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Posted: 3/11/2015 8:50:25 PM EST
[#1]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By NoloContendere: Subguns deletes a post that is not inflammatory in the least. I posted: "what would it take for you to believe? A national organization stepping in?" And they deleted it.  |
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Posted: 3/11/2015 8:57:10 PM EST
[#2]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By NoloContendere:
Subguns deletes a post that is not inflammatory in the least. I posted: "what would it take for you to believe? A national organization stepping in?" And they deleted it. They don't want to believe. |
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PA, USA
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Posted: 3/11/2015 8:59:24 PM EST
[#3]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By k75zracer:
Look at my question from above.... I think that in addition to them losing some of their control.... I think that they are scared about the prosecutions and investigations (along with the respect and manhours) of unregistered MG's, along with the potential loss of all of those cases they spent so much time and money on....Add that into the fact that their agency would in essence be turned upside down... rather than an enforcer, they would become an enabler. And I don't think they are even close to being able to do that function, either by design or by want. Remember, those in charge now were those that were brought on during the clinton years and now have risen to the heights of their .gov careers, just to see it all go down against their beliefs and practices over the past 20 odd years. Of course, I could be wrong, and if I am, someone show me where my thoughts are incorrect (I really would like to hear some arguments against these thoughts!). Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By k75zracer:
Originally Posted By peekay:
Originally Posted By FlyingGorilla:
Word from a little birdie who knows an examiner says that there are a lot of scared high level personnel inside ATF over this case. Hearing that last week then seeing this weak-assed reply makes me wonder if thy might not be giving up and hoping that judgement doesn't go against them further than repealing 922.o. What are they scared of? Why do they even the slightest of fucks about the whole thing? I don't understand why they would even bother to put up a fight. It's another fucking form they have to process. They aren't out anything. Look at my question from above.... I think that in addition to them losing some of their control.... I think that they are scared about the prosecutions and investigations (along with the respect and manhours) of unregistered MG's, along with the potential loss of all of those cases they spent so much time and money on....Add that into the fact that their agency would in essence be turned upside down... rather than an enforcer, they would become an enabler. And I don't think they are even close to being able to do that function, either by design or by want. Remember, those in charge now were those that were brought on during the clinton years and now have risen to the heights of their .gov careers, just to see it all go down against their beliefs and practices over the past 20 odd years. Of course, I could be wrong, and if I am, someone show me where my thoughts are incorrect (I really would like to hear some arguments against these thoughts!). Here's one. Most of the cases they bring are invented of whole cloth. They identify a mark. They approach, and offer to sell machine guns, explosives or both. Once the mark agrees, they bust, and then celebrate it as a budget-building, public relations triumph; stopping the very worst of terrorist plots. The FBI has been doing this almost exclusively of late rather than building cases out of actual leads. They enjoy absolute power now. That dies very, very hard. |
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USA
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Posted: 3/11/2015 8:59:53 PM EST
[#4]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Diesel_Maximus_2992:
not surprised Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Diesel_Maximus_2992:
Originally Posted By NoloContendere:
Subguns deletes a post that is not inflammatory in the least. I posted: "what would it take for you to believe? A national organization stepping in?" And they deleted it. Subguns doesn't delete posts......It's true, I heard it from a subguns fanboii earlier in this very thread. People: DO NOT LET YOUR GUARD DOWN!!!! Some of our own worst enemies will come from within as evidenced from the comments like the ones on subguns and other sites. |
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Posted: 3/11/2015 9:01:07 PM EST
[#5]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By NoloContendere:
Subguns deletes a post that is not inflammatory in the least. I posted: "what would it take for you to believe? A national organization stepping in?" And they deleted it. And would this have anything to do with your "game changer" post earlier? |
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Posted: 3/11/2015 9:02:01 PM EST
[#6]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By dlm1984:
And would this have anything to do with your "game changer" post earlier? Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By dlm1984:
Originally Posted By NoloContendere:
Subguns deletes a post that is not inflammatory in the least. I posted: "what would it take for you to believe? A national organization stepping in?" And they deleted it. And would this have anything to do with your "game changer" post earlier? Patience. 
