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Posted: 5/8/2010 7:03:46 PM EST
[#1]
Quoted:
I hate to say this, because I'm facing the same issue, but I think you––and I–– have to ruthlessly go through the whole process again, with an eye to eliminating as many redundant items as possible, and an overall goal of reducing the overall weight of the gear carried. I would suggest combining the FAKs into two. I have been thinking about this, and to some extent I agree with you. I could probably move the "boo-boo kit onto the MAV (in place of one of the frag pouches), or just incorporate it into the larger kit on the pack. In any case, the FAK on the pack is intended to be used up first, and/or used to replenish items in the other two kits. Of course, now that I consider it, if I use up anything in the VOK, that means I'm seriously injured, in which case I won't be worried about replenishing anything LOL.Eliminate the frag pouches, they are a temptation waiting to be filled. They're there because I had them lying around, and one would make an excellent compass pouch––I've been trying to find a better place for my GI lensatic compass.The holster should be replaced with something lighter. I dunno if it's possible to get lighter than the SERPA, unless I find an M12 for cheap. In fact, the Safariland 6285 I'm looking at is probably heavier. The sheath knife might be replaced with something lighter. I know having a sheath knife is a subject of debate. I prefer to have one, and I like the LMF II, but the sheath is incredibly bulky. I'm thinking a surplus pilot's survival knife, or a RAT might be more handy.Do you really need the Roly-Poly? It's of so little weight as to be inconsequential. In addition, not shown in my third line pics is a bando of 150 rounds of 5.56 (add 5 pounds). So yeah, I suppose having a way to recover mags would be useful. The RP can also hold a Nalgene. OTOH, a cargo pocket is the "old school" solution for recovering mags, so we'll see.Can you replace the multi-tool with something lighter? Doubtful––it's smaller and lighter than the original Gerber I carry in my tool belt. Don't see any bug juice/netting in your gear. Good point, but I've found that it's unnecessary due to my hairyness.  Maybe I'll stick some in my pack. What about a simple, nesting cup for the Nalgene, or same for a GI canteen? I still have yet to get that––it's on my list. The cup might eliminate the need for a filter, as you could build a fire and boil water. See what I mean? Cutting weight will almost certainly mean cutting conveniance, but it might be a necessary trade-off.
I'm looking at each item I carry and asking myself "Is this really necessary?"; Can something lighter/smaller serve as well in it's place? Can I combine some of the functions of two carried items into a single carried item without losing anything significant?I agree, and testing will show the merits of each item. I think, at this point, that you have taken this exercise as far as possible.Thanks, and again I agree. I've put a lot of thought into this, and none of it had to do with looking "tacticool" or having what "all the cool kids are wearing" LOL. The next step is extended field trials, and that will be an eye-opener, I'm thinking.I'm anxious to do so, but unfortunately (or fortunately, depending on your perspective  ), I'm about to begin a new job that will consume a majority of my time. Perhaps I can take some time in a nearby wilderness area to properly evaluate it––I hope so.
Don't forget that a prime purpose of the "Line concept" is to walk a piece, and then shed the backpack, then walk some more and come back to it. Not everything has to be, or should be, carried ALL the timespan Again, agreed. I used to surprise myself by going out all day (and then some) with nothing more than a basic LBE setup and a stuffed butt pack. (I know how you feel on those LOL!) Obviously, whenever possible, the items in the pack would be used first, in order to cut down on weight, and also so that if I had to ditch the pack, I'd lose as little as posible. How much (or how many "lines") are carried carried would also depend on the situtation (think METT-T). Hey, I was hoping you'd chime in. I always appreciate your feedback.  See my comments in blue.
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Posted: 5/10/2010 3:45:07 PM EST
[#2]
I dunno if it's possible to get lighter than the SERPA, unless I find an M12 for cheap.
Keep an eye on GovSurplus for M-12 holsters. I bought one for $12. They have the current ACU vest with all the pouches for $45, for anyone interested. I carried my M9 with the bianchi drop down extension in Iraq (gas passers were fobbits so take it for what its worth) and had no issues. I carry my 220 in one around the property here at home and have for years. |
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Posted: 7/8/2010 1:45:33 PM EST
[#3]
Friendly bump for new members.
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Posted: 7/9/2010 1:49:56 AM EST
[#4]
tag
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Posted: 7/10/2010 8:41:47 AM EST
[#5]
Quoted:
I dunno if it's possible to get lighter than the SERPA, unless I find an M12 for cheap. Keep an eye on GovSurplus for M-12 holsters. I bought one for $12. They have the current ACU vest with all the pouches for $45, for anyone interested. I carried my M9 with the bianchi drop down extension in Iraq (gas passers were fobbits so take it for what its worth) and had no issues. I carry my 220 in one around the property here at home and have for years. I have heard some adverse comments about the Bianchi-made holster, but mine do their intended job just fine. Even if the top flap is removed, and an accessory thumb-catch is installed, they are certainly not what anyone would consider quick-draw holsters, nor are they designed to enhance weapon retention. They are what they are, and they do their intended job well. Clearly, if you expect to grapple with your opponent––as a cop might do––, then a holster with weapon-retention capability is in order. OTOH, many of the latest holsters I have seen––and used–– seem to be the worst of all worlds. They incorporate weapon-retention capability, but also delete the flap which protects the weapon against at least some crud. IOW, they holsters are semi-quick draw, but are dirt/dust traps. Is it useful to draw your pistol semi-quickly, and mebbe have it jam? Not saying this always happens, but the possibility is there. As always, define your most likely mission/scenario, and then go with the gear that meets your well-thought-out most-likely needs. For the most part, a civilian police officer's holster needs are very different from a Soldier's/Marine's, and different still from most civilians. Define the end goal with great care, and most problems solve themselves. FWIW, Bianchi makes a number of iterations of the M-12. Depending on the model, some will fit one or another pistol, and not others. The holsters all look alike, but the model type is clearly cast into the plastic, so it is easy to tell if any particular holster will fit your pistol Go to the Bianchi site, and study up on which model holster will fit which pistol. These holsters don't have any "give", so don't buy a holster that is too small and expect it to somehow expand to fit your pistol. I don't plan on doing quick-draw competitions, so most of my holsters are either M-12s ( I have all the bells and whistles available), an SDS MOLLE pistol pouch, and various USGI leather holsters––multiple types, and all treated with Pecard leather preservative–– as well as some high-end, and some low-end civvy holsters. They all perform their intended function very well––for me. |
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Posted: 7/10/2010 2:41:37 PM EST
[#6]
Quoted:
Quoted:
I dunno if it's possible to get lighter than the SERPA, unless I find an M12 for cheap. Keep an eye on GovSurplus for M-12 holsters. I bought one for $12. They have the current ACU vest with all the pouches for $45, for anyone interested. I carried my M9 with the bianchi drop down extension in Iraq (gas passers were fobbits so take it for what its worth) and had no issues. I carry my 220 in one around the property here at home and have for years. I have heard some adverse comments about the Bianchi-made holster, but mine do their intended job just fine. Even if the top flap is removed, and an accessory thumb-catch is installed, they are certainly not what anyone would consider quick-draw holsters, nor are they designed to enhance weapon retention. They are what they are, and they do their intended job well. Clearly, if you expect to grapple with your opponent––as a cop might do––, then a holster with weapon-retention capability is in order. OTOH, many of the latest holsters I have seen––and used–– seem to be the worst of all worlds. They incorporate weapon-retention capability, but also delete the flap which protects the weapon against at least some crud. IOW, they holsters are semi-quick draw, but are dirt/dust traps. Is it useful to draw your pistol semi-quickly, and mebbe have it jam? Not saying this always happens, but the possibility is there. As always, define your most likely mission/scenario, and then go with the gear that meets your well-thought-out most-likely needs. For the most part, a civilian police officer's holster needs are very different from a Soldier's/Marine's, and different still from most civilians. Define the end goal with great care, and most problems solve themselves. FWIW, Bianchi makes a number of iterations of the M-12. Depending on the model, some will fit one or another pistol, and not others. The holsters all look alike, but the model type is clearly cast into the plastic, so it is easy to tell if any particular holster will fit your pistol Go to the Bianchi site, and study up on which model holster will fit which pistol. These holsters don't have any "give", so don't buy a holster that is too small and expect it to somehow expand to fit your pistol. I don't plan on doing quick-draw competitions, so most of my holsters are either M-12s ( I have all the bells and whistles available), an SDS MOLLE pistol pouch, and various USGI leather holsters––multiple types, and all treated with Pecard leather preservative–– as well as some high-end, and some low-end civvy holsters. They all perform their intended function very well––for me. Raf, I completely agree. For a field holster, the M12 does an admirable job. It's certainly better than the old GI leather holster it replaced, IMHO. The M12 holsters seem to get a lot of hate here, whether justified or not, and I don't know why. Like you said, it's not a "retention" or "quick-draw" holster like the Safariland SLS/ALS and the SERPA. But to keep bulk crud out of your secondary weapon, it does well. I would personally use some sort of lanyard with the M12 to ensure the weapon stays with me. I may actually switch the SERPA holster on the warbelt for an M12, because it's a rough use holster that accomplishes what I need it to do with a minimum of cost.
