 mg. I won't just default take my AI in the morning. I'll go w/o as long as i don't have high E2 symptoms, then give it 2 weeks and have blood work done. Haven't noticed anything weird yet though. |
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Posted: 11/3/2015 10:37:51 AM EST
[#38]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Misery:
Well my TRT debacle continues. My urologist would give me Androgel but not do much to mitigate certain problems I had with it or run a proper panel. I posted about it a few pages back. My issue seemed to be related to DHT and the inability to titrate the dose. One pump just shut off production and two caused problems. The urologist was like "testosterone is testosterone so..." Thanks. So I tell my PCP and he's like I'll give you injections. That way you can dial in the proper dose. Great. Nope, I get the Rx filled that says 10 mL and they give me 1 mL. So I go in person to the doctor's office with vial and say "I can't get this filled again for one month, and it's only good for 2 injections". If I inject once a week at 50 then fine, but not 100 mg. I provide AACE PDF that says once or twice dosing a month is inadequate (they do suggest a 200 mg bimonthly injection but I feel that's poor too). I mean hell, the leaflet in the test box says half-life is 7-8 days. Hello, that's not two weeks worth, let alone 4! So she takes the paper and says she'll inform the doc and call me. So today they call and say he wants me injecting once every 4 weeks and the AACE paper is wrong, or that the information pertains to a different drug. Uh no, I highlighted it and it's testosterone cypionate. Fuck these doctors. Goddamn PCP knows I'm an RN and not trying to pull shit. Is he really that dumb or did he not look at the paperwork. Now off to find a competent doctor again.... Does Phoenix have one??? That sucks. Reading this thread(and others) about how difficult it is to find someone to competently treat lowT makes me shake my head to say the least. I don't have any leads on Dr.s in PHX but can offer the way I found mine. First off, I went with a DO for my PCP because of the "whole patient" approach, rather than treating a single symptom they are supposed to be better at listening to the patient and finding the underlying issue. So when I explained my symptoms to him, he was more than happy to order the blood work then follow on blood work to confirm. He was very honest that I should see a specialist as he felt he wasn't necessarily the best to treat me for lowT since I am so young in case there are other problems. He gave me a list of endocrinologists that he trusts. I cross-referenced that list with a list of in network docs in my area and also googled endo's around me. I searched for any that mentioned TRT since most endo's seem to focus on other things. So I found one that was on my Dr's list, in network, and mentioned trt on his website and have had a very good experience. So I haven't had to go to dr after dr to finally get treatment and was lucky that my research beforehand paid off. Good luck finding a Dr that is worth your time! |
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Posted: 11/3/2015 12:08:35 PM EST
[#39]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Misery: Well my TRT debacle continues. My urologist would give me Androgel but not do much to mitigate certain problems I had with it or run a proper panel. I posted about it a few pages back. My issue seemed to be related to DHT and the inability to titrate the dose. One pump just shut off production and two caused problems. The urologist was like "testosterone is testosterone so..." Thanks. So I tell my PCP and he's like I'll give you injections. That way you can dial in the proper dose. Great. Nope, I get the Rx filled that says 10 mL and they give me 1 mL. So I go in person to the doctor's office with vial and say "I can't get this filled again for one month, and it's only good for 2 injections". If I inject once a week at 50 then fine, but not 100 mg. I provide AACE PDF that says once or twice dosing a month is inadequate (they do suggest a 200 mg bimonthly injection but I feel that's poor too). I mean hell, the leaflet in the test box says half-life is 7-8 days. Hello, that's not two weeks worth, let alone 4! So she takes the paper and says she'll inform the doc and call me. So today they call and say he wants me injecting once every 4 weeks and the AACE paper is wrong, or that the information pertains to a different drug. Uh no, I highlighted it and it's testosterone cypionate. Fuck these doctors. Goddamn PCP knows I'm an RN and not trying to pull shit. Is he really that dumb or did he not look at the paperwork. Now off to find a competent doctor again.... Does Phoenix have one??? But I feel your pain on the Doc situation. They are very ignorant on TRT |
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WA, USA
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Posted: 11/3/2015 1:59:31 PM EST
[#40]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Misery:
Well my TRT debacle continues. My urologist would give me Androgel but not do much to mitigate certain problems I had with it or run a proper panel. I posted about it a few pages back. My issue seemed to be related to DHT and the inability to titrate the dose. One pump just shut off production and two caused problems. The urologist was like "testosterone is testosterone so..." Thanks. So I tell my PCP and he's like I'll give you injections. That way you can dial in the proper dose. Great. Nope, I get the Rx filled that says 10 mL and they give me 1 mL. So I go in person to the doctor's office with vial and say "I can't get this filled again for one month, and it's only good for 2 injections". If I inject once a week at 50 then fine, but not 100 mg. I provide AACE PDF that says once or twice dosing a month is inadequate (they do suggest a 200 mg bimonthly injection but I feel that's poor too). I mean hell, the leaflet in the test box says half-life is 7-8 days. Hello, that's not two weeks worth, let alone 4! So she takes the paper and says she'll inform the doc and call me. So today they call and say he wants me injecting once every 4 weeks and the AACE paper is wrong, or that the information pertains to a different drug. Uh no, I highlighted it and it's testosterone cypionate. Fuck these doctors. Goddamn PCP knows I'm an RN and not trying to pull shit. Is he really that dumb or did he not look at the paperwork. Now off to find a competent doctor again.... Does Phoenix have one??? This is the rule not the exception. When it comes to TRT, most Dr's are incompetent. Even specialists. The most important quality isnt finding one whose knowledgeable, but one whose open minded and will actually listen. There are solutions available nationally if one cant be found in your vicinity. But its not necessarily cheap. Start by googling compounding pharmacies in phoenix. Then start calling them up for referrals. Thats what Ive heard. |
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Posted: 11/3/2015 4:19:10 PM EST
[#41]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By killswitch: This is the rule not the exception. When it comes to TRT, most Dr's are incompetent. Even specialists. The most important quality isnt finding one whose knowledgeable, but one whose open minded and will actually listen. There are solutions available nationally if one cant be found in your vicinity. But its not necessarily cheap. Start by googling compounding pharmacies in phoenix. Then start calling them up for referrals. Thats what Ive heard. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By killswitch: Originally Posted By Misery: Well my TRT debacle continues. My urologist would give me Androgel but not do much to mitigate certain problems I had with it or run a proper panel. I posted about it a few pages back. My issue seemed to be related to DHT and the inability to titrate the dose. One pump just shut off production and two caused problems. The urologist was like "testosterone is testosterone so..." Thanks. So I tell my PCP and he's like I'll give you injections. That way you can dial in the proper dose. Great. Nope, I get the Rx filled that says 10 mL and they give me 1 mL. So I go in person to the doctor's office with vial and say "I can't get this filled again for one month, and it's only good for 2 injections". If I inject once a week at 50 then fine, but not 100 mg. I provide AACE PDF that says once or twice dosing a month is inadequate (they do suggest a 200 mg bimonthly injection but I feel that's poor too). I mean hell, the leaflet in the test box says half-life is 7-8 days. Hello, that's not two weeks worth, let alone 4! So she takes the paper and says she'll inform the doc and call me. So today they call and say he wants me injecting once every 4 weeks and the AACE paper is wrong, or that the information pertains to a different drug. Uh no, I highlighted it and it's testosterone cypionate. Fuck these doctors. Goddamn PCP knows I'm an RN and not trying to pull shit. Is he really that dumb or did he not look at the paperwork. Now off to find a competent doctor again.... Does Phoenix have one??? This is the rule not the exception. When it comes to TRT, most Dr's are incompetent. Even specialists. The most important quality isnt finding one whose knowledgeable, but one whose open minded and will actually listen. There are solutions available nationally if one cant be found in your vicinity. But its not necessarily cheap. Start by googling compounding pharmacies in phoenix. Then start calling them up for referrals. Thats what Ive heard. Go down to your local walamrt pharmacy or whatever large one you have, ask the pharmacist (not counter help) for a few doctors in the area that prescribe all three protocols Testosterone Cypionate HCG (Human Chorionic Gonadotropin) Anastrozole or Arimidex Now you have a list of doctors in your area that should have an idea what they are doing Try calling them and feeling them out on the phone first |
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Posted: 11/4/2015 12:32:45 AM EST
[#42]
To any concerned with changing from IM to sub injections.
