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Posted: 9/10/2024 3:57:25 PM EST
[#1]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By GoldenMead: The Fath-360 missile has a short range like 80 miles tops. Also what’s objective with them? Are they going to use them to hit individual military pieces of equipment and are they even accurate enough for that? Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By GoldenMead: Originally Posted By AlmightyTallest:
I hope that changes, because they are within range. The Fath-360 missile has a short range like 80 miles tops. Also what’s objective with them? Are they going to use them to hit individual military pieces of equipment and are they even accurate enough for that? Russians don't care about accuracy. A minute of city is enough.  New phase of the war and plenty for us all to learn. For the Iranians too. They can test their missiles in a real war against modern countermeassures. |
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Posted: 9/10/2024 3:57:39 PM EST
[#2]
 
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Posted: 9/10/2024 3:58:47 PM EST
[#3]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By BlackHoleSon: And bring Ben and Jack67 back You can't un-ring the bell. |
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Posted: 9/10/2024 4:00:35 PM EST
[#4]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Prime:
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/GXGfCVSXYAA_f-d?format=jpg&name=medium
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/GXHPnf5WwAAo8db?format=png&name=large
Is it common to use a strobe light when clearing a bunker as shown in the last link? |
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Posted: 9/10/2024 4:01:14 PM EST
[#5]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By GoldenMead: The Fath-360 missile has a short range like 80 miles tops. Also what’s objective with them? Are they going to use them to hit individual military pieces of equipment and are they even accurate enough for that? They are very mobile. I wonder if Iran sent enough trucks to launch many at a time. Are they going to have a 50% failure rate like Irans missiles it sent at Israel? New phase of the war and plenty for us all to learn. Edit: Last week the White House and pentagon made comments that Ukraine was just going to get a limited ATACMS going forward. I believe an article was posted here on it. It seems to me hitting these missiles with a ATACM would be a waste of resources. Better to hit strategic sites with them imo. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By GoldenMead: Originally Posted By AlmightyTallest:
I hope that changes, because they are within range. The Fath-360 missile has a short range like 80 miles tops. Also what’s objective with them? Are they going to use them to hit individual military pieces of equipment and are they even accurate enough for that? They are very mobile. I wonder if Iran sent enough trucks to launch many at a time. Are they going to have a 50% failure rate like Irans missiles it sent at Israel? New phase of the war and plenty for us all to learn. Edit: Last week the White House and pentagon made comments that Ukraine was just going to get a limited ATACMS going forward. I believe an article was posted here on it. It seems to me hitting these missiles with a ATACM would be a waste of resources. Better to hit strategic sites with them imo. I agree, I was thinking of using the ATACMS to hit a large storage site for these missiles as a worthy target, not individual launchers. They are like a poor man's HIMARS, so I would be interested in how effective these would be if a few hundred missiles were supplied. |
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Posted: 9/10/2024 4:04:02 PM EST
[#6]
Poland is per reporting from Rzeczpospolita looking to downscale its planned acquisition of M142 HIMARS (Homar-A) Rocket Artillery Systems. Poland had earlier in February of 2023 recieved an FMS approval worth an estimated 10 billion USD which included, among other items 486 M142 HIMARS Launcher modules. These modules formed the basis of the Homar-A GMLRS system which combined them with a Polish domestic truck chassis. Per Captain Paweł Kłosowski from the Armament Agency there are currently no ongoing talks to finalise a procurement contract with other officers in the agency stating that they are waiting on the green light from the finance ministry. The article speculates that the actual contract for these launcher modules could be as low as 126 units with delivery dates that would have already slipped beyond 2025. It is also worth nothing that Poland has recently signed a 10 billion USD contract for AH-64E Apache as well as having 290 Homar-K (K239) GMLRS systems on order from Korea with whom they recently signed an agreement for domestic rocket production. https://rp.pl/biznes/art41096471-himarsy-dla-polski-nie-bedzie-ich-az-500 |
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Posted: 9/10/2024 4:04:52 PM EST
[#7]
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Posted: 9/10/2024 4:06:32 PM EST