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Posted: 7/11/2010 4:28:23 PM EST
[#7]
Quoted:
Quoted:
I dunno if it's possible to get lighter than the SERPA, unless I find an M12 for cheap. Keep an eye on GovSurplus for M-12 holsters. I bought one for $12. They have the current ACU vest with all the pouches for $45, for anyone interested. I carried my M9 with the bianchi drop down extension in Iraq (gas passers were fobbits so take it for what its worth) and had no issues. I carry my 220 in one around the property here at home and have for years. I have heard some adverse comments about the Bianchi-made holster, but mine do their intended job just fine. Even if the top flap is removed, and an accessory thumb-catch is installed, they are certainly not what anyone would consider quick-draw holsters, nor are they designed to enhance weapon retention. They are what they are, and they do their intended job well. Clearly, if you expect to grapple with your opponent––as a cop might do––, then a holster with weapon-retention capability is in order. OTOH, many of the latest holsters I have seen––and used–– seem to be the worst of all worlds. They incorporate weapon-retention capability, but also delete the flap which protects the weapon against at least some crud. IOW, they holsters are semi-quick draw, but are dirt/dust traps. Is it useful to draw your pistol semi-quickly, and mebbe have it jam? Not saying this always happens, but the possibility is there. As always, define your most likely mission/scenario, and then go with the gear that meets your well-thought-out most-likely needs. For the most part, a civilian police officer's holster needs are very different from a Soldier's/Marine's, and different still from most civilians. Define the end goal with great care, and most problems solve themselves. FWIW, Bianchi makes a number of iterations of the M-12. Depending on the model, some will fit one or another pistol, and not others. The holsters all look alike, but the model type is clearly cast into the plastic, so it is easy to tell if any particular holster will fit your pistol Go to the Bianchi site, and study up on which model holster will fit which pistol. These holsters don't have any "give", so don't buy a holster that is too small and expect it to somehow expand to fit your pistol. I don't plan on doing quick-draw competitions, so most of my holsters are either M-12s ( I have all the bells and whistles available), an SDS MOLLE pistol pouch, and various USGI leather holsters––multiple types, and all treated with Pecard leather preservative–– as well as some high-end, and some low-end civvy holsters. They all perform their intended function very well––for me. Raf, I didn't know the M12 came in different variants––Thanks! I'm old enough that I was issued .45s when I was first issued a pistol and thus remember the old WWII style leather that didn't do much. We all bought our own holsters when I was in Germany in the '80s. As far as the M12 hate, I've missed it here, but I'm not surprised. It may not be quick draw, and it may not have an automatic retention system, but I've never had my 220 or M9 fallout. (Yes, doesn't mean it can't happen––maybe Murphy was busy when my weapon was holstered and unstrapped) I agree with you totally that today's holsters do nothing but offer the worst of everything. I have 2 blackhawk holsters (one SERPA) one non-SERPA, and they really leave the weapon exposed (i.e. it gets dirty fast). My M12s keep my weapons noticeably cleaner. I thought about looking at a safariland 6004 until I was able to talk to a LEO who carried one and I got a mixed review. Looking at it on him I have one word––BULKY! I'm not getting one to try and then not like. So, for now, the M12s have it. I've read about the problems with the SERPA, but in my line of business, there are twice as many documented accounts of the things I use daily. I don't discount any of them (SERPA or anesthesia related), but rare is rare and you have to ask yourself if changing your practice is worth it. And that is up to each individual whose decision I'll respect. |
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Posted: 7/11/2010 4:49:33 PM EST
[#8]
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
I dunno if it's possible to get lighter than the SERPA, unless I find an M12 for cheap. Keep an eye on GovSurplus for M-12 holsters. I bought one for $12. They have the current ACU vest with all the pouches for $45, for anyone interested. I carried my M9 with the bianchi drop down extension in Iraq (gas passers were fobbits so take it for what its worth) and had no issues. I carry my 220 in one around the property here at home and have for years. I have heard some adverse comments about the Bianchi-made holster, but mine do their intended job just fine. Even if the top flap is removed, and an accessory thumb-catch is installed, they are certainly not what anyone would consider quick-draw holsters, nor are they designed to enhance weapon retention. They are what they are, and they do their intended job well. Clearly, if you expect to grapple with your opponent––as a cop might do––, then a holster with weapon-retention capability is in order. OTOH, many of the latest holsters I have seen––and used–– seem to be the worst of all worlds. They incorporate weapon-retention capability, but also delete the flap which protects the weapon against at least some crud. IOW, they holsters are semi-quick draw, but are dirt/dust traps. Is it useful to draw your pistol semi-quickly, and mebbe have it jam? Not saying this always happens, but the possibility is there. As always, define your most likely mission/scenario, and then go with the gear that meets your well-thought-out most-likely needs. For the most part, a civilian police officer's holster needs are very different from a Soldier's/Marine's, and different still from most civilians. Define the end goal with great care, and most problems solve themselves. FWIW, Bianchi makes a number of iterations of the M-12. Depending on the model, some will fit one or another pistol, and not others. The holsters all look alike, but the model type is clearly cast into the plastic, so it is easy to tell if any particular holster will fit your pistol Go to the Bianchi site, and study up on which model holster will fit which pistol. These holsters don't have any "give", so don't buy a holster that is too small and expect it to somehow expand to fit your pistol. I don't plan on doing quick-draw competitions, so most of my holsters are either M-12s ( I have all the bells and whistles available), an SDS MOLLE pistol pouch, and various USGI leather holsters––multiple types, and all treated with Pecard leather preservative–– as well as some high-end, and some low-end civvy holsters. They all perform their intended function very well––for me. Raf, I didn't know the M12 came in different variants––Thanks! I'm old enough that I was issued .45s when I was first issued a pistol and thus remember the old WWII style leather that didn't do much. We all bought our own holsters when I was in Germany in the '80s. As far as the M12 hate, I've missed it here, but I'm not surprised. It may not be quick draw, and it may not have an automatic retention system, but I've never had my 220 or M9 fallout. (Yes, doesn't mean it can't happen––maybe Murphy was busy when my weapon was holstered and unstrapped) I agree with you totally that today's holsters do nothing but offer the worst of everything. I have 2 blackhawk holsters (one SERPA) one non-SERPA, and they really leave the weapon exposed (i.e. it gets dirty fast). My M12s keep my weapons noticeably cleaner. I thought about looking at a safariland 6004 until I was able to talk to a LEO who carried one and I got a mixed review. Looking at it on him I have one word––BULKY! I'm not getting one to try and then not like. So, for now, the M12s have it. I've read about the problems with the SERPA, but in my line of business, there are twice as many documented accounts of the things I use daily. I don't discount any of them (SERPA or anesthesia related), but rare is rare and you have to ask yourself if changing your practice is worth it. And that is up to each individual whose decision I'll respect. 03CRNA, thanks for adding your experience! 
