AR Sponsor
Who here is using a FRT with a 22LR. What is your setup? (Page 8 of 11)
|
Originally Posted By jsha22lr: Got mine running. 12" complete borebuddy upper RXD22ti Can Better mag adapter AS designs super safety- shimmed the lever with a piece of stock from a coke can ALG hammer w/purple spring https://youtube.com/shorts/uEwRVvkjfus?si=VuCYJx7a-G0xqYZ2 when you "shimmed" the lever...did you shim the front or the back side of it? ( or does it even matter ) |
Member
Joined:
Jul 2025
Posts:
591
EE: 100% (73)
TN, USA
|
Originally Posted By shultz (in a different thread): The stiffer spring will keep the lever held in position more firmly, not sure if the older spring was causing issues or not. I never had any using the old spring. The new spring is not only thicker wire ie stiffer, it also has larger gaps between coils making it longer plus fully closed ends. It's a better made spring for sure. One potential problem I see is the old spring was at or nearly at solid height in FRT mode, the new spring more so. This is not good for spring longevity. Then again, the new spring being heavier wire should handle this better and even when it does weaken it will still likely be stronger than the old spring when new making service life a wash or in favor of the new spring. Another thing I noticed, the new spring makes overriding the lever with too much trigger finger pressure a bit more difficult. In my set ups the lever would easily fly forward releasing the hammer once it hit the midpoint of travel with a little too much trigger finger pressure using the old lever spring. The new spring and increase in lever drag requires a bit more trigger finger pressure and the lever has to be closer to the hammer for this early release to happen. This is a good thing for overall timing. If you're using the MARC for 22lr, you will probably have to retune anti bounce weight and maybe recoil spring rate if you install the new lever spring, I'm not! The lever has what feels like 50% more drag/friction in FRT mode using the new spring vs old. This increase in lever drag will almost certainly have an impact on 22lr function. Unlikely you would even notice this drag shooting centerfire much less any function impact. So here's a potential head-scratcher: I replaced my Atrius with a MARC (new, stiffer springs) for use with my Rave 140 and increased the recoil spring weight from 3 lbs (blue) to 4lbs (yellow). I had already been having pretty good luck with a steel carrier with two large steel weights, one small steel weight, and one small tungsten carbide weight, so that remained unchanged since my last test. While, totally subjective, I feel like the thing ran better than with the Atrius. I was able to get through a 50 rd drum of Aguila 38 gr 1B220335 that I had previously really struggled with. I was also able to get through 50 rd drums of Federal 38 gr AE22 and Federal 40 gr AM22, both of which gave me fits in the past. I was even able to get through a 50 rd drum of CCI 40 gr subsonic segmented HP 0074s, which really surprised me, since I had suffered stoppages with my yellow recoil spring in the past (but with less weight). I don't know whether this change is because of the spring change, the MARC, additional break-in, the weather, planetary alignment, or the gods @#$%ing with me, but I'm pretty confident that the MARC is at least as good as the Atrius with the Rave 140 (at least in my setup). For fun, I switched to a different lower with an ARC-FIRE and a mil-spec, SS-cut FCG with very light hammer and trigger springs, but that presented all-too-familiar stoppages with the AM22. That that might have been a dirt/tuning issue, though. |
|
Originally Posted By lugnutwrench2: So here's a potential head-scratcher: I replaced my Atrius with a MARC (new, stiffer springs) for use with my Rave 140 and increased the recoil spring weight from 3 lbs (blue) to 4lbs (yellow). I had already been having pretty good luck with a steel carrier with two large steel weights, one small steel weight, and one small tungsten carbide weight, so that remained unchanged since my last test. While, totally subjective, I feel like the thing ran better than with the Atrius. I was able to get through a 50 rd drum of Aguila 38 gr 1B220335 that I had previously really struggled with. I was also able to get through 50 rd drums of Federal 38 gr AE22 and Federal 40 gr AM22, both of which gave me fits in the past. I was even able to get through a 50 rd drum of CCI 40 gr subsonic segmented HP 0074s, which really surprised me, since I had suffered stoppages with my yellow recoil spring in the past (but with less weight). I don't know whether this change is because of the spring change, the MARC, additional break-in, the weather, planetary alignment, or the gods @#$%ing with me, but I'm pretty confident that the MARC is at least as good as the Atrius with the Rave 140 (at least in my setup). For fun, I switched to a different lower with an ARC-FIRE and a mil-spec, SS-cut FCG with very light hammer and trigger springs, but that presented all-too-familiar stoppages with the AM22. That that might have been a dirt/tuning issue, though.  