[#8]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By stone-age: A bit of a sidetrack but a few minutes ago I was on a RC plane forum and a guy was showing a device he has made where his large long range RC plane carries and drops a quadcopter on the bottom. This is for the purpose of saving the batteries on the quadcopter and transporting it to wherever so it has fresh batteries when it arrives at the target area.The device is a post that sticks up from the quad and engages in the belly of the plane at the center of gravity, on command the plane drops it. I've been wondering why nobody on the russian or ukranian side hasn't already thought of this and started using it. Maybe the fpv drones in the war don't actually need that much range? I've also thought a hybrid quad/plane might make sense. Those Vertical Take Off and Landing (VTOL) aircraft do currently exist but at this time they don't seem to be what is needed. They are not so much a quad that can cruise as much as they are a plane with a few propellers bolted on so they can lift off. We've heard reports of the Ukrainians doing something like that. The problem is always the control link(s). There have been reports that the Ukrainian side has been using larger, longer endurance drones to be a "repeater" of sorts to extend the range of the smaller units. Thing is, the smaller units only have so much time in the air to begin. So, if you want longer range small drones, you need to haul them with a bigger drone, let them go and have the larger drone be a repeater. But, if the bad guys spot and take down the larger drone, then you lose the whole group. In my estimation, VTOL fixed-wings have a lot of utility, especially for ISR in that they have much longer range/endurance than the multicopters. In theory, you could have kamikaze fixed-wings just as easily as kamikaze multi-copters. The only thing the multi-copters have going for them is maneuverability, especially janking in close proximity to the target. Much harder to do with a fixed-wing. |
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Posted: 9/10/2024 4:07:27 PM EST
[#9]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By AlmightyTallest: I agree, I was thinking of using the ATACMS to hit a large storage site for these missiles as a worthy target, not individual launchers. They are like a poor man's HIMARS, so I would be interested in how effective these would be if a few hundred missiles were supplied.  Attached File |
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Posted: 9/10/2024 4:07:51 PM EST
[#10]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By CMOS: Damn. Leftism is ultimately going to destroy Western civilization, all the while we watch as it happens right before our eyes. CMOS Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By CMOS: Originally Posted By lorazepam: Europe has plenty of gas they can extract themselves. I really don't feel sorry for them at all. They are holding the knife to their own necks. Damn. Leftism is ultimately going to destroy Western civilization, all the while we watch as it happens right before our eyes. CMOS Destroyed Greece and Rome. Our turn now. |
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Posted: 9/10/2024 4:08:10 PM EST
[#11]
Quote HistoryQuote HistoryOriginally Posted By absael: Originally Posted By stone-age: A bit of a sidetrack but a few minutes ago I was on a RC plane forum and a guy was showing a device he has made where his large long range RC plane carries and drops a quadcopter on the bottom. This is for the purpose of saving the batteries on the quadcopter and transporting it to wherever so it has fresh batteries when it arrives at the target area.The device is a post that sticks up from the quad and engages in the belly of the plane at the center of gravity, on command the plane drops it. I've been wondering why nobody on the russian or ukranian side hasn't already thought of this and started using it. Maybe the fpv drones in the war don't actually need that much range? I've also thought a hybrid quad/plane might make sense. Those Vertical Take Off and Landing (VTOL) aircraft do currently exist but at this time they don't seem to be what is needed. They are not so much a quad that can cruise as much as they are a plane with a few propellers bolted on so they can lift off. Lol. For some reason, this one tickled my funny bone. |
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Posted: 9/10/2024 4:08:56 PM EST
[#12]
Just in a few moments ago:
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Posted: 9/10/2024 4:09:08 PM EST
[#13]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Prime: Interesting news. Gentlemen? Lot's of people got thread banned for trivial and arbitrary reasons. It was more than a little overboard. I doubt they will go back and un thread ban people so they can participate again. |
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TX, USA
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Posted: 9/10/2024 4:11:12 PM EST