You are correct about the Safariland retention holsters being bulky. The belt-mounted versions (6280, 6360) are slightly less bulky, but still obtrusive. I can;t tell you how many times I've bumped into door jambs when I had mine on my cop belt. The BH duty SERPA isn't much better, either, in this regard. They do well for what they were designed for, but I certainly don't consider either to be field holsters. As far as the SERPA failures, I own five or six, including level 3 duty models for a G22 and M&P40. I've used both of the duty models extensively, and have yet to have a holster break or malfunction. The M&P40 model, in particular, took a running fall (while I was wearing it) onto asphalt and was no worse for wear. It retained my pistol with only the trigger guard lock. (I had previously released the hood.) While I don't think the overall design is superior to the Safariland, the SERPA has never let me down. In any case, I'm happy to have multiple manufacturers producing different designs to choose from. I can remember when the Uncle Mikes Pro-2 and a thumbbreak holster were all we had to choose from.
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Posted: 7/12/2010 3:29:28 AM EST
[#9]
Good discussion on the holsters. I've used Safariland, Serpa, Blade-Tech, G-Code, the old M12 and a few others. My use has been numerous field exercises, South America, Iraq and Afghanistan. The old Bianchi M12 is actually a very well designed holster. The flap does what it's intended to do; yeah, it's not a fast draw rig, but it keeps your sidearm secure and protected. My favorite holster has been the Blade-Tech WRS; I know it has the open top and retention gadget, but it's a great design for quick access and excellent carry. When hunting or in thick brush however, you want you pistol covered and dummy-corded. I still remember inching up my climbing tree stand and about 15 feet up I hear a thump at the base of the tree...my S&W revolver somehow had the thumb snap disengaged and nudged out to fall down. It was embarrasing, but a good lesson learned
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Another thing to consider is keeping your sidearm as high on your body as possible! Avoid the drop leg rigs as they are a PITA when walking/hiking any significant distances and are too low to avoid getting brush, mud and water in them. I like them high on the waist generally. Retention is a good idea. Even if it's a quick detach type, once you get into a boat, heavy vegetation or other tight situation where loss is possible; clip it on! Great discussion on an excellent post! ROCK6 |
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Posted: 7/13/2010 5:30:38 AM EST
[#10]
ARJJ,
It's good to hear your experiences with the SERPA are positive––even though the high impact pavement test probably wasn't for you I have a box full of holsters I've tried that didn't make the cut (I bet most of us do) so, while my SO may not like the choices we have in holsters these days (reference the aforementioned box of holsters) ––I certainly do. Would you recommend trying one of the sarfariland holsters (6280, 6360) on one's first line gear? I'm about the same build as you 5'10" 172lbs, 32 waist. My only difference is that I still thread my first line gear on my spec ops belt. I don't have a "war belt" set up yet. I keep my 1st line minimal, and tend to keep my second line gear handy––or worn. Of course once I'm in the OR it all has to come off––to include the weapon. Geneva conventions and all that. That's one reason I keep my 1st line threaded through my belt, as I can be outside and need everything "full battle rattle" as they like to call it these days, or be with a patient in the OR and have to strip down to a scrub top and (next to) no gear. It can be a real PITA!
Also, how are the OSOE double mag pouches working out; would you recommend them? Rock6, Any recommendations on lanyards? I really didn't use the one they issued us with our M9, but I should rethink that and keep one handy. BH is the only one I've read about. If you've used it; pros / cons? I don't know anything about Blade Tech holsters (more research for me). So, in your experience, I take it you recommend them? ***I hope this isn't too confusing. I've jumped back and forth between my requirements while deployed and what I do at home for a SHTF rig, but like most of us, I try to keep them similar, I hope it makes sense. Any insight is appreciated. ETA: spelling and additional question. |
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Posted: 7/13/2010 10:16:05 AM EST
[#11]
My (unasked-for, but that has never given me pause,
 ) advice on lanyards is mostly common sense, and thus more-or less universal.
Obviously, the lanyard should be long enough for pistol use by either arm. This has as a corollary the correct mounting point, which should be somewhere on the upper right chest. This mounting point will (hopefully) remove the slack from the lanyard, possibly preventing being hung up by a dangling lanyard loop, and allow use by either hand. Avoid mounting too near the pocket where the rifle butt sits, I'm thinking more to the center of the chest than to the side. An example of the worst possible mounting point for a pistol lanyard would be adjacent to the butt of the pistol; the lanyard loop dangles and begs to be caught on something or other, and use by the weak hand is impeded, if not made impossible. If the hook on the lanyard rattles at the point where it attaches to the pistol, some electrical tape, or heat-shrink tubing available at Radio Shack can be applied––and perhaps re-applied if the soft anti-rattle substance wears out. Lastly, consider whether or not the mfr specs a given release/break capacity for your lanyard. Some do, some don't. This is a very personal preference, and I can see points on both sides. If your lanyard––or anything similar ever hangs you up in a critical position/situation, that might be very bad. That being a possibility, one might practice with a EZ and quick to reach with either hand small folder or small straight blade knife, whose only real emergency job is to cut you loose from what is hanging you up. Again, such an emergency knife should be centrally located, and easily accessible with either hand. Upper central chest is the obvious place, perhaps adjacent to the lanyard anchor point. Obviously, this emergency knife should be of such blade length and construction to cut you loose with a minimum of fuss, so some thought should be given to same, and particularly its rapid deployment. I use a Gerber rafting knife with factory kydex sheath for this purpose. As an historical aside, the original USGI WW II parachutists coats had a slim pocket in the (IIRC) upper left lapel into which was inserted a GI switchblade knife. The ostensible purpose of said knife was as an emergency knife to cut the parachutist loose from a failed parachute. I don't know if ir was ever so used, but the concept is not new, and has some utility, IMHO. Again, there are rather general considerations, and as such, are submitted for your consideration. As always. feel free to adopt/modify/discard at your option. |
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Posted: 7/13/2010 3:10:27 PM EST
[#12]
Quoted:
My (unasked-for, but that has never given me pause, ) advice on lanyards is mostly common sense, and thus more-or less universal.