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Posted: 3/11/2015 9:02:10 PM EST
[#7]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By jcriley:
Subguns doesn't delete posts......It's true, I heard it from a subguns fanboii earlier in this very thread. People: DO NOT LET YOUR GUARD DOWN!!!! Some of our own worst enemies will come from within as evidenced from the comments like the ones on subguns and other sites. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By jcriley:
Originally Posted By Diesel_Maximus_2992:
Originally Posted By NoloContendere:
Subguns deletes a post that is not inflammatory in the least. I posted: "what would it take for you to believe? A national organization stepping in?" And they deleted it. Subguns doesn't delete posts......It's true, I heard it from a subguns fanboii earlier in this very thread. People: DO NOT LET YOUR GUARD DOWN!!!! Some of our own worst enemies will come from within as evidenced from the comments like the ones on subguns and other sites. They have easily made the case for defamation by now, so I just screenshot their posts. |
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FL, USA
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Posted: 3/11/2015 9:03:00 PM EST
[#8]
NOLO, just out of curiosity how is the money going?
Do you have enough as of now? |
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Posted: 3/11/2015 9:03:50 PM EST
[#9]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By NoloContendere:
They have easily made the case for defamation by now, so I just screenshot their posts. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By NoloContendere:
Originally Posted By jcriley:
Originally Posted By Diesel_Maximus_2992:
Originally Posted By NoloContendere:
Subguns deletes a post that is not inflammatory in the least. I posted: "what would it take for you to believe? A national organization stepping in?" And they deleted it. Subguns doesn't delete posts......It's true, I heard it from a subguns fanboii earlier in this very thread. People: DO NOT LET YOUR GUARD DOWN!!!! Some of our own worst enemies will come from within as evidenced from the comments like the ones on subguns and other sites. They have easily made the case for defamation by now, so I just screenshot their posts. https://archive.org/index.php is another good resource.
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Posted: 3/11/2015 9:04:39 PM EST
[#10]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By NoloContendere: Subguns deletes a post that is not inflammatory in the least. I posted: "what would it take for you to believe? A national organization stepping in?" And they deleted it.  |
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OH, USA
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Posted: 3/11/2015 9:07:03 PM EST
[#11]
"NOLO, just out of curiosity how is the money going? Do you have enough as of now?"
"They have easily made the case for defamation by now, so I just screenshot their posts." IE subguns. I think he anwsered this in the first post mu ha ha... |
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Posted: 3/11/2015 9:08:01 PM EST
[#12]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By TescoVee:
If the NFA and tax doesn't go away I would be in favor of putting tax stamp dollars towards improving approval times. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By TescoVee:
Originally Posted By Mariner82:
Yeah... change the law so that ATF keeps the stamp revenue in house for their operating budget and watch how fast they start cranking out stamps. BATFE really should be a store, who doesn't like their products?. The BATFE budget this year is $1.1 Billion. Even if they got the NFA revenue, it would have no impact on operations. |
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PA, USA
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Posted: 3/11/2015 9:08:17 PM EST
[Last Edit: k75zracer]
[#13]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By fargo007:
Here's one. Most of the cases they bring are invented of whole cloth. They identify a mark. They approach, and offer to sell machine guns, explosives or both. Once the mark agrees, they bust, and then celebrate it as a budget-building, public relations triumph; stopping the very worst of terrorist plots. The FBI has been doing this almost exclusively of late rather than building cases out of actual leads. They enjoy absolute power now. That dies very, very hard. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By fargo007:
Originally Posted By k75zracer:
Originally Posted By peekay:
Originally Posted By FlyingGorilla:
Word from a little birdie who knows an examiner says that there are a lot of scared high level personnel inside ATF over this case. Hearing that last week then seeing this weak-assed reply makes me wonder if thy might not be giving up and hoping that judgement doesn't go against them further than repealing 922.o. What are they scared of? Why do they even the slightest of fucks about the whole thing? I don't understand why they would even bother to put up a fight. It's another fucking form they have to process. They aren't out anything. Look at my question from above.... I think that in addition to them losing some of their control.... I think that they are scared about the prosecutions and investigations (along with the respect and manhours) of unregistered MG's, along with the potential loss of all of those cases they spent so much time and money on....Add that into the fact that their agency would in essence be turned upside down... rather than an enforcer, they would become an enabler. And I don't think they are even close to being able to do that function, either by design or by want. Remember, those in charge now were those that were brought on during the clinton years and now have risen to the heights of their .gov careers, just to see it all go down against their beliefs and practices over the past 20 odd years. Of course, I could be wrong, and if I am, someone show me where my thoughts are incorrect (I really would like to hear some arguments against these thoughts!). Here's one. Most of the cases they bring are invented of whole cloth. They identify a mark. They approach, and offer to sell machine guns, explosives or both. Once the mark agrees, they bust, and then celebrate it as a budget-building, public relations triumph; stopping the very worst of terrorist plots. The FBI has been doing this almost exclusively of late rather than building cases out of actual leads. They enjoy absolute power now. That dies very, very hard. But doesn't your statement make my case though? All of those fabricated cases, those prosecuted and convicted would now have standing to have those cases overturned, and those folks right restored... to say nothing of the possible lawsuits due to false prosecution? |
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VA, USA
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Posted: 3/11/2015 9:09:44 PM EST
[#14]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Hard_Rock: McDonald v. Chicago 2010. 2nd Amendment was Incorporated under the 14th as a Fundamental Right. This elevates it above even a Civil Right. Now with that being said... "You may not apply a fee or tax to the exercise of a Civil Right". Reference the Poll Tax Amendment as well. So, the Government has a very high bar to reach on that one...  Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Hard_Rock: Originally Posted By Beach: Originally Posted By ARDestructo: Guys, taxes were constitutional before shit-care got upheld, and the NFA has always been under the federal government's taxing power. Taxes are constitutional. Healthcare is not constitutionally supported. Can you point out a tax on the first amendment? If not, how can you tax the second? McDonald v. Chicago 2010. 2nd Amendment was Incorporated under the 14th as a Fundamental Right. This elevates it above even a Civil Right. Now with that being said... "You may not apply a fee or tax to the exercise of a Civil Right". Reference the Poll Tax Amendment as well. So, the Government has a very high bar to reach on that one... Yeah, like I posted previously go for the tax angle. Don't argue if machinegun is legal or not. Force the NFA to be rule unconstitutional under taxation. So the ball will pass back to congress and I doubt a NFA lite will become law. |
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Posted: 3/11/2015 9:14:10 PM EST
[Last Edit: dlshady]
[#15]
Aside from the "I know you are, but what am I?" sur-sur-reply from the BATFE in the TX case, what's the latest in the PA case? I don't think we've seen an update on that one in a while?