I had mine turn into a huge steaming pile of poo today! Failure to feed the first rd out of a fresh mag, not just every now and then but nearly every mag change and, some failures during the mag with the bolt held open with the case rim hung on the extractor as it tried to feed. I've never had this issue before today. Lots and LOTS of stove pipes/failure to eject as well. Went back to the house and gave it a good cleaning/once over. It was a little dirty but not horrible. Nothing looked wrong, the extractor LOOKED fine and SEEMED to be working fine. Went back out, no change, back to the house. This time I did another tear down including pulling the extractor. I immediately noticed the BB Red extractor spring looked off, not bad but something didn't look right. Pulled out my spare springs, yep that spring was nearly 3mm shorter than new. New BB red and standard springs are 8mm, bad spring was a tad over 5mm. Installed a new BB red spring, went back out and dumped 6 mags without issue! I have no clue how many rds were on this extractor spring...many K for sure. Left to right. New BB red, BAD BB red, New BB standard spring. Attached File I'm still puzzled how the bad spring was causing the feed issue, maybe it was binding the extractor some how? Sure didnt feel like it when I checked it during cleaning! the extractor felt like it had enough spring tension as well, it didn't feel off to me at all 
|
|
Originally Posted By Jeeps-And-Guns: Glad to see you got yours running. My upper is currently in route to bore buddy for inspection and testing by them. So hopefully they find a issue and can fix it. Any word from BB on your upper? I hope they can find the problem. |
 11” Model1Sales 22LR Barrel PSA 22LR BCG w/ Model1Sales Barrel Collar CMMG Trigger Assembly Hoffman Tactical Super Safety (Shimmed with Coke can), Rounded Detent (Clipped several coils from detent sping) and Cut Trigger from Super Safety Shop Bore Buddy Super Safety Kit (Steel weight carrier with all steel weights, adjustable super safety trip kit) Kriss 25 Round Magazines with CCI Mini Mags |
|
Originally Posted By jsha22lr: Got mine running. 12" complete borebuddy upper RXD22ti Can Better mag adapter AS designs super safety- shimmed the lever with a piece of stock from a coke can ALG hammer w/purple spring https://youtube.com/shorts/uEwRVvkjfus?si=VuCYJx7a-G0xqYZ2 Where did you place the shim? |
Member
Joined:
Jul 2025
Posts:
600
EE: 100% (73)
TN, USA
Member
Joined:
Jul 2025
Posts:
601
EE: 100% (73)
TN, USA
|
Originally Posted By shultz: Interesting, hard to say what made a difference with how finicky 22lr is I had mine turn into a huge steaming pile of poo today! Failure to feed the first rd out of a fresh mag, not just every now and then but nearly every mag change and, some failures during the mag with the bolt held open with the case rim hung on the extractor as it tried to feed. I've never had this issue before today. Lots and LOTS of stove pipes/failure to eject as well. Went back to the house and gave it a good cleaning/once over. It was a little dirty but not horrible. Nothing looked wrong, the extractor LOOKED fine and SEEMED to be working fine. Went back out, no change, back to the house. This time I did another tear down including pulling the extractor. I immediately noticed the BB Red extractor spring looked off, not bad but something didn't look right. Pulled out my spare springs, yep that spring was nearly 3mm shorter than new. New BB red and standard springs are 8mm, bad spring was a tad over 5mm. Installed a new BB red spring, went back out and dumped 6 mags without issue! I have no clue how many rds were on this extractor spring...many K for sure. Left to right. New BB red, BAD BB red, New BB standard spring. https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/39247/1000006011_jpg-3708719.JPG I'm still puzzled how the bad spring was causing the feed issue, maybe it was binding the extractor some how? Sure didnt feel like it when I checked it during cleaning! the extractor felt like it had enough spring tension as well, it didn't feel off to me at all Thanks for sharing! Wow, that's a huge difference. I think I remember hearing vague stories about how bad extractor springs can lead to all kinds of seemingly unrelated reliability problems, but you are the only one I can recall who measured the the spring differences. Do you know if your shorter extractor spring always that length or do you think it became fatigued? I also have a BB red spring and just measured it at 6.5 mm. I have a bunch of other light extractor springs that measure between 8-9 mm. For fun, I threw in one of the lighter ones and will report back if I experience an increase in failures. |
|
