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Posted: 9/3/2022 1:01:11 PM EDT
[#1]
So many leaks the dems might launch impeachment hearings.
Well, a launch is a launch I guess. |
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Posted: 9/3/2022 1:03:59 PM EDT
[#2]
Quote HistoryQuoted: To me Hydrogen propulsion is like a titanium submarine. Great idea in theory. In real life there are always issues.  I was talking to a rather knowledgable friend of mine about hydrogen fuel cells recently. He said they might be viable for long haul trucking. But not much else. Trying to power a whole civilization with hydrogen seems very expensive and potentially quite dangerous. Hydrogen burns with an invisible flame. I've heard that firefighters trained to fight hydrogen fires have to walk into an area with a broom and see when the broom catches fire. When it does, there's your fire.  Quote HistoryQuoted: To me Hydrogen propulsion is like a titanium submarine. Great idea in theory. In real life there are always issues. I was talking to a rather knowledgable friend of mine about hydrogen fuel cells recently. He said they might be viable for long haul trucking. But not much else. Trying to power a whole civilization with hydrogen seems very expensive and potentially quite dangerous. Hydrogen burns with an invisible flame. I've heard that firefighters trained to fight hydrogen fires have to walk into an area with a broom and see when the broom catches fire. When it does, there's your fire.
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Posted: 9/3/2022 1:16:11 PM EDT
[#3]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Do the SRB’s light after the hold-downs release? I think so. Meaning, the stack could potentially blow over in the wind, right? STS would have fallen over backward even if there was no wind, I think? |
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Posted: 9/3/2022 1:19:20 PM EDT
[#4]
This thing will totally end up flying the one time I don't catch the livestream.
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Posted: 9/3/2022 1:32:16 PM EDT
[#5]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Do the SRB’s light after the hold-downs release? Go to the 9 minute mark. I think the SRB's light and then release the whole package almost instantly.  How The Space Shuttle Started Its Engines And Launched |
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Posted: 9/3/2022 1:32:18 PM EDT
[#6]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Sounds like problem with "Tail Service Mast", must be part of the billion dollar mobile tower debacle/money pit Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Imagine fucking up this badly with mostly re used already proven parts lol Sounds like problem with "Tail Service Mast", must be part of the billion dollar mobile tower debacle/money pit The problem is the ground to vehicle interface, owned by the vehicle. They've known for years... |
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Posted: 9/3/2022 1:34:33 PM EDT
[#7]
October eh?
Starship + SHB might just win this race. |
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Posted: 9/3/2022 1:34:55 PM EDT
[#8]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Did STS-1 experience this many problems and delays? Yes, several more in fact. |
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Posted: 9/3/2022 1:36:33 PM EDT
[#9]
16 years. $25 Billion. Already-existing parts.
 Meanwhile, over at SpaceX.... |
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Posted: 9/3/2022 2:00:39 PM EDT
[#10]
Quote HistoryQuoted: This thing will totally end up flying the one time I don't catch the livestream. Slim Chance ! 
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Posted: 9/3/2022 2:04:25 PM EDT
[#11]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Incorrect those requirements are NOT all required to be finished. Some were already done before it was written some are required Within like 2 years. No launch license in Texas until Spacex meets a large portion of those requirements. Is that better? How long long did the Govt drag their feet and delay delay delay, then finally come out with the final PEA? We would still be driving horse and buggies with all these stupid regulations. |
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Posted: 9/3/2022 3:26:44 PM EDT
[#12]
 The SLS is Outdated. Why Does it Exist? |
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Posted: 9/3/2022 3:32:42 PM EDT
[#13]
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Posted: 9/3/2022 4:07:37 PM EDT
[#14]
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Posted: 9/3/2022 4:08:17 PM EDT
[#15]
Quote HistorySee I told you guys it was an Obama big government jobs program. He signed it into law, he could have not signed it, but he did. I stand by my previous statement of Arfcommers here are in favor of an Obama big government jobs program. 
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Posted: 9/3/2022 4:34:56 PM EDT
[#16]
October.
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Posted: 9/3/2022 4:39:29 PM EDT
[#17]
I don't get the purpose of the gateway space station. What capability does it allow that can't be done without it?