And for the record, Thanks NOLO! You're a scholar and a gentleman! |
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PA, USA
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Posted: 3/11/2015 9:14:22 PM EST
[#16]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By k75zracer:
But doesn't your statement make my case though? All of those fabricated cases, those prosecuted and convicted would now have standing to have those cases overturned, and those folks right restored... to say nothing of the possible lawsuits due to false prosecution? Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By k75zracer:
Originally Posted By fargo007:
Originally Posted By k75zracer:
Originally Posted By peekay:
Originally Posted By FlyingGorilla:
Word from a little birdie who knows an examiner says that there are a lot of scared high level personnel inside ATF over this case. Hearing that last week then seeing this weak-assed reply makes me wonder if thy might not be giving up and hoping that judgement doesn't go against them further than repealing 922.o. What are they scared of? Why do they even the slightest of fucks about the whole thing? I don't understand why they would even bother to put up a fight. It's another fucking form they have to process. They aren't out anything. Look at my question from above.... I think that in addition to them losing some of their control.... I think that they are scared about the prosecutions and investigations (along with the respect and manhours) of unregistered MG's, along with the potential loss of all of those cases they spent so much time and money on....Add that into the fact that their agency would in essence be turned upside down... rather than an enforcer, they would become an enabler. And I don't think they are even close to being able to do that function, either by design or by want. Remember, those in charge now were those that were brought on during the clinton years and now have risen to the heights of their .gov careers, just to see it all go down against their beliefs and practices over the past 20 odd years. Of course, I could be wrong, and if I am, someone show me where my thoughts are incorrect (I really would like to hear some arguments against these thoughts!). Here's one. Most of the cases they bring are invented of whole cloth. They identify a mark. They approach, and offer to sell machine guns, explosives or both. Once the mark agrees, they bust, and then celebrate it as a budget-building, public relations triumph; stopping the very worst of terrorist plots. The FBI has been doing this almost exclusively of late rather than building cases out of actual leads. They enjoy absolute power now. That dies very, very hard. But doesn't your statement make my case though? All of those fabricated cases, those prosecuted and convicted would now have standing to have those cases overturned, and those folks right restored... to say nothing of the possible lawsuits due to false prosecution? We're seeing it from different angles. Yes, it would "potentially" affect some of those patently bogus-anyway cases in flight. But I think their bigger worry is that it will impact their playbook in terms of going out there and creating invented turnkey cases, and they'll show dramatically less progress and stand on far weaker budgeting footing if they have to work only true accurate leads. |
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PA, USA
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Posted: 3/11/2015 9:19:11 PM EST
[#17]
We're seeing it from different angles. Yes, it would "potentially" affect some of those patently bogus-anyway cases in flight. But I think their bigger worry is that it will impact their playbook in terms of going out there and creating invented turnkey cases, and they'll show dramatically less progress and stand on far weaker budgeting footing if they have to work only true accurate leads. Ok, I see your point! That's a good way to look at it. |
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USA
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Posted: 3/11/2015 9:23:19 PM EST
[#18]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By NoloContendere:
They have easily made the case for defamation by now, so I just screenshot their posts. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By NoloContendere:
Originally Posted By jcriley:
Originally Posted By Diesel_Maximus_2992:
Originally Posted By NoloContendere:
Subguns deletes a post that is not inflammatory in the least. I posted: "what would it take for you to believe? A national organization stepping in?" And they deleted it. Subguns doesn't delete posts......It's true, I heard it from a subguns fanboii earlier in this very thread. People: DO NOT LET YOUR GUARD DOWN!!!! Some of our own worst enemies will come from within as evidenced from the comments like the ones on subguns and other sites. They have easily made the case for defamation by now, so I just screenshot their posts. Oh, I know. I've seen all their posts, unfortunately I didn't screen shot them and the mods there have done a thorough job scrubbing and sanitizing their board of them. Both he and the one posting as 'different anon' have crossed the line, doesn't take an attorney to see that. There would be some irony though, if those two ended up funding this lawsuit, even if it was indirectly. |
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Posted: 3/11/2015 9:24:29 PM EST
[#19]
Hoping this is resolved swiftly in our favor. I have 3 ARs that are hoping for happy switches.
Thanks Nolo for all your hard work on this. |
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Posted: 3/11/2015 9:31:06 PM EST
[#20]
Kick some ass nolo. I have 17 ars wanting giggle switches. Update in pa?
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Posted: 3/11/2015 9:33:15 PM EST
[#21]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By endofdays:
Kick some ass nolo. I have 17 ars wanting giggle switches. Update in pa? Damn and I thought having 10 and a couple unbuilt lowers was a lot of ARs |
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Posted: 3/11/2015 9:36:01 PM EST
[#22]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By williewvr:
Damn and I thought having 10 and a couple unbuilt lowers was a lot of ARs Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By williewvr:
Originally Posted By endofdays:
Kick some ass nolo. I have 17 ars wanting giggle switches. Update in pa? Damn and I thought having 10 and a couple unbuilt lowers was a lot of ARs Nah, that's just a good start...