Originally Posted By lugnutwrench2: Thanks for sharing! Wow, that's a huge difference. I think I remember hearing vague stories about how bad extractor springs can lead to all kinds of seemingly unrelated reliability problems, but you are the only one I can recall who measured the the spring differences. Do you know if your shorter extractor spring always that length or do you think it became fatigued? I also have a BB red spring and just measured it at 6.5 mm. I have a bunch of other light extractor springs that measure between 8-9 mm. For fun, I threw in one of the lighter ones and will report back if I experience an increase in failures. Both of the BB springs are stronger than the OEM springs, RTB or CMMG. The black dog extractor springs I have(no longer sold) land some where in this mix
|
Member
Joined:
Jul 2025
Posts:
602
EE: 100% (73)
TN, USA
|
Originally Posted By Mach1run: Is there a better choice that the original supersafety for .22 ars yet? Mine just refuses ro behave in the 9 inch config even though it ran fine with the 4.5 barrel. Many of us (myself included) have had good luck with the Atrius and Rave 140 cassette trigger. I can verify the Cornfire MARC and Rave 140 also works well (7" suppressed). I started playing around with the ARC-FIRE and a SS-cut milspec FCG with light hammer and trigger springs, which ran rough using my system tuned (springs/weights/trip) for the MARC/Rave 140. I'm confident if I dedicated more time, I could get that setup to run pretty well, too. |
|
Originally Posted By Mach1run: Is there a better choice that the original supersafety for .22 ars yet? Mine just refuses ro behave in the 9 inch config even though it ran fine with the 4.5 barrel.  Still, its 22lr and when you throw an FRT in the mix shit can go sideways quick! |
Member
Joined:
Jul 2025
Posts:
603
EE: 100% (73)
TN, USA
Member
Joined:
Dec 2023
Posts:
8075
EE: 100% (7)
USA
|
Originally Posted By Mach1run: Is there a better choice that the original supersafety for .22 ars yet? Mine just refuses ro behave in the 9 inch config even though it ran fine with the 4.5 barrel. I’ve had considerable success with the Atrius/Rave140 combo. The Hoffman has a lot of inherent slop that needs to be accounted for in the trip. It’s doable, but the Atrius is more refined. |
Member
Joined:
Jul 2025
Posts:
612
EE: 100% (73)
TN, USA
|
Originally Posted By shultz: I didn't measure it out of the package but I'm pretty sure it was fatigue that shortened it. That now short spring did come from the same 6 pack of 3 red extra power, 3 standard BB extactor springs the two new 8mm springs pictured came from so I assume that spring started life around 8mm. The remaining standard springs from this pack also measured 8mm. Both of the BB springs are stronger than the OEM springs, RTB or CMMG. The black dog extractor springs I have(no longer sold) land some where in this mix For fun, I tried replacing my (partially-fatigued at 6.5 mm) red heavy spring with a 8-9 mm light spring and ripped through about seven mags of various 32-40 gr ammo without much of an issue. (I did have one stoppage in one mag, but the same mag with a the same ammo did fine in a subsequent run.) I didn't have an subs to test, which is usually where I experience the most issues. I wonder what would have happened if you performed the same disassembly, inspection, and reassembly without actually replacing the spring. As you've mentioned, these things are ... um ... nuanced sometimes. 
|
|
Originally Posted By lugnutwrench2: For fun, I tried replacing my (partially-fatigued at 6.5 mm) red heavy spring with a 8-9 mm light spring and ripped through about seven mags of various 32-40 gr ammo without much of an issue. (I did have one stoppage in one mag, but the same mag with a the same ammo did fine in a subsequent run.) I didn't have an subs to test, which is usually where I experience the most issues. I wonder what would have happened if you performed the same disassembly, inspection, and reassembly without actually replacing the spring. As you've mentioned, these things are ... um ... nuanced sometimes. https://media.tenor.com/xzhcn-ub3OAAAAAM/what-can-you-do.gif Blow back extractors really only function as an extractor when extracting live rds. The case is extracting itself shortly after it fires. However, that extractor tension is keeping the spent case pinned to the bolt face until it hits the ejector. Without this extractor tension the cases usually don't make it back to the ejector falling off along the way creating all sorts of interesting jams. |
Member
Joined:
Jul 2025
Posts:
613
EE: 100% (73)
TN, USA
|
Originally Posted By shultz: So, leaving the extractor spring out? Lots and LOTS of failures to eject. Blow back extractors really only function as an extractor when extracting live rds. The case is extracting itself shortly after it fires. However, that extractor tension is keeping the spent case pinned to the bolt face until it hits the ejector. Without this extractor tension the cases usually don't make it back to the ejector falling off along the way creating all sorts of interesting jams. Sorry. I wasn't clear. I meant I wonder what would happen if you reassembled with the old (fatigued) spring rather than replacing it with a new one. |