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Posted: 9/3/2022 4:41:41 PM EDT
[#18]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I don't get the purpose of the gateway space station. What capability does it allow that can't be done without it? I don't see a use for it either. SpaceX's plan for reaching the moon is to build a suitable lander, launch it, then tank up with Methalox in low Earth orbit. Then go straight to the moon and back. From what I've seen of NASA's plans so far it all seems convoluted and expensive. |
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Posted: 9/3/2022 4:46:33 PM EDT
[#19]
Quote HistoryQuoted: More than that, a self admitted corporate welfare scam by NASA itself. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: At this point this is a multibillion dollar scam by the contractors (Boeing?). More than that, a self admitted corporate welfare scam by NASA itself. But, but, but....first bipoc and first wymyn on the moon 
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Posted: 9/3/2022 4:51:27 PM EDT
[#20]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I don't see a use for it either. SpaceX's plan for reaching the moon is to build a suitable lander, launch it, then tank up with Methalox in low Earth orbit. Then go straight to the moon and back. From what I've seen of NASA's plans so far it all seems convoluted and expensive. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: I don't get the purpose of the gateway space station. What capability does it allow that can't be done without it? I don't see a use for it either. SpaceX's plan for reaching the moon is to build a suitable lander, launch it, then tank up with Methalox in low Earth orbit. Then go straight to the moon and back. From what I've seen of NASA's plans so far it all seems convoluted and expensive. This is what was at the Gateway| NASA page Based at NASA’s Johnson Space Center in Houston, Texas, the Gateway Program is building a small, human-tended space station orbiting the Moon that will provide extensive capabilities to support NASA’s Artemis campaign. Built with international and commercial partnerships, Gateway’s capabilities for supporting sustained exploration and research in deep space include docking ports for a variety of visiting spacecraft, space for crew to live and work, and on-board science investigations to study heliophysics, human health, and life sciences, among other areas. Gateway will be a critical platform for developing technology and capabilities to support Moon and Mars exploration in the coming years. Gateway will be humanity’s first space station in lunar orbit to support NASA’s deep space exploration plans, along with the Space Launch System (SLS) rocket, Orion spacecraft, and the Human Landing System (HLS) that will send astronauts to the Moon. NASA has focused Gateway development on the first two elements of Gateway – the Power and Propulsion Element (PPE) and the Habitation and Logistics Outpost (HALO) - which will launch together on a commercially procured launch vehicle. Power and Propulsion Element The Power and Propulsion Element is a high-power, 60-kilowatt solar electric propulsion spacecraft that will provide power, high-rate communications, attitude control, and orbital transfer capabilities for the Gateway. In May 2019, NASA selected Maxar Technologies of Westminster, Colorado, to develop and build the PPE. The PPE is managed out of NASA’s Glenn Research Center in Cleveland, Ohio. Habitation and Logistics Outpost (HALO) HALO is where astronauts will live and conduct research while visiting Gateway. The pressurized living quarters will provide command and control systems for the lunar outpost, and docking ports for visiting spacecraft, such as NASA’s Orion spacecraft, lunar landers, and logistics resupply craft. The HALO module will serve as the backbone for command and control and power distribution across Gateway and will perform other core functions, including hosting science investigations via internal and external payload accommodations, and communicating with lunar surface expeditions. HALO also will enable the aggregation of additional habitable elements to expand Gateway capabilities, leveraging contributions from Gateway’s international partners. Batteries provided by the Japan Aerospace Exploration Agency (JAXA) will power HALO until PPE solar arrays can be deployed and during eclipse periods. Robotic interfaces provided by the Canadian Space Agency will host payloads and provide base points for Canadarm3 robotic operations. ESA (European Space Agency) will provide a lunar communications system to enable high-data-rate communications between the lunar surface and Gateway. HALO is managed out of NASA’s Johnson Space Center in Houston. Northrop Grumman of Dulles, Virginia was awarded a contract for the preliminary design of HALO in 2020, and the remaining content for HALO was finalized between NASA and Northrop Grumman through signing a contract in July 2021. Gateway Science Gateway will provide unique options for Earth science, heliophysics, lunar and planetary sciences, life sciences, astrophysics, and fundamental physics investigations by allowing extended views of the Earth, Sun, Moon, and space not possible from Earth’s surface or from Earth orbit. The first three science instruments for Gateway have already been selected. Two of them, the Heliophysics Environmental and Radiation Measurement Experiment Suite (HERMES) and the European Radiation Sensors Array (ERSA), will fly outside Gateway to monitor the Sun’s radiation environment and space weather. HERMES, led by NASA’s Goddard Space Flight Center, will monitor lower energy solar particles critical to scientific investigations of the Sun including the solar winds. ERSA, led by ESA, will monitor radiation at higher energies with a focus on space weather. The Internal Dosimeter Array (IDA) will fly inside the HALO to allow for the study of radiation shielding effects and improve radiation physics models for cancer, cardiovascular, and central nervous system effects, helping assess crew risk on exploration missions. IDA is being built by ESA, with additional science instruments from JAXA. Initial Launch In February 2021, NASA selected SpaceX to provide launch services for the integrated PPE and HALO spacecraft. After integration on Earth, PPE and HALO are targeted to launch together no earlier than November 2024 on a Falcon Heavy rocket from Launch Complex 39A at Kennedy. Gateway's Future As astronauts prepare for missions to the lunar surface, they will need deliveries of critical pressurized and unpressurized cargo, science experiments and supplies like sample collection materials. In March 2020, NASA announced SpaceX as the first U.S. commercial provider