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Posted: 3/11/2015 9:37:31 PM EST
[#23]
Quote HistoryQuote HistoryOriginally Posted By jcriley:
Originally Posted By X-CaptHook:
...Meanwhile, on the subgun website...  Well, it was just a matter of time. Subguns........keepin' it douchey You know what could be fun...take a screen cap of the subguns classifieds the day before and the day after a win in Hollis or Watson and start a thread there.... |
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Posted: 3/11/2015 9:39:02 PM EST
[#24]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Hard_Rock:
I am utterly stunned at this. I'm not sure how to translate the massive amount of fail by the Government but I noticed that Mr. Soskin didn't sign this... is there a lovers quarrel happening in DOJ, ATF and the AUSA? I'm not sure if they're throwing in the towel, think they can compromise the judge, or are just this stupid and incompetent but... HOLY FUCK. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Hard_Rock:
I am utterly stunned at this. I'm not sure how to translate the massive amount of fail by the Government but I noticed that Mr. Soskin didn't sign this... is there a lovers quarrel happening in DOJ, ATF and the AUSA? I'm not sure if they're throwing in the towel, think they can compromise the judge, or are just this stupid and incompetent but... HOLY FUCK. 
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Posted: 3/11/2015 9:56:59 PM EST
[#25]
Quote HistoryGood enough for government work. |
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Posted: 3/11/2015 9:58:46 PM EST
[#26]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By mean_sartin:
Good enough for government work. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By mean_sartin:
Good enough for government work. 
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Posted: 3/11/2015 10:04:29 PM EST
[#27]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By NoloContendere:
Subguns deletes a post that is not inflammatory in the least. I posted: "what would it take for you to believe? A national organization stepping in?" And they deleted it. Is "A Legal Type Guy" code for paralegal? |
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WA, USA
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Posted: 3/11/2015 10:14:47 PM EST
[#28]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By fargo007:
We're seeing it from different angles. Yes, it would "potentially" affect some of those patently bogus-anyway cases in flight. But I think their bigger worry is that it will impact their playbook in terms of going out there and creating invented turnkey cases, and they'll show dramatically less progress and stand on far weaker budgeting footing if they have to work only true accurate leads. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By fargo007:
Originally Posted By k75zracer:
Originally Posted By fargo007:
Originally Posted By k75zracer:
Look at my question from above.... I think that in addition to them losing some of their control.... I think that they are scared about the prosecutions and investigations (along with the respect and manhours) of unregistered MG's, along with the potential loss of all of those cases they spent so much time and money on....Add that into the fact that their agency would in essence be turned upside down... rather than an enforcer, they would become an enabler. And I don't think they are even close to being able to do that function, either by design or by want. Remember, those in charge now were those that were brought on during the clinton years and now have risen to the heights of their .gov careers, just to see it all go down against their beliefs and practices over the past 20 odd years. Of course, I could be wrong, and if I am, someone show me where my thoughts are incorrect (I really would like to hear some arguments against these thoughts!). Here's one. Most of the cases they bring are invented of whole cloth. They identify a mark. They approach, and offer to sell machine guns, explosives or both. Once the mark agrees, they bust, and then celebrate it as a budget-building, public relations triumph; stopping the very worst of terrorist plots. The FBI has been doing this almost exclusively of late rather than building cases out of actual leads. They enjoy absolute power now. That dies very, very hard. But doesn't your statement make my case though? All of those fabricated cases, those prosecuted and convicted would now have standing to have those cases overturned, and those folks right restored... to say nothing of the possible lawsuits due to false prosecution? We're seeing it from different angles. Yes, it would "potentially" affect some of those patently bogus-anyway cases in flight. But I think their bigger worry is that it will impact their playbook in terms of going out there and creating invented turnkey cases, and they'll show dramatically less progress and stand on far weaker budgeting footing if they have to work only true accurate leads. I think that with 922o tossed out, the ATF can rely on NFA (if it doesn't get tossed...) to prosecute unreg'd MG instead of making/possession of a post-86. Of course, that opens up to possibility of defense against such charges due to the historical inaccuracy of the NFRTR, as well as discovery that would shine a light on possible unequal treatment under the laws. |
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Posted: 3/11/2015 10:22:25 PM EST
[#29]
I can see the administration raising the tax stamp to $10,000 after something like this. That would stink.