|
Originally Posted By lugnutwrench2: Sorry. I wasn't clear. I meant I wonder what would happen if you reassembled with the old (fatigued) spring rather than replacing it with a new one. |
|
Originally Posted By lugnutwrench2: I don't want to answer for @jsha22lr , but if you're not getting a full, reliable hammer reset, you probably want the shim toward the rear (pushing the lever forward). Originally Posted By lugnutwrench2: Originally Posted By lx2008: yeah...i asked the same thing. front or back of the lever??? I don't want to answer for @jsha22lr , but if you're not getting a full, reliable hammer reset, you probably want the shim toward the rear (pushing the lever forward). I shimmed the entire channel of the SS drum. Took a piece of the coke can, bent it into a U to fit in the channel, and forced the lever in to form the shim properly to channel. Easy peasy. |
|
Originally Posted By lx2008: when you "shimmed" the lever...did you shim the front or the back side of it? ( or does it even matter ) I shimmed the entire channel of the supper safety, front and back. Bent the piece of the coke can into the shape of a U, forced the lever in and trimmed off the rest so its flush. |
|
Originally Posted By lugnutwrench2: Many of us (myself included) have had good luck with the Atrius and Rave 140 cassette trigger. I can verify the Cornfire MARC and Rave 140 also works well (7" suppressed). I started playing around with the ARC-FIRE and a SS-cut milspec FCG with light hammer and trigger springs, which ran rough using my system tuned (springs/weights/trip) for the MARC/Rave 140. I'm confident if I dedicated more time, I could get that setup to run pretty well, too. |
Member
Joined:
Dec 2023
Posts:
8208
EE: 100% (7)
USA
|
Originally Posted By Mach1run: Does the atrius and Rave 140 still need the same 3d printed trip and weights the supersaftey uses? Originally Posted By Mach1run: Originally Posted By lugnutwrench2: Many of us (myself included) have had good luck with the Atrius and Rave 140 cassette trigger. I can verify the Cornfire MARC and Rave 140 also works well (7" suppressed). I started playing around with the ARC-FIRE and a SS-cut milspec FCG with light hammer and trigger springs, which ran rough using my system tuned (springs/weights/trip) for the MARC/Rave 140. I'm confident if I dedicated more time, I could get that setup to run pretty well, too. It needs a trip and weights, yes, and I would strongly recommend the metal Bore Buddy parts. 3D printed parts may or may not work. |
Joined:
Feb 2026
Posts:
1
EE: 0% (0)
TX, USA
|
Hi all - I have been lurking and trying to replicate the success many of you are having. Unfortunately, despite a lot of trial and error (and $$$ to Borebuddy), my best results are very inconsistent bursts of fire mixed in with single shots and dead trigger. If anything seems off would appreciate your feedback / advice. Maybe the most bizarre thing is that I was having more success BEFORE adding a suppressor. Works flawlessly in semi auto. In "SS" mode I'm pulling the trigger as gently as possible. 7 inch Borebuddy upper Suppressed (includes "quiet collar") BB super strike firing pin + Light firing pin spring BB pressure plug Rave 140 + MARC Trip screw backed out as far as possible without binding Kriss + Black dog mags Seems to like more weight, steel + steel, maybe I need the lead or tungsten inserts? 3, 4, 6lb recoil springs - seems to like 3 and 4 better than 6 Bolt catch (tested with and without) 40 gr CPRN Mini mags, Thunderbolt, CCI SV I feel like I have been close at times but at the same time so far haha. At this point I'd be happy with a SINGLE mag dump and not having to baby the trigger. At this point it seems like the issue is not on the reset but on the hammer timing. In super slow mo video I am getting 1 more trigger pull than rounds fired, i.e. the burst is ending with a trigger pull and no bang, NOT a failed reset Probably the most frustrating thing is I've followed all of Borebuddys recommendations meticulously and it just doesn't work. I feel like they advertise this stuff to work 'with tuning', but tuning to me means it will take some work to get dialed in, not that it may occasionally work with endless tinkering. |
|