under the Gateway Logistics Services contract to deliver cargo and other supplies to Gateway. One logistics services delivery is anticipated for each crewed Artemis mission to Gateway. Gateway Deep Space Logistics Office is based at NASA's Kennedy Space Center in Florida. >> Related: Learn more about Gateway Deep Space Logistics Gateway international partners will provide important contributions to the Gateway space station, comprising advanced external robotics, additional habitation, and refueling capability. ESA In October 2020, ESA signed an agreement with NASA to contribute habitation and refueling modules, enhanced lunar communications to the Gateway and two more Orion Service Modules. The ESA-provided International Habitation module, I-HAB, will enhance Gateway capabilities for scientific research, life support systems and crew living quarters. These capabilities enable longer duration crewed Gateway missions. The European refueling module will also include crew observation windows. The enhanced lunar communications module will be integrated with the Habitation and Logistics Outpost (HALO) module pre-launch and provide high-rate communications relay between Gateway and elements on the lunar surface. CSA In December 2020, Canada signed an agreement with NASA to participate in Gateway and provide advanced external robotics. The CSA-provided external robotics system includes a next-generation robotic arm, Canadarm3, for Gateway. Canadarm3 will move end-over-end to reach many parts of Gateway’s exterior, where its anchoring "hand" will plug into specially designed interfaces. CSA also will provide robotic interfaces for Gateway modules, which will enable payload installation including that of the first two scientific instruments launching on the inaugural Gateway elements. JAXA In December 2020, Japan finalized an agreement with NASA to provide several capabilities for Gateway’s I-HAB, which will provide the heart of Gateway life support capabilities and additional space where crew will live, work, and conduct research during Artemis missions. JAXA’s planned contributions include I-HAB’s environmental control and life support system, batteries, thermal control, and imagery components, which will be integrated into the module by ESA prior to launch. These capabilities are critical for sustained Gateway operations during crewed and uncrewed time periods. |
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Posted: 9/3/2022 4:53:29 PM EDT
[#21]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I don't see a use for it either. SpaceX's plan for reaching the moon is to build a suitable lander, launch it, then tank up with Methalox in low Earth orbit. Then go straight to the moon and back. From what I've seen of NASA's plans so far it all seems convoluted and expensive. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: I don't get the purpose of the gateway space station. What capability does it allow that can't be done without it? I don't see a use for it either. SpaceX's plan for reaching the moon is to build a suitable lander, launch it, then tank up with Methalox in low Earth orbit. Then go straight to the moon and back. From what I've seen of NASA's plans so far it all seems convoluted and expensive. Wouldn't that be vastly cheaper too? Basically only need enough fuel to reach low Earth orbit for the moon lander. Then launch again with a tanker full of fuel to fill up moon lander for the trip to the moon. This way you don't need to carry enough fuel to get to orbit and make the moon mission in one shot. |
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Posted: 9/3/2022 5:01:32 PM EDT
[#22]
How long before NASA is bankrupt?
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Posted: 9/3/2022 5:14:53 PM EDT
[#23]
Quote HistoryQuoted: How long before NASA is bankrupt? |
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Posted: 9/3/2022 5:17:09 PM EDT
[#24]
Quote HistoryQuoted: 16 years. $25 Billion. Already-existing parts. https://www.gameofthronesquote.com/b/wp-content/uploads/2016/06/tommen-jumping.gif Meanwhile, over at SpaceX.... Elon is probably loling his ass off |
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Posted: 9/3/2022 5:18:59 PM EDT
[#25]
Quote HistoryQuoted: This is what was at the Gateway| NASA page Based at NASA's Johnson Space Center in Houston, Texas, the Gateway Program is building a small, human-tended space station orbiting the Moon that will provide extensive capabilities to support NASA's Artemis campaign. Built with international and commercial partnerships, Gateway's capabilities for supporting sustained exploration and research in deep space include docking ports for a variety of visiting spacecraft, space for crew to live and work, and on-board science investigations to study heliophysics, human health, and life sciences, among other areas. Gateway will be a critical platform for developing technology and capabilities to support Moon and Mars exploration in the coming years. Gateway will be humanity's first space station in lunar orbit to support NASA's deep space exploration plans, along with the Space Launch System (SLS) rocket, Orion spacecraft, and the Human Landing System (HLS) that will send astronauts to the Moon. NASA has focused Gateway development on the first two elements of Gateway the Power and Propulsion Element (PPE) and the Habitation and Logistics Outpost (HALO) - which will launch together on a commercially procured launch vehicle. Power and Propulsion Element The Power and Propulsion Element is a high-power, 60-kilowatt solar electric propulsion spacecraft that will provide power, high-rate communications, attitude control, and orbital transfer capabilities for the Gateway. In May 2019, NASA selected Maxar Technologies of Westminster, Colorado, to develop and build the PPE. The PPE is managed out of NASA's Glenn Research Center in Cleveland, Ohio. Habitation and Logistics Outpost (HALO) HALO is where astronauts will live and conduct research while visiting Gateway. The pressurized living quarters will provide command and control systems for the lunar outpost, and docking ports for visiting spacecraft, such as NASA's Orion spacecraft, lunar landers, and logistics resupply craft. The HALO module will serve as the backbone for command and control and power distribution across Gateway and will perform other core functions, including hosting science investigations via internal and external payload accommodations, and communicating with lunar surface expeditions. HALO also will enable the aggregation of additional habitable elements to expand Gateway capabilities, leveraging contributions from Gateway's international partners. Batteries provided by the Japan Aerospace Exploration Agency (JAXA) will power HALO until PPE