[#14]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By DK-Prof: The old (LoBrau) thread was aggressively moderated by the mods in order to try to keep it on track because lots of people complained about people trolling or trying to derail the thread. The moderation essentially took two forms. One was to boot people who were just posting pro-Russian stuff. The other was to avoid the thread being derailed by constant arguments about Trump, politics, etc. Eventually, the new thread was created because too many people were unhappy with the strict moderation of the old thread. Since then, the OP (LoBrau) of the old thread requested that aggressive moderation of the old thread ends, which we have been happy to implement. Ultimately, nobody WANTED strict moderation to keep trolls out and to keep the thread from being derailed. The mods HATE having to spent tons of time babysitting threads like this, and would much rather NOT have to deal with it. The mods and staff are thrilled to NOT have to deal with it. Unfortunately, by the time that word got out that mods were no longer aggressively moderating the old thread, I think most people had become accustomed to the new thread, and people never really returned to it. It's a shame, and I would love to see it return to prominence. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By DK-Prof: Originally Posted By walkinginadangerzone: Originally Posted By Lieh-tzu: Originally Posted By fervid_dryfire: If my posting rights were reinstated I'd go back to that thread. I still have a tab of it open, right next to this one. Hope abounds for some unlocking to happen and activity there again- it's a 5,000-page thread!...it shouldn't go to waste. Go see the thread now; it's mostly a ghost town. It was wrong to moderate that great thread into the ground- apparently some mods clearly don't appreciate the consequences when they make huge thread-wrecking decisions by taking things too far. Moderation powers should be wielded like a scalpel, not a freaking broadsword, or claymore.  That's my rant; no poll incoming.  Mods don't act without approval of staff, that's been stated on a number of occasions. I don't know why that thread was allowed to be literally moderated to death, but that's what happened. Keeping election talk out along with trolls was a good thing. But there was much more than that going on. The weird thing is that it wasn't always like that. The first 15-18 months of that thread went just fine with an occasional troll getting booted. Then something happened and it completely changed. Oh well. I still think that thread stands as an excellent comprehensive resource for the first 18 months of the 2022 invasion. It's too bad it can't be catalogued and indexed with a table of contents. I wonder if Subnet or Goatboy could extract the entire thread and make an archive of it. It would be great to do topical searches of it. Heck, I'd like to find one of the songs that got posted in early 2022.  You'll asked for it to be moderated more heavily. You'll got what you'll wanted, even if it was unknowingly asking for a safe space. The old (LoBrau) thread was aggressively moderated by the mods in order to try to keep it on track because lots of people complained about people trolling or trying to derail the thread. The moderation essentially took two forms. One was to boot people who were just posting pro-Russian stuff. The other was to avoid the thread being derailed by constant arguments about Trump, politics, etc. Eventually, the new thread was created because too many people were unhappy with the strict moderation of the old thread. Since then, the OP (LoBrau) of the old thread requested that aggressive moderation of the old thread ends, which we have been happy to implement. Ultimately, nobody WANTED strict moderation to keep trolls out and to keep the thread from being derailed. The mods HATE having to spent tons of time babysitting threads like this, and would much rather NOT have to deal with it. The mods and staff are thrilled to NOT have to deal with it. Unfortunately, by the time that word got out that mods were no longer aggressively moderating the old thread, I think most people had become accustomed to the new thread, and people never really returned to it. It's a shame, and I would love to see it return to prominence. Oh, the unintended consequences of my actions!
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Posted: 9/10/2024 4:14:48 PM EST
[#15]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By HIPPO: Agree, but… UA should use whatever LR strike capability they have to delete these. Call it applied R&D. /media/mediaFiles/sharedAlbum/poof_usual_suspects-336.gif Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By HIPPO: Originally Posted By AlmightyTallest: I agree, I was thinking of using the ATACMS to hit a large storage site for these missiles as a worthy target, not individual launchers. They are like a poor man's HIMARS, so I would be interested in how effective these would be if a few hundred missiles were supplied. I'll bet we see HIMARS strike drone footage against these.
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Posted: 9/10/2024 4:20:05 PM EST
[#16]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By doc540: I'm sure I'm influenced by prior history of fighting wars with one hand tied behind your back and allowing the enemy to operate from safe havens. Does this piss off anyone else but me?😡 " I'm totally into bloody prolonged warfare, but not into actually trying to win the war Seems icky" Sec Blinken's Match dot Com profile. |
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Posted: 9/10/2024 4:20:08 PM EST
[#17]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By AlmightyTallest: I'll bet we see HIMARS strike drone footage against these.   
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Posted: 9/10/2024 4:21:06 PM EST
[#18]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Ike838: " I'm totally into bloody prolonged warfare, but not into actually trying to win the war Seems icky" Sec Blinken's Match dot Com profile. |
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Posted: 9/10/2024 4:22:52 PM EST
[Last Edit: HIPPO]
[#19]
2:15 video (2nd tweet). I suspect this will turn out poorly for RU forces.