Originally Posted By Shoot22: Hi all - I have been lurking and trying to replicate the success many of you are having. Unfortunately, despite a lot of trial and error (and $$$ to Borebuddy), my best results are very inconsistent bursts of fire mixed in with single shots and dead trigger. If anything seems off would appreciate your feedback / advice. Maybe the most bizarre thing is that I was having more success BEFORE adding a suppressor. Works flawlessly in semi auto. In "SS" mode I'm pulling the trigger as gently as possible. 7 inch Borebuddy upper Suppressed (includes "quiet collar") BB super strike firing pin + Light firing pin spring BB pressure plug Rave 140 + MARC Trip screw backed out as far as possible without binding Kriss + Black dog mags Seems to like more weight, steel + steel, maybe I need the lead or tungsten inserts? 3, 4, 6lb recoil springs - seems to like 3 and 4 better than 6 Bolt catch (tested with and without) 40 gr CPRN Mini mags, Thunderbolt, CCI SV I feel like I have been close at times but at the same time so far haha. At this point I'd be happy with a SINGLE mag dump and not having to baby the trigger. At this point it seems like the issue is not on the reset but on the hammer timing. In super slow mo video I am getting 1 more trigger pull than rounds fired, i.e. the burst is ending with a trigger pull and no bang, NOT a failed reset Probably the most frustrating thing is I've followed all of Borebuddys recommendations meticulously and it just doesn't work. I feel like they advertise this stuff to work 'with tuning', but tuning to me means it will take some work to get dialed in, not that it may occasionally work with endless tinkering. Try it with a standard collar if you have one. The Quiet Collar was the only thing that made mine malfunction. |
Member
Joined:
Jul 2025
Posts:
677
EE: 100% (73)
TN, USA
|
Originally Posted By Shoot22: Hi all - I have been lurking and trying to replicate the success many of you are having. Unfortunately, despite a lot of trial and error (and $$$ to Borebuddy), my best results are very inconsistent bursts of fire mixed in with single shots and dead trigger. If anything seems off would appreciate your feedback / advice. Maybe the most bizarre thing is that I was having more success BEFORE adding a suppressor. ... 40 gr CPRN Mini mags, Thunderbolt, CCI SV ... Your suppressor will add back-pressure and dump more particulates into your BCG and lower. That will change reliability (sometimes for the better). Make note of that. 40 gr can be difficult as a starting point. It also feels like there's a break-in period that helps, but that's unsupported and could be just vibes on my part. If you can find some locally, I'd start with one of these (or try all four at first and see what works best and use more of that one): * CCI Stinger, 22 LR, 32 Grain, Copper Plated Hollow Point, 1640 fps * Remington 22 Yellow Jacket®, 22 LR, 33 Grain, Plated Truncated Cone Hollow Point, 1500 fps * CCI Velocitor HP, 22 LR, 40 Grain, Copper Plated Hollow Point, 1435 fps * Remington Ranch Hand, 22 LR, 38 Grain, Copper Plated Hollow Point, 1340 fps Ranch Hand is probably the cheapest, but get the 38 gr (not the 40 gr). 22 Yellow Jacket is probably second-cheapest. Get one of those working with the heaviest weight you can and the 4 lb (yellow) recoil spring. If you're maxed out on weight, try changing the recoil spring (up or down) and see what happens. Once you can reliably get whole mag dumps with that ammunition, note the clock position your brass is being ejected. We can likely help you tune for the heavier bullets/lighter loads from there. |
|
I’ve decided I don’t have enough frustration in my life so I’m going to try a .22LR FRT. I have a dedicated .22LR AR I built maybe fifteen years ago, at least ten. It has a BA 16” barrel, CMMG bolt and collar and somebody’s pressure plug. It’s been a reliable shooter, I added a CMMG bolt weight a few months ago. First I’m going to try something that I don’t think will work, but it uses the parts I have on hand: a Partisan FRT and a CMMG trip (it came with the weight.) If it bench tests ok I’ll see if I can get it to run in semi first, I’m expecting the hammer spring to be too weak for rimfire. I believe Partisan has heavier springs in the works, though - I’m not in a hurry. Is this a fool’s errand? |
Member
Joined:
Dec 2023
Posts:
8364
EE: 100% (7)
USA
|
Originally Posted By heavyduty: I’ve decided I don’t have enough frustration in my life so I’m going to try a .22LR FRT.I have a dedicated .22LR AR I built maybe fifteen years ago, at least ten. It has a BA 16” barrel, CMMG bolt and collar and somebody’s pressure plug. It’s been a reliable shooter, I added a CMMG bolt weight a few months ago. First I’m going to try something that I don’t think will work, but it uses the parts I have on hand: a Partisan FRT and a CMMG trip (it came with the weight.) If it bench tests ok I’ll see if I can get it to run in semi first, I’m expecting the hammer spring to be too weak for rimfire. I believe Partisan has heavier springs in the works, though - I’m not in a hurry. Is this a fool’s errand? I kinda sorta eventually got my Rare Breed 22 working. Same basic design as the Disruptor. The Atrius/Rave140 was far more successful. |
| My factory assembled M4 CMMG dedicated carbine with Rare Breed FRT, Bore Buddy weight and trip runs damn well. I have a Partisan in another M4 lower that I could put the CMMG upper on and try it. I will try to do that this weekend. |
NRA Life Member
I can see where you're coming from, 'cause I know where you've been and I can see where you're going 'cause I can see the direction you're headed in. I just don't know where the hell you're at right now.