I continue to see positive effects from a reduced dosage of 100 Mg twice a week to 50 Mg twice per week My Libido is great, E2 seems to be fine also I am guessing what I have researched and read that the sub injections have a more even effect and even amplified effect are true. I think it makes sense that the sub injections take longer to work into the system thus giving you a more balanced dose. I don't fully understand the amplified effect from sub injected into the fat layer as opposed to IM? Or it's just possible I just needed a lower dose? I know a few guys here need or want the higher dose, I always thought more is better too. Having felt out of whack on the 200 Mg a week I can tell you first hand everyone does not need a higher dose, those that do should certainly do whats right for them. My Hematocrit level has been climbing for the last 3 months to 55 at current. I am pretty sure it was the higher dose , also my PSA was going up and down too. My T even hit 1500 a few times, what is the good in that high a number? It has to be higher than most natural levels? Is there any studies on what running a high Total T number does to your endo system if anything? |
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Posted: 11/4/2015 4:34:37 AM EST
[Last Edit: EXPY37]
[#43]
HCT of 55 is too high IMO...
Monitoring HCT is so important to me I set up a personal lab a year and 1/2 ago and can spin a sample and have a reading in <4 minutes. This said, my having a relatively high HCT may have helped save my life early this year when I had a gastro intestinal bleed [bad water?] and lost ~4 L of blood, the ER never gave me a transfusion ---until I made an issue of it as I was losing my vision, and thankfully they got it started before I lost consciousness. I was out of the hospital in 32 hours. |
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Posted: 11/4/2015 4:58:03 AM EST
[#44]
I think I know what you're looking for.
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AZ, USA
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Posted: 11/4/2015 5:02:37 AM EST
[Last Edit: Misery]
[#45]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By jrzy:
Thats really not accurate , Not saying you but there is a high level of drug abuse in the med profession But I feel your pain on the Doc situation. They are very ignorant on TRT Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By jrzy:
Originally Posted By Misery:
Well my TRT debacle continues. My urologist would give me Androgel but not do much to mitigate certain problems I had with it or run a proper panel. I posted about it a few pages back. My issue seemed to be related to DHT and the inability to titrate the dose. One pump just shut off production and two caused problems. The urologist was like "testosterone is testosterone so..." Thanks. So I tell my PCP and he's like I'll give you injections. That way you can dial in the proper dose. Great. Nope, I get the Rx filled that says 10 mL and they give me 1 mL. So I go in person to the doctor's office with vial and say "I can't get this filled again for one month, and it's only good for 2 injections". If I inject once a week at 50 then fine, but not 100 mg. I provide AACE PDF that says once or twice dosing a month is inadequate (they do suggest a 200 mg bimonthly injection but I feel that's poor too). I mean hell, the leaflet in the test box says half-life is 7-8 days. Hello, that's not two weeks worth, let alone 4! So she takes the paper and says she'll inform the doc and call me. So today they call and say he wants me injecting once every 4 weeks and the AACE paper is wrong, or that the information pertains to a different drug. Uh no, I highlighted it and it's testosterone cypionate. Fuck these doctors. Goddamn PCP knows I'm an RN and not trying to pull shit. Is he really that dumb or did he not look at the paperwork. Now off to find a competent doctor again.... Does Phoenix have one??? But I feel your pain on the Doc situation. They are very ignorant on TRT Well in my case it is, not just because I'm an RN, but because I've gone to this guy for over 7 years. He's usually really good about whatever I need. Even with the test he was like "so we don't need to give you needles you can just use what you have at work". Kinda unscrupulous. Yet he won't read up a little and see the correct info. Even my 17th edition of Harrison's from 2008 says 100 my per week. That's the IM bible lol. Yes a lot of medical literature is too conservative about dosing. Mainly d/t lack of knowledge or momentum for an area that needs further study. It is starting to catch up though so these docs should either invest a few minutes looking into things or refer to someone else. Even with conservative information or lowball dosing instructions from older references, it still says to monitor labs. That's the part that gets me. They just do crappy dosing and skimp on labs. |
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WA, USA
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Posted: 11/4/2015 9:13:07 AM EST