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Posted: 9/10/2024 4:25:36 PM EST
[#20]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By 4xGM300m: Russians don't care about accuracy. A minute of city is enough. I understand that hitting anywhere in a city is good enough. But perhaps with these missiles they will attempt to strike military targets such as a himars, troops, artillery, etc… hitting a school full of kids is Russia’s thing but maybe they want to try a new tactic involving destroying military hardware. |
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Posted: 9/10/2024 4:27:04 PM EST
[Last Edit: Dracster]
[#21]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By HIPPO: Poland is per reporting from Rzeczpospolita looking to downscale its planned acquisition of M142 HIMARS (Homar-A) Rocket Artillery Systems. Poland had earlier in February of 2023 recieved an FMS approval worth an estimated 10 billion USD which included, among other items 486 M142 HIMARS Launcher modules. These modules formed the basis of the Homar-A GMLRS system which combined them with a Polish domestic truck chassis. Per Captain Pawe K osowski from the Armament Agency there are currently no ongoing talks to finalise a procurement contract with other officers in the agency stating that they are waiting on the green light from the finance ministry. The article speculates that the actual contract for these launcher modules could be as low as 126 units with delivery dates that would have already slipped beyond 2025. It is also worth nothing that Poland has recently signed a 10 billion USD contract for AH-64E Apache as well as having 290 Homar-K (K239) GMLRS systems on order from Korea with whom they recently signed an agreement for domestic rocket production. https://rp.pl/biznes/art41096471-himarsy-dla-polski-nie-bedzie-ich-az-500 @AlmightyTallest See? That 2040 delivery date ain't gonna cut it.
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Posted: 9/10/2024 4:30:50 PM EST
[#22]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By HIPPO: I suspect Blinken is the hawk, Sullivan and Austin are biting pillows. I bet none of them want to allow ukraine to strike deeper into Russia. I bet someone in the Pentagon or Intel community said we need to allow Ukraine to end this and that the US does not an infinite supply of arms to give away. Reality is starting to hit hopefully. |
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Posted: 9/10/2024 4:33:34 PM EST
[#23]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By HIPPO:
That is a major long range bomber base up Finland. Fingers crossed ! |
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Posted: 9/10/2024 4:34:49 PM EST
[#24]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By GoldenMead: Your post is ridiculous. Israel doesn’t have any aircraft that can carry a GBU-57 or anything that is its equivalent. A F-15 can not carry one lol. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By GoldenMead: Originally Posted By MKSheppard: Israel probably already has something equivalent to GBU-57 for their F-15s. Remember, they have a complete socio-technical military industry that produces all sorts of high tech military goods. Designing and producing a penetrating bomb is something much less complex than what they've done with Iron Dome + Arrow, etc. Your post is ridiculous. Israel doesn’t have any aircraft that can carry a GBU-57 or anything that is its equivalent. A F-15 can not carry one lol. Maybe they can rent a B-52 for a day. That way, we actually receive money instead of spending money. Lol. |
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Posted: 9/10/2024 4:35:59 PM EST
[#25]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By DK-Prof: The old (LoBrau) thread was aggressively moderated by the mods in order to try to keep it on track because lots of people complained about people trolling or trying to derail the thread. The moderation essentially took two forms. One was to boot people who were just posting pro-Russian stuff. The other was to avoid the thread being derailed by constant arguments about Trump, politics, etc. Eventually, the new thread was created because too many people were unhappy with the strict moderation of the old thread. Since then, the OP (LoBrau) of the old thread requested that aggressive moderation of the old thread ends, which we have been happy to implement. Ultimately, nobody WANTED strict moderation to keep trolls out and to keep the thread from being derailed. The mods HATE having to spent tons of time babysitting threads like this, and would much rather NOT have to deal with it. The mods and staff are thrilled to NOT have to deal with it. Unfortunately, by the time that word got out that mods were no longer aggressively moderating the old thread, I think most people had become accustomed to the new thread, and people never really returned to it. It's a shame, and I would love to see it return to prominence. don't forget a lot of us (me included) were banned from the old thread. Yeah imagine that. I am SO controversial. |
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Posted: 9/10/2024 4:36:29 PM EST
[#26]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Dracster: @AlmightyTallest See? That 2040 delivery date ain't gonna cut it. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Dracster: Originally Posted By HIPPO: Poland is per reporting from Rzeczpospolita looking to downscale its planned acquisition of M142 HIMARS (Homar-A) Rocket Artillery Systems. Poland had earlier in February of 2023 recieved an FMS approval worth an estimated 10 billion USD which included, among other items 486 M142 HIMARS Launcher modules. These modules formed the basis of the Homar-A GMLRS system which combined them with a Polish domestic truck chassis. Per Captain Pawe K osowski from the Armament Agency there are currently no ongoing talks to finalise a procurement contract with other officers in the agency stating that they are waiting on the green light from the finance ministry. The article speculates that the actual contract for these launcher modules could be as low as 126 units with delivery dates that would have already slipped beyond 2025. It is also worth nothing that Poland has recently signed a 10 billion USD contract for AH-64E Apache as well as having 290 Homar-K (K239) GMLRS systems on order from Korea with whom they recently signed an agreement for domestic rocket production. https://rp.pl/biznes/art41096471-himarsy-dla-polski-nie-bedzie-ich-az-500 @AlmightyTallest See? That 2040 delivery date ain't gonna cut it. lol, I think Poland will keep adding defense contractors for supplying stuff until they get the equipment in the timeline they wanted.
