Originally Posted By doc540:
Are the Ukrainians for the most part operating inside the Russian's decision cycle?

Or has it been a techno/armor slugfest so far?

Originally Posted By realwar:
Video has also since emerged which appears to show two rescue vessels approaching the burning ship - one to the left side and one to the right - in which a Russian voice can be heard speaking. One man says 'what the f*** are you doing?' before the short clip ends.

Analysts and experts who reviewed the images say they do appear genuine. It is unlikely that Russia will confirm the authenticity of the pictures, amid a near-total information blackout around the sinking which is a huge embarrassment to Vladimir Putin's beleaguered armed forces.  

Moscow did stage what appeared to be a parade of crew members in the port of Sevastopol - in occupied Crimea - on Sunday, during which the captain of the warship and between 150 and 250 members of its crew were shown on camera alongside Black Sea Admiral Nikolai Yevmenov. The Moskva typically carries up to 510 sailors, and there was no word on the whereabouts of the remaining crew or their condition.

But horror accounts of the sinking have started to emerge from conscripts serving on board the ship, with one telling his parents that at least 40 members of the crew were killed with 'many' left missing or maimed with lost limbs after the strike. Hundreds are thought to have died as the vessel went down.

VIDEO

"A man whose son was taken away in such a vile way is not afraid of anything."


https://i.dailymail.co.uk/1s/2022/04/18/09/56736135-10727703-image-a-31_1650271707897.jpg


Parents of another conscript say they have found out some 200 were wounded - many with horrific burns and other major injuries.


She indicated that the Defence Ministry is stopping the survivors from going home, perhaps to prevent accounts of the calamity for Putin reaching the outside world.


Speaking about the sinking of the Moskva, one mother who spoke to Russian investigative newspaper Novaya Gazeta - which is now operating outside the country having been gagged by Putin - said: 'I first heard from him only on 15 April, two days after the incident.'

'My son said the cruiser was hit from the land, from the Ukrainian side, because the fire on board would not have started without a reason. There are people who were killed, wounded and missing.

'My son called me as soon as they were given phones [after being rescued]. Their documents and phones were on the cruiser. He called me, and he cried over what he had seen. It was horrendous. Clearly not everyone survived.'

She said: 'Most of the wounded have limbs torn off, because of the explosions from both the missiles and the detonated ammunition. My son was crying when he called me on 15 April.

'He said: 'Mamochka (tender for mum), I never thought I'd get into such a mess during supposedly peaceful times. I won't even tell you the details of what I've seen, it was so horrendous.'

The mother said: 'I don't want to share his name because I am scared to damage my son. They signed non-disclosure agreements before boarding the cruiser. Please understand me, I am terrified. I am petrified, and I don't know how I will wait for my son to return.'


https://i.dailymail.co.uk/1s/2022/04/18/08/56600985-10727703-image-a-19_1650265608354.jpg


https://i.dailymail.co.uk/1s/2022/04/18/08/56678149-10727703-image-a-27_1650265776833.jpg




'I've no idea how I'll live through this while waiting for my son to return, waiting for him to finish his service. It's awful. And the [state] media, of course, doesn't give any details. Why? Because the Ministry of Defence doesn't want to admit defeat by Ukraine. It doesn't want to admit that such a cruiser sank.'

Separately, a father has vowed to find out the truth about his conscript son Yegor Shkrebets, 20, a ship's cook on the Moskva, now missing presumed dead.

Dmitry, from Yalta in annexed Crimea, said: 'It was reported [by Russian state media] that the entire crew had been evacuated. It is a lie. A blatant and cynical lie. My son is a conscript, and as I was informed by the immediate commanders of the cruiser Moskva, he is not among the dead and wounded and is included in the list of missing.

'A conscript who was not supposed to take part in hostilities is listed as missing….missing on the high seas. After my attempts to clarify the data on the incident, the cruiser commander and his deputy stopped communicating.

'I asked directly: How come you, the officers, are alive, and my son, a conscript soldier, died?'

The father said: 'They tried to tow the cruiser to Sevastopol, but on the way it suddenly sank. Keep thinking for yourselves. I, Dmitry Shkrebets, the father of this conscript Yegor Shkrebets ask everyone who is not afraid and not indifferent.

'Spread this appeal of mine wherever you have the opportunity so that the bastards do not hush up this terrible tragedy. Take care of your children, take care of each other. And I will devote my whole future life to ensuring that the truth wins in this story. A man whose son was taken away in such a vile way is not afraid of anything.

'Thank you for not being indifferent. Soon they will delete this post again, so copy it.'

He implies that his earlier post was deleted by the VK - Russian social media - administration.

Yegor's mother Irina Shkrebets told The Insider and said that she and her husband had been to a hospital in Skalistaya Bay, where they brought the wounded from the cruiser.

According to her, there were about 200 injured sailors. Irina said: 'We looked at every burned [young sailor]. I cannot express how hard it is, but I didn't find mine. There were only 200 there, and there were more than five hundred on the cruiser.

'Where are the others? We turned to Krasnodar, and other [cities], called everyone, but we couldn't find him.'

Her son had been conscripted in August and was involved in the incident when the Moskva took Snake Island early in the war. After the Moskva was sunk, she said: 'We went to the unit. The commander came out, threw up his hands and said: "I won't tell you anything."

'I said: "Where is my son?", and he said: "Well, somewhere in the sea." My husband began to argue: "What does it mean in the sea? Where have you been?" But unit commander refused to answer. These commanders were not on the ship.'

The parents tried to get an answer from the FSB - the Russian Federal Security Service, the main domestic security agency. 'We arrived at the FSB in Sevastopol, where even a man refused to come out - they were standing behind the fence,' she said. 'My husband shouted: "Come out and call the police. Let me punch you in the face."