I can see where you're coming from, 'cause I know where you've been and I can see where you're going 'cause I can see the direction you're headed in. I just don't know where the hell you're at right now.
|
Originally Posted By ARKAR: My factory assembled M4 CMMG dedicated carbine with Rare Breed FRT, Bore Buddy weight and trip runs damn well. I have a Partisan in another M4 lower that I could put the CMMG upper on and try it. I will try to do that this weekend. nothing but very light rim strikes, in SEMI... I never even bothered to flip into 3P. Since the BB bolt weight is so close to interfering with the hammer I even tried with the BW removed, no joy. I only tried using older Federal red box bulk pack This ammo runs like a champ when using the same upper with a MARC, and, in every other 22lr I own. During hand function testing, I had to adjust the FA trip timing little different than what normally works for FA. The safety trip was not always disengaging, small adjustment on the BB trip fixed that. Same lower/disruptor functioned just fine with my 11.5 SA piston upper. This is what I bought the trigger for so no biggie. Would have been nice if the disruptor would have worked for 22lr, another option for me. |
|
Originally Posted By shultz: I'm curious to hear your results with the Partisan. I couldn't get my disruptor to light off a single rd of 22lr nothing but very light rim strikes, in SEMI... I never even bothered to flip into 3P. Since the BB bolt weight is so close to interfering with the hammer I even tried with the BW removed, no joy. I only tried using older Federal red box bulk pack This ammo runs like a champ when using the same upper with a MARC, and, in every other 22lr I own. During hand function testing, I had to adjust the FA trip timing little different than what normally works for FA. The safety trip was not always disengaging, small adjustment on the BB trip fixed that. Same lower/disruptor functioned just fine with my 11.5 SA piston upper. This is what I bought the trigger for so no biggie. Would have been nice if the disruptor would have worked for 22lr, another option for me. I’ll do some testing and report back this weekend. My CMMG M4 runs best with the red box Federal also, but will run the Federal Champion blue box(terribly inconsistent ammo) pretty well. My XM16E1 20” setup has a Cornfire MARC, BB weight and BB trip and runs practically 100% on Remington Golden Bullet. Attached File Attached File |
NRA Life Member
I can see where you're coming from, 'cause I know where you've been and I can see where you're going 'cause I can see the direction you're headed in. I just don't know where the hell you're at right now.
I can see where you're coming from, 'cause I know where you've been and I can see where you're going 'cause I can see the direction you're headed in. I just don't know where the hell you're at right now.
|
Originally Posted By heavyduty: I’ve decided I don’t have enough frustration in my life so I’m going to try a .22LR FRT.I have a dedicated .22LR AR I built maybe fifteen years ago, at least ten. It has a BA 16” barrel, CMMG bolt and collar and somebody’s pressure plug. It’s been a reliable shooter, I added a CMMG bolt weight a few months ago. First I’m going to try something that I don’t think will work, but it uses the parts I have on hand: a Partisan FRT and a CMMG trip (it came with the weight.) If it bench tests ok I’ll see if I can get it to run in semi first, I’m expecting the hammer spring to be too weak for rimfire. I believe Partisan has heavier springs in the works, though - I’m not in a hurry. Is this a fool’s errand? First stumbling block. Everything dropped in, but the trip doesn’t appear to pull the locking bar far enough forward. Looks like I need an adjustable trip like this one? https://borebuddy.com/product/adjustable-trip-kit/ What are my alternatives? |
|
Originally Posted By heavyduty: First stumbling block. Everything dropped in, but the trip doesn't appear to pull the locking bar far enough forward. Looks like I need an adjustable trip like this one? https://borebuddy.com/product/adjustable-trip-kit/ What are my alternatives? I was able to adjust it to where I had consistent trip during hand cycling funtion testing and what appeared to be good timing. Sadly, my disruptor hammer would not strike the FP hard enough, nothing but light strikes and no bang in SEMI... I know of no other good trip alternatives... Maybe you could add a little JB weld to the trip surface then sand it back to adjust timing? |
| Buy the exact Bore Buddy trip you linked to. I’d also buy the adjustable weight kit. It lets you dial it right in for maximum reliability. |
NRA Life Member
I can see where you're coming from, 'cause I know where you've been and I can see where you're going 'cause I can see the direction you're headed in. I just don't know where the hell you're at right now.