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Posted: 9/10/2024 4:44:55 PM EST
[#27]
Been saying this for a year.
Beijing is giving Moscow "very substantial" help to beef up its war machine, and in return Russia is handing over its closely guarded military tech on submarines and missiles, the United States' Deputy Secretary of State Kurt Campbell said Tuesday. Speaking with a group of journalists, including POLITICO, after meetings with European Union and NATO counterparts in Brussels, Campbell upped the ante on Beijing. The U.S. previously focused on Beijing's supply of what's known as dual-use technologies — which can be applied for military or civilian purposes. Now Washington is unambiguously saying that China is aiding the Russian military. With Moscow facing international sanctions, it desperately needs technology to boost its military production to be able to continue its war against Ukraine. https://www.politico.eu/article/united-states-accuse-china-help-russia-war-kurt-campbell/ |
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Posted: 9/10/2024 4:45:19 PM EST
[#28]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By CarmelBytheSea: I wonder if anyone under 50 knows that acronym? Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By CarmelBytheSea: Originally Posted By weptek911: That’s been my bugaboo for a while; Why are we friends with pricks that kicked us out of their country? NO BLOOD FOR LBFMs I say. I wonder if anyone under 50 knows that acronym? I didn't until I read Marcinko's book.
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MD, USA
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Posted: 9/10/2024 4:50:42 PM EST
[#29]
I wonder how long Russia's stockpiles of ADA/SAM missiles are gonna last.
The shoe is now on the other foot; and Russia doesn't have the entire world feeding them weapons, unlike Ukraine. Every S-300/S-400 fired to shoot down a drone in Moscow is one less fired against a F-16 in Ukraine... Also, it appears that Russia has/had been slowly building a stockpile of Shaheeds; the recent Kursk incursion (hey that rhymes) has shook loose a lot of Russian offensive munitions -- after long periods of little or no shaheed attacks; they're cranking them out now. |
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MD, USA
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Posted: 9/10/2024 4:59:51 PM EST
[#30]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By GoldenMead: Your post is ridiculous. Israel doesn’t have any aircraft that can carry a GBU-57 or anything that is its equivalent. A F-15 can not carry one lol. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By GoldenMead: Your post is ridiculous. Israel doesn’t have any aircraft that can carry a GBU-57 or anything that is its equivalent. A F-15 can not carry one lol.  Attached FileIsrael has the F-15I, which is basically the Israeli version of the F-15E Strike Eagle; which has about 20,000 pounds of payload (I think with CFTs) which one can play with. Given that the GBU-28 "Deep Throat" of 4,000 lb Gulf War Fame can penetrate in excess of 16 feet of concrete or 150 feet of earth...and that Israel got 55 of them... ...plus there's always the possibility of an Israeli version of the Disney bomb based off the GBU-28... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Disney_bomb The Disney bomb, also known as the Disney Swish,[4] officially the 4500 lb Concrete Piercing/Rocket Assisted bomb was a rocket-assisted bunker buster bomb developed during the Second World War by the British Royal Navy to penetrate hardened concrete targets, such as submarine pens, which could resist conventional free-fall bombs. Devised by Royal Navy Captain Edward Terrell, the bomb was fitted with solid-fuel rockets to accelerate its descent, giving it an impact speed of 990 mph (1,590 km/h)—substantially beyond the 750 mph (1,210 km/h) free-fall impact velocity[5] of the 5-tonne Tallboy "earthquake" bomb for comparable purposes. The Disney could penetrate 16 ft (4.9 m) of solid concrete before detonating. It wouldn't be that hard to design a rocket boosted 10,000 pound deep penetrating munition for a F-15I, meaning a F-15I could carry two of them. |
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Posted: 9/10/2024 5:02:50 PM EST
[Last Edit: daemon734]