solar arrays can be deployed and during eclipse periods. Robotic interfaces provided by the Canadian Space Agency will host payloads and provide base points for Canadarm3 robotic operations. ESA (European Space Agency) will provide a lunar communications system to enable high-data-rate communications between the lunar surface and Gateway. HALO is managed out of NASA's Johnson Space Center in Houston. Northrop Grumman of Dulles, Virginia was awarded a contract for the preliminary design of HALO in 2020, and the remaining content for HALO was finalized between NASA and Northrop Grumman through signing a contract in July 2021. Gateway Science Gateway will provide unique options for Earth science, heliophysics, lunar and planetary sciences, life sciences, astrophysics, and fundamental physics investigations by allowing extended views of the Earth, Sun, Moon, and space not possible from Earth's surface or from Earth orbit. The first three science instruments for Gateway have already been selected. Two of them, the Heliophysics Environmental and Radiation Measurement Experiment Suite (HERMES) and the European Radiation Sensors Array (ERSA), will fly outside Gateway to monitor the Sun's radiation environment and space weather. HERMES, led by NASA's Goddard Space Flight Center, will monitor lower energy solar particles critical to scientific investigations of the Sun including the solar winds. ERSA, led by ESA, will monitor radiation at higher energies with a focus on space weather. The Internal Dosimeter Array (IDA) will fly inside the HALO to allow for the study of radiation shielding effects and improve radiation physics models for cancer, cardiovascular, and central nervous system effects, helping assess crew risk on exploration missions. IDA is being built by ESA, with additional science instruments from JAXA. Initial Launch In February 2021, NASA selected SpaceX to provide launch services for the integrated PPE and HALO spacecraft. After integration on Earth, PPE and HALO are targeted to launch together no earlier than November 2024 on a Falcon Heavy rocket from Launch Complex 39A at Kennedy. Gateway's Future As astronauts prepare for missions to the lunar surface, they will need deliveries of critical pressurized and unpressurized cargo, science experiments and supplies like sample collection materials. In March 2020, NASA announced SpaceX as the first U.S. commercial provider under the Gateway Logistics Services contract to deliver cargo and other supplies to Gateway. One logistics services delivery is anticipated for each crewed Artemis mission to Gateway. Gateway Deep Space Logistics Office is based at NASA's Kennedy Space Center in Florida. >> Related: Learn more about Gateway Deep Space Logistics Gateway international partners will provide important contributions to the Gateway space station, comprising advanced external robotics, additional habitation, and refueling capability. ESA In October 2020, ESA signed an agreement with NASA to contribute habitation and refueling modules, enhanced lunar communications to the Gateway and two more Orion Service Modules. The ESA-provided International Habitation module, I-HAB, will enhance Gateway capabilities for scientific research, life support systems and crew living quarters. These capabilities enable longer duration crewed Gateway missions. The European refueling module will also include crew observation windows. The enhanced lunar communications module will be integrated with the Habitation and Logistics Outpost (HALO) module pre-launch and provide high-rate communications relay between Gateway and elements on the lunar surface. CSA In December 2020, Canada signed an agreement with NASA to participate in Gateway and provide advanced external robotics. The CSA-provided external robotics system includes a next-generation robotic arm, Canadarm3, for Gateway. Canadarm3 will move end-over-end to reach many parts of Gateway's exterior, where its anchoring "hand" will plug into specially designed interfaces. CSA also will provide robotic interfaces for Gateway modules, which will enable payload installation including that of the first two scientific instruments launching on the inaugural Gateway elements. JAXA In December 2020, Japan finalized an agreement with NASA to provide several capabilities for Gateway's I-HAB, which will provide the heart of Gateway life support capabilities and additional space where crew will live, work, and conduct research during Artemis missions. JAXA's planned contributions include I-HAB's environmental control and life support system, batteries, thermal control, and imagery components, which will be integrated into the module by ESA prior to launch. These capabilities are critical for sustained Gateway operations during crewed and uncrewed time periods. |
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Posted: 9/3/2022 5:22:59 PM EDT
[#26]
Quote HistoryQuoted: October. What a colossal clusterfuck. Wasn't there a seam in the foam coating leaking last week? The engineers claimed it was just steam from a crack in the foam and not actually leaking hydrogen. |
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Posted: 9/3/2022 5:23:52 PM EDT
[#27]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I am still not sure what advantage it offers. It shouldn't be hard to explain why having the gateway is better than not having it. HANDOUTS! That's what it all amounts to. |
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Posted: 9/3/2022 5:44:51 PM EDT
[#28]
Quote HistoryQuoted: HANDOUTS! That's what it all amounts to. Arthur C. Clarke's, 2001 had a mature moon presence and it involves specialized, multi-step processes for moon arrival. 1. Earth to Orbit 2. Earth Orbit to Moon Orbit 3 Moon Orbit to Moon. Maybe it's easy to resupply and stock a moon orbit station. Maybe It' makes more sense to land supplies on the moon instead of crashing the supply vehicles for the gateway into the moon. There should be reasons. And they should be explainable. |
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Posted: 9/3/2022 5:48:32 PM EDT
[#29]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I don't get the purpose of the gateway space station. What capability does it allow that can't be done without it? |
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Posted: 9/3/2022 5:48:49 PM EDT
[#30]
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Posted: 9/3/2022 5:58:12 PM EDT
[#31]
Good lord the negative garbage. Space X has little knowledge and zero experience in deep space travel and living. They are literally having to recreate the Gemini missions to gain the experience NASA did decades ago. They will get there no doubt but dont be ignorant fanboys and think they will actually be faster than any other program.