Obviously, the lanyard should be long enough for pistol use by either arm. This has as a corollary the correct mounting point, which should be somewhere on the upper right chest. This mounting point will (hopefully) remove the slack from the lanyard, possibly preventing being hung up by a dangling lanyard loop, and allow use by either hand. Avoid mounting too near the pocket where the rifle butt sits, I'm thinking more to the center of the chest than to the side. An example of the worst possible mounting point for a pistol lanyard would be adjacent to the butt of the pistol; the lanyard loop dangles and begs to be caught on something or other, and use by the weak hand is impeded, if not made impossible. If the hook on the lanyard rattles at the point where it attaches to the pistol, some electrical tape, or heat-shrink tubing available at Radio Shack can be applied––and perhaps re-applied if the soft anti-rattle substance wears out. Lastly, consider whether or not the mfr specs a given release/break capacity for your lanyard. Some do, some don't. This is a very personal preference, and I can see points on both sides. If your lanyard––or anything similar ever hangs you up in a critical position/situation, that might be very bad. That being a possibility, one might practice with a EZ and quick to reach with either hand small folder or small straight blade knife, whose only real emergency job is to cut you loose from what is hanging you up. Again, such an emergency knife should be centrally located, and easily accessible with either hand. Upper central chest is the obvious place, perhaps adjacent to the lanyard anchor point. Obviously, this emergency knife should be of such blade length and construction to cut you loose with a minimum of fuss, so some thought should be given to same, and particularly its rapid deployment. I use a Gerber rafting knife with factory kydex sheath for this purpose. As an historical aside, the original USGI WW II parachutists coats had a slim pocket in the (IIRC) upper left lapel into which was inserted a GI switchblade knife. The ostensible purpose of said knife was as an emergency knife to cut the parachutist loose from a failed parachute. I don't know if ir was ever so used, but the concept is not new, and has some utility, IMHO. Again, there are rather general considerations, and as such, are submitted for your consideration. As always. feel free to adopt/modify/discard at your option. Hey Raf, I've given a full dollars worth of advice when people never wanted my 2 cents! No offense taken. I was also concerned about the very topic you hit upon. I figured I'd research it when I narrowed models down. My opinion is to get one with a break away, as I'd rather not a have cord potentially decide my fate. But as I stated earlier rare is rare, and I doubt there is anything but anecdotal evidence to go by regarding this. If there was one good quality to the old leather chest harness that I was issued for my 1911; it was that it lent itself very well to the central placement of the lanyard. With the molle system you can attach your lanyard almost anywhere you choose––a nice plus.
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Posted: 7/13/2010 5:30:26 PM EST
[#13]
Quoted:
ARJJ, It's good to hear your experiences with the SERPA are positive––even though the high impact pavement test probably wasn't for you I have a box full of holsters I've tried that didn't make the cut (I bet most of us do) so, while my SO may not like the choices we have in holsters these days (reference the aforementioned box of holsters) ––I certainly do. Would you recommend trying one of the sarfariland holsters (6280, 6360) on one's first line gear? I'm about the same build as you 5'10" 172lbs, 32 waist. My only difference is that I still thread my first line gear on my spec ops belt. I don't have a "war belt" set up yet. I keep my 1st line minimal, and tend to keep my second line gear handy––or worn. Of course once I'm in the OR it all has to come off––to include the weapon. Geneva conventions and all that. That's one reason I keep my 1st line threaded through my belt, as I can be outside and need everything "full battle rattle" as they like to call it these days, or be with a patient in the OR and have to strip down to a scrub top and (next to) no gear. It can be a real PITA!
Also, how are the OSOE double mag pouches working out; would you recommend them? Rock6, Any recommendations on lanyards? I really didn't use the one they issued us with our M9, but I should rethink that and keep one handy. BH is the only one I've read about. If you've used it; pros / cons? I don't know anything about Blade Tech holsters (more research for me). So, in your experience, I take it you recommend them? ***I hope this isn't too confusing. I've jumped back and forth between my requirements while deployed and what I do at home for a SHTF rig, but like most of us, I try to keep them similar, I hope it makes sense. Any insight is appreciated. ETA: spelling and additional question. 03CRNA, are you asking about the Safariland for your personal SHTF gear, or your deployment gear? For SHTF use, it's a solid choice. Not a whole lot of protection from crud getting in the gun, but it's virtually bombproof in construction and operation. For deployment use, I'm assuming you're some type of non-frontline medical personnel? If so, the Safariland is certainly satisfactory, but the additional retention might be overkill. For either use (SHTF or military) the belt mounted versions will work fine, provided your belt is 2" or 2.25" wide. A narrower belt will allow a good bit of up and down movement during the draw. I'd also recommend you get the 6285 or 6365 models as they come standard with a 1.5" drop belt loop to help clear any body armor you may be wearing (or a chest rig). As for the OSOE mag pouches, so far I really like them. They hold two PMags just fine, and the pouches keep both PMags and USGI mags secure and rattle-free. The ony thing I;d like changed is the Fastex buckles––I'd prefer the female end to be on the bottom, versus the top flap, as the female end gives more finger purchase when you release it. I still haven;t had much opportunity to wear all this stuff around, so I'll report back when I've had such an opportunity. Raf gave a much better introduction to lanyards than I ever could, so I'll defer to him (and others who've used them).
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Posted: 7/14/2010 4:52:13 AM EST
[#14]
Thanks for the insight ARJJ
Right now, I'd try the Safariland holster on my SHTF rig and if it works out, I may take it on my next deployment, but I'd still keep the M12 close. I have a good riggers belt that is wide enough to keep the safariland holsters from moving around while drawing. I'll have to look into one of these closer. The extra retention (in a deployed situation) might be a good thing too as you never know when locals, TCNs, (third country nationals), or EPWs may roll in door as we don't turn anyone away. And, in some of those instances we are to stay armed. My job here and in uniform is anesthesia, the job stays the same only the conditions change. While my unit is able to be deployed as far forward as possible, they're not being used that way, except maybe in a few places in Afghanistan. When I was in Iraq everything from tents, to reconfigured Iraqi buildings, to double-wide modular structures were used for ORs (operating rooms). The changing conditions are one reason I'm spending more time on keeping my gear as modular as possible. |
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Posted: 7/14/2010 9:49:23 AM EST
[#15]
Something I did with my nalgene bottles that I think you guys may like is wrap them with duck tape. I choose bright orange suitable for a survival situation as opposed to SHTF, but you can pick any color you think suits your needs. I also highly recommend the folding cups for the bottoms of the bottles. they are a little pricey but worth it. they take up no extra room and weigh very little. again, they are more of a survival item then SHTF item, but the two go hand in hand.
And great job on the rig OP. very well though out. |
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Posted: 7/14/2010 10:17:30 AM EST
[#16]
I modded Naglenes, with duct tape and para cord and also use the MSR folding handle cup. The black tape is a little hard to see, the pic is a tad dark.