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MI, USA
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Posted: 3/11/2015 10:24:47 PM EST
[#30]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By ricky_45: I can see the administration raising the tax stamp to $10,000 after something like this. That would stink. |
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Posted: 3/11/2015 10:40:29 PM EST
[#31]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By FlyingGorilla:
Word from a little birdie who knows an examiner says that there are a lot of scared high level personnel inside ATF over this case. Hearing that last week then seeing this weak-assed reply makes me wonder if thy might not be giving up and hoping that judgement doesn't go against them further than repealing 922.o. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By FlyingGorilla:
Originally Posted By Bloencustoms:
Originally Posted By maleante:
Plaintiff’s surreply brief adds little to the arguments before the Court.1 Defendants therefore rest on their previous briefs, and are prepared to address any specific questions the Court may have in a supplemental filing or at oral argument. Accordingly, for the reasons statedabove and in Defendants’ opening and reply briefs, the Court should dismiss this case or enter summary judgment for Defendants. Wow. Either it's' "We got nuthin", or they have some kind of assurance they will win. Maybe got some dirt on the judge or something. To me it looks like they have either given up, or are very confident of success. Word from a little birdie who knows an examiner says that there are a lot of scared high level personnel inside ATF over this case. Hearing that last week then seeing this weak-assed reply makes me wonder if thy might not be giving up and hoping that judgement doesn't go against them further than repealing 922.o. If it does we all start filing F1s with our trusts. |
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Posted: 3/11/2015 10:40:44 PM EST
[#32]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By SK468:
Only congress can raise it through legislation. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By SK468:
Originally Posted By ricky_45:
I can see the administration raising the tax stamp to $10,000 after something like this. That would stink. I know what you are saying, but still don't think that would stop this administration from adding "processing fees." |
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Posted: 3/11/2015 10:45:23 PM EST
[Last Edit: Top_Secret]
[#33]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By yavorssj:
I know what you are saying, but still don't think that would stop this administration from adding "processing fees." Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By yavorssj:
Originally Posted By SK468:
Originally Posted By ricky_45:
I can see the administration raising the tax stamp to $10,000 after something like this. That would stink. I know what you are saying, but still don't think that would stop this administration from adding "processing fees." Still a tax. If they could have done so under the guise of "fees" they would have at this point. |
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TN, USA
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Posted: 3/11/2015 11:00:43 PM EST
[#34]
Interesting.....
Good work Nolo! |
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Posted: 3/11/2015 11:13:53 PM EST
[#35]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By jcriley:
Subguns doesn't delete posts......It's true, I heard it from a subguns fanboii earlier in this very thread. People: DO NOT LET YOUR GUARD DOWN!!!! Some of our own worst enemies will come from within as evidenced from the comments like the ones on subguns and other sites. Because it needs to be repeated 
This case has brought them out of the woodwork |
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Posted: 3/11/2015 11:13:59 PM EST
[Last Edit: FlyingGorilla]
[#36]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By NoloContendere:
If the court orders it, then we will have oral arguments. If they do not, the court can rule on the fully briefed motion at its leisure. I suspect we have arguments. Nothing has been set yet. Wish there could be TV coverage or webcast for oral arguments in Federal courts. I'd pay to watch the ATF legal team try and tap dance their way around the issues in front of the judge if this gets an impartial hearing. |
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Posted: 3/11/2015 11:34:08 PM EST
[#37]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By FlyingGorilla:
Wish there could be TV coverage or webcast for oral arguments in Federal courts. I'd pay to watch the ATF legal team try and tap dance their way around the issues in front of the judge if this gets an impartial hearing. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By FlyingGorilla:
Originally Posted By NoloContendere:
If the court orders it, then we will have oral arguments. If they do not, the court can rule on the fully briefed motion at its leisure. I suspect we have arguments. Nothing has been set yet. Wish there could be TV coverage or webcast for oral arguments in Federal courts. I'd pay to watch the ATF legal team try and tap dance their way around the issues in front of the judge if this gets an impartial hearing. I'm sure Nolo will correct me if I'm wrong, but all of this is just about the Motion to Dismiss. Assuming the judge denies the motion, then the trial gets scheduled, and the real maneuvering starts. The current government claim under discussion is that Hollis has no merit to his case, and the court should not hear the case. |
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Posted: 3/12/2015 6:28:16 AM EST
[#38]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By NoloContendere:
Subguns deletes a post that is not inflammatory in the least. I posted: "what would it take for you to believe? A national organization stepping in?" And they deleted it. Soon? |
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Posted: 3/12/2015 7:10:05 AM EST
[Last Edit: NoloContendere]
[#39]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By dlshady:
Aside from the "I know you are, but what am I?" sur-sur-reply from the BATFE in the TX case, what's the latest in the PA case? I don't think we've seen an update on that one in a while? And for the record, Thanks NOLO! You're a scholar and a gentleman! PA case is waiting for the judge to grant or deny DOJs motion for leave to file a reply. In PA you don't get a reply as of right. Eta: as soon as judge grants it I will let you know. |
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Posted: 3/12/2015 7:30:58 AM EST
[#40]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Andrapos:
Wow. That's all  Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Andrapos:
Wow. That's all I'm no lawyer but even I can figure it out....they got NOTHING! 
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Posted: 3/12/2015 7:33:51 AM EST
[#41]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Hard_Rock:
Yep, because this case opens several BIG doors and they know it. The Hughes Amendment falls and next is NFA... then the dominoes will just start falling. Sporting Purpose... Unconstitutionally vague. NFA... Taxing the exercise of a Civil Right... Importation ban... Oh the ways that can be killed from 2nd Amendment grounds to things like monopoly laws and stuff. Yeah, ATF has every right to be scared... the shit they've pushed on us over the last 80 years is coming home to roost in a BAD way. The party is over and there isn't a fucking thing they can do about it. If the Judge finds in their favor, we know that she's been bought simply because Nolo's case is as air fucking tight as a virgin nuns ass. ATF's case has more holes than a sponge. I'm just wondering how ATF is going to handle any discovery requests relating to the NFRTR... Should prove quite interesting. Maybe they shouldn't have ever fucked with a few certain people in the industry... Bet their regretting that stupid move right about now. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Hard_Rock:
Originally Posted By FlyingGorilla:
Originally Posted By Bloencustoms:
Originally Posted By maleante:
Plaintiff’s surreply brief adds little to the arguments before the Court.1 Defendants therefore rest on their previous briefs, and are prepared to address any specific questions the Court may have in a supplemental filing or at oral argument. Accordingly, for the reasons statedabove and in Defendants’ opening and reply briefs, the Court should dismiss this case or enter summary judgment for Defendants. Wow. Either it's' "We got nuthin", or they have some kind of assurance they will win. Maybe got some dirt on the judge or something. To me it looks like they have either given up, or are very confident of success. Word from a little birdie who knows an examiner says that there are a lot of scared high level personnel inside ATF over this case. Hearing that last week then seeing this weak-assed reply makes me wonder if thy might not be giving up and hoping that judgement doesn't go against them further than repealing 922.o. Yep, because this case opens several BIG doors and they know it. The Hughes Amendment falls and next is NFA... then the dominoes will just start falling. Sporting Purpose... Unconstitutionally vague. NFA... Taxing the exercise of a Civil Right... Importation ban... Oh the ways that can be killed from 2nd Amendment grounds to things like monopoly laws and stuff. Yeah, ATF has every right to be scared... the shit they've pushed on us over the last 80 years is coming home to roost in a BAD way. The party is over and there isn't a fucking thing they can do about it. If the Judge finds in their favor, we know that she's been bought simply because Nolo's case is as air fucking tight as a virgin nuns ass. ATF's case has more holes than a sponge. I'm just wondering how ATF is going to handle any discovery requests relating to the NFRTR... Should prove quite interesting. Maybe they shouldn't have ever fucked with a few certain people in the industry... Bet their regretting that stupid move right about now. I had always thought before NOLO's case was to attack the Firearms and Ammunition Excise Tax (FAET), then you go after the NFA tax stamp. I mentioned it once and people got all but hurt because some of it goes to wildlife conservation. |
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Posted: 3/12/2015 8:06:07 AM EST
[#42]
Have there been any industry people getting behind this?