New vehicles have issues. Even SpaceX has had to scrub numerous times on experimental first flights. This is also TLI not LEO not to mention it is hydrogen not Kerosene; its slightly harder to work with. |
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Posted: 9/3/2022 5:59:59 PM EDT
[#32]
Quote HistoryQuoted: What a colossal clusterfuck. Wasn't there a seam in the foam coating leaking last week? The engineers claimed it was just steam from a crack in the foam and not actually leaking hydrogen. |
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Posted: 9/3/2022 6:03:26 PM EDT
[#33]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Elon is probably loling his ass off Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: 16 years. $25 Billion. Already-existing parts. https://www.gameofthronesquote.com/b/wp-content/uploads/2016/06/tommen-jumping.gif Meanwhile, over at SpaceX.... Elon is probably loling his ass off Then theres the fact that SLS has been in development and testing for 10-11 years with delays due to the factory getting heavily damaged in a hurricane, the original core stage tank being damaged, and then COVID. 16 years would put it firmly in the Constellation program which shows lack of knowledge of basic historic timelines. |
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Posted: 9/3/2022 6:05:04 PM EDT
[#34]
The rocket surgeons in here will probably come up with all sorts of excuses if/when SS/SH doesnt make it through its first re-entry test or is scrubbed over and over from its not-even-orbital flight.
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Posted: 9/3/2022 6:08:15 PM EDT
[#35]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Good lord the negative garbage. Space X has little knowledge and zero experience in deep space travel and living. They are literally having to recreate the Gemini missions to gain the experience NASA did decades ago. They will get there no doubt but dont be ignorant fanboys and think they will actually be faster than any other program. You do understand that NASA will never put a human on Mars, right? Their big mission right now, is to REPLICATE something we already did in the 1960s, for the entire purpose of putting a black woman on the moon. Nothing else.  And even with ALL of their experience, and proven technology, and vast expertise ... they are still fucking it up, and the world is laughing at us. Not wanting to blow 2-4 billion per launch, just to put a black woman on the moon, make ME the bad guy? LOL. okay. Who exactly are the "ignorant fanboys" again? The NASA we loved in the 60s, 70s and 80s is dead. |
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Posted: 9/3/2022 6:09:06 PM EDT
[#36]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
See ya at the next leak! |
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Posted: 9/3/2022 6:14:06 PM EDT
[#37]
Artemis is a giant piece of shit. The cobbled together Frankenstein jobs program will kill astronauts if it's ever allowed to fly with a crew. Pull it out to the swamps and burn it.
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Posted: 9/3/2022 6:14:23 PM EDT
[#38]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Posted: 9/3/2022 6:16:58 PM EDT
[#39]
Quote HistoryQuoted: The rocket surgeons in here will probably come up with all sorts of excuses if/when SS/SH doesnt make it through its first re-entry test or is scrubbed over and over from its not-even-orbital flight. How many years and how many billions difference between the two? |
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Posted: 9/3/2022 6:18:11 PM EDT
[#40]
Quote HistoryQuoted: You do understand that NASA will never put a human on Mars, right? Their big mission right now, is to REPLICATE something we already did in the 1960s, for the entire purpose of putting a black woman on the moon. Nothing else. And even with ALL of their experience, and proven technology, and vast expertise ... they are still fucking it up, and the world is laughing at us. Not wanting to blow 2-4 billion per launch, just to put a black woman on the moon, make ME the bad guy? LOL. okay. Who exactly are the "ignorant fanboys" again? The NASA we loved in the 60s, 70s and 80s is dead. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Good lord the negative garbage. Space X has little knowledge and zero experience in deep space travel and living. They are literally having to recreate the Gemini missions to gain the experience NASA did decades ago. They will get there no doubt but dont be ignorant fanboys and think they will actually be faster than any other program. You do understand that NASA will never put a human on Mars, right? Their big mission right now, is to REPLICATE something we already did in the 1960s, for the entire purpose of putting a black woman on the moon. Nothing else. And even with ALL of their experience, and proven technology, and vast expertise ... they are still fucking it up, and the world is laughing at us. Not wanting to blow 2-4 billion per launch, just to put a black woman on the moon, make ME the bad guy? LOL. okay. Who exactly are the "ignorant fanboys" again? The NASA we loved in the 60s, 70s and 80s is dead.  Attached File |
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Posted: 9/3/2022 6:19:27 PM EDT
[#41]
Quote HistoryQuoted: SpaceX is having their own problems with SH/SS. Then theres the fact that SLS has been in development and testing for 10-11 years with delays due to the factory getting heavily damaged in a hurricane, the original core stage tank being damaged, and then COVID. 16 years would put it firmly in the Constellation program which shows lack of knowledge of basic historic timelines. NASA has roughly 50 years experience dealing with liquid hydrogen and pumping into the same tank.. |
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Posted: 9/3/2022 6:22:35 PM EDT
[#42]