'He didn't even come out, behind bars he showed his hands criss-cross, to say goodbye, that's all. This is the service of the navy and the FSB of Sevastopol.'

They tried to get the authorities to show them the list of the dead and missing, but were refused. A commander who was on the ship also contacted Irina.

She recalled: 'I said: "Can you at least tell me how my son died?" And he said: "I don't know anything, they were at the supply post. We had missiles all over the cruiser." He could not say and somehow did not say that a missile had actually hit the cruiser.'

Media outlet Agentstvo identified another conscript Mark Tarasov, 24, who was called up after studying at university. His mother Ulyana Tarasova, 47, posted on her social media accounts on April 17: 'My son, Tarasov Mark, went missing on the Cruiser Moskva.'

Her son graduated from St. Petersburg State Transport University and was called up in autumn 2021, she said. She posted pictures from the railway station when she saw him off to military service.

Taras himself posted pictures with the caption: 'See you in a year'.

Agentsvo got in touch with the woman - a friend - who was pictured with Taras on one of the farewell pictures. She confirmed that he had gone to service in the navy.

Earlier, Taras - now presumed dead - had travelled to Portugal, Sweden and Greece.

Naval chief Admiral Nikolay Yevmenov, 60, admitted at the weekend that there had been conscripts on board - despite assurances from the Kremlin that they would not fight in the war.

Continued


Staged crew members

https://i.dailymail.co.uk/1s/2022/04/18/08/56734363-10727703-image-a-21_1650265623738.jpg

Originally Posted By realwar:
Trans: Azov showing a successful counterattack of manpower in Mariupol

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JQ-KIqpJhwA


Trans: The 54th Mechanized Brigade named after Hetman Ivan Mazepi moved to Donetsk region

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_uc6sGNTf0A


Destruction of Russian troops by artillery of the AFU

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Doseq2sPbak

Originally Posted By _disconnector_:
In the beginning yes. I think the Russians disengaged and are rebalancing forces in the east specifically to regain the ability to effectively orient. They were just flailing around like retards outside of Kyiv. We'll see if they can actually fight a fast paced modern war

Originally Posted By M-1975:
Graphic:

Azov is still fighting the Russian forces in Mariupol #Ukraine\uD83C\uDDFA\uD83C\uDDE6 pic.twitter.com/TZjvuec4Or

— Aleph ? \uD83C\uDDFA\uD83C\uDDE6 (@no_itsmyturn) April 18, 2022

Originally Posted By AeroEngineer:


Bolded for emphasis.  I don't think there's been a single Russian announcement that had any truth to it, other than announcing their generals were killed.

Azov still has elements able to fight.  Declaring you've conquered a city and rooting out any and all determined defenders are two different things.

Originally Posted By HIPPO:
Well now.

Bodies of former vice-president of Gazprombank Vladislav Avayev, his wife and daughter was found in his residence in Moscow in suspected murder-suicide https://t.co/mhYnMvU8m6  #Russia

Gazprombank is a key bank in Kremlin's gas-for-rubles scheme

Liveuamap  (@Liveuamap) April 18, 2022

Simple scheme of the place of Gazprombank in gas-for-rubles scheme (or Kremlin's sanctions on Gazprom) pic.twitter.com/V80hCTkJm9

Liveuamap  (@Liveuamap) April 18, 2022

Originally Posted By pr24guy:

Trans: Azov showing a successful counterattack of manpower in Mariupol

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JQ-KIqpJhwA

Originally Posted By Papposilenus:

Wild guess, but my presumption at this point is that Russia may claim "those guys in particular were the Nazis we were talking about this whole time and we got them" as a way to claw victory from the jaws of defeat if they plan to leave Ukraine soon.

Originally Posted By Mal_means_bad:
Rough day for the Russians in the red van.  

Laying down passively together in a big pile while the enemy tosses grenades on you does not seem to be a winning strategy.

Originally Posted By THOT_Vaccine:
Has anyone seen a recent pic of a "Russian Soldier" that isn't obviously 4F?

I've seen midgets, methuselah, clowns, fat men, geeks... all the carnies you would normally see at a circus freakshow. What I haven't seen is a 20-35 year old dude with a normal expression on his face. It's like they emptied out the mental hospitals and the carnivals. Even on RT and the Russian telegram chans. I'm not talking about propaganda photos from six months ago. Just anything from the last couple weeks.

I'm starting to wonder if there wasn't but maybe 10k of what Putin called "Professional Soldiers" in the whole Russian army, and they are all dead now.

I guess fetal alcohol syndrome is a bitch.

Originally Posted By HIPPO:
Ivan making a move at night in Luhansk.

Overnight #Russia took control of most or all of #Kreminna. The #Luhansk governor reported that \uD83C\uDDF7\uD83C\uDDFA entered the town at night and overwhelmed #Ukrainian forces. He further stated that the evacuation planned for civilians today was no longer possible due to the \uD83C\uDDF7\uD83C\uDDFA attack. pic.twitter.com/T9NCuMu645

OSINT Aggregator  (@AggregateOsint) April 18, 2022

Originally Posted By realwar:
Trans: Azov showing a successful counterattack of manpower in Mariupol

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JQ-KIqpJhwA


Trans: The 54th Mechanized Brigade named after Hetman Ivan Mazepi moved to Donetsk region

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_uc6sGNTf0A


Destruction of Russian troops by artillery of the AFU

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Doseq2sPbak

Originally Posted By Bassgasm:


Where does this come from?

In the last century, how many of those battles have the Russians fought, what were the circumstances, and what were the costs?