[#31]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By MKSheppard: I wonder how long Russia's stockpiles of ADA/SAM missiles are gonna last. The shoe is now on the other foot; and Russia doesn't have the entire world feeding them weapons, unlike Ukraine. Every S-300/S-400 fired to shoot down a drone in Moscow is one less fired against a F-16 in Ukraine... Also, it appears that Russia has/had been slowly building a stockpile of Shaheeds; the recent Kursk incursion (hey that rhymes) has shook loose a lot of Russian offensive munitions -- after long periods of little or no shaheed attacks; they're cranking them out now. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By MKSheppard: I wonder how long Russia's stockpiles of ADA/SAM missiles are gonna last. The shoe is now on the other foot; and Russia doesn't have the entire world feeding them weapons, unlike Ukraine. Every S-300/S-400 fired to shoot down a drone in Moscow is one less fired against a F-16 in Ukraine... Also, it appears that Russia has/had been slowly building a stockpile of Shaheeds; the recent Kursk incursion (hey that rhymes) has shook loose a lot of Russian offensive munitions -- after long periods of little or no shaheed attacks; they're cranking them out now. I don't know where you come up with this stuff, but it's easily researchable. They doubled the average monthly numbers in August, with only four days of no attacks. For the most part Russia doesn't have to use strategic ADA against drones. They never deprioritized SHORAD or medium range defenses. The S300/Patriot has been a crutch the west has had to exclusively lean on. The vast majority of UA drones are taken out with EW in the first place. For some reason we haven't gifted them the same technologies Iran and Russia use on 100% of their long range OWAs. Russia has also had the largest amount of ADA known in the world for decades. That was one of the main principles of Gerasimov doctrine and RNGW, to focus heavily A2AD and fires, even at the expense of tactical maneuver. The west are absolutely who are treading water here with ADA.  Attached FileOriginally Posted By 4xGM300m: For the Iranians too. They can test their missiles in a real war against modern countermeassures. Iranian ballistic missiles have been getting tested for years in a LSCO environment against western systems via KSA, with multiple engagements against us as well. |
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Posted: 9/10/2024 5:03:02 PM EST
[#32]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By MKSheppard: /media/mediaFiles/sharedAlbum/planet-of-the-apes-charlton-heston-992.gif Israel has the F-15I, which is basically the Israeli version of the F-15E Strike Eagle; which has about 20,000 pounds of payload (I think with CFTs) which one can play with. Given that the GBU-28 "Deep Throat" of 4,000 lb Gulf War Fame can penetrate in excess of 16 feet of concrete or 150 feet of earth...and that Israel got 55 of them... ...plus there's always the possibility of an Israeli version of the Disney bomb based off the GBU-28... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Disney_bomb It wouldn't be that hard to design a rocket boosted 10,000 pound deep penetrating munition for a F-15I, meaning a F-15I could carry two of them. A GBU-28 is going to do nothing to Irans nuclear facilities. You also said they could strap a GBU-57 or equivalent to a F-15 which is ridiculous. Try reading some of Carmel’s post on the facilities. |
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MD, USA
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Posted: 9/10/2024 5:14:59 PM EST
[#33]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By GoldenMead: A GBU-28 is going to do nothing to Irans nuclear facilities. You also said they could strap a GBU-57 or equivalent to a F-15 which is ridiculous. Try reading some of Carmel’s post on the facilities. There's a reason I specified a 10,000~ pound class weapon (well over twice that of a GBU-28's mass) with rocket boost. GBU-57 relies on sheer mass and drop altitude to achieve it's penetration. If you rocket boost, the required weight goes down. |
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Posted: 9/10/2024 5:19:34 PM EST
[#34]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By GoldenMead: A GBU-28 is going to do nothing to Irans nuclear facilities. You also said they could strap a GBU-57 or equivalent to a F-15 which is ridiculous. Try reading some of Carmel’s post on the facilities. B61 can do it. 