Quote HistoryQuoted: You do understand that NASA will never put a human on Mars, right? Their big mission right now, is to REPLICATE something we already did in the 1960s, for the entire purpose of putting a black woman on the moon. Nothing else. And even with ALL of their experience, and proven technology, and vast expertise ... they are still fucking it up, and the world is laughing at us. Not wanting to blow 2-4 billion per launch, just to put a black woman on the moon, make ME the bad guy? LOL. okay. Who exactly are the "ignorant fanboys" again? The NASA we loved in the 60s, 70s and 80s is dead. The Artemis program is to create long term presence on and around the moon to learn how to live in deep space and on another planetary body. Thats the ENTIRE reason for the program, its why Gateway is a thing, its why they are landing at the south poll. That translates into the Moon to Mars program. The constant lens of politics that you and others see every single thing through is tiring and quite frankly shows just how blind so many people have become. No one outside the US has a super heavy lift rocket this close to operational. Not even SpaceX is near operational let alone man rating and in the end they will likely end up taking just as much time to get to operational status in expendable mode as SLS or more. It makes you the bad guy because you refuse to understand what testing is or that scrubs happen especially with brand new launch vehicles where all the criteria is much more conservative than it might be in operational status. I expect you to bitch every week Starship doesnt launch. Right now they are somewhere 9-10 months late for their orbital test (for various reasons in and out of their control). Hell, because they didnt understand that methane could collect under the vehicle on the OLM they could have lost the vehicle and a ton of infrastructure. |
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Posted: 9/3/2022 6:23:37 PM EDT
[#43]
Launch Attempt News Update
 Artemis I Launch Attempt News Update (Sept. 3, 2022) |
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Posted: 9/3/2022 6:26:29 PM EDT
[#44]
Quote HistoryQuoted: This is what was at the Gateway| NASA page Based at NASA’s Johnson Space Center in Houston, Texas, the Gateway Program is building a small, human-tended space station orbiting the Moon that will provide extensive capabilities to support NASA’s Artemis campaign. Built with international and commercial partnerships, Gateway’s capabilities for supporting sustained exploration and research in deep space include docking ports for a variety of visiting spacecraft, space for crew to live and work, and on-board science investigations to study heliophysics, human health, and life sciences, among other areas. Gateway will be a critical platform for developing technology and capabilities to support Moon and Mars exploration in the coming years. Gateway will be humanity’s first space station in lunar orbit to support NASA’s deep space exploration plans, along with the Space Launch System (SLS) rocket, Orion spacecraft, and the Human Landing System (HLS) that will send astronauts to the Moon. NASA has focused Gateway development on the first two elements of Gateway – the Power and Propulsion Element (PPE) and the Habitation and Logistics Outpost (HALO) - which will launch together on a commercially procured launch vehicle. Power and Propulsion Element The Power and Propulsion Element is a high-power, 60-kilowatt solar electric propulsion spacecraft that will provide power, high-rate communications, attitude control, and orbital transfer capabilities for the Gateway. In May 2019, NASA selected Maxar Technologies of Westminster, Colorado, to develop and build the PPE. The PPE is managed out of NASA’s Glenn Research Center in Cleveland, Ohio. Habitation and Logistics Outpost (HALO) HALO is where astronauts will live and conduct research while visiting Gateway. The pressurized living quarters will provide command and control systems for the lunar outpost, and docking ports for visiting spacecraft, such as NASA’s Orion spacecraft, lunar landers, and logistics resupply craft. The HALO module will serve as the backbone for command and control and power distribution across Gateway and will perform other core functions, including hosting science investigations via internal and external payload accommodations, and communicating with lunar surface expeditions. HALO also will enable the aggregation of additional habitable elements to expand Gateway capabilities, leveraging contributions from Gateway’s international partners. Batteries provided by the Japan Aerospace Exploration Agency (JAXA) will power HALO until PPE solar arrays can be deployed and during eclipse periods. Robotic interfaces provided by the Canadian Space Agency will host payloads and provide base points for Canadarm3 robotic operations. ESA (European Space Agency) will provide a lunar communications system to enable high-data-rate communications between the lunar surface and Gateway. HALO is managed out of NASA’s Johnson Space Center in Houston. Northrop Grumman of Dulles, Virginia was awarded a contract for the preliminary design of HALO in 2020, and the remaining content for HALO was finalized between NASA and Northrop Grumman through signing a contract in July 2021. Gateway Science Gateway will provide unique options for Earth science, heliophysics, lunar and planetary sciences, life sciences, astrophysics, and fundamental physics investigations by allowing extended views of the Earth, Sun, Moon, and space not possible from Earth’s surface or from Earth orbit. The first three science instruments for Gateway have already been selected. Two of them, the Heliophysics Environmental and Radiation Measurement Experiment Suite (HERMES) and the European Radiation Sensors Array (ERSA), will fly outside Gateway to monitor the Sun’s radiation environment and space weather. HERMES, led by NASA’s Goddard Space Flight Center, will monitor lower energy solar particles critical to scientific investigations of the Sun including the solar winds. ERSA, led by ESA, will monitor radiation at higher energies with a focus on space weather. The Internal Dosimeter Array (IDA) will fly inside the HALO to allow for the study of radiation shielding effects and improve radiation physics models for cancer, cardiovascular, and central nervous system effects, helping assess crew risk on exploration missions. IDA is being built by ESA, with additional science instruments from JAXA. Initial Launch In February 2021, NASA selected SpaceX to provide launch services for the integrated PPE and HALO spacecraft. After integration on Earth, PPE and HALO are targeted to launch together no earlier than November 2024 on a Falcon Heavy rocket from Launch Complex 39A at Kennedy. Gateway's Future As astronauts prepare for missions to the lunar surface, they will need deliveries of critical pressurized and unpressurized cargo, science experiments and supplies like sample collection materials. In March 2020, NASA announced SpaceX as the first U.S. commercial provider under the Gateway Logistics Services contract to