I recall a thread a while back about repealing Hughes or the NFA registry and asking about manufacturers who supported it. One or two responses to my question were from people in the industry supporting repeal of both. |
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Posted: 3/12/2015 8:33:27 AM EST
[#43]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By jesse2194:
I had always thought before NOLO's case was to attack the Firearms and Ammunition Excise Tax (FAET), then you go after the NFA tax stamp. I mentioned it once and people got all but hurt because some of it goes to wildlife conservation. if they think that federal funds allocated toward wildlife conservation actually conserve wildlife, they better think twice lolgovernment |
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Posted: 3/12/2015 8:39:58 AM EST
[Last Edit: Top_Secret]
[#44]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By jesse2194:
I had always thought before NOLO's case was to attack the Firearms and Ammunition Excise Tax (FAET), then you go after the NFA tax stamp. I mentioned it once and people got all but hurt because some of it goes to wildlife conservation. I was informed I was a basement dweller for pointing out that the FAET was unconstitutional. 
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Posted: 3/12/2015 8:42:02 AM EST
[#45]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Chris0013:
Have there been any industry people getting behind this? I recall a thread a while back about repealing Hughes or the NFA registry and asking about manufacturers who supported it. One or two responses to my question were from people in the industry supporting repeal of both. I"m an 07/02 SOT and yes, I'm 1000% for this. As are others. More than that, I prefer to not say at this time.
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Posted: 3/12/2015 8:47:55 AM EST
[#46]
Asked this before, never got an answer...
What is your plan if this whole thing just ends up with the ATF giving up and letting you have this small victory. Two guys get guns, boo hoo. Without an appeal ruling or a supreme court ruling, it doesn't mean jack shit to anyone other than the two plaintiffs, correct? |
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TX, USA
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Posted: 3/12/2015 8:50:19 AM EST
[#47]
When is this thing set for trial?
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Posted: 3/12/2015 8:51:29 AM EST
[#48]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By NoloContendere:
Subguns deletes a post that is not inflammatory in the least. I posted: "what would it take for you to believe? A national organization stepping in?" And they deleted it. Say Whaaaaaaat? 
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Posted: 3/12/2015 8:55:01 AM EST
[#49]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By NoloContendere:
PA case is waiting for the judge to grant or deny DOJs motion for leave to file a reply. In PA you don't get a reply as of right. Eta: as soon as judge grants it I will let you know. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By NoloContendere:
Originally Posted By dlshady:
Aside from the "I know you are, but what am I?" sur-sur-reply from the BATFE in the TX case, what's the latest in the PA case? I don't think we've seen an update on that one in a while? And for the record, Thanks NOLO! You're a scholar and a gentleman! PA case is waiting for the judge to grant or deny DOJs motion for leave to file a reply. In PA you don't get a reply as of right. Eta: as soon as judge grants it I will let you know. Thanks! |
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Posted: 3/12/2015 8:56:09 AM EST
[#50]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Xepho: Asked this before, never got an answer... What is your plan if this whole thing just ends up with the ATF giving up and letting you have this small victory. Two guys get guns, boo hoo. Without an appeal ruling or a supreme court ruling, it doesn't mean jack shit to anyone other than the two plaintiffs, correct? |
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