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Posted: 7/14/2010 10:58:13 AM EST
[#17]
Tag
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Posted: 7/14/2010 11:46:47 AM EST
[#18]
Quoted:
I modded Naglenes, with duct tape and para cord and also use the MSR folding handle cup. The black tape is a little hard to see, the pic is a tad dark. http://members.cox.net/mfs1589/EEE.JPG MFS, could you provide a short tutorial on how to mod the Nalgene with the 550 cord? Thanks!
Also, the cup and duct tape are great ideas, guys! Feel free to add your own ideas, tips, comments, etc., and let's keep the discussion going.
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Posted: 7/14/2010 11:52:02 AM EST
[#19]
Quoted:
Thanks for the insight ARJJ Right now, I'd try the Safariland holster on my SHTF rig and if it works out, I may take it on my next deployment, but I'd still keep the M12 close. I have a good riggers belt that is wide enough to keep the safariland holsters from moving around while drawing. I'll have to look into one of these closer. The extra retention (in a deployed situation) might be a good thing too as you never know when locals, TCNs, (third country nationals), or EPWs may roll in door as we don't turn anyone away. And, in some of those instances we are to stay armed. My job here and in uniform is anesthesia, the job stays the same only the conditions change. While my unit is able to be deployed as far forward as possible, they're not being used that way, except maybe in a few places in Afghanistan. When I was in Iraq everything from tents, to reconfigured Iraqi buildings, to double-wide modular structures were used for ORs (operating rooms). The changing conditions are one reason I'm spending more time on keeping my gear as modular as possible. Thanks for filling me in on your job. I think you'll be well-served with the Safariland. I started out with a 6365 (Level 3+) and then went to a 6280 (Level 2), as I didn't care for the thumb release ALS on the 6365. The particular 6280 I had caused my G22 to bind on the draw, and no amount of silicone spray would cure it. That's when I went to the SERPA. I think my problem may have been an isolated case, though, and the VAST majority of Safariland users swear by them. With the Safariland holsters, too, you have a variety of retention options for a given holster. You can add the Sentry Switch to either model, and it can be activated as needed for additional security. I rarely used mine on the 6365, though, as the combination of SLS hood/ALS?hood guard makes for a VERY grab-resistant holster. |
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Posted: 7/14/2010 12:30:14 PM EST
[#20]
Quoted:
Quoted:
I modded Naglenes, with duct tape and para cord and also use the MSR folding handle cup. The black tape is a little hard to see, the pic is a tad dark. http://members.cox.net/mfs1589/EEE.JPG MFS, could you provide a short tutorial on how to mod the Nalgene with the 550 cord? Thanks!
Also, the cup and duct tape are great ideas, guys! Feel free to add your own ideas, tips, comments, etc., and let's keep the discussion going. 3 methods I have used... #1 using a small punch heated with a lighter I melt two holes on the cap strap, one near the top, one near the base. I tie a knot at the bottom run the cord up the outside of the cap strap into the hole I made at the top. This adds a little more cord to the process. I then wrap the cord around the cap strap from the top down tying it off when it meets the knot I tied at the bottom. You could get fancy and braid or weave the cord to get more but that is up to you. #2 Basically the same as above but I loop the para cord around the neck of the bottle first then loop through the two melted holes and wrap down the strap. #3 to shave a few .oz if you are an ultralight kidda dude. Replace the cap strap all together with braided para cord looped around the cap and bottle neck. I started doing this for two reasons. I dropped a bottle on a rock at the perfect angle to cut the cap strap off the lid so to prevent lid loss I tied the strap together. And more cordage is always good just as tape is always good. You could get a couple feet of cord depending on how crazy you get with the braiding. But there is enough for a bootlace, or to lower the bottle to a water source or to gut the cord for the inner strands for fish lines. |
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Posted: 7/31/2010 5:06:14 AM EST
[#21]
To the OP, a quick question.
What made you decide to place your survival/E&E pouch at your back on your belt set up? I am not criticizing in the slightest but rather, I am considering this for my own purposes. I currently have one on my own belt but it is positioned toward the front for access, though I will be the first to admit that seeing your setup does make me take the time to think that most of what is in there would not be needed until I could stop and take the belt off long enough to get into the pouch. If your reasoning is just that simple, that you would be stopping to take the time to use the contents, great, but if there is some additional rationale please enlighten me as I am seriously contemplating going this route now and repositioning my E&E pouch. Thanks. |
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Posted: 7/31/2010 6:15:39 PM EST
[#22]
Quoted:
To the OP, a quick question. What made you decide to place your survival/E&E pouch at your back on your belt set up? I am not criticizing in the slightest but rather, I am considering this for my own purposes. I currently have one on my own belt but it is positioned toward the front for access, though I will be the first to admit that seeing your setup does make me take the time to think that most of what is in there would not be needed until I could stop and take the belt off long enough to get into the pouch. If your reasoning is just that simple, that you would be stopping to take the time to use the contents, great, but if there is some additional rationale please enlighten me as I am seriously contemplating going this route now and repositioning my E&E pouch. Thanks. Quite frankly? Because I had the room there. I am also accustomed to carrying it in a butt pack (during the ALICE era), so stowing it there was a familiar feeling. If I was honestly using this gear in a true SHTF/TEOTWAKI scenario, I'd likely remove the E&E pouch from the belt and place it in a pants cargo pocket. That's really where it needs to go––on your person at all times––and it would make it easier to wear a pack waist belt. As it sits now, it's out of the way when not needed, and it's low-pro enough that it doesn't interfere with my pack's belt too much. |
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Posted: 7/31/2010 6:26:04 PM EST
[#23]
Quoted:
Quite frankly? Because I had the room there. I am also accustomed to carrying it in a butt pack (during the ALICE era), so stowing it there was a familiar feeling. If I was honestly using this gear in a true SHTF/TEOTWAKI scenario, I'd likely remove the E&E pouch from the belt and place it in a pants cargo pocket. That's really where it needs to go––on your person at all times––and it would make it easier to wear a pack waist belt. As it sits now, it's out of the way when not needed, and it's low-pro enough that it doesn't interfere with my pack's belt too much. I appreciate the information. You do make a good point about stowing it in a cargo pocket in the event of real, no BS SHTF use so that it is absolutely always on you. Thanks for the well thought out post, I am definitely taking what I can from it and really evaluating just how I have everything set up. |
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Posted: 5/27/2011 11:00:55 AM EST
[#24]
Although I haven't purchased much of the gear posted in this thread I am in the midst of at least updating my gear over time, I found this thread very informative and wanted to give it a bump so others may enjoy.
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Posted: 5/27/2011 9:32:58 PM EST
[#25]
I ordered a few things for my MAV today. Consider this a tag.
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Posted: 5/29/2011 4:02:34 PM EST
[#26]
Thanks to you guys. I did not want to "bump" it myself and be pretentious.
I hope you find some of the info presented to be useful. |
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Posted: 5/30/2011 6:29:47 PM EST
[#27]
Quoted:
Thanks to you guys. I did not want to "bump" it myself and be pretentious.