deliver cargo and other supplies to Gateway. One logistics services delivery is anticipated for each crewed Artemis mission to Gateway. Gateway Deep Space Logistics Office is based at NASA's Kennedy Space Center in Florida. >> Related: Learn more about Gateway Deep Space Logistics Gateway international partners will provide important contributions to the Gateway space station, comprising advanced external robotics, additional habitation, and refueling capability. ESA In October 2020, ESA signed an agreement with NASA to contribute habitation and refueling modules, enhanced lunar communications to the Gateway and two more Orion Service Modules. The ESA-provided International Habitation module, I-HAB, will enhance Gateway capabilities for scientific research, life support systems and crew living quarters. These capabilities enable longer duration crewed Gateway missions. The European refueling module will also include crew observation windows. The enhanced lunar communications module will be integrated with the Habitation and Logistics Outpost (HALO) module pre-launch and provide high-rate communications relay between Gateway and elements on the lunar surface. CSA In December 2020, Canada signed an agreement with NASA to participate in Gateway and provide advanced external robotics. The CSA-provided external robotics system includes a next-generation robotic arm, Canadarm3, for Gateway. Canadarm3 will move end-over-end to reach many parts of Gateway’s exterior, where its anchoring "hand" will plug into specially designed interfaces. CSA also will provide robotic interfaces for Gateway modules, which will enable payload installation including that of the first two scientific instruments launching on the inaugural Gateway elements. JAXA In December 2020, Japan finalized an agreement with NASA to provide several capabilities for Gateway’s I-HAB, which will provide the heart of Gateway life support capabilities and additional space where crew will live, work, and conduct research during Artemis missions. JAXA’s planned contributions include I-HAB’s environmental control and life support system, batteries, thermal control, and imagery components, which will be integrated into the module by ESA prior to launch. These capabilities are critical for sustained Gateway operations during crewed and uncrewed time periods. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: I don't get the purpose of the gateway space station. What capability does it allow that can't be done without it? I don't see a use for it either. SpaceX's plan for reaching the moon is to build a suitable lander, launch it, then tank up with Methalox in low Earth orbit. Then go straight to the moon and back. From what I've seen of NASA's plans so far it all seems convoluted and expensive. This is what was at the Gateway| NASA page Based at NASA’s Johnson Space Center in Houston, Texas, the Gateway Program is building a small, human-tended space station orbiting the Moon that will provide extensive capabilities to support NASA’s Artemis campaign. Built with international and commercial partnerships, Gateway’s capabilities for supporting sustained exploration and research in deep space include docking ports for a variety of visiting spacecraft, space for crew to live and work, and on-board science investigations to study heliophysics, human health, and life sciences, among other areas. Gateway will be a critical platform for developing technology and capabilities to support Moon and Mars exploration in the coming years. Gateway will be humanity’s first space station in lunar orbit to support NASA’s deep space exploration plans, along with the Space Launch System (SLS) rocket, Orion spacecraft, and the Human Landing System (HLS) that will send astronauts to the Moon. NASA has focused Gateway development on the first two elements of Gateway – the Power and Propulsion Element (PPE) and the Habitation and Logistics Outpost (HALO) - which will launch together on a commercially procured launch vehicle. Power and Propulsion Element The Power and Propulsion Element is a high-power, 60-kilowatt solar electric propulsion spacecraft that will provide power, high-rate communications, attitude control, and orbital transfer capabilities for the Gateway. In May 2019, NASA selected Maxar Technologies of Westminster, Colorado, to develop and build the PPE. The PPE is managed out of NASA’s Glenn Research Center in Cleveland, Ohio. Habitation and Logistics Outpost (HALO) HALO is where astronauts will live and conduct research while visiting Gateway. The pressurized living quarters will provide command and control systems for the lunar outpost, and docking ports for visiting spacecraft, such as NASA’s Orion spacecraft, lunar landers, and logistics resupply craft. The HALO module will serve as the backbone for command and control and power distribution across Gateway and will perform other core functions, including hosting science investigations via internal and external payload accommodations, and communicating with lunar surface expeditions. HALO also will enable the aggregation of additional habitable elements to expand Gateway capabilities, leveraging contributions from Gateway’s international partners. Batteries provided by the Japan Aerospace Exploration Agency (JAXA) will power HALO until PPE solar arrays can be deployed and during eclipse periods. Robotic interfaces provided by the Canadian Space Agency will host payloads and provide base points for Canadarm3 robotic operations. ESA (European Space Agency) will provide a lunar communications system to enable high-data-rate communications between the lunar surface and Gateway. HALO is managed out of NASA’s Johnson Space Center in Houston. Northrop Grumman of Dulles, Virginia was awarded a contract for the preliminary design of HALO in 2020, and the remaining content for HALO was finalized between NASA and Northrop Grumman through signing a contract in July 2021. Gateway Science Gateway will provide unique options for Earth science, heliophysics, lunar and planetary sciences, life sciences, astrophysics, and fundamental physics investigations by allowing extended views of the Earth, Sun, Moon, and space not possible from Earth’s surface or from Earth orbit. The first three science instruments for Gateway have already been selected. Two of them, the Heliophysics Environmental and Radiation Measurement Experiment Suite (HERMES) and the European Radiation Sensors Array (ERSA), will fly outside Gateway to monitor the Sun’s radiation environment