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MD, USA
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Posted: 9/10/2024 5:21:35 PM EST
[Last Edit: MKSheppard]
[#35]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By daemon734: I don't know where you come up with this stuff, but it's easily researchable. They doubled the average monthly numbers in August, with only four days of no attacks. I guess you have short term memory loss as well. Remember very late July-ish, when I pointed out that we were seeing a disconnect between the claimed manufacturing output of the Shaheed factories and what we were actually SEEING at the front in terms of attack frequency + attack size? Turns out the answer to my question "where are they?" got answered -- stockpiles. It only took the Kursk Incursion to shake loose said stockpiles -- i.e. as you point out about 2x the average monthly numbers and only 4 days of no attacks in August. |
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Posted: 9/10/2024 5:23:02 PM EST
[#36]
 I'm seeing a lot of people declaring that the armored column got across the Seym River despite the bridges being out - the bridge in and out of Korenevo is intact, as are the bridges between Korenevo and Korenvo Village The 2 armored platoons didn't need to do a contested wet crossing based on the route they took, which came from the north |
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Posted: 9/10/2024 5:25:41 PM EST
[#37]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By MKSheppard: There's a reason I specified a 10,000~ pound class weapon (well over twice that of a GBU-28's mass) with rocket boost. GBU-57 relies on sheer mass and drop altitude to achieve it's penetration. If you rocket boost, the required weight goes down. lol dude just stop. Your original post I quoted you said they were going to use a GBU-57 or equivalent. But now that you went down this rabbit hole let’s go. So now you’re telling me a f-15 has a hard point that can handle a 10,000 lbs bomb? lol. It doesn’t but let’s say it can for your sake. Now we have a 10,000 pound rocket/bomb how much of that 10k lbs is going to be rocket motor and fuel? So we have a very small explosive that’s going a little master than a GBU-57 and yet it some how does more damage? That 10,000 lbs bomb has a rocket motor, fuel, explosive and some how it has enough armor in the nose to? Maybe you should look at why a GBU-57 weighs so much and why it can penetrate so far and why the US military doesn’t have small rocket bombs to do the same thing. |
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Posted: 9/10/2024 5:28:35 PM EST
[#38]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By HIPPO: I suspect Blinken is the hawk, Sullivan and Austin are biting pillows. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By HIPPO: Originally Posted By Ike838: " I'm totally into bloody prolonged warfare, but not into actually trying to win the war Seems icky" Sec Blinken's Match dot Com profile. My read on Blinken is he's a moron. I don't think anyone in this (mal)adiministration has a clue and they seem focused on our foreign policy should be that which is least likely to disrupt the status quo until after the election. Disgusting. |
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Posted: 9/10/2024 5:29:11 PM EST
[Last Edit: daemon734]
[#39]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By MKSheppard: I guess you have short term memory loss as well. Remember very late July-ish, when I pointed out that we were seeing a disconnect between the claimed manufacturing output of the Shaheed factories and what we were actually SEEING at the front in terms of attack frequency + attack size? Turns out the answer to my question "where are they?" got answered -- stockpiles. It only took the Kursk Incursion to shake loose said stockpiles -- i.e. as you point out about 2x the average monthly numbers and only 4 days of no attacks in August. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By MKSheppard: I guess you have short term memory loss as well. Remember very late July-ish, when I pointed out that we were seeing a disconnect between the claimed manufacturing output of the Shaheed factories and what we were actually SEEING at the front in terms of attack frequency + attack size? Turns out the answer to my question "where are they?" got answered -- stockpiles. It only took the Kursk Incursion to shake loose said stockpiles -- i.e. as you point out about 2x the average monthly numbers and only 4 days of no attacks in August. There has been zero drop in attacks as you claimed, only incremental increases. That goes hand in hand with literally every estimate about production capacity consistently increasing. Your original point in June was that you believe the output of the Shahed factory was less than being reported, not that they were shelving the difference. I was the one who told you that was incorrect. Did they shoot more in August because of Kursk? Probably. But if you have been keeping tabs on Kursk lately I would say it's working. Originally Posted By MKSheppard: after long periods of little or no shaheed attacks You claimed this before and you claimed this now, both times you have been wrong. |
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Posted: 9/10/2024 5:31:27 PM EST
[#40]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By planemaker: My read on Blinken is he's a moron. I don't think anyone in this (mal)adiministration has a clue and they seem focused on our foreign policy should be that which is least likely to disrupt the status quo until after the election. Disgusting. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By planemaker: Originally Posted By HIPPO: Originally Posted By Ike838: " I'm totally into bloody prolonged warfare, but not into actually trying to win the war Seems icky" Sec Blinken's Match dot Com profile. My read on Blinken is he's a moron. I don't think anyone in this (mal)adiministration has a clue and they seem focused on our foreign policy should be that which is least likely to disrupt the status quo until after the election. Disgusting. Correct. This administration inept policies are only prolonging this conflict and costing more lives. |
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Posted: 9/10/2024 5:37:11 PM EST
[#41]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Ryan_Scott: B61 can do it. Too bad we didn’t develop the W61 Earth Penetrator. |
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Posted: 9/10/2024 5:37:44 PM EST