I hope you find some of the info presented to be useful. I keep coming back to this thread, some cool gear in it. OP, Some good ideas, hopefully you wont have to use it.... |
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Posted: 6/1/2011 7:53:12 PM EST
[#28]
Quoted: Thanks for the insight ARJJ Right now, I'd try the Safariland holster on my SHTF rig and if it works out, I may take it on my next deployment, but I'd still keep the M12 close. I have a good riggers belt that is wide enough to keep the safariland holsters from moving around while drawing. I'll have to look into one of these closer. The extra retention (in a deployed situation) might be a good thing too as you never know when locals, TCNs, (third country nationals), or EPWs may roll in door as we don't turn anyone away. And, in some of those instances we are to stay armed. My job here and in uniform is anesthesia, the job stays the same only the conditions change. While my unit is able to be deployed as far forward as possible, they're not being used that way, except maybe in a few places in Afghanistan. When I was in Iraq everything from tents, to reconfigured Iraqi buildings, to double-wide modular structures were used for ORs (operating rooms). The changing conditions are one reason I'm spending more time on keeping my gear as modular as possible. Dude, awesomely important work...my father in law was an anesthesiologist at An Khe and Cu Chi in 1969-1970....  As far as SHTF gear, what are you anticipating? Are you going to be patrollign a neighborhood after a Latrina like event, zombies/Chinese hordes, MZB's, or what? As my friend raf points out, in cold weather (and we had a hell of a snowy cold winter all over the US of A) open top mag pouches will fill with snow. Try going prone in a chest rig- not always fun to do....or manipulate buckles with gloves on to get a fresh magazine...... A guy who's good with his low speed gear will beat a guy with gucci kit who doesn't train with it...train with your gear! Even if it's mag changes while watching TV. Standing, kneeling, prone, weak hand/strong hand...
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Posted: 6/3/2011 7:05:38 PM EST
[#29]
Quoted:
Quoted:
Thanks for the insight ARJJ Right now, I'd try the Safariland holster on my SHTF rig and if it works out, I may take it on my next deployment, but I'd still keep the M12 close. I have a good riggers belt that is wide enough to keep the safariland holsters from moving around while drawing. I'll have to look into one of these closer. The extra retention (in a deployed situation) might be a good thing too as you never know when locals, TCNs, (third country nationals), or EPWs may roll in door as we don't turn anyone away. And, in some of those instances we are to stay armed. My job here and in uniform is anesthesia, the job stays the same only the conditions change. While my unit is able to be deployed as far forward as possible, they're not being used that way, except maybe in a few places in Afghanistan. When I was in Iraq everything from tents, to reconfigured Iraqi buildings, to double-wide modular structures were used for ORs (operating rooms). The changing conditions are one reason I'm spending more time on keeping my gear as modular as possible. Dude, awesomely important work...my father in law was an anesthesiologist at An Khe and Cu Chi in 1969-1970.... As far as SHTF gear, what are you anticipating? Are you going to be patrollign a neighborhood after a Latrina like event, zombies/Chinese hordes, MZB's, or what? As my friend raf points out, in cold weather (and we had a hell of a snowy cold winter all over the US of A) open top mag pouches will fill with snow. Try going prone in a chest rig- not always fun to do....or manipulate buckles with gloves on to get a fresh magazine...... A guy who's good with his low speed gear will beat a guy with gucci kit who doesn't train with it...train with your gear! Even if it's mag changes while watching TV. Standing, kneeling, prone, weak hand/strong hand... TimJ, thanks for that insight! You are correct on all counts. I'll be the first to admit, I don't get to train with my gear like I'd prefer. I also play many roles: plainclothes cop, uniformed cop, weekend 3-gun/SHTF warrior. Each role requires a different wardrobe, gear, weapons, etc. The best I can do is try to keep basic movements and systems similar between each individual equipment set. I.e., I carry some type of Blackhawk SERPA holster regardless of what belt I wear. I try to keep similar equipment in similar locations, etc. On your other point about training versus equipment: I couldn't agree more. All the Gucci in the world isn't going to help you without training and familiarity with it. I'll take a grizzled old vet with a simple pistol belt any day over a young buck with a bunch of shiny kit any day––the former likely knows what he's working with. 
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Posted: 6/4/2011 12:37:43 PM EST
[#30]
Quoted: Just some musings, but perhaps some of you all might provide some illumination on the subject. First, let's do some review. 1/Line gear: Items that never leave your person, unless for extremely brief intervals, and not many of them. This includes, but is not limited to hydration, personal defense, immediate first-aid, navigation, and small amount of food. 2/Line gear: This also augments the above, but the main purpose is fighting. Included, but not limited to mags/carriers, immediate need weapons tools/cleaning kit. 3/Line gear: Everything else needed to survive/accomplish mission. Obviously, there can be overlap between the lines, and some reasonable measures can be made to accomplish one's goals/mission. Here's the problem; We have 3 lines of gear, but only so much room on the body to fit all this stuff. The point is that the user, either out of necessity or for personal conveniance, can shed the layers without adverse effect on the layers still retained/worn. IOW, dumping the backpack should have no negative short-term effects as long as the user still retains his L1/L2 gear. If the user will never, ever have to wear a backpack with a waistbelt––and this precludes all but the most modest-sized backpacks–– then the user can wear a vest rig above (L2) the (misnamed) "Battle Belt" which is really an L1 carrier. The wearing of any decent, modern packpack (L3) necessarily requires room on the user's hips for the hip-belt. This is OK, if the user wears a vest that has enough real estate to accomodate both line L1/L2 items. This approach would seem to require an extended pistol adapter which was thin enough to be worn beneath the backpack waistbelt, but was still attached to the bottom edge of the L1/L2 vest, which was raised sufficiently to clear the pack waist belt. In short, you can wear a chest rig, rigged high to accomodate waistbelt of L3 backpack (in which case your chest rig should include L1 items), OR you can wear chest rig rigged high to accomodate L1 waistbelt. Can't do both. And there's the problem. Note that I exclude leg-mounted platforms. In my experience, these are problematic for a number of reasons. For one, any weight attached to one's legs will slow one down in running, as the weight has to be not only carried, but moved back and forth in a reciprocating motion. Very inefficient, and tiring. Some other issues include snagging, and construction issues that interfere with L3 gear, such as improperly-placed buckles/inadequate length of extension so as to clear L3 belt. Small, lightweight leg platforms have their uses, but any significant weight/bulk should be avoided, IMHO. With all the above said, and with a nod to those users whose needs differ, my thinking at this point, is along the following lines, based on what I possess currently: Line 3: Either MOLLE II (updated) backpack, CFP-90 (updated), or Large ALICE Hellcat. (updated). All of these packs would be capable of carrying a smallish clip-on parasite pack that would be quickly detached, and bridge the gap between L2/L3 for 2-3 days. Line 2/1: Molle II vest or ILBE Medic's vest. This would have enough real-estate to carry fighting/existence load, especially when augmented by parasite pack from main pack. Side note: Not a disparagement on other's approaches. Under certain circumstances, my "take' on things can/would be all wrong, and other's "take" be much better. This post is made in an attempt to provoke discussion on how the 3 Lines of gear interface with each other, and how best to achieve our goals. Last word: As a Long-time collector of milsurp, I have ensembles dating from SpanAm war to present, and have been a RevWar-CivWar re-enactor as well as an occasional camper. I've used most of this stuff, but not in combat. In addition, I could probably outfit a rifle Team with most equipment, aside from weapons. FWIW, I've got so much milsurp gear that my problem is NOT having equipment, but deciding on what to choose. No brag, just fact. OTOH, doesn't make me a guru, just a long-term collector with a tactical, utilitarian bent . Your constructive criticism is most welcome I think another option would be to incorprate your L1 gear onto the hip belt of your L3 pack. Lets say you took a Omni belt for your First line gear, and use a Kifaru Marauder pack. This could give you the ability to separate your first line gear from your third line gear. The only down sides I see are cost, and lose of real estate on your "war belt".   |
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Posted: 6/5/2011 5:42:35 AM EST
[#31]
Quoted:
I think another option would be to incorprate your L1 gear onto the hip belt of your L3 pack. Lets say you took a Omni belt for your First line gear, and use a Kifaru Marauder pack. This could give you the ability to separate your first line gear from your third line gear. The only down sides I see are cost, and lose of real estate on your "war belt". How quickly can the pack be removed from the pack? |
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Posted: 6/5/2011 7:41:25 AM EST
[#32]
ARJJ, I can see where you would want similar setups.....use one on the job and have what you need where you are used to for everything else! makes sense to me!