I can see where you're coming from, 'cause I know where you've been and I can see where you're going 'cause I can see the direction you're headed in. I just don't know where the hell you're at right now.
|
Originally Posted By heavyduty: The Borebuddy trip and weight seem like the best option, then. I may wait until the heavier Partisan springs are actually available first. I tried my disruptors for the first time yesterday. I decided to run out, put up fresh paper targets and paint my steel before dragging all my shit out since I had been messing with getting the disruptor functioning properly with my FRT 22lr upper, the only change here was swapping the SS trip for the FA trip and adjusting it...I grabbed the new combo, a couple mags and jumped on my ATV. Before painting steel and setting up paper, I racked a rd in and click...then another, click... Thinking maybe the hammer could be hitting the bolt weight I pulled it. Still nothing but clicks and very shallow rim strikes.At this point, I fully expected the disruptor I had intended to use with my SA piston upper to have issues igniting crap barnul wolf 223. This ammo has thicker/harder primer cups that are known to cause light strikes in some guns...not one single issue for 120rds of course the better quality M193 I shot more of didn't have any ingition issues either...
|
|
Originally Posted By shultz: Probably not a bad idea. I'm still a little puzzled why the disruptor hammer didn't have sufficient force for good rim strikes... I tried my disruptors for the first time yesterday. I decided to run out, put up fresh paper targets and paint my steel before dragging all my shit out since I had been messing with getting the disruptor functioning properly with my FRT 22lr upper, the only change here was swapping the SS trip for the FA trip and adjusting it...I grabbed the new combo, a couple mags and jumped on my ATV. Before painting steel and setting up paper, I racked a rd in and click...then another, click... Thinking maybe the hammer could be hitting the bolt weight I pulled it. Still nothing but clicks and very shallow rim strikes.At this point, I fully expected the disruptor I had intended to use with my SA piston upper to have issues igniting crap barnul wolf 223. This ammo has thicker/harder primer cups that are known to cause light strikes in some guns...not one single issue for 120rds of course the better quality M193 I shot more of didn't have any ingition issues either...It might be worth trying the heavier hammer spring that is coming. I don’t have a lot of faith this is going to work right now, but it can be a science project. Speaking of which… I noticed CMMG has a comment on their trip page: “The CMMG Auto Sear Trip is NOT designed for use with FRTs (forced reset triggers) or Super Safeties. Adjustable trip kits allow more adjustment and better compatibility with FRTs and Super Safties.” My question is… why not? I already have the damn thing, why won’t it work? I decided to play a little. I started sticking layers of small pieces of electrical tape on the front surface of the trip, it only took four layers to get the hammer to fall. So, before I try your JB Weld idea I decided to do something easier and less permanent - a pad made from thick CA glue, it can be removed in a moment with nail polish. I don’t expect it to stand up to live fire but it should be good enough for bench testing. Part of the issue is that I don’t really understand the theory of operation. Does the slide simply get pulled forward a short distance to move the lock bar enough to arm the system? Total back and forth movement looks to be very small. And the talk of shims in this thread I think applies to the lever on an Atrius type FRT - am I right? |
|
Originally Posted By heavyduty: It might be worth trying the heavier hammer spring that is coming. I don't have a lot of faith this is going to work right now, but it can be a science project. Speaking of which I noticed CMMG has a comment on their trip page: "The CMMG Auto Sear Trip is NOT designed for use with FRTs (forced reset triggers) or Super Safeties. Adjustable trip kits allow more adjustment and better compatibility with FRTs and Super Safties." My question is why not? I already have the damn thing, why won't it work? I decided to play a little. I started sticking layers of small pieces of electrical tape on the front surface of the trip, it only took four layers to get the hammer to fall. So, before I try your JB Weld idea I decided to do something easier and less permanent - a pad made from thick CA glue, it can be removed in a moment with nail polish. I don't expect it to stand up to live fire but it should be good enough for bench testing. Part of the issue is that I don't really understand the theory of operation. Does the slide simply get pulled forward a short distance to move the lock bar enough to arm the system? Total back and forth movement looks to be very small. And the talk of shims in this thread I think applies to the lever on an Atrius type FRT - am I right? Now for a lever type FRT like MARC, Atruis and SS then yes, it is a back and forth motion of the trip that resets the trigger and allows release. This is why the FRT lever sits in a box. You can and may need to shim one end of the "box" window to get proper function. The reset end can be handled with the adjustment screw on the bore buddy SS adjustable trip. There is no adjustment for when trip happens. |
|