and space weather. HERMES, led by NASA’s Goddard Space Flight Center, will monitor lower energy solar particles critical to scientific investigations of the Sun including the solar winds. ERSA, led by ESA, will monitor radiation at higher energies with a focus on space weather. The Internal Dosimeter Array (IDA) will fly inside the HALO to allow for the study of radiation shielding effects and improve radiation physics models for cancer, cardiovascular, and central nervous system effects, helping assess crew risk on exploration missions. IDA is being built by ESA, with additional science instruments from JAXA. Initial Launch In February 2021, NASA selected SpaceX to provide launch services for the integrated PPE and HALO spacecraft. After integration on Earth, PPE and HALO are targeted to launch together no earlier than November 2024 on a Falcon Heavy rocket from Launch Complex 39A at Kennedy. Gateway's Future As astronauts prepare for missions to the lunar surface, they will need deliveries of critical pressurized and unpressurized cargo, science experiments and supplies like sample collection materials. In March 2020, NASA announced SpaceX as the first U.S. commercial provider under the Gateway Logistics Services contract to deliver cargo and other supplies to Gateway. One logistics services delivery is anticipated for each crewed Artemis mission to Gateway. Gateway Deep Space Logistics Office is based at NASA's Kennedy Space Center in Florida. >> Related: Learn more about Gateway Deep Space Logistics Gateway international partners will provide important contributions to the Gateway space station, comprising advanced external robotics, additional habitation, and refueling capability. ESA In October 2020, ESA signed an agreement with NASA to contribute habitation and refueling modules, enhanced lunar communications to the Gateway and two more Orion Service Modules. The ESA-provided International Habitation module, I-HAB, will enhance Gateway capabilities for scientific research, life support systems and crew living quarters. These capabilities enable longer duration crewed Gateway missions. The European refueling module will also include crew observation windows. The enhanced lunar communications module will be integrated with the Habitation and Logistics Outpost (HALO) module pre-launch and provide high-rate communications relay between Gateway and elements on the lunar surface. CSA In December 2020, Canada signed an agreement with NASA to participate in Gateway and provide advanced external robotics. The CSA-provided external robotics system includes a next-generation robotic arm, Canadarm3, for Gateway. Canadarm3 will move end-over-end to reach many parts of Gateway’s exterior, where its anchoring "hand" will plug into specially designed interfaces. CSA also will provide robotic interfaces for Gateway modules, which will enable payload installation including that of the first two scientific instruments launching on the inaugural Gateway elements. JAXA In December 2020, Japan finalized an agreement with NASA to provide several capabilities for Gateway’s I-HAB, which will provide the heart of Gateway life support capabilities and additional space where crew will live, work, and conduct research during Artemis missions. JAXA’s planned contributions include I-HAB’s environmental control and life support system, batteries, thermal control, and imagery components, which will be integrated into the module by ESA prior to launch. These capabilities are critical for sustained Gateway operations during crewed and uncrewed time periods. I couldn't fuck up in Kerbol Space Program worse than NASA's plan.  SpaceX's plan would be pretty decent, but sure to tip over on landing. Kharn |
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Posted: 9/3/2022 6:34:31 PM EDT
[#45]
I’m trying to figure out two things;
1. Apollo already went to the moon in yhe days of slide rules, so what makes Artemis a big deal? 2. Why didn’t they ever send the shuttle to the moon given it had the large payload bay to take stuff there? |
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Posted: 9/3/2022 6:35:05 PM EDT
[#46]
Quote HistoryQuoted: How many years and how many billions difference between the two? Like everything, if launch cadence of SLS goes up, unit cost goes down. Even expendables end up cheaper the more they launch. ULA withdrew a launch bid on Atlas last year or 2020 that was 10-20 million less than SpaceX's on F9 (ULA basically ran out of Atlas V launches to sell). |
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Posted: 9/3/2022 6:38:13 PM EDT
[#47]
Quote HistoryQuoted: NASA has roughly 50 years experience dealing with liquid hydrogen and pumping into the same tank.. |
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Posted: 9/3/2022 6:39:52 PM EDT
[#48]
Quote HistoryQuoted: It's a government agency. So never. well, once they run out of taxpayers, or the number of actual taxpayers falls below a certain level. |
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Posted: 9/3/2022 6:42:21 PM EDT
[#49]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I'm trying to figure out two things; 1. Apollo already went to the moon in yhe days of slide rules, so what makes Artemis a big deal? 2. Why didn't they ever send the shuttle to the moon given it had the large payload bay to take stuff there? The saddest part about the shuttle is that the launch cadence became a small fraction of what it was designed for. Artemis is a big thing because the ENTIRE idea is to go and stay for a much much longer period of time culminating in ISRU and permanent habs being setup. Living there and learning how to live there would make a Mars trip a little less risky. |
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Posted: 9/3/2022 6:43:11 PM EDT
[#50]
Quote HistoryQuoted: If you actually paid attention you would have learned that the interstage was not leaking and did not crack. Do you even know anything about condensation? Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: What a colossal clusterfuck. Wasn't there a seam in the foam coating leaking last week? The engineers claimed it was just steam from a crack in the foam and not actually leaking hydrogen. I haven't been paying attention. I live like 30 mins from the pad itself. I do know that this rocket has taken an incredibly long time and an incredible amount of money. The way those guys work out there, SpaceX not included, is so slow. |
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