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Posted: 6/5/2011 11:56:08 AM EST
[#33]
Quoted: Quoted: I think another option would be to incorprate your L1 gear onto the hip belt of your L3 pack. Lets say you took a Omni belt for your First line gear, and use a Kifaru Marauder pack. This could give you the ability to separate your first line gear from your third line gear. The only down sides I see are cost, and lose of real estate on your "war belt". How quickly can the pack be removed from the pack? I would say once you packs on the ground it would take no more than 1 to 2 minutes to separate the two. Now putting them back together would require some more time as you have to thread the webbing back threw the buckles. I am going to play with this Idea some more and let you know what I find. |
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Posted: 6/5/2011 2:22:40 PM EST
[#34]
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
I think another option would be to incorprate your L1 gear onto the hip belt of your L3 pack. Lets say you took a Omni belt for your First line gear, and use a Kifaru Marauder pack. This could give you the ability to separate your first line gear from your third line gear. The only down sides I see are cost, and lose of real estate on your "war belt". How quickly can the pack be removed from the pack? I would say once you packs on the ground it would take no more than 1 to 2 minutes to separate the two. Now putting them back together would require some more time as you have to thread the webbing back threw the buckles. I am going to play with this Idea some more and let you know what I find. The Army tried a similar arraangement with the original MOLLE I, but that particular set-up was poorly received. Nice idea, mebbe not so good execution. The best, or should I say least bad, way of attaching belt to pack is with a short, flat, aluminum piece, mebbe 4"L x 1"W x 1/8"T that acts as coupler between webbing on pack, and webbing on belt. Aluminum coupler is tethered length of cord to pack, and once seated home into the webbing and blind pocket, a snapped flap prevents it from accidentally being dislodged. Seen this on a back made by Lowe, who made various iterations of this sort of coupling some years ago with mountaineering-style packs whose waistbelt also doubled as a rapelling harness. |
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Posted: 6/8/2011 7:01:40 AM EST
[#35]
ARJJ,
I am working on a new page for the website- basically examples of ways to arrange gear. Would you mind if I included yours? Specifically the one on your FB with the magazine dropping (that is a BA pic) and probably one of the set laid out. |
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Posted: 6/8/2011 2:06:10 PM EST
[#36]
Quoted:
ARJJ, I am working on a new page for the website- basically examples of ways to arrange gear. Would you mind if I included yours? Specifically the one on your FB with the magazine dropping (that is a BA pic) and probably one of the set laid out. Currahee, IM sent––no problem. One question: What is "BA" 
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Posted: 6/8/2011 2:14:06 PM EST
[#37]
Quoted:
Quoted:
ARJJ, I am working on a new page for the website- basically examples of ways to arrange gear. Would you mind if I included yours? Specifically the one on your FB with the magazine dropping (that is a BA pic) and probably one of the set laid out. Currahee, IM sent––no problem. One question: What is "BA" Bad Ass |
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Posted: 6/9/2011 1:00:43 PM EST
[#38]
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
ARJJ, I am working on a new page for the website- basically examples of ways to arrange gear. Would you mind if I included yours? Specifically the one on your FB with the magazine dropping (that is a BA pic) and probably one of the set laid out. Currahee, IM sent––no problem. One question: What is "BA" Bad Ass LOL...I thought so.
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Posted: 6/9/2011 5:16:46 PM EST
[#39]
Quoted:
Quoted:
Thanks for the insight ARJJ Right now, I'd try the Safariland holster on my SHTF rig and if it works out, I may take it on my next deployment, but I'd still keep the M12 close. I have a good riggers belt that is wide enough to keep the safariland holsters from moving around while drawing. I'll have to look into one of these closer. The extra retention (in a deployed situation) might be a good thing too as you never know when locals, TCNs, (third country nationals), or EPWs may roll in door as we don't turn anyone away. And, in some of those instances we are to stay armed. My job here and in uniform is anesthesia, the job stays the same only the conditions change. While my unit is able to be deployed as far forward as possible, they're not being used that way, except maybe in a few places in Afghanistan. When I was in Iraq everything from tents, to reconfigured Iraqi buildings, to double-wide modular structures were used for ORs (operating rooms). The changing conditions are one reason I'm spending more time on keeping my gear as modular as possible. Dude, awesomely important work...my father in law was an anesthesiologist at An Khe and Cu Chi in 1969-1970.... As far as SHTF gear, what are you anticipating? Are you going to be patrollign a neighborhood after a Latrina like event, zombies/Chinese hordes, MZB's, or what? As my friend raf points out, in cold weather (and we had a hell of a snowy cold winter all over the US of A) open top mag pouches will fill with snow. Try going prone in a chest rig- not always fun to do....or manipulate buckles with gloves on to get a fresh magazine...... A guy who's good with his low speed gear will beat a guy with gucci kit who doesn't train with it...train with your gear! Even if it's mag changes while watching TV. Standing, kneeling, prone, weak hand/strong hand... Thanks! I'll be he has some good stories too. The BEST patient population to take care of is the U.S. Military. My Daughter's boyfriend is SF and my son will soon be USAF. I'd hope someone is just as willing to look after them as I was of the young men and women when they came into the CSH in Iraq.
What do I anticipate in a SHTF situation? Whatever I anticipate is probably wrong. Running gunfights is NOT on my list however. Working my a$$ off, be it at the family farm, at my place, or cleaning up the community is the more likely situation (Longer term SHTF situation will surely mean more manual labor). My chest rig allows me to do manual labor, operate equipment, etc. while having gear on me in a useable manner. I found out the hard way how NOT to go prone with it (just a matter of getting the straps right). I've run a few tactical rifle matches with it and found out it works well with my bolt gun. I also used it at the Larry Vickers pistol/carbine course I attended this spring and felt good about the fact I didn't really need to change it afterwards. I've worn it while cutting and splitting all the wood I burned this past winter. I agree with the closed top pouches, although I must say I've never ran open topped ones, so I have no comparison. One of my favorite workouts is 200m hill sprints. I wear this while I run, then shoot five shots prone from my bolt gun to practice my rapid fire. (kind of a different subject––the shooting––but its practice for some local competition) so I know it fits and doesn't rub. Could I practice more? Oh yeah, the best part of the Vicker's course was to be able to bring a more focused training plan back home with me.