Originally Posted By shultz: Yes, thats exactly how this works. Doesn't matter if the trip is releasing an auto sear or disengaging the safety on an out of battery safety type FRT. The function of the bolt pulling the trip forward to the point this happens is what matters. The FA trip dosen't move back and forth for FA or an out of battery safety FRT, It's a pull only off switch and the adjustment is only to get the trip timing/safety off set right. Now for a lever type FRT like MARC, Atruis and SS then yes, it is a back and forth motion of the trip that resets the trigger and allows release. This is why the FRT lever sits in a box. You can and may need to shim one end of the "box" window to get proper function. The reset end can be handled with the adjustment screw on the bore buddy SS adjustable trip. There is no adjustment for when trip happens. Thanks for the explanation! I just pulled the firing pin so I can bench test things (a real pain in the ass, this one is old enough that it’s a roll pin instead of the split pin I’m told they are now) and I’m waiting for the CA pad on the trip to cure overnight. If this works I’ll replace the CA pad with one made from JB Weld. I’m trying to do this with the weight and trip that I have but fully understand that it will be a minor miracle if it’s that simple. |
|
Originally Posted By heavyduty: Thanks for the explanation! I just pulled the firing pin so I can bench test things (a real pain in the ass, this one is old enough that it's a roll pin instead of the split pin I'm told they are now) and I'm waiting for the CA pad on the trip to cure overnight. If this works I'll replace the CA pad with one made from JB Weld. I'm trying to do this with the weight and trip that I have but fully understand that it will be a minor miracle if it's that simple. I also have some older CMMG bolts that use roll pins for FP and extractor retention...the newer style that I mostly use now are much easier to change FP/spring by simple pulling the cotter pin. Even the pin that looks to be an AR extractor pin that retains the 22lr extractor/spring is easy to push out using the FP cotter pin...Anyway,good on you for taking the time to pull the FP and avoid possibly breaking it 
|
|
Originally Posted By heavyduty: It might be worth trying the heavier hammer spring that is coming. I don't have a lot of faith this is going to work right now, but it can be a science project. Speaking of which I noticed CMMG has a comment on their trip page: "The CMMG Auto Sear Trip is NOT designed for use with FRTs (forced reset triggers) or Super Safeties. Adjustable trip kits allow more adjustment and better compatibility with FRTs and Super Safties." My question is why not? I already have the damn thing, why won't it work? I decided to play a little. I started sticking layers of small pieces of electrical tape on the front surface of the trip, it only took four layers to get the hammer to fall. So, before I try your JB Weld idea I decided to do something easier and less permanent - a pad made from thick CA glue, it can be removed in a moment with nail polish. I don't expect it to stand up to live fire but it should be good enough for bench testing. Part of the issue is that I don't really understand the theory of operation. Does the slide simply get pulled forward a short distance to move the lock bar enough to arm the system? Total back and forth movement looks to be very small. And the talk of shims in this thread I think applies to the lever on an Atrius type FRT - am I right? The reason. The auto sear location and the amount of movement needed to release it is NOT the same as say the disruptor safety lever. My BB trip was set perfectly to work FA. It would not always disengage the disruptors safety lever allowing me to pull the trigger... I had to shift it forward a tad and then it did engage/release the safety lever reliably with what appeared to me to be good timing. Only firing would have verified timing and because of the light primer strikes I never got to this point... |
Member
Joined:
Jul 2025
Posts:
687
EE: 100% (73)
TN, USA
| After breaking the set screw on my Bore Buddy Adjustable Super Safety Trip Kit, purchased some spare #3-56 x 1/2" black oxide socket head cap replacement screws from Fastener Depot in case I ever did it again. But the minimum order size was 25 screws, so I have many more than I need. If you would like some for yourself, send me $2 to cover postage, and I'll mail you a couple. |
|
Just know that while it may "bench test" ok and appear to work fine, live fire is another thing. I have had several times where (not just 22lr's) bench tested fine, but choked in live fire. However bench testing is still a good plan as if it does not work in bench testing, it will not work in live fire. Bench testing is still part of the process. Just do not get your hopes up too much if it bench tests ok, it still might not run. |
|
I did a little more investigating into the disruptor light strike issue this morning. It's the hammer spring. I don't have a good way to measure hammer force. So, I used the pain method I laid my finger across the lower approximately where the firing pin head would be. Dropped the disruptor hammer several times and its a very weak hit to say the least, like hardly felt... Pulled out my FRT 22lr that has KVP REDUCED POWER hammer, trigger and disco springs. One drop was enough, Huge difference in felt impact. Hopefully the stiffer hammer spring Partisan is testing will be out soon and work. Hell, I'll get two even if I don't end up using a disruptor for 22lr... |
Who here is using a FRT with a 22LR. What is your setup? (Page 8 of 11)
AR Sponsor