[#46]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By jrzy:
To add to what Killswitch said: Go down to your local walamrt pharmacy or whatever large one you have, ask the pharmacist (not counter help) for a few doctors in the area that prescribe all three protocols Testosterone Cypionate HCG (Human Chorionic Gonadotropin) Anastrozole or Arimidex Now you have a list of doctors in your area that should have an idea what they are doing Try calling them and feeling them out on the phone first I'm about to do this. My TRT doc charges me 1800/yr and my health ins doesn't cover any of it, it's all out of pocket. That's up from 1500 last year. Now, if that's the going rate for feeling good, so be it, but if i can find someone who will cover it under my insurance, then that's even better. Just need someone that will prescribe the top shelf stuff, i don't want anything out of china. Read there was a couple clinics shut down recently for botulism in their prescription meds. Don't need that shit. I don't really need my hand held either. Just need someone who will write me prescriptions and listen to me when i tell them how i'm feeling as well as order blood panels when i need them every 3 to 6 months sometimes. |
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Posted: 11/4/2015 11:57:06 AM EST
[#47]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By EXPY37: HCT of 55 is too high IMO... Monitoring HCT is so important to me I set up a personal lab a year and 1/2 ago and can spin a sample and have a reading in <4 minutes. This said, my having a relatively high HCT may have helped save my life early this year when I had a gastro intestinal bleed [bad water?] and lost ~4 L of blood, the ER never gave me a transfusion ---until I made an issue of it as I was losing my vision, and thankfully they got it started before I lost consciousness. I was out of the hospital in 32 hours. I am pretty sure my HCT is coming down, I cut back the red meat and the lower dose T should bring it down. I was giving blood last year but it didn't keep it down long. I went twice this year to donate blood and the second I walk through the door to give blood my pulse rises above 100 and they won't let me donate blood, my BP is 120/80 but they don't care. |
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Posted: 11/4/2015 12:13:42 PM EST
[#48]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By EXPY37:
HCT of 55 is too high IMO... Monitoring HCT is so important to me I set up a personal lab a year and 1/2 ago and can spin a sample and have a reading in <4 minutes. Yeah. You're gonna have to share the details on this. That's badass |
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Posted: 11/4/2015 12:15:47 PM EST
[#49]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By jrzy:
I am going to pull labs this week. I am pretty sure my HCT is coming down, I cut back the red meat and the lower dose T should bring it down. I was giving blood last year but it didn't keep it down long. I went twice this year to donate blood and the second I walk through the door to give blood my pulse rises above 100 and they won't let me donate blood, my BP is 120/80 but they don't care. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By jrzy:
Originally Posted By EXPY37:
HCT of 55 is too high IMO... Monitoring HCT is so important to me I set up a personal lab a year and 1/2 ago and can spin a sample and have a reading in <4 minutes. This said, my having a relatively high HCT may have helped save my life early this year when I had a gastro intestinal bleed [bad water?] and lost ~4 L of blood, the ER never gave me a transfusion ---until I made an issue of it as I was losing my vision, and thankfully they got it started before I lost consciousness. I was out of the hospital in 32 hours. I am pretty sure my HCT is coming down, I cut back the red meat and the lower dose T should bring it down. I was giving blood last year but it didn't keep it down long. I went twice this year to donate blood and the second I walk through the door to give blood my pulse rises above 100 and they won't let me donate blood, my BP is 120/80 but they don't care. I have the same problem. "It's for my safety"
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Posted: 11/4/2015 12:28:29 PM EST
[Last Edit: SWIRE]
[#50]
Does anyone have experience with feeling too warm and excessive sweating as part of a TRT side effect. I'll have labs done soon to see what my levels are but I know something is out of wack. Work is probably 75 degrees and I'm sitting at a desk, bunch I'm burning up and sweating. Same when I get home. Unless I have a direct fan blowing on me I will be sweating.
This started when I added the compounding pharmacy testosterone creme in addition to the injections, which is what I was instructed to do. Dose is 50mg twice a week of Test C, 40mg every day of the cream, and 500iu of HCG 4x a week. Is this just high E2 or should I have other hormones or blood components checked? Also the November code for PrivateMDLabs is FBLEAVES |
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