It's because of this thread my setup is like it is. It still took a year to refine it to the point where I like it. One of these days I'll get serious and post pics, but my only camera is on my iPhone  and the quality is well. . .
Oh as far as the safariland goes, I never did get one. I still have the M12 as my .mil setup. Not sure if I'll change it at this point for my next trip overseas or not. |
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Posted: 6/10/2011 4:42:55 PM EST
[#40]
Army03CRNA, thanks for detailing your training exploits and how it has affected your gear. Please feel free to post pics of your rig, even if they're cell pics! (That offer goes for anyone else, too.)
Off topic, but on the subject of training...here's some thoughts I've been having recently: "Training" doesn't necessarily have to be a high-speed, tier one course run by an ex-SOCOM operator (LOL). Training can take many different forms, and IMHO you need to diversify your training portfolio. You don't necessarily have to go through a course to develop a regular dry-fire regimen; nor do you need an instructor to begin and maintain a fitness program. You don't necessarily have to pay a ton of money for training, either: I get a shit-ton of professional training free, from nationally-recognized trainers, by being a reserve deputy. I also get instructor opportunites through my agency. Now, getting into LE may not be your thing, and that's fine, but it doesn't hurt to network with the local LE "gun-guys." (Tin-foil types, take a hike LOL.) An Appleseed shoot only costs $70 or $80––for LE, miitary, and several other groups it's free! And folks, an Appleseed shoot or two will drastically improve your rifle marksmanship. Check into your local ranges, too. One that's local to me offers monthly pistol and 3-gun matches, and the latter seems to be geared more toward "real-world" gunfighting than shooting games IMO. There can be a wealth of experience among these shooters, too, who can critique and coach you for free. There may also be a few like-minded fellows who get together away from the range for more survival or SHTF-related activities. Onto training frequency: I'm sure most of us would all love to train 40 hours a week, every week, for the next gunfight or SHTF event. You know, SWAT/SOCOM-style. Unfortunately, most of us simply can't devote that kind of time (or money). I have found that by practicing the basics on a regular basis, I tend to stay fresh and the little stuff falls into place. Even if it's only 3 times a year, don your gear, get out, and use it. Build muscle memory––if you're used to doing only one thing, you'll do it, even if you haven't practiced it 300,000 times. You may not be as smooth or fast as a more practiced individual, but you'll get it done. A little rambling, but I just wanted to stick that out there.
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Posted: 6/10/2011 5:18:19 PM EST
[#41]
I'll second arjj on the Appleseed Shoot- get thee to one, my friends, they are great!
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Posted: 6/10/2011 5:46:25 PM EST
[#42]
Quoted:
I'll second arjj on the Appleseed Shoot- get thee to one, my friends, they are great! Dude, I haven't used a bench (or a rest) since I shot Rifleman. I now consider it a handicap LOL––I use prone/slung to sight in.
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Posted: 7/22/2011 8:26:08 AM EST
[#43]
This thread needs to be bumped
Page with examples of 1st and 2nd line gear Examples of 3rd line gear My current chest rig set up  Exploded view  Left to Right- MORA Knife, Pressure Dressing, HT , Bottle of MP7, 3 mags and a CAT I recently got the radio so I lost a magazine and also added some trauma stuff. Before all I had was a BOK on my belt, but I figure I'm just as likely to run this with my CCW rig which has no trauma stuff. I can double up on ammo in those pouches if needed. |
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Posted: 7/22/2011 6:45:30 PM EST
[#44]
Thanks Currahee. I like the new setup, but I have a question...why the fixed blade on the chest rig? I'm more curious than anything, BTW.
Also, I saw one of our fellow 3-gunner's DBT chest rig on FB earlier. I'd love to see some pics and a description of it cross-posted here if you can do it (and with his permission). It's a very nice setup...I'm thinking about a similar setup for active shooter stuff. |
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Posted: 7/22/2011 6:54:09 PM EST
[#45]
Quoted:
Thanks Currahee. I like the new setup, but I have a question...why the fixed blade on the chest rig? I'm more curious than anything, BTW. Also, I saw one of our fellow 3-gunner's DBT chest rig on FB earlier. I'd love to see some pics and a description of it cross-posted here if you can do it (and with his permission). It's a very nice setup...I'm thinking about a similar setup for active shooter stuff. I figure one knife per "line" 1st line has a multi-tool, 2nd is this and 3rd is a short machete. I have tried a fixed blade in a couple of places, and this is where I like it. |
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Posted: 7/27/2011 1:58:06 PM EST
[#46]
Here is my chest rig and I am a friend of Currahee. I have a Diamondback tactical Low Profile Chest Rig. From left to righ in the pocketst, LED flashlight, gun cleaning gear, 2-cliff bars a survival tin and misc gear, some BOK stuff, 2 Glock 22 Mags. Up top I have 4 mags and my HX370S 2 Meter radio and mic. I really like this setup because it is very light. I dont need 15 mags, 2 pistols, a shotgun in a molle scabard on my back, a gas mask, MOPP suit and a rifle to carry around. This is MY ideal 2nd line setup.
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Posted: 7/27/2011 6:50:35 PM EST
[#47]
Lots of good info here.
Here's my SHTF OSOE Micro rig. I tried a lot of big heavy chest rigs loaded to capacity and they just drove me nuts. I used this recently on a simulated overnighter and it worked out great. 
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Posted: 7/27/2011 7:00:58 PM EST
[#48]
I like your rig.
I go alot more dedicated. The 3 ar shingle, 2 pistol Mags, knife ,Multi tool, and gloves. The shingle is mounted on armor or alone on straps. Pack has everything else. More mags-to-IFAK- toilet paper. |
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Posted: 7/28/2011 7:58:33 AM EST
[#49]
Quoted:
Something I did with my nalgene bottles that I think you guys may like is wrap them with duck tape. I choose bright orange suitable for a survival situation as opposed to SHTF, but you can pick any color you think suits your needs. I also highly recommend the folding cups for the bottoms of the bottles. they are a little pricey but worth it. they take up no extra room and weigh very little. again, they are more of a survival item then SHTF item, but the two go hand in hand. http://img441.imageshack.us/img441/816/nalgenewtap.jpg And great job on the rig OP. very well though out. Where are you guys getting your cups that fit the bottles? |
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Posted: 7/28/2011 8:32:28 AM EST
[#50]
Quoted:
Quoted:
Something I did with my nalgene bottles that I think you guys may like is wrap them with duck tape. I choose bright orange suitable for a survival situation as opposed to SHTF, but you can pick any color you think suits your needs. I also highly recommend the folding cups for the bottoms of the bottles. they are a little pricey but worth it. they take up no extra room and weigh very little. again, they are more of a survival item then SHTF item, but the two go hand in hand. http://img441.imageshack.us/img441/816/nalgenewtap.jpg And great job on the rig OP. very well though out. Where are you guys getting your cups that fit the bottles? Big camping stores have them. I think I got mine from Bas-Pro. Shouldn't be hard to find online at all. |
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