[#42]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By GoldenMead: lol dude just stop. Your original post I quoted you said they were going to use a GBU-57 or equivalent. But now that you went down this rabbit hole let’s go. So now you’re telling me a f-15 has a hard point that can handle a 10,000 lbs bomb? lol. It doesn’t but let’s say it can for your sake. Now we have a 10,000 pound rocket/bomb how much of that 10k lbs is going to be rocket motor and fuel? So we have a very small explosive that’s going a little master than a GBU-57 and yet it some how does more damage? That 10,000 lbs bomb has a rocket motor, fuel, explosive and some how it has enough armor in the nose to? Maybe you should look at why a GBU-57 weighs so much and why it can penetrate so far and why the US military doesn’t have small rocket bombs to do the same thing. There has been a proposal for the USAF to develop rocket assisted penetrators but at least publicly it never went anywhere. The GBU-72 is about to be a thing though, and Israel wants them. |
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Posted: 9/10/2024 5:39:39 PM EST
[#43]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By walkinginadangerzone: lol Called it in another thread. Guessing this is why Russia received Iranian missiles. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By walkinginadangerzone: Originally Posted By HIPPO: House Foreign Affairs Chairman Michael McCaul stated that U.S. Secretary of State Antony Blinken, during a recent conversation, indicated he would be traveling with his UK counterpart to Kyiv to inform Ukrainian officials that they will be allowed to strike Russia with ATACMS missiles, according to Capitol Hill reporter @juliegraceb . lol Called it in another thread. Guessing this is why Russia received Iranian missiles. I think you have it backwards. |
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Posted: 9/10/2024 5:41:54 PM EST
[#44]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By GoldenMead: Too bad we didn’t develop the W61 Earth Penetrator. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By GoldenMead: Originally Posted By Ryan_Scott: B61 can do it. Too bad we didn’t develop the W61 Earth Penetrator. Right, I can’t think of a stand off earth penetrating capability otherwise. The -13 will do for earth penetrating gravity bombs though. |
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Posted: 9/10/2024 5:43:20 PM EST
[#45]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By daemon734: There has been zero drop in attacks as you claimed, only incremental increases. That goes hand in hand with literally every estimate about production capacity consistently increasing. Your original point in June was that you believe the output of the Shahed factory was less than being reported, not that they were shelving the difference. I was the one who told you that was incorrect. Did they shoot more in August because of Kursk? Probably. But if you have been keeping tabs on Kursk lately I would say it's working. I don’t know about Shaheeds but the rate of attacks with Iskander exceeded any open source estimate of production rates recently, so either the rates are wrong or they had a stockpile and were shooting it to blunt the assault. Given we saw it used against very marginal SRBM targets I suspect the latter. |
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Posted: 9/10/2024 5:44:09 PM EST
[#46]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By HIPPO: Just in a few moments ago:
Good |
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Posted: 9/10/2024 5:46:46 PM EST
[#47]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By MKSheppard: I wonder how long Russia's stockpiles of ADA/SAM missiles are gonna last. The shoe is now on the other foot; and Russia doesn't have the entire world feeding them weapons, unlike Ukraine. Every S-300/S-400 fired to shoot down a drone in Moscow is one less fired against a F-16 in Ukraine... Also, it appears that Russia has/had been slowly building a stockpile of Shaheeds; the recent Kursk incursion (hey that rhymes) has shook loose a lot of Russian offensive munitions -- after long periods of little or no shaheed attacks; they're cranking them out now. To start with, the entire rest of the world could give Ukraine all of their S-300 systems and Russia would still have twice as many missiles for that system. Now, most of them, around 7-8000 are old and outdated but those still work fine for ground attacks. Updated/usable SAMs for the S300/S400 were estimated around 4000 a few years back. Then there's the medium and short range systems... |
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Posted: 9/10/2024 5:48:53 PM EST
[#48]
Russia only has 4000 updated SAMs? The US has more PAC-2/3 than that (estimated) and it’s not nearly enough…
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Posted: 9/10/2024 5:49:08 PM EST
[#49]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Ryan_Scott: Right, I can’t think of a stand off earth penetrating capability otherwise. The -13 will do for earth penetrating gravity bombs though. Israel’s only realistic option to destroy the nuclear facilities is the hammer them with Jericho 3 missiles. But nuking a country might piss a few people off but I say they should go for it. |
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Posted: 9/10/2024 5:55:01 PM EST
[Last Edit: daemon734]
[#50]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Ryan_Scott: I don’t know about Shaheeds but the rate of attacks with Iskander exceeded any open source estimate of production rates recently, so either the rates are wrong or they had a stockpile and were shooting it to blunt the assault. Given we saw it used against very marginal SRBM targets I suspect the latter. I keep getting told Russia is flying them off the rails the second they leave the factory, so that would be different. Either way, the people assessing those low production rates have been wrong if Russia has been able to stockpile missiles and OWAs as deep as being shown now...so both some column A and some column B are in play here. Russia is obviously expending significantly more munitions due to the Kursk offensive. That is not in question. However that has little to nothing to do with the overall trends shown the past 2-3 quarters. With that said whatever they are doing in Kursk seems to be working as of late without impacting momentum on the lines elsewhere, so these misconceptions about production capacity and stockpiles are indeed a problem. They seem to be doing just fine substituting fires for committing maneuver troops. |
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